Trakanon Shiled will be IMBA after GU51

Danter · 01-09-2009, 04:25 PM

This issue is too big of a deal to append to the existing thread about GU 51. This shield will completely imbalance tanking in favor of plate tanks once again.With the nerfing of threat transfers for every class, and deaggro from troubs, amends, etc, You think it would make sense that they nerf old tier loot, right? WRONG. The best hate item in the game, bar none, is going to be a piece of loot that is from an INSTANCED RAID MOB FROM LAST EXPANSION. You've got to be ____ kidding me?!?!Brawlers and any plate tanks who do not have this shield are simply not going to be able to hold sufficient aggro, since defensive stance nerfs autoattack. I'm shocked brawlers aren't raising hell about this issue.

Dasein · 01-09-2009, 04:38 PM

Dantx@Unrest wrote:

This issue is too big of a deal to append to the existing thread about GU 51. This shield will completely imbalance tanking in favor of plate tanks once again.With the nerfing of threat transfers for every class, and deaggro from troubs, amends, etc, You think it would make sense that they nerf old tier loot, right? WRONG. The best hate item in the game, bar none, is going to be a piece of loot that is from an INSTANCED RAID MOB FROM LAST EXPANSION. You've got to be ____ kidding me?!?!Brawlers and any plate tanks who do not have this shield are simply not going to be able to hold sufficient aggro, since defensive stance nerfs autoattack. I'm shocked brawlers aren't raising hell about this issue.

You can probably count on one hand the number of tanks on each server with this shield. It's rare enough to be a non-issue when considering class balance. It is powerful, but there's other comparable items, and we have not really scratched the surface of the upper-end TSO items, either.

Aule · 01-09-2009, 04:46 PM

If a trak geared tank is actually running a group instance then one of two cases applies: 1) It's a guild group, in which case everybody has awesome items and who cares. 2) It's a PUG of some sort, in which case the tank is going to be so much better than the average DPS classes that it's not going to matter whether they were wearing that shield or not. I mean seriously, I haven't seen anybody hitting the channels up with "Looking for Trak geared plate tank for befallen instance, please help" or anything.

Detor · 01-09-2009, 05:01 PM

If they start nerfing items from previous expansions as part of the hate overhaul like this item for instance that'll just reinforce that they DO need to change old items and you'll have a flood of people asking that various items that became less effective with these changes be boosted to compensate - and once they've changed one item because its effectiveness was altered they can't say to others "Oh, we aren't going to go back and change old items."

Glerin · 01-09-2009, 05:03 PM

the trak shield itself is the exact opposite of what they want tanks to be - responsible for their own aggro, it should be changed IMO

Bruener · 01-09-2009, 05:46 PM

This thread is a joke. The item is completely in-line compared to the rest of this guys loot table. That shield should be the best shield in game because it is from the end mob of RoK, it should not be replaced except by avatar loot (like they would actually put a shield on the loot tables) or halfway into TSO or further. Yes the hate gain is nice, but it is a clicky buff. I am done responding to this thread because it isn't even worth the time.

Danter · 01-09-2009, 06:22 PM

Glerin wrote:

the trak shield itself is the exact opposite of what they want tanks to be - responsible for their own aggro, it should be changed IMO

At least someone can understand the point of my thread. Thanks.

Argyuile · 01-09-2009, 06:43 PM

Bruener wrote:

This thread is a joke. The item is completely in-line compared to the rest of this guys loot table. That shield should be the best shield in game because it is from the end mob of RoK, it should not be replaced except by avatar loot (like they would actually put a shield on the loot tables) or halfway into TSO or further. Yes the hate gain is nice, but it is a clicky buff. I am done responding to this thread because it isn't even worth the time.

Did you even read the clicky buff? Do you know what the recast is? I doubt it after your comment. Also it has nothing to do with the other items on his loot table it has to do with the agro changes coming in GU51. Hooked on Phonics for the win.

Pins · 01-09-2009, 06:46 PM

Bruener wrote:

This thread is a joke. The item is completely in-line compared to the rest of this guys loot table. That shield should be the best shield in game because it is from the end mob of RoK, it should not be replaced except by avatar loot (like they would actually put a shield on the loot tables) or halfway into TSO or further. Yes the hate gain is nice, but it is a clicky buff. I am done responding to this thread because it isn't even worth the time.

I can't believe you don't know there is a shield on avatar loot tables........

It isn't just a clicky buff, it is a PERMA buff when you have that shield equipped. It's reuse is non-existant, so you can keep it up fll time, thus making aggro(after the changes) for plate tanks to be easy mode that have it, but for those without it, well they are screwed.

digitalblasphemy · 01-09-2009, 07:04 PM

Dantx@Unrest wrote:

This issue is too big of a deal to append to the existing thread about GU 51. This shield will completely imbalance tanking in favor of plate tanks once again.With the nerfing of threat transfers for every class, and deaggro from troubs, amends, etc, You think it would make sense that they nerf old tier loot, right? WRONG. The best hate item in the game, bar none, is going to be a piece of loot that is from an INSTANCED RAID MOB FROM LAST EXPANSION. You've got to be ____ kidding me?!?!Brawlers and any plate tanks who do not have this shield are simply not going to be able to hold sufficient aggro, since defensive stance nerfs autoattack. I'm shocked brawlers aren't raising hell about this issue.

Haha, wow, item envy perhaps?

I don't have this item, but I know the effort and determination it takes to beat this zone. I've killed Trak many times and have never seen this drop other than once for the guild MT. I just love how people all of a sudden fly out of the woodwork and start crying about things that have been in game and unchanged for the best part of a year.

And how many guilds on each server can actually kill this mob? It's doesn't make any difference if this is from the last expansion, the mob is still an orange con, it's still tough as nails and will be a mob most raiding guilds will never beat until the lvl cap is raised to 90.

The only reason you are complaining is you probably play a class that cannot use it. Therefore, if you can't have it, nobody can. I don't have it, and have survived so far in this game. By all accounts the new stance changes are not great for fighters in D stance with the nerf to melee and other things. But this shield isn't going to solve those problems is it. Let the people who have it, enjoy it and use it. They earned it. Let the people who have worked hard to get one, continue to strive and get one.

Focus your attention not on a shield that only a handful of people on my server even have, but rather on something that will affect us ALL. The loss huge loss in melee autoattack dmg from using D stance.

Argyuile · 01-09-2009, 07:28 PM

Haha, wow, item envy perhaps?
I don't have this item, but I know the effort and determination it takes to beat this zone. I've killed Trak many times and have never seen this drop other than once for the guild MT. I just love how people all of a sudden fly out of the woodwork and start crying about things that have been in game and unchanged for the best part of a year.
And how many guilds on each server can actually kill this mob? It's doesn't make any difference if this is from the last expansion, the mob is still an orange con, it's still tough as nails and will be a mob most raiding guilds will never beat until the lvl cap is raised to 90.
The only reason you are complaining is you probably play a class that cannot use it. Therefore, if you can't have it, nobody can. I don't have it, and have survived so far in this game. By all accounts the new stance changes are not great for fighters in D stance with the nerf to melee and other things. But this shield isn't going to solve those problems is it. Let the people who have it, enjoy it and use it. They earned it. Let the people who have worked hard to get one, continue to strive and get one.
Focus your attention not on a shield that only a handful of people on my server even have, but rather on something that will affect us ALL. The loss huge loss in melee autoattack dmg from using D stance.

Yes I'm sure Confirmed one of the top guilds on any server has item envy. Unrest has at least 5 guilds if not more that can kill trak. My guild has 2 of these shields and we didn't start killing Trak until the end of the expansion.

The item could have been in the game for 200 years and it woudnt matter until the fighter hate changes. Thats the catylist. Not OMG I was XANADU and I saw this UBER ITEM which is apparently what you think happened.

If you don't understand why the hate changes make this item so powerful then thats probably a large reason why you have such a difficult time with Trak.

Eveningsong · 01-09-2009, 07:35 PM

It might help to look at a version from Test_copy to see if the item has actually been modified already...

Pins · 01-09-2009, 09:07 PM

Eveningsong wrote:

It might help to look at a version from Test_copy to see if the item has actually been modified already...

It hasn't.

Bruener · 01-09-2009, 10:28 PM

Edit because it is not even worth arguing in this post about something that is not an issue.

Pins · 01-09-2009, 10:39 PM

No, any tank would be a [Removed for Content] to use the Avatar Shield because they'll hold better aggro with the Trak Shield after these changes, and they probably have enough survivability as it is without the Avatar Shield. Thus, why even have that Avatar Shield exist if the Trak Shield is that good? Fact is, Trak Shield effect needs to be modified. It IS one of the 3 hate transfers that still exist. It should not be as good as one that is has a 2 minute recast and 15s duration. The fact is, this item is too good with the hate changes.

But hey, I guess completely broken items are fine. I mean, kind of like the Summoner TSO Legendary Set Robe, or the Greater Void Bane procs which end up stacking.

Cragger · 01-10-2009, 01:37 AM

This shield has already taken one major hit in the change to shield block chance, all it is now is 5% shield effectiveness. Compared to the 25% and greater of TSO heroic instanced shields. Leave it alone, those that have this item worked long and hard to get it and deserve what they have. Go put your envy into something else.

docpaulp · 01-10-2009, 06:04 AM

I want to see those 25 % + shields. Because everyone from instances i see has 15% maximum on it.

And also, it's not envy. Most of the people that want to change it are in guilds that HAVE it already. Please, try to see the reason behind this : If Soe is gonna change all transfers and hate mechanisms, then do it from start to end, with all gear. And not leave up and old item that totally defies the new rules.

If all fighters have about the same threat output after the change as they had before, or maybe a bit better, and were near the hate gain cap with certain classes without the shield , and maxed it with it, now all (plate) fighters will have about the same aggro as before, but with the added shield none of the previous hate gain will be wasted. Where would brawlers stand then ? Further behind, again.

It's like taking away the unbreakable warlock root prior to LU 13 but being able to do a looooong winded quest for all mages to get an item that enhances roots to be unbreakable again , that still existed after the LU - not the best analogy but i hope that you get the point.

Phank · 01-10-2009, 01:18 PM

Taking bets on nerf bat hitting Trak Shield this week. 10% is way O.P. with the new changes to Threat mgt. It is still a difficult item to obtain for most players and should have a worthy effect. I would be happy to see the 10% reduced to 3% like the original version of Siphon Hate. 3% is acceptable.

What is not acceptable is making it a clicky with a harsh reuse timer, or changing the Effect altogether. I can see it now, "Effect: Has a chance to cast Trakanon's Nutsack when caster is hit by melee weapon. Effect will cast 1.2 times per minute. - Hits target for 500 poison damage every 2 seconds, lasts 10 seconds."

Spe · 01-10-2009, 01:38 PM

One of the ways of nerf is to make it timed clicky. Say 12 sec on 2 minutes recast (a bit like another trak item - the mage belt).

Pins · 01-10-2009, 04:35 PM

Spetz@Runnyeye wrote:

One of the ways of nerf is to make it timed clicky. Say 12 sec on 2 minutes recast (a bit like another trak item - the mage belt).

That would be a fair change. Considering the spell equivalent for Paladins is 36% with a 15s duration and 2 minute recast(or was it 3 minute).

BleemTeam · 01-10-2009, 06:25 PM

With the Trak Shield being nearly broken for so long the opposite way, I'm really on the fence about the new changes coupled with the Shield's current state. I would consider a fair change to be in line with the way the rest of the transfer classes' abilities being changed to. Meaning, give it a proc of Hold the Line, per se. When target is it, it will proc Furious Presence causing 1500 Threat. (Which is resistable obviously)

I don't think it's going to be hard at all based on the Tests we've conducted to hold aggro as a Guardian. That is without this shield equipped btw.

Zagats · 01-10-2009, 07:10 PM

I guess I am gonna have one seriously overpowered alt now!!!

Leave it as is..... heh

Nakash · 01-10-2009, 09:49 PM

Trak Shield is broken in the moment on Test (you cant use the clicky) so it seems the change is on the way.

forge32 · 01-11-2009, 04:45 AM

Track shield losses the 10 % of group hate siphon, becuase tanks should no longer depend on others for hate then the monks 10 % siphon raid wide should be removed to.

Watch what you ask for because that will also fall in the same category.

Nebbeny · 01-11-2009, 06:37 AM

Please, try to be less ambigious when you say monks 10% siphon raid wide. Some might take that to mean monks take 10% hate from all 23 people in the raid, which is stupid, but there are people like that. It's an aa, that adds a transfer to the avoidance buffs monks get, where if it's on a non-fighter, it siphons 9% of their hate, and if placed on a fighter, it gives them 4% of the monks hate. Traks shield siphoned 10% of the GROUPS hate, thats 10%, x5, this is 41 more than the monks, and comparing the two is just idiotic.

thial · 01-11-2009, 07:47 PM

change the shield than remove Sigil from paladins cause that's exactly what the shield does...and if i read a post from arilek(how ever u spell his name) there not removing Sigil. Get over it its an uber item that drops from an uber mob that will be well earned once a tank can actually obtain it so let them its not going to complicate any kind of balance and if u think it does like I said get over yourself. If it dropped from say OK or even leviathan than maybe it needs a nerf but considering how hard it really is to obtain its not OP by any means...again get over your self if u think it needs a nerf.

edit

on test

sigil transfers 36% group hate to the pally for 15 sec 2 min recast..nerf the shield nerf sigil end of story

Chefren · 01-12-2009, 05:39 AM

Glerin wrote:

the trak shield itself is the exact opposite of what they want tanks to be - responsible for their own aggro, it should be changed IMO

It could be changed into something like +10% to base taunt amounts when equipped to fit in line with the fighter revamp?

forge32 · 01-12-2009, 06:14 AM

Einina@Runnyeye wrote:

Glerin wrote:
the trak shield itself is the exact opposite of what they want tanks to be - responsible for their own aggro, it should be changed IMO
It could be changed into something like +10% to base taunt amounts when equipped to fit in line with the fighter revamp?

Yes the monks siphon can be done same way to. =)

If going to totally abolish hate siphon abilities all that exist in game should be removed.Half the time i wonder what you guys are thinking i mean seriously.

I know when1 group/raid member die's all tanks then can turn around, and tell them dang im too OP only one person died instead of the majority of group/raid.Will this suit the communities demands then?.I mean you start off omg tanks dps to high ,and now its omg tanks now have abilities/item's/aa to help them hold agro.Get a grip all ready plz.This statement was not solely directed at you but to the community of QQ's that are out for blood for something incredibly so stupid.

Dorieon · 01-12-2009, 06:51 AM

Lol. I like how you act like monks are the majority of people asking for this change. Seriously, its funny to me.

You are reaching hard to backlash at people because some want your shield changed. Well monks aren't the ones you should attack because most of us could care less if they got rid of that ability and gave us something more useful for ourselves.

Take the monk 'siphon' AA I couldn't care less. The only monks that really use it are us raiders and we take it so we can dump hate to the MT (and not all raiders take it). So like I said, please take it away. But I hope they give us a stoneskin or maybe a Moderate type AA ability. I mean all things being fair and all that, a moderate aa would be ok right?

forge32 · 01-12-2009, 07:56 AM

Dorieon@Unrest wrote:

Lol. I like how you act like monks are the majority of people asking for this change. Seriously, its funny to me.
You are reaching hard to backlash at people because some want your shield changed. Well monks aren't the ones you should attack because most of us could care less if they got rid of that ability and gave us something more useful for ourselves.
Take the monk 'siphon' AA I couldn't care less. The only monks that really use it are us raiders and we take it so we can dump hate to the MT (and not all raiders take it). So like I said, please take it away. But I hope they give us a stoneskin or maybe a Moderate type AA ability. I mean all things being fair and all that, a moderate aa would be ok right?

Did i say the majority of monks? No i believe i said the majority of the eq2 community that of course is not a plate tank.LTR.

Your response how ever to defend monks is quite amazeing though.But yeah sure you can have all that stuff when all plate tanks as well get fd, and equivalent dps.You handle the laying down on the job duty, with high dps, and let the plate tanks handle the holding of agro, and actually being able to take the heavy hits.

Maybe my response will show you how irelevent youres was.Take my previous posts personally like an attack against monks when actually the posts where made to show how foolish the op really was.

Are you familuar with sarcasm?

01-09-2009, 04:38 PM	#2
Dasein Loremaster Join Date: Nov 2004 Posts: 2,847	Dantx@Unrest wrote: This issue is too big of a deal to append to the existing thread about GU 51. This shield will completely imbalance tanking in favor of plate tanks once again.With the nerfing of threat transfers for every class, and deaggro from troubs, amends, etc, You think it would make sense that they nerf old tier loot, right? WRONG. The best hate item in the game, bar none, is going to be a piece of loot that is from an INSTANCED RAID MOB FROM LAST EXPANSION. You've got to be ____ kidding me?!?!Brawlers and any plate tanks who do not have this shield are simply not going to be able to hold sufficient aggro, since defensive stance nerfs autoattack. I'm shocked brawlers aren't raising hell about this issue. You can probably count on one hand the number of tanks on each server with this shield. It's rare enough to be a non-issue when considering class balance. It is powerful, but there's other comparable items, and we have not really scratched the surface of the upper-end TSO items, either. __________________ Troll Lord Casywdian

01-09-2009, 04:46 PM	#3
Aule Server: Guk Loremaster Join Date: Dec 2005 Posts: 1,360	If a trak geared tank is actually running a group instance then one of two cases applies: 1) It's a guild group, in which case everybody has awesome items and who cares. 2) It's a PUG of some sort, in which case the tank is going to be so much better than the average DPS classes that it's not going to matter whether they were wearing that shield or not. I mean seriously, I haven't seen anybody hitting the channels up with "Looking for Trak geared plate tank for befallen instance, please help" or anything. __________________ guk.Aule - 90 coercer \| Troops of Doom \| 90 bruiser - guk.Krindi

01-09-2009, 05:01 PM	#4
Detor Loremaster Join Date: Mar 2008 Posts: 1,198	If they start nerfing items from previous expansions as part of the hate overhaul like this item for instance that'll just reinforce that they DO need to change old items and you'll have a flood of people asking that various items that became less effective with these changes be boosted to compensate - and once they've changed one item because its effectiveness was altered they can't say to others "Oh, we aren't going to go back and change old items." __________________ Comcast (SMC D3G-BIZ) & Verizon Cellphone (Droid Charge)

01-09-2009, 05:46 PM	#6
Bruener Loremaster Join Date: Dec 2004 Posts: 2,010	This thread is a joke. The item is completely in-line compared to the rest of this guys loot table. That shield should be the best shield in game because it is from the end mob of RoK, it should not be replaced except by avatar loot (like they would actually put a shield on the loot tables) or halfway into TSO or further. Yes the hate gain is nice, but it is a clicky buff. I am done responding to this thread because it isn't even worth the time. __________________

01-09-2009, 06:22 PM	#7
Danter General Join Date: Dec 2004 Posts: 321	Glerin wrote: the trak shield itself is the exact opposite of what they want tanks to be - responsible for their own aggro, it should be changed IMO At least someone can understand the point of my thread. Thanks.

01-09-2009, 04:25 PM	#1
Danter General Join Date: Dec 2004 Posts: 321	This issue is too big of a deal to append to the existing thread about GU 51. This shield will completely imbalance tanking in favor of plate tanks once again.With the nerfing of threat transfers for every class, and deaggro from troubs, amends, etc, You think it would make sense that they nerf old tier loot, right? WRONG. The best hate item in the game, bar none, is going to be a piece of loot that is from an INSTANCED RAID MOB FROM LAST EXPANSION. You've got to be ____ kidding me?!?!Brawlers and any plate tanks who do not have this shield are simply not going to be able to hold sufficient aggro, since defensive stance nerfs autoattack. I'm shocked brawlers aren't raising hell about this issue.

01-09-2009, 05:03 PM	#5
Glerin Loremaster Join Date: Mar 2006 Posts: 82	the trak shield itself is the exact opposite of what they want tanks to be - responsible for their own aggro, it should be changed IMO

01-09-2009, 06:43 PM	#8
Argyuile Loremaster Join Date: Nov 2004 Posts: 214	Bruener wrote: This thread is a joke. The item is completely in-line compared to the rest of this guys loot table. That shield should be the best shield in game because it is from the end mob of RoK, it should not be replaced except by avatar loot (like they would actually put a shield on the loot tables) or halfway into TSO or further. Yes the hate gain is nice, but it is a clicky buff. I am done responding to this thread because it isn't even worth the time. Did you even read the clicky buff? Do you know what the recast is? I doubt it after your comment. Also it has nothing to do with the other items on his loot table it has to do with the agro changes coming in GU51. Hooked on Phonics for the win. __________________ Disso and SD merged onto a server with no competition for contested thus proving once and for all that nobody really "enjoys" racing for contested content. They just enjoy having it on lock down so no one else can enjoy it. Contested epics are a waste of programming time and resources.

01-09-2009, 06:46 PM	#9
Pins General Join Date: Nov 2004 Posts: 3,040	Bruener wrote: This thread is a joke. The item is completely in-line compared to the rest of this guys loot table. That shield should be the best shield in game because it is from the end mob of RoK, it should not be replaced except by avatar loot (like they would actually put a shield on the loot tables) or halfway into TSO or further. Yes the hate gain is nice, but it is a clicky buff. I am done responding to this thread because it isn't even worth the time. I can't believe you don't know there is a shield on avatar loot tables........ It isn't just a clicky buff, it is a PERMA buff when you have that shield equipped. It's reuse is non-existant, so you can keep it up fll time, thus making aggro(after the changes) for plate tanks to be easy mode that have it, but for those without it, well they are screwed. __________________ Calaglin, Former Illusionist/Guild Leader of Dissolution on Nektulos Calaglin, Former Illusionist/Guild Leader of Confirmed on Unrest

01-09-2009, 07:04 PM	#10
digitalblasphemy Loremaster Join Date: Dec 2004 Posts: 274	Dantx@Unrest wrote: This issue is too big of a deal to append to the existing thread about GU 51. This shield will completely imbalance tanking in favor of plate tanks once again.With the nerfing of threat transfers for every class, and deaggro from troubs, amends, etc, You think it would make sense that they nerf old tier loot, right? WRONG. The best hate item in the game, bar none, is going to be a piece of loot that is from an INSTANCED RAID MOB FROM LAST EXPANSION. You've got to be ____ kidding me?!?!Brawlers and any plate tanks who do not have this shield are simply not going to be able to hold sufficient aggro, since defensive stance nerfs autoattack. I'm shocked brawlers aren't raising hell about this issue. Haha, wow, item envy perhaps? I don't have this item, but I know the effort and determination it takes to beat this zone. I've killed Trak many times and have never seen this drop other than once for the guild MT. I just love how people all of a sudden fly out of the woodwork and start crying about things that have been in game and unchanged for the best part of a year. And how many guilds on each server can actually kill this mob? It's doesn't make any difference if this is from the last expansion, the mob is still an orange con, it's still tough as nails and will be a mob most raiding guilds will never beat until the lvl cap is raised to 90. The only reason you are complaining is you probably play a class that cannot use it. Therefore, if you can't have it, nobody can. I don't have it, and have survived so far in this game. By all accounts the new stance changes are not great for fighters in D stance with the nerf to melee and other things. But this shield isn't going to solve those problems is it. Let the people who have it, enjoy it and use it. They earned it. Let the people who have worked hard to get one, continue to strive and get one. Focus your attention not on a shield that only a handful of people on my server even have, but rather on something that will affect us ALL. The loss huge loss in melee autoattack dmg from using D stance.

01-09-2009, 07:28 PM	#11
Argyuile Loremaster Join Date: Nov 2004 Posts: 214	Haha, wow, item envy perhaps? I don't have this item, but I know the effort and determination it takes to beat this zone. I've killed Trak many times and have never seen this drop other than once for the guild MT. I just love how people all of a sudden fly out of the woodwork and start crying about things that have been in game and unchanged for the best part of a year. And how many guilds on each server can actually kill this mob? It's doesn't make any difference if this is from the last expansion, the mob is still an orange con, it's still tough as nails and will be a mob most raiding guilds will never beat until the lvl cap is raised to 90. The only reason you are complaining is you probably play a class that cannot use it. Therefore, if you can't have it, nobody can. I don't have it, and have survived so far in this game. By all accounts the new stance changes are not great for fighters in D stance with the nerf to melee and other things. But this shield isn't going to solve those problems is it. Let the people who have it, enjoy it and use it. They earned it. Let the people who have worked hard to get one, continue to strive and get one. Focus your attention not on a shield that only a handful of people on my server even have, but rather on something that will affect us ALL. The loss huge loss in melee autoattack dmg from using D stance. Yes I'm sure Confirmed one of the top guilds on any server has item envy. Unrest has at least 5 guilds if not more that can kill trak. My guild has 2 of these shields and we didn't start killing Trak until the end of the expansion. The item could have been in the game for 200 years and it woudnt matter until the fighter hate changes. Thats the catylist. Not OMG I was XANADU and I saw this UBER ITEM which is apparently what you think happened. If you don't understand why the hate changes make this item so powerful then thats probably a large reason why you have such a difficult time with Trak. __________________ Disso and SD merged onto a server with no competition for contested thus proving once and for all that nobody really "enjoys" racing for contested content. They just enjoy having it on lock down so no one else can enjoy it. Contested epics are a waste of programming time and resources.

01-09-2009, 07:35 PM	#12
Eveningsong Tester Join Date: Nov 2004 Posts: 3,844	It might help to look at a version from Test_copy to see if the item has actually been modified already...

01-09-2009, 09:07 PM	#13
Pins General Join Date: Nov 2004 Posts: 3,040	Eveningsong wrote: It might help to look at a version from Test_copy to see if the item has actually been modified already... It hasn't. __________________ Calaglin, Former Illusionist/Guild Leader of Dissolution on Nektulos Calaglin, Former Illusionist/Guild Leader of Confirmed on Unrest

01-09-2009, 10:28 PM	#14
Bruener Loremaster Join Date: Dec 2004 Posts: 2,010	Edit because it is not even worth arguing in this post about something that is not an issue. __________________

01-09-2009, 10:39 PM	#15
Pins General Join Date: Nov 2004 Posts: 3,040	No, any tank would be a [Removed for Content] to use the Avatar Shield because they'll hold better aggro with the Trak Shield after these changes, and they probably have enough survivability as it is without the Avatar Shield. Thus, why even have that Avatar Shield exist if the Trak Shield is that good? Fact is, Trak Shield effect needs to be modified. It IS one of the 3 hate transfers that still exist. It should not be as good as one that is has a 2 minute recast and 15s duration. The fact is, this item is too good with the hate changes. But hey, I guess completely broken items are fine. I mean, kind of like the Summoner TSO Legendary Set Robe, or the Greater Void Bane procs which end up stacking. __________________ Calaglin, Former Illusionist/Guild Leader of Dissolution on Nektulos Calaglin, Former Illusionist/Guild Leader of Confirmed on Unrest

01-10-2009, 01:37 AM	#16
Cragger Loremaster Join Date: Nov 2004 Posts: 253	This shield has already taken one major hit in the change to shield block chance, all it is now is 5% shield effectiveness. Compared to the 25% and greater of TSO heroic instanced shields. Leave it alone, those that have this item worked long and hard to get it and deserve what they have. Go put your envy into something else. __________________

01-10-2009, 06:04 AM	#17
docpaulp General Join Date: Dec 2004 Posts: 98	I want to see those 25 % + shields. Because everyone from instances i see has 15% maximum on it. And also, it's not envy. Most of the people that want to change it are in guilds that HAVE it already. Please, try to see the reason behind this : If Soe is gonna change all transfers and hate mechanisms, then do it from start to end, with all gear. And not leave up and old item that totally defies the new rules. If all fighters have about the same threat output after the change as they had before, or maybe a bit better, and were near the hate gain cap with certain classes without the shield , and maxed it with it, now all (plate) fighters will have about the same aggro as before, but with the added shield none of the previous hate gain will be wasted. Where would brawlers stand then ? Further behind, again. It's like taking away the unbreakable warlock root prior to LU 13 but being able to do a looooong winded quest for all mages to get an item that enhances roots to be unbreakable again , that still existed after the LU - not the best analogy but i hope that you get the point.

01-10-2009, 01:18 PM	#18
Phank Loremaster Join Date: Feb 2005 Posts: 275	Taking bets on nerf bat hitting Trak Shield this week. 10% is way O.P. with the new changes to Threat mgt. It is still a difficult item to obtain for most players and should have a worthy effect. I would be happy to see the 10% reduced to 3% like the original version of Siphon Hate. 3% is acceptable. What is not acceptable is making it a clicky with a harsh reuse timer, or changing the Effect altogether. I can see it now, "Effect: Has a chance to cast Trakanon's Nutsack when caster is hit by melee weapon. Effect will cast 1.2 times per minute. - Hits target for 500 poison damage every 2 seconds, lasts 10 seconds."

01-10-2009, 01:38 PM	#19
Spe Server: Runnyeye Guild: Navigator Dragons Rank: Leader General Join Date: Apr 2005 Posts: 56	One of the ways of nerf is to make it timed clicky. Say 12 sec on 2 minutes recast (a bit like another trak item - the mage belt). __________________ Ð¨ÑƒÐ¼Ð½Ñ‹Ð¹, wizard 80 (Barren Sky) Ð¡Ð¿ÐµÑ†, guardian 80 (Barren Sky) Ð*Ð°Ñ‚Ð¾Ð½Ð³Ð¾Ð±Ð¾Ð¹, troubadour 80 (Barren Sky) ÐŸÐ¾Ð±ÐµÐ³Ð°Ð¹Ñ‡Ð¸Ðº, swashbuckler 72 (Barren Sky) Furik, fury 70 (Runnyeye) - rip Spetz, bruiser 61 (Runnyeye) - rip

01-10-2009, 04:35 PM	#20
Pins General Join Date: Nov 2004 Posts: 3,040	Spetz@Runnyeye wrote: One of the ways of nerf is to make it timed clicky. Say 12 sec on 2 minutes recast (a bit like another trak item - the mage belt). That would be a fair change. Considering the spell equivalent for Paladins is 36% with a 15s duration and 2 minute recast(or was it 3 minute). __________________ Calaglin, Former Illusionist/Guild Leader of Dissolution on Nektulos Calaglin, Former Illusionist/Guild Leader of Confirmed on Unrest

01-10-2009, 06:25 PM	#21
BleemTeam Loremaster Join Date: Nov 2004 Posts: 425	With the Trak Shield being nearly broken for so long the opposite way, I'm really on the fence about the new changes coupled with the Shield's current state. I would consider a fair change to be in line with the way the rest of the transfer classes' abilities being changed to. Meaning, give it a proc of Hold the Line, per se. When target is it, it will proc Furious Presence causing 1500 Threat. (Which is resistable obviously) I don't think it's going to be hard at all based on the Tests we've conducted to hold aggro as a Guardian. That is without this shield equipped btw. __________________ "What's left to ponder?"

01-10-2009, 07:10 PM	#22
Zagats Loremaster Join Date: Aug 2005 Posts: 419	I guess I am gonna have one seriously overpowered alt now!!! Leave it as is..... heh __________________ 80 Defiler - Lawlz/ 80 Alchy/ Master Tink/ 189AA aka 80 Brig - Brekon/ 80 Jeweler/ Master Tink/ 198 AA Retired!!! 80 Coercer - Freeqq/ Master Tink/ 168 AA 80 Guard - Zomg/ Master Muter/ 192 AA 80 Zerk - Zomg (R.I.P) 80 Zerk - Barn/ 80 Provi/ 162 AA 80 Dirge - Micetro/ 165AA 80 Swash - Erno/ 141 AA 80 Templar - Shortey/ 75 Alchy/ 151 AA 80 Inquis - Ubet (R.I.P) 80 Templar - Ubet (R.I.P) 80 Wiz - Brnd/ 145AA 72Conjy - Zzzz 71 Assasin - Scoole 70 Swash - Bladeflash ... I play too much.

01-10-2009, 09:49 PM	#23
Nakash Loremaster Join Date: Nov 2004 Posts: 213	Trak Shield is broken in the moment on Test (you cant use the clicky) so it seems the change is on the way. __________________

01-11-2009, 04:45 AM	#24
forge32 Loremaster Join Date: Nov 2004 Posts: 71	Track shield losses the 10 % of group hate siphon, becuase tanks should no longer depend on others for hate then the monks 10 % siphon raid wide should be removed to. Watch what you ask for because that will also fall in the same category.

01-11-2009, 06:37 AM	#25
Nebbeny Tester Join Date: Nov 2004 Posts: 420	Please, try to be less ambigious when you say monks 10% siphon raid wide. Some might take that to mean monks take 10% hate from all 23 people in the raid, which is stupid, but there are people like that. It's an aa, that adds a transfer to the avoidance buffs monks get, where if it's on a non-fighter, it siphons 9% of their hate, and if placed on a fighter, it gives them 4% of the monks hate. Traks shield siphoned 10% of the GROUPS hate, thats 10%, x5, this is 41 more than the monks, and comparing the two is just idiotic.

01-11-2009, 07:47 PM	#26
thial Loremaster Join Date: Nov 2004 Posts: 257	change the shield than remove Sigil from paladins cause that's exactly what the shield does...and if i read a post from arilek(how ever u spell his name) there not removing Sigil. Get over it its an uber item that drops from an uber mob that will be well earned once a tank can actually obtain it so let them its not going to complicate any kind of balance and if u think it does like I said get over yourself. If it dropped from say OK or even leviathan than maybe it needs a nerf but considering how hard it really is to obtain its not OP by any means...again get over your self if u think it needs a nerf. edit on test sigil transfers 36% group hate to the pally for 15 sec 2 min recast..nerf the shield nerf sigil end of story __________________

01-12-2009, 05:39 AM	#27
Chefren Loremaster Join Date: Mar 2005 Location: Finland Posts: 397	Glerin wrote: the trak shield itself is the exact opposite of what they want tanks to be - responsible for their own aggro, it should be changed IMO It could be changed into something like +10% to base taunt amounts when equipped to fit in line with the fighter revamp? __________________

01-12-2009, 06:14 AM	#28
forge32 Loremaster Join Date: Nov 2004 Posts: 71	Einina@Runnyeye wrote: Glerin wrote: the trak shield itself is the exact opposite of what they want tanks to be - responsible for their own aggro, it should be changed IMO It could be changed into something like +10% to base taunt amounts when equipped to fit in line with the fighter revamp? Yes the monks siphon can be done same way to. =) If going to totally abolish hate siphon abilities all that exist in game should be removed.Half the time i wonder what you guys are thinking i mean seriously. I know when1 group/raid member die's all tanks then can turn around, and tell them dang im too OP only one person died instead of the majority of group/raid.Will this suit the communities demands then?.I mean you start off omg tanks dps to high ,and now its omg tanks now have abilities/item's/aa to help them hold agro.Get a grip all ready plz.This statement was not solely directed at you but to the community of QQ's that are out for blood for something incredibly so stupid.

01-12-2009, 06:51 AM	#29
Dorieon Server: Guk Guild: Despair Rank: Member Loremaster Join Date: Jun 2007 Posts: 171	Lol. I like how you act like monks are the majority of people asking for this change. Seriously, its funny to me. You are reaching hard to backlash at people because some want your shield changed. Well monks aren't the ones you should attack because most of us could care less if they got rid of that ability and gave us something more useful for ourselves. Take the monk 'siphon' AA I couldn't care less. The only monks that really use it are us raiders and we take it so we can dump hate to the MT (and not all raiders take it). So like I said, please take it away. But I hope they give us a stoneskin or maybe a Moderate type AA ability. I mean all things being fair and all that, a moderate aa would be ok right?

01-12-2009, 07:56 AM	#30
forge32 Loremaster Join Date: Nov 2004 Posts: 71	Dorieon@Unrest wrote: Lol. I like how you act like monks are the majority of people asking for this change. Seriously, its funny to me. You are reaching hard to backlash at people because some want your shield changed. Well monks aren't the ones you should attack because most of us could care less if they got rid of that ability and gave us something more useful for ourselves. Take the monk 'siphon' AA I couldn't care less. The only monks that really use it are us raiders and we take it so we can dump hate to the MT (and not all raiders take it). So like I said, please take it away. But I hope they give us a stoneskin or maybe a Moderate type AA ability. I mean all things being fair and all that, a moderate aa would be ok right? Did i say the majority of monks? No i believe i said the majority of the eq2 community that of course is not a plate tank.LTR. Your response how ever to defend monks is quite amazeing though.But yeah sure you can have all that stuff when all plate tanks as well get fd, and equivalent dps.You handle the laying down on the job duty, with high dps, and let the plate tanks handle the holding of agro, and actually being able to take the heavy hits. Maybe my response will show you how irelevent youres was.Take my previous posts personally like an attack against monks when actually the posts where made to show how foolish the op really was. Are you familuar with sarcasm?