Devs, Plz Improve Death March.

[YummiOger]

Death March is a good spell/ buff in theory, but its activation requirements make it useless on a Raid.

 

an Upgrade to Deathmarch would be a wonderful thing. would only require a simple change.

 

-If Mob in engaged Encounter Dies

 

Cast Deathmarch on the group, then IF a Mob dies while active it works. That keeps it Effectively the same ability in Group setting, BUT makes it useful on raids due to one of ur group memebers not having to land the death blow.

 

This would be an Improvement to a SK spell that would add more desireability to a raid. to consistantly give Death March's effect to a group, improving their overall DPS.

 

i got NP being a DPS Tank, but PLZ PLZ give me the tools to do it with.

 

Yummy Izbad

70 SK/Armorer

Message Edited by YummiOger on 07-14-2006 04:58 AM

[Ultimatum]

Personally I'd rather see the spell change more drastically than that.  As it is now, I hate that spell with every fiber of my being.  15 seconds of +104% AUTOATTACK DPS?!  Wow where do I sign up for this huge improvement?  first of all, the extra 4% is worthless since you can only get +100%DPS, and thats the adept 3.  The Master 1 is completely useless as it adds 19% OVER THE DPS CAP....what a great idea!!  Also, if you arent capping your int from the +127 of the adept 3, I doubt you'll cap it from the whopping +145 of the Master 1. Back to the 15 seconds of dps thing, first of all, it is very likely that your raid group (or solo group for that matter) is going to have at least 1 healer and 1 mage in it.  That effectively cuts the number of people who benefit from this buff to 4/6 people.  That would give the group as a whole about 30 swings with this buff in 15 seconds.  Taking into account parries, blocks, misses and repostes against a raid encounter, the number of landed hits is realistically going to be about 15 in 15 seconds from 4 people.  In a word, pathetic.Now, granted, the parent buff lasts a minute, but you have to consider that even if this buff triggered on the mob dying rather than your group landing the killing blow as you suggested, you are going to have overlapping triggers (i.e. you kill a mob, trigger On the March, kill the next mob in 7 seconds, trigger it again etc.) so all in all you are going to miss out on roughly 40% of the buff's time, not to mention once you get to the named in the encounter, this buff is going to wear off in 15 seconds and the rest of the time you are back to where you started.  But alas, as it stands now, this only triggers off your own group getting the kill, so in a raid setting the spell effectively reads "whenever a mob dies, this spell has a 25% chance to trigger 'Crappy Buff' for 15 seconds"Let us not forget that against raid nameds who have no adds (roughly 75% of them) this spell is complete and utter garbage.  Death March needs a complete reworking to be useful in any situation, weather it be Solo, Group, or Raid, but I've been preaching this since 2 weeks after I got the spell, and it falls on deaf ears.My idea for the spell at adept 3 would be to have it be a maintained solo buff, and read:On a successful hostle spell, this spell has a 5% chance to trigger On the March, lasts for 20 seconds    -dispells 80 levels of hostile spell effects (AE)    -makes group immune to root, stun, stifle, fear, and pacify effects    -reduces spell casting times by 10% (AE)    -increases DPS of group by 75%    -Inflicts 150-250 damage instantly and every 5 seconds    -Heals caster by 50-100 instantly and every 5 secondsMight need a little balancing work, but something in that vein would make SKs much more valuable on raids IMO.  Just my 2cp

Message Edited by Razerblaze on 07-14-2006 06:48 AM

[YummiOger]

i waz under the impression that straight up +DPS effected all Damage Applied, be it Spell, Melee, dot whatever.  is that wrong?.

 

yummy

[Ultimatum]

Nope, +DPS modifiers only apply to melee auto attack, which is why that spell might as well be sold by the Fighter Trainer as a joke spell.  And anything over +100% is useless so having the adept 3 at +104% and the Master 1 at +119% is just poor utilization imo.

Message Edited by Razerblaze on 07-14-2006 07:49 AM

[Addex]

The spell is worthless in raids....

[Nicholai24]

At the moment, yes. However, no one ever seems to mention the complete immunity to hostile control spells which On the March provides. The spell is free, fast-casting, and pretty useful in groups. If you're using a 2-hander, and you're hasted, you can land around 4 hits of 1,400+ on a single enemy with autoattacks alone, and no matter how little Death March adds to DPS output for whatever encounter you're engaged in, the fact remains that it's free, so the ratio will still be X Damage / 0 mana. If anything, I'd like On the March changed to a 30 Second buff that effects the group ( or possibly the raid ) immediately upon being cast, and then switches over to the 'if group/raid strikes a death blow, refresh On the March'.

[Ultimatum]

Your argument is very valid, however Templars provide a MUCH more reliable immunity to control spells.  Also, another thing many people overlook, is if you are raiding, an SK is most likely going to be in a DPS group to begin with, and other classes in that group will provide a PERMANENT DPS boost around 70%, so death march is only really going to give you +30% DPS in such situations, not to mention an SK's Int is more than likely going to be capped in said group as well, so NOTHING about that spell is attractive to the raiding community.  In small groups it is slightly more viable, but still has far too many limitations to be a reliable source of DPS and immunity.  The spell has a good concept, but it is much too narrow in utilization.  What I don't get is why Pestilence was changed from the broken garbage it once was, to the most power-efficient spell in an SK's arsenal in only a week or so when it wasnt complained about NEARLY as much as Death March, yet after a year Death March is still a piece of hot trash that doesnt even waste a slot on most raiding SKs hotbars.  I guess those fancy player crafted clothes are that much more impotant...I'm still wondering where SOE's priorities lie with this game...

[tanis147]

i love this spell personally.i play on a pvp server and have found this spell to be godmode for my groups.i will agree tho that some change is needed to maybe make it more useful in raids.

[Kryptonix]

I only use death march when I am harvesting in Gazer Isle and I pull en entire section. Death MArch saves me from dealign with the gazers' annoying stuns. Other than that, I never use it.

[Zoradan]

Prity much worthless now, I'll admit I bought the master just to have it /shrug

 

I like the poster's idea, I would start using it if it procked when the raid killed a mob.

[Nicholai24]

I'm amazed at how people think the spell is worthless because the DPS buff might not give its maximum benefit in a group or raid. Could it be improved? Of course.. but how is making yourself immune to stuns and stifles while you're in the Vaults or Halls of Fate useless? Those're the two most annoying effects in the game, and Death March allows you to pull hordes of enemies and chain your AEs without much fear of interruption, and with no fear of being silenced halfway through Tap Veins. I love the spell in groups, but I'd like to see more functionality on raids. That's all.

[Ultimatum]

---

Nicholai24 wrote:I'm amazed at how people think the spell is worthless because the DPS buff might not give its maximum benefit in a group or raid. So you're saying if you had a buff that gave you +200% haste when the cap is 100% that it would be acceptable?  I don't think so.  Creating a spell that gives you more of something than the game mechanics allow you to use is just unacceptable.Could it be improved? Of course.. but how is making yourself immune to stuns and stifles while you're in the Vaults or Halls of Fate useless? Those're the two most annoying effects in the game, and Death March allows you to pull hordes of enemies and chain your AEs without much fear of interruption, and with no fear of being silenced halfway through Tap Veins. The problem is when you cast the spell, you are NOT immune to control spells.  You have to kill a mob first, and in a place like Vaults, the chances of being feared before the first mob is down is far too great for the spell to be useless imo.  Just go for the Fearless AA or give me a Templar anyday.  Also, while being silenced is annoying, nothing is more annoying than being interrupted halfway through a 4-5 second cast spell.  If SOE would add "Prevents interrupts"  or "+20 focus" the spell would be a lot better.

---

[Nicholai24]

Whatever.

[YummiOger]

Guys i know about group and solo useage.

 

But the topic of this thread is from a RAID standpoint Deathmarch is Useless and needs to be improved.

 

and why r u guys just thinking of only the SK getting a damage boost?.. what about the Monk and Brigand in ur raid group?

 

Additions to Deathmarch would make it Overpowered. it already gives group Immune, +Major DPS, and + Int for vertually free IF u can meet its requirements. WHY add more abilities?.. why not Just make the requirement more freindly and leave the effects be? with several of the T7 encounters having multiple adds and grouped encounters in RAID zones, it would prove to be useful even in its current abilities state.

 

if it proced on Mob Death :

 

1) Solo would be the same

2) Group would be the same

3) RAID would be the only differance. You could time the effects to proc to consistantly give the group buff every 3 mins.

 

I see no Overpowered ability due to there woud be no changes in effects, only more control over its proc.

 

yummy izbad

[Xanoth]

---

YummiOger wrote:

1) Solo would be the same

2) Group would be the same

3) RAID would be the only differance. You could time the effects to proc to consistantly give the group buff every 3 mins.

---

actually solo would be better as would group.im sure i pointed it out somewhere, but dumbfire pets dont proc death march. so if your skellie gets a killing blow death amrch doesnt work...

[SonnyA]

It's actually very good against classes with dumbfire pets or other pets that dies in a couple of blows.

A pet death will trigger it and let you whack at the parent mobs with a little extra damage. I've parsed some solo fights and 25% damage or so comes from my autoattack. To have that doubled isn't bad.

Remember Depeche Mode's words... It's a competitive world. Everything counts in large amounts.

[Ultimatum]

---

YummiOger wrote:

Guys i know about group and solo useage.

 

But the topic of this thread is from a RAID standpoint Deathmarch is Useless and needs to be improved.

 

and why r u guys just thinking of only the SK getting a damage boost?.. what about the Monk and Brigand in ur raid group?A better choice for a group would be a Wizard (for int/str buff and the group wide hostile spell proc buff) and a troubador for the hostile spell buff.  Monks and Brigands are better when grouped with a class that gives a permanent +DPS and +% haste buff, and an SK doesnt benefit well from Haste.

 

Additions to Deathmarch would make it Overpowered. it already gives group Immune, +Major DPS, and + Int for vertually free IF u can meet its requirements. WHY add more abilities?.. why not Just make the requirement more freindly and leave the effects be? with several of the T7 encounters having multiple adds and grouped encounters in RAID zones, it would prove to be useful even in its current abilities state.

My argument has always been that the DPS does not scale well across the tiers.  IMO it should be something like:Adept 1 - +50% DPSAdept 3 - +75% DPSMaster 1 - +100% DPSAs it stands now there is absolutely no reason to upgrade this spell.  I think the Adept 1 is +94% DPS if I remember right.  If that is the case, you can only possibly get +6% DPS max and that (besides the immunity to control effects) is the main selling point of the spell, the +INT is a joke since most raid SKs will cap that in a group with a Wizard pretty easily.  I feel that the DPS needs to scale to make the Master 1 a sought after spell rather than vender trash, and replace the Int buff with something that is actually useful.  I also like an earlier poster's suggestion of having On the March trigger while the spell is cast so it is at least of SOME use without hinging on weather or not you can kill a mob quick...that should be an added bounus.  Named Raid encounters are usually solo so this spell has no use at all during the really important fights.  I don't know about the rest of you, but I don't want some spell that is only marginally usefull on raids when you are clearing trash mobs.

if it proced on Mob Death :

 

1) Solo would be the same

2) Group would be the same

3) RAID would be the only differance. You could time the effects to proc to consistantly give the group buff every 3 mins.

 

I see no Overpowered ability due to there woud be no changes in effects, only more control over its proc.

I also agree with this.  Making it trigger on a mobs death instead of so-and-so getting the killshot would make all kinds of sense, and should have functioned that way since DoF was released.  Also, I thing the buff should be raid wide as well as that would single-handedly make SKs much more desireable for end game content.  I have no hopes for anyone to ever change this spell into anything useful though.  Such a shame.

---

Message Edited by Razerblaze on 07-17-2006 10:20 AM

[Ellestil]

I was under the impression that when a spell has a % amount greater than the cap, it is intended to help counteract getting debuffed. Say, for example, haste is capped at 100%. You have an ability that grants 110%. Normally you will only get the limit of 100% since that is the cap. Unless a mob debuffs you. If he slows your attacks by 20%, your not at 80%, but 90%. That's why a master puts you even more over the max cap limit. It is basically trying to make debuffs on you negligable. That was my impression anyway. I could very well be wrong and if so, then I agree, it's senseless to have spells that have no upgradeable purpose.

Ellestil

[Pitt Hammerfi]

A lil tip for you nubs: Group with an Inquisitor in raid and youll see DM proc 90% of the time

Message Edited by Pitt Hammerfist on 07-17-2006 04:53 PM

[YummiOger]

Pitty, i can see u know something most other SKs do not, or at least me.

Iv looked over the Inq, spell list and for the life of me cant see anything there.

 

SPILL THE BEANZ NOOBER_SK01 !!!! :smileyvery-happy:

 

yummy

[SonnyA]

Inquisitors has a spell that will trigger upon mob death and cause damage to the encounter. However, this spell will take credit for the kill shot and thus also trigger death march.

68 Heretic's Destiny (Scribed) Interrogations 2.0s 0.5s 15.0s 0

An impairment that deals instant heat damage to the enemy's allies when the enemy is slain.

[Ultimatum]

I think Coercers have a similar spell that triggers death march most of the time, but I still think it should be raid wide.  Class combos usually end up getting nerfed anyway...remember the old Templar/Ranger Sanctuary/Stream of Arrows BS?  Yeah...combos ftl.

[Pitt Hammerfi]

---

YummiOger wrote:

Pitty, i can see u know something most other SKs do not, or at least me.

Iv looked over the Inq, spell list and for the life of me cant see anything there.

 

SPILL THE BEANZ NOOBER_SK01 !!!! :smileyvery-happy:

 

yummy

---

hehe yeah the Inqi has a spell that for some reason always lands the death blowits one that procs upon mobs death to deal dmg to the encounter, but counts as a killing blow.now you just gotta work out which classes will benefit from 100% dps and 145 intmost of our scouts can be dps capped anyway with right combo, so they dont really need it

[wakkogooch]

ok, as for the op, in case you have not figured it out yet, not every spell is meant to be useful in all situations, thats why you get a large variety of spells, not so you can cast them all in order, it's so you can cast spells based on the encounter, otherwise, this game would get old in a hurry of just pressing the same buttons every time you fight no matter the dynamic of the encounter.

[Beldin_]

---

Pitt Hammerfist wrote:

now you just gotta work out which classes will benefit from 100% dps and 145 int

most of our scouts can be dps capped anyway with right combo, so they dont really need it

---

Poison procs are at least int based

[tooloose]

I have this in ad3, I use it and most people in the group ask me what its supposed to do because it never seems to do anything. It does need some serious help, because the stun immunity seems to be broke.

[gnarkill]

just make it raid wide...fixed

[Agamemno]

---

tooloose wrote:

I have this in ad3, I use it and most people in the group ask me what its supposed to do because it never seems to do anything. It does need some serious help, because the stun immunity seems to be broke.

---

Nah stun/fear immunity isn't broke. Used this in roost earlier (yeah yeah ima nub, shoosh) and didn't get feared till it wore off which was most of the way though the fight vs. the named that fears, don't remember the name. But he usually fears me right off the bat and all i saw was "IMMUNE" this time.Popped death march on the final mob before we fought him and charged his monkey [expletive haxx0red by Raijinn] after. Did help.I am less than impressed with the duration of the buff that is granted upon proc of DM though, could use an increase IMHO but what do I know.

Message Edited by Agamemnoch on 07-27-2006 10:27 PM

[Kryptonix]

---

Pitt Hammerfist wrote:

---

YummiOger wrote:

Pitty, i can see u know something most other SKs do not, or at least me.

Iv looked over the Inq, spell list and for the life of me cant see anything there.

 

SPILL THE BEANZ NOOBER_SK01 !!!! :smileyvery-happy:

 

yummy

---

hehe yeah the Inqi has a spell that for some reason always lands the death blowits one that procs upon mobs death to deal dmg to the encounter, but counts as a killing blow.now you just gotta work out which classes will benefit from 100% dps and 145 intmost of our scouts can be dps capped anyway with right combo, so they dont really need it

---

Just got done reading this, and yea its ture. What I wanna know is if this is the same for pestilence. Since the Inq spell procs on the mobs death like pestilence. Does anyone know?? If pestilence does do the same as the Inq spell, then problem solved.

[YummiOger]

WOW .. good question .. some1 try it out!

 

yummy