Combat Changes

Untalent · 11-13-2006, 12:12 PM

Honestly, there hasn't been many posts by monks. I'm actually quite surprised by this.For those of you testing it, do you like it? Are you better at tanking then before? How do you feel about the changes?

Cirth_Beer · 11-13-2006, 03:07 PM

I heard it's better since dymus post ^_^ but i also believed there would be much more feedback on those change, look like either everyone is now bruiser (or rerolled) or no monk is on beta.

Bladewind · 11-13-2006, 08:09 PM

I don't have access to the beta boards - would you mind copying the dymus post changes that effect monks here? Thanks!

Message Edited by Bladewind on 11-13-2006 07:09 AM

selch · 11-13-2006, 08:28 PM

Dymus said: They reduced extra hit bonuses of mobs affecting Deflection way too much. So Deflection will not be reduced "as much" compared to previous state of beta against tougher mobs, nameds, heroics, epics etc. etc.

Illustrious · 11-14-2006, 12:38 AM

Havent seen much change in the grand scheme of things tbh, though we can certainly solo a lot less effectively than b4 mobs that used to be a close fight mean u are now pwned and mobs that used to be quite easy are now pretty tough. (relating to green/blue heroics)

However this seems to be true for basically every melee that tries to solo heroics now, only people the changes didnt really effect are casters that root, they can still solo yellow namers easily providing they have a little room to work in.

as far as tanking in grps and raids, havent had much time to test it much myself yet but there is a reasonable amount of feedback on beta forums about it.

Unfortunatly its seems namers and epics still have pretty high "to hit" bonuses that basically ignore all types of avoidance apart from Block (which of course we dont get). These "to hit" bonuses were reduced on saturday but they are still there all be it in reduced form thus meaning we are still subpar tanks for the high end namers and raid content. Things are still changing tho but as it stands now i have read that nothing much has changed in the tanking pecking order.

Yes brawlers can propably still tank all heroic content just fine all be it with a little increased difficulty for healers on some of the tougher namers.

Im guessing that with the reduced damage ranges and the fact our miti % is now closer to the average miti% of a plater than it was b4 (at least until the platers get eof equiped anyway) we will now be better at tanking epics than we were before (which isnt really saying much) and are far less likely to get one shotted with those 12k+ hits we would take on occasion, however seen as avoidance still doesnt work properly and shield users get the only avoidance check that ignores offensive skills (block) then we will still be very much the worst tanks compared to the others just as we were b4, maybe a slightly lesser gap but still not really good enough to have a brawler MT any x4 raid zone as 1st, 2nd or 3rd choice any time soon.

dps wise we will still be good and our new aa lines give us a little more dps (althjough everyone already took a dps nerf so really we just gaining back in AA what they took in the combat changes). The bruiser AA line however gives just as much extra dps as us as so dont expect us to suddenly be better dps than them either all of a sudden.

Cirth_Beer · 11-14-2006, 03:46 PM

hum reading your post i see "nothing change at all we'll even be a weaker in soloing and to be able to do the same dps as before we'll have to be maxed in aaxp" SMILEY

Untalent · 11-14-2006, 06:55 PM

Sounds terrible. We can't solo as well, healers need to user more power to keep us up, and we still can't tank raid content. [expletive haxx0red by Raijinn]?

Almeric_CoS · 11-14-2006, 11:08 PM

Anyone know how the combat changes affected the damage output from the STR achievement line?

Illustrious · 11-15-2006, 12:38 AM

never tried the Str AA lines in Beta im afraid so i cant really comment. I would imagine that they will be just as good for the non raid weapon equiped brawler as they were before tho. Although if new EoF legendary dropped gear turns out to be as good as todays fabled raid drops then things may start to change i guess.

Message Edited by Illustrious on 11-14-2006 11:39 AM

KazzySoJaz · 11-15-2006, 01:05 AM

I think the only way bare fists will be better is if you own hand of destruction and the 60.5 dmg rating calamity, and even then that is a total of 123.5 dmg rating, which will not give you much more dps than str line will. The str line also has a crush debuff, but the procs on the above fabled weapons might keep them ahead a bit.

psubull · 11-15-2006, 01:25 AM

everything was scaled down relatively. Therefore if you have DWs with 55 DR or greater, you're still better off with them over the STR line.

Untalent · 11-15-2006, 06:07 AM

So overall... monks are worse then before as far as tanking is the answer.

Tj · 11-15-2006, 06:42 AM

Monks are a joke now.

You cant tank half as well as you did.

You will take more damage then ever before.

Soloing ? whats that.. they dont want you to.

Dps .. ha ha ha ha haahaa. Its not the same

Again..

You are not a tank

You are slightly dps

You are much more gimped then you were yesteday

You will not solo

The Fairy came and made us all bendover.

boogar · 11-15-2006, 07:11 AM

And the same goes with a Serker with mostly fabled gear and 22 master's,couldnt solo a green named in SoS.Im done good night and good luck because im not starting over again.

Message Edited by boogar on 11-14-2006 06:12 PM

Harbing · 11-15-2006, 07:42 AM

Hello,its really worse now; last night i was with my 70 monk (all ad3, key masters) in SotS gathering staves for the Claymore questline. I had no probs with the green heroics. Atm, after the update, im lying FD ed on the floor, waiting to regenerate 90% of my health and that my Heal refreshes so that i can take on the next single melee based 63 tripple green heroic Mob and -maybe- not die in the process.After the update i still have 65% avoidance and 2.9 k Mit (full AA deflection & parry, 2* dark chitin rings etc) but i get hit more often and i take for sure more damage.What is happening here ?CaineBladesDarathar

Harbing · 11-15-2006, 09:47 AM

addendum:ok, its even worse than i thought it was. Apparently the Mobs just dont care if they are stifled or not. They just use their normal class like abilites (heal themself, use stun etc.). I tried this with Silencing Palm and also with the Dark Squall proc the Manacles of Dark Sky gives. It just doesnt affect them, even when i see the icon on them (eg. they havnt resisted it).Training is very hard now; if FD fails one time im mostly done. And i cant emphasize it enough. I get hit so often and so [Removed for Content] hard by green heroic mobs its ridiculous.I was always under the impression that we sacrifice tanking- and other abilities for soloability. But with this expansion / update SOE seemingly eleminated this Playstyle completely.CaineBladesDarathar

11-13-2006, 03:07 PM	#2
Cirth_Beer Custom Avatar Join Date: Nov 2004 Location: Storms Posts: 2,336	I heard it's better since dymus post ^_^ but i also believed there would be much more feedback on those change, look like either everyone is now bruiser (or rerolled) or no monk is on beta. __________________

11-13-2006, 08:09 PM	#3
Bladewind Loremaster Join Date: Nov 2004 Posts: 783	I don't have access to the beta boards - would you mind copying the dymus post changes that effect monks here? Thanks! Message Edited by Bladewind on 11-13-2006 07:09 AM __________________

11-13-2006, 08:28 PM	#4
selch Lord Join Date: Nov 2005 Location: Istanbul, Turkiye Posts: 1,305	Dymus said: They reduced extra hit bonuses of mobs affecting Deflection way too much. So Deflection will not be reduced "as much" compared to previous state of beta against tougher mobs, nameds, heroics, epics etc. etc. __________________

11-14-2006, 03:46 PM	#6
Cirth_Beer Custom Avatar Join Date: Nov 2004 Location: Storms Posts: 2,336	hum reading your post i see "nothing change at all we'll even be a weaker in soloing and to be able to do the same dps as before we'll have to be maxed in aaxp" __________________

11-14-2006, 11:08 PM	#8
Almeric_CoS The L.G. Join Date: Nov 2004 Location: Southern California Posts: 381	Anyone know how the combat changes affected the damage output from the STR achievement line? __________________ Almeric's Blog: He doesn't know the meaning of the word "concise!"

11-13-2006, 12:12 PM	#1
Untalent Join Date: Apr 2006 Posts: 130	Honestly, there hasn't been many posts by monks. I'm actually quite surprised by this.For those of you testing it, do you like it? Are you better at tanking then before? How do you feel about the changes?

11-14-2006, 12:38 AM	#5
Illustrious Loremaster Join Date: Dec 2004 Posts: 226	Havent seen much change in the grand scheme of things tbh, though we can certainly solo a lot less effectively than b4 mobs that used to be a close fight mean u are now pwned and mobs that used to be quite easy are now pretty tough. (relating to green/blue heroics) However this seems to be true for basically every melee that tries to solo heroics now, only people the changes didnt really effect are casters that root, they can still solo yellow namers easily providing they have a little room to work in. as far as tanking in grps and raids, havent had much time to test it much myself yet but there is a reasonable amount of feedback on beta forums about it. Unfortunatly its seems namers and epics still have pretty high "to hit" bonuses that basically ignore all types of avoidance apart from Block (which of course we dont get). These "to hit" bonuses were reduced on saturday but they are still there all be it in reduced form thus meaning we are still subpar tanks for the high end namers and raid content. Things are still changing tho but as it stands now i have read that nothing much has changed in the tanking pecking order. Yes brawlers can propably still tank all heroic content just fine all be it with a little increased difficulty for healers on some of the tougher namers. Im guessing that with the reduced damage ranges and the fact our miti % is now closer to the average miti% of a plater than it was b4 (at least until the platers get eof equiped anyway) we will now be better at tanking epics than we were before (which isnt really saying much) and are far less likely to get one shotted with those 12k+ hits we would take on occasion, however seen as avoidance still doesnt work properly and shield users get the only avoidance check that ignores offensive skills (block) then we will still be very much the worst tanks compared to the others just as we were b4, maybe a slightly lesser gap but still not really good enough to have a brawler MT any x4 raid zone as 1st, 2nd or 3rd choice any time soon. dps wise we will still be good and our new aa lines give us a little more dps (althjough everyone already took a dps nerf so really we just gaining back in AA what they took in the combat changes). The bruiser AA line however gives just as much extra dps as us as so dont expect us to suddenly be better dps than them either all of a sudden.

11-14-2006, 06:55 PM	#7
Untalent Join Date: Apr 2006 Posts: 130	Sounds terrible. We can't solo as well, healers need to user more power to keep us up, and we still can't tank raid content. [expletive haxx0red by Raijinn]?

11-15-2006, 12:38 AM	#9
Illustrious Loremaster Join Date: Dec 2004 Posts: 226	never tried the Str AA lines in Beta im afraid so i cant really comment. I would imagine that they will be just as good for the non raid weapon equiped brawler as they were before tho. Although if new EoF legendary dropped gear turns out to be as good as todays fabled raid drops then things may start to change i guess. Message Edited by Illustrious on 11-14-2006 11:39 AM

11-15-2006, 01:05 AM	#10
KazzySoJaz General Join Date: Feb 2006 Location: Taxachusetts Posts: 213	I think the only way bare fists will be better is if you own hand of destruction and the 60.5 dmg rating calamity, and even then that is a total of 123.5 dmg rating, which will not give you much more dps than str line will. The str line also has a crush debuff, but the procs on the above fabled weapons might keep them ahead a bit.

11-15-2006, 01:25 AM	#11
psubull General Join Date: Nov 2004 Posts: 370	everything was scaled down relatively. Therefore if you have DWs with 55 DR or greater, you're still better off with them over the STR line. __________________

11-15-2006, 06:07 AM	#12
Untalent Join Date: Apr 2006 Posts: 130	So overall... monks are worse then before as far as tanking is the answer.

11-15-2006, 06:42 AM	#13
Tj Join Date: Jun 2005 Posts: 2	Monks are a joke now. You cant tank half as well as you did. You will take more damage then ever before. Soloing ? whats that.. they dont want you to. Dps .. ha ha ha ha haahaa. Its not the same Again.. You are not a tank You are slightly dps You are much more gimped then you were yesteday You will not solo The Fairy came and made us all bendover.

11-15-2006, 07:11 AM	#14
boogar Loremaster Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: New Hampshire Posts: 61	And the same goes with a Serker with mostly fabled gear and 22 master's,couldnt solo a green named in SoS.Im done good night and good luck because im not starting over again. Message Edited by boogar on 11-14-2006 06:12 PM

11-15-2006, 07:42 AM	#15
Harbing General Join Date: Dec 2005 Posts: 90	Hello,its really worse now; last night i was with my 70 monk (all ad3, key masters) in SotS gathering staves for the Claymore questline. I had no probs with the green heroics. Atm, after the update, im lying FD ed on the floor, waiting to regenerate 90% of my health and that my Heal refreshes so that i can take on the next single melee based 63 tripple green heroic Mob and -maybe- not die in the process.After the update i still have 65% avoidance and 2.9 k Mit (full AA deflection & parry, 2* dark chitin rings etc) but i get hit more often and i take for sure more damage.What is happening here ?CaineBladesDarathar

11-15-2006, 09:47 AM	#16
Harbing General Join Date: Dec 2005 Posts: 90	addendum:ok, its even worse than i thought it was. Apparently the Mobs just dont care if they are stifled or not. They just use their normal class like abilites (heal themself, use stun etc.). I tried this with Silencing Palm and also with the Dark Squall proc the Manacles of Dark Sky gives. It just doesnt affect them, even when i see the icon on them (eg. they havnt resisted it).Training is very hard now; if FD fails one time im mostly done. And i cant emphasize it enough. I get hit so often and so [Removed for Content] hard by green heroic mobs its ridiculous.I was always under the impression that we sacrifice tanking- and other abilities for soloability. But with this expansion / update SOE seemingly eleminated this Playstyle completely.CaineBladesDarathar