New Old Ancient Class Spells, Only Buyable? Also Droping?

10-28-2016, 02:30 AM

Hey,

with 50.000 Faction with Nye'Caelona, Kuen Nozun sells all the ancient spells for your class, not only the 6 existing in the past. But the pricing is enorm (10.000.000 Platin each spell). I have a few question about these new ancients.

Will these new ancients also drop, or are they only buyable?
If they drop, will they only drop in Kunar Ascending zones, or also in old content level 100 zones?
Are the prices meant to stay that high? I know there are a few players having so much money, but i myself, am one of the wealthier ppl of my force and i cannot even afford one of these spells. MANY coins missing here! I know, there is too much money in game and you are probably interested in reducing that. But who can afford that? I guess thats only for players, not playing EQ 2 as an MMORPG, but as an economy simulator. However, fine for me, as long as the spells will also drop like the old 6 ancients for every class.

10-28-2016, 04:16 AM

Kinda cool they are buyable didn't realise the cost though. I agree as long as you can craft them from the grandmaster or get them from drops then all good.

duckster · 10-28-2016, 06:41 PM

Plat cost seems excessive but with previous items that were excessive in terms of currency cost - the mount in tov being 300k status for example.

They should be available in another form - grinding coins being 1 or raid/challenge content?. I hope its not from the new duck zone(rumour).

10-29-2016, 03:12 AM

this is a way to pull loads of plat out of the game, ancients shouldnt be grindable

duckster · 10-29-2016, 03:23 AM

They already have infusion as a means to plat sink but i agree with it being one of the reasons. Doesnt mean there shouldnt be alternatives to having them drop or be grinded.

Even if its a crazy amount of grinding required (3+ months for 1) and making them heirloom/no trade once purchased.

10-29-2016, 09:48 PM

Make it like 500k / spell and its ok I guess.

10-30-2016, 06:18 PM

The only person in my guild that could afford one of these is the guy that sells 2-3 chrono a week (he claims it's cheaper then going to the bar.)

Even at 500k each I could afford to buy 1 of them for 1 of my chars, I'm not a plat farmer

10-30-2016, 07:22 PM

I love the idea of plat sinks to control inflation. Infusing was a good start.

However, 10mil plat is a bit much, considering what the player is getting out of 1 spell upgrade from GM->Ancient. Can we consider dropping it to 1mil perhaps, so more people have at least a reasonable shot to and properly weigh the value proposition of this?

Compare the value of 10M plat worth of infusing (both direct plat + buying crafted infusers at market prices). You'll get literally orders of magnitude more gain out of that than buying one Ancient spell. No one is going to take advantage of buying Ancients when they can get more gains out of infusing... the amount of people who will be fully infuse-capped in both physical/deity bins and "have nothing else to spend their plat on" is going to be incredibly small.

Good idea, but please reconsider the specifics...

10-31-2016, 01:59 AM

Even at $50 worth of krono it's still a big amount for most players to shell out, even for the ones that don't mind "legally buying" plat.

I dunno where the inflection point is on the supply vs demand curve, but I applaud them for getting plat out of the game.

10-31-2016, 08:13 AM

10m plat is like 30 kronos. 30 kronos is like 500$. Sounds like a complete ripoff.

10-31-2016, 03:17 PM

Sure, i agree with that, removing platin from the game is a good thing. I cannot really imagine, how frustrating for new players the current prices must be. But wouldnt it be a better idee to have hundreds of players burning huge amounts of platin, getting something usefull for it instead of just a few and many others disappointed by it? And in general, to have a reachable goal to play/farm for than something which is plainly out of reach?

10-31-2016, 03:35 PM

I have to agree. 10mil is the same as unobtainable.

Kickya · 11-11-2016, 03:34 PM

even 1 mill is still way too high for 99% of the population

if DBG want to remove plat from the game then 1 person on a server spending 100 mill and is the only buyer is way low compared to having 90% of the server spending 100k a spell

what ever the price is will be too rich for me, hehe

if they were 50k i still couldn't buy 1

11-11-2016, 04:50 PM

100k would be stupid cheap with how rare an ancient spell is. They are VERY rare and why whenever they actually do pop up on the broker they're priced at 1m+. At 10m plat i'm buying 0, priced at 1m plat, sure i'd buy one or two....but at 100k i'm buying every single one and increasing my parse....then i get to listed to "you paid to win"

11-13-2016, 01:16 PM

i agree at the price at 1mil each , at that price i would probably buy 1 or 2
at 10 mil that simply would be out of reach

11-13-2016, 01:35 PM

Entropy said: ↑

“I love the idea of plat sinks to control inflation. Infusing was a good start.

However, 10mil plat is a bit much, considering what the player is getting out of 1 spell upgrade from GM->Ancient. Can we consider dropping it to 1mil perhaps, so more people have at least a reasonable shot to and properly weigh the value proposition of this?

Compare the value of 10M plat worth of infusing (both direct plat + buying crafted infusers at market prices). You'll get literally orders of magnitude more gain out of that than buying one Ancient spell. No one is going to take advantage of buying Ancients when they can get more gains out of infusing... the amount of people who will be fully infuse-capped in both physical/deity bins and "have nothing else to spend their plat on" is going to be incredibly small.

Good idea, but please reconsider the specifics...”

They aren't trying to make Ancient spells available to a lot of people, they are trying to pull plat from the people that naturally accumulate it quickly. Aka, SLR groups and especially guys that bot a group.

They also don't have to sell a whole lot of them to have an effect on the economy. Infusions didn't bite into the supply of plat (probably due to an exploit that was found around the time ToT launched), but the ancient spells might. 10 million is a lot of coin going out of the economy.

Lowering the price just means more spells are going to be purchased, not that more plat will be removed. It could actually have the opposite effect with the really high earners being able to buy every purchasable ancient spell for 1/10 the cost and not enough other people purchasing them to make up for the difference.

11-13-2016, 08:27 PM

Hehe actually I'm trying to get all my spells maxed. I have a few old ancients. They go cheap as if they aren't current tier. I've bought a couple now.

11-13-2016, 11:15 PM

The botters I know over several guilds do like to raid as well , but after reading what you said I tend to agree it hard to justify spending that much over infusion.

11-14-2016, 08:52 AM

Meirril said: ↑

“They aren't trying to make Ancient spells available to a lot of people, they are trying to pull plat from the people that naturally accumulate it quickly. Aka, SLR groups and especially guys that bot a group.

They also don't have to sell a whole lot of them to have an effect on the economy. Infusions didn't bite into the supply of plat (probably due to an exploit that was found around the time ToT launched), but the ancient spells might. 10 million is a lot of coin going out of the economy.

Lowering the price just means more spells are going to be purchased, not that more plat will be removed. It could actually have the opposite effect with the really high earners being able to buy every purchasable ancient spell for 1/10 the cost and not enough other people purchasing them to make up for the difference.”

That plat exploit was most definitely the primary cause of the expection deflation not occuring. I spent roughly 3-4M on infusing in TOT; while that's on the higher end of the spectrum, I'm certainly not alone. It should have pulled a ton of plat out of the game, yet Krono prices kept rising. Why? Plat exploit. If DBG can keep that stuff locked down, we should hopefully see some reasonable currency stabilization in KA.

My point still stands on the price of the Ancients though. I hope DBG finds the sweet spot in the demand curve, but when faced with investing 1M, or 10M, into infusing or Ancients... it's not a hard choice. Most classes get most of their parse makeup from AA abilities and (soon) procs. Core class spells just aren't that great anymore. Why would I spent millions of plat to boost a spell by 7-10% when it only makes up 5% of my parse? I'd get FAR more benefit from just buying into more infusing instead.

I love plat sinks and hope they'll continue to add them. There's a lot of potential for this, but they seem to keep adding useful stuff in the form of DBC in order to boost marketplace sales. I mean, I get it, but it's not helping the in game economy. I'd love to be in a game where I actually feel like I need to be looting every corpse and chest to get more plat that has real value.

10-28-2016, 02:30 AM	#1
Yahku New Member Posts: n/a	Hey, with 50.000 Faction with Nye'Caelona, Kuen Nozun sells all the ancient spells for your class, not only the 6 existing in the past. But the pricing is enorm (10.000.000 Platin each spell). I have a few question about these new ancients. Will these new ancients also drop, or are they only buyable? If they drop, will they only drop in Kunar Ascending zones, or also in old content level 100 zones? Are the prices meant to stay that high? I know there are a few players having so much money, but i myself, am one of the wealthier ppl of my force and i cannot even afford one of these spells. MANY coins missing here! I know, there is too much money in game and you are probably interested in reducing that. But who can afford that? I guess thats only for players, not playing EQ 2 as an MMORPG, but as an economy simulator. However, fine for me, as long as the spells will also drop like the old 6 ancients for every class.

10-29-2016, 03:12 AM	#4
kluxor Active Member Posts: n/a	duckster said: ↑ “Plat cost seems excessive but with previous items that were excessive in terms of currency cost - the mount in tov being 300k status for example. They should be available in another form - grinding coins being 1 or raid/challenge content?. I hope its not from the new duck zone(rumour).” this is a way to pull loads of plat out of the game, ancients shouldnt be grindable

10-29-2016, 03:23 AM	#5
duckster Member Join Date: Jan 1970 Posts: 0	kluxor said: ↑ “this is a way to pull loads of plat out of the game, ancients shouldnt be grindable” They already have infusion as a means to plat sink but i agree with it being one of the reasons. Doesnt mean there shouldnt be alternatives to having them drop or be grinded. Even if its a crazy amount of grinding required (3+ months for 1) and making them heirloom/no trade once purchased.

10-31-2016, 01:59 AM	#9
Entropy Active Member Posts: n/a	Yards said: ↑ “10m plat is like 30 kronos. 30 kronos is like 500$. Sounds like a complete ripoff.” Even at $50 worth of krono it's still a big amount for most players to shell out, even for the ones that don't mind "legally buying" plat. I dunno where the inflection point is on the supply vs demand curve, but I applaud them for getting plat out of the game.

11-11-2016, 04:50 PM	#14
kluxor Active Member Posts: n/a	Kickya said: ↑ “even 1 mill is still way too high for 99% of the population if DBG want to remove plat from the game then 1 person on a server spending 100 mill and is the only buyer is way low compared to having 90% of the server spending 100k a spell what ever the price is will be too rich for me, hehe if they were 50k i still couldn't buy 1” 100k would be stupid cheap with how rare an ancient spell is. They are VERY rare and why whenever they actually do pop up on the broker they're priced at 1m+. At 10m plat i'm buying 0, priced at 1m plat, sure i'd buy one or two....but at 100k i'm buying every single one and increasing my parse....then i get to listed to "you paid to win"

10-28-2016, 04:16 AM	#2
Ellimist Active Member Posts: n/a	Kinda cool they are buyable didn't realise the cost though. I agree as long as you can craft them from the grandmaster or get them from drops then all good.

10-28-2016, 06:41 PM	#3
duckster Member Join Date: Jan 1970 Posts: 0	Plat cost seems excessive but with previous items that were excessive in terms of currency cost - the mount in tov being 300k status for example. They should be available in another form - grinding coins being 1 or raid/challenge content?. I hope its not from the new duck zone(rumour).

10-29-2016, 09:48 PM	#6
Raenius Active Member Posts: n/a	Make it like 500k / spell and its ok I guess.

10-30-2016, 06:18 PM	#7
Curmudgeon Member Posts: n/a	The only person in my guild that could afford one of these is the guy that sells 2-3 chrono a week (he claims it's cheaper then going to the bar.) Even at 500k each I could afford to buy 1 of them for 1 of my chars, I'm not a plat farmer

10-30-2016, 07:22 PM	#8
Entropy Active Member Posts: n/a	I love the idea of plat sinks to control inflation. Infusing was a good start. However, 10mil plat is a bit much, considering what the player is getting out of 1 spell upgrade from GM->Ancient. Can we consider dropping it to 1mil perhaps, so more people have at least a reasonable shot to and properly weigh the value proposition of this? Compare the value of 10M plat worth of infusing (both direct plat + buying crafted infusers at market prices). You'll get literally orders of magnitude more gain out of that than buying one Ancient spell. No one is going to take advantage of buying Ancients when they can get more gains out of infusing... the amount of people who will be fully infuse-capped in both physical/deity bins and "have nothing else to spend their plat on" is going to be incredibly small. Good idea, but please reconsider the specifics...

10-31-2016, 08:13 AM	#10
Yards Member Posts: n/a	10m plat is like 30 kronos. 30 kronos is like 500$. Sounds like a complete ripoff.

10-31-2016, 03:17 PM	#11
Yahku New Member Posts: n/a	Sure, i agree with that, removing platin from the game is a good thing. I cannot really imagine, how frustrating for new players the current prices must be. But wouldnt it be a better idee to have hundreds of players burning huge amounts of platin, getting something usefull for it instead of just a few and many others disappointed by it? And in general, to have a reachable goal to play/farm for than something which is plainly out of reach?

10-31-2016, 03:35 PM	#12
ZUES Well-Known Member Posts: n/a	I have to agree. 10mil is the same as unobtainable.

11-11-2016, 03:34 PM	#13
Kickya Member Join Date: Jan 1970 Posts: 0	even 1 mill is still way too high for 99% of the population if DBG want to remove plat from the game then 1 person on a server spending 100 mill and is the only buyer is way low compared to having 90% of the server spending 100k a spell what ever the price is will be too rich for me, hehe if they were 50k i still couldn't buy 1

11-13-2016, 01:16 PM	#15
semisus Active Member Posts: n/a	i agree at the price at 1mil each , at that price i would probably buy 1 or 2 at 10 mil that simply would be out of reach

11-13-2016, 01:35 PM	#16
Meirril Well-Known Member Posts: n/a	Entropy said: ↑ “I love the idea of plat sinks to control inflation. Infusing was a good start. However, 10mil plat is a bit much, considering what the player is getting out of 1 spell upgrade from GM->Ancient. Can we consider dropping it to 1mil perhaps, so more people have at least a reasonable shot to and properly weigh the value proposition of this? Compare the value of 10M plat worth of infusing (both direct plat + buying crafted infusers at market prices). You'll get literally orders of magnitude more gain out of that than buying one Ancient spell. No one is going to take advantage of buying Ancients when they can get more gains out of infusing... the amount of people who will be fully infuse-capped in both physical/deity bins and "have nothing else to spend their plat on" is going to be incredibly small. Good idea, but please reconsider the specifics...” They aren't trying to make Ancient spells available to a lot of people, they are trying to pull plat from the people that naturally accumulate it quickly. Aka, SLR groups and especially guys that bot a group. They also don't have to sell a whole lot of them to have an effect on the economy. Infusions didn't bite into the supply of plat (probably due to an exploit that was found around the time ToT launched), but the ancient spells might. 10 million is a lot of coin going out of the economy. Lowering the price just means more spells are going to be purchased, not that more plat will be removed. It could actually have the opposite effect with the really high earners being able to buy every purchasable ancient spell for 1/10 the cost and not enough other people purchasing them to make up for the difference.

11-13-2016, 08:27 PM	#17
Ellimist Active Member Posts: n/a	Hehe actually I'm trying to get all my spells maxed. I have a few old ancients. They go cheap as if they aren't current tier. I've bought a couple now.

11-13-2016, 11:15 PM	#18
Ashandra Active Member Posts: n/a	The botters I know over several guilds do like to raid as well , but after reading what you said I tend to agree it hard to justify spending that much over infusion.

11-14-2016, 08:52 AM	#19
Entropy Active Member Posts: n/a	Meirril said: ↑ “They aren't trying to make Ancient spells available to a lot of people, they are trying to pull plat from the people that naturally accumulate it quickly. Aka, SLR groups and especially guys that bot a group. They also don't have to sell a whole lot of them to have an effect on the economy. Infusions didn't bite into the supply of plat (probably due to an exploit that was found around the time ToT launched), but the ancient spells might. 10 million is a lot of coin going out of the economy. Lowering the price just means more spells are going to be purchased, not that more plat will be removed. It could actually have the opposite effect with the really high earners being able to buy every purchasable ancient spell for 1/10 the cost and not enough other people purchasing them to make up for the difference.” That plat exploit was most definitely the primary cause of the expection deflation not occuring. I spent roughly 3-4M on infusing in TOT; while that's on the higher end of the spectrum, I'm certainly not alone. It should have pulled a ton of plat out of the game, yet Krono prices kept rising. Why? Plat exploit. If DBG can keep that stuff locked down, we should hopefully see some reasonable currency stabilization in KA. My point still stands on the price of the Ancients though. I hope DBG finds the sweet spot in the demand curve, but when faced with investing 1M, or 10M, into infusing or Ancients... it's not a hard choice. Most classes get most of their parse makeup from AA abilities and (soon) procs. Core class spells just aren't that great anymore. Why would I spent millions of plat to boost a spell by 7-10% when it only makes up 5% of my parse? I'd get FAR more benefit from just buying into more infusing instead. I love plat sinks and hope they'll continue to add them. There's a lot of potential for this, but they seem to keep adding useful stuff in the form of DBC in order to boost marketplace sales. I mean, I get it, but it's not helping the in game economy. I'd love to be in a game where I actually feel like I need to be looting every corpse and chest to get more plat that has real value.