Whats wrong with this picture ?

[HalekAm]

I'm sorry to say, in the words of the fat lady, it's time to go.Having been with EQ2 from the start and having played for many years now , the deciding factor in my  leaving wasn't so much the content of the game ,  as the realization  just how dated and wooden  the graphics and game play  are. In my mind the last two expansions really didn't cut it in terms of revamping and revitalizing  the game. The Desert of Flames  module was I think , the exception in terms of novelty, interest  and pushing the graphical envelop and I'd hoped with each new release they would match its quality and innovation , but imho they  didn't even come close. (They didn't  even have  a  game coin )  Now with duo processors , high speed internet and dynamic video cards being the norm,  the expectations of today' s game is not in Windows 95 mode. Now I'm not trying to compare EQ2 graphics   to say  AoC, which is kinda unfair, but to games of a similar age  like WOW. Even though the timelines of  both are similar, Wow's   "outland"  expansion was "new" and  outstanding in its visuals ,with its lush  surreal lanscapes and vivid colors (I play both games on the high resolution side). As for just one example of them pushing  the gameplay boundaries , flying mounts anyone ?  It continues to attract new players and keeps older ones because  it managed to revitalise the the original game . EQ2 got flying carpets for example that don't really fly, heck they dont even glide well.  I see that some  cosmetic changes are in the works but given the track record of its expansions, which would have been the oppotunity for updates, I don't see it making a huge difference. Now I know the argument can be made about folklore and depth of content verses graphics etc , but then if that is the main selling point why  not  stick with  Everquest 1 ? The reason why most people went to EQ2 were surely the new graphics engine and flowing  gameplay, wasn't it ?  In reading the posts from the devs it seems as though there is little interest in pushing the game out of its current old  format.  It's going the way of SWG and EQ1 , with some expansions to the old tired formulas, eventually   following the Asheron's Call's  path of cyber oblivion. I think  I read that Sony's not even considering an EQ III, which to my mind enforces the opinion that it no long interested in wanting to change.   I am grateful for the years I spent on the game, thanks to all  for the  helps and groups/guilds I've been in ,  its been a blast.  I do hope I am wrong and will one day be a noob in Qeynos 3 getting flamed for being lost in the city.No u can't have my stuff, my house elf is transmutting  the gold into Bejewelled 2 points!!

[Zabe]

Best of luck to you.  I hope you find a game that better fits with your playstyle.  It's clear that you don't want anyone to change your mind, but voice your thoughts prior to leaving.

If you can't find that new game, luck to you in real life.

Zabee.

[Ticker123]

ok, game isnt for you anymore, bye

[Elebu]

Cool and awesome game graphics are of course a selling point to me, but the more important point to me would be the game content and the quality of the overall experience.

After having played UO, EQ1, AC, DAoC, WoW, EQ2, SWG, etc...EQ2 in my mind still has the best gaming experience for the money with competitive, if not substantially better graphics than the competitors, to boot.  I could probably have just as much fun working through EQ2 as a console-based game as a 3D-engine based game.

People always pull out the 'WoW' card but as far as graphics goes, there is no comparison between EQ2 and WoW, keeping in mind EQ2 launched before WoW.  I suppose if low-poly, high-blur graphics are your thing, WoW is right up your alley and the best thing since the interweb.

For me however, I'll take the graphical richness, complexity, and scalability that EQ2 offers over any other MMORPG offering out there - hands down.  A friend I got to return to EQ2 with me and I often talk about how the EQ2 gaming experience is much more like a single-player RPG game rather than a network and client intensive MMORPG.

Best of luck in your search for better mounts and graphics though!

[Svann]

IMO people came to eq2 from eq1 for the gameplay, not the graphics.  Good luck finding another game with as many play options as eq2, I cant think of one.  Hey if you do find one with better gameplay, come back and let us know.

[Jovie]

Svann wrote:

IMO people came to eq2 from eq1 for the gameplay, not the graphics.  Good luck finding another game with as many play options as eq2, I cant think of one.  Hey if you do find one with better gameplay, come back and let us know.

Incorrect for most. Eq1 gameplay was and is pretty much still the best overall system in an mmo.

People came to eq2 for a graphical evolution.

[Halato]

If I had to guess, HalekAmet, it's most likely you are just tired of seeing the same stuff and playing the same game for so long.  I left WoW not because it's a bad game but because it's old hat and the next expansion doesn't promise anything but 9 million Death Knights.  I was just tired of it all.  Orcs aren't unique or fascinating anymore.  They are still rolling their shoulders the exact same way 4 years later.It had been 4 years since I had logged into EQ2, and frankly I've found the graphics pretty stunning when I logged in last week. My computer back in the day wasn't very fast and EQ2 looked grainy and fuzzy. Now that my computer is better they are very crisp and look great.   I say this even after running AoC on high settings for 6 weeks.

[ke'la]

Jovie@Guk wrote:

Svann wrote:

IMO people came to eq2 from eq1 for the gameplay, not the graphics.  Good luck finding another game with as many play options as eq2, I cant think of one.  Hey if you do find one with better gameplay, come back and let us know.

Incorrect for most. Eq1 gameplay was and is pretty much still the best overall system in an mmo.

People came to eq2 for a graphical evolution.

Wow, I would like to have the power to read minds like you do.People came to EQ2 for many different reasons, some just to see what happened after 500 years, some for the graphical imporvment, some for the promous of different gameplay(see all the "this isn't EQ1" posts in the first year if you don't believe me), the truth most came for a combination of reasons not just one, besides if people just came for the "Graphical Evolution" then why are there any former EQ1 players still playing as EQ2 is about as much like a graphically evolved EQ1 as Halflife is like an RPG.

[Giral]

funny cuase most of the people i know that play eq2 are running on older comps , outdated cards, etc,, and play somewhere under balanced settings , and in raids they go to ectrme and turn things down from there ( well preset now )

i have all the spell graphics turned down to just see a little bit of sparkly warklies, have all the overhead combat turned off, run below balanced settings (tweaked down from there as my comp also is a bit dated&nbsp and raid tweaked from extreme .

 if pretty graphics is the main reason you play a game, or leave a game then realy i dont feel sad that your leaving over it.  i'll take a interesting,lore filled,solo,group,raid,tons of zones,multiple tradeskill's,mutliple rasec, multiple classes ,etc game that has Crap graphics, over some Shiney game that has Much less of all of the above 10/ out of 10 times.

also lots of people play Free MMo's. the graphics in them are worse then WOW , but some of them are actualy Fun, have alot sterner death penelties, exp takes longer to aquire,more debt,less loot from mobs, etc,, why do people play these Free MMO's and enjoy them ? sure isnt only becuase there free , becuase some i would pay for(and i have when some of them turned into Pay to play games )  

think this post is just to try and stir up the devs to action on the graphics for High end Dual/Quad core systems, i have seen people in the forums say they run in Max settings(shadows turned down or off) and that on there sytem it runs near flawlessly, and to them the gameis the best Graphic looking game out , i have seen some of the realy nice vids of AOC, and i think the terian,landscapes,mountains ,etc,, look fantastic, but realy Eq2 has been out for going on 5 years .  and in 5 years we all know how for things have advanced with technology, you can Browse the internet on your CELL phone now, what could you do with your Cell phone 5 years ago ?

add to that they didnt just create eq2 overnight, im sure it was in the making for atleast a year befor , and i dont know if there was a graphical engine overhall befor life, but if the started working on eq2 in 2002 the game engine would be about 6 years old maybe older,  and the graphics you can achieve in eq2 are pretty fantastic for a 6 year old engine if you think about it compared to todays games( LOTR? Lol played it hated the washed out look of the game, seemed storyIsh type graphics to me, and Wow well lol i never gave the game a chance cuase i played it for 2 days and /Removed from Hard drive )

[Illine]

graphics are important, and I don't like WoW graphics.

I don't like characters in vanguard

maybe the wolrd is more beautifull in VG than in EQ2, but I do like EQ2 better. my dark elf is just beautifull.

graphics are not everything. First you'll be amazed, but then, if there is a lack of content, you won't spend your days looking at the landscapes. Like in your city.

When you live in a city you just don't look at it anymore, not like a tourist, same for the game, When you've played it for 4 years you don't see it the same way as when you just start.

for me the only bad point on graphics are spells. not so amazing, escpecially some end spells and that spell increase always get the same graphics.  I though that the stronger you were, the more amazing spells would be ... nayyyy !!

Anyway, when I'm raidingm I play extrem perf and I look more my hotbars, my life, other people's mana than the game itself :p

[ZachSpastic]

I have yet to find an MMO with better visuals than EQ2. Goodbye, OP. I'm sure you won't be missed.

[bleap]

ZachSpastic wrote:

I have yet to find an MMO with better visuals than EQ2. Goodbye, OP. I'm sure you won't be missed.

Such anger.....Apparently you haven't tried too many other MMOs out there....the graphics engine in EQ2 is just a few years out of date...and SOE refuses to upgrade it....As for content.....wether you like it or not, EQ2 content is pretty much rehashed throughout the game....they throw in a new MoB or 2 per expansion, but the dragonflies in Ferrot are the same in Fens, the skeletons are pretty much the same everywhere, the rocks and trees are just cut and paste....even your spells are basically the same 5-6 spells with varying degrees of power...and with the exception of a handful of "specialty" spells, all the fighters abilities do the same thing, all the casters spells do the same thing and all the scouts abilities do teh same thing...they just might do it with a different weapon....SOE has become creatively lazy...and why shouldn't they....they have a captive, addicted base population that thinks EQ2 is the best game out there...so why pump money into something that people think is "good enough"? Bottom line is if you are satisfied with EQ2 the way it is, SOE isn't going to change much....if you want change you have 2 options....either complain LOUDLY or protest with your wallet and go elsewhere...

[Spyderbite]

bleap wrote:

if you want change you have 2 options....either complain LOUDLY or protest with your wallet and go elsewhere...

When did complaining loudly ever accomplish anything? If you believe that any changes made to the game were a result of complaints on the forums, you're badly mistaken. Sure, the loud complaints are noted.. but, probably a lot less than the well worded, informative and respectful posts.

[ZachSpastic]

bleap wrote:

ZachSpastic wrote:

I have yet to find an MMO with better visuals than EQ2. Goodbye, OP. I'm sure you won't be missed.

Such anger.....Apparently you haven't tried too many other MMOs out there....the graphics engine in EQ2 is just a few years out of date...and SOE refuses to upgrade it....As for content.....wether you like it or not, EQ2 content is pretty much rehashed throughout the game....they throw in a new MoB or 2 per expansion, but the dragonflies in Ferrot are the same in Fens, the skeletons are pretty much the same everywhere, the rocks and trees are just cut and paste....even your spells are basically the same 5-6 spells with varying degrees of power...and with the exception of a handful of "specialty" spells, all the fighters abilities do the same thing, all the casters spells do the same thing and all the scouts abilities do teh same thing...they just might do it with a different weapon....SOE has become creatively lazy...and why shouldn't they....they have a captive, addicted base population that thinks EQ2 is the best game out there...so why pump money into something that people think is "good enough"? Bottom line is if you are satisfied with EQ2 the way it is, SOE isn't going to change much....if you want change you have 2 options....either complain LOUDLY or protest with your wallet and go elsewhere...

The engine is in dire need of either an overhaul and replacement, that I agree with (multi-core support and actually using the GPU rather than have it sitting idle). But that isn't what the OP said. OP said he was leaving because he thinks WoW is prettier. I stand by my original assertion that the visuals in EQ2 are better than any other MMO currently running live servers. Performance and game content are completely different issues from pretty.

[Naubeta]

How can you think wow looks better than EQ2?

[Shemyaza]

Naubitzi@Crushbone wrote:

How can you think wow looks better than EQ2?

wow's look is consistant throughout. all the armour (even the big shoulders /sigh), weapons, buildings, landscapes, incidental items, creatures, all of it looks like it belongs in the same world. you can argue the merits of the art, but you can't argue about the overall art design and direction. compare that to eq2 where there doesn't seem to be an over all art direction at all.

i'm one of the people that came back during the legends promotion and have to admit that i was underwhelmed by a lot of the stuff i have seen. i don't know if it's tied to the fact that they can't seem to/can't afford to/don't want to upgrade the engine but the trial of the isle section looks more lush, better drawn - hell, just plain better - than a lot of the later zones. it's as if they have had to strip the larger zones down to the bare bones just to keep the engine chugging along at an acceptable rate.

i wouldn't say eq2 looks bad, just patchy. for everything you stop and gawk at in wonder, there's another where you wonder "what the hell ?"

oh, and what happened to the "new" skeletal system they have been promising for the last few years and all the new armour models it would bring? is it coming out before or after duke nukem 4? i know that sounds more than a little facetious, but they really should have had it rolled out by now instead of it only being one race.

[Surething]

Goodbye, farewell, and good luck.

By the way you probably should get your eyes checked; you appear to be having problems with your vision.

[ZachSpastic]

Surething wrote:

Goodbye, farewell, and good luck.

By the way you probably should get your eyes checked; you appear to be having problems with your vision.

That's a possibility I hadn't considered. Perhaps the OP is completely blind, and relies on a friend with a serious drug and alcohol problem to describe to him what is displayed on screen while playing.

[Naubeta]

I really like how EQ2 looks. The thing people criticise - the claymation/pixar - look is what appeals to me. I like the way the models are done with far too many polygons instead of normal maps, I like the tiny details on everything and etc.

[Gilasil]

Did I understand this right?

People actually thought WoW graphics are better then EQ2 graphics?

/boggle

It takes all kinds I guess.

I tried out WoW last ear just to see what the fuss was about.  I was underwhelmed.  I HATED the graphics and it looked to me that the gameplay was a copycat of EQ1 with minor refinements (soloability, rage).  I played for a few months, decided to give EQ2 another go BECAUSE OF ITS GRAPHICS, liked the general direction of gameplay and stayed.

In my mind, WoW is basically pre-Luclin EQ1 graphics with a cartoony venear to make it less obvious what it is.  It's only redeaming feature is it'll run well on a real piece of junk computer.  Since my computers are a few steps above the "junk" category, there's no reason for me to be playing WoW if I can be playing EQ2. 

Basically EQ2 got me back with graphics, soloability, Iksar, storeylines, and lots and lots of content.  But I wouldn't have given it a second chance if it weren't for it's graphics.

Flying mounts would be nice to have in EQ2, but they're not enough by themselves to overcome the CARTOONY WOW GRAPHICS as well as having no cool race I can immerse myself in like I can the Iksar.

I've looked over the propaganda on some of the newer games but none has grabbed me.  I even tried Vanguard (somehow my beta of Vanguard was enough to let me play for free) and couldn't stand the choppiness and poor graphics (I'm spoiled by EQ2),  I gave it up after an hour.  Pity, the classes in particular looked good although I wasn't thrilled with any of the race choices.  If Vanguard had the EQ2 engine I'd have given it a much more serious look even if it was single threaded.

I understand AoC has realistic style graphics and I periodically look it over but it lacks a race I can really immerse myself in.  The Iksar have also spoiled me.  Maybe if I'd been a bigger Conan fan over the years (only ever read one book) it might have caught my eye more.  No, I'm more into the classic fantasy EQ1-2 go after rather then the Conan style.

I understand that the EQ2 engine can't take advantage of multicore machines, but I can cut them some slack.  I'm a software developer IRL and have been spending a lot of time lately plotting a course to migrate the software I'm responsible for to multicore without doing a complete rewrite.  Believe me it's not easy for some software.  Not even close.   In fact the whole multicore trend is on the verge of causing all sorts of problems for software development and not just for games.  Eventually it has the potential to cause a major shift in the way software is designed.   So if SoE hasn't managed to make their single threaded engine multithreaded I can understand.  My company has a whole crapload of software in the same boat.

[Giral]

think this is a good thread that shows how very nice eq2 can look http://forums.station.sony.com/eq2/...topic_id=344003  (b.t.w make sure to scroll back to the beggining of the post as there are 31 pages in this thread with some realy amazing screenshots thru out it )

i realy never have seen anything from wow that could compete with even one of those pictures

Age of Conan does have a step up in graphics from eq2, but it was just released so shouldnt it beat eq2 Hands down? but realy it does not  beat eq2 to a pulp, eq2 on max settings isn't to shabby in a side by side.

and alot more in the http://forums.station.sony.com/eq2/....m?forum_id=206

[Bozojrill1]

Jovie@Guk wrote:

Svann wrote:

IMO people came to eq2 from eq1 for the gameplay, not the graphics. Good luck finding another game with as many play options as eq2, I cant think of one. Hey if you do find one with better gameplay, come back and let us know.

Incorrect for most. Eq1 gameplay was and is pretty much still the best overall system in an mmo.

People came to eq2 for a graphical evolution.

I played EQ for 4-5 years. Hope you don't mean combat is simpler in EQ2, because in EQ1 almost every single class only had to press one button in raids/groups. I also hope you don't mean EQ1 was casual friendly, as almost all classes were forced to group besides a couple. I also hope you don't mean the tradeskill system was better in EQ1, as i found EQ2 tradeskillers more fun, and rewarding (although not really massive money-makers in most cases) and you actually had to do stuff instead of getting carpel tunnel clicking all the materials into the container (before the update) and then clicking one button to combine them all.So i'm not see'n where gameplay in EQ1 is better than anything in all newer MMORPGs. Honestly the only reason i played EQ1 for so long was because it was my first MMORPG, and i had a great guild/friends.

[Sabatini]

Giralus wrote:

Age of Conan does have a step up in graphics from eq2, but it was just released so shouldnt it beat eq2 Hands down? but realy it does not  beat eq2 to a pulp, eq2 on max settings isn't to shabby in a side by side.

Thats the absolute truth. I just came back from AoC and expected EQ2 to look alot worse in comparison but in reality it still looks great and runs a hell of alot smoother for me than AoC. If I turn AOC graphics down to the point that it works as well as EQ2 on full settings, it actually looks worse. When you add on top of that the sheer volume of things to do in this game over that one, and I wonder why I ever left sometimes.

But to each their own.

[Shemyaza]

Giralus wrote:

i realy never have seen anything from wow that could compete with even one of those pictures

i downloaded the wow trial and found two things:

[Draag]

As for content.....wether you like it or not, EQ2 content is pretty much rehashed throughout the game....they throw in a new MoB or 2 per expansion, but the dragonflies in Ferrot are the same in Fens, the skeletons are pretty much the same everywhere, the rocks and trees are just cut and paste....even your spells are basically the same 5-6 spells with varying degrees of power...and with the exception of a handful of "specialty" spells, all the fighters abilities do the same thing, all the casters spells do the same thing and all the scouts abilities do teh same thing...they just might do it with a different weapon....SOE has become creatively lazy...and why shouldn't they....they have a captive, addicted base population that thinks EQ2 is the best game out there...so why pump money into something that people think is "good enough"?I could not agree more. You nailed it.I don't play WoW, not for years, but their graphics were much better than eq2 and they were SMART enough to make it playable on low-end systems.That's right, SMART enough to make their game compatable with millions of people's computers.

[Sabatini]

Shemyaza wrote:

Giralus wrote:

i realy never have seen anything from wow that could compete with even one of those pictures

i downloaded the wow trial and found two things:

Now I look at that picture and see Grotesquely oversized feet, undersized head, lower resolution textures and a man who cant hold a cup by the handle. It aint pretty. 

Having said that, I'll agree that one of the things I do hate the most in EQ is Robes (nearly every other game on the planet does better ones) and the ability to sit on the furnishings in our beautiful homes.

[Shemyaza]

it's all well and good having a thread dealing with super-high rez screenshots with all the options turned on; it's another trying to actually run the game like that in almost any instance you care to mention. the tech for it just isn't there and never will be. i'd go over why this is the case, but i'm sure everyone is already well acquainted with the reasons.

one can argue and make derisive comments about blizzards choice of art style in wow, but you can't argue with the fact that they absolutely nailed it for the average pc user; by keeping the req's low they gave everyone a fair chance of being able to play the game on what even then was non-current hardware. this approach is the absolute opposite of what soe did with the (dead end) game engine they chose. iirc, at launch eq2 had the highest recommended spec of any game i'd played.

i remember loading up eq2 for the first time and thinking that what i was seeing on screen had no relation at all to what was on the back of the box or in all the previews i had seen. wow, on the other hand, looked pretty much like all the screenshots i'd seen.

right now i am running a q6600 and a 9600gt (a common pairing these days) and there are times when eq2 looks stunning. there are also places like neriak and other busy regions where i can watch the fraps fps meter sink faster than i would have thought possible. one only have to look at some of the super-sized kunark zones to see that the pay off of such large zones was a reduction in their complexity.

i haven't played conan yet (i've got my CE box waiting to be opened in around 6 months when the game has ironed out a lot of the bugs), so i can't really comment on that; i can say that warhammer at least seems to have learned that you shouldn't aim so high when it comes to system specs and has kept them system friendly. the recent graphics update in beta really made it look a lot better without requiring a high spec system (i've played it on a few different systems). christ, even vanguard has an easier time on my pc than eq2 does sometimes. i should add that, for me at least, lotro has come closest to balancing graphics and performance. the dx10 stuff looks really, really nice.

soe have had 4 years to optimize the game-engine, i can't really see them getting much more out of it unless they gut the thing and rebuild it; shadows still don't work properly, for gods' sake. sadly, that's something i just don't think viable with the subs that eq2 gets them. i doubt they would spend so much time, resources and money on something they can't show in black and white got them extra dollars.

with the benefit of hindsight i wondered what things the current dev team would have done differently with eq2. I'm guessing that the game-engine and the number of classes would be high on their lists of "i wish it hadn't been done that way" items.

any dev out there want to answer that particular query?

[liveja]

Shemyaza wrote:

Giralus wrote:

i realy never have seen anything from wow that could compete with even one of those pictures

i downloaded the wow trial and found two things:

Beauty is in the eye of the beholder. IMO, that robe is hideously ugly, as is pretty much every other armor/weapon model in World of Warcraft.

Frankly, I'll happily sacrifice the ability to sit in a chair, in exchange for the very nice armor & weapon models we have in EQ2.

Edit: my machine is less than stellar, yet I run in High Quality at all times -- even in raids -- & only experience any kind of significant lag in places like Neriak. WoW was an acceptable substitute back when my PC had a 1.2ghz processor & 800MB RAM, but now, with twice the processor & three times the RAM, I have no issues running EQ2. I could probably run WoW even better ... but then I'd have to look at hideously ugly WoW graphics, not to mention putting up with their fecal swamp of a player base.

[RanmaBoyType]

1) I agree that robe is horrible, and if you have not seen a pretty robe in EQ2 then im sorry it is because your machine in general can't handle the process to have that detail turned on, but don't say they dont exist.  I'll take a screeny of a robe in eq2 and you put it side to side with that one from WoW and then tell me which is better.

2) I agree however with one of the above poster's.  The issue I have with EQ2 is not what you see, it is how eq2's engine processes what you see.  Horrible CPU utilization, especially in a dual core/quad core environment.  Absolutely non existent GPU utilization, upgrading your video card for eq2 is almost a waste it seeems as the engine so horribly uses what GPU's can do today.

It seems to me to get the best experience out of eq2 is to have a fast single core processor and alot of memory.  Everything else is trivial at best.  its ridiculous to think that a single core 4g processor will out perform a quad core 3.0, however it will simply because eq2's engine is written extremely poorly.

If eq2 engine were fixed to better utilize what people have in their machines, then the only thing that would happen is EVERYONE would be able to see a better selection of graphics in the game, that already exist, with half the lag you get if you try to look at it now.  People with lower end machines would not be hurt by this "fix" either, as their utilization would not change.

[Gilasil]

I've been running EQ2 on a three year old machine (no upgrades since it was bought) and the graphics are awesome.  I don't run at close to max settings, but I see nice light interactions, REAL shadows (not that crappy little dark circle under my character)  good looking characters, armor, and weapons.   When it rains I look wet.  The list goes on.  That's just on the normal settings I play with all the time.  On a three year old machine. 

When EQ2 first came out it required a fairly high end setup to really appreciate it, but times have changed.   What was high end then is low end now.  After some quick clicking around the Dell website it looks to me like you could buy something roughly equivalent to my three year old comp nowadays for around $650, and that includes the monitor.

I like to take screenshots of stuff and use them as wallpaper because they look so awesome.

I'm sorry that so many people out there have such sorry excuses for PCs that they can't see EQ2 in all it's splendor, but it really does have awesome graphics.

WoW on the other hand, the less said the better.  Weapons and armor are nothing but caricatures.  Heh, the entire game is a caricature.  I sure wasn't taking screenshots for wallpaper when I was playing WoW on the same machine.

There is no freaking comparison.  EQ2 messed up a lot of things, but one thing they really nailed was the graphics.