ToFS Bug List - Heroic and X2 -- Long

[Banditman]

I would actually prefer he be rooted for the lightning events.  Would make life a lot easier.

[TheGeneral]

Umbral Halls mirror update needs to be fixed.  The update is tied to the mirror that has the option "Activate the Lift".  If you dont have everyone who needs the update to a count down and then click at the same time, only the person who activates the lift gets the update.  We had to let Vhalsera wipe us so that we could go back down and do the timed click.  This really should be a group update.

[aislynn00]

Hm... I'm curious how the reflection adds during the VhalSera fight are supposed to work. 

What causes them to spawn? It certainly doesn't seem to be a fixed timer, nor do they ever seem to stop spawning, even when we get the named below 65%.

How are you supposed to deal with the adds?  They keep single-shotting people, especially casters and druids, on a regular basis whenever the hate-wipe occurs, which seems to be every 30 seconds or less, and burning them down takes way too long, despite everyone in the raid being decked out in x4 DoV raid gear plus SF tier 3 and Underfoot Depths equipment.

[aislynn00]

Gninja wrote:

VhalSera is hitting hard or the adds are hittign hard? I can take a look at both in the morning and see if I missed something.

The adds are hitting hard.  Given that they mem-wipe, it is unavoidable that non-tanks take hits, and these mobs are way too buff for non-tanks, especially casters and druids, to survive the experience.

As for VhalSera, the only way we found to keep his DPS output within reasonable bounds is to have the off-tank aggro any adds, then simply try to hold them while everyone else burns the named down to 65%. 

When we on the first couple of pulls actually tried killing the adds as they spawned, the named was so buff by the time he reached 65% that I was being hit for 20K+ per auto-attack (I run with about 15K mitigation, which is above the cap vs a 98th level mob), which wasn't manageable for long.

I would suggest lowering the HP and DPS of the adds.  Are they really supposed to AE auto-attack and multi-attack with so high a frequency, hitting scouts for 20K+?

[Gninja]

Karnos@Guk wrote:

Gninja wrote:

VhalSera is hitting hard or the adds are hittign hard? I can take a look at both in the morning and see if I missed something.

The adds are hitting hard.  Given that they mem-wipe, it is unavoidable that non-tanks take hits, and these mobs are way too buff for non-tanks, especially casters and druids, to survive the experience.

As for VhalSera, the only way we found to keep his DPS output within reasonable bounds is to have the off-tank aggro any adds, then simply try to hold them while everyone else burns the named down to 65%. 

When we on the first couple of pulls actually tried killing the adds as they spawned, the named was so buff by the time he reached 65% that I was being hit for 20K+ per auto-attack (I run with about 15K mitigation, which is above the cap vs a 98th level mob), which wasn't manageable for long.

I would suggest lowering the HP and DPS of the adds.  Are they really supposed to AE auto-attack and multi-attack with so high a frequency, hitting scouts for 20K+?

No, they shouldn't be. I will be tuning them down.

[aislynn00]

Thanks for the prompt response, Gninja.   You have no idea how nice it is to see a developer so actively (and visibly) involved in rectifying content issues as you and Kander have been the last few weeks.

While I'm already posting, I might as well mention a few problems we ran into earlier tonight, this time in the heroic Tower of Frozen Shadow: Umbral Halls instance, trying to get a couple of additional guildmates flagged for the x2.

Vs The Impish Trickster, we wiped when the healer was caught a bit unprepared by the loads of adds that spawn upon the named's first death.  No big deal; we simply ran back to kill it on our second attempt.  Unfortunately, the named seemed to have disappeared except for an invisible entity that could be targeted but not attacked (we got some sort of "that is an invalid target" message.)  We knew it was the named, since we could see its name when it was targeted, but it was at 0% HP.

The other problem might simply be us screwing up or missing a scripted event somewhere along the way; unfortunately, I don't remember every single thing we did when we successfully completed Umbral Halls the first time, so it is hard to say.  Be that as it may, after clearing all mobs, clicking everything clickable, and doing every quest that seemed able to be completed on the initial Darkness level, we could only progress to VhalSera's Dominion; A Bride's Scorn wasn't an option when clicking any mirror.  That struck me as not right, given that I'm pretty sure we originally did Bride's Scorn before VhalSera's Dominion.

We figured it might be connected to an issue we experienced in that special area you're transported to at some point to fight De'manti Sheda.  As I recall, there was a ring event of sorts there when we originally finished the zone; something about waves of ghostly arachnids, I think.  At any rate, this time, there was nothing but De'manti; not a single other mob spawned.  Is that an intentional change?

Eventually, since we couldn't progress anywhere, we decided to call it: the Trickster couldn't be killed, Narmek and VhalSera were past blue forcefields that we couldn't bring down, and we were unable to access A Bride's Scorn from any mirror.

The named mobs we did kill included: De'manti Sheda, Amontehepna, Deception, Doubt, Depression, Misery, Weapons of Narmek, and Cloak of Narmek.  Not a single trash mob was left up. 

Any idea what went wrong?

[Frain]

Karnos@Guk wrote:

Gninja wrote:

VhalSera is hitting hard or the adds are hittign hard? I can take a look at both in the morning and see if I missed something.

The adds are hitting hard.  Given that they mem-wipe, it is unavoidable that non-tanks take hits, and these mobs are way too buff for non-tanks, especially casters and druids, to survive the experience.

As for VhalSera, the only way we found to keep his DPS output within reasonable bounds is to have the off-tank aggro any adds, then simply try to hold them while everyone else burns the named down to 65%. 

When we on the first couple of pulls actually tried killing the adds as they spawned, the named was so buff by the time he reached 65% that I was being hit for 20K+ per auto-attack (I run with about 15K mitigation, which is above the cap vs a 98th level mob), which wasn't manageable for long.

I would suggest lowering the HP and DPS of the adds.  Are they really supposed to AE auto-attack and multi-attack with so high a frequency, hitting scouts for 20K+?

We usually kill first add and by the time the 2nd add spawns he is down to 66%. And that seems to be around how much dps you need for the fight as we sometimes barely have time to kill an add before another spawns during the lightning part.

Dps needed seems fine in the fight. Curse and adds oneshotting people is what makes it a pain though

[Detor]

I have a bit of a design question for gninja.  It feels like you had an overabundunce of cool ideas for named to do, which is why we have some nonnamed that do special things like the imp trickster and the mirror reflection/evil severed hand encounters.  

My question is - why not swap what the Imp Trickster does for what '???' does in Haunt.  I think the Imp Trickster shouting to the zone and looking like whoever he targets would be a better nonnamed feel, while '???' breaking up into multiple copies of whoever he's targetting, then reassembling himself just sounds like more of a named fight type encounter.  Or swap what the evil severed hand does with Trouveur who currently does nothing?  Although perhaps Trouveur has some really cool things but they're just broken right now.  (there's a piano you can click but nothing happens if you do or don't click it, so that indicates to me you intended that named to do SOMETHING other than just melee)

[Silzin]

@ Karnos The way i have done the zone in the past is. 1. Darkness floor (4th floor) - 5 named on this floor, and there has only bin 1 mob/named in the other room you are teleported to. floor ends in the center of the bottom. 2. VhalSera's Dominion (6th floor i think) - this floor ends at the armored guy Narmek? there is one after for the Mirror quest. the way i normally get throw the Imp after i wipe is pull the adds off in group with out aggroing the Imp till you are out of adds then the Imp will pop back up. 3. A Bride's Scorn (5th floor i think) ends with the High Priest. there is one after for the Mirror quest.

[Brildean]

Also I'm know this isn't limited to just tofs zones but the targeting of spawn mobs from named are most the time annoying. Small windows or have to target through a big npc model. since macro's and tabbing doens't work. Atleast allow us to use tabbing.

[Brildean]

was there any changes to vhal'sera with todays patch.. this is for the x2

[Gninja]

Not today but there should be some tweaks in tomorrow's patch.

[Brildean]

Know if the tweaks got on ginja. going to be running through this thursday.

[Hajji2]

Necretia Widowmaker (x2)

The changes made to this fight yesterday are (to put it concisely) unreasonable.  The cocoons are spawning 2 and 3 on top of each other which makes them excessively difficult to deal with in time to prevent being overrun by the spider adds each of which hits for 3-9k (not counting poison procs, AE attacks, etc).  And on top of that, the Half-Drained Corpses which spawn the cocoons are spam-taunting players onto them preventing the raid from dealing with the cocoons.  I'd suggest reconsidering the changes, or some follow-up balancing to the fight...say like making the cocoons not spawn on top of each other and reducing the frequency the corpses taunt.  This fight did need some beefing up, but not so much as to make the fight require 700k+ DPS to succeed.

[Nekurawr]

Wyllie@Kithicor wrote:

Necretia Widowmaker (x2)

The changes made to this fight yesterday are (to put it concisely) unreasonable.  The cocoons are spawning 2 and 3 on top of each other which makes them excessively difficult to deal with in time to prevent being overrun by the spider adds each of which hits for 3-9k (not counting poison procs, AE attacks, etc).  And on top of that, the Half-Drained Corpses which spawn the cocoons are spam-taunting players onto them preventing the raid from dealing with the cocoons.  I'd suggest reconsidering the changes, or some follow-up balancing to the fight...say like making the cocoons not spawn on top of each other and reducing the frequency the corpses taunt.  This fight did need some beefing up, but not so much as to make the fight require 700k+ DPS to succeed.

Were there any other changes like this that didn't make it into the update notes? And if so, Gninja, could you tell us what they were?

[Brildean]

They've always spawned on eachother or below the floor, where you can't hit them. and if its only 2 to 3 now thats a nice change before we would get between 4 to 9.

i think it would be better if the corpses spawned at 75, 50 and 25%. and it spawned one cacoon that was x2 and had to be dead with in 20 seconds. Concidering how the drops are meh compared to the instanced heroic items.

Right now you get a corpse every 30 seconds and a bunch of cocoons that are hard to target.  That all spawn on top of eachother so if you try tabbing or using a macro you usually end up with the previous corpse.

[Frain]

The x2 zone is completely unplayable atm. Last two times we've been in there the lag has been so bad that we havnt been able to kill anything. First itme it was an old zone and today we started a new instance.

The lag was so horrible before even pulling something and we couldnt even get the first named down

[Nekurawr]

Brildean wrote:

They've always spawned on eachother or below the floor, where you can't hit them. and if its only 2 to 3 now thats a nice change before we would get between 4 to 9.

i think it would be better if the corpses spawned at 75, 50 and 25%. and it spawned one cacoon that was x2 and had to be dead with in 20 seconds. Concidering how the drops are meh compared to the instanced heroic items.

Right now you get a corpse every 30 seconds and a bunch of cocoons that are hard to target.  That all spawn on top of eachother so if you try tabbing or using a macro you usually end up with the previous corpse.

I guess I misunderstood his post; it sounded like there were multiple mobs spawning or something. :o

Edit: Sidenote, has there been any research into why Haunt of Syl'Tor sometimes doesn't properly warp you to the flipped version of the zone after killing the Unmasked Changeling? Would be nice not to have to leave and come back when that happens.

[Hajji2]

The past times we killed it the cocoons were not on top of each other, nor were there more than 2 from a single corpse.  The taunting (target-locking effectively) was not occurring so frequently until this last update.  Can only state what I've seen.

[Brildean]

Ya this encounter needs some tweaking its just an annoying luck based thing right now.

[Hajji2]

Excellent point on the corpse spawn frequency. A percent-based corpse spawn would likely bring this back into the realm of skill-based encounters.  The time-based spawn is really what makes it unmanageable.

[Frain]

Cant see what the problem is with the spider atm. 2 cocoons spawning actually makes it a bit exciting.

For being on the 7th floor the mob is actually quite easy. But if that is how it is intended I dont mind it.

[Thor]

Tserrina x2 for access.

We had the encounter reset several times today when someone died from adds spawning from the doors during the Svartmane part.

Also, we were doing +100k and still had 14-16 adds on the last door when they spawned the 2nd time. Does that sound right?

[Miapa]

New bug in the X2 raid instance that I haven't encountered before.  We've killed Necretia Widowmaker about 5 times now and we couldn't kill her tonight because she kept reseting.  We would get her down to 50%, and she'd reset.  We tried it again and she reset.

We've tried fighting her in the hallway and in her room, no difference.

After a few more attempts it seems that the reset is occuring right when someone dies.  The death it resets on seems completely random too.

Also, another bug that's kind of annoying is "a half-drained corpse" cannot be tab targetted, ever.

[Frain]

Thorine@Oasis wrote:

Tserrina x2 for access.

We had the encounter reset several times today when someone died from adds spawning from the doors during the Svartmane part.

Also, we were doing +100k and still had 14-16 adds on the last door when they spawned the 2nd time. Does that sound right?

As you get less adds per door nowdays you can kill 5 doors and then kill off all the adds on you. Then when you pull the last door you should only get 4-6 from it max which can easily be handled. If you stil have all the adds from other doors when you pull the last one you get swarmed.

Adds oneshotting someone and then resetting has always resetted the encounter. Should probably get fixed but until then just make sure your tank picks them up as soon as they pop. Also if the whole group is close to a door this wont happen as they will hit someone then get aggro on the healer.

[Silzin]

Miapa wrote:

New bug in the X2 raid instance that I haven't encountered before.  We've killed Necretia Widowmaker about 5 times now and we couldn't kill her tonight because she kept reseting.  We would get her down to 50%, and she'd reset.  We tried it again and she reset.

We've tried fighting her in the hallway and in her room, no difference.

After a few more attempts it seems that the reset is occuring right when someone dies.  The death it resets on seems completely random too.

Also, another bug that's kind of annoying is "a half-drained corpse" cannot be tab targetted, ever.

I got these problems last night (3-23-11), but didnt have the time to identify it this well.

[Barakuz]

It appear the reset is due to a fail condition, almost like not enough dps required to kill the adds / cocoons.

We didn't have a problem with 2 cocoons, 3 is unrealistic IMHO. We didn't have enought dps to kill 3 cocoons which means the spiders would spawn, we could manage these but got overloaded with more spawned zombie. We finally overcame this obstacle and get back into the flow, to have the mob reset twice once at 51% the other time in the mid 40%.

Not sure what's going on with the change, but this encounter is a mess - please fix.

Bara

[Miapa]

It's strange.  We're not having the same issue with the cocoons that everyone else is having.  They pretty much die as soon as they spawn after the half-drained corpse dies (they usually die before I even get a target).

[Jrel]

Ah, the summoned weapons during the Librarian/Tome encounter. Could those be nerfed please so that they don't wipe out the raid instantly if someone accidentally hits them?  Even our tanks with 150 crit mit (oh wait, nerfed to 125 and less now with the new patch) can't survive those.

[Soul_Dreamer]

Pull after pull after pull tonight and everytime he's stoneskin under 33%, on our last pull he was even still stoneskinned at 100%,  FROM THE PULL!.

When we're not competing against the lag, we're competing against this buggy PoS mob, it's the only thing stopping us getting the buffs we NEED to progress our x4 raiding. Seriously can you just fix it.

100% > 66% - All stacked behind the mob burning him as fast as possible while the tank/tanks hold the add.66% > 33% - All stacked behind him so he gets hit by lightening and killing adds as they pop.33% > 0% (LOL) - Stoneskin after Stoneskin. 

If we're doing something wrong from 33% down can someone please let us know, we've fought it before with no deaths for 10 mins when he was at 14%, killing the adds, in the hope he would drop the stoneskin.

Lastly.. again the lag...

Tonight we cleared Kraytoks EM, first 2 named in Zek, all but the King in EM Halls with no lag. the Second we split the raid and zone into here to try him we have 10sec + casting lag. Of course at 10:20 just before we have to call the raid for the night the lag vanishes! Can you please sort it out, it's just a joke. The whole zone is blocking us from Content because of bugs and lag.