What skills are uncontested avoidance?

[Junaru]

Like the topic says. Which of the skills are uncontested avoidance?ParryRiposteDodgeBlock

[Morrolan V]

All of block is uncontested.  But, we have no block. 

A PORTION of our deflection is uncontested, depending on which stance you are in, and the quality of the stance you have.  Numbers (off the top of my head, since I am at work):

In offensive stance, 0% is uncontested.

In mid stance, it's ~6% at master level.

In defensive stance, its ~12% at master level.

AFAIK, there is no way for us to increase the uncontested portion beyond the Master I stances.

[Bladewind]

In addition to block and the amounts listed on mixed and defensive stance (depends ont he quality of your stance), there are buffs, AA abilities, and items that give uncontested avoidance.

The rule of thumb is that anything with a description following the format: "Caster/wearer/target will riposte/parry/deflect/block/dodge x% of inocming attacks," is uncontested.

Anything that reads as a + to an avoidance skill is contested.

I think the juggernaut hat adds 5% uncontested dodge, and I know that there are t8 wrist adornemnts that add 3% uncontested parry each (they stack if you use two).

If your avoidance types have uncontested portions, the uncontested amount becomes the minimum amount you wil have of that avoidance type against a foe of the same level.  So, in defensive stance, with master quality, I know my deflection will never be lower than 16% against an even con mob (or 8% in mixed stance).  Similarly, I know my parry will never be below 4% (two t7 2% uncontested parry adorns on my old wristbands).  I'll be upgrading to the 3% adornments soon enough, but I want to settle on more permanent wrist pieces before I take the plunge.

Another great way to get uncontested avoidance is to get an avodiance buff from a shield-wearing fighter and/or agi-spec cleric.  My good templar friend gives me a tremendous effective avoidance boost between his single target stoneskin buff and his shield buff.  A fighter avoidance buff will stack with a cleric buff, so, if you get both, you indirectly gain a substantial block rating (and a boost from any parry that the buff casters have as well).  It gets just plain silly if you have a cleric buff and a shield buff from a block-specced pally who both have uncontested parry wrist adornments.  I've had ACT avoidance reports where I ended up with about 18ish effective block% (almost as if I had a tower shield equipped myself) and an obscenely high parry % when lucky enough to have this ideal buff situation.  Since our block is inherantly zero, and an 8 point cleric buff or master pally buff gives a 60% chance to use their block on a failure, you essentially get two free block checks at 60% of the casters' native block values.

[Hydor]

There are weapon adornments that give uncontested avoidance as well. I think that's about everything

[Junaru]

Ok so gear that gives +4 parry (Say Hoop of War) would that be uncontested or does gear not follow the same as adornments ans buffs.?

[Bladewind]

ANything that just says + to a skill, like the +4 parry on the hoop of war is contested.  The buff/benefit will be uncontested only if the description follows the pattern I mentioned above :

"Caster/Target/Wearer will riposte/parry/deflect/dodge x% of incoming attacks."

[Bladewind]

Hydor@Runnyeye wrote:

There are weapon adornments that give uncontested avoidance as well. I think that's about everything

That's right, there are riposte adornments for slashing weapons.

[Junaru]

Ok thanks for the info.

[Bewts]

Aedyl@Mistmoore wrote:

In addition to block and the amounts listed on mixed and defensive stance (depends ont he quality of your stance), there are buffs, AA abilities, and items that give uncontested avoidance.

The rule of thumb is that anything with a description following the format: "Caster/wearer/target will riposte/parry/deflect/block/dodge x% of inocming attacks," is uncontested.

Anything that reads as a + to an avoidance skill is contested.

I think the juggernaut hat adds 5% uncontested dodge, and I know that there are t8 wrist adornemnts that add 3% uncontested parry each (they stack if you use two).

If your avoidance types have uncontested portions, the uncontested amount becomes the minimum amount you wil have of that avoidance type against a foe of the same level.  So, in defensive stance, with master quality, I know my deflection will never be lower than 16% against an even con mob (or 8% in mixed stance).  Similarly, I know my parry will never be below 4% (two t7 2% uncontested parry adorns on my old wristbands).  I'll be upgrading to the 3% adornments soon enough, but I want to settle on more permanent wrist pieces before I take the plunge.

Another great way to get uncontested avoidance is to get an avodiance buff from a shield-wearing fighter and/or agi-spec cleric.  My good templar friend gives me a tremendous effective avoidance boost between his single target stoneskin buff and his shield buff.  A fighter avoidance buff will stack with a cleric buff, so, if you get both, you indirectly gain a substantial block rating (and a boost from any parry that the buff casters have as well).  It gets just plain silly if you have a cleric buff and a shield buff from a block-specced pally who both have uncontested parry wrist adornments.  I've had ACT avoidance reports where I ended up with about 18ish effective block% (almost as if I had a tower shield equipped myself) and an obscenely high parry % when lucky enough to have this ideal buff situation.  Since our block is inherantly zero, and an 8 point cleric buff or master pally buff gives a 60% chance to use their block on a failure, you essentially get two free block checks at 60% of the casters' native block values.

Out of curiousity... if we use our own avoidance buff on say a cross group Assassin to syphon 9% threat from them... can we still gain the benefits of avoidance from the Paladin and Templar avoidance buffs?  If not, which combination can we have?

I'm not saying it will happen often, but in the situation where you could MT, what would be the ideal setup for a Monk?  I'd assume Templar/Mystic/Warden/Dirge is a good start, but I'm not sure its the best and I'd be curious to hear opinions.  Especially with the ability to keep a mob targetting us for a period of time, I'd like to have input to my RL's if they need a monk to tank something in a raid setting using that skill.

[Exordus]

"Out of curiousity... if we use our own avoidance buff on say a cross group Assassin to syphon 9% threat from them... can we still gain the benefits of avoidance from the Paladin and Templar avoidance buffs?  If not, which combination can we have?"

Can't be done.  Once you have your avoidance up...if any other tank casts their avoidance on you or your target, it will cancel yours out.

[Bladewind]

Bewts wrote:

Aedyl@Mistmoore wrote:

blah blah blah

Out of curiousity... if we use our own avoidance buff on say a cross group Assassin to syphon 9% threat from them... can we still gain the benefits of avoidance from the Paladin and Templar avoidance buffs?  If not, which combination can we have?

I'm not saying it will happen often, but in the situation where you could MT, what would be the ideal setup for a Monk?  I'd assume Templar/Mystic/Warden/Dirge is a good start, but I'm not sure its the best and I'd be curious to hear opinions.  Especially with the ability to keep a mob targetting us for a period of time, I'd like to have input to my RL's if they need a monk to tank something in a raid setting using that skill.

You cannot stack fighter buffs, so you would lose that one.

However, the agi-spec cleric shield buff (inquis or templar) is independent of this, so you could still gain a benefit from that one.

When I MT, I prefer a setup as follows (of course, this is all situational, but in general..):

MT group: 

• Templar for stoneskin, shield buff (get them to put uncontested parry adornments on their wrist items), and targetable on hit offensive group heal proc (placed on me)
• Defiler - better tank buffs than a mystic (bolster is raidwide, so you can get it from a mystic in a different group), good single target proc buffs, too 
• Warden (much better defensive buffs/spells than a fury and the accuracy buff lets me go defensive without gimping myself when needed
• Dirge (another stoneskin proc and a great mix of melee dps buffs, mana regen, plus parry and hate buff if necessary)
• Illusionist (haste gives me the same near cap haste as in mixed/defensive as in offensive, IA is gives me a huge dps increase, time compression on a slow casting healer, and mana regen out the wazoo)

I know a lot of people prefer an assassin or swash in that last spot for a hate transfer, but I find the extra dps that I get from Illusionist buffs gives just as much or more hate than a transfer would.  A coercer would also work in the last slot, but I really like IA.  Having double regen is great on really long fights or with mobs that spam power drains.

Tank benefits from outside the MT group:

• Mystic for bolster
• Pally who has the block AA and uses a tower shield, soulfire gladius, and two uncontested parry wrist adornments to maximize fighter avoidance buff, mitigation transfer, and extra warding

[PaganSaint]

Uncontested Avoidance Types:Block+Parry %+Riposte %+Dodge %+Deflect %Regular +parry, +defense, +deflection are not uncontested, they just add to the contested portions of those avoidance types.The order of avoidance checks is:Parry(Riposte included into this) then Block/Deflection, then Dodge/Base Avoidance, then any sort of buff from a fighter or cleric that lets you use their avoidance if you fail all of your own avoidance checks, their checks are applied in the same order.

[Bewts]

Aedyl@Mistmoore wrote:

You cannot stack fighter buffs, so you would lose that one.

However, the agi-spec cleric shield buff (inquis or templar) is independent of this, so you could still gain a benefit from that one.

When I MT, I prefer a setup as follows (of course, this is all situational, but in general..):

MT group: 

• Templar for stoneskin, shield buff (get them to put uncontested parry adornments on their wrist items), and targetable on hit offensive group heal proc (placed on me)
• Defiler - better tank buffs than a mystic (bolster is raidwide, so you can get it from a mystic in a different group), good single target proc buffs, too 
• Warden (much better defensive buffs/spells than a fury and the accuracy buff lets me go defensive without gimping myself when needed
• Dirge (another stoneskin proc and a great mix of melee dps buffs, mana regen, plus parry and hate buff if necessary)
• Illusionist (haste gives me the same near cap haste as in mixed/defensive as in offensive, IA is gives me a huge dps increase, time compression on a slow casting healer, and mana regen out the wazoo)

I know a lot of people prefer an assassin or swash in that last spot for a hate transfer, but I find the extra dps that I get from Illusionist buffs gives just as much or more hate than a transfer would.  A coercer would also work in the last slot, but I really like IA.  Having double regen is great on really long fights or with mobs that spam power drains.

Tank benefits from outside the MT group:

• Mystic for bolster
• Pally who has the block AA and uses a tower shield, soulfire gladius, and two uncontested parry wrist adornments to maximize fighter avoidance buff, mitigation transfer, and extra warding

Pallies would rarely run that setup unless they were tanking in a raid, no?  So the best bet is to use them as the Tank in the Offtank/Second Tank group to ensure they run this setup normally?  Would mean one less class gimping their DPS in a raid by running a tanking setup.  IE no point in running a Zerker as the ST and telling the paladin to run in defensive stances to max uncontested avoidance.  Might as well have the Paladin fill the ST slot and have the zerker in a full DPS setup/group instead.

I definitely agree on the Illusionist over any of the rogues, they bring a lot more to the group than a rogue would in regards to a straight MT group.  Of course this is provided you can maintain hate on the mob.

Another question is how do you propose handling multiple mob encounters?  I've always had issues in heroic content holding hate when I have AE classes with me.  I haven't had much opportunity to tank anything other than a single target in raids and normally its for about 12 seconds, maybe 15 before I go splat.

Are your AA choices available to look at on the playerstation?  If not could you give a quick rundown of what you run?

Lastly, what is a good way to effectively apply Peel whilst tanking?  You can't obviously pull with it because you'd be tops on the hate list.  Do you just have someone else pull and immediately drop Peel once in range?  I'm curious to peoples opinions on that.

[Bladewind]

The beauty of that setup is that all of the paladin's (or any plate tank's) uncontested comes from shield block and any uncontested adornments they may have.  Their stance only effects their contested avoidance and mitigation.  So, they can run offensive stance with the gladius (or any other 1 hander) and a tower shield, minimizing the impact on their dps.  I prefer a pally who has spent AA points to get the 25% shield block bonus for this, but any plate tank with a shield will help, even a buckler-spec warrior if you want to maximize your support dps.

For multiple mob encounters I usually pop tsunami (use it as a damage shield to gain passive hate), my 3 aoes, and crane flock very shortly after the pull. This works fine on heroic stuff for the most part.  In all honesty, my raid tanking is usually on single target boss mobs.  For longer multi-mob encounters, I would probably designate an MA and rotate around the targets to hold aggro.  Using a swash transfer for extra aoe hate might be better than the illy in that case, too. 

AA-wise,

I am 488 agi, 44862 wis, 44872 int for KoS.  The end line in int is pretty situational, but handy for soloing and some heroic stuff.  The benefits from agi are twofold: all of my art reuse timers are accelerated meaning damage arts, taunts, and defensive buffs are avaiable more often.  Also, the recovery bonus means there is more time between my CAs for auto attacks to land.  The wisdom line is all about aoe dps, which makes it invaluable for shoring up our aoe hate issues.  The stun attack is not useful for raiding, but generates a nice amount of hate on heroic encounters.  The proc does a decent job, and crane flock is just amazing.  It generates a very large amount of dps/hate.

For eof, I basically have all of the tanking skill benefits, heal, all of the aggro skills, improved riposte (situational), the raidwide deaggro, and most of the dps abilities that either have raw damage buffed or reuse and casting buffed.  I did not bother with the ones that had their accuracy boosted.

I use peel if I am having issues keeping a mob under control as I would rescue.  I really love using it on memwipe encounters.  I wait for the first memwipe when someone else gets aggro, then pop it to gain an aggro lock, even through mem wipes, for the duration of the art.  Also, I always try to use stun stance while peel is up - finally a use for it.

[mattmandude]

Interesting, I thought the +7 parry forearm adornment was uncontested.And I don't think anyone's mentioned the staff that drops off of Pawbuster that adds something like 15% uncontested avoidance.

[Couching]

It drops from Nexona in VP rather than pawbuster. The name of the 2h weapon dropped from pawbuster is called bonecrusher.

[Exordus]

mattmandude wrote:

Interesting, I thought the +7 parry forearm adornment was uncontested.And I don't think anyone's mentioned the staff that drops off of Pawbuster that adds something like 15% uncontested avoidance.

I have this hammer, I posted a pic of it up in the T8 equipment sticky.  But it's not the one you're refering to.  Think couching has it right though.

[PaganSaint]

He does.