Early achievers get no recognition.

Queen Alexandria · 09-24-2009, 01:45 AM

I was one of the few who did everything I could to slow down experience so i could gain AA points early on in the game. By the time I was level 70 I had maxed my AAs and then quickly rushed to level 80. All the things I have done since I achieved level 80 seem to have gone on the way side with the new Achievement system and I get no recognition.

No, I don't feel I should go and rekill Darathar, Wuoshi, Mayong, Djinn Master, Godking, Tarinax, Imzok, Overking, Trakanon and Byzola. Seriously... this has got to be a joke. I sat there and watched plenty of my guild mates log in and recieve rewards for their achievements and for having nearly 3000 quests done I don't seem to have much to show for it.

Anyways, this is rediculous. From what I understand since I didnt get credit for AA exp because I was capped the kills were not recorded. But my mythical for example has a record of me having killed Pawbuster to obtain it so I did get the updates for that through questing.

When it comes to achievements I am obsessive about it and must do them, if this is the case and I must redo all of these achievements it makes me sick in the stomach just thinking about it.

Help me or not, im still disgruntled about this.

ke'la · 09-24-2009, 02:18 AM

To playcate those complain about "wasted" AAxp when they kill a MoB while at the cap, they stopped recording Named kills once you cap your AA.

That is the ONLY SYSTEM prior to the addtion of Achievements that accually Permanantly records things like MoB kills. Your Quest Journal only keeps track of things you kill while the quest is active, after wich it just records that you completed it.

So because they accomidated people who where had Capped AA, they have no way of knowing, in a timly manor, who killed what, once you hit the AA cap.

They repeatly informed us of this issue when they desided to once again playcate those that didn't want to do content over. They originally where ONLY going to give retro credit to Slayer kills(Gnolls, etc) and things that could not be redone like Sig quests. However, the majority wanted as much Retro Credit as possable, so they included any named kills that had granted AA(as they have a record of this), but when they told us that, they also said if it didn't give you AA then it was not tracked, so it could give you AA once the cap was raised.

Look at it this way, you would likly want to have killed those named anyway once the expainsion hit, for thier AA, so just hold off until then.

As far as looking in your journal goes, what would require making a specal script that looked though everyones journal for the litterally 100s of quests that require a named mob kill(oh and make sure that dev doesn't miss a single one or there will be heck to pay), then match those quests up to the names(make sure you spell them exsactly right) you had to kill, then check them off the list. Then troubleshooting that script, then adding those quests they missed, then putting it on test, then adding more quests the Test Server people point out, then putting it live only to see it choke on all the journals it goes though(or if it doesn't seeing the explosion because they misssed one quest). All for a one time change that will never be used again.

Thunderthyze · 09-24-2009, 03:56 AM

Zenaide@Mistmoore wrote:

When it comes to achievements I am obsessive about it and must do them, if this is the case and I must redo all of these achievements it makes me sick in the stomach just thinking about it.

Err.....it's only a game?

Queen Alexandria · 09-24-2009, 11:54 AM

It still doesn't change how upset I am that I have to spend months redoing content no one has a desire to do. I know they can't give credit for things that aren't tracked. But how can they check if I killed a mob for a quest update I didn't get if it isn't tracked? I've petitioned before and had issues resolved where they confirmed that I did kill something last week and indeed did not get credit for it. We had loot given to the wrong person on a raid, and customer support was able to confirm that the person supposed to get the loot was definitely not there for the kill. And yeah, it's just a game, why am I getting so upset about it? Oh yeah... I just remembered.

Rannc · 09-24-2009, 11:59 AM

Zenaide@Mistmoore wrote:

It still doesn't change how upset I am that I have to spend months redoing content no one has a desire to do. I know they can't give credit for things that aren't tracked. But how can they check if I killed a mob for a quest update I didn't get if it isn't tracked? I've petitioned before and had issues resolved where they confirmed that I did kill something last week and indeed did not get credit for it. We had loot given to the wrong person on a raid, and customer support was able to confirm that the person supposed to get the loot was definitely not there for the kill. And yeah, it's just a game, why am I getting so upset about it? Oh yeah... I just remembered.

As Oprah would say, "I feel your pain" but the fact that I do simply means we both need counseling. In the grand scheme of life this is not something to get worked up over and I think you know that. Nobody is holding a gun to your head "making" you redo things just to get some bragging rights, etc. It ought to be enough that you know what you've had fun doing in the game.

This is not the stuff resumes are made of you know? Nobody but you cares about what you do here really and few would be impressed if you did every single achievement in the game other than by your having that kind of time for this versus a real life.

I'm not saying that to be unkind to you but honestly, try letting it go and if you can't do that, pick up the phone and make some calls for a therapist because in that case you really do need one.

Yimway · 09-24-2009, 12:05 PM

Zenaide@Mistmoore wrote:

I was one of the few who did everything I could to slow down experience so i could gain AA points early on in the game. By the time I was level 70 I had maxed my AAs and then quickly rushed to level 80. All the things I have done since I achieved level 80 seem to have gone on the way side with the new Achievement system and I get no recognition.
No, I don't feel I should go and rekill Darathar, Wuoshi, Mayong, Djinn Master, Godking, Tarinax, Imzok, Overking, Trakanon and Byzola. Seriously... this has got to be a joke. I sat there and watched plenty of my guild mates log in and recieve rewards for their achievements and for having nearly 3000 quests done I don't seem to have much to show for it.
Anyways, this is rediculous. From what I understand since I didnt get credit for AA exp because I was capped the kills were not recorded. But my mythical for example has a record of me having killed Pawbuster to obtain it so I did get the updates for that through questing.
When it comes to achievements I am obsessive about it and must do them, if this is the case and I must redo all of these achievements it makes me sick in the stomach just thinking about it.
Help me or not, im still disgruntled about this.

You could have parlayed for retroactive achievements not to be effected, so your guildmates would have logged in with the same state as you.

The only option on the table was to make everyone not have them, or provide the rewards for what was actually tracked.

I think they made the right decision. Yes it sucks there are tons of things I killed that I don't have credit for, about the only one I don't look forward to re-doing is DMP.

But I look at it this way, I have a clean list of mobs I can go rekill at the next expansion to get aa.

bigbaldpapa · 09-24-2009, 12:17 PM

Atan@Unrest wrote:

But I look at it this way, I have a clean list of mobs I can go rekill at the next expansion to get aa.

At least there is a brighter side to this issue. I am lucky to be new enough that I have not been affected by this.

Edit: My forum date shows that I have been around a long time. However, I got the account near launch but spent 95% of the time since in SWG. Only this summer had I gave this game a real run and decided to stay.

Brook · 09-24-2009, 12:21 PM

Ranncor@Befallen wrote:

Zenaide@Mistmoore wrote:
It still doesn't change how upset I am that I have to spend months redoing content no one has a desire to do. I know they can't give credit for things that aren't tracked. But how can they check if I killed a mob for a quest update I didn't get if it isn't tracked? I've petitioned before and had issues resolved where they confirmed that I did kill something last week and indeed did not get credit for it. We had loot given to the wrong person on a raid, and customer support was able to confirm that the person supposed to get the loot was definitely not there for the kill. And yeah, it's just a game, why am I getting so upset about it? Oh yeah... I just remembered.
As Oprah would say, "I feel your pain" but the fact that I do simply means we both need counseling. In the grand scheme of life this is not something to get worked up over and I think you know that. Nobody is holding a gun to your head "making" you redo things just to get some bragging rights, etc. It ought to be enough that you know what you've had fun doing in the game.
This is not the stuff resumes are made of you know? Nobody but you cares about what you do here really and few would be impressed if you did every single achievement in the game other than by your having that kind of time for this versus a real life.
I'm not saying that to be unkind to you but honestly, try letting it go and if you can't do that, pick up the phone and make some calls for a therapist because in that case you really do need one.

What qualifies you to tell someone they need a therapist?

The OP has a valid complaint. They do have ways of going back and tracking what a character has done through its life, hell they sent a few years of our data to another company they have been saving.

Problem is that if they actually did go back and sift through all that data for everyone it would take a tremendous amount of time so as usual we are going to get absolutely nothing for the time and money we vets have put into the game xcept an I'm sorry for your inconvenience and we understand your frustration, blah blah blah etc...

Actually I am kind of getting used to it, its frustrating but not unexpected anymore.

Yimway · 09-24-2009, 12:24 PM

Brook wrote:

Problem is that if they actually did go back and sift through all that data for everyone it would take a tremendous amount of time so as usual we are going to get absolutely nothing for the time and money we vets have put into the game xcept an I'm sorry for your inconvenience and we understand your frustration, blah blah blah etc...

The CPU/Database time needed to do this per character is simply not a realistic sollution.

You might be shocked how long that would take to run per character, much less per account, or per server.

CoLD MeTaL · 09-24-2009, 12:29 PM

Atan@Unrest wrote:

Brook wrote:
Problem is that if they actually did go back and sift through all that data for everyone it would take a tremendous amount of time so as usual we are going to get absolutely nothing for the time and money we vets have put into the game xcept an I'm sorry for your inconvenience and we understand your frustration, blah blah blah etc...
The CPU/Database time needed to do this per character is simply not a realistic sollution.
You might be shocked how long that would take to run per character, much less per account, or per server.

Actually I don't think it would be that much to process a server log "ONCE" and scatter the achievements out to each character.

Now if you said "There is no money in it" I would have agreed with that, old timers aren't gonna unsub over this and SOE knows as time has proven that they can ***** us and go on.

Now that i know there is a 'call to mara' and a few items that are NOT pure fluff, this is upsetting. Oh well, as Vonnegut said, "So it goes."

Rannc · 09-24-2009, 01:09 PM

Brook wrote:

Ranncor@Befallen wrote:
Zenaide@Mistmoore wrote:
It still doesn't change how upset I am that I have to spend months redoing content no one has a desire to do. I know they can't give credit for things that aren't tracked. But how can they check if I killed a mob for a quest update I didn't get if it isn't tracked? I've petitioned before and had issues resolved where they confirmed that I did kill something last week and indeed did not get credit for it. We had loot given to the wrong person on a raid, and customer support was able to confirm that the person supposed to get the loot was definitely not there for the kill. And yeah, it's just a game, why am I getting so upset about it? Oh yeah... I just remembered.
As Oprah would say, "I feel your pain" but the fact that I do simply means we both need counseling. In the grand scheme of life this is not something to get worked up over and I think you know that. Nobody is holding a gun to your head "making" you redo things just to get some bragging rights, etc. It ought to be enough that you know what you've had fun doing in the game.
This is not the stuff resumes are made of you know? Nobody but you cares about what you do here really and few would be impressed if you did every single achievement in the game other than by your having that kind of time for this versus a real life.
I'm not saying that to be unkind to you but honestly, try letting it go and if you can't do that, pick up the phone and make some calls for a therapist because in that case you really do need one.
What qualifies you to tell someone they need a therapist?
The OP has a valid complaint. They do have ways of going back and tracking what a character has done through its life, hell they sent a few years of our data to another company they have been saving.
Problem is that if they actually did go back and sift through all that data for everyone it would take a tremendous amount of time so as usual we are going to get absolutely nothing for the time and money we vets have put into the game xcept an I'm sorry for your inconvenience and we understand your frustration, blah blah blah etc...
Actually I am kind of getting used to it, its frustrating but not unexpected anymore.

Many years of professional experience in the field qualifies me since you asked.

That said, you are assuming that you know exactly what historical data the developers have access to when in reality you do not know this with any certainty at all. The fact that someone can cite various examples of restored data hardly proves that 100% of the data for 100% of the the events in this game since 2004 has all been carefully preserved in anticipation of this fine day.

I'd also have to say that one wouldn't need any professional background to see clearly the obsessive need to get "recognition" in a computer game for what it is and with best of intentions suggest that individual get some help. Then again, you could argue that I ought to know better than to think they'd listen to that, particularly here, as opposed to remaining in denial and becoming highly defensive at the suggestion their view is anything less than absolutely correct and completely justified. It never hurts to plant seeds and try even against the odds is my response to that.

Lord Hackenslash · 09-24-2009, 01:13 PM

What's the point of a race when everyone starts at the finish line?

Sarriss · 09-24-2009, 01:57 PM

this was duscusses MANY MANY MANY MANY times as to why this happened, there was even a poll about it in that same discussion thread

http://forums.station.sony.com/eq2/...topic_id=458423

In short it would require too much in the way of resorces to sift through every quest to find out who did what, and even then it would not get everything..

The system hasno record of me ever setting foot in the commonlands, when I started in freeport back in 2004 and live there to this day (so, yea, I've been to the commonlands) here me whining, nope. I'm running through the commonlands trying to remember where the heck some of thes POIs are (I swear they have moved them)

PS; if you didn't vote on the poll, go to your bathroom, look at the mirror, and complain to the guy in it.

ke'la · 09-24-2009, 06:07 PM

CoLD MeTaL wrote:

Atan@Unrest wrote:
Brook wrote:
Problem is that if they actually did go back and sift through all that data for everyone it would take a tremendous amount of time so as usual we are going to get absolutely nothing for the time and money we vets have put into the game xcept an I'm sorry for your inconvenience and we understand your frustration, blah blah blah etc...
The CPU/Database time needed to do this per character is simply not a realistic sollution.
You might be shocked how long that would take to run per character, much less per account, or per server.
Actually I don't think it would be that much to process a server log "ONCE" and scatter the achievements out to each character.
Now if you said "There is no money in it" I would have agreed with that, old timers aren't gonna unsub over this and SOE knows as time has proven that they can ***** us and go on.
Now that i know there is a 'call to mara' and a few items that are NOT pure fluff, this is upsetting. Oh well, as Vonnegut said, "So it goes."

Have you ever accually looked at your chat log on your computer? Or ANY event log from ANY computer system?

They are almost always logged in ASCII format(Text) as that creates the smallest possable uncompressed file(logs can't be compressed cause they are constantly appended to).

You try running a Script that goes though the Terrabytes of Logs they have stored for our charactors and parce them on a per charactor baisis, it also has to be ether an Active script because we can't miss that Named you killed 15secs befor the server went down for its this update, or it could only be run After the servers went down, extending the downtime by HUGE amounts as it parced all that information.

Yes they can go back and look at the logs and see if you have done a SPECIFIC thing, but they have some help in that..

First they have the name of the Charactor that did it, they have a Date/Time range when it was done, and they have the specific event that they need to look for.

So they look though the log on Aug 13, 2009 between 11:30am PST and 12:30pm PST, for a charactor named John, for the line "You Killed Darathar" line. That all can be done in about 10 mins cause it is looking for ONE event in a VERY limited timeframe, for ONE charactor.

Now lets see what they would have to do to get ONE PLAYER every achievment they accompished sence they started playing.

First the would have to repeat the above Search 100s of times per player one for every event that gives players Achivements.

They would have to expained the Timeframe so instead of looking at ONE hour of the log, they would have to look ~42,720 hours of the log* aka the whole thing.

So assuming the Search I talked about above takes about 1 second(I seriously doupt it is anywhere near this fast, probly more like a few mins.). Multiply that 100 times for each search, and as the timeframe is 42k+ times larger you have to account for that as well, so lets increase the search time per query 420 times to account for that, so now we have 420** sec per query, that means each toon would take about 42,000*** secs to populate its Achievment UI. Thats nearly 12 hours per toon. Do you really think anyone would put up with the servers down for 12 hours, assuming they had the processing power to query every single charactor in game at the same time? Thats hundreds of thousands of charactors(cause it is every charactor of every player that has EVER logged in to this game sence it launched).

* 5 years x 365 days/year x 24 hours/day = 42,720 hours** got that by adding 0.001 secs to the search for every HOUR of addtional log required to search.*** 420sec x 100 possable Achivements(there are more then this)

salty21db · 09-24-2009, 06:20 PM

As i say in almost all my replies/posts now.....GAMERS COMPLAIN NO MATTER WHAT

There is no argueing with them...no reasoning with them...no having them see your point of view...for the most part they are just upset people and use this as a outlet or any game as a outlet for their frustrations in life.

Queen Alexandria · 09-24-2009, 08:40 PM

I need therapy.

Armawk · 09-24-2009, 09:01 PM

It IS a great shame, and I might have been one to opt for 'no retrospective if you cant do it completely', but I think they had to decide and probably decided right on a purely 'how many people will be happy or upset' basis.

As for a log search for events to allocate this stuff.. it sounds like an enormous task and I would doubt a reliable result could ever be achieved anyway.

Rannc · 09-24-2009, 09:19 PM

Melina@Splitpaw wrote:

What's the point of a race when everyone starts at the finish line?

Who said it was a race? I thought this was just something for fun? You mean we need to win and most of us have already lost? SMILEY

MyleeSilverwings · 09-24-2009, 09:56 PM

Yes, it is probably unfair ... but me?? I only ask for Antonia Bayle to remain online for a night without crashing multiple times! All the rest is gravy!

Squeezy Plushtoy · 09-24-2009, 10:19 PM

I am in agreement with the OP. I have been through almost all of the content with exception to some TSO. One person made the snazzy comment about running around commonlands and getting PoI's and it was no huge deal. Sure, running around for PoI's is easy... what about going back to get mobs in raid zones that you killed a million times with a great guild that you can't easily go back and get anymore cause -gasp- you aren't raiding anymore?

Basically what SOE is telling me is "Sorry, but since you busted your booty a long time ago it doesn't count and we don't care cause we just now decided to give you rewards for it. But only if you waste time to go back and do it over, which means you waste more time wen you could be moving on to other things. So go back and do it again cause we don't even want to TRY to fix it for people who have been long standing customers and likely have more than one account. We just don't care"

Running around for PoI's is one thing. But when you are no longer able to go back and kill mobs that you could when you were a part of a guild that cleared that content so easy, really pisses you off. Its not an option. And to sit here and see all your guildies log in and get reward after reward for things YOU DID already really freaking sux.

For example.... how can I be an 80 crafter on 3 of my characters, a level 70 and 60 on a few others and NOT have 1,000 combines on any? And the meter tells me I don't even have even one combine recorded... ON ANY OF THOSE CHARACTERS!?

I have killed every raid mob in RoK and almost every one before yet some of those are not credited. And the ones that aren't, I can't easily go back and get.

Normally I shrug things off that most people complain about... and I never post to complain here... but when I sit back and seriously consider quitting a game I have played since launch and the game prior... the money I spent non-stop from then till now (which makes me realize now that its a waste cause I am getting crap with this new system) I realize how much BS this is. Everytime they add something new, its almost like they are finding a new way to screw the veterans. I know thats not how it really it but thats the way it ends up.

I am ready to throw in the towel and say screw SoE. This is ridiculous.

Yes this is just a game.. were it free then I would care a bit less and find a way, maybe, to go back and redo it. But it isn't. I pay for this 'game' I spent a lot of time and money to get the achievements that I am now not being rewarded for and yet people who havent done half of what I have feel the need to tell others they have no reason to complain and be upset. If you aren't upset, yay for you. I am. Many are and we have every right to be. There is no way I want to go back and REDO content on all my level 80's. Thats upsurd.

Aurel · 09-24-2009, 10:22 PM

There are plenty enough topics on this already. I think they get the point, you guys are frustrated...

I am sure back in the beginning of EQ2, if they had known 1) that they would add an AAXP system and 2) that they would later on then add an achievement system, then they would have started tracking all of this from the very beginning. Unfortunately, they didn't know back then that this would come around. You are basically scolding them for not knowing the future. *shrug*

Gortha · 09-25-2009, 12:27 AM

I find it quite interesting that so many people are upset over getting "screwed out of rewards" - what rewards exactly ? achievements award points that you cant spend on anything, and dont DO anything for you. I simply dont understand why "bragging rights" are SO important to people.

if the points could be spent somehow, I'd be just as angry - but honestly aside from bragging rights and a few fluff items, what has been denied you?

...nothing...

ke'la · 09-25-2009, 01:08 AM

Squeezy Plushtoy wrote:

I am in agreement with the OP. I have been through almost all of the content with exception to some TSO. One person made the snazzy comment about running around commonlands and getting PoI's and it was no huge deal. Sure, running around for PoI's is easy... what about going back to get mobs in raid zones that you killed a million times with a great guild that you can't easily go back and get anymore cause -gasp- you aren't raiding anymore?
Basically what SOE is telling me is "Sorry, but since you busted your booty a long time ago it doesn't count and we don't care cause we just now decided to give you rewards for it. But only if you waste time to go back and do it over, which means you waste more time wen you could be moving on to other things. So go back and do it again cause we don't even want to TRY to fix it for people who have been long standing customers and likely have more than one account. We just don't care"
No what they are saying by doing give as much retroactive as they resonably can with out spending Man-years looking through Terrabytes of logs for every single charactor ever played by anyone is. "We understand you worked very hard to kill those mobs and we will do the best we can to get you credit, but it is simply not feasable to get you credit for everything". The FACT that they had MULTIPLE threads on this subject befor it went live INCLUDING a PLAYER POLL that resulted in an OVERWHELMING majority vote for exsactly what they implemented. Means not only do they understand exsactly what the issue is, but they where in fact listening to the players and doing the best they can.
Running around for PoI's is one thing. But when you are no longer able to go back and kill mobs that you could when you were a part of a guild that cleared that content so easy, really pisses you off. Its not an option. And to sit here and see all your guildies log in and get reward after reward for things YOU DID already really freaking sux.
For example.... how can I be an 80 crafter on 3 of my characters, a level 70 and 60 on a few others and NOT have 1,000 combines on any? And the meter tells me I don't even have even one combine recorded... ON ANY OF THOSE CHARACTERS!?
I have killed every raid mob in RoK and almost every one before yet some of those are not credited. And the ones that aren't, I can't easily go back and get.
Because there is no record* of you doing those things, because PRIOR to this being added to the game there was no need or reason to record such information. Now they could spend litteral Man-years parcing there Terabytes worth of logges and to record every single little achivement you could possably have gotten, leaving the servers down the whole time ofcourse, as that is the only way to get EVERYTHING. Or they could do the best they could at giving you the Achivements you earned.
Normally I shrug things off that most people complain about... and I never post to complain here... but when I sit back and seriously consider quitting a game I have played since launch and the game prior... the money I spent non-stop from then till now (which makes me realize now that its a waste cause I am getting crap with this new system) I realize how much BS this is. Everytime they add something new, its almost like they are finding a new way to screw the veterans. I know thats not how it really it but thats the way it ends up.
I am ready to throw in the towel and say screw SoE. This is ridiculous.
You do know that every Named mob you have not gotten an Achivement for also has NEVER granted you AAxp right? That means while all your "Guild Mates" have to scape and claw for AAxp when SoF launchs you have a ready made list of MoBs to go hit that WILL grant you AAxp when you kill them.
Yes this is just a game.. were it free then I would care a bit less and find a way, maybe, to go back and redo it. But it isn't. I pay for this 'game' I spent a lot of time and money to get the achievements that I am now not being rewarded for and yet people who havent done half of what I have feel the need to tell others they have no reason to complain and be upset. If you aren't upset, yay for you. I am. Many are and we have every right to be. There is no way I want to go back and REDO content on all my level 80's. Thats upsurd.
Then don't other then Braging rights, a few fluff items, and AAxp(once SoF launches) there really is no reason to do any of the achievments if you don't want to. As far as not having a reason to be upset, um how this was going to be implimented was known more or less sence mid-August, I think the time to be upset about it has LONG past.

*Just to be clear, yes they do log EVERYTHING, however parcing a log like that is far more difficult then having a seperate record of what specific things you have done. One is just a list of specific things you have done, the other is a listing of absolutly EVERYTHING you have done. One can be more or less cut and pasted in to the new listing, the other would have to first be parced on a Charactor by Charactor basis going back 5years, and doing that befor the servers would be able to come back up. Do you Really think it is possable in any kind of reasonable amount of time to parce ASCII Files Terrabytes in size, Hundreds of thousands of times(once for each charactor that has ever been created) in any amount of time that players would except as a reasonable down time?

Gungo · 09-25-2009, 02:30 AM

just to be crystal clear on how pathetic people crying about these updates are.

In the 2 days since the patch i have finished EVERY SINGLE POIEVERY SINGLE GENERAL (except slayers)EVERY SINGLE QUEST (except Holiday and 4000 quests)I SOLOED EVERY RAID in t5/t6 including splitpaw (except djinn mster need 3 people at least)EVERY crafting mission (need 1000 Combines)

I did this in 2 days with my server down most of yesterday evening.Working on the dugeons now.

Bindsya_Wounds · 09-25-2009, 03:08 AM

I can understand this happening with the exploration and stuff , but were talking about T8 raid mobs and not getting credit for those. Not silly T4 and T5 ones that you can ** Brag ** about soloing. Also its not just bragging rights you gain , for example I recieved a void portal that takes me directly to Palace .. thats quite a long run really LOL . So the folks that have completed the shard zones and didnt even get that , yeah I can see why they are upset. I just want credited for the T8 raid mobs I did ... LOL Killed Byzola the day before patch ... /sigh

I can agree though someone had mentioned in this topic that theres always someone to complain and you are right , they cant make us all happy but I just feel like this is a big deal. ... Ok im done rambline , just wanted to toss my 2 cents in.

Jozalin / Josalyn

Mistmoore

Queen Alexandria · 09-25-2009, 03:20 AM

Gungo wrote:

just to be crystal clear on how pathetic people crying about these updates are.
In the 2 days since the patch i have finished EVERY SINGLE POIEVERY SINGLE GENERAL (except slayers)EVERY SINGLE QUEST (except Holiday and 4000 quests)I SOLOED EVERY RAID in t5/t6 including splitpaw (except djinn mster need 3 people at least)EVERY crafting mission (need 1000 Combines)
I did this in 2 days with my server down most of yesterday evening.Working on the dugeons now.

Grats dude. You want to join me in therapy? Thats a lot of gaming in two days.

ke'la · 09-25-2009, 04:07 AM

Bindsya_Wounds wrote:

I can understand this happening with the exploration and stuff , but were talking about T8 raid mobs and not getting credit for those. Not silly T4 and T5 ones that you can ** Brag ** about soloing. Also its not just bragging rights you gain , for example I recieved a void portal that takes me directly to Palace .. thats quite a long run really LOL . So the folks that have completed the shard zones and didnt even get that , yeah I can see why they are upset. I just want credited for the T8 raid mobs I did ... LOL Killed Byzola the day before patch ... /sigh
I can agree though someone had mentioned in this topic that theres always someone to complain and you are right , they cant make us all happy but I just feel like this is a big deal. ... Ok im done rambline , just wanted to toss my 2 cents in.
Jozalin / Josalyn
Mistmoore

The reason your not getting credit for those is the same reason you didn't get credit for the T5 Raid Mobs, you never recieved AAxp for them.

They can only give you credit if they have tracked it in the past. The only tracking system they had prior to the update was the what had already Granted you AAxp.

Does it stink that you have to do SOME stuff again, while others don't yeah, but the only other options are:

everyone having to do everything again
the senario we are in now
The servers still not up because they are still not done parcing the Terrabytes of logs they would have to go though to give you credit for everything.

Which option would you prefure?

Spritelady · 09-25-2009, 09:31 AM

Regarding the Tradeskill Combines....

This info WAS tracked for EQ2Players, and a Dev commented on trying to "fix it so they were counted" back in the In Testing thread on the subject. Apparently that fell through.

The one that really annoys me is having to kill Aiden again. I have the stupid earring from the quest, i couldn't have that if I hadn't killed Aiden =)

CoLD MeTaL · 09-25-2009, 10:19 AM

kela wrote:

{0}

I have been a professional developer for more than 20 years, I know exactly what it would entail. You can say "Not cost effective" and you can say "Not worth the funds", but hard/difficult/whatever that is what work is. However customers should be taken care of, and if you are going to be asinine enough to introduce a system like this 5 years after the system has been put in place, you do the freaking work. half-a**ed doesn't even come close to how this was done, speaking as a developer. It's like converting an accoounting system and not making sure the balance sheet is right because it 'would take too much time'.

bryldan · 09-25-2009, 11:00 AM

CoLD MeTaL wrote:

kela wrote:
{0}
I have been a professional developer for more than 20 years, I know exactly what it would entail. You can say "Not cost effective" and you can say "Not worth the funds", but hard/difficult/whatever that is what work is. However customers should be taken care of, and if you are going to be asinine enough to introduce a system like this 5 years after the system has been put in place, you do the freaking work. half-a**ed doesn't even come close to how this was done, speaking as a developer. It's like converting an accoounting system and not making sure the balance sheet is right because it 'would take too much time'.

If they did this we would have more ppl complaining/DEMANDING money back from the servers being down a few days would that be reasonable for you to get credit on a few things that takes minutes to go do? In those three days of downtime instead of not playing you could have gone and done everything that you were missing so look at it that way.

09-24-2009, 01:45 AM	#1
Queen Alexandria Loremaster Join Date: Nov 2004 Posts: 221	I was one of the few who did everything I could to slow down experience so i could gain AA points early on in the game. By the time I was level 70 I had maxed my AAs and then quickly rushed to level 80. All the things I have done since I achieved level 80 seem to have gone on the way side with the new Achievement system and I get no recognition. No, I don't feel I should go and rekill Darathar, Wuoshi, Mayong, Djinn Master, Godking, Tarinax, Imzok, Overking, Trakanon and Byzola. Seriously... this has got to be a joke. I sat there and watched plenty of my guild mates log in and recieve rewards for their achievements and for having nearly 3000 quests done I don't seem to have much to show for it. Anyways, this is rediculous. From what I understand since I didnt get credit for AA exp because I was capped the kills were not recorded. But my mythical for example has a record of me having killed Pawbuster to obtain it so I did get the updates for that through questing. When it comes to achievements I am obsessive about it and must do them, if this is the case and I must redo all of these achievements it makes me sick in the stomach just thinking about it. Help me or not, im still disgruntled about this. __________________

09-24-2009, 02:18 AM	#2
ke'la Loremaster Join Date: Dec 2004 Posts: 5,445	To playcate those complain about "wasted" AAxp when they kill a MoB while at the cap, they stopped recording Named kills once you cap your AA. That is the ONLY SYSTEM prior to the addtion of Achievements that accually Permanantly records things like MoB kills. Your Quest Journal only keeps track of things you kill while the quest is active, after wich it just records that you completed it. So because they accomidated people who where had Capped AA, they have no way of knowing, in a timly manor, who killed what, once you hit the AA cap. They repeatly informed us of this issue when they desided to once again playcate those that didn't want to do content over. They originally where ONLY going to give retro credit to Slayer kills(Gnolls, etc) and things that could not be redone like Sig quests. However, the majority wanted as much Retro Credit as possable, so they included any named kills that had granted AA(as they have a record of this), but when they told us that, they also said if it didn't give you AA then it was not tracked, so it could give you AA once the cap was raised. Look at it this way, you would likly want to have killed those named anyway once the expainsion hit, for thier AA, so just hold off until then. As far as looking in your journal goes, what would require making a specal script that looked though everyones journal for the litterally 100s of quests that require a named mob kill(oh and make sure that dev doesn't miss a single one or there will be heck to pay), then match those quests up to the names(make sure you spell them exsactly right) you had to kill, then check them off the list. Then troubleshooting that script, then adding those quests they missed, then putting it on test, then adding more quests the Test Server people point out, then putting it live only to see it choke on all the journals it goes though(or if it doesn't seeing the explosion because they misssed one quest). All for a one time change that will never be used again. __________________

09-24-2009, 03:56 AM	#3
Thunderthyze Loremaster Join Date: Sep 2005 Location: Old South Wales Posts: 2,050	Zenaide@Mistmoore wrote: When it comes to achievements I am obsessive about it and must do them, if this is the case and I must redo all of these achievements it makes me sick in the stomach just thinking about it. Err.....it's only a game? __________________

09-24-2009, 11:54 AM	#4
Queen Alexandria Loremaster Join Date: Nov 2004 Posts: 221	It still doesn't change how upset I am that I have to spend months redoing content no one has a desire to do. I know they can't give credit for things that aren't tracked. But how can they check if I killed a mob for a quest update I didn't get if it isn't tracked? I've petitioned before and had issues resolved where they confirmed that I did kill something last week and indeed did not get credit for it. We had loot given to the wrong person on a raid, and customer support was able to confirm that the person supposed to get the loot was definitely not there for the kill. And yeah, it's just a game, why am I getting so upset about it? Oh yeah... I just remembered. __________________

09-24-2009, 11:59 AM	#5
Rannc Server: Befallen General Join Date: Mar 2005 Posts: 26	Zenaide@Mistmoore wrote: It still doesn't change how upset I am that I have to spend months redoing content no one has a desire to do. I know they can't give credit for things that aren't tracked. But how can they check if I killed a mob for a quest update I didn't get if it isn't tracked? I've petitioned before and had issues resolved where they confirmed that I did kill something last week and indeed did not get credit for it. We had loot given to the wrong person on a raid, and customer support was able to confirm that the person supposed to get the loot was definitely not there for the kill. And yeah, it's just a game, why am I getting so upset about it? Oh yeah... I just remembered. As Oprah would say, "I feel your pain" but the fact that I do simply means we both need counseling. In the grand scheme of life this is not something to get worked up over and I think you know that. Nobody is holding a gun to your head "making" you redo things just to get some bragging rights, etc. It ought to be enough that you know what you've had fun doing in the game. This is not the stuff resumes are made of you know? Nobody but you cares about what you do here really and few would be impressed if you did every single achievement in the game other than by your having that kind of time for this versus a real life. I'm not saying that to be unkind to you but honestly, try letting it go and if you can't do that, pick up the phone and make some calls for a therapist because in that case you really do need one.

09-24-2009, 12:05 PM	#6
Yimway Loremaster Join Date: Apr 2005 Posts: 9,707	Zenaide@Mistmoore wrote: I was one of the few who did everything I could to slow down experience so i could gain AA points early on in the game. By the time I was level 70 I had maxed my AAs and then quickly rushed to level 80. All the things I have done since I achieved level 80 seem to have gone on the way side with the new Achievement system and I get no recognition. No, I don't feel I should go and rekill Darathar, Wuoshi, Mayong, Djinn Master, Godking, Tarinax, Imzok, Overking, Trakanon and Byzola. Seriously... this has got to be a joke. I sat there and watched plenty of my guild mates log in and recieve rewards for their achievements and for having nearly 3000 quests done I don't seem to have much to show for it. Anyways, this is rediculous. From what I understand since I didnt get credit for AA exp because I was capped the kills were not recorded. But my mythical for example has a record of me having killed Pawbuster to obtain it so I did get the updates for that through questing. When it comes to achievements I am obsessive about it and must do them, if this is the case and I must redo all of these achievements it makes me sick in the stomach just thinking about it. Help me or not, im still disgruntled about this. You could have parlayed for retroactive achievements not to be effected, so your guildmates would have logged in with the same state as you. The only option on the table was to make everyone not have them, or provide the rewards for what was actually tracked. I think they made the right decision. Yes it sucks there are tons of things I killed that I don't have credit for, about the only one I don't look forward to re-doing is DMP. But I look at it this way, I have a clean list of mobs I can go rekill at the next expansion to get aa. __________________

09-24-2009, 12:17 PM	#7
bigbaldpapa Loremaster Join Date: Nov 2004 Posts: 69	Atan@Unrest wrote: But I look at it this way, I have a clean list of mobs I can go rekill at the next expansion to get aa. At least there is a brighter side to this issue. I am lucky to be new enough that I have not been affected by this. Edit: My forum date shows that I have been around a long time. However, I got the account near launch but spent 95% of the time since in SWG. Only this summer had I gave this game a real run and decided to stay.

09-24-2009, 12:21 PM	#8
Brook Tester Join Date: Apr 2005 Posts: 1,336	Ranncor@Befallen wrote: Zenaide@Mistmoore wrote: It still doesn't change how upset I am that I have to spend months redoing content no one has a desire to do. I know they can't give credit for things that aren't tracked. But how can they check if I killed a mob for a quest update I didn't get if it isn't tracked? I've petitioned before and had issues resolved where they confirmed that I did kill something last week and indeed did not get credit for it. We had loot given to the wrong person on a raid, and customer support was able to confirm that the person supposed to get the loot was definitely not there for the kill. And yeah, it's just a game, why am I getting so upset about it? Oh yeah... I just remembered. As Oprah would say, "I feel your pain" but the fact that I do simply means we both need counseling. In the grand scheme of life this is not something to get worked up over and I think you know that. Nobody is holding a gun to your head "making" you redo things just to get some bragging rights, etc. It ought to be enough that you know what you've had fun doing in the game. This is not the stuff resumes are made of you know? Nobody but you cares about what you do here really and few would be impressed if you did every single achievement in the game other than by your having that kind of time for this versus a real life. I'm not saying that to be unkind to you but honestly, try letting it go and if you can't do that, pick up the phone and make some calls for a therapist because in that case you really do need one. What qualifies you to tell someone they need a therapist? The OP has a valid complaint. They do have ways of going back and tracking what a character has done through its life, hell they sent a few years of our data to another company they have been saving. Problem is that if they actually did go back and sift through all that data for everyone it would take a tremendous amount of time so as usual we are going to get absolutely nothing for the time and money we vets have put into the game xcept an I'm sorry for your inconvenience and we understand your frustration, blah blah blah etc... Actually I am kind of getting used to it, its frustrating but not unexpected anymore. __________________ But seriously, you're the kind of guy that zones into gears without a healer and spends the whole match talking about the fact there isn't a healer instead of contributing. I hate you, and everyone like you that plays this game. Please spend less time whining and more time winning, it contributes to the general growth of the game and makes gameplay more enjoyable for all.

09-24-2009, 12:24 PM	#9
Yimway Loremaster Join Date: Apr 2005 Posts: 9,707	Brook wrote: Problem is that if they actually did go back and sift through all that data for everyone it would take a tremendous amount of time so as usual we are going to get absolutely nothing for the time and money we vets have put into the game xcept an I'm sorry for your inconvenience and we understand your frustration, blah blah blah etc... The CPU/Database time needed to do this per character is simply not a realistic sollution. You might be shocked how long that would take to run per character, much less per account, or per server. __________________

09-24-2009, 12:29 PM	#10
CoLD MeTaL Loremaster Join Date: Apr 2005 Posts: 3,217	Atan@Unrest wrote: Brook wrote: Problem is that if they actually did go back and sift through all that data for everyone it would take a tremendous amount of time so as usual we are going to get absolutely nothing for the time and money we vets have put into the game xcept an I'm sorry for your inconvenience and we understand your frustration, blah blah blah etc... The CPU/Database time needed to do this per character is simply not a realistic sollution. You might be shocked how long that would take to run per character, much less per account, or per server. Actually I don't think it would be that much to process a server log "ONCE" and scatter the achievements out to each character. Now if you said "There is no money in it" I would have agreed with that, old timers aren't gonna unsub over this and SOE knows as time has proven that they can ***** us and go on. Now that i know there is a 'call to mara' and a few items that are NOT pure fluff, this is upsetting. Oh well, as Vonnegut said, "So it goes." __________________

09-24-2009, 01:09 PM	#11
Rannc Server: Befallen General Join Date: Mar 2005 Posts: 26	Brook wrote: Ranncor@Befallen wrote: Zenaide@Mistmoore wrote: It still doesn't change how upset I am that I have to spend months redoing content no one has a desire to do. I know they can't give credit for things that aren't tracked. But how can they check if I killed a mob for a quest update I didn't get if it isn't tracked? I've petitioned before and had issues resolved where they confirmed that I did kill something last week and indeed did not get credit for it. We had loot given to the wrong person on a raid, and customer support was able to confirm that the person supposed to get the loot was definitely not there for the kill. And yeah, it's just a game, why am I getting so upset about it? Oh yeah... I just remembered. As Oprah would say, "I feel your pain" but the fact that I do simply means we both need counseling. In the grand scheme of life this is not something to get worked up over and I think you know that. Nobody is holding a gun to your head "making" you redo things just to get some bragging rights, etc. It ought to be enough that you know what you've had fun doing in the game. This is not the stuff resumes are made of you know? Nobody but you cares about what you do here really and few would be impressed if you did every single achievement in the game other than by your having that kind of time for this versus a real life. I'm not saying that to be unkind to you but honestly, try letting it go and if you can't do that, pick up the phone and make some calls for a therapist because in that case you really do need one. What qualifies you to tell someone they need a therapist? The OP has a valid complaint. They do have ways of going back and tracking what a character has done through its life, hell they sent a few years of our data to another company they have been saving. Problem is that if they actually did go back and sift through all that data for everyone it would take a tremendous amount of time so as usual we are going to get absolutely nothing for the time and money we vets have put into the game xcept an I'm sorry for your inconvenience and we understand your frustration, blah blah blah etc... Actually I am kind of getting used to it, its frustrating but not unexpected anymore. Many years of professional experience in the field qualifies me since you asked. That said, you are assuming that you know exactly what historical data the developers have access to when in reality you do not know this with any certainty at all. The fact that someone can cite various examples of restored data hardly proves that 100% of the data for 100% of the the events in this game since 2004 has all been carefully preserved in anticipation of this fine day. I'd also have to say that one wouldn't need any professional background to see clearly the obsessive need to get "recognition" in a computer game for what it is and with best of intentions suggest that individual get some help. Then again, you could argue that I ought to know better than to think they'd listen to that, particularly here, as opposed to remaining in denial and becoming highly defensive at the suggestion their view is anything less than absolutely correct and completely justified. It never hurts to plant seeds and try even against the odds is my response to that.

09-24-2009, 01:13 PM	#12
Lord Hackenslash Loremaster Join Date: Nov 2004 Posts: 496	What's the point of a race when everyone starts at the finish line? __________________

09-24-2009, 01:57 PM	#13
Sarriss Server: Oasis Guild: Keepers of the Oak Rank: Guardian of the Oak Loremaster Join Date: Jan 2005 Posts: 132	this was duscusses MANY MANY MANY MANY times as to why this happened, there was even a poll about it in that same discussion thread http://forums.station.sony.com/eq2/...topic_id=458423 In short it would require too much in the way of resorces to sift through every quest to find out who did what, and even then it would not get everything.. The system hasno record of me ever setting foot in the commonlands, when I started in freeport back in 2004 and live there to this day (so, yea, I've been to the commonlands) here me whining, nope. I'm running through the commonlands trying to remember where the heck some of thes POIs are (I swear they have moved them) PS; if you didn't vote on the poll, go to your bathroom, look at the mirror, and complain to the guy in it.

09-24-2009, 06:07 PM	#14
ke'la Loremaster Join Date: Dec 2004 Posts: 5,445	CoLD MeTaL wrote: Atan@Unrest wrote: Brook wrote: Problem is that if they actually did go back and sift through all that data for everyone it would take a tremendous amount of time so as usual we are going to get absolutely nothing for the time and money we vets have put into the game xcept an I'm sorry for your inconvenience and we understand your frustration, blah blah blah etc... The CPU/Database time needed to do this per character is simply not a realistic sollution. You might be shocked how long that would take to run per character, much less per account, or per server. Actually I don't think it would be that much to process a server log "ONCE" and scatter the achievements out to each character. Now if you said "There is no money in it" I would have agreed with that, old timers aren't gonna unsub over this and SOE knows as time has proven that they can ***** us and go on. Now that i know there is a 'call to mara' and a few items that are NOT pure fluff, this is upsetting. Oh well, as Vonnegut said, "So it goes." Have you ever accually looked at your chat log on your computer? Or ANY event log from ANY computer system? They are almost always logged in ASCII format(Text) as that creates the smallest possable uncompressed file(logs can't be compressed cause they are constantly appended to). You try running a Script that goes though the Terrabytes of Logs they have stored for our charactors and parce them on a per charactor baisis, it also has to be ether an Active script because we can't miss that Named you killed 15secs befor the server went down for its this update, or it could only be run After the servers went down, extending the downtime by HUGE amounts as it parced all that information. Yes they can go back and look at the logs and see if you have done a SPECIFIC thing, but they have some help in that.. First they have the name of the Charactor that did it, they have a Date/Time range when it was done, and they have the specific event that they need to look for. So they look though the log on Aug 13, 2009 between 11:30am PST and 12:30pm PST, for a charactor named John, for the line "You Killed Darathar" line. That all can be done in about 10 mins cause it is looking for ONE event in a VERY limited timeframe, for ONE charactor. Now lets see what they would have to do to get ONE PLAYER every achievment they accompished sence they started playing. First the would have to repeat the above Search 100s of times per player one for every event that gives players Achivements. They would have to expained the Timeframe so instead of looking at ONE hour of the log, they would have to look ~42,720 hours of the log* aka the whole thing. So assuming the Search I talked about above takes about 1 second(I seriously doupt it is anywhere near this fast, probly more like a few mins.). Multiply that 100 times for each search, and as the timeframe is 42k+ times larger you have to account for that as well, so lets increase the search time per query 420 times to account for that, so now we have 420 sec per query, that means each toon would take about 42,000* secs to populate its Achievment UI. Thats nearly 12 hours per toon. Do you really think anyone would put up with the servers down for 12 hours, assuming they had the processing power to query every single charactor in game at the same time? Thats hundreds of thousands of charactors(cause it is every charactor of every player that has EVER logged in to this game sence it launched). * 5 years x 365 days/year x 24 hours/day = 42,720 hours got that by adding 0.001 secs to the search for every HOUR of addtional log required to search.* 420sec x 100 possable Achivements(there are more then this) __________________

09-24-2009, 06:20 PM	#15
salty21db Loremaster Join Date: Mar 2008 Posts: 337	As i say in almost all my replies/posts now.....GAMERS COMPLAIN NO MATTER WHAT There is no argueing with them...no reasoning with them...no having them see your point of view...for the most part they are just upset people and use this as a outlet or any game as a outlet for their frustrations in life.

09-24-2009, 08:40 PM	#16
Queen Alexandria Loremaster Join Date: Nov 2004 Posts: 221	I need therapy. __________________

09-24-2009, 09:01 PM	#17
Armawk Server: Everfrost Guild: Nos Es Rutilus Rank: Tirones Loremaster Join Date: Nov 2006 Posts: 2,240	It IS a great shame, and I might have been one to opt for 'no retrospective if you cant do it completely', but I think they had to decide and probably decided right on a purely 'how many people will be happy or upset' basis. As for a log search for events to allocate this stuff.. it sounds like an enormous task and I would doubt a reliable result could ever be achieved anyway.

09-24-2009, 09:19 PM	#18
Rannc Server: Befallen General Join Date: Mar 2005 Posts: 26	Melina@Splitpaw wrote: What's the point of a race when everyone starts at the finish line? Who said it was a race? I thought this was just something for fun? You mean we need to win and most of us have already lost?

09-24-2009, 09:56 PM	#19
MyleeSilverwings Loremaster Join Date: Nov 2004 Posts: 110	Yes, it is probably unfair ... but me?? I only ask for Antonia Bayle to remain online for a night without crashing multiple times! All the rest is gravy!

09-24-2009, 10:19 PM	#20
Squeezy Plushtoy Loremaster Join Date: Nov 2004 Posts: 2	I am in agreement with the OP. I have been through almost all of the content with exception to some TSO. One person made the snazzy comment about running around commonlands and getting PoI's and it was no huge deal. Sure, running around for PoI's is easy... what about going back to get mobs in raid zones that you killed a million times with a great guild that you can't easily go back and get anymore cause -gasp- you aren't raiding anymore? Basically what SOE is telling me is "Sorry, but since you busted your booty a long time ago it doesn't count and we don't care cause we just now decided to give you rewards for it. But only if you waste time to go back and do it over, which means you waste more time wen you could be moving on to other things. So go back and do it again cause we don't even want to TRY to fix it for people who have been long standing customers and likely have more than one account. We just don't care" Running around for PoI's is one thing. But when you are no longer able to go back and kill mobs that you could when you were a part of a guild that cleared that content so easy, really pisses you off. Its not an option. And to sit here and see all your guildies log in and get reward after reward for things YOU DID already really freaking sux. For example.... how can I be an 80 crafter on 3 of my characters, a level 70 and 60 on a few others and NOT have 1,000 combines on any? And the meter tells me I don't even have even one combine recorded... ON ANY OF THOSE CHARACTERS!? I have killed every raid mob in RoK and almost every one before yet some of those are not credited. And the ones that aren't, I can't easily go back and get. Normally I shrug things off that most people complain about... and I never post to complain here... but when I sit back and seriously consider quitting a game I have played since launch and the game prior... the money I spent non-stop from then till now (which makes me realize now that its a waste cause I am getting crap with this new system) I realize how much BS this is. Everytime they add something new, its almost like they are finding a new way to screw the veterans. I know thats not how it really it but thats the way it ends up. I am ready to throw in the towel and say screw SoE. This is ridiculous. Yes this is just a game.. were it free then I would care a bit less and find a way, maybe, to go back and redo it. But it isn't. I pay for this 'game' I spent a lot of time and money to get the achievements that I am now not being rewarded for and yet people who havent done half of what I have feel the need to tell others they have no reason to complain and be upset. If you aren't upset, yay for you. I am. Many are and we have every right to be. There is no way I want to go back and REDO content on all my level 80's. Thats upsurd. __________________ Char art by Me; Sig Layout by Rachel 80 Dirge of Antonia Bayle 80 Mystic of Antonia Bayle 80 Bruiser of Antoina Bayle 73 Warden of Antonia Bayle 70 Illusionist of Antonia Bayle ... and then some

09-24-2009, 10:22 PM	#21
Aurel Book Goddess Join Date: Mar 2006 Location: The Bazaar Posts: 669	There are plenty enough topics on this already. I think they get the point, you guys are frustrated... I am sure back in the beginning of EQ2, if they had known 1) that they would add an AAXP system and 2) that they would later on then add an achievement system, then they would have started tracking all of this from the very beginning. Unfortunately, they didn't know back then that this would come around. You are basically scolding them for not knowing the future. shrug __________________

09-25-2009, 12:27 AM	#22
Gortha General Join Date: Nov 2004 Posts: 64	I find it quite interesting that so many people are upset over getting "screwed out of rewards" - what rewards exactly ? achievements award points that you cant spend on anything, and dont DO anything for you. I simply dont understand why "bragging rights" are SO important to people. if the points could be spent somehow, I'd be just as angry - but honestly aside from bragging rights and a few fluff items, what has been denied you? ...nothing...

09-25-2009, 01:08 AM	#23
ke'la Loremaster Join Date: Dec 2004 Posts: 5,445	Squeezy Plushtoy wrote: I am in agreement with the OP. I have been through almost all of the content with exception to some TSO. One person made the snazzy comment about running around commonlands and getting PoI's and it was no huge deal. Sure, running around for PoI's is easy... what about going back to get mobs in raid zones that you killed a million times with a great guild that you can't easily go back and get anymore cause -gasp- you aren't raiding anymore? Basically what SOE is telling me is "Sorry, but since you busted your booty a long time ago it doesn't count and we don't care cause we just now decided to give you rewards for it. But only if you waste time to go back and do it over, which means you waste more time wen you could be moving on to other things. So go back and do it again cause we don't even want to TRY to fix it for people who have been long standing customers and likely have more than one account. We just don't care" No what they are saying by doing give as much retroactive as they resonably can with out spending Man-years looking through Terrabytes of logs for every single charactor ever played by anyone is. "We understand you worked very hard to kill those mobs and we will do the best we can to get you credit, but it is simply not feasable to get you credit for everything". The FACT that they had MULTIPLE threads on this subject befor it went live INCLUDING a PLAYER POLL that resulted in an OVERWHELMING majority vote for exsactly what they implemented. Means not only do they understand exsactly what the issue is, but they where in fact listening to the players and doing the best they can. Running around for PoI's is one thing. But when you are no longer able to go back and kill mobs that you could when you were a part of a guild that cleared that content so easy, really pisses you off. Its not an option. And to sit here and see all your guildies log in and get reward after reward for things YOU DID already really freaking sux. For example.... how can I be an 80 crafter on 3 of my characters, a level 70 and 60 on a few others and NOT have 1,000 combines on any? And the meter tells me I don't even have even one combine recorded... ON ANY OF THOSE CHARACTERS!? I have killed every raid mob in RoK and almost every one before yet some of those are not credited. And the ones that aren't, I can't easily go back and get. Because there is no record* of you doing those things, because PRIOR to this being added to the game there was no need or reason to record such information. Now they could spend litteral Man-years parcing there Terabytes worth of logges and to record every single little achivement you could possably have gotten, leaving the servers down the whole time ofcourse, as that is the only way to get EVERYTHING. Or they could do the best they could at giving you the Achivements you earned. Normally I shrug things off that most people complain about... and I never post to complain here... but when I sit back and seriously consider quitting a game I have played since launch and the game prior... the money I spent non-stop from then till now (which makes me realize now that its a waste cause I am getting crap with this new system) I realize how much BS this is. Everytime they add something new, its almost like they are finding a new way to screw the veterans. I know thats not how it really it but thats the way it ends up. I am ready to throw in the towel and say screw SoE. This is ridiculous. You do know that every Named mob you have not gotten an Achivement for also has NEVER granted you AAxp right? That means while all your "Guild Mates" have to scape and claw for AAxp when SoF launchs you have a ready made list of MoBs to go hit that WILL grant you AAxp when you kill them. Yes this is just a game.. were it free then I would care a bit less and find a way, maybe, to go back and redo it. But it isn't. I pay for this 'game' I spent a lot of time and money to get the achievements that I am now not being rewarded for and yet people who havent done half of what I have feel the need to tell others they have no reason to complain and be upset. If you aren't upset, yay for you. I am. Many are and we have every right to be. There is no way I want to go back and REDO content on all my level 80's. Thats upsurd. Then don't other then Braging rights, a few fluff items, and AAxp(once SoF launches) there really is no reason to do any of the achievments if you don't want to. As far as not having a reason to be upset, um how this was going to be implimented was known more or less sence mid-August, I think the time to be upset about it has LONG past. *Just to be clear, yes they do log EVERYTHING, however parcing a log like that is far more difficult then having a seperate record of what specific things you have done. One is just a list of specific things you have done, the other is a listing of absolutly EVERYTHING you have done. One can be more or less cut and pasted in to the new listing, the other would have to first be parced on a Charactor by Charactor basis going back 5years, and doing that befor the servers would be able to come back up. Do you Really think it is possable in any kind of reasonable amount of time to parce ASCII Files Terrabytes in size, Hundreds of thousands of times(once for each charactor that has ever been created) in any amount of time that players would except as a reasonable down time? __________________

09-25-2009, 02:30 AM	#24
Gungo Loremaster Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Crushbone Posts: 5,378	just to be crystal clear on how pathetic people crying about these updates are. In the 2 days since the patch i have finished EVERY SINGLE POIEVERY SINGLE GENERAL (except slayers)EVERY SINGLE QUEST (except Holiday and 4000 quests)I SOLOED EVERY RAID in t5/t6 including splitpaw (except djinn mster need 3 people at least)EVERY crafting mission (need 1000 Combines) I did this in 2 days with my server down most of yesterday evening.Working on the dugeons now.

09-25-2009, 03:08 AM	#25
Bindsya_Wounds Loremaster Join Date: Dec 2004 Posts: 1	I can understand this happening with the exploration and stuff , but were talking about T8 raid mobs and not getting credit for those. Not silly T4 and T5 ones that you can Brag about soloing. Also its not just bragging rights you gain , for example I recieved a void portal that takes me directly to Palace .. thats quite a long run really LOL . So the folks that have completed the shard zones and didnt even get that , yeah I can see why they are upset. I just want credited for the T8 raid mobs I did ... LOL Killed Byzola the day before patch ... /sigh I can agree though someone had mentioned in this topic that theres always someone to complain and you are right , they cant make us all happy but I just feel like this is a big deal. ... Ok im done rambline , just wanted to toss my 2 cents in. Jozalin / Josalyn Mistmoore

09-25-2009, 03:20 AM	#26
Queen Alexandria Loremaster Join Date: Nov 2004 Posts: 221	Gungo wrote: just to be crystal clear on how pathetic people crying about these updates are. In the 2 days since the patch i have finished EVERY SINGLE POIEVERY SINGLE GENERAL (except slayers)EVERY SINGLE QUEST (except Holiday and 4000 quests)I SOLOED EVERY RAID in t5/t6 including splitpaw (except djinn mster need 3 people at least)EVERY crafting mission (need 1000 Combines) I did this in 2 days with my server down most of yesterday evening.Working on the dugeons now. Grats dude. You want to join me in therapy? Thats a lot of gaming in two days. __________________

09-25-2009, 04:07 AM	#27
ke'la Loremaster Join Date: Dec 2004 Posts: 5,445	Bindsya_Wounds wrote: I can understand this happening with the exploration and stuff , but were talking about T8 raid mobs and not getting credit for those. Not silly T4 and T5 ones that you can Brag about soloing. Also its not just bragging rights you gain , for example I recieved a void portal that takes me directly to Palace .. thats quite a long run really LOL . So the folks that have completed the shard zones and didnt even get that , yeah I can see why they are upset. I just want credited for the T8 raid mobs I did ... LOL Killed Byzola the day before patch ... /sigh I can agree though someone had mentioned in this topic that theres always someone to complain and you are right , they cant make us all happy but I just feel like this is a big deal. ... Ok im done rambline , just wanted to toss my 2 cents in. Jozalin / Josalyn Mistmoore The reason your not getting credit for those is the same reason you didn't get credit for the T5 Raid Mobs, you never recieved AAxp for them. They can only give you credit if they have tracked it in the past. The only tracking system they had prior to the update was the what had already Granted you AAxp. Does it stink that you have to do SOME stuff again, while others don't yeah, but the only other options are: everyone having to do everything again the senario we are in now The servers still not up because they are still not done parcing the Terrabytes of logs they would have to go though to give you credit for everything. Which option would you prefure? __________________

09-25-2009, 09:31 AM	#28
Spritelady Loremaster Join Date: Jul 2005 Posts: 275	Regarding the Tradeskill Combines.... This info WAS tracked for EQ2Players, and a Dev commented on trying to "fix it so they were counted" back in the In Testing thread on the subject. Apparently that fell through. The one that really annoys me is having to kill Aiden again. I have the stupid earring from the quest, i couldn't have that if I hadn't killed Aiden =) __________________ Shianne Level 90 Fury Dracos Reborn - Butcherblock Server

09-25-2009, 10:19 AM	#29
CoLD MeTaL Loremaster Join Date: Apr 2005 Posts: 3,217	kela wrote: {0} I have been a professional developer for more than 20 years, I know exactly what it would entail. You can say "Not cost effective" and you can say "Not worth the funds", but hard/difficult/whatever that is what work is. However customers should be taken care of, and if you are going to be asinine enough to introduce a system like this 5 years after the system has been put in place, you do the freaking work. half-a**ed doesn't even come close to how this was done, speaking as a developer. It's like converting an accoounting system and not making sure the balance sheet is right because it 'would take too much time'. __________________

09-25-2009, 11:00 AM	#30
bryldan Loremaster Join Date: May 2006 Posts: 692	CoLD MeTaL wrote: kela wrote: {0} I have been a professional developer for more than 20 years, I know exactly what it would entail. You can say "Not cost effective" and you can say "Not worth the funds", but hard/difficult/whatever that is what work is. However customers should be taken care of, and if you are going to be asinine enough to introduce a system like this 5 years after the system has been put in place, you do the freaking work. half-a**ed doesn't even come close to how this was done, speaking as a developer. It's like converting an accoounting system and not making sure the balance sheet is right because it 'would take too much time'. If they did this we would have more ppl complaining/DEMANDING money back from the servers being down a few days would that be reasonable for you to get credit on a few things that takes minutes to go do? In those three days of downtime instead of not playing you could have gone and done everything that you were missing so look at it that way.