New Con system would fix PVP

Jibantic · 08-10-2007, 05:30 PM

I'm new to pvp, but find the con and aggro system for pvp far to messed up. Consider this. 1 level 15 toon vs 6 level 15 toons. How is it fair, fun or for the most part challenging that the group of 6 can attack the solo? The reason people are level locking is to gain an advantage on the con/aggro system. Now consider a new aggro system. 1 level 30 (cons orange) = 6 level 15 toons. or 2 level 30 (cons orange)= 12 level 15 toons or for more fun 1 level 70 (cons yellow) to - 24 level 15 toons I think you can agree, if the aggro/con system where tweaked like this we could be having a lot more fun and spend less time complaining about level locks and twinks. further consideration could be made to take into account the groups: - Hitpoints - Power - Defense - Attack - AAs - Level - Gear Levels - Resist and so on. Why is pvp so black and white when it comes to con and who can fight who?

Bozidar · 08-10-2007, 05:35 PM

Because if you don't keep it as simple as possible (and the current system is a far cry from that) it becomes unmanagable and misunderstood by the masses

Keep It Simple

Wytie · 08-10-2007, 05:53 PM

Bozidar wrote:

Keep It Simple

I agree but the OP is on to a good idea imo just not exaclt what he said

It would need to be tweeked cause i dont care how many level 15's you have they will never have a chance against a real 70 and they never should but at the same time if they raid up to a 4x then they should con to higher level just not sure how high, and thats where SOE would have to come in test and find out what that 4x should be able to take and make it con to them.

All in all it should be simple but also different but thats just my opinion

DarkMasterMan · 08-10-2007, 06:45 PM

<-- has killed lvl 70's at level 20 with 3 people, 2 others and myself. That said, we then killed a 2v3 of level 70's, at level 22. Then, at level 26, I solo'd a level 70. Its completely doable, it just takes gear, spells, and some practice SMILEY

-Arctura- · 08-10-2007, 06:58 PM

DarkMasterMan wrote:

<-- has killed lvl 70's at level 20 with 3 people, 2 others and myself. That said, we then killed a 2v3 of level 70's, at level 22. Then, at level 26, I solo'd a level 70. Its completely doable, it just takes gear, spells, and some practice

(( yeah... like i said, pvp is not broken at allll SMILEY

Sightless · 08-10-2007, 07:18 PM

-Arctura- wrote:

DarkMasterMan wrote:
<-- has killed lvl 70's at level 20 with 3 people, 2 others and myself. That said, we then killed a 2v3 of level 70's, at level 22. Then, at level 26, I solo'd a level 70. Its completely doable, it just takes gear, spells, and some practice
(( yeah... like i said, pvp is not broken at allll

I could see this happening "if" that level 26 was a Fury or Warden in full fabled gear going up against a Necromancer in treasured gear and app Is. Or maybe a Guardian or Beserker in treasured and app Is.

DarkMasterMan · 08-10-2007, 07:24 PM

=) lvl 26 warden, vs a lvl 70 conj, yep, wrecked him pretty bad too

Sightless · 08-10-2007, 07:32 PM

DarkMasterMan wrote:

=) lvl 26 warden, vs a lvl 70 conj, yep, wrecked him pretty bad too

Was probably a farming bot.

Killque · 08-10-2007, 07:51 PM

DarkMasterMan wrote:

=) lvl 26 warden, vs a lvl 70 conj, yep, wrecked him pretty bad too

I cant belive im saying this, but your an idiot.

DarkMasterMan · 08-10-2007, 07:52 PM

Dessy titled conj, trying to take me out at TS tower, I fled to just beyond the keep, rooted the pet, and he went down =p

Orthureon · 08-10-2007, 08:24 PM

DarkMasterMan.

Grats on taking out a 70 especially being 44 levels lower, though that further displays the completely broken game mechanics that exist. There should be NO WAY IN HELL of taking down a 70 at level 26 solo. I don't care if they have all APP1s and treasured gear (by treasured I mean their level treasured, which can sometimes be really nice). If he had all APP1s and level 20 or 30 gear I would say sure you should own him/her.

I feel hitting anyone 16 levels and higher should be nearly impossible be it master spells/CAs, even after debuffing them. Though with the same prinicple you shouldn't even really stand a chance of landing a debuff. Go fight a mob 8 levels higher and see how easy it is to hit. Then try a mob a mere 12 levels higher and see what happens. I feel 16 is being generous. I know sony didn't want levels to matter that much in PVP but there has got to be a point when levels do matter, IE 44 level difference.

However I would be willing to compromise and say 20 levels max after a lot of debuffs of course. You know what happens to triple up mobs 20 levels lower than me, they die and pretty [Removed for Content] fast aswell. That is on any toon I have ever played.

Also, just to clarify I don't get ganked much by greys, but I see it happen all the time to really twinked out well played toons which con much higher than the lowbies. So I am not crying because I get owned lol, just something broken that should be fixed.

Haliken · 08-10-2007, 08:25 PM

DarkMasterMan wrote:

=) lvl 26 warden, vs a lvl 70 conj, yep, wrecked him pretty bad too

And this is why I'm one of those who believe that a level 70 should have something like a 10x damage multiplier if the opponent is that many levels lower (and a 0.10x multiplier for the lower person), just so that you CAN'T win a fight like that. Ever.

matt2004 · 08-10-2007, 08:31 PM

EQ2 is;

-one of the best games on the market (if you play on a pve server)

-the worst atrocity ever created since the beginning of mankind (if you play on a pvp server)

and im a pvp freak. Yes, im twinked (dont have a choice). but the system sucks and i wont be renewing my account. thanks for the free month of play though b/c of Vanguard. At least i know that there is no need to reactivate my account to see if the game has changed because now i know for sure its still crap.

i really wish i could get into pve more because i would be happily on a pve server but i just cant play a game with no pvp. and EQ2 pvp isnt pvp.

Killque · 08-10-2007, 09:19 PM

DarkMasterMan wrote:

Dessy titled conj, trying to take me out at TS tower, I fled to just beyond the keep, rooted the pet, and he went down =p

I would be willing to bet all my plat that you couldnt even keep up with a level 70s HP regen. I will never belive that you killed him unless he entered combat loosing his ooc regen and didnt ever even cast a spell on you.

44 levels is simply not possible.

Norrsken · 08-11-2007, 04:38 AM

Killque wrote:

DarkMasterMan wrote:
Dessy titled conj, trying to take me out at TS tower, I fled to just beyond the keep, rooted the pet, and he went down =p
I would be willing to bet all my plat that you couldnt even keep up with a level 70s HP regen. I will never belive that you killed him unless he entered combat loosing his ooc regen and didnt ever even cast a spell on you.
44 levels is simply not possible.

oh, its very doable. The guy he attacks must just be incredibly bad at pvp. I took down a 70 warden once, with a 30ish necro. I mean, omg! But that was not me having skill, but the warden sucking so bad a black hole would have been envious. Same with that conj. We all know titles mean squat.

Xova · 08-11-2007, 06:54 PM

Killque wrote:

DarkMasterMan wrote:
Dessy titled conj, trying to take me out at TS tower, I fled to just beyond the keep, rooted the pet, and he went down =p
I would be willing to bet all my plat that you couldnt even keep up with a level 70s HP regen. I will never belive that you killed him unless he entered combat loosing his ooc regen and didnt ever even cast a spell on you.
44 levels is simply not possible.

Darkmasterman = Master Drakan. Probably one of the best PvP'ers when it comes to tactics and using game mechanics to his advantage.

His Warden is pretty tough. We actually had him on a run at crab and he held up pretty well, though the AE's got him eventually. So it doesn't surprise me to hear that he was able to take out a 70 Conj, albeit the conjuror must have REALLY sucked and been in bad gear.

That said though, expect to see a change with reds vs grays due to things like this.

MaNiaGG84 · 08-11-2007, 07:59 PM

So this happened on Vox? Would be the only explanation. Some guy bought a conj and didnt find the spell bar cause he was playing the game the first time, his UI wasnt working or sth like that

08-10-2007, 05:30 PM	#1
Jibantic Loremaster Join Date: Dec 2004 Posts: 42	I'm new to pvp, but find the con and aggro system for pvp far to messed up. Consider this. 1 level 15 toon vs 6 level 15 toons. How is it fair, fun or for the most part challenging that the group of 6 can attack the solo? The reason people are level locking is to gain an advantage on the con/aggro system. Now consider a new aggro system. 1 level 30 (cons orange) = 6 level 15 toons. or 2 level 30 (cons orange)= 12 level 15 toons or for more fun 1 level 70 (cons yellow) to - 24 level 15 toons I think you can agree, if the aggro/con system where tweaked like this we could be having a lot more fun and spend less time complaining about level locks and twinks. further consideration could be made to take into account the groups: - Hitpoints - Power - Defense - Attack - AAs - Level - Gear Levels - Resist and so on. Why is pvp so black and white when it comes to con and who can fight who? __________________

08-10-2007, 05:53 PM	#3
Wytie Mouse Betrayer! Join Date: Mar 2006 Posts: 2,579	Bozidar wrote: Keep It Simple I agree but the OP is on to a good idea imo just not exaclt what he said It would need to be tweeked cause i dont care how many level 15's you have they will never have a chance against a real 70 and they never should but at the same time if they raid up to a 4x then they should con to higher level just not sure how high, and thats where SOE would have to come in test and find out what that 4x should be able to take and make it con to them. All in all it should be simple but also different but thats just my opinion __________________

08-10-2007, 06:58 PM	#5
-Arctura- Loremaster Join Date: Nov 2004 Location: Canada Posts: 1,589	DarkMasterMan wrote: <-- has killed lvl 70's at level 20 with 3 people, 2 others and myself. That said, we then killed a 2v3 of level 70's, at level 22. Then, at level 26, I solo'd a level 70. Its completely doable, it just takes gear, spells, and some practice (( yeah... like i said, pvp is not broken at allll

08-10-2007, 07:18 PM	#6
Sightless Loremaster Join Date: Aug 2007 Posts: 1,199	-Arctura- wrote: DarkMasterMan wrote: <-- has killed lvl 70's at level 20 with 3 people, 2 others and myself. That said, we then killed a 2v3 of level 70's, at level 22. Then, at level 26, I solo'd a level 70. Its completely doable, it just takes gear, spells, and some practice (( yeah... like i said, pvp is not broken at allll I could see this happening "if" that level 26 was a Fury or Warden in full fabled gear going up against a Necromancer in treasured gear and app Is. Or maybe a Guardian or Beserker in treasured and app Is. __________________ Doing your own thing isn't good, if it prevents others from doing their own thing.

08-10-2007, 07:32 PM	#8
Sightless Loremaster Join Date: Aug 2007 Posts: 1,199	DarkMasterMan wrote: =) lvl 26 warden, vs a lvl 70 conj, yep, wrecked him pretty bad too Was probably a farming bot. __________________ Doing your own thing isn't good, if it prevents others from doing their own thing.

08-10-2007, 05:35 PM	#2
Bozidar Loremaster Join Date: May 2006 Posts: 3,292	Because if you don't keep it as simple as possible (and the current system is a far cry from that) it becomes unmanagable and misunderstood by the masses Keep It Simple

08-10-2007, 06:45 PM	#4
DarkMasterMan Loremaster Join Date: Jan 2005 Posts: 75	<-- has killed lvl 70's at level 20 with 3 people, 2 others and myself. That said, we then killed a 2v3 of level 70's, at level 22. Then, at level 26, I solo'd a level 70. Its completely doable, it just takes gear, spells, and some practice

08-10-2007, 07:24 PM	#7
DarkMasterMan Loremaster Join Date: Jan 2005 Posts: 75	=) lvl 26 warden, vs a lvl 70 conj, yep, wrecked him pretty bad too

08-10-2007, 07:51 PM	#9
Killque Loremaster Join Date: Sep 2006 Posts: 1,112	DarkMasterMan wrote: =) lvl 26 warden, vs a lvl 70 conj, yep, wrecked him pretty bad too I cant belive im saying this, but your an idiot.

08-10-2007, 07:52 PM	#10
DarkMasterMan Loremaster Join Date: Jan 2005 Posts: 75	Dessy titled conj, trying to take me out at TS tower, I fled to just beyond the keep, rooted the pet, and he went down =p

08-10-2007, 08:24 PM	#11
Orthureon Loremaster Join Date: Jan 2006 Posts: 1,073	DarkMasterMan. Grats on taking out a 70 especially being 44 levels lower, though that further displays the completely broken game mechanics that exist. There should be NO WAY IN HELL of taking down a 70 at level 26 solo. I don't care if they have all APP1s and treasured gear (by treasured I mean their level treasured, which can sometimes be really nice). If he had all APP1s and level 20 or 30 gear I would say sure you should own him/her. I feel hitting anyone 16 levels and higher should be nearly impossible be it master spells/CAs, even after debuffing them. Though with the same prinicple you shouldn't even really stand a chance of landing a debuff. Go fight a mob 8 levels higher and see how easy it is to hit. Then try a mob a mere 12 levels higher and see what happens. I feel 16 is being generous. I know sony didn't want levels to matter that much in PVP but there has got to be a point when levels do matter, IE 44 level difference. However I would be willing to compromise and say 20 levels max after a lot of debuffs of course. You know what happens to triple up mobs 20 levels lower than me, they die and pretty [Removed for Content] fast aswell. That is on any toon I have ever played. Also, just to clarify I don't get ganked much by greys, but I see it happen all the time to really twinked out well played toons which con much higher than the lowbies. So I am not crying because I get owned lol, just something broken that should be fixed. __________________ NAGAFEN Server DAEMIEN 92 Shadowknight XEOS 92 Ranger EXILON 92 Inquisitor.

08-10-2007, 08:25 PM	#12
Haliken Loremaster Join Date: Jan 2005 Posts: 162	DarkMasterMan wrote: =) lvl 26 warden, vs a lvl 70 conj, yep, wrecked him pretty bad too And this is why I'm one of those who believe that a level 70 should have something like a 10x damage multiplier if the opponent is that many levels lower (and a 0.10x multiplier for the lower person), just so that you CAN'T win a fight like that. Ever.

08-10-2007, 08:31 PM	#13
matt2004 Loremaster Join Date: Dec 2004 Posts: 194	EQ2 is; -one of the best games on the market (if you play on a pve server) -the worst atrocity ever created since the beginning of mankind (if you play on a pvp server) and im a pvp freak. Yes, im twinked (dont have a choice). but the system sucks and i wont be renewing my account. thanks for the free month of play though b/c of Vanguard. At least i know that there is no need to reactivate my account to see if the game has changed because now i know for sure its still crap. i really wish i could get into pve more because i would be happily on a pve server but i just cant play a game with no pvp. and EQ2 pvp isnt pvp.

08-10-2007, 09:19 PM	#14
Killque Loremaster Join Date: Sep 2006 Posts: 1,112	DarkMasterMan wrote: Dessy titled conj, trying to take me out at TS tower, I fled to just beyond the keep, rooted the pet, and he went down =p I would be willing to bet all my plat that you couldnt even keep up with a level 70s HP regen. I will never belive that you killed him unless he entered combat loosing his ooc regen and didnt ever even cast a spell on you. 44 levels is simply not possible.

08-11-2007, 04:38 AM	#15
Norrsken Loremaster Join Date: Dec 2004 Posts: 6,450	Killque wrote: DarkMasterMan wrote: Dessy titled conj, trying to take me out at TS tower, I fled to just beyond the keep, rooted the pet, and he went down =p I would be willing to bet all my plat that you couldnt even keep up with a level 70s HP regen. I will never belive that you killed him unless he entered combat loosing his ooc regen and didnt ever even cast a spell on you. 44 levels is simply not possible. oh, its very doable. The guy he attacks must just be incredibly bad at pvp. I took down a 70 warden once, with a 30ish necro. I mean, omg! But that was not me having skill, but the warden sucking so bad a black hole would have been envious. Same with that conj. We all know titles mean squat. __________________

08-11-2007, 06:54 PM	#16
Xova Loremaster Join Date: Feb 2006 Posts: 509	Killque wrote: DarkMasterMan wrote: Dessy titled conj, trying to take me out at TS tower, I fled to just beyond the keep, rooted the pet, and he went down =p I would be willing to bet all my plat that you couldnt even keep up with a level 70s HP regen. I will never belive that you killed him unless he entered combat loosing his ooc regen and didnt ever even cast a spell on you. 44 levels is simply not possible. Darkmasterman = Master Drakan. Probably one of the best PvP'ers when it comes to tactics and using game mechanics to his advantage. His Warden is pretty tough. We actually had him on a run at crab and he held up pretty well, though the AE's got him eventually. So it doesn't surprise me to hear that he was able to take out a 70 Conj, albeit the conjuror must have REALLY sucked and been in bad gear. That said though, expect to see a change with reds vs grays due to things like this.

08-11-2007, 07:59 PM	#17
MaNiaGG84 Loremaster Join Date: Nov 2006 Posts: 92	So this happened on Vox? Would be the only explanation. Some guy bought a conj and didnt find the spell bar cause he was playing the game the first time, his UI wasnt working or sth like that