Interview with Lead Designer Akil “Lyndro” Hooper on Game Update 63: SKYSHRINE

[bks6721]

I'm a casual player that logs a lot of hours.  I almost never group with anyone other than my wife.  Rare exceptions like getting an ER update in Cella are the only time I group with others.  Two of my chars have run Pools, that is the extent of my DoV experience.

90/320 SK

90/320 Templar

90/320 Monk

90/320 Wizard

90/320 Warlock

90/320 Berzerker

90/320 Paladin

90/250 Ranger

90/240 Coercer

90/255 Necro

EVERY other class between 30 and 68.

all 9 TS at 90

It isn't hard.  I quest, solo, harvest...  I've never been powerleveled on any toon or bought any loot rights.

[Rijacki]

Katz wrote:

Rijacki wrote:

Katz wrote:

I would have liked a long post stating:  This is what we are doing, this is why we are doing it, this is what it will do to help you, and this is why it is good for the game in the long run.  

From page one or two:

Lyndro-EQ2 wrote:

Hey folks,

I know that much of this is information that you already knew, but we wanted to get everything in a centralized place, so people don't have to dig around to try and find the answers to these questions.

The AA requirement won't be 320 for sure (We don't want to require AoD), the bar for earning XP in 90 is going to be 280, because you have your heroic endlines at that point (and I hate large primes so 277 wasn't going to work). The requirement exists so we (the developers) and you (the players) have a little more information about what a level 91+ player is. Right now if you form a pick up group, you really don't have an idea whether your tank has 65 AAs or 317 AAs. The same goes for us, content for a level 90 with few AAs is pretty different than content for a level 90 with a whole lot of them.

It's not a long post, but there really doesn't need to be much more rational than that. You're intelligent, you shouldn't need hand holding and someone coming in a explaining in small words with a huge post exactly every detail of why a level 90 with less than 200 AA (as many are claiming they have) is vastly different than a level 90 with 280 AA (no mattere where they're spent).

Whether you meant it to sound that way or not, you are being condescending.   You could have made your point with out the "hand holding" and "small words" comments.  If I make a change at work that is significant, I do explain in detail why the change is good, necessary, and I answer questions about details.   Otherwise there will be resistance, aggravation, and discontent.   I'm intelligent enough to know that, to anticipate it, and to try to prevent it by how the change is presented.   And I don't hold peoples hands and use small words.  I treat them as adults and give them appropriate explanations.

You're right, I was being condescending, I'm sorry. It's borne of frustration for the calls for an 'explaination' when one was very concise and precisely given early in the thread (but drowned out with a lot of noise).

What more reason does there need to be than "Content for a level 90 with few AAs is pretty different than content for a level 90 with a whole lot of them" especially when coupled with the statement 2 sentences before, "The requirement exists so we (the developers) and you (the players) have a little more information about what a level 91+ [character] is." There doesn't need to be any more rational than that. It doesn't need to be a conspiracy theory (as some are trying to spin it) or a way to divide the "mere mortals" from every one else or a way to sell XP potions. It is simply and only so there is a better way to know, for them and us, what a 91+ character is capable of.

There have been countless threads (often created by the same few players) complaining about a character's inability to do thus and so and how it's so unfair for "mere mortals" and how that player thinks thus and so heroic content requires certain raid gear while others, completely baffled by that allegation, will showcase their own characters and groups completing that same content with gear less than the complainer is wearing. This exemplifies exactly what Akil is explaining, "Content for a level 90 with few AAs is pretty different than content for a level 90 with a whole lot of them". The complainer probably has few AA and so the content is far far more difficult than another of the same level in worse gear with a lot of AA. (AA can be put into several survivability points as well as dps ones.)

The AA requirement for leveling past 90 is nothing more than a way to 'normalise' an expectation of what a 91+ character is capable of doing. It doesn't need to be anything more or anything less than that. There doesn't need to be more explanation that that. It doesn't even need to be a conspiracy theory to sell more of anything. And it doesn't even present itself as a way to winnow the chaff of anyone. Just and only a way to have a valid benchmark with a level indicator.

[Koleg]

Katz wrote:

Whether you meant it to sound that way or not, you are being condescending.   You could have made your point with out the "hand holding" and "small words" comments.  If I make a change at work that is significant, I do explain in detail why the change is good, necessary, and I answer questions about details.   Otherwise there will be resistance, aggravation, and discontent.   I'm intelligent enough to know that, to anticipate it, and to try to prevent it by how the change is presented.   And I don't hold peoples hands and use small words.  I treat them as adults and give them appropriate explanations.

I think we can all agree that GU63 does NOT have a huge amount of content, while at the same does have quite a bit to do.  But honestly, how long do we all think that content will last?  With 1 overland zone (~100 quests), 3 heroic zones (each with a EM/HM), a solo zone of two (with EM/HM) and 1 or 2 raid zones (again w/ EM/HM).  That is not a lot of content unless it is challenging to some degree.

Challenging is different to everyone, but we can all agree that some people are more progressive than others.  I'll not venture a guess as to what percentage of people fall into a challenge mode and which do not.  We can all also agree that characters with high tiered gear are more capable of more challenging content.  On the same note we can all agree that characters with more AA and high tier spell/ca quality are also more capable of more challenging content.

So, with so little content, which needs to last until Winter '12 without "slowing down" the consumption of the small amount of content available, that content must be challenging to every group of players, whether they be solo'ers, Trade Skillers, Groups, Raiders or Questers. 

With the requirment of prestige abilities being tied to an assumed AA minimum, the Dev's will have the oportunity to design, scale and tune that content to a higher challenging level.  Which will require the characters using that more challenging content to build up to it and prepare for it.  Once all characters have completed that content they will have nothing left.  In DOV1 even thought content was overly challenging to many it was not trivial to any.  Creating heroic zones without applying some degree of challenge to them, such as Ascent is now,  will make those new zones trivial to many too quickly.  Leaving nothing left to progress into.

[Cloudrat]

I never feel at  loss for something to do.  There is no reason to tie leveling to AA at the point in the game,  Tie prestige points to AA because they represent the same aspect of the game.  The ability to do adventure content.

Harvesting fun, which is part of crafting, is based on the color of the mobs around the nodes.  Once again the nodes are in a small mob packed zone like KOS making it more difficult and less fun the lower your level.   Yes  I can carefully harvest with a low level adv around red mobs, but that isn't something I want to do for hours on end.  I do that only when I absolutely have to for crafting quests and then return to my 90 necro to enjoy harvesting and chatting.

It really doesn't matter how easy it is to get the AA and that also depends on your definition of easy. Don't begin to presume you know what someone else can or cannot do easily.

As  for  the developers needing to know what a 91 can do hahahahaha

[Raknid]

Pauly@Befallen wrote:

I'm a casual player that logs a lot of hours.  I almost never group with anyone other than my wife.  Rare exceptions like getting an ER update in Cella are the only time I group with others.  Two of my chars have run Pools, that is the extent of my DoV experience.

90/320 SK

90/320 Templar

90/320 Monk

90/320 Wizard

90/320 Warlock

90/320 Berzerker

90/320 Paladin

90/250 Ranger

90/240 Coercer

90/255 Necro

EVERY other class between 30 and 68.

all 9 TS at 90

It isn't hard.  I quest, solo, harvest...  I've never been powerleveled on any toon or bought any loot rights.

Exactly.

The need, or benefits, of having adequate AA for your level have always been completely transparent. There are reasonable excuses for not having adequate AA for your level, but simply being "casual" isn't one of them.

While the need for AAs was well known, there was no "enforcement" mechanism. People could choose not to have adequate AA and still try to participate in content designed for a higer amount.

Now there is an enforcement mechanism, and people act suprised that their past choices have caught up with them?

The new overland content can be done at level 90 and offers good rewards, some would say too good. The new heroic content is designed for a certain level of AA.

If you were under AAd and tried to participate in heroic content in the past, you will be unable to continue to do so in the new content. 

If you were under AAd and only chose to do the solo content, you can keep on trucking without needing the new prestige levels or the new prestige talents.

Players may WANT the levels, but they do not NEED them to participate in the solo content in this GU.

The only reason to NEED the new levels and talents is if you were tackling heroic content and are planning on tackling the new heroic content. In that case, you should be go to go, unless in the past you were bringing and underdeveloped character to heroic content.

This plan of theirs also has the benefit of helping to maintain the value of some of the older content. If you can't level to 92 you probably arent going to be able to go to that heroic content, use the tradable drops from that heroic content, or buy loots rights to non tradable drops. This will keep underdeveloped characters running the old content until they get up to par with the new. 

It is a good plan in my opinion which only n affects those people who chose not to develop their characters. Those characters will not be locked out from doing any content for which their characters are actually suitable, therefore in my mind there is absolutely no "penalty."

[Rosss]

Koleg@Unrest_old wrote:

Katz wrote:

Whether you meant it to sound that way or not, you are being condescending.   You could have made your point with out the "hand holding" and "small words" comments.  If I make a change at work that is significant, I do explain in detail why the change is good, necessary, and I answer questions about details.   Otherwise there will be resistance, aggravation, and discontent.   I'm intelligent enough to know that, to anticipate it, and to try to prevent it by how the change is presented.   And I don't hold peoples hands and use small words.  I treat them as adults and give them appropriate explanations.

I think we can all agree that GU63 does NOT have a huge amount of content, while at the same does have quite a bit to do.  But honestly, how long do we all think that content will last?  With 1 overland zone (~100 quests), 3 heroic zones (each with a EM/HM), a solo zone of two (with EM/HM) and 1 or 2 raid zones (again w/ EM/HM).  That is not a lot of content unless it is challenging to some degree.

Challenging is different to everyone, but we can all agree that some people are more progressive than others.  I'll not venture a guess as to what percentage of people fall into a challenge mode and which do not.  We can all also agree that characters with high tiered gear are more capable of more challenging content.  On the same note we can all agree that characters with more AA and high tier spell/ca quality are also more capable of more challenging content.

So, with so little content, which needs to last until Winter '12 without "slowing down" the consumption of the small amount of content available, that content must be challenging to every group of players, whether they be solo'ers, Trade Skillers, Groups, Raiders or Questers. 

With the requirment of prestige abilities being tied to an assumed AA minimum, the Dev's will have the oportunity to design, scale and tune that content to a higher challenging level.  Which will require the characters using that more challenging content to build up to it and prepare for it.  Once all characters have completed that content they will have nothing left.  In DOV1 even thought content was overly challenging to many it was not trivial to any.  Creating heroic zones without applying some degree of challenge to them, such as Ascent is now,  will make those new zones trivial to many too quickly.  Leaving nothing left to progress into.

Honestly it is even more than that.  By establishing a baseline character power that you can develop around you can effectively create more content in which more people can enjoyable and successfully use.  You are making more efficient use of the resources you have and ensuring a broader player base.

And by defining the baseline you enable the player base to understand where they need to be in order to enjoy said content.

[Raknid]

Cloudrat wrote:

Yes  I can carefully harvest with a low level adv around red mobs, but that isn't something I want to do for hours on end. 

In my opinion this is a complete red herring. The only difference could be two levels. The overland zone is designed for solo play. Those two levels are not going to mean a whole lot of increased danger.

[Cloudrat]

Raknid wrote:

Cloudrat wrote:

Yes  I can carefully harvest with a low level adv around red mobs, but that isn't something I want to do for hours on end. 

In my opinion this is a complete red herring. The only difference could be two levels. The overland zone is designed for solo play. Those two levels are not going to mean a whole lot of increased danger.

No that was one of the reasons someone else gave for it not mattering what level you are when harvesting.  It was not an attempt to deflect from the fact that I would prefer to harvest around blue mobs than yellow.  

And yes a couple levels  makes a huge difference when you are a harvester wearing harvesting gear.

[Kippah]

I think this is a fantastic step in the right direction.  Kudos, Lyndro!

akin99 wrote:

This is not a casual vs raider issue. I am very casual. I play 3-4 times a week for 1-2 hours. 3-6 hours most weeks. I have 2 lvl 90's one with 310 aa other with 260aa. I only started playing in late August so roughly 7 months of playtime. If you are playing at all it is almost impossible to not have reached 280 plus AA. I solo quest for almost all my exp.

I dont really care if the devs gate these levels or not, but I will say if you have a toon 3, 4, 5, 6, years old or more and it is not at 280 plus AA it is because you dont want to get there.

Exactly!

Cloudrat wrote:

Yes  I can carefully harvest with a low level adv around red mobs, but that isn't something I want to do for hours on end.  I do that only when I absolutely have to for crafting quests and then return to my 90 necro to enjoy harvesting and chatting.

It sounds like you already have the solution to your concern.    Win/win.

[Rosss]

Raknid wrote:

Cloudrat wrote:

Yes  I can carefully harvest with a low level adv around red mobs, but that isn't something I want to do for hours on end. 

In my opinion this is a complete red herring. The only difference could be two levels. The overland zone is designed for solo play. Those two levels are not going to mean a whole lot of increased danger.

Agreed.  The solo content will not require level 92 and as such will not require level 92 to harvest in. 

It is more about a sense of being entitled to something that you want and not wanting to pay the price for it.

From a time, money, development, business, and general player, progression, content standpoint this shoud be a very welcome addition.

My only hope is that SoE will use the benchmark they are setting and develop good soild content that can actually be accessed and enjoyed by anyone who meets the criteria.

[Raknid]

Cloudrat wrote:

Raknid wrote:

Cloudrat wrote:

Yes  I can carefully harvest with a low level adv around red mobs, but that isn't something I want to do for hours on end. 

In my opinion this is a complete red herring. The only difference could be two levels. The overland zone is designed for solo play. Those two levels are not going to mean a whole lot of increased danger.

No that was one of the reasons someone else gave for it not mattering what level you are when harvesting.  It was not an attempt to deflect from the fact that I would prefer to harvest around blue mobs than yellow.  

And yes a couple levels  makes a huge difference when you are a harvester wearing harvesting gear.

Have any harvesting areas in the game been designed to be aggro or danger free? You still have a choice of risk mitigation strategies. Just because you can't carry on as you did exactly in the past is not a good enough reason, in my opinion, to scrap something that has major benefites elsewhere.

It's not like you WONT be able to harvest, you might just have to change your routine a bit.

[Koleg]

Cloudrat wrote:

Raknid wrote:

Cloudrat wrote:

Yes  I can carefully harvest with a low level adv around red mobs, but that isn't something I want to do for hours on end. 

In my opinion this is a complete red herring. The only difference could be two levels. The overland zone is designed for solo play. Those two levels are not going to mean a whole lot of increased danger.

No that was one of the reasons someone else gave for it not mattering what level you are when harvesting.  It was not an attempt to deflect from the fact that I would prefer to harvest around blue mobs than yellow.  

And yes a couple levels  makes a huge difference when you are a harvester wearing harvesting gear.

I knew at least 3 level 30-ish players that would constantly harvest in Sundered Frontier before DOV was release.  They would constantly harvets rares to sell on the broker or to guildies.  They didn't have a single toon over level 50, but made thier fortunes harveting in higher level 90 zones.

[Obann]

Personal thoughts here.  Some may not like them and think it's an easy approach.  I'd like to think it's a compromise. There is no need to point out how easy it is to gain AA.  This is not the point of this post.

Many have pointed out that this is continuing DoV content and should follow those lines as the expansion did at launch.  At launch of the expansion the majority of characters where level 90 with 250 AA.  At that point it was perfectly acceptable to kill 90+ mobs with just those 250 AA. 

Here is what I would like to see. 

Personally, I would like to see the AA requirement dropped to 250AA in order to level past level 90, which is in line with DoV at launch. This would allow for the majority to experience the new content without having to AA grind.  As for the prestige AA maintian the current 280AA.  It is resonable to have the expectation that a little more work is needed to get something prestiges.

[Cloudrat]

Koleg@Unrest_old wrote:

Cloudrat wrote:

Raknid wrote:

Cloudrat wrote:

Yes  I can carefully harvest with a low level adv around red mobs, but that isn't something I want to do for hours on end. 

In my opinion this is a complete red herring. The only difference could be two levels. The overland zone is designed for solo play. Those two levels are not going to mean a whole lot of increased danger.

No that was one of the reasons someone else gave for it not mattering what level you are when harvesting.  It was not an attempt to deflect from the fact that I would prefer to harvest around blue mobs than yellow.  

And yes a couple levels  makes a huge difference when you are a harvester wearing harvesting gear.

I knew at least 3 level 30-ish players that would constantly harvest in Sundered Frontier before DOV was release.  They would constantly harvets rares to sell on the broker or to guildies.  They didn't have a single toon over level 50, but made thier fortunes harveting in higher level 90 zones.

I don't want to make a fortune. I want to continue playing the same game I have been playing for years.  I don't care if I ever kill any more wildlife.  I want to harvest, craft for me and my friends, help others, decorate houses and socialize.  No more killing just to satisfy someone else's idea of what is fun.

Edit: Ok this is starting to turn into the Cloudrat taking the bait thread lol  I am done  peace out.

[Koleg]

Cloudrat wrote:

I don't want to make a fortune. I want to continue playing the same game I have been playing for years.  I don't care if I ever kill any more wildlife.  I want to harvest, craft for me and my friends, help others, decorate houses and socialize.  No more killing just to satisfy someone else's idea of what is fun.

Edit: Ok this is starting to turn into the Cloudrat taking the bait thread lol  I am done  peace out.

You should be happy then, because there is no reason you can't do all that.  And leveling w/o killing wildlife?  You've done that in the past I would assume to some degree.  Is there any reason to ever think you would never have to do it again in the future?  This is a level based game after all.  Some of those levels require killing wildlife and others do not.  My guess is that you, along with everyone else, has done both in the past and will again in the future.

[Trynt]

Obann@Permafrost wrote:

Many have pointed out that this is continuing DoV content and should follow those lines as the expansion did at launch.  At launch of the expansion the majority of characters where level 90 with 250 AA.  At that point it was perfectly acceptable to kill 90+ mobs with just those 250 AA. 

Here is what I would like to see. 

Personally, I would like to see the AA requirement dropped to 250AA in order to level past level 90, which is in line with DoV at launch. This would allow for the majority to experience the new content without having to AA grind.  As for the prestige AA maintian the current 280AA.  It is resonable to have the expectation that a little more work is needed to get something prestiges.

DoV Part 1's launch was over a year ago, and the AA cap was raised to 250 over 2 years ago.  Expecting DoV Part 2's difficulty designed with Sentinal's Fate AA caps in mind is silly.

Attaining the heroic endlines that were introduced with DoV Part 1 is a natural prerequisite to DoV part 2.  Lyndro stated exactly this as their rationale for choosing 280 as the threshold, and it's the logical choice.

I get that some people don't want to invest in their characters to "kill any more wildlife" (lol), don't mind being a detriment to the PUG they join, etc... That's fine, and completely their perogative... alone.

The 280 threshold won't make harvesting or even soloing the new content impossible no matter how many times some cry otherwise.

[Sinnous]

Cloud, I'm not trying to flame here but, killing is inherently part of how the everquest franchise has always handled advancement for the most part, yes you can get xp from other things as well, but that is truly just the nature of the game. That aside, you'll still be able to harvest the new zones at 90 without having to have a bajillion AAs the level 92 requirement for AAs is specifically referring to group/heroic content unless I missed something(which is possible).

Again not trying to flame or be condescending but I feel like your point is already addressed as taken care of, since you shouldn't have to kill anything to keep doing what you do.

[Cloudrat]

Sinnous wrote:

Cloud, I'm not trying to flame here but, killing is inherently part of how the everquest franchise has always handled advancement for the most part, yes you can get xp from other things as well, but that is truly just the nature of the game. That aside, you'll still be able to harvest the new zones at 90 without having to have a bajillion AAs the level 92 requirement for AAs is specifically referring to group/heroic content unless I missed something(which is possible).

Again not trying to flame or be condescending but I feel like your point is already addressed as taken care of, since you shouldn't have to kill anything to keep doing what you do.

Oh geez  I keep taking the bait.   I am fully aware  it is possible to harvest at 90.  I also didn't just fall off the turnip truck and I know it will be easier at 92. I should not have to run and get a bunch of AA for this to be possible. 

[Alenna]

Rosss@Everfrost wrote:

Katz wrote:

I think what bothers me about it..is that it is inconsistent with leveling and AA throughout all the other levels.   You go through with the two being not tied to each other in any way that gates you from leveling until level 90.  Then suddenly they are tied together.   Why?  Why weren't they tied together all along?  

Will it affect me in any significant way?  No.  My main has enough AA already and can continue to level. My alts I build AA's on before I level them just because they are easier to play when they have high AA's.  Plus, it is fun to research builds and experiment with how you allocate the aa points.  So that isn't it.  I will have enough AA points on my alts when they are level 90.

The change is creating cognitive dissonance, and that makes me, and probably others, uncomfortable. 

Someone needs to explain it in a way that makes sense.   That is, why does it make sense to tie AA level to your adventure level ONLY when you reach level 90.  Why does it make sense to change having the tab for prestige points say "you must have 280 aa points allocated before you can use prestige points".   Which is what I expected to happen.  I'm used to leveling affecting how you can allocate aa points and how many you can allocate in each tab.  I'm not used to aa points controlling leveling.

It makes sense because prestige is directly tied to leveling.  They are not like aa's.  You earn them as you level past 90.  1 prestige point for every 20% past 90.  So in essence levels > than 90 are "prestige levels", and the only reason you will need them is if you are doing heroic content.  That content is being designed around characters with a baseline of 280aa's so that the developers can have a standard idea of character power.  It is a good thing to have content standardized based upon certain character power checks, this is a very simple way to do that.  It makes it so you do not zone into an instance instantly get killed and then be upset because the content is ridiculously hard.  The standard is honestly set at a very good spot.  If you are currently doing heroic content and understand your class and care how you perform, 280aa's pretty much ensures you have your heroic endline (class defining abilities).

It will not affect your ability to do the new overland content, or gain aa xp from the new overland content so what's the problem?

but it does affect the albility of some people to gain adventure XP

[Raknid]

Cloudrat wrote:

I also didn't just fall off the turnip truck and I know it will be easier at 92. I should not have to run and get a bunch of AA for this to be possible. 

Read what I posted earlier.

Raknid wrote:

Cloudrat wrote:

And yes a couple levels  makes a huge difference when you are a harvester wearing harvesting gear.

Have any harvesting areas in the game been designed to be aggro or danger free? You still have a choice of risk mitigation strategies. Just because you can't carry on as you did exactly in the past is not a good enough reason, in my opinion, to scrap something that has major benefites elsewhere.

It's not like you WONT be able to harvest, you might just have to change your routine a bit.

Meaning you might have to decide whether you want to wear all harvesting gear, all armor, or a mix of both.

There is nothing to keep you from harvesting, nothing at all. You may have to change some, but that is to be expected...the game changes.

What I see you complaining about is that you cannot carry on in the exact smae way that you did before.

As I just said above, things change. You can roll with it and adapt, which I think would be the reasonable response, or you can tear yourself apart trying to get the game to conform to YOUR way of playing.

That is not how it works. We adapt our playstyle to the game, the game does not necesarrily adapt its playstyle to us so we can just keep chugging on doing what we have always done.

[Dethdlr]

Cloudrat wrote:

Oh geez  I keep taking the bait.   I am fully aware  it is possible to harvest at 90.  I also didn't just fall off the turnip truck and I know it will be easier at 92. I should not have to run and get a bunch of AA for this to be possible. 

We're only talking two levels. 

I assume those two levels won't make the difference between something being aggro and something not being aggro, right?

If so, then the only time level will matter is if you aggro something by accident, right?

If thats the case, it would be WAY easier to kill the thing you aggro'd at level 90 with 280 AAs than it would be at level 92 with 200 AAs. But they're not going to let you get to level 92 with 200 AAs, you've got to have at least 280.

So if it's for ease of harvesting in aggro areas, it would be in your best interest to go grab the additional AAs anyway so you can get the end line heroic abilities and make harvesting in the new aggro areas easier. 

(And I'm honestly not trying to bait you or pick on you, hopefully it's not comming across that way.  Just discussing the pros and cons of the change.)

[Raknid]

Alenna@Guk wrote:

but it does affect the albility of some people to gain adventure XP

Adventure experience correlates with levels. Levels correlate with what content you can do. In this case the solo content, that content designed for players with characters who may not have high AA, does not require anything above level 90 to access or complete.

There is therefore no NEED to obtain adventure experieince beyond 90 if you are only going to do the solo content. It may be desired, but it is not needed.

If you want to access the heroic content you WILL need those levels. But, you will also need those AA. Therefore it is reasonable to require the appropriate number of AAs before you can level up and access that content.

[Rosss]

Alenna@Guk wrote:

Rosss@Everfrost wrote:

Katz wrote:

I think what bothers me about it..is that it is inconsistent with leveling and AA throughout all the other levels.   You go through with the two being not tied to each other in any way that gates you from leveling until level 90.  Then suddenly they are tied together.   Why?  Why weren't they tied together all along?  

Will it affect me in any significant way?  No.  My main has enough AA already and can continue to level. My alts I build AA's on before I level them just because they are easier to play when they have high AA's.  Plus, it is fun to research builds and experiment with how you allocate the aa points.  So that isn't it.  I will have enough AA points on my alts when they are level 90.

The change is creating cognitive dissonance, and that makes me, and probably others, uncomfortable. 

Someone needs to explain it in a way that makes sense.   That is, why does it make sense to tie AA level to your adventure level ONLY when you reach level 90.  Why does it make sense to change having the tab for prestige points say "you must have 280 aa points allocated before you can use prestige points".   Which is what I expected to happen.  I'm used to leveling affecting how you can allocate aa points and how many you can allocate in each tab.  I'm not used to aa points controlling leveling.

It makes sense because prestige is directly tied to leveling.  They are not like aa's.  You earn them as you level past 90.  1 prestige point for every 20% past 90.  So in essence levels > than 90 are "prestige levels", and the only reason you will need them is if you are doing heroic content.  That content is being designed around characters with a baseline of 280aa's so that the developers can have a standard idea of character power.  It is a good thing to have content standardized based upon certain character power checks, this is a very simple way to do that.  It makes it so you do not zone into an instance instantly get killed and then be upset because the content is ridiculously hard.  The standard is honestly set at a very good spot.  If you are currently doing heroic content and understand your class and care how you perform, 280aa's pretty much ensures you have your heroic endline (class defining abilities).

It will not affect your ability to do the new overland content, or gain aa xp from the new overland content so what's the problem?

but it does affect the albility of some people to gain adventure XP

Not if said people get off their tail ends and meet the aa requirement prior to go live of gu63.

It is not an unreasonable expectation folks.  What is being said is this...

IF you do not have 280aa then you will not be missing out on anything but lots of deaths, frustration, and getting hated by lots of people you are grouping with BECAUSE the content is designed around 280+ aa strengths.

So I will say it again you will have no need for the extra two levels because the content that you are accessing without the appropriate aa's is designed for characters <280 aa's.  You will be doing level/power appropriate content. 

If this is not acceptable see my first sentence above.  There is plenty of time to get to the minimum required aa's prior to GU 63 hitting live servers.

[Nakaru-Nitepaw]

I have to agree with Cloudrat. I am also ashamed at the members of the EQ2 community who think barring your fellow players from leveling to max level is acceptable... AA should have nothing to do with levels. Do any of you even know what AA stands for? "Alternate Advancement". If it becomes a requirement to have them (even with solo content), then lets just remove the word "alternate" from the title completely. Not everybody is a min/maxer. Some of us want to have fun, and don't care about how high we get a skill or point pool. We want our veteran bonus, we want to be accepted in groups, and we want to enjoy the game the way it has always been. And lets face it we all know that when 92 is the cap, nobody will want to group with anyone lower. That's just how a lot of people roll these days. Some of you might be fine with pointless grinding of the same content over and over and over just to get a few numbers, but the rest of us would rather just have fun, and we shouldn't be denied level 91 just because we don't want to boringly grind AAs. It isn't fair to barricade people from leveling. It's like going back to forcing citizenship quests and access quests for the next overland zone all over again. I also believe our veteran bonuses will be moved to 92, leaving us without the extra boost, making us have to shill to the station cash beast to get pots. I don't care how you try to justify it, it's ludacris. There are other ways of achieving whateve goal SOE had in mind, that don't hurt players leveling up, and many people have shown you those ideas. I don't know of any other MMORPG out there that would be balzy enough to deny players from leveling up because they didn't complete something else. If I find one, I'd probably never play it because to me it would suck.

[Raknid]

Eschia@Antonia Bayle wrote:

 Some of us want to have fun

What are you not going to be able to do the day after this LU launches that you could do the day before?

What content is launching in the LU that you will not be able to do?

Seriously. Can you answer those two questions?

[Rosss]

Eschia@Antonia Bayle wrote:

I have to agree with Cloudrat. I am also ashamed at the members of the EQ2 community who think barring your fellow players from leveling to max level is acceptable... AA should have nothing to do with levels. Do any of you even know what AA stands for? "Alternate Advancement". If it becomes a requirement to have them (even with solo content), then lets just remove the word "alternate" from the title completely. Not everybody is a min/maxer. Some of us want to have fun, and don't care about how high we get a skill or point pool. We want our veteran bonus, we want to be accepted in groups, and we want to enjoy the game the way it has always been. And lets face it we all know that when 92 is the cap, nobody will want to group with anyone lower. That's just how a lot of people roll these days. Some of you might be fine with pointless grinding of the same content over and over and over just to get a few numbers, but the rest of us would rather just have fun, and we shouldn't be denied level 91 just because we don't want to boringly grind AAs. It isn't fair to barricade people from leveling. It's like going back to forcing citizenship quests and access quests for the next overland zone all over again. I also believe our veteran bonuses will be moved to 92, leaving us without the extra boost, making us have to shill to the station cash beast to get pots. I don't care how you try to justify it, it's ludacris. There are other ways of achieving whateve goal SOE had in mind, that don't hurt players leveling up, and many people have shown you those ideas. I don't know of any other MMORPG out there that would be balzy enough to deny players from leveling up because they didn't complete something else. If I find one, I'd probably never play it because to me it would suck.

The vet cap will stay at 90. 

AA's will never be a requirement for solo content. 

It is a group/raid requirement that ensures you at least respect your group members enough to say..ya know what I may not be raid or even top end heroic geared, but I care enough to have the minimum required aa's. 

I value your time please value mine.

[Trynt]

Eschia@Antonia Bayle wrote:

...we want to be accepted in groups...

It works both ways.  Don't be a handicap to the group.  Get the heroic endlines that were released a year ago.

It's not a rational expectation for any character to be a burden on a group, and be "accepted" at the same time.   No one deserves to be carried through content on the backs of people who've actually invested in their toons' growth.

[CleeGrahamx2099]

I for one could care less if you are level 90 while I am at 92 if I am doing the old DoV content. That content was MADE for level 90's, so why would I not want to group with them if I am doing the old content. I am a casual player so even with the new content, I will be doing the old content quite a bit to help the guild and get shards for my alts and for my main to stock up on yellow adornments.

Now with that said, the new dungeons are going to be aimed at level 92 so yes, I want you to be level 92 and have 280+AAs. I don't want a tank going in there at level 90 or 92 with 200 AAs. They won't have the skills needed to survive, keep agro, and help out the group like they should. For the post that stated "I want to respected in groups", well there you go. You wouldn't be respecting people trying to do a challenging level 92 instance with only 150-200 AAs would you?

When I first leveled up my pally to 90, I didn't even go into a DoV instance until he hit 300 AAs because I knew how important it was going to be for him to get them and to make sure I even had a chance to keep agro and do what I needed to do to help the group. Again, everyone has their own styles of play but I see a lot of people talking about the group aspect and that's my two cents on it.

[Koleg]

Eschia@Antonia Bayle wrote:

I have to agree with Cloudrat. I am also ashamed at the members of the EQ2 community who think barring your fellow players from leveling to max level is acceptable... AA should have nothing to do with levels. Do any of you even know what AA stands for? "Alternate Advancement". If it becomes a requirement to have them (even with solo content), then lets just remove the word "alternate" from the title completely.

Not everybody is a min/maxer. Some of us want to have fun, and don't care about how high we get a skill or point pool.

We want our veteran bonus, we want to be accepted in groups, and we want to enjoy the game the way it has always been. And lets face it we all know that when 92 is the cap, nobody will want to group with anyone lower. That's just how a lot of people roll these days.

Some of you might be fine with pointless grinding of the same content over and over and over just to get a few numbers, but the rest of us would rather just have fun, and we shouldn't be denied level 91 just because we don't want to boringly grind AAs.

It isn't fair to barricade people from leveling. It's like going back to forcing citizenship quests and access quests for the next overland zone all over again.

I also believe our veteran bonuses will be moved to 92, leaving us without the extra boost, making us have to shill to the station cash beast to get pots. I don't care how you try to justify it, it's ludacris. There are other ways of achieving whateve goal SOE had in mind, that don't hurt players leveling up, and many people have shown you those ideas.

I don't know of any other MMORPG out there that would be balzy enough to deny players from leveling up because they didn't complete something else. If I find one, I'd probably never play it because to me it would suck.

Wall of txt ... reformated

If people don't care how high they get a skill or pool then why would they care how high they get a level?  IMO, 75% of the problem with PUGs and the Dungeon Finder is becasue some people don't care how they advance their characters, yet they still feel, nay DEMAND, they they are included in content where they cannot possibly be a contrinuting factor souly because they have not the abilities available to them as the rest they force to carry their load.  The Dungeon Finder is a complete failure for this one reason and this one reason alone.

It would be far easier to group with a level 89 player with >280 AA then it would to group with a level 90 player <100 AA. 

AA is available to be earned ffrom level 10 forward... it is rewarded from completing any of the 6000+ quests or adventuring / exploring any of the thousands of micro areas of the game.  it is rewarded from killing each mob and doubly so when that mib has a star.  Nobody needs to grind anything over and over when there is so much availabled from the start to the finish of the journey.  Only through neglect does it become a problem.

Character development is not singularly focued in EQ2 and there is nothing barricading anyone from character advancement.  Every MMO and for that matter every game, including consols or board games such as monoply, all require something to be done before moving forard and allowing you to do somethine else, this is no different.

The difference with the EQ2 Alternate model is that is makes the players in the same level range completely different.  Which creates a huge disparity between what each can accomplish.  They is no way a 90/0 player can ever hope to compete or accomplish the same things as a 90/320 player, yet that continues to be the demand from the 90/0 players.  If content is available for 90/0 players then 90/320 players have nonthing to do, where as the opposite of tht is not true.  In the adventuring world today AA far outweights levels and has for a long time.  The good news is it is not hard to acquire.  The bad news is people don't value it, but expect the same rewards.

The rumor is the Vet bonus is not changing, but it is still too early to tell w/o any red namers.

[Indabuff]

First off let me say I am a casual...I enjoy farming...decorating...and crafting. I have only one toon that meetsthe requirement and that just happened today...and I am FOR this change.

The distance between the playstyles has gotten too wide. To develop even overland content is next to impossibleto make it valuable to both ends of the scale. The only way to end the "its too easy" or "its too hard" problem isto bring the ends closer together.

As for harvesting being a reason to keep it as is, well thats a bit of a stretch dont you think. You are able to harvest, maybe not the way it was before but its still very doeable. We all need to be more reasonable here and stop onlylooking at our individual playstyles. You can always put an effort into one toon to get there so harvesting is easier, thats what I did. Try and look a bit beyond that.

For me I will take my one toon into the new lands and the rest....well they will get there when they are ready.