Forced prestige paths??? - Page 3

lodgepark8485 · 11-01-2012, 04:01 PM

In order to spec in both of the current prestige trees you must now spend 12 in the top line. correct. But this thread is full of people saying that we lose this we lose that. you had 10 points prior to this expansion now you have 25. If you spec the current spec you have now on beta it will take you 16 points that leaves you with 9 MORE than you had before plus 2 new abilities that many say are worthless but hey every little bit does something.

I dont know exactly what every class has in those first lines but im sure people are calling the useless ones ive seen which many classes share, are the ones that debuff 2% potency and what not or add 3 flurry. But if you look at it thats 48% potency debuff on the mob if every one specced that way or grp gets 18% flurry (and yes i know not all classes share those exact ones just using them for an example but many do). HOW is that useless?

Many classes have sides that arent balanced but on those it sure seems like taking both conversions is an equal compromise. If you like one of the end lines SO MUCH. Guess you'll have to decide whether its worth changing from your current spec. But again I repeat you LOSE nothing!!! how is 9 more points and 2 new abilities in the top row useless losing?

lodgepark8485 · 11-01-2012, 04:20 PM

Just did a quick look to see exactly what each class so called useless AAs are...

Scouts - potency debuff on mob 3% = usually a minmum of 6 scouts in a raid = 18% potency debuff

- 3% flurry to grp = 6-9% flurry in scout grps for everyone in that grp

Tanks - Either increased damage on some CAs or reduced incoming damage, a toss up cuz tanks seem to already shoose either or - and a grp dmg proc

Mages - 1% double cast = 1-3% dbl cast in mage grps

- 2% increased health power and healing amount = 2-6% in all grps

Healers - 5% reduced incoming damage = 10% reduced damage not sure if it stacks but all the rest do so why not to grp

- 3% double cast and 10% flurry to healed target

Pretty useless stuff huh? May not be first choice but its definately not useless

Orthureon · 11-01-2012, 04:22 PM

KenCoop wrote:

I haven't quite made it to 95 on test yet, but if I am understanding correctly at 95 both trees unlock, and you can spec some into the other side if haven't taken even point for every ability on the one side.
if this is the case then this thread seems to be addressing a non-issue, because the player could then either choose to fill up one tree and take the new presitge end line, or to put points into the other tree at that point.
It seems to be very similar to how the current prestige works on live.
Perhaps I am misunderstanding, so if someone who has made it to 95 could please clarify I would appreciate it.

Ken the main guff here is that you must now pretty much waste 6 more points on the top tier line to be able to purchase the abilities you are already using CURRENTLY. Yes you will get access to new things come the expansion and still be able to spec into the things you had, but you have just wasted 6+ points by doing so.

We are asking that they lock the choice to one conversion, and once the conversion is chosen, or you spend 10 points in the regular prestige line it then opens up the bottom prestige. Simple solution.

lodgepark8485 · 11-01-2012, 04:41 PM

^^^Your way would create an imbalance. Although personally for my classes i would love it.

Leawyn · 11-01-2012, 06:18 PM

lodgepark8485 wrote:

In order to spec in both of the current prestige trees you must now spend 12 in the top line. correct. But this thread is full of people saying that we lose this we lose that. you had 10 points prior to this expansion now you have 25. If you spec the current spec you have now on beta it will take you 16 points that leaves you with 9 MORE than you had before plus 2 new abilities that many say are worthless but hey every little bit does something.

You don't see a problem at all that instead of getting 15 new points to spend, as we all were anticipating, we only get 9? Or that instead of costing 10 points to have what we have now, it would cost 16? How is this OK? They're literally taking away something and making us get 6 more points to get it back.

lodgepark8485 wrote:

^^^Your way would create an imbalance. Although personally for my classes i would love it.

How would it cause an imbalance? You can't just say it would and not explain why you think so. I think locking to a single tree after 10 points are spent (thus allowing you to put 1 point in the other tree if you choose without it costing you 6 points to get!) will accomplish what they want (avoiding double dipping on the conversions) without blocking us from logging in day 1 of the expansion and losing an ability if we're spec'd that way.

Davngr1 · 11-01-2012, 08:30 PM

lodgepark8485 wrote:

^^^Your way would create an imbalance. Although personally for my classes i would love it.

there is no imbalance what so ever unless you claim that there is an imbalance on live currently.

Cyrdemac · 11-02-2012, 08:42 AM

It's simple. You can't keep your current spec (if cross specced) unless you spend more points into useless skills. And by doing so, you also can't reach the bottom skills.

Therefore you are forced to give up something you learned to like and play with to enjoy the new stuff coming in CoE. And being forced to give something up, is loosing something imho.

It's like stealing someones car and giving it back when he pays you some of the money he just found. In your opinion, he didn't lost anything, because he can still keep his (bought-back) car and enjoy the money he got left.

Orthureon · 11-02-2012, 01:14 PM

Cyrdemac wrote:

It's like stealing someones car and giving it back when he pays you some of the money he just found. In your opinion, he didn't lost anything, because he can still keep his (bought-back) car and enjoy the money he got left.

Lol I love the analogy!

yadlajoi · 11-02-2012, 03:44 PM

the analogy is wrong cause you paid a ransom for your car only to realise they changed your engine to a lower version.

shannontroester · 11-03-2012, 12:43 AM

atleast both of the coercer "endlines" suck so I can just get both conversions (12 pot=1cb and then 12 cb=1 pot) lol

yadlajoi · 11-03-2012, 08:34 AM

another update and still no change to the forced prestige path. either right or left...

Maroger · 11-03-2012, 03:23 PM

Cyrdemac wrote:

It's simple. You can't keep your current spec (if cross specced) unless you spend more points into useless skills. And by doing so, you also can't reach the bottom skills.
Therefore you are forced to give up something you learned to like and play with to enjoy the new stuff coming in CoE. And being forced to give something up, is loosing something imho.
It's like stealing someones car and giving it back when he pays you some of the money he just found. In your opinion, he didn't lost anything, because he can still keep his (bought-back) car and enjoy the money he got left.

But this is the way SOE development work. Take something away you already have and make you get it again in the next expansion. Although what they give you is alway worse than what you had. This is the SOE development path ALWAYS

Frezzyisfuzzy · 11-06-2012, 06:17 PM

I'm a little late to the party, but my vote is also strongly in favor of splitting the top and bottom trees. As it is, you're really limiting the diversity for new specs. Isn't it kinda the point of these things to let us tailor the character's abilities to our playstyle?

Mogrim · 11-07-2012, 07:16 PM

How about an easily implimented compromise position. 4 points to open a tree, 8 points to open both.

Orthureon · 11-08-2012, 12:20 PM

GIVE US FREEDOM OF CHOICE IN CoE 2012!!!

Idea 1:

Open the trees up and let people progress through them in a tier style but can choose any ability from either tree once "x" amount of points have been spent in each tier. No exception, completely open after tier point requirements are met, ALA Heroic Tree.

Idea 2:

Open the trees up and let people progress through them in a tier style but can choose any ability from either tree once "x" amount of points have been spent in each tier. Exception, conversions locked to one choice.

Idea 3:

Once you spend 6 points in the 1st tier abilities it unlocks BOTH side's second tier abilities. Then simply lock the top trees after 10 points spent, take an endline or not 10 points spent opens the bottom tree. This will limit you to one conversion still and allow access to all the new goodies.

Frezzyisfuzzy · 11-08-2012, 08:00 PM

Orthureon wrote:

GIVE US FREEDOM OF CHOICE IN CoE 2012!!!
Idea 1:
Open the trees up and let people progress through them in a tier style but can choose any ability from either tree once "x" amount of points have been spent in each tier. No exception, completely open after tier point requirements are met, ALA Heroic Tree.
Idea 2:
Open the trees up and let people progress through them in a tier style but can choose any ability from either tree once "x" amount of points have been spent in each tier. Exception, conversions locked to one choice.
Idea 3:
Once you spend 6 points in the 1st tier abilities it unlocks BOTH side's second tier abilities. Then simply lock the top trees after 10 points spent, take an endline or not 10 points spent opens the bottom tree. This will limit you to one conversion still and allow access to all the new goodies.

These. Any of these. Please God give us any of these options so I don't have to hate myself as I spend my new prestige points.

macStuibhart · 11-09-2012, 06:00 PM

As I have now read the whole thread all I see is a lot of bickering back and forth etween the players. Instead of bickering, fighting and making general nuisances of ourselves why doesn't everyone get together and work out a comprehensive plan to put forth to the devs and see what they think? I have a couple toons that will lose out in this depending on what the choices are, I haven't looked at them all yet, but in the end I might come up with something better but I do know that with all of us yelling and clamouring for the changes we want we aren't going to get anything effected because the devs will probably just ignore us. Its kind of like my kids, when they are both yelling and screaming they get put in their room and left to stew until they are willing to do what they needed to do in the first place. Until we stop the yelling and screaming the devs are better off letting us blow off the steam and then come in when we are reasonable again.

11-01-2012, 04:22 PM	#63
Orthureon Loremaster Join Date: Jan 2006 Posts: 1,073	KenCoop wrote: I haven't quite made it to 95 on test yet, but if I am understanding correctly at 95 both trees unlock, and you can spec some into the other side if haven't taken even point for every ability on the one side. if this is the case then this thread seems to be addressing a non-issue, because the player could then either choose to fill up one tree and take the new presitge end line, or to put points into the other tree at that point. It seems to be very similar to how the current prestige works on live. Perhaps I am misunderstanding, so if someone who has made it to 95 could please clarify I would appreciate it. Ken the main guff here is that you must now pretty much waste 6 more points on the top tier line to be able to purchase the abilities you are already using CURRENTLY. Yes you will get access to new things come the expansion and still be able to spec into the things you had, but you have just wasted 6+ points by doing so. We are asking that they lock the choice to one conversion, and once the conversion is chosen, or you spend 10 points in the regular prestige line it then opens up the bottom prestige. Simple solution. __________________ NAGAFEN Server DAEMIEN 92 Shadowknight XEOS 92 Ranger EXILON 92 Inquisitor.

11-01-2012, 06:18 PM	#65
Leawyn Loremaster Join Date: Dec 2004 Posts: 1,014	lodgepark8485 wrote: In order to spec in both of the current prestige trees you must now spend 12 in the top line. correct. But this thread is full of people saying that we lose this we lose that. you had 10 points prior to this expansion now you have 25. If you spec the current spec you have now on beta it will take you 16 points that leaves you with 9 MORE than you had before plus 2 new abilities that many say are worthless but hey every little bit does something. You don't see a problem at all that instead of getting 15 new points to spend, as we all were anticipating, we only get 9? Or that instead of costing 10 points to have what we have now, it would cost 16? How is this OK? They're literally taking away something and making us get 6 more points to get it back. lodgepark8485 wrote: ^^^Your way would create an imbalance. Although personally for my classes i would love it. How would it cause an imbalance? You can't just say it would and not explain why you think so. I think locking to a single tree after 10 points are spent (thus allowing you to put 1 point in the other tree if you choose without it costing you 6 points to get!) will accomplish what they want (avoiding double dipping on the conversions) without blocking us from logging in day 1 of the expansion and losing an ability if we're spec'd that way. __________________ Maelani \| Maelya \| Maerie \| Maehymn \| Maewyn \| Maekita \| Maelynne

11-01-2012, 08:30 PM	#66
Davngr1 Loremaster Join Date: Nov 2005 Posts: 2,179	lodgepark8485 wrote: ^^^Your way would create an imbalance. Although personally for my classes i would love it. there is no imbalance what so ever unless you claim that there is an imbalance on live currently. __________________

11-02-2012, 08:42 AM	#67
Cyrdemac Loremaster Join Date: Nov 2004 Posts: 274	It's simple. You can't keep your current spec (if cross specced) unless you spend more points into useless skills. And by doing so, you also can't reach the bottom skills. Therefore you are forced to give up something you learned to like and play with to enjoy the new stuff coming in CoE. And being forced to give something up, is loosing something imho. It's like stealing someones car and giving it back when he pays you some of the money he just found. In your opinion, he didn't lost anything, because he can still keep his (bought-back) car and enjoy the money he got left. __________________

11-02-2012, 01:14 PM	#68
Orthureon Loremaster Join Date: Jan 2006 Posts: 1,073	Cyrdemac wrote: It's like stealing someones car and giving it back when he pays you some of the money he just found. In your opinion, he didn't lost anything, because he can still keep his (bought-back) car and enjoy the money he got left. Lol I love the analogy! __________________ NAGAFEN Server DAEMIEN 92 Shadowknight XEOS 92 Ranger EXILON 92 Inquisitor.

11-01-2012, 04:01 PM	#61
lodgepark8485 Loremaster Join Date: Feb 2010 Posts: 30	In order to spec in both of the current prestige trees you must now spend 12 in the top line. correct. But this thread is full of people saying that we lose this we lose that. you had 10 points prior to this expansion now you have 25. If you spec the current spec you have now on beta it will take you 16 points that leaves you with 9 MORE than you had before plus 2 new abilities that many say are worthless but hey every little bit does something. I dont know exactly what every class has in those first lines but im sure people are calling the useless ones ive seen which many classes share, are the ones that debuff 2% potency and what not or add 3 flurry. But if you look at it thats 48% potency debuff on the mob if every one specced that way or grp gets 18% flurry (and yes i know not all classes share those exact ones just using them for an example but many do). HOW is that useless? Many classes have sides that arent balanced but on those it sure seems like taking both conversions is an equal compromise. If you like one of the end lines SO MUCH. Guess you'll have to decide whether its worth changing from your current spec. But again I repeat you LOSE nothing!!! how is 9 more points and 2 new abilities in the top row useless losing?

11-01-2012, 04:20 PM	#62
lodgepark8485 Loremaster Join Date: Feb 2010 Posts: 30	Just did a quick look to see exactly what each class so called useless AAs are... Scouts - potency debuff on mob 3% = usually a minmum of 6 scouts in a raid = 18% potency debuff - 3% flurry to grp = 6-9% flurry in scout grps for everyone in that grp Tanks - Either increased damage on some CAs or reduced incoming damage, a toss up cuz tanks seem to already shoose either or - and a grp dmg proc Mages - 1% double cast = 1-3% dbl cast in mage grps - 2% increased health power and healing amount = 2-6% in all grps Healers - 5% reduced incoming damage = 10% reduced damage not sure if it stacks but all the rest do so why not to grp - 3% double cast and 10% flurry to healed target Pretty useless stuff huh? May not be first choice but its definately not useless

11-01-2012, 04:41 PM	#64
lodgepark8485 Loremaster Join Date: Feb 2010 Posts: 30	^^^Your way would create an imbalance. Although personally for my classes i would love it.

11-02-2012, 03:44 PM	#69
yadlajoi Loremaster Join Date: Aug 2009 Posts: 155	the analogy is wrong cause you paid a ransom for your car only to realise they changed your engine to a lower version.

11-03-2012, 12:43 AM	#70
shannontroester Lord Join Date: Feb 2011 Posts: 51	atleast both of the coercer "endlines" suck so I can just get both conversions (12 pot=1cb and then 12 cb=1 pot) lol __________________ Ucala-yea I know Gnomes are the Superior Race Dev confirmed

11-03-2012, 08:34 AM	#71
yadlajoi Loremaster Join Date: Aug 2009 Posts: 155	another update and still no change to the forced prestige path. either right or left...

11-03-2012, 03:23 PM	#72
Maroger Loremaster Join Date: Nov 2004 Posts: 3,313	Cyrdemac wrote: It's simple. You can't keep your current spec (if cross specced) unless you spend more points into useless skills. And by doing so, you also can't reach the bottom skills. Therefore you are forced to give up something you learned to like and play with to enjoy the new stuff coming in CoE. And being forced to give something up, is loosing something imho. It's like stealing someones car and giving it back when he pays you some of the money he just found. In your opinion, he didn't lost anything, because he can still keep his (bought-back) car and enjoy the money he got left. But this is the way SOE development work. Take something away you already have and make you get it again in the next expansion. Although what they give you is alway worse than what you had. This is the SOE development path ALWAYS

11-06-2012, 06:17 PM	#73
Frezzyisfuzzy Loremaster Join Date: Dec 2007 Posts: 28	I'm a little late to the party, but my vote is also strongly in favor of splitting the top and bottom trees. As it is, you're really limiting the diversity for new specs. Isn't it kinda the point of these things to let us tailor the character's abilities to our playstyle?

11-07-2012, 07:16 PM	#74
Mogrim Loremaster Join Date: Oct 2008 Posts: 135	How about an easily implimented compromise position. 4 points to open a tree, 8 points to open both. __________________

11-08-2012, 12:20 PM	#75
Orthureon Loremaster Join Date: Jan 2006 Posts: 1,073	GIVE US FREEDOM OF CHOICE IN CoE 2012!!! Idea 1: Open the trees up and let people progress through them in a tier style but can choose any ability from either tree once "x" amount of points have been spent in each tier. No exception, completely open after tier point requirements are met, ALA Heroic Tree. Idea 2: Open the trees up and let people progress through them in a tier style but can choose any ability from either tree once "x" amount of points have been spent in each tier. Exception, conversions locked to one choice. Idea 3: Once you spend 6 points in the 1st tier abilities it unlocks BOTH side's second tier abilities. Then simply lock the top trees after 10 points spent, take an endline or not 10 points spent opens the bottom tree. This will limit you to one conversion still and allow access to all the new goodies. __________________ NAGAFEN Server DAEMIEN 92 Shadowknight XEOS 92 Ranger EXILON 92 Inquisitor.

11-08-2012, 08:00 PM	#76
Frezzyisfuzzy Loremaster Join Date: Dec 2007 Posts: 28	Orthureon wrote: GIVE US FREEDOM OF CHOICE IN CoE 2012!!! Idea 1: Open the trees up and let people progress through them in a tier style but can choose any ability from either tree once "x" amount of points have been spent in each tier. No exception, completely open after tier point requirements are met, ALA Heroic Tree. Idea 2: Open the trees up and let people progress through them in a tier style but can choose any ability from either tree once "x" amount of points have been spent in each tier. Exception, conversions locked to one choice. Idea 3: Once you spend 6 points in the 1st tier abilities it unlocks BOTH side's second tier abilities. Then simply lock the top trees after 10 points spent, take an endline or not 10 points spent opens the bottom tree. This will limit you to one conversion still and allow access to all the new goodies. These. Any of these. Please God give us any of these options so I don't have to hate myself as I spend my new prestige points.

11-09-2012, 06:00 PM	#77
macStuibhart Loremaster Join Date: Feb 2006 Posts: 8	As I have now read the whole thread all I see is a lot of bickering back and forth etween the players. Instead of bickering, fighting and making general nuisances of ourselves why doesn't everyone get together and work out a comprehensive plan to put forth to the devs and see what they think? I have a couple toons that will lose out in this depending on what the choices are, I haven't looked at them all yet, but in the end I might come up with something better but I do know that with all of us yelling and clamouring for the changes we want we aren't going to get anything effected because the devs will probably just ignore us. Its kind of like my kids, when they are both yelling and screaming they get put in their room and left to stew until they are willing to do what they needed to do in the first place. Until we stop the yelling and screaming the devs are better off letting us blow off the steam and then come in when we are reasonable again.