DPS Potential?

Kilil · 08-11-2009, 03:40 PM

Coming back to EQ2 here. Haven't seen endgame content yet but I'm planning on taking either a mystic or Inquis there. Wondering with the right spec and gear what is the potential dps of a Mystic? I plan on healing but know there will be situations that I can support/backup heal and dps. I saw mention of someone at 9k dps, is this possible?

TYVM

Kil~

Banditman · 08-11-2009, 04:01 PM

I believe the current worldwide record is 12k. I've done 7k, but neither of those are really an answer. The question is one of perspective.

My Mystic did 7k in a raid putting out ~140k DPS. He wasn't casting heals at all, though he did have some "on attack" style healing procs going. He used a combination of T2 and T3 armor and jewelry, and was swinging the Supple Dogwood Staff from Nexona. The Troub in my group was doing 8k, I remember that distinctly, but I cannot recall who the other group members were.

Inquisitors properly spec'ed are likely capable of equivalent things. It's all so situational that you can't give an accurate answer.

To be honest, pick whatever healer class you like that isn't a Druid and you'll be a desired member of any raid force. Even Druids would be fine, except that there are just so bloody many of them you can't take a step without squishing a couple.

Kilil · 08-11-2009, 04:55 PM

What is the average or respectable dps for pure damage classes?

TYVM

Kil~

Adegx · 08-11-2009, 05:09 PM

impossible question. Which class we talking about? For example an assassin will have a much higher average than just about any other class. Even then it comes down to gear, AA's, and to some extent the player.

Banditman · 08-11-2009, 06:11 PM

I could tell you Assassins can do 27k and would you know anything more than you know now? Not really, because you need perspective to understand that. If I then told you the Assassin was in an Avatar geared guild, doing 250k raidwide DPS, you might better understand it.

. . . and once again, situation. The bottom line is that while EQ2 does have some problems, overall, the game is pretty well balanced. Yes, there are some issues that need to be addressed, but few games offer so many classes and problems certainly do arise from that.

Play the class you like is the bottom line.

Kilil · 08-11-2009, 06:29 PM

Well, not knowing endgame I prolly dont know the correct questions to ask SMILEY My question was directed towards relative dps. Against like geared toons is a mystic able to reach good dps or are we very low regardless. Maybe 30% of pure dps classes?

I enjoy playing classes that can do multiple jobs like tank/dps or heal/dps depending on the situation.

Is this comment true? Mystics can dps small group content but don't come close to raid dps standards? If it is not true please correct it as you see fit SMILEY

TYVM

Kil~

StaticLex · 08-11-2009, 08:15 PM

Banditman wrote:

To be honest, pick whatever healer class you like that isn't a Druid and you'll be a desired member of any raid force. Even Druids would be fine, except that there are just so bloody many of them you can't take a step without squishing a couple.

Hey now! rofl

I probably see just as many templars running around as druids actually, although the fury class seems to have fallen off the map compared to wardens. Anyway, mystic and inquis seem rare to me so if you're down to play an uncommon class, it probably wouldn't hurt to stick with what you have.

Arcanemundi · 08-11-2009, 11:13 PM

I did 7795 DPS a couple nights ago, but I think it was because I had a lot of DPS gear on and was in the right group.

Swashbuckler

Berserker (Bloodlust +STR) (Warcry - Berserk)

Templar (Virtue +STR)

Coercer (Breeze + 15% Casting Haste w/4 Set) (Peace of Mind Damage Proc)

Dirge (Blade Chime +Attack Speed) (Crypt's Revenge +Disease Proc) (Carcophony of Blades +Attack Speed)

Most of them were completely mastered, and very geared out.

Alternatively:

Inquisitor might give more DPS: (Fanatical Devotion & Strike of Faith)

Banditman · 08-12-2009, 10:05 AM

Kilil wrote:

Well, not knowing endgame I prolly dont know the correct questions to ask My question was directed towards relative dps. Against like geared toons is a mystic able to reach good dps or are we very low regardless. Maybe 30% of pure dps classes?
I enjoy playing classes that can do multiple jobs like tank/dps or heal/dps depending on the situation.
Is this comment true? Mystics can dps small group content but don't come close to raid dps standards? If it is not true please correct it as you see fit
TYVM
Kil~

Mystics can DPS most group content, but you will never be asked into a group for that role. There are other classes who do it far better. Mystics solo well . . . not to the level of a Fury, but they are good enough to get you where you need to be.

A Fury is a far better dual role class, once they reach the level cap. Again, the problem there is that there are just so many of them around.

The most important thing you can do is decide what role you want to play. I hear you, you want to play two roles. Great, but it's not reality. I personally have five level capped characters so that I can pretty much fill whatever role I want to on any given night. That's the reality.

Every now and then, I'll get into a situation where a zone might require two healers for one or two fights, but a single healer can handle it otherwise. In that case, my Mystic works out well. I can play a DPS role for most of the zone, but heal for the fights that need help.

The real problem is that a Mystic is such a good healer where in most situations I can handle ALL the healing and the group would be better off leaving that second healer at home, bringing another DPS and getting through that much faster.

The other pain point I haven't mentioned yet is gear.

If you want to DPS as a Mystic, or any of the healer classes, you're going to need two completely different sets of gear. That gets time consuming and costly to accrue, let me tell you! Again, no different than any other healing class, you just have to be aware that if you try to DPS in your standard healing gear, it's going to be weaksauce. Take a look at the "Melodic" type of Mastercrafted armor sometime, you'll see what I mean. It's pretty decent when you're leveling.

Adegx · 08-12-2009, 11:06 AM

In a group situation, you'll only be asked in to do one thing, heal. If you show up as a for example an inq. And are like I can tank good. Yea...i instantly start thinking about finding an excuse to drop group. We have one like that on our server....it did not go well.

All classes in Eq2 can solo. And thus bring some dps. But stick to what your good at. Buff, heal, Support the group and let the true dps classes your supporting shine.

Morghus · 08-12-2009, 11:15 AM

Raz_wolf wrote:

In a group situation, you'll only be asked in to do one thing, heal. If you show up as a for example an inq. And are like I can tank good. Yea...i instantly start thinking about finding an excuse to drop group. We have one like that on our server....it did not go well.
All classes in Eq2 can solo. And thus bring some dps. But stick to what your good at. Buff, heal, Support the group and let the true dps classes your supporting shine.

True, a healer's main purpose is to heal/debuff but if they can throw out extra dps without hindering their main goal there is no reason they shouldnt unless the ideas of buff/healbot are so ingrained to the individual. Some fights it can be impossible/impractical but on others it would not be detrimental. Every bit of dps helps to kill the mob that much faster, leaving less room for any sudden problems like spikes or power issues and the faster they die the less healing is required.

Adegx · 08-12-2009, 11:28 AM

I didn't say don't turn on auto attack. If you can get a few licks in between the heals, buffs, debuffs then by all means do so. Just not to the determent of the group or your job.

In a group situation a good healer that keeps the tank up, And thusly a good tank that can focus on just holding hate, instead of surviving. Will allow the dps to go all out. Any dps class, especially assassins that can go "all out" will bring so much more dps than you will ever be capable of. I know its kind of a hard concept, but think of it as you doing indirect dps.

Groups work better as a well oiled machine. The sum of all its parts working in perfect unison to achieve the goal.

Typically groups that don't work well together and try to preform outside their role wipe. Or in the very least end up not being fun.

Kilil · 08-12-2009, 02:04 PM

How about this, lets say heals are taken care of. How will a Mystic or Inquis perform in a full dps role? And where will they be on the dps scale relative to other classes? If a Mystic can not fill a dps role they just simply can't and that is acceptable but with 10 years of MMO experience I have seen people take classes and do things they weren't intended to very successfully. At this point in the game I'm sure that everything has been tried.

Back to my original question, what is our potential if able to fully dps? Where do we stand relative to other dps classes?

TYVM

Blood~

Banditman · 08-12-2009, 02:51 PM

If heals are taken care of, you will not be asked into the group. You will not be able to do the job of a DPS class. Then again, no healer can really do that.

As it should be.

If you want to DPS, roll one of those.

It sounds as if you are having trouble deciding which role you want to play at end game. While that is understandable, it's pretty important to figure out before you get there.

If you roll a healer, you are going to heal at end game. No second guesses. No "if heals are taken care of". An endgame healer gets groups as a healer, not as a DPS class. There are a lot of Furies out there right now who have found this out the hard way.

Adegx · 08-12-2009, 06:40 PM

Bandit is spot on. I've sorta been thinking this in so few words. Decide what role you want to furfill and then strive to be the best at it. Don't try to be something your not. Normally you'll just fail at both that way.

Kilil · 08-12-2009, 07:00 PM

Banditman wrote:

If heals are taken care of, you will not be asked into the group. You will not be able to do the job of a DPS class. Then again, no healer can really do that.

This is what I was looking for. TYVM for the responses.

Kilil~

08-11-2009, 04:01 PM	#2
Banditman Loremaster Join Date: Nov 2004 Posts: 7,459	I believe the current worldwide record is 12k. I've done 7k, but neither of those are really an answer. The question is one of perspective. My Mystic did 7k in a raid putting out ~140k DPS. He wasn't casting heals at all, though he did have some "on attack" style healing procs going. He used a combination of T2 and T3 armor and jewelry, and was swinging the Supple Dogwood Staff from Nexona. The Troub in my group was doing 8k, I remember that distinctly, but I cannot recall who the other group members were. Inquisitors properly spec'ed are likely capable of equivalent things. It's all so situational that you can't give an accurate answer. To be honest, pick whatever healer class you like that isn't a Druid and you'll be a desired member of any raid force. Even Druids would be fine, except that there are just so bloody many of them you can't take a step without squishing a couple. __________________

08-11-2009, 06:11 PM	#5
Banditman Loremaster Join Date: Nov 2004 Posts: 7,459	I could tell you Assassins can do 27k and would you know anything more than you know now? Not really, because you need perspective to understand that. If I then told you the Assassin was in an Avatar geared guild, doing 250k raidwide DPS, you might better understand it. . . . and once again, situation. The bottom line is that while EQ2 does have some problems, overall, the game is pretty well balanced. Yes, there are some issues that need to be addressed, but few games offer so many classes and problems certainly do arise from that. Play the class you like is the bottom line. __________________

08-11-2009, 06:29 PM	#6
Kilil Loremaster Join Date: Nov 2004 Posts: 76	Well, not knowing endgame I prolly dont know the correct questions to ask My question was directed towards relative dps. Against like geared toons is a mystic able to reach good dps or are we very low regardless. Maybe 30% of pure dps classes? I enjoy playing classes that can do multiple jobs like tank/dps or heal/dps depending on the situation. Is this comment true? Mystics can dps small group content but don't come close to raid dps standards? If it is not true please correct it as you see fit TYVM Kil~

08-11-2009, 08:15 PM	#7
StaticLex Loremaster Join Date: Nov 2004 Location: USA Posts: 1,230	Banditman wrote: To be honest, pick whatever healer class you like that isn't a Druid and you'll be a desired member of any raid force. Even Druids would be fine, except that there are just so bloody many of them you can't take a step without squishing a couple. Hey now! rofl I probably see just as many templars running around as druids actually, although the fury class seems to have fallen off the map compared to wardens. Anyway, mystic and inquis seem rare to me so if you're down to play an uncommon class, it probably wouldn't hurt to stick with what you have. __________________ When you've played this game for ten years and gone to bat seven-thousand times and gotten two-thousand hits do you know what that really means? It means you've gone zero for five-thousand. --- Reggie Jackson

08-12-2009, 10:05 AM	#9
Banditman Loremaster Join Date: Nov 2004 Posts: 7,459	Kilil wrote: Well, not knowing endgame I prolly dont know the correct questions to ask My question was directed towards relative dps. Against like geared toons is a mystic able to reach good dps or are we very low regardless. Maybe 30% of pure dps classes? I enjoy playing classes that can do multiple jobs like tank/dps or heal/dps depending on the situation. Is this comment true? Mystics can dps small group content but don't come close to raid dps standards? If it is not true please correct it as you see fit TYVM Kil~ Mystics can DPS most group content, but you will never be asked into a group for that role. There are other classes who do it far better. Mystics solo well . . . not to the level of a Fury, but they are good enough to get you where you need to be. A Fury is a far better dual role class, once they reach the level cap. Again, the problem there is that there are just so many of them around. The most important thing you can do is decide what role you want to play. I hear you, you want to play two roles. Great, but it's not reality. I personally have five level capped characters so that I can pretty much fill whatever role I want to on any given night. That's the reality. Every now and then, I'll get into a situation where a zone might require two healers for one or two fights, but a single healer can handle it otherwise. In that case, my Mystic works out well. I can play a DPS role for most of the zone, but heal for the fights that need help. The real problem is that a Mystic is such a good healer where in most situations I can handle ALL the healing and the group would be better off leaving that second healer at home, bringing another DPS and getting through that much faster. The other pain point I haven't mentioned yet is gear. If you want to DPS as a Mystic, or any of the healer classes, you're going to need two completely different sets of gear. That gets time consuming and costly to accrue, let me tell you! Again, no different than any other healing class, you just have to be aware that if you try to DPS in your standard healing gear, it's going to be weaksauce. Take a look at the "Melodic" type of Mastercrafted armor sometime, you'll see what I mean. It's pretty decent when you're leveling. __________________

08-11-2009, 03:40 PM	#1
Kilil Loremaster Join Date: Nov 2004 Posts: 76	Coming back to EQ2 here. Haven't seen endgame content yet but I'm planning on taking either a mystic or Inquis there. Wondering with the right spec and gear what is the potential dps of a Mystic? I plan on healing but know there will be situations that I can support/backup heal and dps. I saw mention of someone at 9k dps, is this possible? TYVM Kil~

08-11-2009, 04:55 PM	#3
Kilil Loremaster Join Date: Nov 2004 Posts: 76	What is the average or respectable dps for pure damage classes? TYVM Kil~

08-11-2009, 05:09 PM	#4
Adegx Server: Permafrost Guild: League of the Extraordinary Rank: KNIGHTS Loremaster Join Date: Dec 2004 Posts: 276	impossible question. Which class we talking about? For example an assassin will have a much higher average than just about any other class. Even then it comes down to gear, AA's, and to some extent the player.

08-11-2009, 11:13 PM	#8
Arcanemundi Server: Antonia Bayle Guild: Electus Vir Rank: Order of Electus Vir ~ Senior Raider Loremaster Join Date: Jan 2007 Posts: 92	I did 7795 DPS a couple nights ago, but I think it was because I had a lot of DPS gear on and was in the right group. Swashbuckler Berserker (Bloodlust +STR) (Warcry - Berserk) Templar (Virtue +STR) Coercer (Breeze + 15% Casting Haste w/4 Set) (Peace of Mind Damage Proc) Dirge (Blade Chime +Attack Speed) (Crypt's Revenge +Disease Proc) (Carcophony of Blades +Attack Speed) Most of them were completely mastered, and very geared out. Alternatively: Inquisitor might give more DPS: (Fanatical Devotion & Strike of Faith)

08-12-2009, 11:06 AM	#10
Adegx Server: Permafrost Guild: League of the Extraordinary Rank: KNIGHTS Loremaster Join Date: Dec 2004 Posts: 276	In a group situation, you'll only be asked in to do one thing, heal. If you show up as a for example an inq. And are like I can tank good. Yea...i instantly start thinking about finding an excuse to drop group. We have one like that on our server....it did not go well. All classes in Eq2 can solo. And thus bring some dps. But stick to what your good at. Buff, heal, Support the group and let the true dps classes your supporting shine.

08-12-2009, 11:15 AM	#11
Morghus Loremaster Join Date: Oct 2007 Posts: 2,105	Raz_wolf wrote: In a group situation, you'll only be asked in to do one thing, heal. If you show up as a for example an inq. And are like I can tank good. Yea...i instantly start thinking about finding an excuse to drop group. We have one like that on our server....it did not go well. All classes in Eq2 can solo. And thus bring some dps. But stick to what your good at. Buff, heal, Support the group and let the true dps classes your supporting shine. True, a healer's main purpose is to heal/debuff but if they can throw out extra dps without hindering their main goal there is no reason they shouldnt unless the ideas of buff/healbot are so ingrained to the individual. Some fights it can be impossible/impractical but on others it would not be detrimental. Every bit of dps helps to kill the mob that much faster, leaving less room for any sudden problems like spikes or power issues and the faster they die the less healing is required.

08-12-2009, 11:28 AM	#12
Adegx Server: Permafrost Guild: League of the Extraordinary Rank: KNIGHTS Loremaster Join Date: Dec 2004 Posts: 276	I didn't say don't turn on auto attack. If you can get a few licks in between the heals, buffs, debuffs then by all means do so. Just not to the determent of the group or your job. In a group situation a good healer that keeps the tank up, And thusly a good tank that can focus on just holding hate, instead of surviving. Will allow the dps to go all out. Any dps class, especially assassins that can go "all out" will bring so much more dps than you will ever be capable of. I know its kind of a hard concept, but think of it as you doing indirect dps. Groups work better as a well oiled machine. The sum of all its parts working in perfect unison to achieve the goal. Typically groups that don't work well together and try to preform outside their role wipe. Or in the very least end up not being fun.

08-12-2009, 02:04 PM	#13
Kilil Loremaster Join Date: Nov 2004 Posts: 76	How about this, lets say heals are taken care of. How will a Mystic or Inquis perform in a full dps role? And where will they be on the dps scale relative to other classes? If a Mystic can not fill a dps role they just simply can't and that is acceptable but with 10 years of MMO experience I have seen people take classes and do things they weren't intended to very successfully. At this point in the game I'm sure that everything has been tried. Back to my original question, what is our potential if able to fully dps? Where do we stand relative to other dps classes? TYVM Blood~

08-12-2009, 02:51 PM	#14
Banditman Loremaster Join Date: Nov 2004 Posts: 7,459	If heals are taken care of, you will not be asked into the group. You will not be able to do the job of a DPS class. Then again, no healer can really do that. As it should be. If you want to DPS, roll one of those. It sounds as if you are having trouble deciding which role you want to play at end game. While that is understandable, it's pretty important to figure out before you get there. If you roll a healer, you are going to heal at end game. No second guesses. No "if heals are taken care of". An endgame healer gets groups as a healer, not as a DPS class. There are a lot of Furies out there right now who have found this out the hard way. __________________

08-12-2009, 06:40 PM	#15
Adegx Server: Permafrost Guild: League of the Extraordinary Rank: KNIGHTS Loremaster Join Date: Dec 2004 Posts: 276	Bandit is spot on. I've sorta been thinking this in so few words. Decide what role you want to furfill and then strive to be the best at it. Don't try to be something your not. Normally you'll just fail at both that way.

08-12-2009, 07:00 PM	#16
Kilil Loremaster Join Date: Nov 2004 Posts: 76	Banditman wrote: If heals are taken care of, you will not be asked into the group. You will not be able to do the job of a DPS class. Then again, no healer can really do that. This is what I was looking for. TYVM for the responses. Kilil~