Vitality

[Kraqen]

Can I get some clarification?  I checked the update notes and can't find it.  What was changed this morning?  Changed to %200?  Does that mean it is providing %200 xp bonus and just consumes the vitality faster?  Or we have been given twice the vitality to accrue, as in the double xp will last twice as long on a full vitality charge?

If so, does it take twice as long to accrue the new full amount?

Any details out there?

[Barx]

It should consume at the same rate (consumption goes off incoming combat XP, not outgoing amount), only now instead of giving x2.0 bonus (doubling the output) it gives +200%. If all you were running before was vitality, you'll be gaining XP at a faster rate. It's only the combination of bonuses that got nerfed. Vitality post-change should be equivalent to vitality + a 50% XP pot in the old system (100% + 200% = 300% new system vs 1x2x1.5 = 300% old system).

[Rothgar]

Kraqen wrote:

Can I get some clarification?  I checked the update notes and can't find it.  What was changed this morning?  Changed to %200?  Does that mean it is providing %200 xp bonus and just consumes the vitality faster?  Or we have been given twice the vitality to accrue, as in the double xp will last twice as long on a full vitality charge?

If so, does it take twice as long to accrue the new full amount?

Any details out there?

Confirmed that the consumption and gain rate haven't changed.  Only the bonus that it gives you was changed.

[Kraqen]

Many thanks!

You know, all of these years I just assumed the bonuses were additive.  Surprised to learn otherwise.

[Barx]

Kraqen wrote:

Many thanks!

You know, all of these years I just assumed the bonuses were additive.  Surprised to learn otherwise.

Yeah, without a large # of them they acted similar to being addative. Figure vitality + a 50% pot would have been 250% instead of 300%, hard to tell the difference there unless you test it carefully over a large # of mobs. It was only when you started stacking on 3+ effects that it got huge.

[Kraqen]

How does aa conversion work?  If I have a pot that gives aa and combat xp bonus, does that get added twice?  Both before and after the conversion?  Xp bonus for the kill THEN aa bonus for the conversion?

[Barx]

Kraqen wrote:

How does aa conversion work?  If I have a pot that gives aa and combat xp bonus, does that get added twice?  Both before and after the conversion?  Xp bonus for the kill THEN aa bonus for the conversion?

I'm not sure about that. My guess is that the AA bonus either does not apply to AAXP converted from combat or that it only applies to the base combat, but I've never tested it. I'd be interested in seeing the answer to that as well.

[urgthock]

Barx@Antonia Bayle wrote:

Kraqen wrote:

How does aa conversion work?  If I have a pot that gives aa and combat xp bonus, does that get added twice?  Both before and after the conversion?  Xp bonus for the kill THEN aa bonus for the conversion?

I'm not sure about that. My guess is that the AA bonus either does not apply to AAXP converted from combat or that it only applies to the base combat, but I've never tested it. I'd be interested in seeing the answer to that as well.

If that is the case, the AA exp pot is worthless. How many "true" (quest, named, disco etc) AA hits will you get within the limited time you have the pot running.

[Kraqen]

Ok, am I right here? (If I am following Barx correctly)

Old system -

Vitality alone = Double XP (+100% bonus)

50% potion alone = +50% bonus xp -- %150 total, each kill = 1 and a half kills

Vitality + 50% potion = Quad xp (+300% bonus, each kill = 4 kills)  100 x 2 x 1.5

New System

Vitality alone = Triple XP (+ 200%) each kill is worth 3 kills --- Faster gain than before

100% potion = Double XP (+100%) Each kill = 2 kills --- Faster than old system

Vitality and 100% potion = Quad XP (200% + 100% = 300% bonus) = Same as old system

1 Is this correct?

2 Does the change to vitality include tradeskill xp as well

3 Did we ever figure out the combat to aa conversion?  If I have a potion that gives combat and aa xp, do I 'double dip' the bonus when at %100 AA?

[Kraqen]

Hmmm, facing a netiquet dillema ---

Do I bump my own post hoping for more discussion or insight (frowned upon even if it has been over 24 hours)?

or

Do I start a new post with the same question (again, frowned upon when there is an existing post).

Whatever will I do?

[KatrinaDeath]

Kraqen wrote:

Hmmm, facing a netiquet dillema ---

Do I bump my own post hoping for more discussion or insight (frowned upon even if it has been over 24 hours)?

or

Do I start a new post with the same question (again, frowned upon when there is an existing post).

Whatever will I do?

PM a buddy to bump the post for you.

[Kraqen]

Swisha@Nagafen wrote:

Kraqen wrote:

Hmmm, facing a netiquet dillema ---

Do I bump my own post hoping for more discussion or insight (frowned upon even if it has been over 24 hours)?

or

Do I start a new post with the same question (again, frowned upon when there is an existing post).

Whatever will I do?

PM a buddy to bump the post for you.

See, now I can wait until this topic falls off the first page and then reply to your post.

DOH!  Too soon.

[KatrinaDeath]

Kraqen wrote:

Swisha@Nagafen wrote:

Kraqen wrote:

Hmmm, facing a netiquet dillema ---

Do I bump my own post hoping for more discussion or insight (frowned upon even if it has been over 24 hours)?

or

Do I start a new post with the same question (again, frowned upon when there is an existing post).

Whatever will I do?

PM a buddy to bump the post for you.

See, now I can wait until this topic falls off the first page and then reply to your post.

DOH!  Too soon.

Yeah it's best to wait until it's almost off the page.

[Kraqen]

I'll try harder next time

[Arathon]

Rothgar wrote:

Kraqen wrote:

Can I get some clarification?  I checked the update notes and can't find it.  What was changed this morning?  Changed to %200?  Does that mean it is providing %200 xp bonus and just consumes the vitality faster?  Or we have been given twice the vitality to accrue, as in the double xp will last twice as long on a full vitality charge?

If so, does it take twice as long to accrue the new full amount?

Any details out there?

Confirmed that the consumption and gain rate haven't changed.  Only the bonus that it gives you was changed.

I specifically came over to the forums to see if there was an issue with Vitality consumption.  I had basically been without vitality since the patch waiting on my Orb to reset.  I reset my vitality on my alt and continued to quest.  With in 2 hours (solo) i burned thru 100 percent vitality while locked at level 35 getting AA from questing and killing mobs in zek and feeroot.  That 100 percent vitality basically netted me 2.5 to 3 AA (81-84 AA).  

Now, its been a while since I leveled another alt., but that consumption rate seems much faster than I remember it being in the past.   I was not using any potions or RAF.  The only bonus I had was from my 5 - 90 level characters (100 percent bonus).   Again, its been a long while since I paid attention to vitality, but does this seem like a normal consumption now adays?

thanks

[Barx]

Kraqen wrote:

Ok, am I right here? (If I am following Barx correctly)

Old system -

Vitality alone = Double XP (+100% bonus)

50% potion alone = +50% bonus xp -- %150 total, each kill = 1 and a half kills

Vitality + 50% potion = Quad xp (+300% bonus, each kill = 4 kills)  100 x 2 x 1.5

New System

Vitality alone = Triple XP (+ 200%) each kill is worth 3 kills --- Faster gain than before

100% potion = Double XP (+100%) Each kill = 2 kills --- Faster than old system

Vitality and 100% potion = Quad XP (200% + 100% = 300% bonus) = Same as old system

1 Is this correct?

2 Does the change to vitality include tradeskill xp as well

3 Did we ever figure out the combat to aa conversion?  If I have a potion that gives combat and aa xp, do I 'double dip' the bonus when at %100 AA?

Yep that seems corrected, and yep it should include tradeskill XP as well. Re #3 I still do not know, someone poke Rothgar until he comes back and confirms it one way or the other

Arathon wrote:

Rothgar wrote:

Kraqen wrote:

Can I get some clarification?  I checked the update notes and can't find it.  What was changed this morning?  Changed to %200?  Does that mean it is providing %200 xp bonus and just consumes the vitality faster?  Or we have been given twice the vitality to accrue, as in the double xp will last twice as long on a full vitality charge?

If so, does it take twice as long to accrue the new full amount?

Any details out there?

Confirmed that the consumption and gain rate haven't changed.  Only the bonus that it gives you was changed.

I specifically came over to the forums to see if there was an issue with Vitality consumption.  I had basically been without vitality since the patch waiting on my Orb to reset.  I reset my vitality on my alt and continued to quest.  With in 2 hours (solo) i burned thru 100 percent vitality while locked at level 35 getting AA from questing and killing mobs in zek and feeroot.  That 100 percent vitality basically netted me 2.5 to 3 AA (81-84 AA).  

Now, its been a while since I leveled another alt., but that consumption rate seems much faster than I remember it being in the past.   I was not using any potions or RAF.  The only bonus I had was from my 5 - 90 level characters (100 percent bonus).   Again, its been a long while since I paid attention to vitality, but does this seem like a normal consumption now adays?

thanks

Vitality goes very fast at the lower end. I've burned through 100% vit in 2 hours around L35 in the past before the change, that is a reasonable rate of burn since it goes that much faster at that level.

[Arathon]

Thanks for clarifying that.  It seemed fast to me, but Its not normally something I pay much attention to. 

[urgthock]

Barx@Antonia Bayle wrote:

Kraqen wrote:

Ok, am I right here? (If I am following Barx correctly)

Old system -

Vitality alone = Double XP (+100% bonus)

50% potion alone = +50% bonus xp -- %150 total, each kill = 1 and a half kills

Vitality + 50% potion = Quad xp (+300% bonus, each kill = 4 kills)  100 x 2 x 1.5

New System

Vitality alone = Triple XP (+ 200%) each kill is worth 3 kills --- Faster gain than before

100% potion = Double XP (+100%) Each kill = 2 kills --- Faster than old system

Vitality and 100% potion = Quad XP (200% + 100% = 300% bonus) = Same as old system

1 Is this correct?

2 Does the change to vitality include tradeskill xp as well

3 Did we ever figure out the combat to aa conversion?  If I have a potion that gives combat and aa xp, do I 'double dip' the bonus when at %100 AA?

Yep that seems corrected, and yep it should include tradeskill XP as well. Re #3 I still do not know, someone poke Rothgar until he comes back and confirms it one way or the other

I don't think it includes tradeskill XP. I was doing a bit of  tradeskilling this weekend on my sage and I distinctly remembered this change and when I checked my vitality it said 100%, not 200%. So either it isn't displaying right or it isn't effecting tradeskill XP.

*Edit* Actually, I think it just said you are earning double experience with no particular numbers. But double = 100% and 200% would be triple. It might just be a description/display error though.

[Barx]

urgthock wrote:

I don't think it includes tradeskill XP. I was doing a bit of  tradeskilling this weekend on my sage and I distinctly remembered this change and when I checked my vitality it said 100%, not 200%. So either it isn't displaying right or it isn't effecting tradeskill XP.

Last I checked, tooltips for vitality all still said double XP (which is incorrect), that's both for adventuring and tradeskill. However the multi-90 bonus was doubled and the potions were doubled, so the change was made to TS XP as well. I think it's just the vitality tooltip hasn't been corrected yet. The tooltip for multi-90 bonus still needs updating on the char select screen as well, last time I checked there it was still displaying 10% per rather than the current 20%.

It's stuff like that which is why I want a total XP% display on the tooltip. Something like "Total XP Bonus: 310%" when you're running vitality (200%) and a 110% pot. Then it becomes very easy to see what kind of bonus you're getting, rather than having to add them up or wonder whether the text is right or not.

[Keirie]

How long doe it take to restore vitality? I used to be able to go an entire week playing a toon before zeroing the vitality, but now i fly through it. Does that mean I will just have to play with zero vitality if i want to play one toon exclusively without time off for vitality regen? I am not going to blow 10 bucks every time i zero vitality on a health potion from market place so hopefully there are other non-costly ways to restore it. Since vitality goes so rapidly with the new change, i think they should also increase the regen rate for it so that people who want to play one toon can without having to play with zero vitality.

[Barx]

Keirie wrote:

How long doe it take to restore vitality? I used to be able to go an entire week playing a toon before zeroing the vitality, but now i fly through it. Does that mean I will just have to play with zero vitality if i want to play one toon exclusively without time off for vitality regen? I am not going to blow 10 bucks every time i zero vitality on a health potion from market place so hopefully there are other non-costly ways to restore it. Since vitality goes so rapidly with the new change, i think they should also increase the regen rate for it so that people who want to play one toon can without having to play with zero vitality.

Vitality is consumed at the same rate as before, as Rothgar confirmed earlier in this thread.

IIRC vitality regens 0.5% per hour, meaning it takes a little more than a week to get to full from 0, although that could be an old number. You can still play without vitality, you just don't get the 200% XP bonus -- it's meant to reward steady moderate play and make grinding somewhat slower (since you run out of vitality when you grind).

There a 5-year veteran reward item that lets you restore it to 100% once per week for adventuring and a similar item in the 6-year reward for tradeskill vitality.

[Keirie]

I see, so if you like to play one toon heavily you are penalized for it? way to go soe. A week to completly replenish the vitality is way to long, at most it should recharge withing two or three days. It does ont have to be a full charge just enough to keep playing with some charge for extended periods. I do not think you should be dinged for playing one toon a lot, i.e. several days exclusively or even several weeks. Quested recharge potions would be a lot more platable then the 1000 sc ones sold on marketplace, which imho is way to costly for them....300 sc is more then fair.

[urgthock]

Keirie wrote:

I see, so if you like to play one toon heavily you are penalized for it? way to go soe. A week to completly replenish the vitality is way to long, at most it should recharge withing two or three days. It does ont have to be a full charge just enough to keep playing with some charge for extended periods. I do not think you should be dinged for playing one toon a lot, i.e. several days exclusively or even several weeks. Quested recharge potions would be a lot more platable then the 1000 sc ones sold on marketplace, which imho is way to costly for them....300 sc is more then fair.

Not receiving a benefit or bonus is not the same as being penalized. It's all in your point of view.

[Jrral]

Keirie wrote:

I see, so if you like to play one toon heavily you are penalized for it?

Nope. Vitality is intended as a bonus to help out people who don't play their toons constantly. If you're an intermittent player, you end up running with vitality most of the time and get the boost. If you play constantly the idea was you'd tend to keep your vitality used up and not have a lot of down-time between play sessions to regenerate it, so you'd spend most  of your time at the normal XP gain rate. The goal was to help people who couldn't play every day keep up better with their friends who could (at least as far as leveling went, obviously gear drops and quests would be another matter).

[Grumble69]

Whether it's a penalty or not is beside the point.  It's an unnecessary speed bump and they ought to just get rid of it.  At the very least, reset it daily.

[Kraqen]

Grumble69 wrote:

Whether it's a penalty or not is beside the point.  It's an unnecessary speed bump and they ought to just get rid of it.  At the very least, reset it daily.

I'm afraid I don't understand this.  The reasoning behind vitality was explained and makes perfect sense.  How is it a speed bump?  Not trying to be aversarial here, I just really don't understand your objection to vitality?  You think it should be dropped as a mechanic altogether and just increase all levelling speeds by %200?

I think you would be in a minority there, most people seem to feel that levelling is too fast (I think it is perfect if you include all of the ways to slow it down).

I'm all for calling out SOE for their mistakes, but sometimes the anti SOE rhetoric is just overblown.  Not an accusation against you, it just seems like nothing can be explained or discussed on this board without someone jumping on the hate SOE bandwagon ("... just like SOE to penalize us for playing one character ...".  I fear that the 'pile-on' hate on this board may drown out some serious complaints or comments.

[Glenolas]

Keirie wrote:

How long doe it take to restore vitality?

Used to be:  Exactly one week.  100% / 7  days ~14.2% per day  or slightly less than  .6% per hour,  applied on the hour.

[Waters]

Kraqen wrote:

New System

Vitality alone = Triple XP (+ 200%) each kill is worth 3 kills --- Faster gain than before

100% potion = Double XP (+100%) Each kill = 2 kills --- Faster than old system

Vitality and 100% potion = Quad XP (200% + 100% = 300% bonus) = Same as old system

1 Is this correct?

2 Does the change to vitality include tradeskill xp as well

3 Did we ever figure out the combat to aa conversion?  If I have a potion that gives combat and aa xp, do I 'double dip' the bonus when at %100 AA?

1. That looks right, yep.

2. Yes, tradeskill experience was included in the recent update and uses the same calculations as adventure experience.

3. Yes, both adventure experience and AA experience bonuses do stack for an increased benefit. 

[Powers]

What the heck?  You guys raised XP gain again?  Do you want us to reach level 90 in two weeks?

It's already nearly impossible to do any significant number of quests while leveling up without turning off XP.  This only makes it worse.

Powers  &8^]

[Fizzlecog]

Powers wrote:

What the heck?  You guys raised XP gain again?  Do you want us to reach level 90 in two weeks?

It's already nearly impossible to do any significant number of quests while leveling up without turning off XP.  This only makes it worse.

Powers  &8^]

i managed to get to 84 in 3 days with only about 200 quests done hehe, it may be to fast but thats why they created the aa slider. it also means people can level/gain aa at what ever pace they want to.