Tradeskill XP requirements.

[Ahupu]

Not sure if this was intended, but the tradeskill XP required from 95-96 went up by a factor of 5, but the adventure XP 95-96 stayed roughly the same? If this is working as intended it doesn't seem exactly fair.

[Kuulei]

Ahupu said: ↑

“Not sure if this was intended, but the tradeskill XP required from 95-96 went up by a factor of 5, but the adventure XP 95-96 stayed roughly the same? If this is working as intended it doesn't seem exactly fair.”

I was told: Exp amounts have not been adjusted for expansion yet
After attempting to get a single character to 100 carpenter, I gave up at level 97 and figure if this is what I have to look forward to, I will be damned if I am going to subject myself to this more than once There is even a 100% exp bonus on beta and its still painful.


If they put a buffer in later, I'll buff up to try recipes, but no, there just isn't enough time before nov 11 to level all 9 trade skills from 95 - 100.

[Caith]

Kuulei said: ↑

“I was told: Exp amounts have not been adjusted for expansion yet”

That was on a previous build, when it required 9 billion xp to level due to the table not being set up. The xp requirements for level have indeed increased over the previous expansion, you won't be able to sneeze and gain a level.

The tradeskill quest experience has NOT yet been adjusted to take the increase into account.

[Ahupu]

So am I to assume that the adventure experience will also be similarly altered? Because so far that does not seem to be the case. While I am primarily a crafter, I do adventure as well and increasing one without the other seems a bit heavy handed.

[FriggaWitch]

I wrote this in a prior post Why Bother

[Kuulei]

Caith said: ↑

“That was on a previous build, when it required 9 billion xp to level due to the table not being set up. The xp requirements for level have indeed increased over the previous expansion, you won't be able to sneeze and gain a level.

The tradeskill quest experience has NOT yet been adjusted to take the increase into account.”

I hope its adjusted during the beta, currently there is not enough hours in the day to level crafters to 100 to feedback and / or bug recipes

[Lateana]

I am resurrecting this because it has been 20 days into Beta and I have not seen an update on it yet. Today I ran a level 95 crafter through the questline and with the server bonus of 100% plus my Potion of Hastened Learning of 25% I moved up only 1/2 a level. When will this be addressed?

[Kalika]

Same here :
Adv questline completed => level 99,5 used a potion or two.
TS Questline =? level 95,4

To be fair, since the Adv is 5 times longer this 0.4 =>2 ... so level 97.

What i like in the previous expansions was that i never had to grind too much. TS timelines, even if longer, took us to 94 or 94,5 and I just did some extra city writ to level up.

[Lateana]

I just craft for my 40+ alts. I want to move up in crafting before I grow old and die.

[Pauly]

personally.. I like it harder to level. I don't like competing for customers with people who are NOT willing to put in the effort.

[Ahupu]

Pauly said: ↑

“personally.. I like it harder to level. I don't like competing for customers with people who are NOT willing to put in the effort.”

You misunderstand my complaint, I do not care that the xp required for TS levels is increased by a factor of five. I care that adventure levels increased from 94-95~12,000,000 to 95-96~ 12,500,000 and TS 94-95=50,000 to 95-96=239,000 (or so). There needs to be a parity or we are being punished for tradeskilling. I do not care which direction that parity is applied, Keep it the way it is for us and increase adv XP requirements to 60,000,000 and I would be just as happy.

[Cisteros]

I know 75-90 minutes a level sounds like a lot, especially when compared to the 30 minutes it took to level from 92-95

[Ahupu]

Ahupu said: ↑

“You misunderstand my complaint, I do not care that the xp required for TS levels is increased by a factor of five. I care that adventure levels increased from 94-95~12,000,000 to 95-96~ 12,500,000 and TS 94-95=50,000 to 95-96=239,000 (or so). There needs to be a parity or we are being punished for tradeskilling. I do not care which direction that parity is applied, Keep it the way it is for us and increase adv XP requirements to 60,000,000 and I would be just as happy.”

Sorry misposted this yesterday morning right before I left for work so (a little after the fact) edit:

Adventure xp 94-95~1,200,000 (not 12,000,000) and 95-96~1,250,000(not 12,500,000), oh and of course the ending 6,000,000 (not 60,000,000).


Other than that my point remains the same, either we suffer the same 4% increase as adventurers or they should suffer the 480% increase we did. I have 12 toons (95/95) all of which are going to have to suffer through leveling on both sides and I honestly do not care which way they chose to go for parity.

Caith said: ↑

“That was on a previous build, when it required 9 billion xp to level due to the table not being set up. The xp requirements for level have indeed increased over the previous expansion, you won't be able to sneeze and gain a level.

The tradeskill quest experience has NOT yet been adjusted to take the increase into account.”

So while I can appreciate this sentiment, its implementation has been, "The xp requirements for level have indeed increased over the previous expansion, you won't be able to sneeze and gain a level...unless you are an adventurer, your xp stayed the same...crafters though you guys need to get the equivalent of 25 of your last levels to get to 100." While I know it isn't, it FEELS like a punishment for not being an adventurer. You want to make it harder? Fine, make it harder across the board. XP gains from rush orders are a quantifiable amount gained at a reasonably set rate ( without a pot of progress roughly 3 minutes for me at least ymmv), after losing our vet bonuses it is going to take 25-30 rush orders PER LEVEL, or 75-90 minutes. In that same time, I could solo 2-3 adventure levels (depending on which amount of time), because I can gain XP from multiple kills in less time and in amounts that equate to doing a rush order in 10 seconds...for each kill. And as an adventure leveler I am slow, I know people who will be level 100 adventurers within an hour to an hour and a half of the expac going live. I do not want, or need, easy; what I want is fairness.

[Lateana]

It is actually much worse than stated. I can take three of my adventure toons out together (3 accounts) and level them all up at the same time. Crafters don't have that option. Crafters have to be leveled one at a time. So for me, it is 480% times three , or 1,440% worse for leveling up the same three adventure characters in crafting.

[Feldon]

The ability to do repetitive tasks for a longer period (grinding XP) just proves you are a better monkey, not that you are a more skilled, talented, or dedicated player. Dramatic increases in XP requirements don't make a better game, just a longer one.

[Deveryn]

Feldon said: ↑

“The ability to do repetitive tasks for a longer period (grinding XP) just proves you are a better monkey, not that you are a more skilled, talented, or dedicated player. Dramatic increases in XP requirements don't make a better game, just a longer one.”

Doing repetitive tasks for a longer period is what it's benn all about these days, with people having so many crafting alts. This was thanks to the initial change to faster xp, which didn't really make for a better game either. This will still be better than the way things were.

[Lateana]

Deveryn said: ↑

“Doing repetitive tasks for a longer period is what it's benn all about these days, with people having so many crafting alts. This was thanks to the initial change to faster xp, which didn't really make for a better game either. This will still be better than the way things were.”

Not hardly.

[Pauly]

so I can have all 9 of my crafters to 100 within a couple days if I choose to. Doesn't sound too hard.

[Deveryn]

So 1 writ gives ~5% at 95. It only means you'll want to level with progress potions. A couple of hours and about 17 potions later, you're done. In the end, it's good for anyone who actually got into this for some extra money and doesn't mind the work. It's another way for everyone to get a fair shot at selling the new stuff before everyone catches all their toons up.

[Ahupu]

Which is why I have stockpiled over 120 progress potions so far, I just resent the disparity between the two different play styles xp increases. As I said I wouldn't mind if both had such a drastic increase it is the one sidedness that gets me.

[Caith]

Ahupu said: ↑

“Which is why I have stockpiled over 120 progress potions so far, I just resent the disparity between the two different play styles xp increases. As I said I wouldn't mind if both had such a drastic increase it is the one sidedness that gets me.”

Lets be clear here. A level 95 tradeskiller can be leveled in a far quicker time then a level 95 adventurer, even without progress potions. To level from 95-96 as an adventurer it requires 1,212,000 experience points. To level from 95-96 as a tradeskiller it requires 237,600 experience points.

Exactly what parity are you championing?

[Paddyo]

The amount of experience needed, X, is irrelevant, Caith. It's the investment of time needed to level. The truth is, the WORK in tradeskill leveling has already been done in getting to 90 in the first place. Getting an adventurer to 90 is more or less a game of deciding which route of powerleveling that character you want to take; tradeskills are ALWAYS work. So forgive me if I believe that it shouldnt take me longer to go 95-96 tailor than it does 95-96 Inquisitor, or that it should even take the same amount of time. The numbers you speak of matter not, if the time investment becomes ridiculous. Besides, you have other ways of keeping tradeskillers from getting what they want quickly, ala research assistant bottlenecks and requiring elapsed time to pass before a follow up quest is offered. Leveling should NEVER be more work than adventuring.

[Paddyo]

I missed the main point I was trying to address: It can take a million xp points to level adventure and 237,600 xp points to level tradeskill, but I cant group 6 tradeskillers and soak their experience as I craft like I can in a full adventure group. If I am not getting enough XP from crafting and questing, it could take 10 xp to go from 95-96 and still take longer than adventure if the rate of return is significantly higher.

[Deveryn]

Adventuring is still more work, more moving around more doing things in general. Tradeskilling remains the most relaxed process, especially when you get to line up your writ giver, table and clipboard. I've never had finger or wrist troubles as a result of it, but I do get tired of pushing around an adventurer.

[Lateana]

As I and several others have pointed out, we can level several characters through adventuring at the same time and have fun doing it. Crafting is a solo affair and is zero fun doing writs. If we could do all the crafting quests as a group event, including writs as adventurers do, then it would be equal. As it is, crafters are penalized regarding both time and fun.

[Lateana]

As it stands, my husband and I will split between us our scholar crafters on each server we play on. Since I have the luckiest harvesters, he will focus on leveling up our scholars. Our main focus will be on our raid characters and the basics of their support. The rest of our fleet of crafters will have to wait until hell freezes over or until XP changes significantly.

[Sisca]

I've managed to get one of my army of alts through the signature quest line, mainly due to bugs in the early days and the difficulty of the "solo" dungeons. That said, that alt is at almost 99 without taking any XP potions or doing any grinding or running the Adv solo dungeons/missions. I figure if this was live I'd be able to do this in a couple of nights of easy playing and then run a bunch of AS missions for the coin & gear to be 100. I've also had the enjoyment of doing each of the required dungeons as a duo with my wife.

I've run multiple alts through the TS quest line and can easily do 2 - 3 a day through that line. Without using any XP potions none of the alts that I ran though at 95 even made it halfway to 96 by the end of the line.

I realize that they don't want you to "sneeze and be 100" but to me the huge disparity isn't in the amount of XP it's in the amount of entertainment. As an adventurer I spend a lot more time completing my quest line with a little grinding at the end to finish getting my level while as a tradeskiller I quickly finish my quest and end up basically grinding all 5 levels.

Sadly, I don't know how to fix it. If they gave more XP for the quest then they'd either have to make it much more grindy (harvest 100 of Item X instead of 5) like Qho's quests which isn't all that fun. They tried doing TS missions to encourage us to at least group up and do tradeskills but they don't seem all that popular and people were just soloing them anyway.

Perhaps they could put back the old TS instances and then provide a bonus to TS XP for everyone that's currently working on a writ in that instance. You're still grinding out your XP but at least you can do it with others around and it's not quite so solitary. The disadvantage is that most of us have gotten used to having everything in one place and all our raws in the harvest depot in our guild halls so they'd need some way of allowing us to use the depot without having to run back & forth to fill up our bags with raws & fuel. Just an idea and probably not feasible.

[Loredena]

I'm not sure what the answer is either, other than a lot more tradeskill quests, and I know there's a shortage of time for that! In earlier tiers I can essentially level off of TS quests, or grind writs, my choice and I've done both. In general the former is significantly more fun than the latter, but of course it's also a lot faster. I get that no one wants it to be an hours effort to get from 95 to 100 -- but it would be closer to what has happened in the past, plus what the adventurers see, if the tradeskill line at least got us partway through 97, especially since that's the level at which we can use the TS signature quest reward.

As others have said, it isn't the amount of experience required, that's just a math game. It's not even the # of hours (because yes, the adventurer signature quest line takes a good bit longer). It's the # of hours of mindless grinding. I don't mind finishing off a level or two that way, status is nice too after all! I do mind doing essentially the entire tier that way, especially given that it is a solo-only activity. That's really the difference - with adventuring I can choose to do it solo, with the crafting I have to.

[Pauly]

so, adventuring is too fast leveling. There is NO way someone should buy the expansion, do some simple quests for a few hours the first night and be at max level. That should take a week or more.
This game shouldn't be about being equal, being fast, being fair. It's about playing. If you don't want to play, then don't. Don't ruin it for the people that do like to play.

Why the rush to get your crafter to 100? What are you going to do after you ding? Stand in your guild hall and complain that it was too easy and you have nothing left to do?

[Cisteros]

no they are going to harvest and make bank selling stuff