can we bring back level locking at a higher range? - Page 2

Oo · 07-15-2008, 02:24 PM

Bozidar wrote:

Doopsy@Nagafen wrote:
You do realize don't you that not everyone has the time or inclination to grind to end-game and then grind for gear/plat once they get there? That's not being a noob, that's life. If you played 5 -10 hours per week, you could get all the PvP you wanted, experience different toons, equip them as well as your competition, etc. in T2-T3. Fact is, it was easier for a casual player to get into EQ2 PvP and compete before lvl locking was killed, than since when you really have to get to T8 and compete with people who are raiding, farming tokens, farming instances nightly, etc. More casual playerswill never ever be able to compete with that. (Don't get me wrong, if you have the time and want to do that, great and you should get awesome rewards, but the lower level PvP provided another option to some.) Not everyone can or will invest the hours to get to end-game just so they can enjoy the most populated PvP tier. With the low-level PvP at it's pinnacle, everyone could participate.
they want the casual player to have to spend more time in game to accomplish things and gain enjoyment.
i'm not sure why they want to de-casual the casual player, because the monthly subscription fee is the same either way.. but that's what they've done, imo.

I answered this in one of the many other threads on this topic. The short answer is they did it because they were bored with the sluggish end-game PvP and wanted to force them level up so they could kill them. That's all.

Bozidar · 07-15-2008, 02:28 PM

Doopsy@Nagafen wrote:

I answered this in one of the many other threads on this topic. The short answer is they did it because they were bored with the sluggish end-game PvP and wanted to force them level up so they could kill them. That's all.

It wasn't a question you can answer. I was talking about soe, not the folks who lobbied to have locking removed.

Bozidar · 07-15-2008, 02:33 PM

MMKA wrote:

What is not balanced about it? I have been playing in T2 quite a bit lately with a variety of classes and have yet to see one all powerful class. Healers may have a slight advantage over some classes and clothies may be a little weak against other classes but overall, it's 100% better than T8 because every class has a good chance to win.
If nothing else, the fights last longer than 3 seconds (unless you are ganking a noob 4 levels lower which really isn't pvp anyway).

You're playing T2 quite a bit lately? I played low level pvp for 2 years. There's no balance in T2-T8. If you're thinking that any class has a chance to win in T2, it's because you haven't faced the professional locked players who have either leveled up or left.

Oo · 07-15-2008, 02:39 PM

Bozidar wrote:

Doopsy@Nagafen wrote:
I answered this in one of the many other threads on this topic. The short answer is they did it because they were bored with the sluggish end-game PvP and wanted to force them level up so they could kill them. That's all.
It wasn't a question you can answer. I was talking about soe, not the folks who lobbied to have locking removed.

Well, without getting into a long analysis of the changes Devs have made to PvP over time based on the public outcry, I think it's one and the same. Whether SoE actually bought into the premise the whiners gave (taking care of the new players) is an interesting academic question. But, the reality is likely that they just responded to the repeated complaining of end-gamers.

Paikis · 07-15-2008, 02:40 PM

Doopsy@Nagafen wrote:

Devildog93 wrote:
I know this has been talked about in other threads, but i am wondering how much interest there would be in reviving level-locking for pvp at the lower tiers. We know the problems associated with this: griefing new guys. -Faize
I always had to laugh at this line of logic for killing low-level pvp.

Its the truth. I've rolled alts while the so called 'golden age' of T2 PvP lockers was going strong. It sucked. You couldn't leave immunity without being ganked by groups. Timorous Deep was impossible to quest in because there were GROUPS of griefers waiting for you to break immunity. Ever tied to kill 9 scorpions when you have a whole group beating on you as soon as your immunity breaks? Its not fun.

TerminalEyesore · 07-15-2008, 02:40 PM

I understand that the PvP experience gains were put in to force level locked griefers to level up and move on, allowing new players a little bit of breathing room to play. But by forcing ALL PvPers to gain experience, you're basically punishing everyone for the misdeeds of the few. You're throwing out the baby with the bathwater. I feel like I'd LIKE to PvP, but if I keep it up, I'm gonna level out of my favorite PvP range. I'm not a griefer, but the PvP experience penalty hits me just as hard as it does those it was put in for. If I'm out harvesting, and I successfully defend myself against an attacker, I'm pushed that much closer out of the gaming level(s) I enjoy. It almost makes me want to lose, just to not suffer the victory penalty, which is more significant than the reward. Which is a shame, cause this IS a PvP server, and PvPing is what we're all here for (isn't it?). I want to enjoy the combat with another player, but that drawback is always gnawing on me, making me reconsider doing what I'm working so hard preparing for, even to the point of throwing the fight. So what's the point?So, what if, when you're level locked, you ONLY gain PvP experience when you kill someone on your recent list. If a person on your recent kill list attacks you, then you don't gain experience for successfully defending yourself. That way they can't exploit the system. Wouldn't this be more intelligently targeted toward the actual griefers?If you're in a group and ANYONE in that group kills someone on ANYONE IN THAT GROUP'S recent list, then you gain experience. If you don't like that, then tell the person, chew their [Removed for Content] out, or leave that group. This will get the message out that not everyone is OK with griefing, along with STILL leveling the actual griefers.Gaining 4% experience for killing a blue that attacked me at level 22 was very disturbing, and disappointing. It makes me not want to fight back too many times, and basically makes me feel like I have to pay more attention to my experience gains that just simply enjoy the game.

Bozidar · 07-15-2008, 02:48 PM

Paikis wrote:

Doopsy@Nagafen wrote:
Devildog93 wrote:
I know this has been talked about in other threads, but i am wondering how much interest there would be in reviving level-locking for pvp at the lower tiers. We know the problems associated with this: griefing new guys. -Faize
I always had to laugh at this line of logic for killing low-level pvp.
Its the truth. I've rolled alts while the so called 'golden age' of T2 PvP lockers was going strong. It sucked. You couldn't leave immunity without being ganked by groups. Timorous Deep was impossible to quest in because there were GROUPS of griefers waiting for you to break immunity. Ever tied to kill 9 scorpions when you have a whole group beating on you as soon as your immunity breaks? Its not fun.

/fail

there was no such thing as Timorous Deep (or even greater feydark) during the golden age of T2 pvp lockers. SMILEY

Dalema · 07-15-2008, 02:51 PM

I'd say T4-T6 are the most balanced in the game.

And T2-T5 Furies are the most powerful Demron? I'd actually have to agree, bar T2. There are still classes that can walk over them though: Swashies, brigands, Coercers, Illys, Inqs etc. I'd say that in pure 1v1s, Coercer has always been the most powerful in the middle tiers.

Oo · 07-15-2008, 02:52 PM

Paikis wrote:

Doopsy@Nagafen wrote:
Devildog93 wrote:
I know this has been talked about in other threads, but i am wondering how much interest there would be in reviving level-locking for pvp at the lower tiers. We know the problems associated with this: griefing new guys. -Faize
I always had to laugh at this line of logic for killing low-level pvp.
Its the truth. I've rolled alts while the so called 'golden age' of T2 PvP lockers was going strong. It sucked. You couldn't leave immunity without being ganked by groups. Timorous Deep was impossible to quest in because there were GROUPS of griefers waiting for you to break immunity. Ever tied to kill 9 scorpions when you have a whole group beating on you as soon as your immunity breaks? Its not fun.

You miss the point. My point, Paikis, is come to naggy and try to do some quests off Dreg's Landing Docks. How much fun was it trying to do SS quests a year ago as a lvl 45 toon? The point is that problem you mention wasn't a problem endemic to T2 level lockers. And the same people who claimed such did the same thing at end-game, but in a much worse setting since they were no-limit zones. That's the hypocrisy I'm speaking of. You know that most of the T2 lockers were end-gamers, and at end-game there was a real lull in PvP. Go back a year and read all those threads...

It was always hard rolling a new toon past lvl 10, from day one of PvP. It sucked once they "fixed" it, that if you did get to that point, you could hardly find any PvP, unless you kept grinding or spent hours hunting. It was fun to most being able to walk into Antonica or CL and fight countless fights in front of the gates.

BTW, If I'm not mistaken, they killed pvp lvl-locking before RoK came out, or about the same time.

Bozidar · 07-15-2008, 02:56 PM

Dalema wrote:

I'd say T4-T6 are the most balanced in the game.
And T2-T5 Furies are the most powerful Demron? I'd actually have to agree, bar T2. There are still classes that can walk over them though: Swashies, brigands, Coercers, Illys, Inqs etc. I'd say that in pure 1v1s, Coercer has always been the most powerful in the middle tiers.

once you hit 50 all balance goes out the door. assassinate, sniper shot, ice comet. Handing out Harm Touches to 3 more classes hardly improved the balance of the game

Dalema · 07-15-2008, 03:03 PM

Meh, I think those abilities are pretty overrated, bar HT. HT (well, MT really) hits a level 34 for what Assassinate normally does at level 50.

Bozidar · 07-15-2008, 03:05 PM

Dalema wrote:

Meh, I think those abilities are pretty overrated, bar HT. HT (well, MT really) hits a level 34 for what Assassinate normally does at level 50.

but they're abilties added to classes that already are quite awesome at bringing the damage..

Dalema · 07-15-2008, 03:13 PM

True, but they aren't as bad as thier T8 versions, or anything like. With about 60% cold resist, I've been hit for over 7.4k by a Bolt of Ice M1, and for 6.2k by Execute.

I agree that those abilites are powerful, but the classes that get them are high DPS classes. They're good, but nothing like as powerful as the T8 versions in comparison.

wellehad0 · 07-15-2008, 03:27 PM

Sightless wrote:

There is no even playing field in the lower levels. You're either lying, or you have no idea what some of the more powerful classes can do. There are no equals to a Fury in T2-T5 PvP, none period.
I'm sorry you can't compete in T8 PvP, the easiest tier to gear up in by the way, but dont' try and lie and say that low level PvP is balanced. It's far from balanced.

i really think then you must not be that skilled at this game.. i have played every class in t2 and have had slayer and above titles with every class and i solo 99% of the time... if i can take a necro out of all classes in t2-t3 and crush any class 1v1 then im sorry to say you FAIL on saying its not balanced.. furys are not strong at all in t2 there damage is only average.. a good illy could destroy a fury would not even know what happend...

so again if you bother to get atleast adept 3's and above for your toon and do the MOK quest then if you fail in pvp its your fault... if you would just take the time to play around with each class in t2-t4 then you would know each class has a huge weakness in one area or another...

so on furys people who say they are OP are the same people who have no idea how to fight them.. my WIZ has NP taken on furrys in t3. furrys dont have the power like wardens do so they are very easy to burn down.. wardens same way since 9/10 people are mele wardens they blow power at a alarming rate and have huge cool downs on there mele CA's so if you are burning them down they have to stop attacking and do nothing but heal. wich means boys and girls they are not attacking you. people who are affraid of t3 furys are the same people who think there are monsters under there bead when all tha tis under your bead is a little roach that you could swat away with ease.. the only point i will give into is yes a 3 man group of nothing but furry sis very strong but so would a 3 man group of wizy or any other class. i would take a 3 man group of wardens over a 3 man group of furys all day long...

rangers same thing when one hits you root and get into there mele range ASAP and they will go down just as fast as a cloth wearing toon.

scouts. sinple dont be in mele range. yes they have a range CA but oh well take it like a man and burn them down before your root breaks (master roots are your friend)

to tell the truth the only class in high t2-t3 that is a little OP is the litte played right Necro.. with masters in life taps fears and chains and a m1 mage pet all you have to do is chain lifeburn then fear and throw on 2 dots and they are done without even getting to hit you..

right now in t2-t4 its not classes who are OP its the AA's and knowing where to put them makes each class.. before only a few people knew how to max AA at lvl 10 now its spamed in chat every 3 seconds. so again if you dont bother to spend a couple hours on your toon then yes you will suck no matter what class you are playing

but of course i must be wrong and need to hurry to be luch meat to the T8 scout gank squads. i jsut hope that when i get there that there will be a huge majical fix where classes will all be on equal terms and that all epic and fable gear will also be equal to all classes...

ok im off to t3 pvp (where you dont need to invest a years time to compete maybe a couple hours at most in getting mats) have fun and sorry you wont see me at the docks anytime soon so your cheap no skilled t8 gank squads will just have to wait a little longer

Bloodfa · 07-15-2008, 03:50 PM

Actually, T8 gank squads are more avoidable than T2 ones were. You've got access to totems that at T2 simply don't exist, for starters. Also, T8 gank squads tend to stay in just a few areas. T2 ... hell, I remember seeing some guys in places that I thought "What the hell? there's nothing over here at all but me?!?!" SMILEY

Just sayin' ...

MMKA · 07-15-2008, 05:17 PM

Bozidar wrote:

You're playing T2 quite a bit lately? I played low level pvp for 2 years. There's no balance in T2-T8. If you're thinking that any class has a chance to win in T2, it's because you haven't faced the professional locked players who have either leveled up or left.

Correction - there wasn't a lot of balance in pvp before they stopped people who had been locked for 3 years from locking. Many of those people had all fabled pvp gear that made them unbeatable. Low level pvp now is a lot different than it was a year ago because most the the pvp geared players have left or leveled.

Now with the writ system, they could allow people to still lock but make it so that in order to get tokens, you automatically get xp when turning in a writ. That would allow people to choose between pvp gear and pvp at their desired level. They could also Decrease the fabled drops in t2-t3 to almost nil or give a huge amount of xp whenever you picked up a fabled item. That would mean that the gear stays where it is now and keeps everyone on a fair playing field at least in a few tears. Even T8 would be better because there would be less people to raid with, hence, less fabled gear and less twinked 80's running around one shotting people. I really don't see a down side to this!

The players were not at fault for the T2 pvp debacle of previous years. SOE screwed up low level pvp by allowing pvp gear too early in the game - or at all for that matter. Take away the gear and the playing field levels out considerably.

The best part is that the T8 gankers will still have plenty of miners and farmers to gank, although the fights may only last .5 seconds then!

Bozidar · 07-15-2008, 05:25 PM

MMKA wrote:

Correction - there wasn't a lot of balance in pvp before they stopped people who had been locked for 3 years from locking. Many of those people had all fabled pvp gear that made them unbeatable. Low level pvp now is a lot different than it was a year ago because most the the pvp geared players have left or leveled.
Now with the writ system, they could allow people to still lock but make it so that in order to get tokens, you automatically get xp when turning in a writ. That would allow people to choose between pvp gear and pvp at their desired level. They could also Decrease the fabled drops in t2-t3 to almost nil or give a huge amount of xp whenever you picked up a fabled item. That would mean that the gear stays where it is now and keeps everyone on a fair playing field at least in a few tears. Even T8 would be better because there would be less people to raid with, hence, less fabled gear and less twinked 80's running around one shotting people. I really don't see a down side to this!
The players were not at fault for the T2 pvp debacle of previous years. SOE screwed up low level pvp by allowing pvp gear too early in the game - or at all for that matter. Take away the gear and the playing field levels out considerably.
The best part is that the T8 gankers will still have plenty of miners and farmers to gank, although the fights may only last .5 seconds then!

The gear has nothing to do with it, those classes are just more powerful -- in a warden's case a LOT more powerful. You dont need fabled gear in T2 either, most of it was crap even back in the day.

Who needs tokens in T2? No one.. [Removed for Content] are ya talking about? And again, T2 fabled stuff is 99% garbage, and quest gear out there is better than it.

You think that 1 piece of pvp gear at 20, 1 piece at 23, and i think 4 by the end of T2 is too much pvp gear early in the game? [Removed for Content] are you talking about man? that gear isn't even that good anymore, see the aformentioned quest gear.

The problem with low level (T2) pvp is that the classes jjust aren't developed enough to really have the tools to deal with all the other classes. Gear is meaningless. I could go out in handcrafted gear on a warden and kill 95/100 people playing this game. I could go out naked on a brigand and never lose in T2 pvp because only swashies can see me, and i know how to get t2 evacs.

ImAnExileL · 07-15-2008, 06:44 PM

I support this change -- a change for the better.T8 PVP sucks. T4/T5 is the best tier tbh.~Peak

Sightless · 07-15-2008, 07:13 PM

Doopsy@Nagafen wrote:

Sightless wrote:
I had multiple T2 twinks, and every time after a week, maybe two I thought to myself; "Wow this is boring, easy, and repetitive. How can anyone not want the challenge of higher level PvP." And every time I either deleted those characters, or leveled to the higher tiers.
You do realize don't you that not everyone has the time or inclination to grind to end-game and then grind for gear/plat once they get there? That's not being a noob, that's life. If you played 5 -10 hours per week, you could get all the PvP you wanted, experience different toons, equip them as well as your competition, etc. in T2-T3. Fact is, it was easier for a casual player to get into EQ2 PvP and compete before lvl locking was killed, than since when you really have to get to T8 and compete with people who are raiding, farming tokens, farming instances nightly, etc. More casual playerswill never ever be able to compete with that. (Don't get me wrong, if you have the time and want to do that, great and you should get awesome rewards, but the lower level PvP provided another option to some.) Not everyone can or will invest the hours to get to end-game just so they can enjoy the most populated PvP tier. With the low-level PvP at it's pinnacle, everyone could participate.

I'm probably among the most casual type of gamers you could imagine. I work two jobs, raise 4 kids, and spend time with my wife. On top of reading books I love, getting bored with one character and making alts. And if that doesn't take my time, I often help everyone in my guild in one form or another, especially if my kids are online playing.

Yet I compete in Tier 8, without raiding, without fabled gear, and on multiple characters. I have a Guardian, level 73 of all things and he is great fun to play. So in Tier 8, playing casually I have a 73 Guardian, 80 Warlock, and 80 Ranger.

In tier 2 there were so many twinks you couldn't even harvest unless you locked a character before level 10, and crafted to a respectable level to go out safely and harvest. Check out Demron's post on how to survive if you're new to PvP. That's my post. I'm not a noob at PvP, I've played EQ1 PvP for years, Dark Age of Camelot PvP, and now EQ2 PvP. I know the problems people experience from being new to a game.

Buttcliffe · 07-15-2008, 08:14 PM

unfortunately you're asking them to add code that they can't copy paste from somewhere else. They'll be forced to write new code, and you know what that means. [Removed for Content] will be broken

seahawk · 07-15-2008, 10:14 PM

I am not gonna bang on ya for starting another thread on locking but... (( haha .. just messing ))

Like the OP mentioned the main culprit for the current reason we have pvp exp is/was the lockers. (( I assume this to be the case, b/c I don't ever remember SoE saying why.. but the countless threads on the issues with lockers must have had some impact. ))

While I must admit you bring up a novel approach to the pvp exp for kills, I don't think the lockers were the only reason we have pvp exp. I think on some small level, it is a way to get all the classes moved up to the higher tiers where there is less class imbalances. While tier 8 is not a completely balanced pvp system, it is more balanced there then say tier 3 pvp. Once a toon gets to tier 5 they pretty much have all of their class spells and almost all their traits. The only thing I can really think of that they are missing would be their Ancient teaching spells.

Personally, I think pvp is more enjoyable and it is easier for SoE to make changes to class imbalances with the players whole arsenal at their disposal. There is a reason in t2/3 pvp all you seem to see are SK's and healers. (( from a Q perspective )). I am sure the freeporters see tons of druids and swashi's also. Those classes are virtually unbeatable at those tiers. Not saying you can't beat 'em, but not having your full arsenal makes some classes especially hard to kill.

I guess the point I am making is this.. the lockers definitely made life H*ll for new players and the exp for pvp was the fix. But, whether it be an unintended side effect or some master plan by SoE the exp gain from pvp gets players into tiers where they start getting ALL THEIR spells and arts and that helps the pvp experience as whole with respect to class balances. I don't think it is a coincidence that by the time you hit tier 4 the pvp exp gain is pretty negligable and by tier 4 you are really close to having all your spells.

Personally, I have no problem at all with how it is implemented. I currently have a little 44 ranger that is locked (( my first locked toon btw )) and the exp I get is minimal. I plan to stay in that tier till I level out of it from pvp. I am guessing it will be around a 150 kills per level, so around 1500 kills for that tier. That seems pretty reasonable to me.

Just my thoughts!

MMKA · 07-16-2008, 12:12 AM

Bozidar wrote:

The gear has nothing to do with it, those classes are just more powerful -- in a warden's case a LOT more powerful. You dont need fabled gear in T2 either, most of it was crap even back in the day.
Who needs tokens in T2? No one.. [Removed for Content] are ya talking about? And again, T2 fabled stuff is 99% garbage, and quest gear out there is better than it.
You think that 1 piece of pvp gear at 20, 1 piece at 23, and i think 4 by the end of T2 is too much pvp gear early in the game? [Removed for Content] are you talking about man? that gear isn't even that good anymore, see the aformentioned quest gear.
The problem with low level (T2) pvp is that the classes jjust aren't developed enough to really have the tools to deal with all the other classes. Gear is meaningless. I could go out in handcrafted gear on a warden and kill 95/100 people playing this game. I could go out naked on a brigand and never lose in T2 pvp because only swashies can see me, and i know how to get t2 evacs.

Well, that's your opinion. I feel that the classes are pretty close in T2-T3 as long as they wear mc gear and have adept III spells. The good thing about T2 pvp is that if you feel a particular class is overpowered, you can roll that class and have a playable toon in a day or so. There really is no reason for anyone to complain about a class being overpowered in T2. Ater all, it's not like you have to spend 6 months leveling in order to find out your class is not viable in pvp. Nobody is forced to play a particular class. There are enough wardens for everyone!

ImAnExileL · 07-16-2008, 02:58 AM

Bring back level locking.T8 PVP is a [Removed for Content] gang bang of zerging at the docks, 24/7. Hardly anyone solos and its rare to get a good 6v6 nowadays.T4/T5 PVP is the best. Bring it back!

Dalema · 07-16-2008, 07:46 AM

Agreed.

Bozidar · 07-16-2008, 09:31 AM

lol, as much as i've been arguing, i do support bringing back level locking somewhere around t3.

i just dont think you can make a good case that it's better pvp because it's balanced. it's not.. dont lie about it.

but it sure is a lot of fun, it's easier for the casual player, and i just dont see any good reason why perma-locking in the high 20's and above shouldn't be supported.

Devildog93 · 07-16-2008, 04:15 PM

Hell, i'd be fine with them setting it at lvl 32 and above. 32 is still fairly easy to get to in quick fashion, the gear is still relatively cheap, and i think you aren't hopelessly unbalanced at that point. Imbalances from class to class will always be there, but in team vs. team pvp i don't know how much that matters. We did fine before with your cookie cutter team of guardian, dirge(me), warden, inquisitor, assassin, brigand(or fury at times). There were several good teams out there back in the day, i'm just not seeing them any more. On a side note, is there any way we can bring it to the attention of a dev or at least see if the pvp mod can pass it along?-Faize

ImAnExileL · 07-16-2008, 06:44 PM

I really hope SOE considers this change. for the good.I have done the T8 thing on 4 different toons now, and it really isn't fun.I play this game to PVP, basically nothing else -- so when I log in and see only an x10 ofQeynos on the dock all day long in Kylong Plains, or run into the fame [Removed for Content] that only fight 6v1 with god spells in stacked groups and never fight a 6v6.. it makes me want to log off and find a better game.T5 has a lot less of that if you ask me.Also, anyone else not have a text box to write in? I only see a black background. Makes it extra hard!

Dalema · 07-16-2008, 07:12 PM

Mid tier PvP is more fun and Balanced, its official.

Of the last 6 fights I've had in T8 on Mils, this is what has happened:

1) Fly to TG right behind Toxicz. When he lands I fear him and Mezz him. Stupid resists mean I dont get all my reactives stacked but I kill him at ariund 40% health. Mythical Brig 0 Mils 1. I walk over to /bow and loot his chest, and I've regened to 47%.

2) (straight after) I turn around and see a Swashie standing a bit behind me. I run over to him and by that time I've regened to 54%. I Mezz him and he godspells me (mischief Maker). I die.

3) I rez and rebuff at TG. I run up the side rocks to see Pletia there (80 Ranger). She is grouped with Impulse (80 Ranger). I run up the nearest building and jump up the ledge. After 5 minutes they eventually work up the skill to get onto the ledge. I fear Impulse off and Mezz Pletia. Im at red HP from the auto attacks and one CA they were able to get off. I kill Pletia without losing any HP, clicky neck heal and run down to mezz Impulse. Before I've finished debuffing Pletia is back with rez sickness and I die.

4) I rez and see my mate Arivath (exiled Ranger) we run to the cave heading to JW to fight. An 80 Swashie (entoza) jumps from the Sokokar behind us, followed by the above zergers. I mezz the swashie and he godpspells me, I die.

5) a Few hours later, I log on again. I run up the Tg ramp and see a level 77 Swashie. I've fought him before and he used 2 godspells in one fight. He puts up his burns and I run to the tower and jump on the ledge so that he wastes them. The Swashie from earlier flys in with an 80 guard, its now 3v1. They both jump up the ledge. I mezz the swashie, he godspells me. I die.

6) I manage to find a solo Swashie (lol) he sees me and puts up all his temps. I land my long distance stun, he godspells me and I die.

T8 PvP is seriously horrendous. If its not the above its a Qeynos raid/zerg force at the docks.

ImAnExileL · 07-16-2008, 07:23 PM

Those types of god spells still exist in T5, but really -- you don't see them that much. Zerging exists too, but its a huge difference when the scouts in T5 typically don't kill you in about 2 seconds.

HerbertWalker · 07-16-2008, 08:03 PM

Paikis wrote:

No level locking. At all. Ever.
Why? For the same reason that level locking in the teens sucked, except if you have all the locked twinks in T4 you can't just level past them in an afternoon, T4 takes a long time to level through, especially when you have swarms of twinks griefing you every time they see you 9don't say it doesn't happen, it does)

Yes, T7 is a better tier for such things.

07-15-2008, 02:24 PM	#31
Oo Server: Venekor Guild: Tunare Watch Rank: Council of Tunare General Join Date: Apr 2005 Posts: 96	Bozidar wrote: Doopsy@Nagafen wrote: You do realize don't you that not everyone has the time or inclination to grind to end-game and then grind for gear/plat once they get there? That's not being a noob, that's life. If you played 5 -10 hours per week, you could get all the PvP you wanted, experience different toons, equip them as well as your competition, etc. in T2-T3. Fact is, it was easier for a casual player to get into EQ2 PvP and compete before lvl locking was killed, than since when you really have to get to T8 and compete with people who are raiding, farming tokens, farming instances nightly, etc. More casual playerswill never ever be able to compete with that. (Don't get me wrong, if you have the time and want to do that, great and you should get awesome rewards, but the lower level PvP provided another option to some.) Not everyone can or will invest the hours to get to end-game just so they can enjoy the most populated PvP tier. With the low-level PvP at it's pinnacle, everyone could participate. they want the casual player to have to spend more time in game to accomplish things and gain enjoyment. i'm not sure why they want to de-casual the casual player, because the monthly subscription fee is the same either way.. but that's what they've done, imo. I answered this in one of the many other threads on this topic. The short answer is they did it because they were bored with the sluggish end-game PvP and wanted to force them level up so they could kill them. That's all. __________________

07-15-2008, 02:28 PM	#32
Bozidar Loremaster Join Date: May 2006 Posts: 3,292	Doopsy@Nagafen wrote: I answered this in one of the many other threads on this topic. The short answer is they did it because they were bored with the sluggish end-game PvP and wanted to force them level up so they could kill them. That's all. It wasn't a question you can answer. I was talking about soe, not the folks who lobbied to have locking removed.

07-15-2008, 02:33 PM	#33
Bozidar Loremaster Join Date: May 2006 Posts: 3,292	MMKA wrote: What is not balanced about it? I have been playing in T2 quite a bit lately with a variety of classes and have yet to see one all powerful class. Healers may have a slight advantage over some classes and clothies may be a little weak against other classes but overall, it's 100% better than T8 because every class has a good chance to win. If nothing else, the fights last longer than 3 seconds (unless you are ganking a noob 4 levels lower which really isn't pvp anyway). You're playing T2 quite a bit lately? I played low level pvp for 2 years. There's no balance in T2-T8. If you're thinking that any class has a chance to win in T2, it's because you haven't faced the professional locked players who have either leveled up or left.

07-15-2008, 02:39 PM	#34
Oo Server: Venekor Guild: Tunare Watch Rank: Council of Tunare General Join Date: Apr 2005 Posts: 96	Bozidar wrote: Doopsy@Nagafen wrote: I answered this in one of the many other threads on this topic. The short answer is they did it because they were bored with the sluggish end-game PvP and wanted to force them level up so they could kill them. That's all. It wasn't a question you can answer. I was talking about soe, not the folks who lobbied to have locking removed. Well, without getting into a long analysis of the changes Devs have made to PvP over time based on the public outcry, I think it's one and the same. Whether SoE actually bought into the premise the whiners gave (taking care of the new players) is an interesting academic question. But, the reality is likely that they just responded to the repeated complaining of end-gamers. __________________

07-15-2008, 02:40 PM	#35
Paikis Loremaster Join Date: Jun 2008 Posts: 1,254	Doopsy@Nagafen wrote: Devildog93 wrote: I know this has been talked about in other threads, but i am wondering how much interest there would be in reviving level-locking for pvp at the lower tiers. We know the problems associated with this: griefing new guys. -Faize I always had to laugh at this line of logic for killing low-level pvp. Its the truth. I've rolled alts while the so called 'golden age' of T2 PvP lockers was going strong. It sucked. You couldn't leave immunity without being ganked by groups. Timorous Deep was impossible to quest in because there were GROUPS of griefers waiting for you to break immunity. Ever tied to kill 9 scorpions when you have a whole group beating on you as soon as your immunity breaks? Its not fun. __________________ Kaelas, Necromancer Valindor, Templar Paikis, Troubador Ashk, Berserker Mirbolt, Shadowknight

07-15-2008, 02:40 PM	#36
TerminalEyesore Loremaster Join Date: Nov 2004 Posts: 23	I understand that the PvP experience gains were put in to force level locked griefers to level up and move on, allowing new players a little bit of breathing room to play. But by forcing ALL PvPers to gain experience, you're basically punishing everyone for the misdeeds of the few. You're throwing out the baby with the bathwater. I feel like I'd LIKE to PvP, but if I keep it up, I'm gonna level out of my favorite PvP range. I'm not a griefer, but the PvP experience penalty hits me just as hard as it does those it was put in for. If I'm out harvesting, and I successfully defend myself against an attacker, I'm pushed that much closer out of the gaming level(s) I enjoy. It almost makes me want to lose, just to not suffer the victory penalty, which is more significant than the reward. Which is a shame, cause this IS a PvP server, and PvPing is what we're all here for (isn't it?). I want to enjoy the combat with another player, but that drawback is always gnawing on me, making me reconsider doing what I'm working so hard preparing for, even to the point of throwing the fight. So what's the point?So, what if, when you're level locked, you ONLY gain PvP experience when you kill someone on your recent list. If a person on your recent kill list attacks you, then you don't gain experience for successfully defending yourself. That way they can't exploit the system. Wouldn't this be more intelligently targeted toward the actual griefers?If you're in a group and ANYONE in that group kills someone on ANYONE IN THAT GROUP'S recent list, then you gain experience. If you don't like that, then tell the person, chew their [Removed for Content] out, or leave that group. This will get the message out that not everyone is OK with griefing, along with STILL leveling the actual griefers.Gaining 4% experience for killing a blue that attacked me at level 22 was very disturbing, and disappointing. It makes me not want to fight back too many times, and basically makes me feel like I have to pay more attention to my experience gains that just simply enjoy the game.

07-15-2008, 02:48 PM	#37
Bozidar Loremaster Join Date: May 2006 Posts: 3,292	Paikis wrote: Doopsy@Nagafen wrote: Devildog93 wrote: I know this has been talked about in other threads, but i am wondering how much interest there would be in reviving level-locking for pvp at the lower tiers. We know the problems associated with this: griefing new guys. -Faize I always had to laugh at this line of logic for killing low-level pvp. Its the truth. I've rolled alts while the so called 'golden age' of T2 PvP lockers was going strong. It sucked. You couldn't leave immunity without being ganked by groups. Timorous Deep was impossible to quest in because there were GROUPS of griefers waiting for you to break immunity. Ever tied to kill 9 scorpions when you have a whole group beating on you as soon as your immunity breaks? Its not fun. /fail there was no such thing as Timorous Deep (or even greater feydark) during the golden age of T2 pvp lockers.

07-15-2008, 02:51 PM	#38
Dalema Loremaster Join Date: Sep 2005 Posts: 155	I'd say T4-T6 are the most balanced in the game. And T2-T5 Furies are the most powerful Demron? I'd actually have to agree, bar T2. There are still classes that can walk over them though: Swashies, brigands, Coercers, Illys, Inqs etc. I'd say that in pure 1v1s, Coercer has always been the most powerful in the middle tiers. __________________ Zaci 80 Swashbuckler Im better than you

07-15-2008, 02:52 PM	#39
Oo Server: Venekor Guild: Tunare Watch Rank: Council of Tunare General Join Date: Apr 2005 Posts: 96	Paikis wrote: Doopsy@Nagafen wrote: Devildog93 wrote: I know this has been talked about in other threads, but i am wondering how much interest there would be in reviving level-locking for pvp at the lower tiers. We know the problems associated with this: griefing new guys. -Faize I always had to laugh at this line of logic for killing low-level pvp. Its the truth. I've rolled alts while the so called 'golden age' of T2 PvP lockers was going strong. It sucked. You couldn't leave immunity without being ganked by groups. Timorous Deep was impossible to quest in because there were GROUPS of griefers waiting for you to break immunity. Ever tied to kill 9 scorpions when you have a whole group beating on you as soon as your immunity breaks? Its not fun. You miss the point. My point, Paikis, is come to naggy and try to do some quests off Dreg's Landing Docks. How much fun was it trying to do SS quests a year ago as a lvl 45 toon? The point is that problem you mention wasn't a problem endemic to T2 level lockers. And the same people who claimed such did the same thing at end-game, but in a much worse setting since they were no-limit zones. That's the hypocrisy I'm speaking of. You know that most of the T2 lockers were end-gamers, and at end-game there was a real lull in PvP. Go back a year and read all those threads... It was always hard rolling a new toon past lvl 10, from day one of PvP. It sucked once they "fixed" it, that if you did get to that point, you could hardly find any PvP, unless you kept grinding or spent hours hunting. It was fun to most being able to walk into Antonica or CL and fight countless fights in front of the gates. BTW, If I'm not mistaken, they killed pvp lvl-locking before RoK came out, or about the same time. __________________

07-15-2008, 02:56 PM	#40
Bozidar Loremaster Join Date: May 2006 Posts: 3,292	Dalema wrote: I'd say T4-T6 are the most balanced in the game. And T2-T5 Furies are the most powerful Demron? I'd actually have to agree, bar T2. There are still classes that can walk over them though: Swashies, brigands, Coercers, Illys, Inqs etc. I'd say that in pure 1v1s, Coercer has always been the most powerful in the middle tiers. once you hit 50 all balance goes out the door. assassinate, sniper shot, ice comet. Handing out Harm Touches to 3 more classes hardly improved the balance of the game

07-15-2008, 03:03 PM	#41
Dalema Loremaster Join Date: Sep 2005 Posts: 155	Meh, I think those abilities are pretty overrated, bar HT. HT (well, MT really) hits a level 34 for what Assassinate normally does at level 50. __________________ Zaci 80 Swashbuckler Im better than you

07-15-2008, 03:05 PM	#42
Bozidar Loremaster Join Date: May 2006 Posts: 3,292	Dalema wrote: Meh, I think those abilities are pretty overrated, bar HT. HT (well, MT really) hits a level 34 for what Assassinate normally does at level 50. but they're abilties added to classes that already are quite awesome at bringing the damage..

07-15-2008, 03:13 PM	#43
Dalema Loremaster Join Date: Sep 2005 Posts: 155	True, but they aren't as bad as thier T8 versions, or anything like. With about 60% cold resist, I've been hit for over 7.4k by a Bolt of Ice M1, and for 6.2k by Execute. I agree that those abilites are powerful, but the classes that get them are high DPS classes. They're good, but nothing like as powerful as the T8 versions in comparison. __________________ Zaci 80 Swashbuckler Im better than you

07-15-2008, 03:27 PM	#44
wellehad0 Loremaster Join Date: Jul 2007 Posts: 335	Sightless wrote: There is no even playing field in the lower levels. You're either lying, or you have no idea what some of the more powerful classes can do. There are no equals to a Fury in T2-T5 PvP, none period. I'm sorry you can't compete in T8 PvP, the easiest tier to gear up in by the way, but dont' try and lie and say that low level PvP is balanced. It's far from balanced. i really think then you must not be that skilled at this game.. i have played every class in t2 and have had slayer and above titles with every class and i solo 99% of the time... if i can take a necro out of all classes in t2-t3 and crush any class 1v1 then im sorry to say you FAIL on saying its not balanced.. furys are not strong at all in t2 there damage is only average.. a good illy could destroy a fury would not even know what happend... so again if you bother to get atleast adept 3's and above for your toon and do the MOK quest then if you fail in pvp its your fault... if you would just take the time to play around with each class in t2-t4 then you would know each class has a huge weakness in one area or another... so on furys people who say they are OP are the same people who have no idea how to fight them.. my WIZ has NP taken on furrys in t3. furrys dont have the power like wardens do so they are very easy to burn down.. wardens same way since 9/10 people are mele wardens they blow power at a alarming rate and have huge cool downs on there mele CA's so if you are burning them down they have to stop attacking and do nothing but heal. wich means boys and girls they are not attacking you. people who are affraid of t3 furys are the same people who think there are monsters under there bead when all tha tis under your bead is a little roach that you could swat away with ease.. the only point i will give into is yes a 3 man group of nothing but furry sis very strong but so would a 3 man group of wizy or any other class. i would take a 3 man group of wardens over a 3 man group of furys all day long... rangers same thing when one hits you root and get into there mele range ASAP and they will go down just as fast as a cloth wearing toon. scouts. sinple dont be in mele range. yes they have a range CA but oh well take it like a man and burn them down before your root breaks (master roots are your friend) to tell the truth the only class in high t2-t3 that is a little OP is the litte played right Necro.. with masters in life taps fears and chains and a m1 mage pet all you have to do is chain lifeburn then fear and throw on 2 dots and they are done without even getting to hit you.. right now in t2-t4 its not classes who are OP its the AA's and knowing where to put them makes each class.. before only a few people knew how to max AA at lvl 10 now its spamed in chat every 3 seconds. so again if you dont bother to spend a couple hours on your toon then yes you will suck no matter what class you are playing but of course i must be wrong and need to hurry to be luch meat to the T8 scout gank squads. i jsut hope that when i get there that there will be a huge majical fix where classes will all be on equal terms and that all epic and fable gear will also be equal to all classes... ok im off to t3 pvp (where you dont need to invest a years time to compete maybe a couple hours at most in getting mats) have fun and sorry you wont see me at the docks anytime soon so your cheap no skilled t8 gank squads will just have to wait a little longer

07-15-2008, 03:50 PM	#45
Bloodfa Server: Nagafen General Join Date: Dec 2004 Posts: 2,873	Actually, T8 gank squads are more avoidable than T2 ones were. You've got access to totems that at T2 simply don't exist, for starters. Also, T8 gank squads tend to stay in just a few areas. T2 ... hell, I remember seeing some guys in places that I thought "What the hell? there's nothing over here at all but me?!?!" Just sayin' ... __________________

07-15-2008, 05:17 PM	#46
MMKA Loremaster Join Date: Aug 2007 Posts: 124	Bozidar wrote: You're playing T2 quite a bit lately? I played low level pvp for 2 years. There's no balance in T2-T8. If you're thinking that any class has a chance to win in T2, it's because you haven't faced the professional locked players who have either leveled up or left. Correction - there wasn't a lot of balance in pvp before they stopped people who had been locked for 3 years from locking. Many of those people had all fabled pvp gear that made them unbeatable. Low level pvp now is a lot different than it was a year ago because most the the pvp geared players have left or leveled. Now with the writ system, they could allow people to still lock but make it so that in order to get tokens, you automatically get xp when turning in a writ. That would allow people to choose between pvp gear and pvp at their desired level. They could also Decrease the fabled drops in t2-t3 to almost nil or give a huge amount of xp whenever you picked up a fabled item. That would mean that the gear stays where it is now and keeps everyone on a fair playing field at least in a few tears. Even T8 would be better because there would be less people to raid with, hence, less fabled gear and less twinked 80's running around one shotting people. I really don't see a down side to this! The players were not at fault for the T2 pvp debacle of previous years. SOE screwed up low level pvp by allowing pvp gear too early in the game - or at all for that matter. Take away the gear and the playing field levels out considerably. The best part is that the T8 gankers will still have plenty of miners and farmers to gank, although the fights may only last .5 seconds then!

07-15-2008, 05:25 PM	#47
Bozidar Loremaster Join Date: May 2006 Posts: 3,292	MMKA wrote: Correction - there wasn't a lot of balance in pvp before they stopped people who had been locked for 3 years from locking. Many of those people had all fabled pvp gear that made them unbeatable. Low level pvp now is a lot different than it was a year ago because most the the pvp geared players have left or leveled. Now with the writ system, they could allow people to still lock but make it so that in order to get tokens, you automatically get xp when turning in a writ. That would allow people to choose between pvp gear and pvp at their desired level. They could also Decrease the fabled drops in t2-t3 to almost nil or give a huge amount of xp whenever you picked up a fabled item. That would mean that the gear stays where it is now and keeps everyone on a fair playing field at least in a few tears. Even T8 would be better because there would be less people to raid with, hence, less fabled gear and less twinked 80's running around one shotting people. I really don't see a down side to this! The players were not at fault for the T2 pvp debacle of previous years. SOE screwed up low level pvp by allowing pvp gear too early in the game - or at all for that matter. Take away the gear and the playing field levels out considerably. The best part is that the T8 gankers will still have plenty of miners and farmers to gank, although the fights may only last .5 seconds then! The gear has nothing to do with it, those classes are just more powerful -- in a warden's case a LOT more powerful. You dont need fabled gear in T2 either, most of it was crap even back in the day. Who needs tokens in T2? No one.. [Removed for Content] are ya talking about? And again, T2 fabled stuff is 99% garbage, and quest gear out there is better than it. You think that 1 piece of pvp gear at 20, 1 piece at 23, and i think 4 by the end of T2 is too much pvp gear early in the game? [Removed for Content] are you talking about man? that gear isn't even that good anymore, see the aformentioned quest gear. The problem with low level (T2) pvp is that the classes jjust aren't developed enough to really have the tools to deal with all the other classes. Gear is meaningless. I could go out in handcrafted gear on a warden and kill 95/100 people playing this game. I could go out naked on a brigand and never lose in T2 pvp because only swashies can see me, and i know how to get t2 evacs.

07-15-2008, 06:44 PM	#48
ImAnExileL General Join Date: Jul 2008 Posts: 28	I support this change -- a change for the better.T8 PVP sucks. T4/T5 is the best tier tbh.~Peak

07-15-2008, 07:13 PM	#49
Sightless Loremaster Join Date: Aug 2007 Posts: 1,199	Doopsy@Nagafen wrote: Sightless wrote: I had multiple T2 twinks, and every time after a week, maybe two I thought to myself; "Wow this is boring, easy, and repetitive. How can anyone not want the challenge of higher level PvP." And every time I either deleted those characters, or leveled to the higher tiers. You do realize don't you that not everyone has the time or inclination to grind to end-game and then grind for gear/plat once they get there? That's not being a noob, that's life. If you played 5 -10 hours per week, you could get all the PvP you wanted, experience different toons, equip them as well as your competition, etc. in T2-T3. Fact is, it was easier for a casual player to get into EQ2 PvP and compete before lvl locking was killed, than since when you really have to get to T8 and compete with people who are raiding, farming tokens, farming instances nightly, etc. More casual playerswill never ever be able to compete with that. (Don't get me wrong, if you have the time and want to do that, great and you should get awesome rewards, but the lower level PvP provided another option to some.) Not everyone can or will invest the hours to get to end-game just so they can enjoy the most populated PvP tier. With the low-level PvP at it's pinnacle, everyone could participate. I'm probably among the most casual type of gamers you could imagine. I work two jobs, raise 4 kids, and spend time with my wife. On top of reading books I love, getting bored with one character and making alts. And if that doesn't take my time, I often help everyone in my guild in one form or another, especially if my kids are online playing. Yet I compete in Tier 8, without raiding, without fabled gear, and on multiple characters. I have a Guardian, level 73 of all things and he is great fun to play. So in Tier 8, playing casually I have a 73 Guardian, 80 Warlock, and 80 Ranger. In tier 2 there were so many twinks you couldn't even harvest unless you locked a character before level 10, and crafted to a respectable level to go out safely and harvest. Check out Demron's post on how to survive if you're new to PvP. That's my post. I'm not a noob at PvP, I've played EQ1 PvP for years, Dark Age of Camelot PvP, and now EQ2 PvP. I know the problems people experience from being new to a game. __________________ Doing your own thing isn't good, if it prevents others from doing their own thing.

07-15-2008, 08:14 PM	#50
Buttcliffe Loremaster Join Date: May 2006 Posts: 704	unfortunately you're asking them to add code that they can't copy paste from somewhere else. They'll be forced to write new code, and you know what that means. [Removed for Content] will be broken

07-15-2008, 10:14 PM	#51
seahawk General Join Date: Nov 2004 Posts: 340	I am not gonna bang on ya for starting another thread on locking but... (( haha .. just messing )) Like the OP mentioned the main culprit for the current reason we have pvp exp is/was the lockers. (( I assume this to be the case, b/c I don't ever remember SoE saying why.. but the countless threads on the issues with lockers must have had some impact. )) While I must admit you bring up a novel approach to the pvp exp for kills, I don't think the lockers were the only reason we have pvp exp. I think on some small level, it is a way to get all the classes moved up to the higher tiers where there is less class imbalances. While tier 8 is not a completely balanced pvp system, it is more balanced there then say tier 3 pvp. Once a toon gets to tier 5 they pretty much have all of their class spells and almost all their traits. The only thing I can really think of that they are missing would be their Ancient teaching spells. Personally, I think pvp is more enjoyable and it is easier for SoE to make changes to class imbalances with the players whole arsenal at their disposal. There is a reason in t2/3 pvp all you seem to see are SK's and healers. (( from a Q perspective )). I am sure the freeporters see tons of druids and swashi's also. Those classes are virtually unbeatable at those tiers. Not saying you can't beat 'em, but not having your full arsenal makes some classes especially hard to kill. I guess the point I am making is this.. the lockers definitely made life H*ll for new players and the exp for pvp was the fix. But, whether it be an unintended side effect or some master plan by SoE the exp gain from pvp gets players into tiers where they start getting ALL THEIR spells and arts and that helps the pvp experience as whole with respect to class balances. I don't think it is a coincidence that by the time you hit tier 4 the pvp exp gain is pretty negligable and by tier 4 you are really close to having all your spells. Personally, I have no problem at all with how it is implemented. I currently have a little 44 ranger that is locked (( my first locked toon btw )) and the exp I get is minimal. I plan to stay in that tier till I level out of it from pvp. I am guessing it will be around a 150 kills per level, so around 1500 kills for that tier. That seems pretty reasonable to me. Just my thoughts! __________________

07-16-2008, 12:12 AM	#52
MMKA Loremaster Join Date: Aug 2007 Posts: 124	Bozidar wrote: The gear has nothing to do with it, those classes are just more powerful -- in a warden's case a LOT more powerful. You dont need fabled gear in T2 either, most of it was crap even back in the day. Who needs tokens in T2? No one.. [Removed for Content] are ya talking about? And again, T2 fabled stuff is 99% garbage, and quest gear out there is better than it. You think that 1 piece of pvp gear at 20, 1 piece at 23, and i think 4 by the end of T2 is too much pvp gear early in the game? [Removed for Content] are you talking about man? that gear isn't even that good anymore, see the aformentioned quest gear. The problem with low level (T2) pvp is that the classes jjust aren't developed enough to really have the tools to deal with all the other classes. Gear is meaningless. I could go out in handcrafted gear on a warden and kill 95/100 people playing this game. I could go out naked on a brigand and never lose in T2 pvp because only swashies can see me, and i know how to get t2 evacs. Well, that's your opinion. I feel that the classes are pretty close in T2-T3 as long as they wear mc gear and have adept III spells. The good thing about T2 pvp is that if you feel a particular class is overpowered, you can roll that class and have a playable toon in a day or so. There really is no reason for anyone to complain about a class being overpowered in T2. Ater all, it's not like you have to spend 6 months leveling in order to find out your class is not viable in pvp. Nobody is forced to play a particular class. There are enough wardens for everyone!

07-16-2008, 02:58 AM	#53
ImAnExileL General Join Date: Jul 2008 Posts: 28	Bring back level locking.T8 PVP is a [Removed for Content] gang bang of zerging at the docks, 24/7. Hardly anyone solos and its rare to get a good 6v6 nowadays.T4/T5 PVP is the best. Bring it back!

07-16-2008, 07:46 AM	#54
Dalema Loremaster Join Date: Sep 2005 Posts: 155	Agreed. __________________ Zaci 80 Swashbuckler Im better than you

07-16-2008, 09:31 AM	#55
Bozidar Loremaster Join Date: May 2006 Posts: 3,292	lol, as much as i've been arguing, i do support bringing back level locking somewhere around t3. i just dont think you can make a good case that it's better pvp because it's balanced. it's not.. dont lie about it. but it sure is a lot of fun, it's easier for the casual player, and i just dont see any good reason why perma-locking in the high 20's and above shouldn't be supported.

07-16-2008, 04:15 PM	#56
Devildog93 Loremaster Join Date: Mar 2006 Posts: 52	Hell, i'd be fine with them setting it at lvl 32 and above. 32 is still fairly easy to get to in quick fashion, the gear is still relatively cheap, and i think you aren't hopelessly unbalanced at that point. Imbalances from class to class will always be there, but in team vs. team pvp i don't know how much that matters. We did fine before with your cookie cutter team of guardian, dirge(me), warden, inquisitor, assassin, brigand(or fury at times). There were several good teams out there back in the day, i'm just not seeing them any more. On a side note, is there any way we can bring it to the attention of a dev or at least see if the pvp mod can pass it along?-Faize

07-16-2008, 06:44 PM	#57
ImAnExileL General Join Date: Jul 2008 Posts: 28	I really hope SOE considers this change. for the good.I have done the T8 thing on 4 different toons now, and it really isn't fun.I play this game to PVP, basically nothing else -- so when I log in and see only an x10 ofQeynos on the dock all day long in Kylong Plains, or run into the fame [Removed for Content] that only fight 6v1 with god spells in stacked groups and never fight a 6v6.. it makes me want to log off and find a better game.T5 has a lot less of that if you ask me.Also, anyone else not have a text box to write in? I only see a black background. Makes it extra hard!

07-16-2008, 07:12 PM	#58
Dalema Loremaster Join Date: Sep 2005 Posts: 155	Mid tier PvP is more fun and Balanced, its official. Of the last 6 fights I've had in T8 on Mils, this is what has happened: 1) Fly to TG right behind Toxicz. When he lands I fear him and Mezz him. Stupid resists mean I dont get all my reactives stacked but I kill him at ariund 40% health. Mythical Brig 0 Mils 1. I walk over to /bow and loot his chest, and I've regened to 47%. 2) (straight after) I turn around and see a Swashie standing a bit behind me. I run over to him and by that time I've regened to 54%. I Mezz him and he godspells me (mischief Maker). I die. 3) I rez and rebuff at TG. I run up the side rocks to see Pletia there (80 Ranger). She is grouped with Impulse (80 Ranger). I run up the nearest building and jump up the ledge. After 5 minutes they eventually work up the skill to get onto the ledge. I fear Impulse off and Mezz Pletia. Im at red HP from the auto attacks and one CA they were able to get off. I kill Pletia without losing any HP, clicky neck heal and run down to mezz Impulse. Before I've finished debuffing Pletia is back with rez sickness and I die. 4) I rez and see my mate Arivath (exiled Ranger) we run to the cave heading to JW to fight. An 80 Swashie (entoza) jumps from the Sokokar behind us, followed by the above zergers. I mezz the swashie and he godpspells me, I die. 5) a Few hours later, I log on again. I run up the Tg ramp and see a level 77 Swashie. I've fought him before and he used 2 godspells in one fight. He puts up his burns and I run to the tower and jump on the ledge so that he wastes them. The Swashie from earlier flys in with an 80 guard, its now 3v1. They both jump up the ledge. I mezz the swashie, he godspells me. I die. 6) I manage to find a solo Swashie (lol) he sees me and puts up all his temps. I land my long distance stun, he godspells me and I die. T8 PvP is seriously horrendous. If its not the above its a Qeynos raid/zerg force at the docks. __________________ Zaci 80 Swashbuckler Im better than you

07-16-2008, 07:23 PM	#59
ImAnExileL General Join Date: Jul 2008 Posts: 28	Those types of god spells still exist in T5, but really -- you don't see them that much. Zerging exists too, but its a huge difference when the scouts in T5 typically don't kill you in about 2 seconds.

07-16-2008, 08:03 PM	#60
HerbertWalker Loremaster Join Date: Dec 2004 Posts: 396	Paikis wrote: No level locking. At all. Ever. Why? For the same reason that level locking in the teens sucked, except if you have all the locked twinks in T4 you can't just level past them in an afternoon, T4 takes a long time to level through, especially when you have swarms of twinks griefing you every time they see you 9don't say it doesn't happen, it does) Yes, T7 is a better tier for such things.