Regardless Of What Most Say, Fury Kicks @ss

Acupunctu · 01-12-2005, 10:43 PM

I've heard so many complaints about the Fury, that If I were to look at these forums before I had made my choice, I would have never picked it, and would have regretted my decision. First off, I'm a bit tired of the complaints that our spells are broken, things don't stack the way they should, blah blah blah. Well if our class was so broken, why can I solo mobs 6-8 levels higher than me, that a Berserker/Palydin with DOUBLE my armor class can't even solo themselves? How then, am I able to do nearly the same damage as a Wizard, the same level as me, per battle? I can do between 1700-2400 damage per battle that classes that are specifically designed to do damage have a hard time keeping up (not to mention that I can be the main healer in the group if I choose to, and not even need a secondary healer). Now, I am by no means intending to brag or gloat, but from most of the posts on these boards, I am seeing more and more furies regretting their decision. I understand that there are still glitches/bugs that keep the fury from being all that it can be (and can be said for most classes as well), but as it stands, there is no other class I would choose to be if given a second chance.

A Content Fury, LVL 31

Message Edited by Acupuncture on 01-12-2005 12:43 PM

Bad_Mojo · 01-12-2005, 10:48 PM

Acupuncture wrote:

I've heard so many complaints about the Fury, that If I were to look at these forums before I had made my choice, I would have never picked it, and would have regretted my decision. First off, I'm a bit tired of the complaints that our spells are broken, things don't stack the way they should, blah blah blah. Well if our class was so broken, why can I solo mobs 6-8 levels higher than me, that a Berserker/Palydin with DOUBLE my armor class can't even solo themselves? How then, am I able to do nearly the same damage as a Wizard, the same level as me, per battle? I can do between 1700-2400 damage per battle that classes that are specifically designed to do damage have a hard time keeping up (not to mention that I can be the main healer in the group if I choose to, and not even need a secondary healer). Now, I am by no means intending to brag or gloat, but from most of the posts on these boards, I am seeing more and more furies regretting their decision. I understand that there are still glitches/bugs that keep the fury from being all that it can be (and can be said for most classes as well), but as it stands, there is no other class I would choose to be if given a second chance.

A Content Fury, LVL 31

Message Edited by Acupuncture on 01-12-2005 12:43 PM

What mobs are you solo'ing that you are beating despite them being 8 levels higher than you? ( I assume these are'solo' and not 'group' mobs...)

1700-2400 damage per battle is nothing really. It's good for a priest, but the scout classes will easily top that (and Wizards are currently just as broken as we are, they do less damage than most scout archetypes). At higher levels, just the initial assassin attack (one strike) does more than you do in an entire battle SMILEY That's beside the point though, nobody is complaining about our damage output, just the fact that some of our spells are supposed to proc an effect and don't... And we lag behind the other healers at higher levels.

Message Edited by Bad_Mojo on 01-12-2005 01:05 PM

Acupunctu · 01-12-2005, 11:14 PM

Mostly soloing in Runneye or EL, obviously not group mobs, but my LVL 30 Paladin friend can barely kill things 2 levels higher than him. I'm not saying some our spells arent broken, but the fact of the matter remains that we are quite a versatile group. Sure, and assasin can attack for high DPS, but can they heal, or buff AC Power, and Health like we do AND attack for a high amount? Nope.

Bad_Mojo · 01-12-2005, 11:17 PM

Acupuncture wrote:

Mostly soloing in Runneye or EL, obviously not group mobs, but my LVL 30 Paladin friend can barely kill things 2 levels higher than him. I'm not saying some our spells arent broken, but the fact of the matter remains that we are quite a versatile group. Sure, and assasin can attack for high DPS, but can they heal, or buff AC Power, and Health like we do AND attack for a high amount? Nope.

Meh, we do ok as far as damage goes. I've found that at the lower the level, the less the difference, but the higher you get the more the DPS classes really start to outshine the others. Rensu has posted up numbers on occasion and in a group of tanks and DPS, he was at the bottom. That really doesn't bother me though, since I consider any damage I do to be cake, the real reason I am there is to heal/buff/debuff, and if those are broken, there's a problem SMILEY

Acupunctu · 01-13-2005, 12:49 AM

I've been in many groups where, when using the parser, shows that I was 90% of the time in the top 2 for DPS. Now, this was a group with everyone hovering around lvl30 in varsoon, with 2 assasins, a wizard, a berserker tank, a templar and myself. This could also be due to the fact that all of my jewerly/armor is always kept at orange, and full lvl 30 armor. Needless to say, most of those in the group were quite impressed :smileywink:

ren · 01-13-2005, 12:49 AM

Our DPS really only shines in solo/duo or if you want to burn mana. Also, 2400dmg is indeed nothing, I see warlock nukes that do 1100 instantly and I am relying on a dot that does 500dmg "eventually". I don't even think our greatest asset to DPS is spells -- rather it is from melee and having so many procs. However, again, I can't melee much in large group encounters because 1) you can't heal, buff, debuff, and melee at the same time, 2) you are generating aggro by meleeing, and 3) I really don't wanna be in that melee mess because proximity to a mob does seem to increase the chances that it turns on you, just like in EQL. Also, it may have Wild Swing or point blank AoEs that I really don't want damaging me.

Ohh, also -- it depends on the quality of everyone's spells. If you have lots of Adepts and your paladin friend is in app2s, it isn't really a good comparison. Also food for thought, Paladins parse fairly well. Even in small group encounters, I can't touch a Paladins DPS. I am not quite sure why your friend cannot solo, but I know plenty of high level Paladins that can and do.

Ohh, ooh, one more thing -- I am actually not "At the bottom" on most parses. I am usually above enchanters =P I consistently parse 0-30dps in a group environment (where I have to heal/buff/debuff), and upwards for 50-70 solo and duo. Even adding proc buffs from everyone and adding it to my score doesn't bump me up that much, usually, which is how I have been gauging whether or not to undertake the tedious task of buffing people ad naseum.

Message Edited by rensu on 01-12-2005 11:53 AM

Also, 1 more thing. I have taken up hunting in LS/ Solusek's eye and those mobs barrage for 1500-2k+ and do hits for 1k fairly quick. I don't wanna be grabbing aggro from that at all. On some mobs deeper in, they can do 3500+ pt barrages and kill you instantly. Heck, half of the time in there, if a caster gets aggro and doesn't lose it, he will die before I can even land 1 heal on him. Not that 500hp is really gonna help when the mob hits him for 1500 (this is a problem for all priests -- even in multi-priest groups, that caster gonna get creamed).

Message Edited by rensu on 01-12-2005 12:10 PM

Acupunctu · 01-13-2005, 01:19 AM

well honestly the 1500-2400 is a bad example, because this directly relates to the amount of damage everyone else was doing. For example, in our group, all of us doing DPS (4 of us) were all at the top, only about 200+/- points apart from eachother. Therefore, had there been less DPS'rs in battle, I would be upwards of 3k or 4k (which I have done before), when everyone else was doing about 2k. Again, these numbers are purely subjective, and were used only to give you an example of what everyone else was doing. All of my spells are adpt at the minimum, with my Lvl 30 skill lightning strike being adept 2 (naturally). I average about 50 -65 DPS in a group if I am secondary healer, which does not slack by a long shot.

Message Edited by Acupuncture on 01-12-2005 03:20 PM

Message Edited by Acupuncture on 01-12-2005 03:22 PM

FloydNakamic · 01-13-2005, 01:24 AM

what is 'the parser' and how do you access it?

I agree that fury is a great class and I am very happy with my choice. The reason you see mostly negative things on the boards is because people don't bother posting about the things that are working.

Message Edited by FloydNakamichi on 01-12-2005 12:24 PM

Acupunctu · 01-13-2005, 01:29 AM

Good point. It's a third party program that I personally do not have, and would like to know where to get it. My experience with it is mainly from groupmates that had/used it.

ren · 01-13-2005, 01:46 AM

It depends on how long the fight lasts, too. We get a burst of huge damage, but it has a 9s refresh and is also quite mana intensive. Also, we get dots, but it takes them 20 seconds to do ~800 dmg (which is already ~40dps). However, I clock most fights ending before then or before I nuke at all. On long fights, also, I am usually taken back to more of healer role since I have to keep debuffs up and, well, heal, but definitely on yard trash I can burn them for the 15 seconds that they are alive =p

Even still, take an easy "plow" encounter for example where I parsed extremely well (44.74dps), much higher than other encounters and it broke down:

Zerker: 4080

Me: 1387

Monk: 2474

Ranger: 1509 (slacker -- didn't do big hits)

Warlock: 2389

Coercer: 732

So right there I did 11% of the damage. Nobody proc'd anything of mine this fight, so that is what it is.

Then let's shoot to one inside Sol at 30~ seconds again where I did one of my best dps scores (38.47) as well as have some from procs:

Paladin: 4954 (-434 & 168 for FF and BS)

Ranger: 3583 (-443 for BL --- slacking again maybe? =x)

Warlock: 5477

Me: 1308 (+443 +434 +16 SMILEY

= 2353

Templar: 221

Illusionist: 0

And you get ~15% of damage contributed is from me.

This doesn't mean that this is all I am capable of. Rather, this is just parsing from normal group experiences and my playstyle. Also, mobs in Soluseks Eye seem very resistant to my "big" nuke so I don't use that much because it is a waste of mana. Also, again, I am healing as well. I suppose I could do more damage if I did not heal at all, but that isn't really why people invite me to group with them. They have been pretty good about keeping the roles doing what they should be doing so far, so I have faith that they won't turn around and tell us that we should expect to be second rate healers just because we can do a bit more damage than the other priests.

darkshm · 01-13-2005, 02:08 AM

From what I've heard about 'zerkers and wizards DPS getting hit pretty hard lately, you can probably expect your / our damage contributions to go up a tad. Thanks for the numbers Rens. Anyway I'm sure the Templar was mostly just healing? Surely he/she coulda done more than that right? And I've got to think the ranger was slacking yeah, heh.Did the group know these encounters were going to be used for stat captures? I'd love to see some where the team knew ahead of time (so no slacking on the ranger's part, and maybe the templar could go offensive too?)

ren · 01-13-2005, 02:19 AM

He was main healer in Sol yeah and I was backup. They knew I was parsing but they weren't going all-out. The ranger didn't do any of his major attacks, which is the reason that I think he was slacking.

Edit: the damage that the cleric did was some crushing damage and a blessed weapon proc. He didn't even start fighting until 13 seconds remaining in the fight.

Message Edited by rensu on 01-12-2005 01:19 PM

Kit_Oturea · 01-13-2005, 03:08 AM

Bad move.

From years of experience, the worst thing to do on a board is to say your class is fine. In fact, in other games I have actually see people "plant" "we are great" posts just to defer nerfs to another class.

The classes whining get looked at. 75% of the time the Dev's then NERF those who aren't.

Luckily We have Rensu here to give hard numbers to protect us from the coming nerf bat.

More importantly the "whines" are reasonable.

We have heals that do WORSE then heals 14 levels lower then them at equal rank (app III, etc) which cost less mana and worked fine. I.e. we need our heals looked at post 26th level (read fleshweave).

We can not sit as lions and being one and forgetting what your character's race is after even 7 levels is annoying. A /showform command would greatly improve many furies enjoyment of the game.

A good number of our buffs simply do not work.

Etc.

These are ligitament concerns and that is what the board is for.

See ya,

Rakk

27 Fury

Kithcor

Acupunctu · 01-13-2005, 03:44 AM

For the record, I never said that our class was "fine" and free of flaws. In fact, if you read my posts, I do acknowledge the fact that there are things that need to be fixed. However, the degree of severity of many of the posts list a sort of regret for ever choosing a particular class, yet all classes have broken/non stackable buffs/spells to a degree. So if you want a pessimistic approach on the whole situation, every class is "broken."

MsIr · 01-13-2005, 08:52 AM

Acupuncture wrote:

I've heard so many complaints about the Fury, that If I were to look at these forums before I had made my choice, I would have never picked it, and would have regretted my decision. First off, I'm a bit tired of the complaints that our spells are broken, things don't stack the way they should, blah blah blah. Well if our class was so broken, why can I solo mobs 6-8 levels higher than me, that a Berserker/Palydin with DOUBLE my armor class can't even solo themselves? How then, am I able to do nearly the same damage as a Wizard, the same level as me, per battle? I can do between 1700-2400 damage per battle that classes that are specifically designed to do damage have a hard time keeping up (not to mention that I can be the main healer in the group if I choose to, and not even need a secondary healer). Now, I am by no means intending to brag or gloat, but from most of the posts on these boards, I am seeing more and more furies regretting their decision. I understand that there are still glitches/bugs that keep the fury from being all that it can be (and can be said for most classes as well), but as it stands, there is no other class I would choose to be if given a second chance.

A Content Fury, LVL 31

Message Edited by Acupuncture on 01-12-2005 12:43 PM

Bleh, you trying to get us nerfed? :smileyvery-happy: There are issues with our class, but it is still a very fun class. Glad to see their is another happy Fury out there!

MsIree

MsIr · 01-13-2005, 09:00 AM

Bad_Mojo wrote:

Acupuncture wrote:

I've heard so many complaints about the Fury, that If I were to look at these forums before I had made my choice, I would have never picked it, and would have regretted my decision. First off, I'm a bit tired of the complaints that our spells are broken, things don't stack the way they should, blah blah blah. Well if our class was so broken, why can I solo mobs 6-8 levels higher than me, that a Berserker/Palydin with DOUBLE my armor class can't even solo themselves? How then, am I able to do nearly the same damage as a Wizard, the same level as me, per battle? I can do between 1700-2400 damage per battle that classes that are specifically designed to do damage have a hard time keeping up (not to mention that I can be the main healer in the group if I choose to, and not even need a secondary healer). Now, I am by no means intending to brag or gloat, but from most of the posts on these boards, I am seeing more and more furies regretting their decision. I understand that there are still glitches/bugs that keep the fury from being all that it can be (and can be said for most classes as well), but as it stands, there is no other class I would choose to be if given a second chance.

A Content Fury, LVL 31

Message Edited by Acupuncture on 01-12-2005 12:43 PM

What mobs are you solo'ing that you are beating despite them being 8 levels higher than you? ( I assume these are'solo' and not 'group' mobs...)

1700-2400 damage per battle is nothing really. It's good for a priest, but the scout classes will easily top that (and Wizards are currently just as broken as we are, they do less damage than most scout archetypes). At higher levels, just the initial assassin attack (one strike) does more than you do in an entire battle That's beside the point though, nobody is complaining about our damage output, just the fact that some of our spells are supposed to proc an effect and don't... And we lag behind the other healers at higher levels.

Message Edited by Bad_Mojo on 01-12-2005 01:05 PM

Actually I was in a group in EL where the SK had a parser that would show in chat what dmg was done by who. Most of us had never seen that before, and it quickly turned into a contest to see who could get the high score. The group was SK/TRB/TMP/FRY/BZK/WIZ all within 3 levels of each other. Since we had a templar I decided to chain nuke. Only once did I get outdamaged, and that was because I laid a heal. Most in the group couldn't believe it. Frankly I was surprised myself. :smileytongue: We are quite good casters. I do agree we don't heal as well as other priests, and that wizards are broken.

MsIree

Axterix · 01-13-2005, 09:10 AM

I've seen that parser program as well. In the group I was in, which had a berserker, assassin, summoner, coercer, and swashbuckler, I only managed to be on top once, even if all I did was nuke. Most of the time, I was about 3rd to 5th. That's with adept 1s for all the relevant powers, pretty much. Of course, that's without figuring in the damage my DS was doing, which probably wasn't too much, since I pretty much didn't need to heal SMILEY

A respectable showing, but when it comes to DPS, scouts are where it is at.

Acupunctu · 01-13-2005, 10:44 AM

Exactly Msiree, I am usually always in the top 2 when using the parser in groups. I think a lot of this has to do with the option of choosing the lightning skill at level 30 instead of the heal. This enabled me to be quite a force to be reckoned with.

Mjk_cz · 01-13-2005, 12:16 PM

Hehe i took druid because of healing, not because of nuking SMILEY

. I mostly complain about bad scaling of druid's healing spells, might look great up to lvl 25, but looks like beyond lvl 30 our heals are weak SMILEY

While enemy's hits scale up really fast, my healing is alerady capped by lvl 12 regrow... and nothing relpaces it.. so far SMILEY

SolsticeRunewo · 01-13-2005, 08:19 PM

As you level you will realize theres a huge gap in between how much DMG we can do compared to DPS classes. Comparing how the Fury works at lvl 30 is a totally different situation at lvl 40+. I am a lvl 45 Fury and hunt exclusively in Perma and Lavastorm. If I was to put out any sort of damage to an enemy I would have to burn all my mana in doing so which would not be playing my class to nearly 1/4 of its potential.

I realized by picking this class yet again ( lvl 65 Druid EQL ) that I was going to be a support class, that didnt bother me. What is nice about Druids this time around is that we sometimes get to play the solo healer which would never happen in EQL.

What I mostly focus on in fight ( now remember it varies upon which mobs you encounter ) I will make sure I am debuffing the mob and keeping ATK and +stats to the tanks and DPS classes along with supplying help for the main healer by regen or backup heals. Every so often in the encounter I will cast my two DDs which roughly do on average about 370dmg per which is only a measly 700dmg in 18seconds where a scout class has easily did that in one hit , plus I burned over 300 mana doing so.

ren · 01-13-2005, 08:28 PM

Also remember that we get our last nuke at 38, our last "good" DoT at 36, and our last low dmg/debuff DoT at 43.

Katx · 01-13-2005, 11:19 PM

To me, being a competent Fury isn't about being able to solo well. It's not about how much damage we can do, either.

I picked this class because I wanted to be a healer, and we were supposed to be able to plug any healer into a group function as well as (if differently than) any other healer in terms of healing.

It seems that all classes are having problems with their spells scaling up as they level (particularly hard hit are pure casters and healers since better weapons don't mask the scaling issues like they do on melee and scout abilities).

No one has made any issue with our soloing abilities or how much damage we do, to my knowledge. Everyone is posting about healing spells not scaling well at upper levels (being dependent upon a level 12 spell above level 30 is just plain ridiculous), spells whose secondary effects don't work, spells that are just plain broken, etc.

While I am glad that you are happy with your Fury, and while I also still enjoy this class, your post does nothing but harm us in terms of trying to get the *actual* broken things fixed.

Ee · 01-14-2005, 01:33 AM

Acupuncture wrote:

Exactly Msiree, I am usually always in the top 2 when using the parser in groups. I think a lot of this has to do with the option of choosing the lightning skill at level 30 instead of the heal. This enabled me to be quite a force to be reckoned with.

Lets see how you do now that this spell is working as the appropriate upgrade to SoT as oppose to an extra spell on our hot bar. When I chose my level 30 spell I made sure to PM several other 30+ Furies asking which spell they chose and if it was sharing a reuse timer with one of our current spells - this was the only one that did not, so I went with it. As the little icon flashed up on my spell bar I noticed that it was identical to SoT and it was obvious (for me) that they were meant to share a timer. Sure enough a couple days later my Wizard friends level 30 nuke was sharing a timer, and here we are now hardly a week later and the fury nuke is sharing a timer. Now, the only reason you were able to unload damage greater than classes that are actual damage dealers is because of these spells not stacking. Infact, taking away this spell will more than likely lower your dps by over 1200 on the appropriate mobs.

Furies are not meant to deal sick amounts of damage. Prior to these spells stacking my fury would consistently parse slightly above my paladin friend where my ranger and wizard friends (all real life friends, an we tested this at a lan) were offten well ahead of me. Although the ranger was a few levels lower and struggled to hit a couple of the mobs and I was able to parse higher than him on occassion there was no amount of spamming I could do to get within the "wizards" damage range. Now, if at the time I was able to stack Clap/SoT it would have been a different story - but rather meaningless considering these spells were not meant to "stack".

Acupunctu · 01-14-2005, 04:21 AM

Yea seriously, talk about learning the hard way. I had no idea the new thunders trike spell was designed to stack, and it's pretty irresponsible of SOE to simply overlook this aspect and give us the o'l screwgy a week later. I guess, at the very least, it'll get me to become the main healer again instead of a primary DPS'r.....I guess its not all bad, but still dissapointing nonetheless.

Bulzie · 01-14-2005, 08:52 PM

"why can I solo mobs 6-8 levels higher than me,"Ok I cannot get past this line Acu. Tell us what mobs you are soloing that are 6-8 levels above you? I think that is a pretty bold statement to throw out there. I would think 6-8 levels higher then you would be very very Red to you unless something has changed with the con tables?? And if that were the case, don't see how you would be able to do any dmg as you would be spamming heals on yourself as we cannot take dmg like a tank. Sorry, maybe you just estimated to high but have a hard time believing you are 2nd on list of DPS or anything else you saying.

Acupunctu · 01-15-2005, 10:57 PM

Ok, I have stated this MANY TIMES, but in EL, the sand turtles (the big ones) were level 34, and I was level 27, and I could easily defeat them ( with about 33% of my mana left as well). Now that is 7 levels higher, not 8, but you get the point.

ren · 01-15-2005, 11:15 PM

I'll never disagree (at this point in the game) with anyone that says that Furies can solo well. They can. The problem does not lie here, though, and I didn't choose Fury to be a "good soloer". Also, I don't believe it is correct to force us into this role because of our current, lacking skillset.

Message Edited by rensu on 01-15-2005 10:16 AM

Axterix · 01-17-2005, 02:51 AM

Acupuncture wrote:

Ok, I have stated this MANY TIMES, but in EL, the sand turtles (the big ones) were level 34, and I was level 27, and I could easily defeat them ( with about 33% of my mana left as well). Now that is 7 levels higher, not 8, but you get the point.

Of course, it is only a matter of time before the toughness of the mobs in EL gets adjusted SMILEY

Twizz · 01-17-2005, 02:41 PM

Axterix wrote:

Acupuncture wrote:

Ok, I have stated this MANY TIMES, but in EL, the sand turtles (the big ones) were level 34, and I was level 27, and I could easily defeat them ( with about 33% of my mana left as well). Now that is 7 levels higher, not 8, but you get the point.

Of course, it is only a matter of time before the toughness of the mobs in EL gets adjusted

Not sure they need to be adjusted, solo xp isn't that great and I think there is a penalty for killing red mobs. Most efficient stuff to solo seem to be white-orange mobs.

AUxe · 01-17-2005, 10:06 PM

Friend of mine and I did a test (hes a 25 Fury and im a 25 Warlock)

I could consistently solo green mobs, occasionally blue if root held and all went well. Problem is root would not hold long enough on higher level mobs so I would get beat down and multiple recasts of root deplenishses power. And yes all spells were adept 1 or better.

So we are talking several levels below 25.

My fury friend could consistently kill red solo mobs up to level 30 with little risk.

Now this was a direct comparison and now we are approaching 30 it hasnt changed. So you can tell me whatever you like about Fury's not being powerful, but I know the truth.

In fact, I was so convinced that I have now created a druid on his way to Fury and my Warlock is back in the library until he figures out how to be competitive.

01-12-2005, 10:48 PM	#2
Bad_Mojo Loremaster Join Date: Nov 2004 Location: Colorado Posts: 341	Acupuncture wrote: I've heard so many complaints about the Fury, that If I were to look at these forums before I had made my choice, I would have never picked it, and would have regretted my decision. First off, I'm a bit tired of the complaints that our spells are broken, things don't stack the way they should, blah blah blah. Well if our class was so broken, why can I solo mobs 6-8 levels higher than me, that a Berserker/Palydin with DOUBLE my armor class can't even solo themselves? How then, am I able to do nearly the same damage as a Wizard, the same level as me, per battle? I can do between 1700-2400 damage per battle that classes that are specifically designed to do damage have a hard time keeping up (not to mention that I can be the main healer in the group if I choose to, and not even need a secondary healer). Now, I am by no means intending to brag or gloat, but from most of the posts on these boards, I am seeing more and more furies regretting their decision. I understand that there are still glitches/bugs that keep the fury from being all that it can be (and can be said for most classes as well), but as it stands, there is no other class I would choose to be if given a second chance. A Content Fury, LVL 31 Message Edited by Acupuncture on 01-12-2005 12:43 PM What mobs are you solo'ing that you are beating despite them being 8 levels higher than you? ( I assume these are'solo' and not 'group' mobs...) 1700-2400 damage per battle is nothing really. It's good for a priest, but the scout classes will easily top that (and Wizards are currently just as broken as we are, they do less damage than most scout archetypes). At higher levels, just the initial assassin attack (one strike) does more than you do in an entire battle That's beside the point though, nobody is complaining about our damage output, just the fact that some of our spells are supposed to proc an effect and don't... And we lag behind the other healers at higher levels. Message Edited by Bad_Mojo on 01-12-2005 01:05 PM

01-12-2005, 11:17 PM	#4
Bad_Mojo Loremaster Join Date: Nov 2004 Location: Colorado Posts: 341	Acupuncture wrote: Mostly soloing in Runneye or EL, obviously not group mobs, but my LVL 30 Paladin friend can barely kill things 2 levels higher than him. I'm not saying some our spells arent broken, but the fact of the matter remains that we are quite a versatile group. Sure, and assasin can attack for high DPS, but can they heal, or buff AC Power, and Health like we do AND attack for a high amount? Nope. Meh, we do ok as far as damage goes. I've found that at the lower the level, the less the difference, but the higher you get the more the DPS classes really start to outshine the others. Rensu has posted up numbers on occasion and in a group of tanks and DPS, he was at the bottom. That really doesn't bother me though, since I consider any damage I do to be cake, the real reason I am there is to heal/buff/debuff, and if those are broken, there's a problem

01-13-2005, 01:46 AM	#10
ren Join Date: Nov 2004 Posts: 409	It depends on how long the fight lasts, too. We get a burst of huge damage, but it has a 9s refresh and is also quite mana intensive. Also, we get dots, but it takes them 20 seconds to do ~800 dmg (which is already ~40dps). However, I clock most fights ending before then or before I nuke at all. On long fights, also, I am usually taken back to more of healer role since I have to keep debuffs up and, well, heal, but definitely on yard trash I can burn them for the 15 seconds that they are alive =p Even still, take an easy "plow" encounter for example where I parsed extremely well (44.74dps), much higher than other encounters and it broke down: Zerker: 4080 Me: 1387 Monk: 2474 Ranger: 1509 (slacker -- didn't do big hits) Warlock: 2389 Coercer: 732 So right there I did 11% of the damage. Nobody proc'd anything of mine this fight, so that is what it is. Then let's shoot to one inside Sol at 30~ seconds again where I did one of my best dps scores (38.47) as well as have some from procs: Paladin: 4954 (-434 & 168 for FF and BS) Ranger: 3583 (-443 for BL --- slacking again maybe? =x) Warlock: 5477 Me: 1308 (+443 +434 +16 = 2353 Templar: 221 Illusionist: 0 And you get ~15% of damage contributed is from me. This doesn't mean that this is all I am capable of. Rather, this is just parsing from normal group experiences and my playstyle. Also, mobs in Soluseks Eye seem very resistant to my "big" nuke so I don't use that much because it is a waste of mana. Also, again, I am healing as well. I suppose I could do more damage if I did not heal at all, but that isn't really why people invite me to group with them. They have been pretty good about keeping the roles doing what they should be doing so far, so I have faith that they won't turn around and tell us that we should expect to be second rate healers just because we can do a bit more damage than the other priests.

01-13-2005, 02:08 AM	#11
darkshm Join Date: Nov 2004 Posts: 349	From what I've heard about 'zerkers and wizards DPS getting hit pretty hard lately, you can probably expect your / our damage contributions to go up a tad. Thanks for the numbers Rens. Anyway I'm sure the Templar was mostly just healing? Surely he/she coulda done more than that right? And I've got to think the ranger was slacking yeah, heh.Did the group know these encounters were going to be used for stat captures? I'd love to see some where the team knew ahead of time (so no slacking on the ranger's part, and maybe the templar could go offensive too?) __________________ Senescent - 56 Erudite Fury (Exile officer) -Befallen Betwixt - 34 Dark Elf Defiler -Befallen

01-13-2005, 08:52 AM	#15
MsIr Join Date: Nov 2004 Posts: 24	Acupuncture wrote: I've heard so many complaints about the Fury, that If I were to look at these forums before I had made my choice, I would have never picked it, and would have regretted my decision. First off, I'm a bit tired of the complaints that our spells are broken, things don't stack the way they should, blah blah blah. Well if our class was so broken, why can I solo mobs 6-8 levels higher than me, that a Berserker/Palydin with DOUBLE my armor class can't even solo themselves? How then, am I able to do nearly the same damage as a Wizard, the same level as me, per battle? I can do between 1700-2400 damage per battle that classes that are specifically designed to do damage have a hard time keeping up (not to mention that I can be the main healer in the group if I choose to, and not even need a secondary healer). Now, I am by no means intending to brag or gloat, but from most of the posts on these boards, I am seeing more and more furies regretting their decision. I understand that there are still glitches/bugs that keep the fury from being all that it can be (and can be said for most classes as well), but as it stands, there is no other class I would choose to be if given a second chance. A Content Fury, LVL 31 Message Edited by Acupuncture on 01-12-2005 12:43 PM Bleh, you trying to get us nerfed? :smileyvery-happy: There are issues with our class, but it is still a very fun class. Glad to see their is another happy Fury out there! MsIree __________________ "Not everything that counts can be counted, and not everything that can be counted counts." Albert Einstein Oasis: Evilina Anilive - 32nd Fury / 25th Tailor(retired) Nameless(EQ1): Charmaine - 54th Dark Elf Necromancer

01-12-2005, 10:43 PM	#1
Acupunctu Join Date: Nov 2004 Posts: 31	I've heard so many complaints about the Fury, that If I were to look at these forums before I had made my choice, I would have never picked it, and would have regretted my decision. First off, I'm a bit tired of the complaints that our spells are broken, things don't stack the way they should, blah blah blah. Well if our class was so broken, why can I solo mobs 6-8 levels higher than me, that a Berserker/Palydin with DOUBLE my armor class can't even solo themselves? How then, am I able to do nearly the same damage as a Wizard, the same level as me, per battle? I can do between 1700-2400 damage per battle that classes that are specifically designed to do damage have a hard time keeping up (not to mention that I can be the main healer in the group if I choose to, and not even need a secondary healer). Now, I am by no means intending to brag or gloat, but from most of the posts on these boards, I am seeing more and more furies regretting their decision. I understand that there are still glitches/bugs that keep the fury from being all that it can be (and can be said for most classes as well), but as it stands, there is no other class I would choose to be if given a second chance. A Content Fury, LVL 31 Message Edited by Acupuncture on 01-12-2005 12:43 PM

01-12-2005, 11:14 PM	#3
Acupunctu Join Date: Nov 2004 Posts: 31	Mostly soloing in Runneye or EL, obviously not group mobs, but my LVL 30 Paladin friend can barely kill things 2 levels higher than him. I'm not saying some our spells arent broken, but the fact of the matter remains that we are quite a versatile group. Sure, and assasin can attack for high DPS, but can they heal, or buff AC Power, and Health like we do AND attack for a high amount? Nope.

01-13-2005, 12:49 AM	#5
Acupunctu Join Date: Nov 2004 Posts: 31	I've been in many groups where, when using the parser, shows that I was 90% of the time in the top 2 for DPS. Now, this was a group with everyone hovering around lvl30 in varsoon, with 2 assasins, a wizard, a berserker tank, a templar and myself. This could also be due to the fact that all of my jewerly/armor is always kept at orange, and full lvl 30 armor. Needless to say, most of those in the group were quite impressed :smileywink:

01-13-2005, 01:19 AM	#7
Acupunctu Join Date: Nov 2004 Posts: 31	well honestly the 1500-2400 is a bad example, because this directly relates to the amount of damage everyone else was doing. For example, in our group, all of us doing DPS (4 of us) were all at the top, only about 200+/- points apart from eachother. Therefore, had there been less DPS'rs in battle, I would be upwards of 3k or 4k (which I have done before), when everyone else was doing about 2k. Again, these numbers are purely subjective, and were used only to give you an example of what everyone else was doing. All of my spells are adpt at the minimum, with my Lvl 30 skill lightning strike being adept 2 (naturally). I average about 50 -65 DPS in a group if I am secondary healer, which does not slack by a long shot. Message Edited by Acupuncture on 01-12-2005 03:20 PM Message Edited by Acupuncture on 01-12-2005 03:22 PM

01-13-2005, 01:24 AM	#8
FloydNakamic Join Date: Nov 2004 Posts: 57	what is 'the parser' and how do you access it? I agree that fury is a great class and I am very happy with my choice. The reason you see mostly negative things on the boards is because people don't bother posting about the things that are working. Message Edited by FloydNakamichi on 01-12-2005 12:24 PM

01-13-2005, 01:29 AM	#9
Acupunctu Join Date: Nov 2004 Posts: 31	Good point. It's a third party program that I personally do not have, and would like to know where to get it. My experience with it is mainly from groupmates that had/used it.

01-13-2005, 02:19 AM	#12
ren Join Date: Nov 2004 Posts: 409	He was main healer in Sol yeah and I was backup. They knew I was parsing but they weren't going all-out. The ranger didn't do any of his major attacks, which is the reason that I think he was slacking. Edit: the damage that the cleric did was some crushing damage and a blessed weapon proc. He didn't even start fighting until 13 seconds remaining in the fight. Message Edited by rensu on 01-12-2005 01:19 PM

01-13-2005, 03:08 AM	#13
Kit_Oturea Loremaster Join Date: Nov 2004 Posts: 112	Bad move. From years of experience, the worst thing to do on a board is to say your class is fine. In fact, in other games I have actually see people "plant" "we are great" posts just to defer nerfs to another class. The classes whining get looked at. 75% of the time the Dev's then NERF those who aren't. Luckily We have Rensu here to give hard numbers to protect us from the coming nerf bat. More importantly the "whines" are reasonable. We have heals that do WORSE then heals 14 levels lower then them at equal rank (app III, etc) which cost less mana and worked fine. I.e. we need our heals looked at post 26th level (read fleshweave). We can not sit as lions and being one and forgetting what your character's race is after even 7 levels is annoying. A /showform command would greatly improve many furies enjoyment of the game. A good number of our buffs simply do not work. Etc. These are ligitament concerns and that is what the board is for. See ya, Rakk 27 Fury Kithcor

01-13-2005, 03:44 AM	#14
Acupunctu Join Date: Nov 2004 Posts: 31	For the record, I never said that our class was "fine" and free of flaws. In fact, if you read my posts, I do acknowledge the fact that there are things that need to be fixed. However, the degree of severity of many of the posts list a sort of regret for ever choosing a particular class, yet all classes have broken/non stackable buffs/spells to a degree. So if you want a pessimistic approach on the whole situation, every class is "broken."

01-13-2005, 09:00 AM	#16
MsIr Join Date: Nov 2004 Posts: 24	Bad_Mojo wrote: Acupuncture wrote: I've heard so many complaints about the Fury, that If I were to look at these forums before I had made my choice, I would have never picked it, and would have regretted my decision. First off, I'm a bit tired of the complaints that our spells are broken, things don't stack the way they should, blah blah blah. Well if our class was so broken, why can I solo mobs 6-8 levels higher than me, that a Berserker/Palydin with DOUBLE my armor class can't even solo themselves? How then, am I able to do nearly the same damage as a Wizard, the same level as me, per battle? I can do between 1700-2400 damage per battle that classes that are specifically designed to do damage have a hard time keeping up (not to mention that I can be the main healer in the group if I choose to, and not even need a secondary healer). Now, I am by no means intending to brag or gloat, but from most of the posts on these boards, I am seeing more and more furies regretting their decision. I understand that there are still glitches/bugs that keep the fury from being all that it can be (and can be said for most classes as well), but as it stands, there is no other class I would choose to be if given a second chance. A Content Fury, LVL 31 Message Edited by Acupuncture on 01-12-2005 12:43 PM What mobs are you solo'ing that you are beating despite them being 8 levels higher than you? ( I assume these are'solo' and not 'group' mobs...) 1700-2400 damage per battle is nothing really. It's good for a priest, but the scout classes will easily top that (and Wizards are currently just as broken as we are, they do less damage than most scout archetypes). At higher levels, just the initial assassin attack (one strike) does more than you do in an entire battle That's beside the point though, nobody is complaining about our damage output, just the fact that some of our spells are supposed to proc an effect and don't... And we lag behind the other healers at higher levels. Message Edited by Bad_Mojo on 01-12-2005 01:05 PM Actually I was in a group in EL where the SK had a parser that would show in chat what dmg was done by who. Most of us had never seen that before, and it quickly turned into a contest to see who could get the high score. The group was SK/TRB/TMP/FRY/BZK/WIZ all within 3 levels of each other. Since we had a templar I decided to chain nuke. Only once did I get outdamaged, and that was because I laid a heal. Most in the group couldn't believe it. Frankly I was surprised myself. :smileytongue: We are quite good casters. I do agree we don't heal as well as other priests, and that wizards are broken. MsIree __________________ "Not everything that counts can be counted, and not everything that can be counted counts." Albert Einstein Oasis: Evilina Anilive - 32nd Fury / 25th Tailor(retired) Nameless(EQ1): Charmaine - 54th Dark Elf Necromancer

01-13-2005, 09:10 AM	#17
Axterix Loremaster Join Date: Nov 2004 Posts: 183	I've seen that parser program as well. In the group I was in, which had a berserker, assassin, summoner, coercer, and swashbuckler, I only managed to be on top once, even if all I did was nuke. Most of the time, I was about 3rd to 5th. That's with adept 1s for all the relevant powers, pretty much. Of course, that's without figuring in the damage my DS was doing, which probably wasn't too much, since I pretty much didn't need to heal A respectable showing, but when it comes to DPS, scouts are where it is at.

01-13-2005, 10:44 AM	#18
Acupunctu Join Date: Nov 2004 Posts: 31	Exactly Msiree, I am usually always in the top 2 when using the parser in groups. I think a lot of this has to do with the option of choosing the lightning skill at level 30 instead of the heal. This enabled me to be quite a force to be reckoned with.

01-13-2005, 12:16 PM	#19
Mjk_cz Loremaster Join Date: Nov 2004 Posts: 112	Hehe i took druid because of healing, not because of nuking . I mostly complain about bad scaling of druid's healing spells, might look great up to lvl 25, but looks like beyond lvl 30 our heals are weak While enemy's hits scale up really fast, my healing is alerady capped by lvl 12 regrow... and nothing relpaces it.. so far __________________ Runnyeye ~ Majk ~ Assassin/Kerra Runnyeye ~ Majka ~ Fury/High elf http://eq2players.station.sony.com/en/pplayer.vm?characterId=225712204 http://eq2players.station.sony.com/en/player.vm?characterId=286683204 Hw/balance/crash/quest/rewards issues >>> cosmetic armor design issues!

01-13-2005, 08:19 PM	#20
SolsticeRunewo Join Date: Nov 2004 Posts: 2	As you level you will realize theres a huge gap in between how much DMG we can do compared to DPS classes. Comparing how the Fury works at lvl 30 is a totally different situation at lvl 40+. I am a lvl 45 Fury and hunt exclusively in Perma and Lavastorm. If I was to put out any sort of damage to an enemy I would have to burn all my mana in doing so which would not be playing my class to nearly 1/4 of its potential. I realized by picking this class yet again ( lvl 65 Druid EQL ) that I was going to be a support class, that didnt bother me. What is nice about Druids this time around is that we sometimes get to play the solo healer which would never happen in EQL. What I mostly focus on in fight ( now remember it varies upon which mobs you encounter ) I will make sure I am debuffing the mob and keeping ATK and +stats to the tanks and DPS classes along with supplying help for the main healer by regen or backup heals. Every so often in the encounter I will cast my two DDs which roughly do on average about 370dmg per which is only a measly 700dmg in 18seconds where a scout class has easily did that in one hit , plus I burned over 300 mana doing so.

01-13-2005, 08:28 PM	#21
ren Join Date: Nov 2004 Posts: 409	Also remember that we get our last nuke at 38, our last "good" DoT at 36, and our last low dmg/debuff DoT at 43.

01-13-2005, 11:19 PM	#22
Katx General Join Date: Nov 2004 Posts: 201	To me, being a competent Fury isn't about being able to solo well. It's not about how much damage we can do, either. I picked this class because I wanted to be a healer, and we were supposed to be able to plug any healer into a group function as well as (if differently than) any other healer in terms of healing. It seems that all classes are having problems with their spells scaling up as they level (particularly hard hit are pure casters and healers since better weapons don't mask the scaling issues like they do on melee and scout abilities). No one has made any issue with our soloing abilities or how much damage we do, to my knowledge. Everyone is posting about healing spells not scaling well at upper levels (being dependent upon a level 12 spell above level 30 is just plain ridiculous), spells whose secondary effects don't work, spells that are just plain broken, etc. While I am glad that you are happy with your Fury, and while I also still enjoy this class, your post does nothing but harm us in terms of trying to get the actual broken things fixed. __________________ Ximeni - 70 Fury Eithne - 70 Swashbuckler Troops of Doom - Master Officer Guk

01-14-2005, 01:33 AM	#23
Ee Join Date: Nov 2004 Posts: 43	Acupuncture wrote: Exactly Msiree, I am usually always in the top 2 when using the parser in groups. I think a lot of this has to do with the option of choosing the lightning skill at level 30 instead of the heal. This enabled me to be quite a force to be reckoned with. Lets see how you do now that this spell is working as the appropriate upgrade to SoT as oppose to an extra spell on our hot bar. When I chose my level 30 spell I made sure to PM several other 30+ Furies asking which spell they chose and if it was sharing a reuse timer with one of our current spells - this was the only one that did not, so I went with it. As the little icon flashed up on my spell bar I noticed that it was identical to SoT and it was obvious (for me) that they were meant to share a timer. Sure enough a couple days later my Wizard friends level 30 nuke was sharing a timer, and here we are now hardly a week later and the fury nuke is sharing a timer. Now, the only reason you were able to unload damage greater than classes that are actual damage dealers is because of these spells not stacking. Infact, taking away this spell will more than likely lower your dps by over 1200 on the appropriate mobs. Furies are not meant to deal sick amounts of damage. Prior to these spells stacking my fury would consistently parse slightly above my paladin friend where my ranger and wizard friends (all real life friends, an we tested this at a lan) were offten well ahead of me. Although the ranger was a few levels lower and struggled to hit a couple of the mobs and I was able to parse higher than him on occassion there was no amount of spamming I could do to get within the "wizards" damage range. Now, if at the time I was able to stack Clap/SoT it would have been a different story - but rather meaningless considering these spells were not meant to "stack".

01-14-2005, 04:21 AM	#24
Acupunctu Join Date: Nov 2004 Posts: 31	Yea seriously, talk about learning the hard way. I had no idea the new thunders trike spell was designed to stack, and it's pretty irresponsible of SOE to simply overlook this aspect and give us the o'l screwgy a week later. I guess, at the very least, it'll get me to become the main healer again instead of a primary DPS'r.....I guess its not all bad, but still dissapointing nonetheless.

01-14-2005, 08:52 PM	#25
Bulzie Loremaster Join Date: Nov 2004 Posts: 255	"why can I solo mobs 6-8 levels higher than me,"Ok I cannot get past this line Acu. Tell us what mobs you are soloing that are 6-8 levels above you? I think that is a pretty bold statement to throw out there. I would think 6-8 levels higher then you would be very very Red to you unless something has changed with the con tables?? And if that were the case, don't see how you would be able to do any dmg as you would be spamming heals on yourself as we cannot take dmg like a tank. Sorry, maybe you just estimated to high but have a hard time believing you are 2nd on list of DPS or anything else you saying.

01-15-2005, 10:57 PM	#26
Acupunctu Join Date: Nov 2004 Posts: 31	Ok, I have stated this MANY TIMES, but in EL, the sand turtles (the big ones) were level 34, and I was level 27, and I could easily defeat them ( with about 33% of my mana left as well). Now that is 7 levels higher, not 8, but you get the point.

01-15-2005, 11:15 PM	#27
ren Join Date: Nov 2004 Posts: 409	I'll never disagree (at this point in the game) with anyone that says that Furies can solo well. They can. The problem does not lie here, though, and I didn't choose Fury to be a "good soloer". Also, I don't believe it is correct to force us into this role because of our current, lacking skillset. Message Edited by rensu on 01-15-2005 10:16 AM

01-17-2005, 02:51 AM	#28
Axterix Loremaster Join Date: Nov 2004 Posts: 183	Acupuncture wrote: Ok, I have stated this MANY TIMES, but in EL, the sand turtles (the big ones) were level 34, and I was level 27, and I could easily defeat them ( with about 33% of my mana left as well). Now that is 7 levels higher, not 8, but you get the point. Of course, it is only a matter of time before the toughness of the mobs in EL gets adjusted

01-17-2005, 02:41 PM	#29
Twizz Loremaster Join Date: Nov 2004 Posts: 169	Axterix wrote: Acupuncture wrote: Ok, I have stated this MANY TIMES, but in EL, the sand turtles (the big ones) were level 34, and I was level 27, and I could easily defeat them ( with about 33% of my mana left as well). Now that is 7 levels higher, not 8, but you get the point. Of course, it is only a matter of time before the toughness of the mobs in EL gets adjusted Not sure they need to be adjusted, solo xp isn't that great and I think there is a penalty for killing red mobs. Most efficient stuff to solo seem to be white-orange mobs. __________________ Akhorahil Gildarion Styrbjorn Murazor

01-17-2005, 10:06 PM	#30
AUxe Join Date: Dec 2004 Posts: 5	Friend of mine and I did a test (hes a 25 Fury and im a 25 Warlock) I could consistently solo green mobs, occasionally blue if root held and all went well. Problem is root would not hold long enough on higher level mobs so I would get beat down and multiple recasts of root deplenishses power. And yes all spells were adept 1 or better. So we are talking several levels below 25. My fury friend could consistently kill red solo mobs up to level 30 with little risk. Now this was a direct comparison and now we are approaching 30 it hasnt changed. So you can tell me whatever you like about Fury's not being powerful, but I know the truth. In fact, I was so convinced that I have now created a druid on his way to Fury and my Warlock is back in the library until he figures out how to be competitive.