Coercer class/spell issues

Mjollnyr · 12-19-2004, 04:04 AM

I'm a level 28 (recently rolled back from 29) coercer. I've noticed that a significant number of our spells have problems. I thought it might be a good idea to start a list. This way we dont have several threads regarding the same issues.The known problems i've encountered with my coercer.- Stun and mez stacking. If you stun a mob then mez it while it is still stuned, the mez will remain on the mob (the icon in maintained bar) but the mob will not actually be mezed as soon as stun wears off. I've noticed that this goes as far as any spell to wear off on a mezed mob will cause this problem- I've recently found out that inviting people to your group will end mez. This occured when my group was camping to correct the 'locked in combat' bug, and an add poped. I mezed the add, then broke the encounter, thinking i would hold the mob mezed til everyone was back from relogging and we could reform the group. Each time someone was added to the group the mez would pop. Annoying, but not common.- AE mez: Does not drain mana (and refresh i presume, 14s duration is very short) as spell description says. Mez portion is not very practical, the spell mez's the encounter and once one of the mobs is hit the entire encounter breaks mez. Not sure if this spell is broken, or if it is just the way this spell was ment to work?*- Some melee AE's (example: Assault) breaks mez. I has the understanding that AE's were not suppose to hit mezed mobs, due to the way they are flagged. Is this working as intended?*- Necro swarm pets break all mez's on encounter. After talking to some necro friends, the swarm rats when cast erase all buffs on mobs, good or bad. This is not so much a coercer problem as it is a necro problem, but something coercers should be aware of when flipping out on the group for breaking mez.These are the problems i have experienced.* = The problems that might be actually working as intended make me want to ask the question: Do we have a class rep, someone who can take our problems to Sony to be addressed?Please post your experiences. I'd like to hear an accurate story about the charm spell.Hope this helps someone. Thanks

Krelfeari · 12-19-2004, 07:09 PM

the ae thing actually has an explanation, certain AE skills WILL hit them and others WON'T.....its color coded but i don't remember which color means what.....just test ur AE skill that does'nt break them then the one that does...and you'll know.

The mez broke every time someone was added to group just like any debuff would have left the monster and its health would have returned i think

maybe the AE mez is to control a group of adds for a short time?

no idea on the stacking and necro swarm spell tho, sorry.....don't worry tho man every class has problems right now ok? the game is hardly a month old. Every game needs ironed out after release and thats what were for, just keep givin positive feedback like this and don't flame or curse SOE and also use the feedback command in game to let them hear about the problems or how to fix them in ur opinion.

Good post btw, no real whining or complaining like some here lately.

p.s. Lucan for Pres!

Nerj · 12-20-2004, 09:40 PM

I have a question on AE Mez. If you cast AE Mez on a group and a member of the group resists it does the whole group resist then? Also, if not, does attacking then non-mezzed mob break mez?

Tanatus · 12-20-2004, 10:02 PM

Yes all AE mez work all or none

Single mob resist AE = all group resist

Single mob broke lose = all group broke lose

Mjollnyr · 12-28-2004, 01:48 PM

Something else to add to the list of things that break mez. SMILEY

Rezing. Recently discovered that rezing someone in combat pops mez's. Not sure why, but i got pounded into the dirt and died. Was not fun, but was interesting SMILEY

When someone /dance's the mob i have mez'ed and it breaks, i'm switching mains SMILEY

jddro · 12-28-2004, 07:57 PM

Always nice to know, my coerc is only lvl 11 right now, so still getting up there , but still good info to watch for patches maybe SMILEY

Vladdax · 12-30-2004, 03:02 PM

Mjollnyr wrote:- Some melee AE's (example: Assault) breaks mez. I has the understanding that AE's were not suppose to hit mezed mobs, due to the way they are flagged. Is this working as intended?*

I note on this one. Melee AoE's come in two types, encounter only and pbaoe. Encounter only AoE are skills with a green background and will only affect the locked targetted encounter and will not beak mez. PBAoE skills have a blue background and will attack anything withing range regarless whether it's in the locked encounter, an unagro'd encounter or a mezd mob.

Jb · 12-30-2004, 09:38 PM

It's been a while since I've done it but when root wears off on a mezed target it doesn't break the mez, it should only be two mez or stun effects stacked simultaniously that cause the problem.

I think mobs have "state" or "effect" flags that indicate things like root, stun, stiffle. When those effects wear off the flag is removed. Thing is someone got lazy and instead of making a mez flag, they reused the stun flag and just have it get turned off if the mob is damaged while under effect of the mez spell.

So if you stun a still mezed mob and the group engages it, they hit it and break the mez so the stun flag is removed and the mob starts swinging back with 10+ seconds to go on your proper stun spell.

You stun a mob, then mez it, and when stun wears off the stun flag is set to not stunned, effectively breaking the mez. If you try to re-mez, since your mez spell is already in effect, it doesnt bother resetting flags that already should be in place, just resets the spell duration timer and therefore will not set the flag back to stunned regardless of the icon.

This theory is further confirmed by the fact that if you cancel that non-working mez from your maintained spells bar and then recast it, it will take hold.

It's fairly easy to fix too. I really don't know why it hasn't gotten fixed yet, because it can't possibly be working as intended.

I guess we should be thankfull for the berserker's bloodrage nerf that made it useless, they have one less aoe skill to break mez with. If you want look at that as enchanter love that's propably all we've gotten so far.

And yes, assault is supposed to break mez as others have pointed out.

One change I would like to see is for aoe HO's to stop hitting mezzed mobs, there is absolutely no logical reason for a Heroic Opportunity to potentialy get the group wiped.

Jer · 01-04-2005, 01:03 AM

I have noticed many times that if I stun, then mez, the mez drops when the stun wears off.

It is as if the mez "inherits" the stun timer when you cast it on a stunned mob. I think this only happens on a stun that I cast not someone else's stun.

Taelnaya · 01-04-2005, 01:27 AM

Simple fix with the stun issue. If you get a train stun one, root it, then back away till the stun is off and mezz then. Not only does this save the squishy ones from getting hit but gives you chance to get probably one other under control while waiting for stun to wear off and root has effectively parked them.My biggest issue is that pets can break mezz. Its really frustrating.

12-19-2004, 04:04 AM	#1
Mjollnyr Loremaster Join Date: Nov 2004 Posts: 237	I'm a level 28 (recently rolled back from 29) coercer. I've noticed that a significant number of our spells have problems. I thought it might be a good idea to start a list. This way we dont have several threads regarding the same issues.The known problems i've encountered with my coercer.- Stun and mez stacking. If you stun a mob then mez it while it is still stuned, the mez will remain on the mob (the icon in maintained bar) but the mob will not actually be mezed as soon as stun wears off. I've noticed that this goes as far as any spell to wear off on a mezed mob will cause this problem- I've recently found out that inviting people to your group will end mez. This occured when my group was camping to correct the 'locked in combat' bug, and an add poped. I mezed the add, then broke the encounter, thinking i would hold the mob mezed til everyone was back from relogging and we could reform the group. Each time someone was added to the group the mez would pop. Annoying, but not common.- AE mez: Does not drain mana (and refresh i presume, 14s duration is very short) as spell description says. Mez portion is not very practical, the spell mez's the encounter and once one of the mobs is hit the entire encounter breaks mez. Not sure if this spell is broken, or if it is just the way this spell was ment to work?- Some melee AE's (example: Assault) breaks mez. I has the understanding that AE's were not suppose to hit mezed mobs, due to the way they are flagged. Is this working as intended?- Necro swarm pets break all mez's on encounter. After talking to some necro friends, the swarm rats when cast erase all buffs on mobs, good or bad. This is not so much a coercer problem as it is a necro problem, but something coercers should be aware of when flipping out on the group for breaking mez.These are the problems i have experienced.* = The problems that might be actually working as intended make me want to ask the question: Do we have a class rep, someone who can take our problems to Sony to be addressed?Please post your experiences. I'd like to hear an accurate story about the charm spell.Hope this helps someone. Thanks __________________ ======================== Grind -- Guardian -- Kithicor -- Chaotic Legion

12-19-2004, 07:09 PM	#2
Krelfeari Join Date: Nov 2004 Posts: 413	the ae thing actually has an explanation, certain AE skills WILL hit them and others WON'T.....its color coded but i don't remember which color means what.....just test ur AE skill that does'nt break them then the one that does...and you'll know. The mez broke every time someone was added to group just like any debuff would have left the monster and its health would have returned i think maybe the AE mez is to control a group of adds for a short time? no idea on the stacking and necro swarm spell tho, sorry.....don't worry tho man every class has problems right now ok? the game is hardly a month old. Every game needs ironed out after release and thats what were for, just keep givin positive feedback like this and don't flame or curse SOE and also use the feedback command in game to let them hear about the problems or how to fix them in ur opinion. Good post btw, no real whining or complaining like some here lately. p.s. Lucan for Pres! __________________ Psykoala Hypnoplatypus, first Ratongan Coercer to be diagnosed with "Animal Skitzophrenia" where each personality is a different creature. Sig Update: November 16, 2005 Lvl 31 Quests 230+ Current personality: Owlbear

12-20-2004, 09:40 PM	#3
Nerj Join Date: Nov 2004 Posts: 254	I have a question on AE Mez. If you cast AE Mez on a group and a member of the group resists it does the whole group resist then? Also, if not, does attacking then non-mezzed mob break mez? __________________ Lockeye wrote: I've watched coercers who solo higher con heroics using 2 unbreakable roots while keeping 2 separate encounters locked down at the same time (no other class could pull off such a heroic feat). That is called Crowd Control. What Enchanter's are supposed to do.

12-28-2004, 01:48 PM	#5
Mjollnyr Loremaster Join Date: Nov 2004 Posts: 237	Something else to add to the list of things that break mez. Rezing. Recently discovered that rezing someone in combat pops mez's. Not sure why, but i got pounded into the dirt and died. Was not fun, but was interesting When someone /dance's the mob i have mez'ed and it breaks, i'm switching mains __________________ ======================== Grind -- Guardian -- Kithicor -- Chaotic Legion

12-30-2004, 03:02 PM	#7
Vladdax Loremaster Join Date: Nov 2004 Posts: 66	Mjollnyr wrote:- Some melee AE's (example: Assault) breaks mez. I has the understanding that AE's were not suppose to hit mezed mobs, due to the way they are flagged. Is this working as intended?* I note on this one. Melee AoE's come in two types, encounter only and pbaoe. Encounter only AoE are skills with a green background and will only affect the locked targetted encounter and will not beak mez. PBAoE skills have a blue background and will attack anything withing range regarless whether it's in the locked encounter, an unagro'd encounter or a mezd mob. __________________ Vladdax - Evolution Guild 51 Rat Assassin - Splitpaw http://www.splitpaw.net

12-20-2004, 10:02 PM	#4
Tanatus Loremaster Join Date: Nov 2004 Posts: 2,003	Yes all AE mez work all or none Single mob resist AE = all group resist Single mob broke lose = all group broke lose

12-28-2004, 07:57 PM	#6
jddro Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Wisconsin Posts: 43	Always nice to know, my coerc is only lvl 11 right now, so still getting up there , but still good info to watch for patches maybe

12-30-2004, 09:38 PM	#8
Jb Join Date: Nov 2004 Posts: 41	It's been a while since I've done it but when root wears off on a mezed target it doesn't break the mez, it should only be two mez or stun effects stacked simultaniously that cause the problem. I think mobs have "state" or "effect" flags that indicate things like root, stun, stiffle. When those effects wear off the flag is removed. Thing is someone got lazy and instead of making a mez flag, they reused the stun flag and just have it get turned off if the mob is damaged while under effect of the mez spell. So if you stun a still mezed mob and the group engages it, they hit it and break the mez so the stun flag is removed and the mob starts swinging back with 10+ seconds to go on your proper stun spell. You stun a mob, then mez it, and when stun wears off the stun flag is set to not stunned, effectively breaking the mez. If you try to re-mez, since your mez spell is already in effect, it doesnt bother resetting flags that already should be in place, just resets the spell duration timer and therefore will not set the flag back to stunned regardless of the icon. This theory is further confirmed by the fact that if you cancel that non-working mez from your maintained spells bar and then recast it, it will take hold. It's fairly easy to fix too. I really don't know why it hasn't gotten fixed yet, because it can't possibly be working as intended. I guess we should be thankfull for the berserker's bloodrage nerf that made it useless, they have one less aoe skill to break mez with. If you want look at that as enchanter love that's propably all we've gotten so far. And yes, assault is supposed to break mez as others have pointed out. One change I would like to see is for aoe HO's to stop hitting mezzed mobs, there is absolutely no logical reason for a Heroic Opportunity to potentialy get the group wiped.

01-04-2005, 01:03 AM	#9
Jer Join Date: Nov 2004 Posts: 6	I have noticed many times that if I stun, then mez, the mez drops when the stun wears off. It is as if the mez "inherits" the stun timer when you cast it on a stunned mob. I think this only happens on a stun that I cast not someone else's stun.

01-04-2005, 01:27 AM	#10
Taelnaya Join Date: Nov 2004 Posts: 20	Simple fix with the stun issue. If you get a train stun one, root it, then back away till the stun is off and mezz then. Not only does this save the squishy ones from getting hit but gives you chance to get probably one other under control while waiting for stun to wear off and root has effectively parked them.My biggest issue is that pets can break mezz. Its really frustrating.