The re-charge bug is back with a vengence and -worse- than ever

Rijacki · 11-15-2005, 09:53 PM

Potions, poisons, and totems are items with multiple charges. The are designed to run out after being used a set number of times. However, there is a nasty nasty bug that keeps resurfacing (and now it is at its worst) that "refills" the charged item with zoning of any kind. It doesn't matter where the poison, potion, or totem is when it is used or even if it is moved from one slot to another (the last refill bug only "worked" when an item was not moved from the old activatible slot). Poisons, potions, and totems don't run out unless you use all the charges in one zone (and don't die). This is a problem! There have been numerous times the "refill bug" was said to be fixed and it resurfaces (sometimes slightly different) with the next LU. The simple solution would be to make poisons, potions and totems single use, stacking items (but still have them crafted with the same number of "doses" as current: 7 max for poisons and potions, 15 max for totems). When a dose is used, it would be gone forever, just like food is when an item is consumed. The side benefit of making them stacking single use items would be the ability to have more than the current dose amount (in the non-stacking bauble) in a stack without taking up more inventory space (i.e. a scout could have 20 of one poison in -one- stack rather than three 7-dose vials). FIX THE REFILL BUG PERAMENTLY! please! Totems, poisons, and potions are NOT supposed to be like an imbued ring, a hex doll, or any other non-charged usable buff. Totems, poisons, and potions are supposed to be "consumed" after a certain number of charges are used. The effects on several of the potions have been improved with that in mind. The effects of poisons have been tuned with that in mind. FIX THE REFILL BUG PERAMENTLY! Please make them into stacking single use items (but retain the multi-combine or they will go back to being -waaaaay- to expensive to produce). Potions, poisons, and totems do not require attuning. Since they currently refill, they can be handed down from one character to another. They can even used by everyone in a party (as long as the last dose is not used) and then refilled with the next zoning. (They should, though, retain the multi-dose from one combine since alchemists and woodworkers do not have cheaper fuel costs like provisioners and the cost to craft per-dose is -still- higher, at least for poisons, than the NPC sold per dose). FIX THE REFILL BUG! Fix it in a way it won't ever come back. We're all tired of trying to convince devs that the problem exists every single LU after it's "fixed"

Ildarus · 11-15-2005, 10:13 PM

In my opinion this isn't a problem. Some of them are getting to [expletive haxx0red by Raijinn] expensive anyways. We have SoW totems going for over 2gp a piece at times on our server. If it is fixed though, I don't care either, I am about to start making my own Sow Totems and I will give them to my guild members and that will fix the pricing problem. LOL

zorbdan · 11-15-2005, 10:15 PM

That stackable idea is a good one, at release potions were stackable then they changed it for some reason who knows why. I would also like to see them change it back to stackable and for gods sake pls fix the recharge bug once and for all.

Message Edited by zorbdan on 11-15-2005 09:19 AM

PurrceyPurespir · 11-15-2005, 10:16 PM

I agree...leave it in. Few extra uses are nice.

Aweful big tirade over such a small thing. Many more important bugs than this.

zorbdan · 11-15-2005, 10:26 PM

Ildarus wrote:
In my opinion this isn't a problem. Some of them are getting to [expletive haxx0red by Raijinn] expensive anyways. We have SoW totems going for over 2gp a piece at times on our server. If it is fixed though, I don't care either, I am about to start making my own Sow Totems and I will give them to my guild members and that will fix the pricing problem. LOL

The recharge bug is probably what is causing the high prices.

Cuz · 11-15-2005, 10:57 PM

PurrceyPurespirit wrote:

I agree...leave it in. Few extra uses are nice.

Aweful big tirade over such a small thing. Many more important bugs than this.

It's not a few extra uses, it's a permanent item if you pay half attention. Use them a few times, zone, you have it at full again. In all honnesty 2gp for a SoW totem that you'll never run out of is rather cheap. I can tell you that people not in my guild will be looking at some mighty hefty prices for my potions and poisons soon enough. Why should I sell t5 legendary poisons at 4 gold when the player, like his weapon and armor, can have it for as long as he wants it?

SniplenButterfigs · 11-15-2005, 10:59 PM

PurrceyPurespirit wrote:

I agree...leave it in. Few extra uses are nice.

Aweful big tirade over such a small thing. Many more important bugs than this.

Did it ever occur to you that the alchemists can't make any money if they sell one potion every ten years? It's not a few extra uses, it's a neverending potion/poison.

Silverfrost · 11-15-2005, 11:39 PM

We're currently trying to reproduce this in our development environment, but haven't been able to so far. If someone has exact steps I'd love to hear them.

Cuz · 11-15-2005, 11:45 PM

Use a charge, log out, and back in. The charge should be back. That's how I used to keep my own potions going. I had to make sure not to unequip them however. I haven't tried it in a while, but the OP seems to believe it's still there. Considering no one has clamored about it being gone, I kind of believe him.

Vulking · 11-15-2005, 11:49 PM

I would think this would be easy to fix. Just make every potion, poison, totem, etc. have just one charge. When crafting allow up to 8 to be made if pristine combine is done. I think you could then make them stackable.

I believe there was an issue with the stacking of multi-use items.

Calthine · 11-15-2005, 11:57 PM

It's still there, but it's intermittant, making it hard to reproduce. it seems to have something to do with zoning or logging BEFORE you're saved server-side. Like the totems and potions are not updating server-side, and a zone change causes their previous state to re-load. (Someone noted in a PM to me once that being inspected causes the 'fill line' to reset, which causes me to suspect it's a save issue.)

Scort · 11-15-2005, 11:58 PM

Don't put it in your activateable slot Silverfrost. Just use it from your inventory. Then zone or log out. You don't have zone or log right away. If you put it in your activateable slot, it uses it properly it seems.

Message Edited by Scortch on 11-15-2005 01:59 PM

Strifex · 11-15-2005, 11:59 PM

Yes the problem is still here and it's easy to reproduce. Lately all I have been doing is T6 instances: AT, Poets, Cazels, Roost. Everytime I enter an instance I use a damage and debuff posion. Everytime I leave the isntance my posions are refilled. There have been a couple times where my poison has not been recharged. The couple times I can think of is once when I died in Silent City and reused a posion, then I called to FP after a while. I noticed my posion was at 6/7. Also last night I did the Master Djinn solo part of the quest in the tower of moon and I had to recast a poison before going in. I noticed that it didn't recharge after I left. Besides these two events though I have had my poisons recharge everytime and it always recharges if you use it in the T6 instances I mentioned above and then zone out when you are finished. I have a couple of posions that are at 4/7 and 5/7 charges and I've been using them since level 55 non stop.

Milthon · 11-16-2005, 12:00 AM

I recently made one of my guildmates who is new to the game a t3 legendary poison. He was in awe of the amount in contributed to his dps. He asked me the other day what the charges mean. He couldnt understand the concept. So I explained that it was 7 charges meaning it could be activated 7 times total.

His response. " I have been using it constantly for 2 weeks and it still shows 7/7 charges."

This would explain why potions and poisons don't actually sell. You only ever have to buy one of the very best and never bother with it again.

ag · 11-16-2005, 12:06 AM

Hammarus wrote:
I would think this would be easy to fix. Just make every potion, poison, totem, etc. have just one charge. When crafting allow up to 8 to be made if pristine combine is done. I think you could then make them stackable.

I believe there was an issue with the stacking of multi-use items.

Yes please!! Do this! Do it now! SMILEY

Rijacki · 11-16-2005, 12:10 AM

zorbdan wrote:
That stackable idea is a good one, at release potions were stackable then they changed it for some reason who knows why. I would also like to see them change it back to stackable and for gods sake pls fix the recharge bug once and for all.
Message Edited by zorbdan on 11-15-2005 09:19 AM

Potions and poisons (not sure about totems) used to make ONE item per combine. Even when fuel was all the same price, the price for solutions and suspensions (a required component) was rather expensive. To make ONE T5 potion or poison dose, at that time, cost over 1g just because of the solution/suspension cost. Now... imagine if they were to make ONE dose per combine. T6 fuel is 36s each. Poisons and potions use 6 fuels if using jeweler made vials and a solution which costs 10s. That would be over 2g just to make ONE dose. Alchemists and Woodworkers want to keep a minimum of the same number of doses to combine (max 7 for potions and poisons and max 15 for totems) to keep the price to cost at a point that the items could have a snow-ball's chance in.... of selling. Currently, NPC sold poisons are still priced cheaper (but not as bad as it had been) per dose than it costs and alchemist to make, per dose, but the alchemist poison IS heaps better. If alchemist poison was one combine for one dose, not even rogue or predator alchemists would ever use crafted because the NPC would be a mere fraction of cost. No one really wants alchemists or woodworkers to make potions, poisons, and totems as one dose per combine (it would be as stupid as one arrow per combine, one throwing hammer per combine, provisioner fuel costing the same as every other craft's fuel).

Rijacki · 11-16-2005, 12:12 AM

Milthon wrote:
I recently made one of my guildmates who is new to the game a t3 legendary poison. He was in awe of the amount in contributed to his dps. He asked me the other day what the charges mean. He couldnt understand the concept. So I explained that it was 7 charges meaning it could be activated 7 times total.

His response. " I have been using it constantly for 2 weeks and it still shows 7/7 charges."

This would explain why potions and poisons don't actually sell. You only ever have to buy one of the very best and never bother with it again.

Not only that, but, since it doesn't need to be attuned, once your guild mate is in T4, he can pass the poison down to someone in T3 and they can use it indefinately (as long as they remember not to use the last dose before zoning).

Yarginis · 11-16-2005, 12:30 AM

It sounds to me like if they were to fix this they would need to drastically reduce the prices of these potions/poisons then. Otherwise fixing this would be a huge cash burden on poison using classes. Prehaps in this case it would be best for the playerbase at large (there will be a lot more people negatively effected by the fix than people getting a benefit from it) if it were simply left as is ans simply reworded as intended to be as such. Either that or make them recharge over time or rechargeable by an NPC for a cost similar to if it were an item being repaired. (Hell, have the repair person refil them when you repair) Ultimetly I think it has to come down to alcemists are ~11% of the crafting poupulation. Where "fix"ing this would negatively impact all the poison users AND everyone they group with who rely's on their DPS.

ag · 11-16-2005, 12:40 AM

Yargnit:As someone who both supplies and consumes poison, I'll offer my opinion: I'd rather see the bug fixed first, and deal with the subsequent issues than leave it unfixed.

Silverfrost · 11-16-2005, 12:45 AM

Can we get the name of an item that someone has been able to reproduce this with since update 16? There's a possibility that it may only affect certain items.

Cuz · 11-16-2005, 12:52 AM

Yargnit wrote:
It sounds to me like if they were to fix this they would need to drastically reduce the prices of these potions/poisons then. Otherwise fixing this would be a huge cash burden on poison using classes. Prehaps in this case it would be best for the playerbase at large (there will be a lot more people negatively effected by the fix than people getting a benefit from it) if it were simply left as is ans simply reworded as intended to be as such. Either that or make them recharge over time or rechargeable by an NPC for a cost similar to if it were an item being repaired. (Hell, have the repair person refil them when you repair)

Ultimetly I think it has to come down to alcemists are ~11% of the crafting poupulation. Where "fix"ing this would negatively impact all the poison users AND everyone they group with who rely's on their DPS.

The problem is that if the item can last forever the price will be similar to other items like that. How much did you pay for your legendary BP? Would you be willing to pay a similar price for rare poisons? Obviously it wouldn't be that high, but it would be much much higher than it is now.

EtoilePirate · 11-16-2005, 12:52 AM

Silverfrost wrote:
Can we get the name of an item that someone has been able to reproduce this with since update 16? There's a possibility that it may only affect certain items.

I've now used a Spirit of the Monkey 5-charge totem 7 times. And I'm sorry I can't remember the names, but T5 (level 40-50) Legendary damage poisons sometimes get the bug.

Dasein · 11-16-2005, 12:56 AM

I've seen it on the Totem of the Chameleon

smoody · 11-16-2005, 12:57 AM

It seems to me that the simplest solution for this would be to make the items 1 charge each and let them stack. This would make the alchemists and woodworkers happy. Let me have have 7 single charge items for each potion combine I make at pristine on my alchemist. This would greatly help the inventory slot management as well as eliminate the re-charge bug which has been around off and on for months.

I experience this issue on Fredethel on an intermittent basis. Sometimes the charge is consumed, other times it isn't. I have been able to isolate what sequence of events causes it to occur.

Fredethel

Ramsy02 · 11-16-2005, 01:01 AM

spirt of the wolf totems, spirit of the butterfly totems, spirit of the bat, spirit of the rat, spirit of the(invis) totem. Basically ALL totems posions and potions recharge. all you gotta do is leave item in same spot in inventory and when its near 1 charge left , zone ... then they all recharge

Ruben · 11-16-2005, 01:02 AM

Silverfrost wrote:

Can we get the name of an item that someone has been able to reproduce this with since update 16? There's a possibility that it may only affect certain items.

Spirit Totem Of the Winged Viper, Spirit Totem of the Rat. Zone into tradeskill instance, use charges then zone out or else camp while in tradeskill instance then log back in from character screen. Thats only time I have seen this occur. Usually make my own totems but still its a bug hehe.

Forgot to add, leave them in the charm spot for it to work, if you move them out and zone or even put back in before zone they dont seem to recharge every time.

Message Edited by RubenBlades on 11-15-2005 03:04 PM

Alarye · 11-16-2005, 01:09 AM

I have had a SoW totem do this, Retribution of the Sky (I think thats the Name) and one other poison.

It seems that turning these into at X Quality level = 1, 3, 5, 7 items produced in the same manner as a WORT wouldn't be too hard and then make the singles stackable. not sure but that seems to be a surefire fix to this.

Stormykat · 11-16-2005, 01:10 AM

I have noticed this also. With any totem or potion or poison that I use from my inventory and that I have moved to my hotbar. I've noticed it on every potion and poison (the three that come to mind that i've been using the most of are touch of the beholder poison, sanctification of the swashbuckler potion and barrier of blades poison) also it's been doing that with my totems that i haven't had hotbarred but have been using from my inventory. (monkey and cobra totems)

Jai1 · 11-16-2005, 01:11 AM

Something weird happened to me the other day... I just claimed the top 2 exp buffing potions(52%) and stacked them. I only took 2. I used one of the two TS potions and I only thought they were 15 mins or so and didnt see an icon and I did some combines, got a level and left the zone. The next day I was TSin again and saw that I had 2 of the TS potions again. I am using them from inventory. Not sure how I got the second but if that is a bug, so much for the single dose stacking idea. Maybe there's something wrong with using them from inventory.

Launceal · 11-16-2005, 01:11 AM

Rijacki wrote:
zorbdan wrote:
That stackable idea is a good one, at release potions were stackable then they changed it for some reason who knows why. I would also like to see them change it back to stackable and for gods sake pls fix the recharge bug once and for all.
Message Edited by zorbdan on 11-15-2005 09:19 AM
Potions and poisons (not sure about totems) used to make ONE item per combine. Even when fuel was all the same price, the price for solutions and suspensions (a required component) was rather expensive. To make ONE T5 potion or poison dose, at that time, cost over 1g just because of the solution/suspension cost. Now... imagine if they were to make ONE dose per combine. T6 fuel is 36s each. Poisons and potions use 6 fuels if using jeweler made vials and a solution which costs 10s. That would be over 2g just to make ONE dose. Alchemists and Woodworkers want to keep a minimum of the same number of doses to combine (max 7 for potions and poisons and max 15 for totems) to keep the price to cost at a point that the items could have a snow-ball's chance in.... of selling. Currently, NPC sold poisons are still priced cheaper (but not as bad as it had been) per dose than it costs and alchemist to make, per dose, but the alchemist poison IS heaps better. If alchemist poison was one combine for one dose, not even rogue or predator alchemists would ever use crafted because the NPC would be a mere fraction of cost. No one really wants alchemists or woodworkers to make potions, poisons, and totems as one dose per combine (it would be as stupid as one arrow per combine, one throwing hammer per combine, provisioner fuel costing the same as every other craft's fuel).

All that is being proposed is that the actual item is one charge, yet stackable. This solves the recharge problem. The combines to make a stack of 15 could be identical to today (where 3 totems of 5 charges are made at once). Or even give us a bone and make the combine create a full stack of 20, etc. To those that want a 1g item to have perma-charges, come on, stop being greedy. There is a reason why tradeskilling is in the game, and a reason why consumable items are part of the economy. The recharge bug is just that, a bug. Borderline exploit if you actually deliberately take action to keep recharging it every time you can. Its no different than exploiting to xp faster or dup cash. This is just dupping charges.

11-15-2005, 09:53 PM	#1
Rijacki Tester Join Date: Nov 2004 Posts: 7,842	Potions, poisons, and totems are items with multiple charges. The are designed to run out after being used a set number of times. However, there is a nasty nasty bug that keeps resurfacing (and now it is at its worst) that "refills" the charged item with zoning of any kind. It doesn't matter where the poison, potion, or totem is when it is used or even if it is moved from one slot to another (the last refill bug only "worked" when an item was not moved from the old activatible slot). Poisons, potions, and totems don't run out unless you use all the charges in one zone (and don't die). This is a problem! There have been numerous times the "refill bug" was said to be fixed and it resurfaces (sometimes slightly different) with the next LU. The simple solution would be to make poisons, potions and totems single use, stacking items (but still have them crafted with the same number of "doses" as current: 7 max for poisons and potions, 15 max for totems). When a dose is used, it would be gone forever, just like food is when an item is consumed. The side benefit of making them stacking single use items would be the ability to have more than the current dose amount (in the non-stacking bauble) in a stack without taking up more inventory space (i.e. a scout could have 20 of one poison in -one- stack rather than three 7-dose vials). FIX THE REFILL BUG PERAMENTLY! please! Totems, poisons, and potions are NOT supposed to be like an imbued ring, a hex doll, or any other non-charged usable buff. Totems, poisons, and potions are supposed to be "consumed" after a certain number of charges are used. The effects on several of the potions have been improved with that in mind. The effects of poisons have been tuned with that in mind. FIX THE REFILL BUG PERAMENTLY! Please make them into stacking single use items (but retain the multi-combine or they will go back to being -waaaaay- to expensive to produce). Potions, poisons, and totems do not require attuning. Since they currently refill, they can be handed down from one character to another. They can even used by everyone in a party (as long as the last dose is not used) and then refilled with the next zoning. (They should, though, retain the multi-dose from one combine since alchemists and woodworkers do not have cheaper fuel costs like provisioners and the cost to craft per-dose is -still- higher, at least for poisons, than the NPC sold per dose). FIX THE REFILL BUG! Fix it in a way it won't ever come back. We're all tired of trying to convince devs that the problem exists every single LU after it's "fixed" __________________

11-15-2005, 10:13 PM	#2
Ildarus Loremaster Join Date: Mar 2005 Location: MPLS, MN Posts: 221	In my opinion this isn't a problem. Some of them are getting to [expletive haxx0red by Raijinn] expensive anyways. We have SoW totems going for over 2gp a piece at times on our server. If it is fixed though, I don't care either, I am about to start making my own Sow Totems and I will give them to my guild members and that will fix the pricing problem. LOL __________________ Lord Sarron-Level 80 Swashbuckler Serpaw-Level 74 Berserker Simbarth-Level 22 Shadowknight/76 Alchemist

11-15-2005, 10:15 PM	#3
zorbdan Loremaster Join Date: Nov 2004 Posts: 230	That stackable idea is a good one, at release potions were stackable then they changed it for some reason who knows why. I would also like to see them change it back to stackable and for gods sake pls fix the recharge bug once and for all. Message Edited by zorbdan on 11-15-2005 09:19 AM __________________

11-15-2005, 10:16 PM	#4
PurrceyPurespir Join Date: Nov 2004 Posts: 15	I agree...leave it in. Few extra uses are nice. Aweful big tirade over such a small thing. Many more important bugs than this. __________________

11-15-2005, 10:26 PM	#5
zorbdan Loremaster Join Date: Nov 2004 Posts: 230	Ildarus wrote: In my opinion this isn't a problem. Some of them are getting to [expletive haxx0red by Raijinn] expensive anyways. We have SoW totems going for over 2gp a piece at times on our server. If it is fixed though, I don't care either, I am about to start making my own Sow Totems and I will give them to my guild members and that will fix the pricing problem. LOL The recharge bug is probably what is causing the high prices. __________________

11-15-2005, 10:57 PM	#6
Cuz Loremaster Join Date: Apr 2005 Posts: 825	PurrceyPurespirit wrote: I agree...leave it in. Few extra uses are nice. Aweful big tirade over such a small thing. Many more important bugs than this. It's not a few extra uses, it's a permanent item if you pay half attention. Use them a few times, zone, you have it at full again. In all honnesty 2gp for a SoW totem that you'll never run out of is rather cheap. I can tell you that people not in my guild will be looking at some mighty hefty prices for my potions and poisons soon enough. Why should I sell t5 legendary poisons at 4 gold when the player, like his weapon and armor, can have it for as long as he wants it? __________________ ------------------------------------------------------------ one immature posted ------------------------------------------------------------

11-15-2005, 10:59 PM	#7
SniplenButterfigs Loremaster Join Date: Nov 2004 Posts: 35	PurrceyPurespirit wrote: I agree...leave it in. Few extra uses are nice. Aweful big tirade over such a small thing. Many more important bugs than this. Did it ever occur to you that the alchemists can't make any money if they sell one potion every ten years? It's not a few extra uses, it's a neverending potion/poison. __________________ Lord Snippy Butterfigs /chuckles Qeynosian wizard Antonia's Dragoons(Lucan D'Lere)

11-15-2005, 11:39 PM	#8
Silverfrost Developer Join Date: Nov 2004 Posts: 48	We're currently trying to reproduce this in our development environment, but haven't been able to so far. If someone has exact steps I'd love to hear them. __________________ Don Neufeld Technical Director, EverQuest II Lead Programmer Emeritus, PlanetSide

11-15-2005, 11:45 PM	#9
Cuz Loremaster Join Date: Apr 2005 Posts: 825	Use a charge, log out, and back in. The charge should be back. That's how I used to keep my own potions going. I had to make sure not to unequip them however. I haven't tried it in a while, but the OP seems to believe it's still there. Considering no one has clamored about it being gone, I kind of believe him. __________________ ------------------------------------------------------------ one immature posted ------------------------------------------------------------

11-15-2005, 11:49 PM	#10
Vulking Loremaster Join Date: Nov 2004 Posts: 301	I would think this would be easy to fix. Just make every potion, poison, totem, etc. have just one charge. When crafting allow up to 8 to be made if pristine combine is done. I think you could then make them stackable. I believe there was an issue with the stacking of multi-use items. __________________ Red One: "stay on topic.." Red Two: "I can't shake him!" Red One: "stay on topic.." Red Two: "There too close!.....ahhhhhhghh!!"

11-15-2005, 11:57 PM	#11
Calthine ZAM EQII Join Date: Nov 2004 Posts: 7,439	It's still there, but it's intermittant, making it hard to reproduce. it seems to have something to do with zoning or logging BEFORE you're saved server-side. Like the totems and potions are not updating server-side, and a zone change causes their previous state to re-load. (Someone noted in a PM to me once that being inspected causes the 'fill line' to reset, which causes me to suspect it's a save issue.) __________________ Please visit my non-gaming Blog! or follow me on Twitter!

11-15-2005, 11:58 PM	#12
Scort Join Date: Nov 2004 Posts: 255	Don't put it in your activateable slot Silverfrost. Just use it from your inventory. Then zone or log out. You don't have zone or log right away. If you put it in your activateable slot, it uses it properly it seems. Message Edited by Scortch on 11-15-2005 01:59 PM

11-15-2005, 11:59 PM	#13
Strifex Loremaster Join Date: Nov 2004 Posts: 34	Yes the problem is still here and it's easy to reproduce. Lately all I have been doing is T6 instances: AT, Poets, Cazels, Roost. Everytime I enter an instance I use a damage and debuff posion. Everytime I leave the isntance my posions are refilled. There have been a couple times where my poison has not been recharged. The couple times I can think of is once when I died in Silent City and reused a posion, then I called to FP after a while. I noticed my posion was at 6/7. Also last night I did the Master Djinn solo part of the quest in the tower of moon and I had to recast a poison before going in. I noticed that it didn't recharge after I left. Besides these two events though I have had my poisons recharge everytime and it always recharges if you use it in the T6 instances I mentioned above and then zone out when you are finished. I have a couple of posions that are at 4/7 and 5/7 charges and I've been using them since level 55 non stop.

11-16-2005, 12:00 AM	#14
Milthon Loremaster Join Date: Nov 2004 Posts: 9	I recently made one of my guildmates who is new to the game a t3 legendary poison. He was in awe of the amount in contributed to his dps. He asked me the other day what the charges mean. He couldnt understand the concept. So I explained that it was 7 charges meaning it could be activated 7 times total. His response. " I have been using it constantly for 2 weeks and it still shows 7/7 charges." This would explain why potions and poisons don't actually sell. You only ever have to buy one of the very best and never bother with it again.

11-16-2005, 12:06 AM	#15
ag General Join Date: Nov 2004 Posts: 851	Hammarus wrote: I would think this would be easy to fix. Just make every potion, poison, totem, etc. have just one charge. When crafting allow up to 8 to be made if pristine combine is done. I think you could then make them stackable. I believe there was an issue with the stacking of multi-use items. Yes please!! Do this! Do it now! __________________ 70 Brigand, 70 Coercer, 60 Bruiser, 50 Inquisitor 70 Alchemist, 70 Armorer, 70 Carpenter, 70 Provisioner, 40 Jeweler, 350 Tinkerer

11-16-2005, 12:10 AM	#16
Rijacki Tester Join Date: Nov 2004 Posts: 7,842	zorbdan wrote: That stackable idea is a good one, at release potions were stackable then they changed it for some reason who knows why. I would also like to see them change it back to stackable and for gods sake pls fix the recharge bug once and for all. Message Edited by zorbdan on 11-15-2005 09:19 AM Potions and poisons (not sure about totems) used to make ONE item per combine. Even when fuel was all the same price, the price for solutions and suspensions (a required component) was rather expensive. To make ONE T5 potion or poison dose, at that time, cost over 1g just because of the solution/suspension cost. Now... imagine if they were to make ONE dose per combine. T6 fuel is 36s each. Poisons and potions use 6 fuels if using jeweler made vials and a solution which costs 10s. That would be over 2g just to make ONE dose. Alchemists and Woodworkers want to keep a minimum of the same number of doses to combine (max 7 for potions and poisons and max 15 for totems) to keep the price to cost at a point that the items could have a snow-ball's chance in.... of selling. Currently, NPC sold poisons are still priced cheaper (but not as bad as it had been) per dose than it costs and alchemist to make, per dose, but the alchemist poison IS heaps better. If alchemist poison was one combine for one dose, not even rogue or predator alchemists would ever use crafted because the NPC would be a mere fraction of cost. No one really wants alchemists or woodworkers to make potions, poisons, and totems as one dose per combine (it would be as stupid as one arrow per combine, one throwing hammer per combine, provisioner fuel costing the same as every other craft's fuel). __________________

11-16-2005, 12:12 AM	#17
Rijacki Tester Join Date: Nov 2004 Posts: 7,842	Milthon wrote: I recently made one of my guildmates who is new to the game a t3 legendary poison. He was in awe of the amount in contributed to his dps. He asked me the other day what the charges mean. He couldnt understand the concept. So I explained that it was 7 charges meaning it could be activated 7 times total. His response. " I have been using it constantly for 2 weeks and it still shows 7/7 charges." This would explain why potions and poisons don't actually sell. You only ever have to buy one of the very best and never bother with it again. Not only that, but, since it doesn't need to be attuned, once your guild mate is in T4, he can pass the poison down to someone in T3 and they can use it indefinately (as long as they remember not to use the last dose before zoning). __________________

11-16-2005, 12:30 AM	#18
Yarginis General Join Date: Jul 2005 Posts: 255	It sounds to me like if they were to fix this they would need to drastically reduce the prices of these potions/poisons then. Otherwise fixing this would be a huge cash burden on poison using classes. Prehaps in this case it would be best for the playerbase at large (there will be a lot more people negatively effected by the fix than people getting a benefit from it) if it were simply left as is ans simply reworded as intended to be as such. Either that or make them recharge over time or rechargeable by an NPC for a cost similar to if it were an item being repaired. (Hell, have the repair person refil them when you repair) Ultimetly I think it has to come down to alcemists are ~11% of the crafting poupulation. Where "fix"ing this would negatively impact all the poison users AND everyone they group with who rely's on their DPS. __________________

11-16-2005, 12:40 AM	#19
ag General Join Date: Nov 2004 Posts: 851	Yargnit:As someone who both supplies and consumes poison, I'll offer my opinion: I'd rather see the bug fixed first, and deal with the subsequent issues than leave it unfixed. __________________ 70 Brigand, 70 Coercer, 60 Bruiser, 50 Inquisitor 70 Alchemist, 70 Armorer, 70 Carpenter, 70 Provisioner, 40 Jeweler, 350 Tinkerer

11-16-2005, 12:45 AM	#20
Silverfrost Developer Join Date: Nov 2004 Posts: 48	Can we get the name of an item that someone has been able to reproduce this with since update 16? There's a possibility that it may only affect certain items. __________________ Don Neufeld Technical Director, EverQuest II Lead Programmer Emeritus, PlanetSide

11-16-2005, 12:52 AM	#21
Cuz Loremaster Join Date: Apr 2005 Posts: 825	Yargnit wrote: It sounds to me like if they were to fix this they would need to drastically reduce the prices of these potions/poisons then. Otherwise fixing this would be a huge cash burden on poison using classes. Prehaps in this case it would be best for the playerbase at large (there will be a lot more people negatively effected by the fix than people getting a benefit from it) if it were simply left as is ans simply reworded as intended to be as such. Either that or make them recharge over time or rechargeable by an NPC for a cost similar to if it were an item being repaired. (Hell, have the repair person refil them when you repair) Ultimetly I think it has to come down to alcemists are ~11% of the crafting poupulation. Where "fix"ing this would negatively impact all the poison users AND everyone they group with who rely's on their DPS. The problem is that if the item can last forever the price will be similar to other items like that. How much did you pay for your legendary BP? Would you be willing to pay a similar price for rare poisons? Obviously it wouldn't be that high, but it would be much much higher than it is now. __________________ ------------------------------------------------------------ one immature posted ------------------------------------------------------------

11-16-2005, 12:52 AM	#22
EtoilePirate Tester Join Date: Feb 2005 Location: Washington, DC Posts: 1,258	Silverfrost wrote: Can we get the name of an item that someone has been able to reproduce this with since update 16? There's a possibility that it may only affect certain items. I've now used a Spirit of the Monkey 5-charge totem 7 times. And I'm sorry I can't remember the names, but T5 (level 40-50) Legendary damage poisons sometimes get the bug. __________________ Kella The Mighty Pirate, Assassin & Tailor Nimari, Fury-at-Large Test Server

11-16-2005, 12:56 AM	#23
Dasein Loremaster Join Date: Nov 2004 Posts: 2,847	I've seen it on the Totem of the Chameleon __________________ Troll Lord Casywdian

11-16-2005, 12:57 AM	#24
smoody Loremaster Join Date: Feb 2005 Posts: 41	It seems to me that the simplest solution for this would be to make the items 1 charge each and let them stack. This would make the alchemists and woodworkers happy. Let me have have 7 single charge items for each potion combine I make at pristine on my alchemist. This would greatly help the inventory slot management as well as eliminate the re-charge bug which has been around off and on for months. I experience this issue on Fredethel on an intermittent basis. Sometimes the charge is consumed, other times it isn't. I have been able to isolate what sequence of events causes it to occur. Fredethel __________________ 62 Ranger / 64 Provisioner - Nektulos (Vengeance) 65 Alchemist 61 Carpenter

11-16-2005, 01:01 AM	#25
Ramsy02 Loremaster Join Date: Jan 2005 Posts: 48	spirt of the wolf totems, spirit of the butterfly totems, spirit of the bat, spirit of the rat, spirit of the(invis) totem. Basically ALL totems posions and potions recharge. all you gotta do is leave item in same spot in inventory and when its near 1 charge left , zone ... then they all recharge

11-16-2005, 01:02 AM	#26
Ruben Loremaster Join Date: Nov 2004 Location: Maryville, Tennessee Posts: 105	Silverfrost wrote: Can we get the name of an item that someone has been able to reproduce this with since update 16? There's a possibility that it may only affect certain items. Spirit Totem Of the Winged Viper, Spirit Totem of the Rat. Zone into tradeskill instance, use charges then zone out or else camp while in tradeskill instance then log back in from character screen. Thats only time I have seen this occur. Usually make my own totems but still its a bug hehe. Forgot to add, leave them in the charm spot for it to work, if you move them out and zone or even put back in before zone they dont seem to recharge every time. Message Edited by RubenBlades on 11-15-2005 03:04 PM __________________ Ruben - 73 Froglock Monk Rudie Bagle - 73 Gnome Warden 71 Iceheart Half-Elf Swashbuckler BlackBurrow Server CoLeader and CoFounder - Order Of Honor

11-16-2005, 01:09 AM	#27
Alarye Loremaster Join Date: Nov 2004 Location: ----- Texas ------- Posts: 49	I have had a SoW totem do this, Retribution of the Sky (I think thats the Name) and one other poison. It seems that turning these into at X Quality level = 1, 3, 5, 7 items produced in the same manner as a WORT wouldn't be too hard and then make the singles stackable. not sure but that seems to be a surefire fix to this. __________________

11-16-2005, 01:10 AM	#28
Stormykat Loremaster Join Date: Nov 2004 Posts: 44	I have noticed this also. With any totem or potion or poison that I use from my inventory and that I have moved to my hotbar. I've noticed it on every potion and poison (the three that come to mind that i've been using the most of are touch of the beholder poison, sanctification of the swashbuckler potion and barrier of blades poison) also it's been doing that with my totems that i haven't had hotbarred but have been using from my inventory. (monkey and cobra totems) __________________

11-16-2005, 01:11 AM	#29
Jai1 Loremaster Join Date: Dec 2004 Posts: 618	Something weird happened to me the other day... I just claimed the top 2 exp buffing potions(52%) and stacked them. I only took 2. I used one of the two TS potions and I only thought they were 15 mins or so and didnt see an icon and I did some combines, got a level and left the zone. The next day I was TSin again and saw that I had 2 of the TS potions again. I am using them from inventory. Not sure how I got the second but if that is a bug, so much for the single dose stacking idea. Maybe there's something wrong with using them from inventory.

11-16-2005, 01:11 AM	#30
Launceal Join Date: Nov 2004 Posts: 43	Rijacki wrote: zorbdan wrote: That stackable idea is a good one, at release potions were stackable then they changed it for some reason who knows why. I would also like to see them change it back to stackable and for gods sake pls fix the recharge bug once and for all. Message Edited by zorbdan on 11-15-2005 09:19 AM Potions and poisons (not sure about totems) used to make ONE item per combine. Even when fuel was all the same price, the price for solutions and suspensions (a required component) was rather expensive. To make ONE T5 potion or poison dose, at that time, cost over 1g just because of the solution/suspension cost. Now... imagine if they were to make ONE dose per combine. T6 fuel is 36s each. Poisons and potions use 6 fuels if using jeweler made vials and a solution which costs 10s. That would be over 2g just to make ONE dose. Alchemists and Woodworkers want to keep a minimum of the same number of doses to combine (max 7 for potions and poisons and max 15 for totems) to keep the price to cost at a point that the items could have a snow-ball's chance in.... of selling. Currently, NPC sold poisons are still priced cheaper (but not as bad as it had been) per dose than it costs and alchemist to make, per dose, but the alchemist poison IS heaps better. If alchemist poison was one combine for one dose, not even rogue or predator alchemists would ever use crafted because the NPC would be a mere fraction of cost. No one really wants alchemists or woodworkers to make potions, poisons, and totems as one dose per combine (it would be as stupid as one arrow per combine, one throwing hammer per combine, provisioner fuel costing the same as every other craft's fuel). All that is being proposed is that the actual item is one charge, yet stackable. This solves the recharge problem. The combines to make a stack of 15 could be identical to today (where 3 totems of 5 charges are made at once). Or even give us a bone and make the combine create a full stack of 20, etc. To those that want a 1g item to have perma-charges, come on, stop being greedy. There is a reason why tradeskilling is in the game, and a reason why consumable items are part of the economy. The recharge bug is just that, a bug. Borderline exploit if you actually deliberately take action to keep recharging it every time you can. Its no different than exploiting to xp faster or dup cash. This is just dupping charges.