Drum of the Ethernaut Chronicler NERFED!!! - Page 2

Fatuus · 06-05-2009, 09:42 AM

I am deeply saddened by the lack of care that is being shown to the bards in this update.

Quote from Aeralik:

Correct. This doesnt change things like luck of the dirge or blessings. If you can modify the proc rate of an item or spell now, you can still do it after this change.

Quote from Kiara:

The next thing you'll see in this update is that the values of the procs can no longer be modified, with a few notable exceptions like achievements or item set enhancements. Generic bonuses will no longer apply to triggered damage generated from items. This will allow us to move forward with creating items that can have higher damage item procs in the future.

This drum, and its affect, did not trigger higher damage...it lengthed the effect of procs and spells. It had positive and negative effects...but Aeralik's view was basically 'huh I didn't know it did that, changing it to affect songs.' Per what was written in the producer's letter and guidance given to us by SoE, the change was to affect the damage DONE to a mob, really this affect's a bards ability to DEBUFF and eeks out a little bit on our short term offensive buffs. This is the end item reward to what would be considered "THE" questline in TSO. How could Aeralik not know what that item did when he created it? It boggles my mind, especially since its been out for over 6 months and is listed as the best ranged item for dirges (probably troubs too) by people who KNOW how to play a dirge.

What's even sadder is EVERYONE who has posted in this forum has been extremely critical of this change. Its not inline with what the producers letter intent was as stated...and the new changes made by Aeralik (which were denounced harder by everyone in this forum) haven't recieved a comment or update in 3 days. But, he has lots of time ot post about the images used by necromancer pets in the forums.

Lastly the changes are not even posted in the test update notes that Kiara posted yesterday...basically meaning this is trying to be another stealth nerf to the bard class.

Hey lets start stealth nerfing everyone's mythical...it sounds like lots of fun!

Fix this Aeralik....fix it now man...this is just beyond words!

bryldan · 06-05-2009, 09:51 AM

Fatuus wrote:

I am deeply saddened by the lack of care that is being shown to the bards in this update.
Quote from Aeralik:
Correct. This doesnt change things like luck of the dirge or blessings. If you can modify the proc rate of an item or spell now, you can still do it after this change.
Quote from Kiara:
The next thing you'll see in this update is that the values of the procs can no longer be modified, with a few notable exceptions like achievements or item set enhancements. Generic bonuses will no longer apply to triggered damage generated from items. This will allow us to move forward with creating items that can have higher damage item procs in the future.
This drum, and its affect, did not trigger higher damage...it lengthed the effect of procs and spells. It had positive and negative effects...but Aeralik's view was basically 'huh I didn't know it did that, changing it to affect songs.' Per what was written in the producer's letter and guidance given to us by SoE, the change was to affect the damage DONE to a mob, really this affect's a bards ability to DEBUFF and eeks out a little bit on our short term offensive buffs. This is the end item reward to what would be considered "THE" questline in TSO. How could Aeralik not know what that item did when he created it? It boggles my mind, especially since its been out for over 6 months and is listed as the best ranged item for dirges (probably troubs too) by people who KNOW how to play a dirge.
What's even sadder is EVERYONE who has posted in this forum has been extremely critical of this change. Its not inline with what the producers letter intent was as stated...and the new changes made by Aeralik (which were denounced harder by everyone in this forum) haven't recieved a comment or update in 3 days. But, he has lots of time ot post about the images used by necromancer pets in the forums.
Lastly the changes are not even posted in the test update notes that Kiara posted yesterday...basically meaning this is trying to be another stealth nerf to the bard class.
Hey lets start stealth nerfing everyone's mythical...it sounds like lots of fun!
Fix this Aeralik....fix it now man...this is just beyond words!

You know this wouldnt happen if the item helped assassins!!!!!!

Hecula · 06-05-2009, 12:27 PM

Undo this change. I don't even play a bard but I can follow the line of objections in this thread and agree with them. That reward item is a seriously difficult item to attain - making it useless is pretty mean. I've played with many Dirges and Troubs on live with this item - I didn't feel it was doing something so amazing that it needed to be nerfed - especially into oblivion. If it does something other than the wording indicates - CHANGE THE WORDING NOT THE EFFECT - it's very simple.

Krooner · 06-05-2009, 05:01 PM

Hecula wrote " CHANGE THE WORDING NOT THE EFFECT - it's very simple.

This is exact same thing that happened with COB.

It began with "Provides a desease proc and interupt with every attack"

Which became something resembeling the warning label on a pack of smokes.

Argyuile · 06-05-2009, 06:09 PM

Are you implying that if I smoke I will get super powers?

Seriously though, don't touch this item or be prepared to give us refunds.

Leisu · 06-05-2009, 06:09 PM

Aeralik wrote:

I don't believe it was originally intended to increase the duration of proc spells since it refered to "songs" in the description. I did however fix it to no longer apply to damage dots which means its beneficial songs and debuff songs. Also because this is a drum, I added a little boost to Selo's Accelerando IV so your group can march a little faster into battle.

Screw it....it doesn't matter what i write. You're not going to listen anyways.

Sosum · 06-05-2009, 07:11 PM

Aeralik wrote:

I don't believe it was originally intended to increase the duration of proc spells since it refered to "songs" in the description. I did however fix it to no longer apply to damage dots which means its beneficial songs and debuff songs. Also because this is a drum, I added a little boost to Selo's Accelerando IV so your group can march a little faster into battle.

so this out ranked fixing summoners how? run speed was fine!

thecynic315 · 06-05-2009, 07:17 PM

Sosumya@Unrest wrote:

Aeralik wrote:
I don't believe it was originally intended to increase the duration of proc spells since it refered to "songs" in the description. I did however fix it to no longer apply to damage dots which means its beneficial songs and debuff songs. Also because this is a drum, I added a little boost to Selo's Accelerando IV so your group can march a little faster into battle.
so this out ranked fixing summoners how? run speed was fine!

Cause screwing up one working item took him all of Id say 30min-1hour. Fixing 2 classes that have been screwed for several years is A) not somehting you you really want him to do. You want to be fixed and adjusted properly, 2 things this Dev is not known for. B) I just realized that the mechanics dev is screwing up and item.....ummmmmmm this makes about as much sence as having Domino create a brand new UI for the game.

Fatuus · 06-10-2009, 09:02 AM

Aeralik,

It's been 5 days since I made my last post...and we have had 2 Test updates go thru. WILL YOU PLEASE listen to the bards posting here about how rediculous the changes you are making on this item are? We give you what you want...FEEDBACK...and everyone UNIVERSALLY states that this change is not only bad...but makes the item pointless now to even equip in its current form.

1) Why would you put a run speed buff on the weapon? WHY? And you wonder why the community gets upset when devs make ninja changes on major gear items (The amount of work to get this item is GREATER then the fabled Epic weapon version in RoK) and then never listen to the community that actually plays the characters.

2) When are you going to change other aspects of the bard buffs? Tomb Calm / Dead Calm still works off of Spell Crit instead of Melee crit....even though its a melee attack. You changed Chime of Blades...why not this spell so its more in line with melee players. IT ONLY HITS OFF OF MELEE ATTACKS!

Note: Kiara I am not attacking anyone here...simply pointing out a severe lack of communication on the part of the team here to communicate with the community on a topic of intense interest to ALL of the bard community. The fix he made to this item is simply terrible...ask any bard and they will easily...readilly...respond that its just that bad. I honestly do not know what he was thinking when he made the change.

thecynic315 · 06-10-2009, 01:52 PM

While we are looking for feedback from the Devs maybe we can get an aswer on why the changes to the Drum only seem to work on the T8 Debuffs. I checked all debuffs on CAs/Spells and only T8 was being effected by the Drum nothing else.

This means that A) the lvl 44 Daro's Master II that everyone uses as its superior to the T8 Adep III is not effected by the Drum, and B) means that theres a posiblilty that when T9 rolls around the Drum becomes even more usless, this is actualy quite a feat as the only way the Drum could be worse is if it casted a 10k DoT on the user that broke stealth.

Bruener · 06-10-2009, 01:53 PM

Wow, this whole post seems like a big joke.

Seriously, have the bards looked at the rest of the items from this quest? They are all junk for every other class. Bards werer the exception and for some reason came out with a very nice item. The changes SOE has made only brings this back in line with all the other items from the quest. A quest that is cake to finish and is "Heroic" fabled.

I think we can all agree that Bards do not in any way fall into the category of classes that need luvin.

Asif · 06-10-2009, 02:16 PM

Bruener wrote:

Wow, this whole post seems like a big joke.
Seriously, have the bards looked at the rest of the items from this quest? They are all junk for every other class. Bards werer the exception and for some reason came out with a very nice item. The changes SOE has made only brings this back in line with all the other items from the quest. A quest that is cake to finish and is "Heroic" fabled.
I think we can all agree that Bards do not in any way fall into the category of classes that need luvin.

Hmm maybe you should play one and come back to us .

Till you do play a bard i doubt anyone will listen to you !!!!

I do have a Conjy so i do know the mess they are in. ( See what i mean about playing the class)

Rayche · 06-10-2009, 02:19 PM

Bruener wrote:

Wow, this whole post seems like a big joke.
Seriously, have the bards looked at the rest of the items from this quest? They are all junk for every other class. Bards werer the exception and for some reason came out with a very nice item. The changes SOE has made only brings this back in line with all the other items from the quest. A quest that is cake to finish and is "Heroic" fabled.
I think we can all agree that Bards do not in any way fall into the category of classes that need luvin.

Waitaminute. You're bitter because the reward you got sucked, so the answer is to make the other rewards all suck?

That's just plain selfish.

Anyway, Bards are definitely in need of some lovin in many areas.

thecynic315 · 06-10-2009, 03:11 PM

Bruener wrote:

Wow, this whole post seems like a big joke.
Seriously, have the bards looked at the rest of the items from this quest? They are all junk for every other class. Bards werer the exception and for some reason came out with a very nice item. The changes SOE has made only brings this back in line with all the other items from the quest. A quest that is cake to finish and is "Heroic" fabled.
I think we can all agree that Bards do not in any way fall into the category of classes that need luvin.

Does your reward cause you to lose DPS due to anything other then not using a diffrent item in that slot? Cause thats what the orginal changes to the item caused Bards to do.

Bruener · 06-10-2009, 04:56 PM

Androw@Najena wrote:

Bruener wrote:
Wow, this whole post seems like a big joke.
Seriously, have the bards looked at the rest of the items from this quest? They are all junk for every other class. Bards werer the exception and for some reason came out with a very nice item. The changes SOE has made only brings this back in line with all the other items from the quest. A quest that is cake to finish and is "Heroic" fabled.
I think we can all agree that Bards do not in any way fall into the category of classes that need luvin.
Does your reward cause you to lose DPS due to anything other then not using a diffrent item in that slot? Cause thats what the orginal changes to the item caused Bards to do.

How so? You mean the fact that the original item gave you a gain to all of your DPS unlike every other reward out there?

This is a heroic quest line item reward. It is not hard to attain. With the change it is actually in line with that. It is still a better ranged item slot than any other heroic item you are going to get. So you still get an item that is useful for its attainability.

Now lets look at the options for fighters. Yeah, nobody is going to replace an epic with one of those weapons. Oh boy, the option for a cloak that is not as good as the cloak you get for finishing the line.

I am sorry, but complaints about this item not getting to be as uber as it was are all going to fall on deaf ears...for good reason.

thecynic315 · 06-10-2009, 05:20 PM

ruener wrote:

Androw@Najena wrote:
Bruener wrote:
Wow, this whole post seems like a big joke.
Seriously, have the bards looked at the rest of the items from this quest? They are all junk for every other class. Bards werer the exception and for some reason came out with a very nice item. The changes SOE has made only brings this back in line with all the other items from the quest. A quest that is cake to finish and is "Heroic" fabled.
I think we can all agree that Bards do not in any way fall into the category of classes that need luvin.
Does your reward cause you to lose DPS due to anything other then not using a diffrent item in that slot? Cause thats what the orginal changes to the item caused Bards to do.
How so? You mean the fact that the original item gave you a gain to all of your DPS unlike every other reward out there?
This is a heroic quest line item reward. It is not hard to attain. With the change it is actually in line with that. It is still a better ranged item slot than any other heroic item you are going to get. So you still get an item that is useful for its attainability.
Now lets look at the options for fighters. Yeah, nobody is going to replace an epic with one of those weapons. Oh boy, the option for a cloak that is not as good as the cloak you get for finishing the line.
I am sorry, but complaints about this item not getting to be as uber as it was are all going to fall on deaf ears...for good reason.

No I mean once the proc changes go through if you equiped your reward from the SIG quest would your DPS be reduced just by equiping the reward?

With the orginal proc changes the Drum caused a decrease in DPS just by equiping it because a 'SONG' is anything with a duration, like a DoT.

My newest complaint is that what Arelik SAYS he changed is not what the item is actualy doing. I have no thoughts that the Drum will be usfull at all after GU52, but if they are going to make a change then 'SONG' needs to mean any detrimental applied to a mob that has a duration, and any benifical temp buff that has a duration like the Drum states. On test only T8 debuffs, and SOME of our temp buffs are working at all.

Ramathorne · 06-10-2009, 05:25 PM

It really isn't better than any other range slot now. All the good stuff got removed and all the bad stayed, like lengthening our dots which hurt us on short fights. Several bows are better. We lose dps mod because we cannot adorn it and there is no damage at range from it. With the amount of jousting in raids most people should be swapping it out anyway. With that awsome run speed buff they added it is going to drop selo's if we do swap it out. I can execpt the nerf, fine I am used to it. Please remove or change the run speed addition so it doesn't drop selo's.

Cannon · 06-10-2009, 06:08 PM

Bruener wrote:

Androw@Najena wrote:
Bruener wrote:
Wow, this whole post seems like a big joke.
Seriously, have the bards looked at the rest of the items from this quest? They are all junk for every other class. Bards werer the exception and for some reason came out with a very nice item. The changes SOE has made only brings this back in line with all the other items from the quest. A quest that is cake to finish and is "Heroic" fabled.
I think we can all agree that Bards do not in any way fall into the category of classes that need luvin.
Does your reward cause you to lose DPS due to anything other then not using a diffrent item in that slot? Cause thats what the orginal changes to the item caused Bards to do.
How so? You mean the fact that the original item gave you a gain to all of your DPS unlike every other reward out there?
This is a heroic quest line item reward. It is not hard to attain. With the change it is actually in line with that. It is still a better ranged item slot than any other heroic item you are going to get. So you still get an item that is useful for its attainability.
Now lets look at the options for fighters. Yeah, nobody is going to replace an epic with one of those weapons. Oh boy, the option for a cloak that is not as good as the cloak you get for finishing the line.
I am sorry, but complaints about this item not getting to be as uber as it was are all going to fall on deaf ears...for good reason.

Since when does a heroic questline mean treasured gear? I say this is because there is no "Heroic" gear it is treasured, legendary or fabled. Also I thought the TSO line was a Signature Series much like Prismatic, Peacock, Claymore and Sword of Destiny quest lines. Could you go back to your class forum and raise a fuss over there!

Bruener · 06-10-2009, 08:44 PM

Playmea@Guk wrote:

Bruener wrote:
Androw@Najena wrote:
Bruener wrote:
Wow, this whole post seems like a big joke.
Seriously, have the bards looked at the rest of the items from this quest? They are all junk for every other class. Bards werer the exception and for some reason came out with a very nice item. The changes SOE has made only brings this back in line with all the other items from the quest. A quest that is cake to finish and is "Heroic" fabled.
I think we can all agree that Bards do not in any way fall into the category of classes that need luvin.
Does your reward cause you to lose DPS due to anything other then not using a diffrent item in that slot? Cause thats what the orginal changes to the item caused Bards to do.
How so? You mean the fact that the original item gave you a gain to all of your DPS unlike every other reward out there?
This is a heroic quest line item reward. It is not hard to attain. With the change it is actually in line with that. It is still a better ranged item slot than any other heroic item you are going to get. So you still get an item that is useful for its attainability.
Now lets look at the options for fighters. Yeah, nobody is going to replace an epic with one of those weapons. Oh boy, the option for a cloak that is not as good as the cloak you get for finishing the line.
I am sorry, but complaints about this item not getting to be as uber as it was are all going to fall on deaf ears...for good reason.
Since when does a heroic questline mean treasured gear? I say this is because there is no "Heroic" gear it is treasured, legendary or fabled. Also I thought the TSO line was a Signature Series much like Prismatic, Peacock, Claymore and Sword of Destiny quest lines. Could you go back to your class forum and raise a fuss over there!

Wrong, wrong, and wrong. Heroic questline means heroic gear. Meaning gear that is at par with heroic gear. Hence fabled items that drop in heroic zones are not as good as x4 fabled drops. Furthermore this is NOT a quest line like Prismatic, Peacock, Claymore and SoD. Those all had x4 encounters that had to be defeated in order to get the reward. It is more like the SoD pre-final reward and Thuuga questline...you know, "heroic" style rewards.

So, could you please stop pretending like this item should be better than what it is? Fix the bug and it is good.

ccarro · 06-10-2009, 09:59 PM

Bruener wrote:

Playmea@Guk wrote:
Bruener wrote:
Androw@Najena wrote:
Bruener wrote:
Wow, this whole post seems like a big joke.
Seriously, have the bards looked at the rest of the items from this quest? They are all junk for every other class. Bards werer the exception and for some reason came out with a very nice item. The changes SOE has made only brings this back in line with all the other items from the quest. A quest that is cake to finish and is "Heroic" fabled.
I think we can all agree that Bards do not in any way fall into the category of classes that need luvin.
Does your reward cause you to lose DPS due to anything other then not using a diffrent item in that slot? Cause thats what the orginal changes to the item caused Bards to do.
How so? You mean the fact that the original item gave you a gain to all of your DPS unlike every other reward out there?
This is a heroic quest line item reward. It is not hard to attain. With the change it is actually in line with that. It is still a better ranged item slot than any other heroic item you are going to get. So you still get an item that is useful for its attainability.
Now lets look at the options for fighters. Yeah, nobody is going to replace an epic with one of those weapons. Oh boy, the option for a cloak that is not as good as the cloak you get for finishing the line.
I am sorry, but complaints about this item not getting to be as uber as it was are all going to fall on deaf ears...for good reason.
Since when does a heroic questline mean treasured gear? I say this is because there is no "Heroic" gear it is treasured, legendary or fabled. Also I thought the TSO line was a Signature Series much like Prismatic, Peacock, Claymore and Sword of Destiny quest lines. Could you go back to your class forum and raise a fuss over there!
Wrong, wrong, and wrong. Heroic questline means heroic gear. Meaning gear that is at par with heroic gear. Hence fabled items that drop in heroic zones are not as good as x4 fabled drops. Furthermore this is NOT a quest line like Prismatic, Peacock, Claymore and SoD. Those all had x4 encounters that had to be defeated in order to get the reward. It is more like the SoD pre-final reward and Thuuga questline...you know, "heroic" style rewards.
So, could you please stop pretending like this item should be better than what it is? Fix the bug and it is good.

You obviously dont play a bard, and you have no idea how nice it was to have a decent bard item.

This nerf sucks and anyone who has it, will agree. RUN SPEED! Give me a break!

bryldan · 06-10-2009, 10:14 PM

Bruener wrote:

Playmea@Guk wrote:
Bruener wrote:
Androw@Najena wrote:
Bruener wrote:
Wow, this whole post seems like a big joke.
Seriously, have the bards looked at the rest of the items from this quest? They are all junk for every other class. Bards werer the exception and for some reason came out with a very nice item. The changes SOE has made only brings this back in line with all the other items from the quest. A quest that is cake to finish and is "Heroic" fabled.
I think we can all agree that Bards do not in any way fall into the category of classes that need luvin.
Does your reward cause you to lose DPS due to anything other then not using a diffrent item in that slot? Cause thats what the orginal changes to the item caused Bards to do.
How so? You mean the fact that the original item gave you a gain to all of your DPS unlike every other reward out there?
This is a heroic quest line item reward. It is not hard to attain. With the change it is actually in line with that. It is still a better ranged item slot than any other heroic item you are going to get. So you still get an item that is useful for its attainability.
Now lets look at the options for fighters. Yeah, nobody is going to replace an epic with one of those weapons. Oh boy, the option for a cloak that is not as good as the cloak you get for finishing the line.
I am sorry, but complaints about this item not getting to be as uber as it was are all going to fall on deaf ears...for good reason.
Since when does a heroic questline mean treasured gear? I say this is because there is no "Heroic" gear it is treasured, legendary or fabled. Also I thought the TSO line was a Signature Series much like Prismatic, Peacock, Claymore and Sword of Destiny quest lines. Could you go back to your class forum and raise a fuss over there!
Wrong, wrong, and wrong. Heroic questline means heroic gear. Meaning gear that is at par with heroic gear. Hence fabled items that drop in heroic zones are not as good as x4 fabled drops. Furthermore this is NOT a quest line like Prismatic, Peacock, Claymore and SoD. Those all had x4 encounters that had to be defeated in order to get the reward. It is more like the SoD pre-final reward and Thuuga questline...you know, "heroic" style rewards.
So, could you please stop pretending like this item should be better than what it is? Fix the bug and it is good.

Ok with your reasoning then maybe they need to start nerfing some gear from HEROIC zones?

Are you a healer? NERF the healer charm from palace

Tank? Well i can think of two shields which definately need nerfed (lc,aob)

These items are just as easy to obtain as the item from this quest line. Heck i have seen the charm and the shields plenty of times running those zones.

Elwin · 06-10-2009, 10:28 PM

Bruener wrote:

Playmea@Guk wrote:
Bruener wrote:
Androw@Najena wrote:
Bruener wrote:
Wow, this whole post seems like a big joke.
Seriously, have the bards looked at the rest of the items from this quest? They are all junk for every other class. Bards werer the exception and for some reason came out with a very nice item. The changes SOE has made only brings this back in line with all the other items from the quest. A quest that is cake to finish and is "Heroic" fabled.
I think we can all agree that Bards do not in any way fall into the category of classes that need luvin.
Does your reward cause you to lose DPS due to anything other then not using a diffrent item in that slot? Cause thats what the orginal changes to the item caused Bards to do.
How so? You mean the fact that the original item gave you a gain to all of your DPS unlike every other reward out there?
This is a heroic quest line item reward. It is not hard to attain. With the change it is actually in line with that. It is still a better ranged item slot than any other heroic item you are going to get. So you still get an item that is useful for its attainability.
Now lets look at the options for fighters. Yeah, nobody is going to replace an epic with one of those weapons. Oh boy, the option for a cloak that is not as good as the cloak you get for finishing the line.
I am sorry, but complaints about this item not getting to be as uber as it was are all going to fall on deaf ears...for good reason.
Since when does a heroic questline mean treasured gear? I say this is because there is no "Heroic" gear it is treasured, legendary or fabled. Also I thought the TSO line was a Signature Series much like Prismatic, Peacock, Claymore and Sword of Destiny quest lines. Could you go back to your class forum and raise a fuss over there!
Wrong, wrong, and wrong. Heroic questline means heroic gear. Meaning gear that is at par with heroic gear. Hence fabled items that drop in heroic zones are not as good as x4 fabled drops. Furthermore this is NOT a quest line like Prismatic, Peacock, Claymore and SoD. Those all had x4 encounters that had to be defeated in order to get the reward. It is more like the SoD pre-final reward and Thuuga questline...you know, "heroic" style rewards.
So, could you please stop pretending like this item should be better than what it is? Fix the bug and it is good.

Back to your bridge you evil troll!!!!!

You have no magic powers here!!!!!!!!

Cannon · 06-11-2009, 10:30 AM

Bruener wrote:

Playmea@Guk wrote:
Bruener wrote:
Androw@Najena wrote:
Bruener wrote:
Wow, this whole post seems like a big joke.
Seriously, have the bards looked at the rest of the items from this quest? They are all junk for every other class. Bards werer the exception and for some reason came out with a very nice item. The changes SOE has made only brings this back in line with all the other items from the quest. A quest that is cake to finish and is "Heroic" fabled.
I think we can all agree that Bards do not in any way fall into the category of classes that need luvin.
Does your reward cause you to lose DPS due to anything other then not using a diffrent item in that slot? Cause thats what the orginal changes to the item caused Bards to do.
How so? You mean the fact that the original item gave you a gain to all of your DPS unlike every other reward out there?
This is a heroic quest line item reward. It is not hard to attain. With the change it is actually in line with that. It is still a better ranged item slot than any other heroic item you are going to get. So you still get an item that is useful for its attainability.
Now lets look at the options for fighters. Yeah, nobody is going to replace an epic with one of those weapons. Oh boy, the option for a cloak that is not as good as the cloak you get for finishing the line.
I am sorry, but complaints about this item not getting to be as uber as it was are all going to fall on deaf ears...for good reason.
Since when does a heroic questline mean treasured gear? I say this is because there is no "Heroic" gear it is treasured, legendary or fabled. Also I thought the TSO line was a Signature Series much like Prismatic, Peacock, Claymore and Sword of Destiny quest lines. Could you go back to your class forum and raise a fuss over there!
Wrong, wrong, and wrong. Heroic questline means heroic gear. Meaning gear that is at par with heroic gear. Hence fabled items that drop in heroic zones are not as good as x4 fabled drops. Furthermore this is NOT a quest line like Prismatic, Peacock, Claymore and SoD. Those all had x4 encounters that had to be defeated in order to get the reward. It is more like the SoD pre-final reward and Thuuga questline...you know, "heroic" style rewards.
So, could you please stop pretending like this item should be better than what it is? Fix the bug and it is good.

How am I wrong is this not a signature series questline. This is "THE" xpac quest just because it doesnt end in a raid instance doesnt mean the reward should be any less. Not many groups could even think about challanging the Palace in the first few months.

Rosem · 06-11-2009, 11:04 AM

The quest line for the Band of Thuuga is largely, if not fully, soloable. I don't know about other people out there, but I am unable to solo Outer Stronghold or Palace - not to mention the other instances. The reward should be better than what it is about to be nerfed into; at least on parr with the other rewards from the quest - and after this nerf, it won't be.

Bruener · 06-11-2009, 11:38 AM

Rosemar@Nektulos wrote:

The quest line for the Band of Thuuga is largely, if not fully, soloable. I don't know about other people out there, but I am unable to solo Outer Stronghold or Palace - not to mention the other instances. The reward should be better than what it is about to be nerfed into; at least on parr with the other rewards from the quest - and after this nerf, it won't be.

No, after the nerf it will still be better than most of the items, and on par with the rest of them. Go ask the other classes that you play with what they think about the rewards for this item.

Oh wait, instead maybe SOE should add an additional proc that instantly dev fists any mob. Than while you are at it add a complete heal proc that goes off 5x per minute.

Seriously, have any of you guys actually looked at the other rewards from this questline? And if you have you cannot tell me that you were extremely thankful you weren't any other class completing this thing.

Cannon · 06-11-2009, 11:57 AM

Bruener wrote:

Rosemar@Nektulos wrote:
The quest line for the Band of Thuuga is largely, if not fully, soloable. I don't know about other people out there, but I am unable to solo Outer Stronghold or Palace - not to mention the other instances. The reward should be better than what it is about to be nerfed into; at least on parr with the other rewards from the quest - and after this nerf, it won't be.
No, after the nerf it will still be better than most of the items, and on par with the rest of them. Go ask the other classes that you play with what they think about the rewards for this item.
Oh wait, instead maybe SOE should add an additional proc that instantly dev fists any mob. Than while you are at it add a complete heal proc that goes off 5x per minute.
Seriously, have any of you guys actually looked at the other rewards from this questline? And if you have you cannot tell me that you were extremely thankful you weren't any other class completing this thing.

Actually I have and the brigands I know are quite happy with the meat cleaver quest reward.

Arathy · 06-11-2009, 12:17 PM

Regardless of what "type" of reward it should be, the short of it is that the whole added Run Speed is over used now.

It seems that Run Speed is the new black these days. If you want a unique bard item, what about something like.. 10% off the immunity timer on Gravitas and Jester's Cap?

That's just off the top of my head, and something that (while I don't know if it's even doable) is unique, and not just another + run speed.

Arathy · 06-11-2009, 12:19 PM

Bruener wrote:

Rosemar@Nektulos wrote:
The quest line for the Band of Thuuga is largely, if not fully, soloable. I don't know about other people out there, but I am unable to solo Outer Stronghold or Palace - not to mention the other instances. The reward should be better than what it is about to be nerfed into; at least on parr with the other rewards from the quest - and after this nerf, it won't be.
No, after the nerf it will still be better than most of the items, and on par with the rest of them. Go ask the other classes that you play with what they think about the rewards for this item.
Oh wait, instead maybe SOE should add an additional proc that instantly dev fists any mob. Than while you are at it add a complete heal proc that goes off 5x per minute.
Seriously, have any of you guys actually looked at the other rewards from this questline? And if you have you cannot tell me that you were extremely thankful you weren't any other class completing this thing.

Actually.. as a coercer I'm pretty happy with my dagger reward. When it's outlived it's usefulness in the secondary slot it'll still be a great piece for appearance.

bryldan · 06-11-2009, 01:02 PM

Reko@Najena wrote:

Bruener wrote:
Rosemar@Nektulos wrote:
The quest line for the Band of Thuuga is largely, if not fully, soloable. I don't know about other people out there, but I am unable to solo Outer Stronghold or Palace - not to mention the other instances. The reward should be better than what it is about to be nerfed into; at least on parr with the other rewards from the quest - and after this nerf, it won't be.
No, after the nerf it will still be better than most of the items, and on par with the rest of them. Go ask the other classes that you play with what they think about the rewards for this item.
Oh wait, instead maybe SOE should add an additional proc that instantly dev fists any mob. Than while you are at it add a complete heal proc that goes off 5x per minute.
Seriously, have any of you guys actually looked at the other rewards from this questline? And if you have you cannot tell me that you were extremely thankful you weren't any other class completing this thing.
Actually.. as a coercer I'm pretty happy with my dagger reward. When it's outlived it's usefulness in the secondary slot it'll still be a great piece for appearance.

Yup a lot of classes like the rewards. If they made this item into a charm item like it is on test that would be good reward since the really good charm slots are hard to come by (other than the healer one).

Cannon · 06-11-2009, 01:08 PM

bryldan wrote:

Reko@Najena wrote:
Bruener wrote:
Rosemar@Nektulos wrote:
The quest line for the Band of Thuuga is largely, if not fully, soloable. I don't know about other people out there, but I am unable to solo Outer Stronghold or Palace - not to mention the other instances. The reward should be better than what it is about to be nerfed into; at least on parr with the other rewards from the quest - and after this nerf, it won't be.
No, after the nerf it will still be better than most of the items, and on par with the rest of them. Go ask the other classes that you play with what they think about the rewards for this item.
Oh wait, instead maybe SOE should add an additional proc that instantly dev fists any mob. Than while you are at it add a complete heal proc that goes off 5x per minute.
Seriously, have any of you guys actually looked at the other rewards from this questline? And if you have you cannot tell me that you were extremely thankful you weren't any other class completing this thing.
Actually.. as a coercer I'm pretty happy with my dagger reward. When it's outlived it's usefulness in the secondary slot it'll still be a great piece for appearance.
Yup a lot of classes like the rewards. If they made this item into a charm item like it is on test that would be good reward since the really good charm slots are hard to come by (other than the healer one).

This is currently a charm on Test? That would be sweet.

06-05-2009, 09:42 AM	#31
Fatuus Loremaster Join Date: Jan 2005 Posts: 315	I am deeply saddened by the lack of care that is being shown to the bards in this update. Quote from Aeralik: Correct. This doesnt change things like luck of the dirge or blessings. If you can modify the proc rate of an item or spell now, you can still do it after this change. Quote from Kiara: The next thing you'll see in this update is that the values of the procs can no longer be modified, with a few notable exceptions like achievements or item set enhancements. Generic bonuses will no longer apply to triggered damage generated from items. This will allow us to move forward with creating items that can have higher damage item procs in the future. This drum, and its affect, did not trigger higher damage...it lengthed the effect of procs and spells. It had positive and negative effects...but Aeralik's view was basically 'huh I didn't know it did that, changing it to affect songs.' Per what was written in the producer's letter and guidance given to us by SoE, the change was to affect the damage DONE to a mob, really this affect's a bards ability to DEBUFF and eeks out a little bit on our short term offensive buffs. This is the end item reward to what would be considered "THE" questline in TSO. How could Aeralik not know what that item did when he created it? It boggles my mind, especially since its been out for over 6 months and is listed as the best ranged item for dirges (probably troubs too) by people who KNOW how to play a dirge. What's even sadder is EVERYONE who has posted in this forum has been extremely critical of this change. Its not inline with what the producers letter intent was as stated...and the new changes made by Aeralik (which were denounced harder by everyone in this forum) haven't recieved a comment or update in 3 days. But, he has lots of time ot post about the images used by necromancer pets in the forums. Lastly the changes are not even posted in the test update notes that Kiara posted yesterday...basically meaning this is trying to be another stealth nerf to the bard class. Hey lets start stealth nerfing everyone's mythical...it sounds like lots of fun! Fix this Aeralik....fix it now man...this is just beyond words! __________________

06-05-2009, 09:51 AM	#32
bryldan Loremaster Join Date: May 2006 Posts: 692	Fatuus wrote: I am deeply saddened by the lack of care that is being shown to the bards in this update. Quote from Aeralik: Correct. This doesnt change things like luck of the dirge or blessings. If you can modify the proc rate of an item or spell now, you can still do it after this change. Quote from Kiara: The next thing you'll see in this update is that the values of the procs can no longer be modified, with a few notable exceptions like achievements or item set enhancements. Generic bonuses will no longer apply to triggered damage generated from items. This will allow us to move forward with creating items that can have higher damage item procs in the future. This drum, and its affect, did not trigger higher damage...it lengthed the effect of procs and spells. It had positive and negative effects...but Aeralik's view was basically 'huh I didn't know it did that, changing it to affect songs.' Per what was written in the producer's letter and guidance given to us by SoE, the change was to affect the damage DONE to a mob, really this affect's a bards ability to DEBUFF and eeks out a little bit on our short term offensive buffs. This is the end item reward to what would be considered "THE" questline in TSO. How could Aeralik not know what that item did when he created it? It boggles my mind, especially since its been out for over 6 months and is listed as the best ranged item for dirges (probably troubs too) by people who KNOW how to play a dirge. What's even sadder is EVERYONE who has posted in this forum has been extremely critical of this change. Its not inline with what the producers letter intent was as stated...and the new changes made by Aeralik (which were denounced harder by everyone in this forum) haven't recieved a comment or update in 3 days. But, he has lots of time ot post about the images used by necromancer pets in the forums. Lastly the changes are not even posted in the test update notes that Kiara posted yesterday...basically meaning this is trying to be another stealth nerf to the bard class. Hey lets start stealth nerfing everyone's mythical...it sounds like lots of fun! Fix this Aeralik....fix it now man...this is just beyond words! You know this wouldnt happen if the item helped assassins!!!!!!

06-05-2009, 06:09 PM	#35
Argyuile Loremaster Join Date: Nov 2004 Posts: 214	Are you implying that if I smoke I will get super powers? Seriously though, don't touch this item or be prepared to give us refunds. __________________ Disso and SD merged onto a server with no competition for contested thus proving once and for all that nobody really "enjoys" racing for contested content. They just enjoy having it on lock down so no one else can enjoy it. Contested epics are a waste of programming time and resources.

06-05-2009, 06:09 PM	#36
Leisu Server: Butcherblock Guild: Dracos Reborn Rank: Inactive General Join Date: Apr 2007 Posts: 43	Aeralik wrote: I don't believe it was originally intended to increase the duration of proc spells since it refered to "songs" in the description. I did however fix it to no longer apply to damage dots which means its beneficial songs and debuff songs. Also because this is a drum, I added a little boost to Selo's Accelerando IV so your group can march a little faster into battle. Screw it....it doesn't matter what i write. You're not going to listen anyways.

06-05-2009, 07:11 PM	#37
Sosum General Join Date: Mar 2005 Location: Phoenix, AZ Posts: 361	Aeralik wrote: I don't believe it was originally intended to increase the duration of proc spells since it refered to "songs" in the description. I did however fix it to no longer apply to damage dots which means its beneficial songs and debuff songs. Also because this is a drum, I added a little boost to Selo's Accelerando IV so your group can march a little faster into battle. so this out ranked fixing summoners how? run speed was fine! __________________

06-05-2009, 12:27 PM	#33
Hecula Loremaster Join Date: Nov 2004 Posts: 422	Undo this change. I don't even play a bard but I can follow the line of objections in this thread and agree with them. That reward item is a seriously difficult item to attain - making it useless is pretty mean. I've played with many Dirges and Troubs on live with this item - I didn't feel it was doing something so amazing that it needed to be nerfed - especially into oblivion. If it does something other than the wording indicates - CHANGE THE WORDING NOT THE EFFECT - it's very simple.

06-05-2009, 05:01 PM	#34
Krooner Loremaster Join Date: Nov 2004 Posts: 912	Hecula wrote " CHANGE THE WORDING NOT THE EFFECT - it's very simple. This is exact same thing that happened with COB. It began with "Provides a desease proc and interupt with every attack" Which became something resembeling the warning label on a pack of smokes.

06-05-2009, 07:17 PM	#38
thecynic315 Loremaster Join Date: Dec 2004 Posts: 454	Sosumya@Unrest wrote: Aeralik wrote: I don't believe it was originally intended to increase the duration of proc spells since it refered to "songs" in the description. I did however fix it to no longer apply to damage dots which means its beneficial songs and debuff songs. Also because this is a drum, I added a little boost to Selo's Accelerando IV so your group can march a little faster into battle. so this out ranked fixing summoners how? run speed was fine! Cause screwing up one working item took him all of Id say 30min-1hour. Fixing 2 classes that have been screwed for several years is A) not somehting you you really want him to do. You want to be fixed and adjusted properly, 2 things this Dev is not known for. B) I just realized that the mechanics dev is screwing up and item.....ummmmmmm this makes about as much sence as having Domino create a brand new UI for the game. __________________ I QUIT once EQ2x came about!

06-10-2009, 09:02 AM	#39
Fatuus Loremaster Join Date: Jan 2005 Posts: 315	Aeralik, It's been 5 days since I made my last post...and we have had 2 Test updates go thru. WILL YOU PLEASE listen to the bards posting here about how rediculous the changes you are making on this item are? We give you what you want...FEEDBACK...and everyone UNIVERSALLY states that this change is not only bad...but makes the item pointless now to even equip in its current form. 1) Why would you put a run speed buff on the weapon? WHY? And you wonder why the community gets upset when devs make ninja changes on major gear items (The amount of work to get this item is GREATER then the fabled Epic weapon version in RoK) and then never listen to the community that actually plays the characters. 2) When are you going to change other aspects of the bard buffs? Tomb Calm / Dead Calm still works off of Spell Crit instead of Melee crit....even though its a melee attack. You changed Chime of Blades...why not this spell so its more in line with melee players. IT ONLY HITS OFF OF MELEE ATTACKS! Note: Kiara I am not attacking anyone here...simply pointing out a severe lack of communication on the part of the team here to communicate with the community on a topic of intense interest to ALL of the bard community. The fix he made to this item is simply terrible...ask any bard and they will easily...readilly...respond that its just that bad. I honestly do not know what he was thinking when he made the change. __________________

06-10-2009, 01:52 PM	#40
thecynic315 Loremaster Join Date: Dec 2004 Posts: 454	While we are looking for feedback from the Devs maybe we can get an aswer on why the changes to the Drum only seem to work on the T8 Debuffs. I checked all debuffs on CAs/Spells and only T8 was being effected by the Drum nothing else. This means that A) the lvl 44 Daro's Master II that everyone uses as its superior to the T8 Adep III is not effected by the Drum, and B) means that theres a posiblilty that when T9 rolls around the Drum becomes even more usless, this is actualy quite a feat as the only way the Drum could be worse is if it casted a 10k DoT on the user that broke stealth. __________________ I QUIT once EQ2x came about!

06-10-2009, 01:53 PM	#41
Bruener Loremaster Join Date: Dec 2004 Posts: 2,010	Wow, this whole post seems like a big joke. Seriously, have the bards looked at the rest of the items from this quest? They are all junk for every other class. Bards werer the exception and for some reason came out with a very nice item. The changes SOE has made only brings this back in line with all the other items from the quest. A quest that is cake to finish and is "Heroic" fabled. I think we can all agree that Bards do not in any way fall into the category of classes that need luvin. __________________

06-10-2009, 02:16 PM	#42
Asif Loremaster Join Date: Nov 2004 Posts: 391	Bruener wrote: Wow, this whole post seems like a big joke. Seriously, have the bards looked at the rest of the items from this quest? They are all junk for every other class. Bards werer the exception and for some reason came out with a very nice item. The changes SOE has made only brings this back in line with all the other items from the quest. A quest that is cake to finish and is "Heroic" fabled. I think we can all agree that Bards do not in any way fall into the category of classes that need luvin. Hmm maybe you should play one and come back to us . Till you do play a bard i doubt anyone will listen to you !!!! I do have a Conjy so i do know the mess they are in. ( See what i mean about playing the class)

06-10-2009, 02:19 PM	#43
Rayche Server: Antonia Bayle Guild: Mayhem Rank: Alts Loremaster Join Date: Nov 2004 Posts: 519	Bruener wrote: Wow, this whole post seems like a big joke. Seriously, have the bards looked at the rest of the items from this quest? They are all junk for every other class. Bards werer the exception and for some reason came out with a very nice item. The changes SOE has made only brings this back in line with all the other items from the quest. A quest that is cake to finish and is "Heroic" fabled. I think we can all agree that Bards do not in any way fall into the category of classes that need luvin. Waitaminute. You're bitter because the reward you got sucked, so the answer is to make the other rewards all suck? That's just plain selfish. Anyway, Bards are definitely in need of some lovin in many areas. __________________ Rhandy Rhoades ~ 90 Troubador Kasey ~ 90 Bruiser Cometus ~ 82 Conjuror / 90 Master Sage Rayche ~ 81 Mystic / 90 Master Alchemist / 450 Adorning Tungar ~ 64 Necromancer / 80 Master Tailor Antonia Bayle Server

06-10-2009, 03:11 PM	#44
thecynic315 Loremaster Join Date: Dec 2004 Posts: 454	Bruener wrote: Wow, this whole post seems like a big joke. Seriously, have the bards looked at the rest of the items from this quest? They are all junk for every other class. Bards werer the exception and for some reason came out with a very nice item. The changes SOE has made only brings this back in line with all the other items from the quest. A quest that is cake to finish and is "Heroic" fabled. I think we can all agree that Bards do not in any way fall into the category of classes that need luvin. Does your reward cause you to lose DPS due to anything other then not using a diffrent item in that slot? Cause thats what the orginal changes to the item caused Bards to do. __________________ I QUIT once EQ2x came about!

06-10-2009, 04:56 PM	#45
Bruener Loremaster Join Date: Dec 2004 Posts: 2,010	Androw@Najena wrote: Bruener wrote: Wow, this whole post seems like a big joke. Seriously, have the bards looked at the rest of the items from this quest? They are all junk for every other class. Bards werer the exception and for some reason came out with a very nice item. The changes SOE has made only brings this back in line with all the other items from the quest. A quest that is cake to finish and is "Heroic" fabled. I think we can all agree that Bards do not in any way fall into the category of classes that need luvin. Does your reward cause you to lose DPS due to anything other then not using a diffrent item in that slot? Cause thats what the orginal changes to the item caused Bards to do. How so? You mean the fact that the original item gave you a gain to all of your DPS unlike every other reward out there? This is a heroic quest line item reward. It is not hard to attain. With the change it is actually in line with that. It is still a better ranged item slot than any other heroic item you are going to get. So you still get an item that is useful for its attainability. Now lets look at the options for fighters. Yeah, nobody is going to replace an epic with one of those weapons. Oh boy, the option for a cloak that is not as good as the cloak you get for finishing the line. I am sorry, but complaints about this item not getting to be as uber as it was are all going to fall on deaf ears...for good reason. __________________

06-10-2009, 05:20 PM	#46
thecynic315 Loremaster Join Date: Dec 2004 Posts: 454	ruener wrote: Androw@Najena wrote: Bruener wrote: Wow, this whole post seems like a big joke. Seriously, have the bards looked at the rest of the items from this quest? They are all junk for every other class. Bards werer the exception and for some reason came out with a very nice item. The changes SOE has made only brings this back in line with all the other items from the quest. A quest that is cake to finish and is "Heroic" fabled. I think we can all agree that Bards do not in any way fall into the category of classes that need luvin. Does your reward cause you to lose DPS due to anything other then not using a diffrent item in that slot? Cause thats what the orginal changes to the item caused Bards to do. How so? You mean the fact that the original item gave you a gain to all of your DPS unlike every other reward out there? This is a heroic quest line item reward. It is not hard to attain. With the change it is actually in line with that. It is still a better ranged item slot than any other heroic item you are going to get. So you still get an item that is useful for its attainability. Now lets look at the options for fighters. Yeah, nobody is going to replace an epic with one of those weapons. Oh boy, the option for a cloak that is not as good as the cloak you get for finishing the line. I am sorry, but complaints about this item not getting to be as uber as it was are all going to fall on deaf ears...for good reason. No I mean once the proc changes go through if you equiped your reward from the SIG quest would your DPS be reduced just by equiping the reward? With the orginal proc changes the Drum caused a decrease in DPS just by equiping it because a 'SONG' is anything with a duration, like a DoT. My newest complaint is that what Arelik SAYS he changed is not what the item is actualy doing. I have no thoughts that the Drum will be usfull at all after GU52, but if they are going to make a change then 'SONG' needs to mean any detrimental applied to a mob that has a duration, and any benifical temp buff that has a duration like the Drum states. On test only T8 debuffs, and SOME of our temp buffs are working at all. __________________ I QUIT once EQ2x came about!

06-10-2009, 05:25 PM	#47
Ramathorne Server: Nektulos Guild: Reverentia Rank: Senior Member Loremaster Join Date: Nov 2004 Posts: 10	It really isn't better than any other range slot now. All the good stuff got removed and all the bad stayed, like lengthening our dots which hurt us on short fights. Several bows are better. We lose dps mod because we cannot adorn it and there is no damage at range from it. With the amount of jousting in raids most people should be swapping it out anyway. With that awsome run speed buff they added it is going to drop selo's if we do swap it out. I can execpt the nerf, fine I am used to it. Please remove or change the run speed addition so it doesn't drop selo's.

06-10-2009, 06:08 PM	#48
Cannon Loremaster Join Date: Nov 2004 Posts: 70	Bruener wrote: Androw@Najena wrote: Bruener wrote: Wow, this whole post seems like a big joke. Seriously, have the bards looked at the rest of the items from this quest? They are all junk for every other class. Bards werer the exception and for some reason came out with a very nice item. The changes SOE has made only brings this back in line with all the other items from the quest. A quest that is cake to finish and is "Heroic" fabled. I think we can all agree that Bards do not in any way fall into the category of classes that need luvin. Does your reward cause you to lose DPS due to anything other then not using a diffrent item in that slot? Cause thats what the orginal changes to the item caused Bards to do. How so? You mean the fact that the original item gave you a gain to all of your DPS unlike every other reward out there? This is a heroic quest line item reward. It is not hard to attain. With the change it is actually in line with that. It is still a better ranged item slot than any other heroic item you are going to get. So you still get an item that is useful for its attainability. Now lets look at the options for fighters. Yeah, nobody is going to replace an epic with one of those weapons. Oh boy, the option for a cloak that is not as good as the cloak you get for finishing the line. I am sorry, but complaints about this item not getting to be as uber as it was are all going to fall on deaf ears...for good reason. Since when does a heroic questline mean treasured gear? I say this is because there is no "Heroic" gear it is treasured, legendary or fabled. Also I thought the TSO line was a Signature Series much like Prismatic, Peacock, Claymore and Sword of Destiny quest lines. Could you go back to your class forum and raise a fuss over there! __________________

06-10-2009, 08:44 PM	#49
Bruener Loremaster Join Date: Dec 2004 Posts: 2,010	Playmea@Guk wrote: Bruener wrote: Androw@Najena wrote: Bruener wrote: Wow, this whole post seems like a big joke. Seriously, have the bards looked at the rest of the items from this quest? They are all junk for every other class. Bards werer the exception and for some reason came out with a very nice item. The changes SOE has made only brings this back in line with all the other items from the quest. A quest that is cake to finish and is "Heroic" fabled. I think we can all agree that Bards do not in any way fall into the category of classes that need luvin. Does your reward cause you to lose DPS due to anything other then not using a diffrent item in that slot? Cause thats what the orginal changes to the item caused Bards to do. How so? You mean the fact that the original item gave you a gain to all of your DPS unlike every other reward out there? This is a heroic quest line item reward. It is not hard to attain. With the change it is actually in line with that. It is still a better ranged item slot than any other heroic item you are going to get. So you still get an item that is useful for its attainability. Now lets look at the options for fighters. Yeah, nobody is going to replace an epic with one of those weapons. Oh boy, the option for a cloak that is not as good as the cloak you get for finishing the line. I am sorry, but complaints about this item not getting to be as uber as it was are all going to fall on deaf ears...for good reason. Since when does a heroic questline mean treasured gear? I say this is because there is no "Heroic" gear it is treasured, legendary or fabled. Also I thought the TSO line was a Signature Series much like Prismatic, Peacock, Claymore and Sword of Destiny quest lines. Could you go back to your class forum and raise a fuss over there! Wrong, wrong, and wrong. Heroic questline means heroic gear. Meaning gear that is at par with heroic gear. Hence fabled items that drop in heroic zones are not as good as x4 fabled drops. Furthermore this is NOT a quest line like Prismatic, Peacock, Claymore and SoD. Those all had x4 encounters that had to be defeated in order to get the reward. It is more like the SoD pre-final reward and Thuuga questline...you know, "heroic" style rewards. So, could you please stop pretending like this item should be better than what it is? Fix the bug and it is good. __________________

06-10-2009, 09:59 PM	#50
ccarro General Join Date: Apr 2005 Location: Maine Posts: 225	Bruener wrote: Playmea@Guk wrote: Bruener wrote: Androw@Najena wrote: Bruener wrote: Wow, this whole post seems like a big joke. Seriously, have the bards looked at the rest of the items from this quest? They are all junk for every other class. Bards werer the exception and for some reason came out with a very nice item. The changes SOE has made only brings this back in line with all the other items from the quest. A quest that is cake to finish and is "Heroic" fabled. I think we can all agree that Bards do not in any way fall into the category of classes that need luvin. Does your reward cause you to lose DPS due to anything other then not using a diffrent item in that slot? Cause thats what the orginal changes to the item caused Bards to do. How so? You mean the fact that the original item gave you a gain to all of your DPS unlike every other reward out there? This is a heroic quest line item reward. It is not hard to attain. With the change it is actually in line with that. It is still a better ranged item slot than any other heroic item you are going to get. So you still get an item that is useful for its attainability. Now lets look at the options for fighters. Yeah, nobody is going to replace an epic with one of those weapons. Oh boy, the option for a cloak that is not as good as the cloak you get for finishing the line. I am sorry, but complaints about this item not getting to be as uber as it was are all going to fall on deaf ears...for good reason. Since when does a heroic questline mean treasured gear? I say this is because there is no "Heroic" gear it is treasured, legendary or fabled. Also I thought the TSO line was a Signature Series much like Prismatic, Peacock, Claymore and Sword of Destiny quest lines. Could you go back to your class forum and raise a fuss over there! Wrong, wrong, and wrong. Heroic questline means heroic gear. Meaning gear that is at par with heroic gear. Hence fabled items that drop in heroic zones are not as good as x4 fabled drops. Furthermore this is NOT a quest line like Prismatic, Peacock, Claymore and SoD. Those all had x4 encounters that had to be defeated in order to get the reward. It is more like the SoD pre-final reward and Thuuga questline...you know, "heroic" style rewards. So, could you please stop pretending like this item should be better than what it is? Fix the bug and it is good. You obviously dont play a bard, and you have no idea how nice it was to have a decent bard item. This nerf sucks and anyone who has it, will agree. RUN SPEED! Give me a break! __________________

06-10-2009, 10:14 PM	#51
bryldan Loremaster Join Date: May 2006 Posts: 692	Bruener wrote: Playmea@Guk wrote: Bruener wrote: Androw@Najena wrote: Bruener wrote: Wow, this whole post seems like a big joke. Seriously, have the bards looked at the rest of the items from this quest? They are all junk for every other class. Bards werer the exception and for some reason came out with a very nice item. The changes SOE has made only brings this back in line with all the other items from the quest. A quest that is cake to finish and is "Heroic" fabled. I think we can all agree that Bards do not in any way fall into the category of classes that need luvin. Does your reward cause you to lose DPS due to anything other then not using a diffrent item in that slot? Cause thats what the orginal changes to the item caused Bards to do. How so? You mean the fact that the original item gave you a gain to all of your DPS unlike every other reward out there? This is a heroic quest line item reward. It is not hard to attain. With the change it is actually in line with that. It is still a better ranged item slot than any other heroic item you are going to get. So you still get an item that is useful for its attainability. Now lets look at the options for fighters. Yeah, nobody is going to replace an epic with one of those weapons. Oh boy, the option for a cloak that is not as good as the cloak you get for finishing the line. I am sorry, but complaints about this item not getting to be as uber as it was are all going to fall on deaf ears...for good reason. Since when does a heroic questline mean treasured gear? I say this is because there is no "Heroic" gear it is treasured, legendary or fabled. Also I thought the TSO line was a Signature Series much like Prismatic, Peacock, Claymore and Sword of Destiny quest lines. Could you go back to your class forum and raise a fuss over there! Wrong, wrong, and wrong. Heroic questline means heroic gear. Meaning gear that is at par with heroic gear. Hence fabled items that drop in heroic zones are not as good as x4 fabled drops. Furthermore this is NOT a quest line like Prismatic, Peacock, Claymore and SoD. Those all had x4 encounters that had to be defeated in order to get the reward. It is more like the SoD pre-final reward and Thuuga questline...you know, "heroic" style rewards. So, could you please stop pretending like this item should be better than what it is? Fix the bug and it is good. Ok with your reasoning then maybe they need to start nerfing some gear from HEROIC zones? Are you a healer? NERF the healer charm from palace Tank? Well i can think of two shields which definately need nerfed (lc,aob) These items are just as easy to obtain as the item from this quest line. Heck i have seen the charm and the shields plenty of times running those zones.

06-10-2009, 10:28 PM	#52
Elwin Server: Venekor Guild: Blades of Honor Rank: Master Blade Loremaster Join Date: Aug 2006 Posts: 659	Bruener wrote: Playmea@Guk wrote: Bruener wrote: Androw@Najena wrote: Bruener wrote: Wow, this whole post seems like a big joke. Seriously, have the bards looked at the rest of the items from this quest? They are all junk for every other class. Bards werer the exception and for some reason came out with a very nice item. The changes SOE has made only brings this back in line with all the other items from the quest. A quest that is cake to finish and is "Heroic" fabled. I think we can all agree that Bards do not in any way fall into the category of classes that need luvin. Does your reward cause you to lose DPS due to anything other then not using a diffrent item in that slot? Cause thats what the orginal changes to the item caused Bards to do. How so? You mean the fact that the original item gave you a gain to all of your DPS unlike every other reward out there? This is a heroic quest line item reward. It is not hard to attain. With the change it is actually in line with that. It is still a better ranged item slot than any other heroic item you are going to get. So you still get an item that is useful for its attainability. Now lets look at the options for fighters. Yeah, nobody is going to replace an epic with one of those weapons. Oh boy, the option for a cloak that is not as good as the cloak you get for finishing the line. I am sorry, but complaints about this item not getting to be as uber as it was are all going to fall on deaf ears...for good reason. Since when does a heroic questline mean treasured gear? I say this is because there is no "Heroic" gear it is treasured, legendary or fabled. Also I thought the TSO line was a Signature Series much like Prismatic, Peacock, Claymore and Sword of Destiny quest lines. Could you go back to your class forum and raise a fuss over there! Wrong, wrong, and wrong. Heroic questline means heroic gear. Meaning gear that is at par with heroic gear. Hence fabled items that drop in heroic zones are not as good as x4 fabled drops. Furthermore this is NOT a quest line like Prismatic, Peacock, Claymore and SoD. Those all had x4 encounters that had to be defeated in order to get the reward. It is more like the SoD pre-final reward and Thuuga questline...you know, "heroic" style rewards. So, could you please stop pretending like this item should be better than what it is? Fix the bug and it is good. Back to your bridge you evil troll!!!!! You have no magic powers here!!!!!!!!

06-11-2009, 10:30 AM	#53
Cannon Loremaster Join Date: Nov 2004 Posts: 70	Bruener wrote: Playmea@Guk wrote: Bruener wrote: Androw@Najena wrote: Bruener wrote: Wow, this whole post seems like a big joke. Seriously, have the bards looked at the rest of the items from this quest? They are all junk for every other class. Bards werer the exception and for some reason came out with a very nice item. The changes SOE has made only brings this back in line with all the other items from the quest. A quest that is cake to finish and is "Heroic" fabled. I think we can all agree that Bards do not in any way fall into the category of classes that need luvin. Does your reward cause you to lose DPS due to anything other then not using a diffrent item in that slot? Cause thats what the orginal changes to the item caused Bards to do. How so? You mean the fact that the original item gave you a gain to all of your DPS unlike every other reward out there? This is a heroic quest line item reward. It is not hard to attain. With the change it is actually in line with that. It is still a better ranged item slot than any other heroic item you are going to get. So you still get an item that is useful for its attainability. Now lets look at the options for fighters. Yeah, nobody is going to replace an epic with one of those weapons. Oh boy, the option for a cloak that is not as good as the cloak you get for finishing the line. I am sorry, but complaints about this item not getting to be as uber as it was are all going to fall on deaf ears...for good reason. Since when does a heroic questline mean treasured gear? I say this is because there is no "Heroic" gear it is treasured, legendary or fabled. Also I thought the TSO line was a Signature Series much like Prismatic, Peacock, Claymore and Sword of Destiny quest lines. Could you go back to your class forum and raise a fuss over there! Wrong, wrong, and wrong. Heroic questline means heroic gear. Meaning gear that is at par with heroic gear. Hence fabled items that drop in heroic zones are not as good as x4 fabled drops. Furthermore this is NOT a quest line like Prismatic, Peacock, Claymore and SoD. Those all had x4 encounters that had to be defeated in order to get the reward. It is more like the SoD pre-final reward and Thuuga questline...you know, "heroic" style rewards. So, could you please stop pretending like this item should be better than what it is? Fix the bug and it is good. How am I wrong is this not a signature series questline. This is "THE" xpac quest just because it doesnt end in a raid instance doesnt mean the reward should be any less. Not many groups could even think about challanging the Palace in the first few months. __________________

06-11-2009, 11:04 AM	#54
Rosem Server: Nektulos Guild: Wanderers of Norrath Rank: Officer Alts General Join Date: Feb 2009 Posts: 16	The quest line for the Band of Thuuga is largely, if not fully, soloable. I don't know about other people out there, but I am unable to solo Outer Stronghold or Palace - not to mention the other instances. The reward should be better than what it is about to be nerfed into; at least on parr with the other rewards from the quest - and after this nerf, it won't be. __________________

06-11-2009, 11:38 AM	#55
Bruener Loremaster Join Date: Dec 2004 Posts: 2,010	Rosemar@Nektulos wrote: The quest line for the Band of Thuuga is largely, if not fully, soloable. I don't know about other people out there, but I am unable to solo Outer Stronghold or Palace - not to mention the other instances. The reward should be better than what it is about to be nerfed into; at least on parr with the other rewards from the quest - and after this nerf, it won't be. No, after the nerf it will still be better than most of the items, and on par with the rest of them. Go ask the other classes that you play with what they think about the rewards for this item. Oh wait, instead maybe SOE should add an additional proc that instantly dev fists any mob. Than while you are at it add a complete heal proc that goes off 5x per minute. Seriously, have any of you guys actually looked at the other rewards from this questline? And if you have you cannot tell me that you were extremely thankful you weren't any other class completing this thing. __________________

06-11-2009, 11:57 AM	#56
Cannon Loremaster Join Date: Nov 2004 Posts: 70	Bruener wrote: Rosemar@Nektulos wrote: The quest line for the Band of Thuuga is largely, if not fully, soloable. I don't know about other people out there, but I am unable to solo Outer Stronghold or Palace - not to mention the other instances. The reward should be better than what it is about to be nerfed into; at least on parr with the other rewards from the quest - and after this nerf, it won't be. No, after the nerf it will still be better than most of the items, and on par with the rest of them. Go ask the other classes that you play with what they think about the rewards for this item. Oh wait, instead maybe SOE should add an additional proc that instantly dev fists any mob. Than while you are at it add a complete heal proc that goes off 5x per minute. Seriously, have any of you guys actually looked at the other rewards from this questline? And if you have you cannot tell me that you were extremely thankful you weren't any other class completing this thing. Actually I have and the brigands I know are quite happy with the meat cleaver quest reward. __________________

06-11-2009, 12:17 PM	#57
Arathy General Join Date: Dec 2004 Posts: 171	Regardless of what "type" of reward it should be, the short of it is that the whole added Run Speed is over used now. It seems that Run Speed is the new black these days. If you want a unique bard item, what about something like.. 10% off the immunity timer on Gravitas and Jester's Cap? That's just off the top of my head, and something that (while I don't know if it's even doable) is unique, and not just another + run speed.

06-11-2009, 12:19 PM	#58
Arathy General Join Date: Dec 2004 Posts: 171	Bruener wrote: Rosemar@Nektulos wrote: The quest line for the Band of Thuuga is largely, if not fully, soloable. I don't know about other people out there, but I am unable to solo Outer Stronghold or Palace - not to mention the other instances. The reward should be better than what it is about to be nerfed into; at least on parr with the other rewards from the quest - and after this nerf, it won't be. No, after the nerf it will still be better than most of the items, and on par with the rest of them. Go ask the other classes that you play with what they think about the rewards for this item. Oh wait, instead maybe SOE should add an additional proc that instantly dev fists any mob. Than while you are at it add a complete heal proc that goes off 5x per minute. Seriously, have any of you guys actually looked at the other rewards from this questline? And if you have you cannot tell me that you were extremely thankful you weren't any other class completing this thing. Actually.. as a coercer I'm pretty happy with my dagger reward. When it's outlived it's usefulness in the secondary slot it'll still be a great piece for appearance.

06-11-2009, 01:02 PM	#59
bryldan Loremaster Join Date: May 2006 Posts: 692	Reko@Najena wrote: Bruener wrote: Rosemar@Nektulos wrote: The quest line for the Band of Thuuga is largely, if not fully, soloable. I don't know about other people out there, but I am unable to solo Outer Stronghold or Palace - not to mention the other instances. The reward should be better than what it is about to be nerfed into; at least on parr with the other rewards from the quest - and after this nerf, it won't be. No, after the nerf it will still be better than most of the items, and on par with the rest of them. Go ask the other classes that you play with what they think about the rewards for this item. Oh wait, instead maybe SOE should add an additional proc that instantly dev fists any mob. Than while you are at it add a complete heal proc that goes off 5x per minute. Seriously, have any of you guys actually looked at the other rewards from this questline? And if you have you cannot tell me that you were extremely thankful you weren't any other class completing this thing. Actually.. as a coercer I'm pretty happy with my dagger reward. When it's outlived it's usefulness in the secondary slot it'll still be a great piece for appearance. Yup a lot of classes like the rewards. If they made this item into a charm item like it is on test that would be good reward since the really good charm slots are hard to come by (other than the healer one).

06-11-2009, 01:08 PM	#60
Cannon Loremaster Join Date: Nov 2004 Posts: 70	bryldan wrote: Reko@Najena wrote: Bruener wrote: Rosemar@Nektulos wrote: The quest line for the Band of Thuuga is largely, if not fully, soloable. I don't know about other people out there, but I am unable to solo Outer Stronghold or Palace - not to mention the other instances. The reward should be better than what it is about to be nerfed into; at least on parr with the other rewards from the quest - and after this nerf, it won't be. No, after the nerf it will still be better than most of the items, and on par with the rest of them. Go ask the other classes that you play with what they think about the rewards for this item. Oh wait, instead maybe SOE should add an additional proc that instantly dev fists any mob. Than while you are at it add a complete heal proc that goes off 5x per minute. Seriously, have any of you guys actually looked at the other rewards from this questline? And if you have you cannot tell me that you were extremely thankful you weren't any other class completing this thing. Actually.. as a coercer I'm pretty happy with my dagger reward. When it's outlived it's usefulness in the secondary slot it'll still be a great piece for appearance. Yup a lot of classes like the rewards. If they made this item into a charm item like it is on test that would be good reward since the really good charm slots are hard to come by (other than the healer one). This is currently a charm on Test? That would be sweet. __________________