Removing Crit Chance?

[x82nd77]

treebouncer wrote:

Apparently the removal of crit from gear was unintended and it will be put back on.

Source

http://forums.station.sony.com/eq2/...topic_id=506535

They are going to add a few slots to pieces level 60+ but that is all.  I have quickly lost whatever faith I had in them.  

Whoops, It was unintentional we will fix it next week.

Well... it was intentional but we meant to do it a different way... 

[Crismorn]

level 60+ sounds good

[urgthock]

WOW! Maybe I shouldn't have but I giggled when I saw the name of the poster above.

[Currplunk]

Came back to the game with my girfriend and GU61 made us extremely powerful.  We loved it however, all the crit made it easier to level up and experience the game without getting bogged down in certain areas.  Of course, we only play together and groups outside of ourselves are non-existant.   I would love for all the crit to come back.  I understand the need for the game to drag itself out as it is subscription based, but honestly if we weren't outleveling a zone every 3 days or so, the leveling would have gotten boring.  It seems to me that pre-80 or whatnot that the game is dead anyways.  Why make the few players you do have under 80 stick around where they don't want to be?

[Notsovilepriest]

They apparently nerfed the crit on a ton of SF gear between the last 2 days, my inq dropped from 210 to 137...

[MurFalad]

Silverzx wrote:

grouping up is simply not an option today.  this isn't the game it was 7 years ago.  if you tell me you can find full groups of unmentored players before level 80, you're a liar.  Its not that we don't want to group.  We just can't group unless you wanna spend 2 hours broadcasting the channels just to form a measly group of 3.

I have been in a full group of unmentored players before 80, DFC a few weeks ago in fact, they're rare, especially since its hard to get people to join them when the best rewards are to be had /following a level 90 around opening chests and looting bodies, but they do happen from time to time, and when they do I have to say they're really fun, in fact I cannot remember a bad one.  I'm not saying they are easy to form, or common though.

There is a lot of unconstructive feedback on these forums, I guess that's par for course with MMO's.  Things like people complaining that some numbers on their gear that were buffed to high heaven went down a bit (but their characters are still MUCH more powerful then they were 2 weeks ago, and they did nothing at all to earn it), yet none of these people actually said why this made their gameplay worse?

I don't get the problem with it being 7 years old (what age does it need to be? They're releasing games today that look worse then EQ2, have less content and have very similar gameplay mechanics today still...  And if newer = better then why is Rift showing so many empty servers?).

Grouping up should be a key part of gameplay in an MMO since it defines the major difference between a MMO and a single player RPG, everyone knows that since that's the gameplay that is encouraged at the level cap.  But expecting new players to wade through 89 levels of solo content just to get to the good stuff never was a good design, and I'm guessing the original designers never intended this either.

IMO I think everything that prevents and discourages grouping at lower levels should go, right now the current design of mentoring is just like the grey shards of TSO, people won't group up even with a DF if they can get better rewards by just getting someone else to clear everything.

Neither will they group up if they can solo the content because they can blow through heroics without any help at all.

Nor will people be motivated by phat loot from dungeons if they can swap to their level 90 and mow all the mobs down and pass the loot over to their alts, or buy it for coppers off the broker since its so easy to acquire.

Neither will the reward of lots of plat motivate people if they can three man PR for more plat then they'll get from running 100 quests.  (I wonder if the horse has bolted on the plat thing, and I guess trivialising it at least does give gold farmers a headache which has to be a good thing   Although if they are rewarding us with plat for quests then it should mean something?).

I think EQ2 is by far the best MMO out there, and the game has improved in many areas a lot the past year (where we had really big problems with itemisation like multiple stats that were capped etc) there are still so many bad gameplay mechanics in EQ2 that discourage people from actually playing the game before the level cap, unfortunately its hard to remove anything from the game once its allowed to get out of hand.

[Illmarr]

Jerokane@Antonia Bayle wrote:

Lcneed wrote:

Maybe this is all part of a Master Plan.  Ever went to a Costco where it has these little food stands with the free bites?   Once you get a taste of the Crit Chance, you will now have to work your way faster to level 80+.   They don't want you to linger at the lower levels when they are concentrating on level 90+ contents for the next expansion.

With these clueless devs and the rampage they cause on the pre-85 game, they can then just as well just remove all pre-85 content and just let us all create insta level85 characters with 300 AA and be done with it.

The pre-85 content has now become so extremely tedious and boring and now with the whole rampage on itemization also completely senseless... so why bother having us all still leveling up through this garbage if level85+ is where they want us at anyway!

It was tedious and boring when you were crying for adjustments to the gear after DoV launch before you quit the first time, even though you could kill anything in the old un-optimized gear that still existed. Now they went way overboard in giving everyone the bread and circuses they asked for, saw it was bad and toned it back down. The new "nerfed" gear still has now-optimized stats boosting the character's power against lower level content into the trivial range. I stipulate it's just stupid to have gear itemized with crit bonus when no crit chance is given but even the crit chance nerf hasn't balanced things. A level 47 Troubador with 6.5% crit chance and +70 DPS using HQ weapons auto-attacking for over 1K on even con mobs in Everfrost? HOw much more overpowered do players need to be to fit your definition of not tedious and boring?

At this point there is just ZERO fun left leveling up a character in this game! They effectively killed that off!

And the only definition of fun is yours? It's no fun for me range pulling white or orange con mobs as a weak DPS class and having them be dead before they get to you. If there isn't going to be any challenge, just drop the pretense of it and have the popular Iwin buttton to skip the tedium of one shotting everything and having to buy arrows and just let me magically be 90/300

And all due to DoV expac and the stupid Stat simplification changes! One single expac that effectively destroyed 7 years worth of perfectly fine content!!

Way to go devs! /facepalm!

Please, just go quietly into the night...again

[Illmarr]

Nadirah@Crushbone wrote:

Gilasil wrote:

What's all this nonsense about can't solo without crit?  That's nuts.

Of course you can solo without crit.  It might take a bit longer but it's most definately doable.  You can even level without some 90 mentoring you.  I've certainly done it on multiple toons, all of which had utterly garbage gear before 80 or so with mnimal crit chance and I did fine.

I suppose most classes would have to stick to solo mobs though.  I guess some people couldn't handle that.

I do agree with a couple posters that if they're going to mess with the gear they need to give those affected a gear unattuning and probably also a free AA respec.  I wish there were some way to give those who paid plat for their gear a refund but I can't think of any.  If you're going to mess with people's gear you have to give them a chance to adjust.

It probably would also make sense if they made the prevalence of crit chance gradual with level so there isn't this sudden change at 80.  Without knowing details of their database we don't know if there's a fundamental reason that can't be done or if the script writer just isn't any good.

Apparently there is so much gear they have to do it with scripts.  They don't have the manpower to change it all by hand. 

Much of our point was that they JUST did the itemization and change it two days later. You'd think they have tested this crap.

Yes you would. And they should have. And that is the point that should be argued. But if that is actually the point, why isn't that the point being argued, rather than incessant whining about taking away over-powered crit chance?

[zzvalarzz]

I know this is going to sound crazy but I actually thought there was a plan to all this (I KNOW! I'm crazy!) Buffing up the "mid level" (say 50-80) gear so much "flattened the curve" making the huge jumps in power from 70 to 80 and 80 to 90 much smoother. I thought "ahhh they didnt want to nerf end game gear to flatten the curve (cause of the screaming) so they raised up the mid lvls...next they buff up the mobs a ton to bring back some challenge". Now I really don't think there is a plan of any kind...its just random flailing about.

[Silverzx]

old content is trivial with or without the new gear so it shouldn't be balanced around it.  This will just help newer players ease into end game easier.  Someone posted this in the testing feedback forum and I couldn't have said it better myself:

"The power curve on Critical Chance on the way to 90 was actually finally starting to make sense when you consider the addition of Critical Bonus on items and the progression of item power leading up to Velious... then you do this update?

Having ALL Critical Chance progression in the game crammed into the span of 10 levels is completely absurd and makes no sense at all. Seeing characters go from 18-25% Critical Chance to 150%+ in only 10 levels is just rediculous. I hope the "removal of critical chance on items below 80" change and all the other items broken by this hotfix are reverted/fixed as soon as possible."

[Hamervelder]

zzvalarzz wrote:

I know this is going to sound crazy but I actually thought there was a plan to all this (I KNOW! I'm crazy!) Buffing up the "mid level" (say 50-80) gear so much "flattened the curve" making the huge jumps in power from 70 to 80 and 80 to 90 much smoother. I thought "ahhh they didnt want to nerf end game gear to flatten the curve (cause of the screaming) so they raised up the mid lvls...next they buff up the mobs a ton to bring back some challenge". Now I really don't think there is a plan of any kind...its just random flailing about.

This sums up my thoughts on the matter pretty well.  What looked like the start of a pretty solid plan ended up being Silius' usual haphazard "work", if you can call it that.  If ever there were a developer who CLEARLY could NOT do his job right, it's that guy.  Itemization has been nothing but a muddled, vacuous disaster ever since he took over the job.

[Deago]

They want to us to need mercs for soloing hard heroics.

They want to pull some sort of either LoN/SC method to enhance this (maybe not on live but on extended.)

They have reasons....I hope otherwise its not greed its well id rather not say

I will say I pulled out a few old toons from the 50-70 range and geared them up and had so much fun with them in crit gear soloing instances etc..(it still had some challenge..in some spots...alright but you get my point..fun )

Now they just sit and cry wondering what is going on....

You got my toons hooked on crit.  Then you take it away..now they are in a crit rehab center jeeze...

More I think about I believe this was intentional because now the can say "we are sorry we will give everybody a free onetime 90lv toon or something just like smoke toyed around with earlier lol.

I dont see how an educated developer (im a software engineer) could honestly come about not seeing the headache this would entail.  This was on purpose  

[Felshades]

Cisteros@Crushbone wrote:

Nadirah@Crushbone wrote:

Gilasil wrote:

What's all this nonsense about can't solo without crit?  That's nuts.

Of course you can solo without crit.  It might take a bit longer but it's most definately doable.  You can even level without some 90 mentoring you.  I've certainly done it on multiple toons, all of which had utterly garbage gear before 80 or so with mnimal crit chance and I did fine.

I suppose most classes would have to stick to solo mobs though.  I guess some people couldn't handle that.

I do agree with a couple posters that if they're going to mess with the gear they need to give those affected a gear unattuning and probably also a free AA respec.  I wish there were some way to give those who paid plat for their gear a refund but I can't think of any.  If you're going to mess with people's gear you have to give them a chance to adjust.

It probably would also make sense if they made the prevalence of crit chance gradual with level so there isn't this sudden change at 80.  Without knowing details of their database we don't know if there's a fundamental reason that can't be done or if the script writer just isn't any good.

Apparently there is so much gear they have to do it with scripts.  They don't have the manpower to change it all by hand. 

Much of our point was that they JUST did the itemization and change it two days later. You'd think they have tested this crap.

Yes you would. And they should have. And that is the point that should be argued. But if that is actually the point, why isn't that the point being argued, rather than incessant whining about taking away over-powered crit chance?

My complaint about taking away crit chance isn't taking away excessive crit chance.

For seven years my characters have had A chance to hit with a critical strike. Back in the day, I played a warlock as my main. She gained critical strike chance from INT. Fast forward to now, and you only gain crit strike chance from blue stats. Which come as a percentage. Which I think is dumb. But anyways...

Totally removing my ability to crit because I didn't choose one AA line over another is dumb. There are better solutions from it. I don't want 100% crit chance at 50. I don't NEED it. But I should be able to crit, without AA, as I have been able to for YEARS.

I'd like to see them get rid of this percentage to crit on gear thing. Do it in a rating system instead. The amount of rating you need to crit is different at each level, say you need 40 crit rating per 1% crit at level 50, but you need almost 200 crit rating at 85 per percent. World of Warcraft does it this way and it allows you to actually put crit on lower levels without using things like ".02 %" that look pathetic.  Here's their current rating system:

Critical Strike Rating required for 1% Critical Chance
Level 60	Level 70	Level 80	Level 85
14	22.08	45.91	179.34

[guillero]

Cisteros@Crushbone wrote:

Jerokane@Antonia Bayle wrote:

Lcneed wrote:

Maybe this is all part of a Master Plan.  Ever went to a Costco where it has these little food stands with the free bites?   Once you get a taste of the Crit Chance, you will now have to work your way faster to level 80+.   They don't want you to linger at the lower levels when they are concentrating on level 90+ contents for the next expansion.

With these clueless devs and the rampage they cause on the pre-85 game, they can then just as well just remove all pre-85 content and just let us all create insta level85 characters with 300 AA and be done with it.

The pre-85 content has now become so extremely tedious and boring and now with the whole rampage on itemization also completely senseless... so why bother having us all still leveling up through this garbage if level85+ is where they want us at anyway!

It was tedious and boring when you were crying for adjustments to the gear after DoV launch before you quit the first time, even though you could kill anything in the old un-optimized gear that still existed. Now they went way overboard in giving everyone the bread and circuses they asked for, saw it was bad and toned it back down. The new "nerfed" gear still has now-optimized stats boosting the character's power against lower level content into the trivial range. I stipulate it's just stupid to have gear itemized with crit bonus when no crit chance is given but even the crit chance nerf hasn't balanced things. A level 47 Troubador with 6.5% crit chance and +70 DPS using HQ weapons auto-attacking for over 1K on even con mobs in Everfrost? HOw much more overpowered do players need to be to fit your definition of not tedious and boring?

At this point there is just ZERO fun left leveling up a character in this game! They effectively killed that off!

And the only definition of fun is yours? It's no fun for me range pulling white or orange con mobs as a weak DPS class and having them be dead before they get to you. If there isn't going to be any challenge, just drop the pretense of it and have the popular Iwin buttton to skip the tedium of one shotting everything and having to buy arrows and just let me magically be 90/300

And all due to DoV expac and the stupid Stat simplification changes! One single expac that effectively destroyed 7 years worth of perfectly fine content!!

Way to go devs! /facepalm!

Please, just go quietly into the night...again

Get off your high horse man! You really should stop dreaming and pretending things that ain't there!

Grouping pre-level85 is dead! It has been for years!  There are not enough people in each and every tier to get full groups going!

Tell me mister wise guy? What is the difference of having a little bit of own power in the lower tiers to complete Heroic quests on your own (with quite a bit of challenge... everyone who says they could easymode heroic dungeons solo ON LEVEL are flat out lying!) or constantly beg a guild member to mentor down and chain pull the entire dungeon and obliterate everything on it's path (which was the norm pre-GU 61 !) !

Sorry...but then I rather have a little extra power and duo heroic content together with my gf with some actual challenge! It's a hell lot more fun than with mentored down level90's!

----------

And when it comes to itemization in lower tiers! The reason we quite after Velious is because Velious and the stat simplification destroyed every single piece of gear pre level 80 and rendered it useless! 7 years worth of perfectly fine content obliterated with one single expansion! THAT'S WHY!

So yeah! We were just as excited as many others here when they announced to finally reitemize the lower tiers!

What we didn't expect them to do, is obliterating the game even further! Making things even worse than they already were!

Gear with wrong appearances, gear that suddenly slots in the wrong slot (like bracer in hand slot, etc), stats that make even less sense than before! And we can go on about the trainwreck this latest game update was!

And now they suddenly remove crit chance ENTIRELY from every single piece of gear pre level 80! Crit chance on gear that has existed for years and was perfectly fine! People (like me) who build our characters (like melee warden) around it!

All because they screwed up with the re-itemization script! So instead of ADJUSTING it, they just use another easymode SLEDGEHAMMER!

This dev team has lost it's mind! They are totally clueless! They simply lost it! One dissaster patch after the other!

They completely destroying this "once" beautiful and great game! /facepalm

[Silverzx]

Nadirah@Crushbone wrote:

Cisteros@Crushbone wrote:

Nadirah@Crushbone wrote:

Gilasil wrote:

What's all this nonsense about can't solo without crit?  That's nuts.

Of course you can solo without crit.  It might take a bit longer but it's most definately doable.  You can even level without some 90 mentoring you.  I've certainly done it on multiple toons, all of which had utterly garbage gear before 80 or so with mnimal crit chance and I did fine.

I suppose most classes would have to stick to solo mobs though.  I guess some people couldn't handle that.

I do agree with a couple posters that if they're going to mess with the gear they need to give those affected a gear unattuning and probably also a free AA respec.  I wish there were some way to give those who paid plat for their gear a refund but I can't think of any.  If you're going to mess with people's gear you have to give them a chance to adjust.

It probably would also make sense if they made the prevalence of crit chance gradual with level so there isn't this sudden change at 80.  Without knowing details of their database we don't know if there's a fundamental reason that can't be done or if the script writer just isn't any good.

Apparently there is so much gear they have to do it with scripts.  They don't have the manpower to change it all by hand. 

Much of our point was that they JUST did the itemization and change it two days later. You'd think they have tested this crap.

Yes you would. And they should have. And that is the point that should be argued. But if that is actually the point, why isn't that the point being argued, rather than incessant whining about taking away over-powered crit chance?

My complaint about taking away crit chance isn't taking away excessive crit chance.

For seven years my characters have had A chance to hit with a critical strike. Back in the day, I played a warlock as my main. She gained critical strike chance from INT. Fast forward to now, and you only gain crit strike chance from blue stats. Which come as a percentage. Which I think is dumb. But anyways...

Totally removing my ability to crit because I didn't choose one AA line over another is dumb. There are better solutions from it. I don't want 100% crit chance at 50. I don't NEED it. But I should be able to crit, without AA, as I have been able to for YEARS.

I'd like to see them get rid of this percentage to crit on gear thing. Do it in a rating system instead. The amount of rating you need to crit is different at each level, say you need 40 crit rating per 1% crit at level 50, but you need almost 200 crit rating at 85 per percent. World of Warcraft does it this way and it allows you to actually put crit on lower levels without using things like ".02 %" that look pathetic.  Here's their current rating system:

Critical Strike Rating required for 1% Critical Chance
Level 60	Level 70	Level 80	Level 85
14	22.08	45.91	179.34

there is absolutely 0 chance they're gonna redo crit mechanics just so it can feel like "back in the day".  back in the day there was no double attack either, and definitely not triple attacks, flurries, spell double attacks, crit bonuses, etc.  what do we do about those?  welcome to 2011, where gear is(should be) more powerful

[d1anaw]

I don't even bother trying to comprehend the whole thing. To me, it seems like it's yet another way to lend an air of superiority for some. Now they won't take people into their groups unless it meets a certain criteria, then they want to complain and complain that they cannot get groups together. Personally, I'd be happy to see it return to where I needed to know that my healers needed wis first and int second and can the rest of the nonsense.

[Felshades]

Silverzx wrote:

there is absolutely 0 chance they're gonna redo crit mechanics just so it can feel like "back in the day".  back in the day there was no double attack either, and definitely not triple attacks, flurries, spell double attacks, crit bonuses, etc.  what do we do about those?  welcome to 2011, where gear is(should be) more powerful

And you missed my point entirely.

I wasn't referring to "feeling like it was back in the day" I was referring to scaling better at lower levels and not adding ridiculous looking numbers to gear to do it.

Seriously. Getting an item that goes from .02% chance to crit and then upgrading it with an item that gives .025% chance to crit(since they want lower levels to have lower crit chance) is rather ridiculous. At least with a scaling rating system you can add numbers that don't look entirely moronic because the amount you need to gain 1% crit scales.

You also should never need 100% crit. Ever. Becuase of stat inflation they had to add Critical Avoidance to mobs because once you get to 100% crit, you don't feel any stronger if you've capped the stat. They should never have done it by percentage in the first place.

[Illmarr]

Woulda, coulda, shoulda. I find it beyond funny that all the people who whined about the new mechanics and stat  released with DoV making lower levels "Impossible" have gotten their stat revamps they asked for but now whine because of blue stats that never should have been touched at all, and they never had before. Nowhere did anyone who ragequit over lower level stat revamp say they needed blue stats, but now here they are saying they need them.

Seriously, go find a game with cheat codes, use them and play that. It will suit your idea of fun, and won't drag the rest of us somewhere we don't want to go

[Crismorn]

Nadirah@Crushbone wrote:

Silverzx wrote:

there is absolutely 0 chance they're gonna redo crit mechanics just so it can feel like "back in the day".  back in the day there was no double attack either, and definitely not triple attacks, flurries, spell double attacks, crit bonuses, etc.  what do we do about those?  welcome to 2011, where gear is(should be) more powerful

And you missed my point entirely.

I wasn't referring to "feeling like it was back in the day" I was referring to scaling better at lower levels and not adding ridiculous looking numbers to gear to do it.

Seriously. Getting an item that goes from .02% chance to crit and then upgrading it with an item that gives .025% chance to crit(since they want lower levels to have lower crit chance) is rather ridiculous. At least with a scaling rating system you can add numbers that don't look entirely moronic because the amount you need to gain 1% crit scales.

You also should never need 100% crit. Ever. Becuase of stat inflation they had to add Critical Avoidance to mobs because once you get to 100% crit, you don't feel any stronger if you've capped the stat. They should never have done it by percentage in the first place.

The last time they could have gotten away with a crit rating system was end of EoF now it would just destroy character progression without boosting many other blue stats to make up for loss of crit "imo. you could not add enough blue stats to fill the gap of 100% crits"

[MurFalad]

Crismorn wrote:

The last time they could have gotten away with a crit rating system was end of EoF now it would just destroy character progression without boosting many other blue stats to make up for loss of crit "imo. you could not add enough blue stats to fill the gap of 100% crits"

I'd say that would be the last time they could have altered the current crit system.  Crit today though is effectively always 100% for the content we can do, if its a lot less then we effectively cannot do that content, so its a gating stat.

It would be a fairly though to change crit because we can assume everyone over level 85 effectively has 100% crit so all they need to do is up people's DPS to take account of that for levels 85-90 and delete crit, levels 70-85 would require a little bit of care since these are the levels that people did not have 100% crit so would need a ramping up of dps to compensate.  But seeing how massively peoples gear has been buffed for those levels it would be hard to get it so wrong that people were too weak.

The tricky bit would then be to figure out how much of someones DPS to remove if they actually release a new crit system into the game (all those AA's and CA's would need to be taken into account).  If it was done for a new expansion though any slight resulting nerf in player power wouldn't matter since more powerful gear would be on offer (even if they guessed wrong and shaved 50% off players power in the lower levels we'd still be too powerful for the content so I don't see any real problems...).

I'd actually like to see a crit system that always scales.  One idea is a system where the more potency/prime stat/crit bonus we have the more crit rating we needed to actually get a crit, this would mean gearing would be a constant choice to get the optimum levels of these stats, do we want to hit harder, or get more of those hits to crit.

That could create quite a interesting gearing system.

[MurFalad]

Nadirah@Crushbone wrote:

You also should never need 100% crit. Ever. Becuase of stat inflation they had to add Critical Avoidance to mobs because once you get to 100% crit, you don't feel any stronger if you've capped the stat. They should never have done it by percentage in the first place.

Definitely 100% agree, it was a woefully short sighted decision putting percentage stats into the game and anyone could see the problem of capped stats was going to occur eventually (the WoW devs made the same mistake early on and nerfed every item with such stats). 

They've made the best of a bad system in DoV (the alternative would be a total change), but always critting sort of takes the point of critical hits away.

[Silverzx]

Nadirah@Crushbone wrote:

Silverzx wrote:

there is absolutely 0 chance they're gonna redo crit mechanics just so it can feel like "back in the day".  back in the day there was no double attack either, and definitely not triple attacks, flurries, spell double attacks, crit bonuses, etc.  what do we do about those?  welcome to 2011, where gear is(should be) more powerful

And you missed my point entirely.

I wasn't referring to "feeling like it was back in the day" I was referring to scaling better at lower levels and not adding ridiculous looking numbers to gear to do it.

Seriously. Getting an item that goes from .02% chance to crit and then upgrading it with an item that gives .025% chance to crit(since they want lower levels to have lower crit chance) is rather ridiculous. At least with a scaling rating system you can add numbers that don't look entirely moronic because the amount you need to gain 1% crit scales.

You also should never need 100% crit. Ever. Becuase of stat inflation they had to add Critical Avoidance to mobs because once you get to 100% crit, you don't feel any stronger if you've capped the stat. They should never have done it by percentage in the first place.

you should never need/have 100% crit chance since the definition of it means a chance to crit.  what you don't seem to understand is that starting a few expansions ago, the game was based on and balanced around gearing up to get 100% crit chance thus allowing you to crit 100% of the time.  is it still a chance to crit? no.  is it necessary to crit 100% of the time? yes.

We have to balance gear around what crit has to be today, not what it shoulda been

[Felshades]

Crismorn wrote:

Nadirah@Crushbone wrote:

Silverzx wrote:

there is absolutely 0 chance they're gonna redo crit mechanics just so it can feel like "back in the day".  back in the day there was no double attack either, and definitely not triple attacks, flurries, spell double attacks, crit bonuses, etc.  what do we do about those?  welcome to 2011, where gear is(should be) more powerful

And you missed my point entirely.

I wasn't referring to "feeling like it was back in the day" I was referring to scaling better at lower levels and not adding ridiculous looking numbers to gear to do it.

Seriously. Getting an item that goes from .02% chance to crit and then upgrading it with an item that gives .025% chance to crit(since they want lower levels to have lower crit chance) is rather ridiculous. At least with a scaling rating system you can add numbers that don't look entirely moronic because the amount you need to gain 1% crit scales.

You also should never need 100% crit. Ever. Becuase of stat inflation they had to add Critical Avoidance to mobs because once you get to 100% crit, you don't feel any stronger if you've capped the stat. They should never have done it by percentage in the first place.

The last time they could have gotten away with a crit rating system was end of EoF now it would just destroy character progression without boosting many other blue stats to make up for loss of crit "imo. you could not add enough blue stats to fill the gap of 100% crits"

You don't need 100% crit. Crit chance inflation is why you have crit avoidance.

The fact blue stats came in as percentages allowed for it. Using a ratings system rather than a percentage system allows you to change the curve at any time if you feel stat inflation is getting too high. if the system is not designed in the first place to allow 100% crits, then you won't notice any gap because you wouldn't have known any different. You don't need that fireball to go up 5k damage just because you gained a level or got a new piece of gear.

Agreeing it's too late to fix it now without a complete game systems revamp ala LU13, but its too late in the game to go with it now. Maybe for the next one... if it's not farmville in norrath as I'm afraid it will be.

[SOE-MOD-02]

This post has moved: /eq2/posts/preList.m?topic_id=49996...post_id=5628874 Insults and vulgarities are not permitted on these forums.

[hoosierdaddy]

Ok, it's now next week and there's not even anything in the test server patch notes about fixing last week's "unintened mistake." So when this week, as was promised, will the absence of Crit Chance on lower level gear be addressed?

[Deneir_Allaston]

hoosierdaddy wrote:

Ok, it's now next week and there's not even anything in the test server patch notes about fixing last week's "unintened mistake." So when this week, as was promised, will the absence of Crit Chance on lower level gear be addressed?

Really hard to say since yeasterdays Test Update Notes listed this:

"Accessories should now start seeing crit starting with necks at 60 and cloak, waist, and charms at 70."

And according to todays Live Update Notes they have completely omitted that line of text anyways, either intentionally or by accident.

I really cant agree with the seemingly random and arbitrary design decision to place it on only specific slots starting at 60 either. The Critical Chance progression they had before the bugged Critical Chance removal Hotfix was alright they just needed to tune the amount each slot was granting from Tier to Tier starting at level 50 and moving upward to level 80+. Granting Critical Chance on ALL the "Crit bearing slots" - Primary, Secondary, Ranged, Neck, Waist, Cloak, and Charms makes sense, is more intuitive, and follows the same progression for Critical Chance we have on items in Destiny of Velious.

I would much rather see Critical Chance following that mold then the Test Update Note suggested arbitrary slot based approach which changes from Tier to Tier.

[Runewind]

Deneir_Allaston wrote:

hoosierdaddy wrote:

Ok, it's now next week and there's not even anything in the test server patch notes about fixing last week's "unintened mistake." So when this week, as was promised, will the absence of Crit Chance on lower level gear be addressed?

Really hard to say since yeasterdays Test Update Notes listed this:

"Accessories should now start seeing crit starting with necks at 60 and cloak, waist, and charms at 70."

And according to todays Live Update Notes they have completely omitted that line of text anyways, either intentionally or by accident.

I really cant agree with the seemingly random and arbitrary design decision to place it on only specific slots starting at 60 either. The Critical Chance progression they had before the bugged Critical Chance removal Hotfix was alright they just needed to tune the amount each slot was granting from Tier to Tier starting at level 50 and moving upward to level 80+. Granting Critical Chance on ALL the "Crit bearing slots" - Primary, Secondary, Ranged, Neck, Waist, Cloak, and Charms makes sense, is more intuitive, and follows the same progression for Critical Chance we have on items in Destiny of Velious.

I would much rather see Critical Chance following that mold then the Test Update Note suggested arbitrary slot based approach which changes from Tier to Tier.

Why are they insistant on alienating their player base? This change/bug/nerf has honestly made me angrier than anything SOE has ever done and I play a ranger. I'm usually pretty levelheaded, but I don't like feeling like I have whiplash with gear and then being lied to/misled about the intention or nature of those changes.

First, SOE, you do a sweeping change to gear. Okay. That was (mostly) good. It was needed. That gear was not at all desirable anymore. Then you discover that the automatic reitemization script that you were using made some mistakes (understandable. It's a program). Then you say you're going to fix it (yay).

Then one day while we're all waiting for the gear that was missed to fall in line with the changes we get an update that says that all the crit chance on gear below 80 was being removed. We're shocked (understandably) this didn't show up on test. No one knew it was coming. And, to top it off, crit was removed from gear ABOVE level 80 as well. None of this was communicated to us once before it happened. People are confused and angry and so Kander jumps on and says "Hey guys. Calm down. It's a bug. All the changes are bugs. It's all cool. It will be fixed on Tuesday." People start to calm down. Okay, Tuesday is a long time but we can wait. There are other games. We have characters who haven't been hit as hard.

Then we get another post that seems a bit less sure of the "bug"iness of the change. We get an update that "The crit removal is going to be on a scale that starts at level 60 on crit bearing pieces." No one even knows what that means. Crit removal? Is that crit chance? Why would they remove crit chance intentionally from gear when they just added MASSIVE crit bonus to every piece of gear above level 40? That doesn't make any sense? People start to get angry and confused again. Somebody suggests maybe they mean crit mit? Well that would make sense. Crit mit is useless at level 60 and, besides, right before this update they removed a bunch of crit mit requirements, right? Okay crit mit. Sure. That's crit removal.

Then, finally, this note that I highlighted shows up on test. We've STILL had no communication from a dev team that PROMISED us more communication. They have completely ignored everyone who said that removing crit chance made no sense. They have lied about the nature of the nerf. And they won't even clarify what they are doing to the community.

Sigh... anyway, I just needed to vent. I imagine my post was too long for anyone to read anyway, but I never yell on these forums and this time I felt like I just needed to. Anyway... I hope SOE wises up and actually reverses this change like people want. And, in the future, I hope they DO communicate better with their players. Who knows? People might actually start to think they care about us if they didn't pull this stuff....

[Yimway]

Runewind wrote:

Then, finally, this note that I highlighted shows up on test. We've STILL had no communication from a dev team that PROMISED us more communication. They have completely ignored everyone who said that removing crit chance made no sense. They have lied about the nature of the nerf. And they won't even clarify what they are doing to the community.

Newsflash, they don't know what they're doing, they didn't have a plan, and they're led by someone that doesn't understand the mechanics/stats that everything works off.

[LardLord]

Wait, they're putting crit back on low level gear? I can't even keep up, but I was pleased with items on live as of last night when playing with some friends in the low-mid 60s.

[Valentina]

Runewind wrote:

Deneir_Allaston wrote:

hoosierdaddy wrote:

Ok, it's now next week and there's not even anything in the test server patch notes about fixing last week's "unintened mistake." So when this week, as was promised, will the absence of Crit Chance on lower level gear be addressed?

Really hard to say since yeasterdays Test Update Notes listed this:

"Accessories should now start seeing crit starting with necks at 60 and cloak, waist, and charms at 70."

And according to todays Live Update Notes they have completely omitted that line of text anyways, either intentionally or by accident.

I really cant agree with the seemingly random and arbitrary design decision to place it on only specific slots starting at 60 either. The Critical Chance progression they had before the bugged Critical Chance removal Hotfix was alright they just needed to tune the amount each slot was granting from Tier to Tier starting at level 50 and moving upward to level 80+. Granting Critical Chance on ALL the "Crit bearing slots" - Primary, Secondary, Ranged, Neck, Waist, Cloak, and Charms makes sense, is more intuitive, and follows the same progression for Critical Chance we have on items in Destiny of Velious.

I would much rather see Critical Chance following that mold then the Test Update Note suggested arbitrary slot based approach which changes from Tier to Tier.

Why are they insistant on alienating their player base? This change/bug/nerf has honestly made me angrier than anything SOE has ever done and I play a ranger. I'm usually pretty levelheaded, but I don't like feeling like I have whiplash with gear and then being lied to/misled about the intention or nature of those changes.

First, SOE, you do a sweeping change to gear. Okay. That was (mostly) good. It was needed. That gear was not at all desirable anymore. Then you discover that the automatic reitemization script that you were using made some mistakes (understandable. It's a program). Then you say you're going to fix it (yay).

Then one day while we're all waiting for the gear that was missed to fall in line with the changes we get an update that says that all the crit chance on gear below 80 was being removed. We're shocked (understandably) this didn't show up on test. No one knew it was coming. And, to top it off, crit was removed from gear ABOVE level 80 as well. None of this was communicated to us once before it happened. People are confused and angry and so Kander jumps on and says "Hey guys. Calm down. It's a bug. All the changes are bugs. It's all cool. It will be fixed on Tuesday." People start to calm down. Okay, Tuesday is a long time but we can wait. There are other games. We have characters who haven't been hit as hard.

Then we get another post that seems a bit less sure of the "bug"iness of the change. We get an update that "The crit removal is going to be on a scale that starts at level 60 on crit bearing pieces." No one even knows what that means. Crit removal? Is that crit chance? Why would they remove crit chance intentionally from gear when they just added MASSIVE crit bonus to every piece of gear above level 40? That doesn't make any sense? People start to angry and confused again. Somebody suggests maybe they mean crit mit? Well that would make sense. Crit mit is useless at level 60 and, besides, right before this update they removed a bunch of crit mit requirements, right? Okay crit mit. Sure. That's crit removal.

Then, finally, this note that I highlighted shows up on test. We've STILL had no communication from a dev team that PROMISED us more communication. They have completely ignored everyone who said that removing crit chance made no sense. They have lied about the nature of the nerf. And they won't even clarify what they are doing to the community.

Sigh... anyway, I just needed to vent. I imagine my post was too long for anyone to read anyway, but I never yell on these forums and this time I felt like I just needed to. Anyway... I hope SOE wises up and actually reverses this change like people want. And, in the future, I hope they DO communicate better with their players. Who knows? People might actually start to think they care about us if they didn't pull this stuff....

Read the whole thing.  Agreed with all of it.  The last three or so weeks of EQ2 have irritated me more than most of the last 6+ years combined.