Being lied to, again.

[ren]

---

DaranHB wrote:
I took a quick glance at the boards for the Mystic Class, according to the 5 seconds it took me to read the post Wards Stack.

Now if Wards Stack and Reactive heals are going to stack.....come on people make the jump with me....

Regens are suppossed to stack!

I'm thinking that there were some major stacking issues with buffs and such, if you think of it it makes sense. Ward is a rune and works prety simply absorbing damage. Reactives are a bit more complicated since they are triggered whenever combat damage occurs. Regens are just slightly less complicated in a world of no stacking limits (we dont live in that world)

So instead of going on about how much we suck, why not think for a moment in terms of this.....

If Regrowth and Fleshweave (and subsequent upgrades) were allowed to stack, would you be able to heal effectively at level 20, 30, 40, and 50.

If regens stacked would it be stupidly powerful?

If regens stacked with some restrictions, say one long 30sec regen with no stats and one short 12 sec regen with some secondary boost like offensive procs or such could stack, would it be effective?

The devs aren't dumb, they aren't ignorant. They are professional coders doing things with 1s and 0s that I cant even begin to wrap my head around. There is room for improvement and tweaking....that being said, I will say that things like this needed to be done in beta testing. Imagine if a console game that cant be patched were released with the bugs that online games have? the company would be out of business in no time, Patches and such are crutches that online game developers have taken to using as a form of game development, which is unfortunate for the players of these games

---

If regens stacked without lowering the amount they heal for, we would be so powerful that it wouldn't even be funny.  Furies are already a really good class, our melee proc buffs are not something to scoff at, I just think that we lack a major instant heal.  When my heal is 710 (for 246MP!!!! w/3s cast time) and my tank gets hit for 800 and my chanter for 1500s, you will see your mana drop so fast and then you have no mana to buff with and you are holding all the aggro because you just dropped like 5 healing spells on everyone in the span of 10 seconds.  A 50 Paladin can do a 650ish heal with 2s cast time/5 refresh for around the same mana as us.  They also have wards and other heals that are quite nice.

Now, I could conceive that Ferine Elixer would do nearly 14-1500 heal at an adept3/4 or master level, but aren't we supposed to be tuned to an AP3 level?  Also, why does this spell and all of our post 20 heals cost SO much mana?  The STR/STA does nothing!  It isnt worth the 124 mana it costs to cast this heal over Effloresce (623pt heal for 122mp and faster refresh).  Efflo master is going to be MUCH more common than a FE master and if any newbie ever got an Efflo master in a couple months, I can imagine them charging upwards of 50g and selling it easily and selling out in seconds.  Heck, I would buy it again at that price (paid 20g the first time, money very well spent).  I would buy Regrowth M1 at that price.  Is that really the point?  That's a lot of money for a lowbie, but I can 100% see that happening if our higher level heals aren't addressed because right now they are just sloppy, inefficient back-up heals and Feral Salve has been reduced to a buff instead of a heal (141mp for a 92pt proc [for me, maybe more for melee as is true with my other buffs] and +5agi that now seems to go off fairly often -- Adept1 btw -- only heals for 502),  I use Bloom M1 to heal and Feral Salve to buff... /laugh.

[deore]

If regens were supposed to stack, I think it would make sense. You would still use regrowth as a base regen then stack another higher level regen on it but at a much higher MP cost.To have a better regen, you would have to pay the price, in power, of Regrowth and another higher level but much more costly regen.If they aren't supposed to stack then, I agree, the healing potential/power consumption ratio doesn't seem to make sense for higher level spells(if the numbers posted are correct).Maybe if regrowth(or whichever is the long duration regen at higher level), at least, were allowed to stack with any of the other regens, it would be enough.

[Sar]

I'm at 27 Warden and we have the same problem as you folks.  After reading posts from all the priest classes it looks like all our heals are broken.  We all have the same problem with our healing spells.  So, yes we can heal pretty well compared to the other classes until SOE goes and fixes the Clerics by allowing there reactives to stack (next big patch).  If there reactives can stack they should do the same with our regens and the shammy's wards.  Only makes sence.  Why should the clerics stack if druids & shammy's heal don't?   Go check out the Warden forum and see all the [expletive ninja'd by Faarbot]ing about our BoTG spell.  It is NOT an upgrade regen at all, at least not until you are well into your 30's.  I think it will all get fixed eventually just might take a while.   And have we ever had an official response from the dev's about any of this?  I haven't seen any.

[Neko]

---

Eeko wrote:

Yeah, good point Neko!   All of our 20+ heals are weak compared to the sub 20 ones to force us to prove our skill !  /sarcasm 

---

Proving the simple skill to play the character as intended, rather than saying its broken because it does play like a Templar.

 

 

 

[Ee]

---

Neko wrote:

Proving the simple skill to play the character as intended, rather than saying its broken because it does play like a Templar.

---

 

This has absolutly nothing to do with Templars.    I know how to play me class, and I assure you I play it to the fullest - but that is beside the point.    The point is that our low level heals are better than the higher level heals that claim to be upgrades.   So we are "broken" (if you must use that word) because the higher level spells are a waste of hotbar space when put next to the lower level ones.   If you do not see something wrong with this you have probably not recieved the new set of heals at this time.   As soon as I got most of my upgraded heals I made them adept1 - although some of them have a bit of room to grow with levels, I doubt very much that they will begin to out heal the lower level spells.

[Neko]

http://eqiiforums.station.sony.com/eq2/board/message?board.id=17&message.id=148&page=3

 

Read some of the tales of Higher level Furies and how they are very successful healers.

 

How come they can do so well with such a 'broken class' and such 'broken' spells?

 

If the class and spells were the problem, then such exploits would be very few, rather than being rather common.

 

They are playing the same class as those saying Furies are broken, or the spells are broken.

 

Same class, same spells, the only difference really is the player.

 

 

If two people are given the same tools, and one person makes a crappy bird house and another makes a good bird house, it is not the tools that are the problem...

[FloydNakamic]

I'm not sure that our higher level heals are tremendously 'broken.' Just because a new spell isn't immediately better then the old one doesn't mean it won't be better eventually. This is not a game where you throw out the old and replace with the new - you get the new, spend a few levels upgrading it and when it becomes yellow or so to you then it is around as good or a little better then the old, then much better as it becomes more trivial to you. Regrowth at adept 1 is pretty good for me still at 27 and it now cons green heals 101 a tick - at adept 3 apparently it heals for 118 a tick - at master 1 it would be even better healing for 141 a tick (supposedly). Since I don't have an adept 1 fleshweave yet i can't tell if it will be better eventually but the big differences seem to come from the upgrades to the class of spell not necessarily the new spell in itself. I noticed with Cyclone that for many levels at app3 it just didn't do the damage stinging swarm does at adept 1 - now it is yellow or white to me and at adept 3 does a little more damage per tick than stining swarm. That amount has steadily gone up as I progress. Yes, things probably need to be tweaked a bit but the sky is NOT falling in my opiinion

[Redrum the R]

First of all, if you haven't played a Fury 34+ then you really can't comment on this post intelligently. The Fury heals fine up until you start hunting in Runnyeye or Rivervale. Then, the inferiority of Fury heals STARTS becoming evident and it only gets worse. In order for the HoT to work the tank has to be damaged and if you wait until you see some damage then you are going to be playing "catch-up" healing because the Fleshweave and Regrowth won't bring the tank back up fast...that means you have to blow mana on the inefficient direct heals.

 

Now some hard evidence instead of these bull[expletive ninja'd by Faarbot] vague "we heal fine" statements some of you are making.

 

I am at level 38 now. In order to truly understand how suck [expletive ninja'd by Faarbot] we are at healing you need to group with a tank who is kind of low level compared to the creature. The purpose in doing this is to eliminate the "How good the tank is at defending himself" quotient.

 

So...we took a level 33 shadowknight and had him tank the level 40 creatures at the Rivervale farm. I solo healed him first and had to use every bit of my mana to keep him alive. I am no slouch healer either. Here is the sequence of events:

1. Scarecrow runs to camp....and I hit it with Brutal Intimidation before it gets there

2. Regrowth lands on tank when he first shows a little damage.

3. Fleshweave lands on tank immediately after...tank is now at half health while the SLOW HoTs do their thing.

4. I am forced to burn either Effloresce or Wilding Salve...both around 490 hp direct heals and very inefficient

5. Regrowth is refreshed immediately after it expires

6. Time for ANOTHER direct heal

7. Fleshweave is refreshed the instant it drops

8. Time for Another direct heal.

9. And another direct heal....maybe even have to blow my Sylvan Touch

 

The point is...over the course of the fight we only get to use our efficient heals (regrowth & fleshweave) about 2 times each. All the rest are inefficient direct heals.

 

Now...we took that same 33 shadowknight and had our Templar heal him solo. He only spent half his mana. Why? presumably because their efficient heal line of spells doesn't take as long to do their thing so they can just spam their efficient heals and not be forced to use the inefficient spells. The cleric didn't even stress while I was spamming heals to keep him alive like crazy.

 

When I chose Druid I was under the assumption that all the healers were going to be equal at healing and differ only in their secondary role. Something like this:

1. Fury    Primary Role: Healer    Secondary Role: DPS enhancement + Utility spells like SoW

2. Warden   Primary Role: Healer   Secondary Role: Defense enhancement + Utility spells like SoW

3. Templar   Primary Role: Healer   Secondary Role: Best Defense enhancement

4. Inquisitor   Primary Role: Healer   Secondary Role: Defense enhancement + Debuffer

5. Mystic   Primary Role: Healer   Secondary Role: Defense enhancement + Debuffer + Utility spells

6. Defiler   Primary Role: Healer   Secondary Role: Best Debuffer + Utility spells like SoW

 

But...this is not the case and I DO feel decieved.

[FloydNakamic]

Someone cannot comment intelligently on the subject below 38, huh?  That's quite a subjective statement - as hard to prove as some of your other claims.  You can stage your tests any way you like but why on earth would you think a tank should be able to take the damage of a MOB 7 levels above him?  Why should you be able to mitigate that damage effectively?  That is a wildly arbitrary experiment if you are trying to determine whether you are or not your heals are effective. By that same reasoning a scout class could complain that they barely land any of their attacks against MOBS 7 levels above themselves - guess their attacks are 'broken.'  How easy do you want this game to be?

 

You, of course, are entitled to your opinion.  However just because you dismiss other people's thoughts as unintelligent does not make you right.  Do I KNOW we are working correctly?  No.  Do you KNOW we aren't - nope.

 

ALL classes have those who think theirs is inferior - the grass is always greener.....   check out this thread on the inquisitor page:

 

http://eqiiforums.station.sony.com/eq2/board/message?board.id=14&message.id=385

Message Edited by FloydNakamichi on 12-24-2004 03:19 PM

[TimboSilvermi]

Anyone who creates their own subclass premises independantly of observed facts is very likely to feel cheated in how their class plays out in reality.

 

As most veteran readers of this forum know, a Fury's primary role in a full group, especially after the midlevels, is DPS enhancement, not healing.  I'm not sure why that is taking so long to sink in for some persistent posters here.

 

Also, it's fairly common knowledge - even among us below level 38 - that Regrowth and Fleshweave don't stack.  If you continue to  pursue the role of  primary healer, you need to pick one and stick with it.  Most higher-level Furies report success using Bloom as their primary heal, in part because its short-term regen effect DOES stack with the Regen line.

 

I apologize if this post comes across as arrogant or confrontational, but this thread (and many like it) seem to keep circling back to the same issue over and over again; a fundamental difference in preconceptions of what the Fury class should be.  Let's accept it for what it is and focus on what really is broken.

[FumoFu]

can we delete this post on the grounds that fury's rock... no1 was lied to but yes somethings need enhancing... nuff said boss ^_^

[Redrum the R]

Wow, I thought I described the test simply, but I guess I need to elaborate more. The test wasn't to see whether the level 33 could tank. The test was to illustrate the healing ability of the Fury vs the Templar when someone was getting beat up bad.

Why should I (Fury 3 be able to mitigate the damage from a level 40 mob? Because those are the kinds of creatures I fight. I healed him and won the fights but it took all my mana. The cleric did the same battle healing solo with only half his mana.

It is in NO WAY the same as a scout trying to hit something 7 levels above themself. Heals do the same amount of healing regardless of what level person you are using them on. The point was to create a situation where a lot of healing was necessary to see who could do the job better. jeez. Stop trying to defend positions just for the sake of argument.

 

---

FloydNakamichi wrote:

Someone cannot comment intelligently on the subject below 38, huh?  That's quite a subjective statement - as hard to prove as some of your other claims.  You can stage your tests any way you like but why on earth would you think a tank should be able to take the damage of a MOB 7 levels above him?  Why should you be able to mitigate that damage effectively?  That is a wildly arbitrary experiment if you are trying to determine whether you are or not your heals are effective. By that same reasoning a scout class could complain that they barely land any of their attacks against MOBS 7 levels above themselves - guess their attacks are 'broken.'  How easy do you want this game to be?

 

You, of course, are entitled to your opinion.  However just because you dismiss other people's thoughts as unintelligent does not make you right.  Do I KNOW we are working correctly?  No.  Do you KNOW we aren't - nope.

 

ALL classes have those who think theirs is inferior - the grass is always greener.....   check out this thread on the inquisitor page:

 

http://eqiiforums.station.sony.com/eq2/board/message?board.id=14&message.id=385

Message Edited by FloydNakamichi on 12-24-2004 03:19 PM

---

[Redrum the R]

Yes, I am insisting that my class was passed off as being primarily a healer. Each previous title should not be "overridden" by subsequent titles. First, I am a Priest who "Priests augment and replenish health..."  Second, I am a Druid who "...Heal and purge ailments and blessing with physical prowess" Third, I am a Fury who "...strengthen and heal companions" I based my creation on these advertised facts not idenpendantly of them. The "boards" only contain unofficial opinions such as "primary role is DPS enhancement." That's something I sure as hell never read in the official class descriptions.

So yes, I expect to be able to be a primary healer like the cleric and shamy should also be. There is no mention in the class definitions of "secondary healer."

---

TimboSilvermist wrote:

Anyone who creates their own subclass premises independantly of observed facts is very likely to feel cheated in how their class plays out in reality.

 

As most veteran readers of this forum know, a Fury's primary role in a full group, especially after the midlevels, is DPS enhancement, not healing.  I'm not sure why that is taking so long to sink in for some persistent posters here.

 

Also, it's fairly common knowledge - even among us below level 38 - that Regrowth and Fleshweave don't stack.  If you continue to  pursue the role of  primary healer, you need to pick one and stick with it.  Most higher-level Furies report success using Bloom as their primary heal, in part because its short-term regen effect DOES stack with the Regen line.

 

I apologize if this post comes across as arrogant or confrontational, but this thread (and many like it) seem to keep circling back to the same issue over and over again; a fundamental difference in preconceptions of what the Fury class should be.  Let's accept it for what it is and focus on what really is broken.

---

[Aszuth]

Druids can't main heal Tier 4+? Heh, thats laughable....

 

I'm a 36 Zerker now, and I group EXCLUSIVELY with a Fury/Warden healing team as the tank - Fury on primary heals, Warden on secondary heals/DPS (usually pure DPS on unnamed, sometimes even on named)....

 

We've all but cleared every inch of Runnyeye and run into little problem ANYWHERE in the zone....

 

Did I mention that I also never use a shield, since I prefer DPS since my healing is never an issue?

 

Even in a 4-man group with those two healers and a 38 Ranger we were killing 39++ mobs, the miner named, Mudslinger, Hurgoz - all yellow or higher to the tank (me)....

 

I would imagine your primary difficulty is coming from a reluctance to spend time improving your character - the Fury in my group (my lady) has nearly every heal as Adept 3 now b/c rather than just hoarding her coin senselessly she's been focusing on improving her character's viability. (Hell, the top guild of our server started trying to spam invite us after seeing how well she healed - as a "[Removed for Content] class") We may not have much coin to our name (30gp or so with a few Adept 3 parts for Tier 3-4 banked for as our tradeskills get up to par)

 

I am of the opinion that an experienced Fury that keeps up on upgrading their spells appropriately is probably the single best healer in the game.

 

(PS - We tend to chain pull, usually the only mana breaks we take are when people need to go to the bathroom, eat, or to get full mana before a named - <3 10-15 min clears from zone-in to miners without anything being gray as only group in the zone)

[Aszuth]

Deleted - double posted, not used to this forum type yet.

Message Edited by Aszuthan on 12-24-2004 09:38 PM

[Redrum the R]

At your level the difference is just starting to become evident. You probably fight level 37-40 stuff in controllable numbers...stuff that's meant to be chain pulled for exp. A templar can solo heal you in that situation freeing up a spot in the group. When you do a raid and fight something that hits real hard you will understand why slow HoTs are so inferior. When I am stuck solo healing a level 40 group my mana gets drained fast enough to stop chain pulling....later it will get worse during raids.

---

Aszuthan wrote:

Druids can't main heal Tier 4+? Heh, thats laughable....

 

I'm a 36 Zerker now, and I group EXCLUSIVELY with a Fury/Warden healing team as the tank - Fury on primary heals, Warden on secondary heals/DPS (usually pure DPS on unnamed, sometimes even on named)....

 

We've all but cleared every inch of Runnyeye and run into little problem ANYWHERE in the zone....

 

Did I mention that I also never use a shield, since I prefer DPS since my healing is never an issue?

 

Even in a 4-man group with those two healers and a 38 Ranger we were killing 39++ mobs, the miner named, Mudslinger, Hurgoz - all yellow or higher to the tank (me)....

 

I would imagine your primary difficulty is coming from a reluctance to spend time improving your character - the Fury in my group (my lady) has nearly every heal as Adept 3 now b/c rather than just hoarding her coin senselessly she's been focusing on improving her character's viability. (Hell, the top guild of our server started trying to spam invite us after seeing how well she healed - as a "[Removed for Content] class") We may not have much coin to our name (30gp or so with a few Adept 3 parts for Tier 3-4 banked for as our tradeskills get up to par)

 

I am of the opinion that an experienced Fury that keeps up on upgrading their spells appropriately is probably the single best healer in the game.

 

(PS - We tend to chain pull, usually the only mana breaks we take are when people need to go to the bathroom, eat, or to get full mana before a named - <3 10-15 min clears from zone-in to miners without anything being gray as only group in the zone)

---

[Aszuth]

I was killing the same stuff today with her as solo healer - we opted to move onto easier stuff though, because we had some low 30's melee in the group that rarely could hit the stuff...

 

Stop your senseless [expletive ninja'd by Faarbot]ing and attempts to say the class is crap when it's not...

 

(Oh and PS - the only clerics at our level on the server group with secondary healers still... have yet to see anyone efficiently single healer on our server PERIOD)

[ren]

Ahh -- I don't think that anyone is saying that Furies are (expletive deleted), but we do lack a major heal to keep up with insane mob dps and regrowth resolution times makes us sloppy, inefficient healers in comparison.  Our proc buffs and pure melee buffs are spectacular though and we are a fairly solid class.

[Redrum the R]

---

Aszuthan wrote:

I was killing the same stuff today with her as solo healer - we opted to move onto easier stuff though, because we had some low 30's melee in the group that rarely could hit the stuff...

 

Stop your senseless [expletive ninja'd by Faarbot]ing and attempts to say the class is crap when it's not...

 

(Oh and PS - the only clerics at our level on the server group with secondary healers still... have yet to see anyone efficiently single healer on our server PERIOD)

---

What does it say when a non-Fury tries to defend the healing prowess of a Fury? I mean, how would you know the subtle tell tale signs of a growing inadequacy of healing prowess? Only someone who has played healers often AND has played a Fury to 34+ will BEGIN to see the downward trend.

Wait til your Fury friend gets to level 39 then talk to me again when your Fury friend's efficient heal only slowly refills half a bubble of the tank's health.

 

PS and yes I spend lots of money upgrading spells

[Aszuth]

She's been doing CT zone duo healing and not complained once this morning, shrug(healing a L43 tank on mobs ranging up to 46 if she's recalling correctly)

 

And the reason why I'm defending the class instead of her is that she doesn't like to post on the forums - she sits right next to me and agrees with what I'm posting however, would've been just as easy to lie and state I was a fury however - doesn't make my posts any less valid.

 

Not to mention that the quality of your tank has bearing on how much damage the tank takes - which in turn effects how much healing they need to be kept up - you do realize this, right?

 

With buffs in a normal group at 10% shy of L37 (yes, she dinged before me and did Feerott access w/o me while I was sleeping off a cold) - I'm sitting at nearly 2.2k AC in 2HS/DW modes, 2650ish with my shield when I decide to use it (rarely). I also rarely allow mobs to ping pong onto other members - which once again allows her to only have to focus on one person, which once again benefits a Druid class the most when it happens (since constant damage to one target means the regens are always being consumed effectively).

 

Do you understand the basics of math and how a better tank (solid aggro, high AC) relates into making regen based healers stronger? Or do I have to post a primer?

 

Hell, the stuff we were killing when we were L33 with my Warden/Fury combo I've seen wipe the floor with groups with L36 tanks and Cleric/Shaman teams for healing. (and saw them later attempt to do it with just the cleric - and he was OOM before half the encounter was down)

 

If you're sooooo upset that this class is "soooo bad" why don't you reroll as something else that fits your desire more - I used to play an Inquisitor on our previous server before we moved to Toxx, and to be blunt - the healing power between the classes in XP group settings has always been in the Fury's favor so far. (although my Inquisitor was 32 when we left - so haven't been able to directly compare since)

 

But seriously, take the reroll idea and run with it - I have a feeling you'll be back to playing a Fury and alot more quiet in a month or two if you do.

[Maizey3]

---

Redrum the Red wrote:

Only someone who has played healers often AND has played a Fury to 34+ will BEGIN to see the downward trend.

---

I disagree.  I play a 33 Fury & my husband a 33 Berserker.  I only duo with him.  He is quite capable of understanding the efficiency (or lack thereof) of my heals.

 

I am not debating the topic of the Fury class and heals.  Just simply pointing out that it is inaccurate for someone to say that a when people play exclusively with one another, it is impossible for a tank to analyze the healers spells - especially if the duo are a real life couple.

[Redrum the R]

Nobody is arguing that a higher quality tank takes less damage than a lower quality one. You will find however that no matter how good your tank is, there is a mob that can beat him down hard. When you start getting hit real hard you will begin to understand why a ~100 per tick heal is crap. Then you will see your Fury using inefficient direct heals instead of the class specific efficient heals.

Your second point is funny. All the healer classes have an efficient line of heal spells. When you are in a chain pulling situation and your tank is of the correct level then all of the healers have an easy time using their efficient heals. At level 39 Fury, I am already significantly worse at healing than a level 36 cleric vs mobs like Lamia / Nightbloods and with a level 41 tank. Simply put, my HoTs can't heal faster than the foes deal out damage. I then have to resort to catching up with direct heals, which in turn makes it hard to keep the DPS buffs refreshed. If you fight things that only do a Net ~100 damage per tick time then you could argue that the regen heals are efficient, but the things I am fighting at level 39 do way more than 100 dmg per tick time. Even if the monster does only get ~100 net damage through your AC the other healer class' efficient line of spells work just as good as HoT. The difference is that when the damage speeds up so do their heals whereas HoT heals the same amount in the same amount of time.

Level 33 is fairly irrelevant. The differences are barely apparent at that level.

As for your suggestion to reroll a character...why should I have to suffer for a game balance error on sony's part? I still like the "flavor" of this class I just want them to make it a viable healer at high levels.

Your friend who actually plays the Fury...I'd like to read some detailed examples of what sequence of spells they are casting, what characters are in the group, and what level mobs they are chain pulling.

It is very possible to solo heal exp chain pulling groups up to around level 38. Even I did it when I was level 38 with a 38 tank vs level 38-39 blight rats. But, I watched a level 36 cleric do the same thing and expend less mana. That's my point and it is one you can't understand until you play a high level fury and run the same tests. I can't solo heal vs lamias and nightbloods even with a level 41 tank (and I doubt any Fury can) without getting down to 25% mana each fight. But, I bet a level 39 cleric could do it for a lot less mana.

---

Aszuthan wrote:

Not to mention that the quality of your tank has bearing on how much damage the tank takes - which in turn effects how much healing they need to be kept up - you do realize this, right?

Do you understand the basics of math and how a better tank (solid aggro, high AC) relates into making regen based healers stronger? Or do I have to post a primer?

 

Hell, the stuff we were killing when we were L33 with my Warden/Fury combo I've seen wipe the floor with groups with L36 tanks and Cleric/Shaman teams for healing. (and saw them later attempt to do it with just the cleric - and he was OOM before half the encounter was down)

 

If you're sooooo upset that this class is "soooo bad" why don't you reroll as something else that fits your desire more - I used to play an Inquisitor on our previous server before we moved to Toxx, and to be blunt - the healing power between the classes in XP group settings has always been in the Fury's favor so far. (although my Inquisitor was 32 when we left - so haven't been able to directly compare since)

 

But seriously, take the reroll idea and run with it - I have a feeling you'll be back to playing a Fury and alot more quiet in a month or two if you do.

---

 

 

 

 

[Karla]

---

alxsen20 wrote:

*sigh*

 

The archtype system is based on a key rule that is: "each class and subsequent subclass can fulfill the main role of the archtype equally well, though perhaps in different ways."

 

That is what we were told, and promised. Well, quite frankly, we were lied to.

 

I am not here to argue about whether or not other classes heal better than wardens/furies. We all know that is true. Sure, regens are unique type of healing and as such, can be used in other ways and perhaps be more effective under the right circumstances. However, the same can be said for wards and reactives, so in that aspect we are equal.

 

Unfortunately that is where the similarities and equality stop. Cleric and shaman heals are simply put, more powerful.

 

Now, i know alot of people who chose the druid path chose it because they wanted versatility, and didn't particularly like being the main healer. That's fine, but you have to realize, that is eq1's druid philosophy, and i personally want what i was promised.

 

Regens sorely need to be looked into and enhanced.

 

Now for my general griping and whining =P.  I want a real "upgrade" to a spell, heck, i think we all do. I am pretty sure that this is a wide-spread problem which most classes are having to deal with.

 

Now, there are some nice point to point breakdowns that dissect the upgrades and prove that they are in fact slight increases.  this one comes to mind: http://eqiiforums.station.sony.com/eq2/board/message?board.id=16&message.id=924 .The problem is the word slight. with the mobs increasing in strength drastically, and dealing 100's of points of damage more than before. Who cares if your spell heals for 4 ticks longer, but heals at a lesser rate and just barely heals more in the end, and only costs 10 power less? who cares if your new instant adds a miniscule stat increase for 20 secs, heals 10 more at MAX LVL,which is generally 10 levels after you get it, and costs 50 more power?

 

What good is effeciency if you can't dish out enough heals to stay with the damage? And more often than not, when you try and can just barely keep them alive, you will get aggro and die for your efforts. This problem is small in the lower levels, but it becomes a fairly moderate problem in mid-level, and will only get exponentially worse and become a nightmare at lvl 50.

 

note: All my whining is pre-big patch. So if they fix this and i look like a jerk, please forgive me =P

Message Edited by alxsen20 on 12-17-2004 10:00 PM

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Just to let ya know mystics cant heal worth a [expletive ninja'd by Faarbot] and if you want ill trade ya your regens fro my wards.  At 24 my best heal takes like 88 mana has a 6-8 second recast and only heals for 301.

 

Whats yours?

[Gestalt79]

Buddy I group with a lot is a Defiler, which I imagine uses same/similar heal to Mystic, his big heal is very equal to the Fury's in the 20s.  Both of us have Adept1 (efflo for me, dunno his name), both heal for over 400 now, though he's a level ahead so slightly higher.  Basicaly at equal levels we heal the same with direct heals, of course you can't use app1 or 2 and expect it to heal like a Fury's Adept1 heal.

 

I like my regen, but I'd like to see stacking and or Fleshweave be more than a sideways upgrade (at 33).  Both regen and runes are nice at various times, I'll keep my regen cause it suits me.

Message Edited by Gestalt79 on 12-28-2004 02:31 PM