Bruiser + Lock + Inquis

Kilil · 08-26-2009, 01:51 PM

Comin back to EQ here and we're runnin a small group. So far got a bruiser, warlock and inquisitor. AOE is a concern. What tools does a bruiser have to keep agro on AOE? As the Inquis and once in a while i'm getting healing agro, not too bad but it happens. The warlock can get aoe agro relativly easy. Any tips or suggestions? I am not well versed in bruiser and any info is appreciated.

tyvm

Aull · 08-26-2009, 06:30 PM

Bruisers have only one encounter taunt the is on an 18 sec reuse timer. At lvl 80 bruisers get divide and conquer that is a so so encounter taunt but is better than nothing. Savage assualt is the bruiser best blue aoe attention getting tool due to the massive damage that it can inflict if it crits, but the recast time is far to great to have any consistancy at holding aggro pull after pull.

With aa's bruisers can get the reuse timer shortened to be about 13 secs on the encounter taunt. However at the higher levels of play taunts are a joke in comparison to dps aggro. All basic taunts for all fighters not just bruisers do not dump enough threat to actually be better than dps. A 10k spell crit is far superior to a 1800 threat taunt and this is where fighters suffer when in groups with high dps.

The wisdom aa line helps as long as the temps are up. Other than that a bruiser will have difficulty with aoe aggro vs aoe dps classes.

At the lower levels of play this may not be that huge of an issue. Once the levels start to increase then a dps class will see their dps increase at a greater rate than what fighter dps and threat can account for.

It will be tough for a bruiser to hold aoe aggro.

Mosha D'Khan · 08-26-2009, 07:29 PM

Aull wrote:

Bruisers have only one encounter taunt the is on an 18 sec reuse timer. At lvl 80 bruisers get divide and conquer that is a so so encounter taunt but is better than nothing. Savage assualt is the bruiser best blue aoe attention getting tool due to the massive damage that it can inflict if it crits, but the recast time is far to great to have any consistancy at holding aggro pull after pull.
With aa's bruisers can get the reuse timer shortened to be about 13 secs on the encounter taunt. However at the higher levels of play taunts are a joke in comparison to dps aggro. All basic taunts for all fighters not just bruisers do not dump enough threat to actually be better than dps. A 10k spell crit is far superior to a 1800 threat taunt and this is where fighters suffer when in groups with high dps.
The wisdom aa line helps as long as the temps are up. Other than that a bruiser will have difficulty with aoe aggro vs aoe dps classes.
At the lower levels of play this may not be that huge of an issue. Once the levels start to increase then a dps class will see their dps increase at a greater rate than what fighter dps and threat can account for.
It will be tough for a bruiser to hold aoe aggro.

i would have to agree with this 100%. i also have a hard time keeping agro in aoe groups, but i am not spected in the wisdom line. still with how hard it is i dont think it would help all that much, but cant hurt to try.

Aull · 08-26-2009, 09:12 PM

I think from lvl 20-50 a bruiser will be ok for most everyday norrath group instances and quests. It is when the all the aa's, spell double attck, +spell & ca damage mods, spell & ca crits, and any other dps increaser that the dps classes get at the higher levels are what has made tanks have such trouble with aggro.

Fighter dps has gone up with the expansions but not threat. Taunts are useless basically.

It should not be as noticable till that time comes then things will change drastically. So just have fun till then.

Sprin · 09-25-2009, 07:47 PM

Remember when fighting in a zone with lots of Encounter atacks... designate someone as your "MA" for the group and constantly swap targets to do single target attacks and taunts on them.. . This will help TREMENDOUSLY when holding aggro against multiple targets..

in the start of an AOE / Encounter attack, toss up the group taunt and a solo taunt on the first target, do your two AOE's and swap to the next target, do some attacks on him and your solo target taunt again... swap back and forth between targets and make sure they arent on any other players.. if you come accross one that is, that is what rescue, drag, Divide and Conqure and your other Shadow tree force target is for... the one that increases your hate position (aka another rescue)...

Remember, you are tanking, not DPS'ng... while it is ESSENTIAL to put out as much DPS as you can to keep the mobs on you, AOE wise bruisers blow, so you have to swap targets often and do single target attacks to keep them all on you....

And remember the primary reactive taunt is based off you doing damage to the mobs, so this will help you do damage to everyone when your blue AOEs are down and helps trigger more aggro on each mob to you

It takes more skill as a bruiser to keep Encounters all on you, but its very doable.

End line Shadow tree gives you an ability to increase the taunt amount and change Divide and Conquor to a "all group" instead of "half group" force target onto you... put one point into that off the very get go when you get your 173 AA points... because that allows you another full group taunt / group rescue in AOE encounters...

Bruisers are beastly tanks that very few people actually play, and even less know how to play well as a tank... so tahts why they get bad reps as tanks, because a lot of people just plain suck at tanking, and there are far fewere bruisers out there tanking then anyone else, so it just goes to say there will be a LOT less "good" bruiser tanks then any other class... so therefore people think that Bruisers aren't as good at tanking... its not true.

Dechau · 09-26-2009, 07:04 AM

For that Trio you could also have the Lock to use a different spec?

They can make a transfer/feed hate spec that could help a little..

Sure he would lose some dps, but in the long run it might be an idea, since aggro will be better..

Aule · 09-26-2009, 07:41 AM

Most of the sorcerers I know are spec'd for this anyways because it gives them a bit more of a shot of living. Takes the 4% hate transfer and makes it 9%.

08-26-2009, 07:29 PM	#3
Mosha D'Khan Loremaster Join Date: Dec 2005 Posts: 440	Aull wrote: Bruisers have only one encounter taunt the is on an 18 sec reuse timer. At lvl 80 bruisers get divide and conquer that is a so so encounter taunt but is better than nothing. Savage assualt is the bruiser best blue aoe attention getting tool due to the massive damage that it can inflict if it crits, but the recast time is far to great to have any consistancy at holding aggro pull after pull. With aa's bruisers can get the reuse timer shortened to be about 13 secs on the encounter taunt. However at the higher levels of play taunts are a joke in comparison to dps aggro. All basic taunts for all fighters not just bruisers do not dump enough threat to actually be better than dps. A 10k spell crit is far superior to a 1800 threat taunt and this is where fighters suffer when in groups with high dps. The wisdom aa line helps as long as the temps are up. Other than that a bruiser will have difficulty with aoe aggro vs aoe dps classes. At the lower levels of play this may not be that huge of an issue. Once the levels start to increase then a dps class will see their dps increase at a greater rate than what fighter dps and threat can account for. It will be tough for a bruiser to hold aoe aggro. i would have to agree with this 100%. i also have a hard time keeping agro in aoe groups, but i am not spected in the wisdom line. still with how hard it is i dont think it would help all that much, but cant hurt to try. __________________

09-26-2009, 07:04 AM	#6
Dechau Loremaster Join Date: Jul 2005 Posts: 312	For that Trio you could also have the Lock to use a different spec? They can make a transfer/feed hate spec that could help a little.. Sure he would lose some dps, but in the long run it might be an idea, since aggro will be better.. __________________ Main: Scipius Africanus 90 Fury - The Lost Order Alts: Shauku Endbringer 90 Zerker - The Lost Order Leshrac Sigil 90 Defiler - The Lost Order Nicol Bolas 90 Bruiser - The Lost Order Gosta Dirk 82 Dirge - Mighty Danes Splitpaw server for the win..

09-26-2009, 07:41 AM	#7
Aule Server: Guk Loremaster Join Date: Dec 2005 Posts: 1,360	Most of the sorcerers I know are spec'd for this anyways because it gives them a bit more of a shot of living. Takes the 4% hate transfer and makes it 9%. __________________ guk.Aule - 90 coercer \| Troops of Doom \| 90 bruiser - guk.Krindi

08-26-2009, 01:51 PM	#1
Kilil Loremaster Join Date: Nov 2004 Posts: 76	Comin back to EQ here and we're runnin a small group. So far got a bruiser, warlock and inquisitor. AOE is a concern. What tools does a bruiser have to keep agro on AOE? As the Inquis and once in a while i'm getting healing agro, not too bad but it happens. The warlock can get aoe agro relativly easy. Any tips or suggestions? I am not well versed in bruiser and any info is appreciated. tyvm

08-26-2009, 06:30 PM	#2
Aull Loremaster Join Date: Jan 2006 Posts: 1,429	Bruisers have only one encounter taunt the is on an 18 sec reuse timer. At lvl 80 bruisers get divide and conquer that is a so so encounter taunt but is better than nothing. Savage assualt is the bruiser best blue aoe attention getting tool due to the massive damage that it can inflict if it crits, but the recast time is far to great to have any consistancy at holding aggro pull after pull. With aa's bruisers can get the reuse timer shortened to be about 13 secs on the encounter taunt. However at the higher levels of play taunts are a joke in comparison to dps aggro. All basic taunts for all fighters not just bruisers do not dump enough threat to actually be better than dps. A 10k spell crit is far superior to a 1800 threat taunt and this is where fighters suffer when in groups with high dps. The wisdom aa line helps as long as the temps are up. Other than that a bruiser will have difficulty with aoe aggro vs aoe dps classes. At the lower levels of play this may not be that huge of an issue. Once the levels start to increase then a dps class will see their dps increase at a greater rate than what fighter dps and threat can account for. It will be tough for a bruiser to hold aoe aggro.

08-26-2009, 09:12 PM	#4
Aull Loremaster Join Date: Jan 2006 Posts: 1,429	I think from lvl 20-50 a bruiser will be ok for most everyday norrath group instances and quests. It is when the all the aa's, spell double attck, +spell & ca damage mods, spell & ca crits, and any other dps increaser that the dps classes get at the higher levels are what has made tanks have such trouble with aggro. Fighter dps has gone up with the expansions but not threat. Taunts are useless basically. It should not be as noticable till that time comes then things will change drastically. So just have fun till then.

09-25-2009, 07:47 PM	#5
Sprin Server: Nagafen Guild: L U S H Rank: LUSH (Supreme Drinker!) General Join Date: Apr 2007 Posts: 2,364	Remember when fighting in a zone with lots of Encounter atacks... designate someone as your "MA" for the group and constantly swap targets to do single target attacks and taunts on them.. . This will help TREMENDOUSLY when holding aggro against multiple targets.. in the start of an AOE / Encounter attack, toss up the group taunt and a solo taunt on the first target, do your two AOE's and swap to the next target, do some attacks on him and your solo target taunt again... swap back and forth between targets and make sure they arent on any other players.. if you come accross one that is, that is what rescue, drag, Divide and Conqure and your other Shadow tree force target is for... the one that increases your hate position (aka another rescue)... Remember, you are tanking, not DPS'ng... while it is ESSENTIAL to put out as much DPS as you can to keep the mobs on you, AOE wise bruisers blow, so you have to swap targets often and do single target attacks to keep them all on you.... And remember the primary reactive taunt is based off you doing damage to the mobs, so this will help you do damage to everyone when your blue AOEs are down and helps trigger more aggro on each mob to you It takes more skill as a bruiser to keep Encounters all on you, but its very doable. End line Shadow tree gives you an ability to increase the taunt amount and change Divide and Conquor to a "all group" instead of "half group" force target onto you... put one point into that off the very get go when you get your 173 AA points... because that allows you another full group taunt / group rescue in AOE encounters... Bruisers are beastly tanks that very few people actually play, and even less know how to play well as a tank... so tahts why they get bad reps as tanks, because a lot of people just plain suck at tanking, and there are far fewere bruisers out there tanking then anyone else, so it just goes to say there will be a LOT less "good" bruiser tanks then any other class... so therefore people think that Bruisers aren't as good at tanking... its not true.