Zoning and Food

SavinDwa · 02-16-2005, 07:18 PM

I haven't checked this in a couple of days, so I guess it could just be a bug, but....

Am I the only one that noticed that the food you are currently eating/drinking disapears on test when you zone? If this is not just a temporary bug, and I have a sneaky suspicious it is not unless it came about when fixing the issue that eating food while crafting was not working ......

Anyway, if its not a bug it significantly reduces any advantage of having food that last 3-4 hours. I would be better off with 4 -1 hour food items.

Has anyone seen anything to make us think this is designed change? if so, how does everyone feel about it?

By the way, I know a lot of people are suggesting that food gets made like WROTs in batches. However, before we make such a change I hope someone is going to look at the supply and demand situation. Increasing the batches to 4 effectively is the same as increasing supply by a factor of 4. Since we don't know what impact the other changes are going to have on supply I think we should be careful before we do this. Maybe we only need batches of 2, maybe we need batchees of 10 or even 20. If the correct number is 4 then it is pure luck. I don't think now is a good time to just guess.

KrysHawk · 02-16-2005, 07:25 PM

I've just checked and the 1 hour duration steak I just ate has disappeared as soon as I zone, c'mon guys opening those big gates doesn't use that much energy!!!!!!

Gallenite · 02-16-2005, 09:48 PM

Thanks - Mailing this around for followup on our side.

goboy · 02-16-2005, 09:55 PM

KrysHawk wrote:
I've just checked and the 1 hour duration steak I just ate has disappeared as soon as I zone, c'mon guys opening those big gates doesn't use that much energy!!!!!!

Nope, its using the privy after zoning that does it....

Diaz_EGG · 02-16-2005, 10:10 PM

SavinDwarf wrote:

By the way, I know a lot of people are suggesting that food gets made like WROTs in batches. However, before we make such a change I hope someone is going to look at the supply and demand situation. Increasing the batches to 4 effectively is the same as increasing supply by a factor of 4. Since we don't know what impact the other changes are going to have on supply I think we should be careful before we do this. Maybe we only need batches of 2, maybe we need batchees of 10 or even 20. If the correct number is 4 then it is pure luck. I don't think now is a good time to just guess.

I think a change needs to be made so that refined and interim provisioning products that cannot be consumed for power or health regen boosts can be produced in batches of up to 4 for pristine success.

Saev · 02-16-2005, 10:58 PM

Diaz_EGG wrote:

SavinDwarf wrote:

By the way, I know a lot of people are suggesting that food gets made like WROTs in batches. However, before we make such a change I hope someone is going to look at the supply and demand situation. Increasing the batches to 4 effectively is the same as increasing supply by a factor of 4. Since we don't know what impact the other changes are going to have on supply I think we should be careful before we do this. Maybe we only need batches of 2, maybe we need batchees of 10 or even 20. If the correct number is 4 then it is pure luck. I don't think now is a good time to just guess.

I think a change needs to be made so that refined and interim provisioning products that cannot be consumed for power or health regen boosts can be produced in batches of up to 4 for pristine success.

Unless the provisioning recipes are completely revised this would not work. The only time you get 'final' recipes is in the latter stages of each level. These recipes are usually the one requiring 2 or 3 raws, and 5 or 6 combines. Most of the earlier recipes feed into later recipes, so they would almost all be 'interim' products.

Revising the recipes would be a good thing anyway due to both the uneven distribution of recipes (no drinks early in a tier, 3 recipes in each the first few levels per tier followed by 15 or so at mid-level) and the inability to make recipes as you get them (for example 2 of 3 recipes at 33 require higher level recipes to make).

All of which has nothing to do with the original post - sorry about that.

Message Edited by Saevan on 02-16-2005 09:59 AM

roganem · 02-16-2005, 11:07 PM

SavinDwarf wrote:

By the way, I know a lot of people are suggesting that food gets made like WROTs in batches. However, before we make such a change I hope someone is going to look at the supply and demand situation. Increasing the batches to 4 effectively is the same as increasing supply by a factor of 4. Since we don't know what impact the other changes are going to have on supply I think we should be careful before we do this. Maybe we only need batches of 2, maybe we need batchees of 10 or even 20. If the correct number is 4 then it is pure luck. I don't think now is a good time to just guess.

Ideally it would be great if the sub components came out in stacks of 20 and leave the final combine at 1 or 2. Let get the tedium part of crafting removed.

Schirf · 02-16-2005, 11:35 PM

Now that we're off topic...

I think a better solution would be to up all input requirements x4 (including the fuel) and the output by x4. Thus, the production per raw and cost per item wouldn't change, but the process would take 1/4th of the current time to produce a stack of 20.

Or this could be saved for the advanced provisioning books, which could be "big batch" recipies able to make many items using the above formula.

Message Edited by Schirf on 02-16-2005 10:37 AM

Kroder · 02-16-2005, 11:48 PM

Schirf wrote:

Now that we're off topic...

I think a better solution would be to up all input requirements x4 (including the fuel) and the output by x4. Thus, the production per raw and cost per item wouldn't change, but the process would take 1/4th of the current time to produce a stack of 20.

Or this could be saved for the advanced provisioning books, which could be "big batch" recipies able to make many items using the above formula.

Message Edited by Schirf on 02-16-2005 10:37 AM

That would be a way to boost output speed, yes.

But, if you think it through, that would put a demand on the players who go out and gather the harvestables for the provisioners. Many provisioners do not do this themselves due to the time factior involved, gathering food items is also nearly prohibitive due to the time required to do so.

Provisioners, to put it simply, would need 4 times as many gathered resources. This would, very likely, cause the prices of harvested goods to skyrocket. Provisioners who gathered for themselves would find nodes few, and far between. The cash cow would not be provisioners, but those doing the gathering for them. Prices would be unlikely to fall as a result.

The increase in supply would be strangled by the new bottleneck of relatively low amount of gathered resources.

Not to mention, if this was put into books, they would be hideously expensive. The trend has been, it seems with these books, to think the artisan class that uses them can afford ridiculous prices to get them.

The gatherers, for better or worse, have always been the ones who start trends with pricing.

Gallenite · 02-17-2005, 12:55 AM

SavinDwarf wrote:

I haven't checked this in a couple of days, so I guess it could just be a bug, but....

Am I the only one that noticed that the food you are currently eating/drinking disapears on test when you zone? If this is not just a temporary bug, and I have a sneaky suspicious it is not unless it came about when fixing the issue that eating food while crafting was not working ......

Looks like a potential fix for this was just checked in and will be hitting Test Server soon. SMILEY

Jayces · 02-17-2005, 01:11 AM

Gallenite wrote:

SavinDwarf wrote:

I haven't checked this in a couple of days, so I guess it could just be a bug, but....

Am I the only one that noticed that the food you are currently eating/drinking disapears on test when you zone? If this is not just a temporary bug, and I have a sneaky suspicious it is not unless it came about when fixing the issue that eating food while crafting was not working ......

Looks like a potential fix for this was just checked in and will be hitting Test Server soon.

This bug has been on live for a long time though it does seem to be random, I hope you guys can fix it.

On a number of occasions I have had my food drink buffs dissapear, revert to previous ones or not refresh when zoning or losing connection.

I wish I could blame it on one thing but it has always been random.

If food prices are coming down then it won't be mush of an issue but at current costs losing the effect of high end food isn't worth the risk in buying it.

Kroder · 02-17-2005, 01:17 AM

Kroder wrote:

Schirf wrote:

Now that we're off topic...

I think a better solution would be to up all input requirements x4 (including the fuel) and the output by x4. Thus, the production per raw and cost per item wouldn't change, but the process would take 1/4th of the current time to produce a stack of 20.

Or this could be saved for the advanced provisioning books, which could be "big batch" recipies able to make many items using the above formula.

Message Edited by Schirf on 02-16-2005 10:37 AM

That would be a way to boost output speed, yes.

But, if you think it through, that would put a demand on the players who go out and gather the harvestables for the provisioners. Many provisioners do not do this themselves due to the time factior involved, gathering food items is also nearly prohibitive due to the time required to do so.

Provisioners, to put it simply, would need 4 times as many gathered resources. This would, very likely, cause the prices of harvested goods to skyrocket. Provisioners who gathered for themselves would find nodes few, and far between. The cash cow would not be provisioners, but those doing the gathering for them. Prices would be unlikely to fall as a result.

The increase in supply would be strangled by the new bottleneck of relatively low amount of gathered resources.

Not to mention, if this was put into books, they would be hideously expensive. The trend has been, it seems with these books, to think the artisan class that uses them can afford ridiculous prices to get them.

The gatherers, for better or worse, have always been the ones who start trends with pricing.

Ok... this is silly now. I put up a reasonable, and thought out, reply to someones post, and I get one starred for my efforts? I'm sorry people, but if you guys cannot stand the sight of constructive, non-inflammatory criticism, you need to go to a website that hosts flame wars.

Grumpy_Warrior_01 · 02-17-2005, 02:36 AM

Kroder wrote:

Ok... this is silly now. I put up a reasonable, and thought out, reply to someones post, and I get one starred for my efforts? I'm sorry people, but if you guys cannot stand the sight of constructive, non-inflammatory criticism, you need to go to a website that hosts flame wars.

The whole star thing needs to go away, I think it's primarily an outlet for abuse by the twelve year-olds. Just turn them off completely in your preferences.

ArivenGemini · 02-17-2005, 02:41 AM

Gallenite wrote:
SavinDwarf wrote:
I haven't checked this in a couple of days, so I guess it could just be a bug, but....

Am I the only one that noticed that the food you are currently eating/drinking disapears on test when you zone? If this is not just a temporary bug, and I have a sneaky suspicious it is not unless it came about when fixing the issue that eating food while crafting was not working ......

Looks like a potential fix for this was just checked in and will be hitting Test Server soon.

Does this also address the problem currently on live where you select "eat when hungry" and it immediately consumes a unit if food (and drink for that option) even if you are not hungry?

SavinDwa · 02-17-2005, 02:43 AM

Gallenite,

I appreciate the feedback. Thanks for dealing with this.

Sholtan · 02-17-2005, 03:00 AM

Gallenite wrote:

SavinDwarf wrote:

I haven't checked this in a couple of days, so I guess it could just be a bug, but....

Am I the only one that noticed that the food you are currently eating/drinking disapears on test when you zone? If this is not just a temporary bug, and I have a sneaky suspicious it is not unless it came about when fixing the issue that eating food while crafting was not working ......

Looks like a potential fix for this was just checked in and will be hitting Test Server soon.

Appreciate the fix(es)... It is kind of sad however, I have bugged this numerous times in game, on test, this past week. Is the 'appropriate' place to bug items for the fastest response now to post on the forums? Just curious.

Thanks again for looking into this.

SavinDwa · 02-17-2005, 07:16 PM

Sholtan,

I tend not to bug things like this because its hard to tell if its a bug or that the game just changed. In addition, with a bug report you don't get a reply or the input of other players.

02-16-2005, 07:18 PM	#1
SavinDwa Join Date: Nov 2004 Posts: 147	I haven't checked this in a couple of days, so I guess it could just be a bug, but.... Am I the only one that noticed that the food you are currently eating/drinking disapears on test when you zone? If this is not just a temporary bug, and I have a sneaky suspicious it is not unless it came about when fixing the issue that eating food while crafting was not working ...... Anyway, if its not a bug it significantly reduces any advantage of having food that last 3-4 hours. I would be better off with 4 -1 hour food items. Has anyone seen anything to make us think this is designed change? if so, how does everyone feel about it? By the way, I know a lot of people are suggesting that food gets made like WROTs in batches. However, before we make such a change I hope someone is going to look at the supply and demand situation. Increasing the batches to 4 effectively is the same as increasing supply by a factor of 4. Since we don't know what impact the other changes are going to have on supply I think we should be careful before we do this. Maybe we only need batches of 2, maybe we need batchees of 10 or even 20. If the correct number is 4 then it is pure luck. I don't think now is a good time to just guess. __________________ Savin the Dwarf, Short of brains and stature, Long on Loyalty

02-16-2005, 09:48 PM	#3
Gallenite Developer Join Date: Nov 2004 Posts: 169	Thanks - Mailing this around for followup on our side. __________________ ____ Scott Hartsman Senior Producer Emeritus, EverQuest II

02-16-2005, 09:55 PM	#4
goboy Tester Join Date: Dec 2004 Posts: 511	KrysHawk wrote: I've just checked and the 1 hour duration steak I just ate has disappeared as soon as I zone, c'mon guys opening those big gates doesn't use that much energy!!!!!! Nope, its using the privy after zoning that does it.... __________________ Jaly, Test Gnome

02-16-2005, 10:10 PM	#5
Diaz_EGG Loremaster Join Date: Nov 2004 Posts: 10	SavinDwarf wrote: By the way, I know a lot of people are suggesting that food gets made like WROTs in batches. However, before we make such a change I hope someone is going to look at the supply and demand situation. Increasing the batches to 4 effectively is the same as increasing supply by a factor of 4. Since we don't know what impact the other changes are going to have on supply I think we should be careful before we do this. Maybe we only need batches of 2, maybe we need batchees of 10 or even 20. If the correct number is 4 then it is pure luck. I don't think now is a good time to just guess. I think a change needs to be made so that refined and interim provisioning products that cannot be consumed for power or health regen boosts can be produced in batches of up to 4 for pristine success. __________________ Diaz - Ratonga Dirge Grimrod - Dwaven Defiler Guild Officer in Legion (Befallen)

02-16-2005, 10:58 PM	#6
Saev General Join Date: Nov 2004 Posts: 521	Diaz_EGG wrote: SavinDwarf wrote: By the way, I know a lot of people are suggesting that food gets made like WROTs in batches. However, before we make such a change I hope someone is going to look at the supply and demand situation. Increasing the batches to 4 effectively is the same as increasing supply by a factor of 4. Since we don't know what impact the other changes are going to have on supply I think we should be careful before we do this. Maybe we only need batches of 2, maybe we need batchees of 10 or even 20. If the correct number is 4 then it is pure luck. I don't think now is a good time to just guess. I think a change needs to be made so that refined and interim provisioning products that cannot be consumed for power or health regen boosts can be produced in batches of up to 4 for pristine success. Unless the provisioning recipes are completely revised this would not work. The only time you get 'final' recipes is in the latter stages of each level. These recipes are usually the one requiring 2 or 3 raws, and 5 or 6 combines. Most of the earlier recipes feed into later recipes, so they would almost all be 'interim' products. Revising the recipes would be a good thing anyway due to both the uneven distribution of recipes (no drinks early in a tier, 3 recipes in each the first few levels per tier followed by 15 or so at mid-level) and the inability to make recipes as you get them (for example 2 of 3 recipes at 33 require higher level recipes to make). All of which has nothing to do with the original post - sorry about that. Message Edited by Saevan on 02-16-2005 09:59 AM __________________

02-16-2005, 07:25 PM	#2
KrysHawk Tester Join Date: Dec 2004 Posts: 13	I've just checked and the 1 hour duration steak I just ate has disappeared as soon as I zone, c'mon guys opening those big gates doesn't use that much energy!!!!!!

02-16-2005, 11:07 PM	#7
roganem Join Date: Nov 2004 Posts: 17	SavinDwarf wrote: By the way, I know a lot of people are suggesting that food gets made like WROTs in batches. However, before we make such a change I hope someone is going to look at the supply and demand situation. Increasing the batches to 4 effectively is the same as increasing supply by a factor of 4. Since we don't know what impact the other changes are going to have on supply I think we should be careful before we do this. Maybe we only need batches of 2, maybe we need batchees of 10 or even 20. If the correct number is 4 then it is pure luck. I don't think now is a good time to just guess. Ideally it would be great if the sub components came out in stacks of 20 and leave the final combine at 1 or 2. Let get the tedium part of crafting removed.

02-16-2005, 11:35 PM	#8
Schirf Loremaster Join Date: Nov 2004 Posts: 87	Now that we're off topic... I think a better solution would be to up all input requirements x4 (including the fuel) and the output by x4. Thus, the production per raw and cost per item wouldn't change, but the process would take 1/4th of the current time to produce a stack of 20. Or this could be saved for the advanced provisioning books, which could be "big batch" recipies able to make many items using the above formula. Message Edited by Schirf on 02-16-2005 10:37 AM

02-16-2005, 11:48 PM	#9
Kroder Loremaster Join Date: Nov 2004 Posts: 94	Schirf wrote: Now that we're off topic... I think a better solution would be to up all input requirements x4 (including the fuel) and the output by x4. Thus, the production per raw and cost per item wouldn't change, but the process would take 1/4th of the current time to produce a stack of 20. Or this could be saved for the advanced provisioning books, which could be "big batch" recipies able to make many items using the above formula. Message Edited by Schirf on 02-16-2005 10:37 AM That would be a way to boost output speed, yes. But, if you think it through, that would put a demand on the players who go out and gather the harvestables for the provisioners. Many provisioners do not do this themselves due to the time factior involved, gathering food items is also nearly prohibitive due to the time required to do so. Provisioners, to put it simply, would need 4 times as many gathered resources. This would, very likely, cause the prices of harvested goods to skyrocket. Provisioners who gathered for themselves would find nodes few, and far between. The cash cow would not be provisioners, but those doing the gathering for them. Prices would be unlikely to fall as a result. The increase in supply would be strangled by the new bottleneck of relatively low amount of gathered resources. Not to mention, if this was put into books, they would be hideously expensive. The trend has been, it seems with these books, to think the artisan class that uses them can afford ridiculous prices to get them. The gatherers, for better or worse, have always been the ones who start trends with pricing. __________________ Our deepest fear is not that we are inadequate. Our deepest fear is that we are powerful beyond measure. It is our light, not our darkness that most frightens us. We ask ourselves, Who am I to be brilliant, gorgeous, talented, fabulous? Actually, who are you not to be? --------Nelson Mandela (orig. quote Marianne Williamson)

02-17-2005, 12:55 AM	#10
Gallenite Developer Join Date: Nov 2004 Posts: 169	SavinDwarf wrote: I haven't checked this in a couple of days, so I guess it could just be a bug, but.... Am I the only one that noticed that the food you are currently eating/drinking disapears on test when you zone? If this is not just a temporary bug, and I have a sneaky suspicious it is not unless it came about when fixing the issue that eating food while crafting was not working ...... Looks like a potential fix for this was just checked in and will be hitting Test Server soon. __________________ ____ Scott Hartsman Senior Producer Emeritus, EverQuest II

02-17-2005, 01:11 AM	#11
Jayces Loremaster Join Date: Nov 2004 Posts: 35	Gallenite wrote: SavinDwarf wrote: I haven't checked this in a couple of days, so I guess it could just be a bug, but.... Am I the only one that noticed that the food you are currently eating/drinking disapears on test when you zone? If this is not just a temporary bug, and I have a sneaky suspicious it is not unless it came about when fixing the issue that eating food while crafting was not working ...... Looks like a potential fix for this was just checked in and will be hitting Test Server soon. This bug has been on live for a long time though it does seem to be random, I hope you guys can fix it. On a number of occasions I have had my food drink buffs dissapear, revert to previous ones or not refresh when zoning or losing connection. I wish I could blame it on one thing but it has always been random. If food prices are coming down then it won't be mush of an issue but at current costs losing the effect of high end food isn't worth the risk in buying it.

02-17-2005, 01:17 AM	#12
Kroder Loremaster Join Date: Nov 2004 Posts: 94	Kroder wrote: Schirf wrote: Now that we're off topic... I think a better solution would be to up all input requirements x4 (including the fuel) and the output by x4. Thus, the production per raw and cost per item wouldn't change, but the process would take 1/4th of the current time to produce a stack of 20. Or this could be saved for the advanced provisioning books, which could be "big batch" recipies able to make many items using the above formula. Message Edited by Schirf on 02-16-2005 10:37 AM That would be a way to boost output speed, yes. But, if you think it through, that would put a demand on the players who go out and gather the harvestables for the provisioners. Many provisioners do not do this themselves due to the time factior involved, gathering food items is also nearly prohibitive due to the time required to do so. Provisioners, to put it simply, would need 4 times as many gathered resources. This would, very likely, cause the prices of harvested goods to skyrocket. Provisioners who gathered for themselves would find nodes few, and far between. The cash cow would not be provisioners, but those doing the gathering for them. Prices would be unlikely to fall as a result. The increase in supply would be strangled by the new bottleneck of relatively low amount of gathered resources. Not to mention, if this was put into books, they would be hideously expensive. The trend has been, it seems with these books, to think the artisan class that uses them can afford ridiculous prices to get them. The gatherers, for better or worse, have always been the ones who start trends with pricing. Ok... this is silly now. I put up a reasonable, and thought out, reply to someones post, and I get one starred for my efforts? I'm sorry people, but if you guys cannot stand the sight of constructive, non-inflammatory criticism, you need to go to a website that hosts flame wars. __________________ Our deepest fear is not that we are inadequate. Our deepest fear is that we are powerful beyond measure. It is our light, not our darkness that most frightens us. We ask ourselves, Who am I to be brilliant, gorgeous, talented, fabulous? Actually, who are you not to be? --------Nelson Mandela (orig. quote Marianne Williamson)

02-17-2005, 02:36 AM	#13
Grumpy_Warrior_01 Loremaster Join Date: Nov 2004 Posts: 528	Kroder wrote: Ok... this is silly now. I put up a reasonable, and thought out, reply to someones post, and I get one starred for my efforts? I'm sorry people, but if you guys cannot stand the sight of constructive, non-inflammatory criticism, you need to go to a website that hosts flame wars. The whole star thing needs to go away, I think it's primarily an outlet for abuse by the twelve year-olds. Just turn them off completely in your preferences.

02-17-2005, 02:41 AM	#14
ArivenGemini Loremaster Join Date: Nov 2004 Posts: 1,260	Gallenite wrote: SavinDwarf wrote: I haven't checked this in a couple of days, so I guess it could just be a bug, but.... Am I the only one that noticed that the food you are currently eating/drinking disapears on test when you zone? If this is not just a temporary bug, and I have a sneaky suspicious it is not unless it came about when fixing the issue that eating food while crafting was not working ...... Looks like a potential fix for this was just checked in and will be hitting Test Server soon. Does this also address the problem currently on live where you select "eat when hungry" and it immediately consumes a unit if food (and drink for that option) even if you are not hungry? __________________

02-17-2005, 02:43 AM	#15
SavinDwa Join Date: Nov 2004 Posts: 147	Gallenite, I appreciate the feedback. Thanks for dealing with this. __________________ Savin the Dwarf, Short of brains and stature, Long on Loyalty

02-17-2005, 03:00 AM	#16
Sholtan Loremaster Join Date: Dec 2004 Posts: 1	Gallenite wrote: SavinDwarf wrote: I haven't checked this in a couple of days, so I guess it could just be a bug, but.... Am I the only one that noticed that the food you are currently eating/drinking disapears on test when you zone? If this is not just a temporary bug, and I have a sneaky suspicious it is not unless it came about when fixing the issue that eating food while crafting was not working ...... Looks like a potential fix for this was just checked in and will be hitting Test Server soon. Appreciate the fix(es)... It is kind of sad however, I have bugged this numerous times in game, on test, this past week. Is the 'appropriate' place to bug items for the fastest response now to post on the forums? Just curious. Thanks again for looking into this.

02-17-2005, 07:16 PM	#17
SavinDwa Join Date: Nov 2004 Posts: 147	Sholtan, I tend not to bug things like this because its hard to tell if its a bug or that the game just changed. In addition, with a bug report you don't get a reply or the input of other players. __________________ Savin the Dwarf, Short of brains and stature, Long on Loyalty