Priests losing parry....(and more thoughts) - Page 4

otlg · 04-29-2005, 06:00 AM

Veldaar:

For the record, my problem wasn't with your desire to be on equal footing. However, having said that, *no one* should be soloing groups for '3 or more'. At least not logically. Problem is, we're all a bunch of spoiled rotten brats now, who've grown a customed to totally ignoring the con system. If you actually read what the con system says, you'll see people are doing way too many encounters that 'shouldn't' be possible (and there just aren't that many 'good' players for the number of those fights).

And if you think you get beat down wearing plate, put on the leathers my friend. Your life ain't so bad...

Osiri

Texasguy24 · 04-30-2005, 08:02 PM

One word: weak. This thread has gotten really lame... people claiming they go to castles and stuff? [expletive ninja'd by Faarbot]? Seriousely, who cares? It's a game.. priests don't need to parry.. I am one. a warden, I don't want parry.. I want dodge. I think light armor wearers should be dodging, not parrying.

Personally, at this point, I don't care what templars think. They don't need parry either, they have plate armor. Quit whining, you're EQ's spoiled little brats =P Just take your plate mitigation, your non aggroing, super efficient healing, poor mistreated self, and get lost. =D

MadisonPark · 05-01-2005, 03:19 AM

Texasguy24 wrote:

One word: weak. This thread has gotten really lame... people claiming they go to castles and stuff? [expletive ninja'd by Faarbot]? Seriousely, who cares? It's a game.. priests don't need to parry.. I am one. a warden, I don't want parry.. I want dodge. I think light armor wearers should be dodging, not parrying.

Personally, at this point, I don't care what templars think. They don't need parry either, they have plate armor. Quit whining, you're EQ's spoiled little brats =P Just take your plate mitigation, your non aggroing, super efficient healing, poor mistreated self, and get lost. =D

Completely ignoring how self involved you sound, lets put it this way. Right now, as a self buffed, well equipped level 50 templar I have 50%- 70% mitigation (the high side includes mitigation procs from my various heals, and only last for about 15 seconds at a time) and 55% avoidance. This avoidance is unbuffed, as templars have no defense, avoidance or agility buffs. This is comprised of 25% base, 25% parry and the rest is block ( i forget the number, but i think its around 5% as I use a buckler). With my current avoidance, fighting a mob that is any con above grey, I get interupted 4 out of 5 casts. I can completely forget casting anything with a cast time of longer than 3 seconds. Losing my 25% parry, who knows how much base because of heavy armor, and my block down to 3%, Id estimate my avoidance going down to about 10%. Imagine the interupt rate then. Clerics have the lowest hp of all the priests to compensate for their heavy armor ( similiarly equiped druids that I know can buff their hp to 500 points higher), well this is all good and fine, because were getting hit for less damage. Only problem being that will be hit so often, and consequently interupted, that we wont be albe to heal our selves with our "non aggroing, super efficient" reactives. Non agroing I might want to mention being fixed most likely when these combat changes take effect.

*edit: proper grammar = my friend*

Message Edited by MadisonPark on 04-30-2005 04:21 PM

Chanliang · 05-02-2005, 01:57 AM

For me removing parry might be last hit, I have currently level 39 mystic very well equipped all spells are adept1 or better and I solo 70% of my playing time. Currently I have little over 50% mitigation 49.1% avoidance (parry about 32%). Currently my debuffs hardly effect of mobs so all I really have is spell damage, melee and sta debuffs which allows me to solo relatively well but slow. I currently have to cast 5sec aoe nuke for example 2-4 times on group encounters (3-4 x 1-2 arrow down greens or 2-3x2 arrow down blues). Some groups of 3 greens I can also solo but can't really get off 5sec aoe on them ever. I get occasionally interrupted even on my 1sec heals. If parry will be removed and seems that block will be also tad lower my soloing times are well over as will game be. As a caster class interrupts are our worst nightmare and we need something to enable us to be able to solo. You can't solo if you have to use all your power for healing cause we need power for dealing damage as our melee is crap at best. If we're meant to use our power more or less on healing then SOE needs to make us melee/caster class. In my books and if you look up our skills, equipment we aren't pure casters. We are or least should be more hybrid melee/caster class. Maybe we aren't suppose to solo heroic encounters but c'mon, we are talking about greens sometimes perhaps easiest blues. They are well below our level so they should be doable to some extend. There is no sane reason for removing parry from priests, none. If someone tries to tell that we're pure casters it's bull****, if you can wield and swing sword, heavy maces, morning stars, spears, hammers, use heavy/medium/light armor we aren't even close on caster class. Unfortunately I don't have character on test, would play if I could make copy of my char to test so can't tell how bad this is but even from current mechanics on live I've already problems with interrupts and staying alive this change will make it a lot worse. SO PLEASE RECONSIDER IT AGAIN (and again and again...)

Morogoth Drakul · 05-13-2005, 02:26 AM

Chanliang wrote:For me removing parry might be last hit, I have currently level 39 mystic very well equipped all spells are adept1 or better and I solo 70% of my playing time. Currently I have little over 50% mitigation 49.1% avoidance (parry about 32%). Currently my debuffs hardly effect of mobs so all I really have is spell damage, melee and sta debuffs which allows me to solo relatively well but slow. I currently have to cast 5sec aoe nuke for example 2-4 times on group encounters (3-4 x 1-2 arrow down greens or 2-3x2 arrow down blues). Some groups of 3 greens I can also solo but can't really get off 5sec aoe on them ever. I get occasionally interrupted even on my 1sec heals. If parry will be removed and seems that block will be also tad lower my soloing times are well over as will game be. As a caster class interrupts are our worst nightmare and we need something to enable us to be able to solo. You can't solo if you have to use all your power for healing cause we need power for dealing damage as our melee is crap at best. If we're meant to use our power more or less on healing then SOE needs to make us melee/caster class. In my books and if you look up our skills, equipment we aren't pure casters. We are or least should be more hybrid melee/caster class. Maybe we aren't suppose to solo heroic encounters but c'mon, we are talking about greens sometimes perhaps easiest blues. They are well below our level so they should be doable to some extend. There is no sane reason for removing parry from priests, none. If someone tries to tell that we're pure casters it's bull****, if you can wield and swing sword, heavy maces, morning stars, spears, hammers, use heavy/medium/light armor we aren't even close on caster class. Unfortunately I don't have character on test, would play if I could make copy of my char to test so can't tell how bad this is but even from current mechanics on live I've already problems with interrupts and staying alive this change will make it a lot worse. SO PLEASE RECONSIDER IT AGAIN (and again and again...)

agreed. half my ability to avoid hits is parry as i dont use a buckler most times...which is only 5% anyway. If this was lost There would be no soloing for me at all, even on solo mobs. On my pure opion... SOE screwed every class in the game except the tanks in soloing. As a mage I use to solo stuff all the time, very very hard if at all now unless your a summoner type. As a scout..i guess it just depends on too many factors (bows, poisons, environmet to fight. the mob itself). As a healer (and Ive only played Cleric so I cant speak for the other classes) but I get chewed up by blue solos sometimes. Dont get me wrong though I can solo white/yellow solos as a templar and some oranges, depends on the mob alot too. I think all the classes should be able to solo at their level (i.e white con solo) at the least but some cant right now, and without parry i doubt i could. SOE please think about the things you do to us before you do it. AND FOR ONCE LISTEN TO YOU PAYING CUSTOMERS.

Heiro · 05-13-2005, 12:29 PM

lvl 37 -38 on Wednesday 5/11 night in Feerrott soloing groups of heroic / normal -4/5 mob groups - white / yellow / orange (no arrows or one down).

Not really missing the parry all that much.

Havent been having any problems soloing...

Dont see what all the hub-bub is about ...

Captain Ulissariusss or whatever his name is was a challenge though ... tough mob to solo even green SMILEY

mistress_darknes · 05-13-2005, 03:23 PM

Wardens are stuck with light armor too,

we will be killed in one blow, how will we keep the tank or our group standing, when we will have to be healing ourselves all the time.

the only way we can keep the group safe is if we can parry the attacks and cast heals on our group,

uhg

so tired of nerf this nerf that,

why start the game with something if your just going to remove it.

same thing in Starwars hooked us then nerfed us to death and we left the game.

S

TerrorRising · 05-14-2005, 02:15 AM

Right now, healers, especially inquisitors/templars, get the snot knocked out of them by greens, even no arrow greens. Trying to solo in high lvl zones as a cleric is tough if not impossible.

The main thing now is that clerics need parry in groups when the tank dies to stay alive long enough to either let someone else pick up the aggr or to battle-revive the tank and allow him/her to re-establish aggression. If you remove parry without adequate compensation to the priest class (or whatever you call the first level), they are going to die before the aggression can be shifted, and then the rest of the group will die.

Also, I've seen mobs ignore my damage pull to go straight for the priest because of the buffs in place (no casting occurs during pulls). If I don't have time to cast my spells, especially with mobs doing 800+ hits, the priest is toast with its little buckler shield. While priests should not be tanking, they should be able to take some good hits, even at upper levels (albeit dodging, parrying, or blocking) while the tank establishes aggression. Come on guys, priests are rice-paper pure casters. Give them a little defense or give them something else for what you are taking away (along the same line, please).

05-01-2005, 03:19 AM	#93
MadisonPark Loremaster Join Date: Nov 2004 Posts: 888	Texasguy24 wrote: One word: weak. This thread has gotten really lame... people claiming they go to castles and stuff? [expletive ninja'd by Faarbot]? Seriousely, who cares? It's a game.. priests don't need to parry.. I am one. a warden, I don't want parry.. I want dodge. I think light armor wearers should be dodging, not parrying. Personally, at this point, I don't care what templars think. They don't need parry either, they have plate armor. Quit whining, you're EQ's spoiled little brats =P Just take your plate mitigation, your non aggroing, super efficient healing, poor mistreated self, and get lost. =D Completely ignoring how self involved you sound, lets put it this way. Right now, as a self buffed, well equipped level 50 templar I have 50%- 70% mitigation (the high side includes mitigation procs from my various heals, and only last for about 15 seconds at a time) and 55% avoidance. This avoidance is unbuffed, as templars have no defense, avoidance or agility buffs. This is comprised of 25% base, 25% parry and the rest is block ( i forget the number, but i think its around 5% as I use a buckler). With my current avoidance, fighting a mob that is any con above grey, I get interupted 4 out of 5 casts. I can completely forget casting anything with a cast time of longer than 3 seconds. Losing my 25% parry, who knows how much base because of heavy armor, and my block down to 3%, Id estimate my avoidance going down to about 10%. Imagine the interupt rate then. Clerics have the lowest hp of all the priests to compensate for their heavy armor ( similiarly equiped druids that I know can buff their hp to 500 points higher), well this is all good and fine, because were getting hit for less damage. Only problem being that will be hit so often, and consequently interupted, that we wont be albe to heal our selves with our "non aggroing, super efficient" reactives. Non agroing I might want to mention being fixed most likely when these combat changes take effect. edit: proper grammar = my friend Message Edited by MadisonPark on 04-30-2005 04:21 PM __________________ Lairia- Templar on Guk

05-13-2005, 02:26 AM	#95
Morogoth Drakul Loremaster Join Date: Dec 2004 Posts: 224	Chanliang wrote:For me removing parry might be last hit, I have currently level 39 mystic very well equipped all spells are adept1 or better and I solo 70% of my playing time. Currently I have little over 50% mitigation 49.1% avoidance (parry about 32%). Currently my debuffs hardly effect of mobs so all I really have is spell damage, melee and sta debuffs which allows me to solo relatively well but slow. I currently have to cast 5sec aoe nuke for example 2-4 times on group encounters (3-4 x 1-2 arrow down greens or 2-3x2 arrow down blues). Some groups of 3 greens I can also solo but can't really get off 5sec aoe on them ever. I get occasionally interrupted even on my 1sec heals. If parry will be removed and seems that block will be also tad lower my soloing times are well over as will game be. As a caster class interrupts are our worst nightmare and we need something to enable us to be able to solo. You can't solo if you have to use all your power for healing cause we need power for dealing damage as our melee is crap at best. If we're meant to use our power more or less on healing then SOE needs to make us melee/caster class. In my books and if you look up our skills, equipment we aren't pure casters. We are or least should be more hybrid melee/caster class. Maybe we aren't suppose to solo heroic encounters but c'mon, we are talking about greens sometimes perhaps easiest blues. They are well below our level so they should be doable to some extend. There is no sane reason for removing parry from priests, none. If someone tries to tell that we're pure casters it's bull****, if you can wield and swing sword, heavy maces, morning stars, spears, hammers, use heavy/medium/light armor we aren't even close on caster class. Unfortunately I don't have character on test, would play if I could make copy of my char to test so can't tell how bad this is but even from current mechanics on live I've already problems with interrupts and staying alive this change will make it a lot worse. SO PLEASE RECONSIDER IT AGAIN (and again and again...) agreed. half my ability to avoid hits is parry as i dont use a buckler most times...which is only 5% anyway. If this was lost There would be no soloing for me at all, even on solo mobs. On my pure opion... SOE screwed every class in the game except the tanks in soloing. As a mage I use to solo stuff all the time, very very hard if at all now unless your a summoner type. As a scout..i guess it just depends on too many factors (bows, poisons, environmet to fight. the mob itself). As a healer (and Ive only played Cleric so I cant speak for the other classes) but I get chewed up by blue solos sometimes. Dont get me wrong though I can solo white/yellow solos as a templar and some oranges, depends on the mob alot too. I think all the classes should be able to solo at their level (i.e white con solo) at the least but some cant right now, and without parry i doubt i could. SOE please think about the things you do to us before you do it. AND FOR ONCE LISTEN TO YOU PAYING CUSTOMERS. __________________ ~Cry Me A River And Bleed Me An Ocean~ =====Nagafen===== [Sseth]=[Guardian] [Salathiel]=[Inquistor] [Morogoth]=[Assassin]

05-13-2005, 03:23 PM	#97
mistress_darknes Loremaster Join Date: Mar 2005 Posts: 39	Wardens are stuck with light armor too, we will be killed in one blow, how will we keep the tank or our group standing, when we will have to be healing ourselves all the time. the only way we can keep the group safe is if we can parry the attacks and cast heals on our group, uhg so tired of nerf this nerf that, why start the game with something if your just going to remove it. same thing in Starwars hooked us then nerfed us to death and we left the game. S __________________ Looking for a fun loving guild? With a family style play? a bit of Raiding? Vindicators! best guild you ll ever find!

04-29-2005, 06:00 AM	#91
otlg Loremaster Join Date: Mar 2005 Posts: 110	Veldaar: For the record, my problem wasn't with your desire to be on equal footing. However, having said that, *no one* should be soloing groups for '3 or more'. At least not logically. Problem is, we're all a bunch of spoiled rotten brats now, who've grown a customed to totally ignoring the con system. If you actually read what the con system says, you'll see people are doing way too many encounters that 'shouldn't' be possible (and there just aren't that many 'good' players for the number of those fights). And if you think you get beat down wearing plate, put on the leathers my friend. Your life ain't so bad... Osiri

04-30-2005, 08:02 PM	#92
Texasguy24 Loremaster Join Date: Mar 2005 Posts: 8	One word: weak. This thread has gotten really lame... people claiming they go to castles and stuff? [expletive ninja'd by Faarbot]? Seriousely, who cares? It's a game.. priests don't need to parry.. I am one. a warden, I don't want parry.. I want dodge. I think light armor wearers should be dodging, not parrying. Personally, at this point, I don't care what templars think. They don't need parry either, they have plate armor. Quit whining, you're EQ's spoiled little brats =P Just take your plate mitigation, your non aggroing, super efficient healing, poor mistreated self, and get lost. =D

05-02-2005, 01:57 AM	#94
Chanliang Loremaster Join Date: Dec 2004 Posts: 198	For me removing parry might be last hit, I have currently level 39 mystic very well equipped all spells are adept1 or better and I solo 70% of my playing time. Currently I have little over 50% mitigation 49.1% avoidance (parry about 32%). Currently my debuffs hardly effect of mobs so all I really have is spell damage, melee and sta debuffs which allows me to solo relatively well but slow. I currently have to cast 5sec aoe nuke for example 2-4 times on group encounters (3-4 x 1-2 arrow down greens or 2-3x2 arrow down blues). Some groups of 3 greens I can also solo but can't really get off 5sec aoe on them ever. I get occasionally interrupted even on my 1sec heals. If parry will be removed and seems that block will be also tad lower my soloing times are well over as will game be. As a caster class interrupts are our worst nightmare and we need something to enable us to be able to solo. You can't solo if you have to use all your power for healing cause we need power for dealing damage as our melee is crap at best. If we're meant to use our power more or less on healing then SOE needs to make us melee/caster class. In my books and if you look up our skills, equipment we aren't pure casters. We are or least should be more hybrid melee/caster class. Maybe we aren't suppose to solo heroic encounters but c'mon, we are talking about greens sometimes perhaps easiest blues. They are well below our level so they should be doable to some extend. There is no sane reason for removing parry from priests, none. If someone tries to tell that we're pure casters it's bull****, if you can wield and swing sword, heavy maces, morning stars, spears, hammers, use heavy/medium/light armor we aren't even close on caster class. Unfortunately I don't have character on test, would play if I could make copy of my char to test so can't tell how bad this is but even from current mechanics on live I've already problems with interrupts and staying alive this change will make it a lot worse. SO PLEASE RECONSIDER IT AGAIN (and again and again...)

05-13-2005, 12:29 PM	#96
Heiro Tester Join Date: Nov 2004 Posts: 146	lvl 37 -38 on Wednesday 5/11 night in Feerrott soloing groups of heroic / normal -4/5 mob groups - white / yellow / orange (no arrows or one down). Not really missing the parry all that much. Havent been having any problems soloing... Dont see what all the hub-bub is about ... Captain Ulissariusss or whatever his name is was a challenge though ... tough mob to solo even green

05-14-2005, 02:15 AM	#98
TerrorRising Loremaster Join Date: Nov 2004 Posts: 15	Right now, healers, especially inquisitors/templars, get the snot knocked out of them by greens, even no arrow greens. Trying to solo in high lvl zones as a cleric is tough if not impossible. The main thing now is that clerics need parry in groups when the tank dies to stay alive long enough to either let someone else pick up the aggr or to battle-revive the tank and allow him/her to re-establish aggression. If you remove parry without adequate compensation to the priest class (or whatever you call the first level), they are going to die before the aggression can be shifted, and then the rest of the group will die. Also, I've seen mobs ignore my damage pull to go straight for the priest because of the buffs in place (no casting occurs during pulls). If I don't have time to cast my spells, especially with mobs doing 800+ hits, the priest is toast with its little buckler shield. While priests should not be tanking, they should be able to take some good hits, even at upper levels (albeit dodging, parrying, or blocking) while the tank establishes aggression. Come on guys, priests are rice-paper pure casters. Give them a little defense or give them something else for what you are taking away (along the same line, please).