COH for Healers? 30 minute or 1 hour timer? Maybe make xp groups more fun? Cost 10 or 20 gold?

Diz · 03-17-2006, 08:05 PM

Just an Idea I have been kicking around. Not templar specific, but rather for the whole Prist community, but wanted to KICK it around here first.Facts.Conjuror is the Only Class the can us COH (Call of Hero @ lvl 55ish) to summon a group mate to the group), they can do this every 8 minutes for the cost of under 2 gold for the component. Additionally out of the Conjorers I have talk to about this, they don't feel COH is a class Defining ability, that makes or breaks them.So, How many time has the avereage EQ2 group force been DEEP in a dungeon, and then 1 member has to leave, vital or not? If you didn't bring that one special (q of 24) the conj, the group is the lurch with 5 untill you fight back to the top (burning time) or just fight with a crippled group.So I propose for the sake of xp groups and fun, why not give a healers a HORRIBLY EXPENSIVE Coh ability? I'm talking the kind ya only use very rarely.Here are some things that would make it a nice desprite decision to use.- 30 minute to 1 hour timer, or longer, once every 24 hours would be kewl-outside of battle obviously- Long CAST timer, bring the group to a halt for a bit to cast it (Better then fighting through low level mobs for half hour, like scaleborn)- INgredient costs something rediculous, 10 or 20g, heck even costs a LORE item, that can only be dropped or harvestedanyway, make it painful to use, but at least give groups the option of continuing if a member needs to leave, especially a vital member--I don't how many times I have stood around the entrance of scaleborn for 25 minutes waiting for everyone to get there (Pick up group btw), then move down into the dungeon. Get passed the Fountain room, then a Key class needs to leave. We evac to the top, wait on another member, the fight our way down, only now someone else as to leave cause we burned so much time fighting low level mobs to get to the high level content.

CoLD MeTaL · 03-17-2006, 08:22 PM

Like "Reverse Odyssey"?

I could live with it, don't know how much it would help my Templar.

Diz · 03-17-2006, 11:21 PM

the goal wouldn't be to help the Templar, or rather the priest class (I want all the priests to get this, usually 1 priest in every group)the goal would be to help the EQ2 community. Help those Groups who need a replacement, and don't wanna burn an hour comming up for a new body, just fight back down to where they wanna play anyway.

utkCREW · 03-17-2006, 11:47 PM

I like that

I never played EQ1, but my guilds necromancer said he used to have some summon dead ability. He could bring a friends body to him. I'd like that moreso than COH. As an inquisitor, I'd love to tell my groupmate to kill himself in order to "recieve salvation" hehe. But more practically, for instance, T6 Eye farms, or T7 Temple of Scale. No telling how many times a person died, and the 'fun balls' in Silent City would bounce their body off the side of the ledge. Would be nice to be able to summon their body to you. It should be on a cast timer like 10 minutes or so.

Magpie1 · 03-17-2006, 11:50 PM

Great idea :smileyhappy:.

countercontr · 03-18-2006, 01:09 AM

I like this idea, As clerics we can send people out i guess it wouldnt be too far a stretch to send people in. Maybe make it to where they have to be in their home city to work to make more of a restriction, since we can only send people to their home. But I think it would be handy, if the conjurors didnt take offense of us having a similar spell.

Celestian_ · 03-18-2006, 02:10 AM

I suggested this a long time ago.City of Heroes allows people whom spec in the "teleport" field to get a Call of Heroes sorta ability and it just made grouping/forming up a lot easier. I dunno why they are so hung up on not doing it except for the fact you can replace members of your party that leave and not have to fight out/back.All priests should have it, cept maybe Furies cause they got group invis.

RingleToo · 03-18-2006, 03:23 AM

Really is a nice idea except for the "horribly expensive" part. A 10g -20g cost would be impractical (requiring a Lore item would be insane :smileywink: ). Personally, I can't think of any circumstance in which I'd use a COH type spell if it cost that much - I'd just let everybody die (kidding!). Maybe for a guildie if they were willing to pay for it :smileyvery-happy:

COH is a convenience spell - albeit a very, very nice convenience - that can save a lot of time, but I don't really see it as being so critical to survival as to warrant that kind of cost. I'm not even sure that there is even any reason to make it pricey and/or difficult to use. Having another class with the ability to cast some sort of COH would be a real benefit, but I don't think it needs to be quite so painful to use.

Diz · 03-18-2006, 10:37 AM

They deffinately won't give use something that is easy and what not. the only way I see us getting this would be if were highly undisirable for common use.Reason I say Lore, is cause then the item couldn't be stacked the ability abused for summoning zerg hordes in raids (as this is not the intention of the PRIEST version of the spell) also the high cost could be deffered by the entire remaing group. I was easly pay 6g to have a replacement tank brought down to the bottom of Scaleborn. Easily. 6g per person is nothing when compared the time Burned on fighting back up and back down.see where I'm comming from.in order to get, we'd have to basically take some penalties, this the ones I outlined.

faldorian viva · 03-20-2006, 06:27 PM

Dizax wrote:in order to get, we'd have to basically take some penalties, this the ones I outlined.

Well, i see what you mean, but the way CotH works now is so different from the way it was in eq1. At it's current form we can't use it to port in entire raids... with the recast timer being so high.

As someone else mentioned before make it higher recast timer, like say 20 min or may be even 30 minutes. No need to make it cost lots of money.

What would be a very cool idea, if you make it cost lots of money: Could it be possible to make the reagent come from the one who is being CotHed instead of the one casting it? And to avoid grieving you can add the lovely yes or no box.

Zannah · 03-20-2006, 07:00 PM

If every priest could do this the restrictions would make it almost impossible to use.ATM - how many people in your raid can CoH? One, maybe 2. How many priests do you have? - 6? Thats a full group ported in at once. SOE won't allow that seeing how the current CoH has been gimped.Summon Corpse? Corpses arent 'real' here in EQ2 - else we could drag them and things would be beautiful. Post OOW druids could summon corpses too I think (tho maybe it was port themselves to the corpse? or port a rezer to the corpse?) after AA point investment (hell they might have given them resurect as well - Dr00dz have always been the darlings of EQ :smileyindifferent: )I just don't think it fits for us - even Odessey is a bit strange - not sure how it fits in the lore of a cleric at all.

Giallolas · 03-21-2006, 12:18 AM

Interesting idea. Though I think I'd rather something different than this. This feels like taking away potential utility from conjies or necros (for the corpses). I hoping for some flavor more along the forgotten gods stuff. Druids draw power from nature, shaman from ancesters and lost spirits. Clerics draw their power from....I think forgotten gods. Hoping for a bit of flavor to come from those gods. Perhaps a special spell per tier based upon your alignment or make us choose what god we profess to follow. Then we would gain their special spell each tier. Hehe, and I would say something better than entertainment level spells.

dragontamer619 · 03-23-2006, 06:33 AM

The way I see Odyssey is like this. We are all about the divine righteousness. We are holy warriors who still have faith in the gods that left us so long ago. We are the closest things to the gods that the mortals know. We are all about sending people to higher levels (ie the afterlife etc). Odyssey sends you away from the danger, it blesses you, it saves you. In a sense it's a prayer that is answered by us. We send you home to be safe.

I see Call of the Hero a Conjuror spell only. Why? They are summoners. They summon pets. They can summon you to them. It makes sense for them to have Call of the Hero. Necromancers summon undead things. In Everquest they could summon your corpse. They got the short end of the stick in this game because there are no corpses. If they still had spirit shards, they could summon you back to the revive camp then rez you, and cut down on XP debt. But such is not the case anymore. Wizards get evacs, and in Everquest Wizards and Druids could port you all over the place. But in Everquest 2 they cannot, yet. I don't see the big deal about having to make a call of the hero spell for Templars. We get odyssey, we can send you home. I like that.

If they had to change Odyssey, they should remove that pop up window asking if they want to be ported. I don't get a pop up window for Evac or to be summoned. That is the only thing I do not like about Oydessey any more. I like have two Call of Qeynos spells though.

Diz · 03-23-2006, 05:47 PM

dragontamer619 wrote:
We get odyssey, we can send you home. I like that.

to change Odyssey, they should remove that pop up window asking if they want to be ported. I don't get a pop up window for Evac or to be summoned. That is the only thing I do not like about Oydessey any more.

This was done because Templars with an eval streak were Sending people that opposed them home.IE. If another group was in a camp the Templars group wanted, the TEmplar simply sent their Healer or Tank away, thus [Removed for Content] them off and crippeling their group.this is why, Oddyssey has a Pop up, so you can just Banish people you don't like or want.

AzraelAzgard · 03-23-2006, 07:16 PM

Odyssey was great.

I used to send botters home, most of the time it would be someone playing who had only ever known life farming Feerrott Head Hunters or nodes and they wouldnt know how to get back SMILEY

Giallolas · 03-24-2006, 12:16 AM

Odyssey only worked if grouped or in raid with them. Couldn't just target anyone and send them home in the first place. But, if they were foolish enough to join your group or be idiots in your raid force, I did used to send those peeps home.

Wossname · 03-24-2006, 02:27 AM

Odyssey is junk, people can already gate home. I've cast it 3 times in 55 levels, I wouldn't miss it. I like the idea of a CoH-like ability for priests. If we could port group members to us once every 30 minutes that would be great given the reality of pickup groups having a slowly changing roster. If we could port the dead to us it would be great but would only make sense if it had a short re-use timer (60s say). What I would object to is a high cost component, make it no more that what Conjurors pay.

dragontamer619 · 03-24-2006, 06:54 AM

Dizax wrote:
dragontamer619 wrote:
We get odyssey, we can send you home. I like that.

to change Odyssey, they should remove that pop up window asking if they want to be ported. I don't get a pop up window for Evac or to be summoned. That is the only thing I do not like about Oydessey any more.
This was done because Templars with an eval streak were Sending people that opposed them home.IE. If another group was in a camp the Templars group wanted, the TEmplar simply sent their Healer or Tank away, thus [Removed for Content] them off and crippeling their group.this is why, Oddyssey has a Pop up, so you can just Banish people you don't like or want.
I know that is why odyssey was changed. I understand and I do agree with the changes made to it. That doesn't mean I don't have to like it. =P I cannot for the life of me see a purpose of Templars having a call of the hero spell. Call me crazy but I can't. I use my Odyssey fairly often. I call home, pick up 4 guild writs go out to TT kill a bunch of mobs, odyssey home, rinse and repeat. The recast time of odyssey is way shorter than my Call of Qeynos so I can make a few trips before my CoQ comes back up.
I

03-17-2006, 08:05 PM	#1
Diz Join Date: Nov 2004 Posts: 54	Just an Idea I have been kicking around. Not templar specific, but rather for the whole Prist community, but wanted to KICK it around here first.Facts.Conjuror is the Only Class the can us COH (Call of Hero @ lvl 55ish) to summon a group mate to the group), they can do this every 8 minutes for the cost of under 2 gold for the component. Additionally out of the Conjorers I have talk to about this, they don't feel COH is a class Defining ability, that makes or breaks them.So, How many time has the avereage EQ2 group force been DEEP in a dungeon, and then 1 member has to leave, vital or not? If you didn't bring that one special (q of 24) the conj, the group is the lurch with 5 untill you fight back to the top (burning time) or just fight with a crippled group.So I propose for the sake of xp groups and fun, why not give a healers a HORRIBLY EXPENSIVE Coh ability? I'm talking the kind ya only use very rarely.Here are some things that would make it a nice desprite decision to use.- 30 minute to 1 hour timer, or longer, once every 24 hours would be kewl-outside of battle obviously- Long CAST timer, bring the group to a halt for a bit to cast it (Better then fighting through low level mobs for half hour, like scaleborn)- INgredient costs something rediculous, 10 or 20g, heck even costs a LORE item, that can only be dropped or harvestedanyway, make it painful to use, but at least give groups the option of continuing if a member needs to leave, especially a vital member--I don't how many times I have stood around the entrance of scaleborn for 25 minutes waiting for everyone to get there (Pick up group btw), then move down into the dungeon. Get passed the Fountain room, then a Key class needs to leave. We evac to the top, wait on another member, the fight our way down, only now someone else as to leave cause we burned so much time fighting low level mobs to get to the high level content. __________________

03-17-2006, 08:22 PM	#2
CoLD MeTaL Loremaster Join Date: Apr 2005 Posts: 3,217	Like "Reverse Odyssey"? I could live with it, don't know how much it would help my Templar. __________________

03-17-2006, 11:21 PM	#3
Diz Join Date: Nov 2004 Posts: 54	the goal wouldn't be to help the Templar, or rather the priest class (I want all the priests to get this, usually 1 priest in every group)the goal would be to help the EQ2 community. Help those Groups who need a replacement, and don't wanna burn an hour comming up for a new body, just fight back down to where they wanna play anyway. __________________

03-17-2006, 11:50 PM	#5
Magpie1 Loremaster Join Date: Nov 2004 Location: Aberdeen, UK Posts: 105	Great idea :smileyhappy:. __________________

03-18-2006, 02:10 AM	#7
Celestian_ General Join Date: Nov 2004 Posts: 326	I suggested this a long time ago.City of Heroes allows people whom spec in the "teleport" field to get a Call of Heroes sorta ability and it just made grouping/forming up a lot easier. I dunno why they are so hung up on not doing it except for the fact you can replace members of your party that leave and not have to fight out/back.All priests should have it, cept maybe Furies cause they got group invis. __________________

03-17-2006, 11:47 PM	#4
utkCREW Loremaster Join Date: Nov 2004 Posts: 33	I like that I never played EQ1, but my guilds necromancer said he used to have some summon dead ability. He could bring a friends body to him. I'd like that moreso than COH. As an inquisitor, I'd love to tell my groupmate to kill himself in order to "recieve salvation" hehe. But more practically, for instance, T6 Eye farms, or T7 Temple of Scale. No telling how many times a person died, and the 'fun balls' in Silent City would bounce their body off the side of the ledge. Would be nice to be able to summon their body to you. It should be on a cast timer like 10 minutes or so.

03-18-2006, 01:09 AM	#6
countercontr Join Date: Apr 2005 Posts: 11	I like this idea, As clerics we can send people out i guess it wouldnt be too far a stretch to send people in. Maybe make it to where they have to be in their home city to work to make more of a restriction, since we can only send people to their home. But I think it would be handy, if the conjurors didnt take offense of us having a similar spell.

03-18-2006, 03:23 AM	#8
RingleToo Loremaster Join Date: Nov 2004 Location: watervliet Posts: 324	Really is a nice idea except for the "horribly expensive" part. A 10g -20g cost would be impractical (requiring a Lore item would be insane :smileywink: ). Personally, I can't think of any circumstance in which I'd use a COH type spell if it cost that much - I'd just let everybody die (kidding!). Maybe for a guildie if they were willing to pay for it :smileyvery-happy: COH is a convenience spell - albeit a very, very nice convenience - that can save a lot of time, but I don't really see it as being so critical to survival as to warrant that kind of cost. I'm not even sure that there is even any reason to make it pricey and/or difficult to use. Having another class with the ability to cast some sort of COH would be a real benefit, but I don't think it needs to be quite so painful to use. __________________

03-18-2006, 10:37 AM	#9
Diz Join Date: Nov 2004 Posts: 54	They deffinately won't give use something that is easy and what not. the only way I see us getting this would be if were highly undisirable for common use.Reason I say Lore, is cause then the item couldn't be stacked the ability abused for summoning zerg hordes in raids (as this is not the intention of the PRIEST version of the spell) also the high cost could be deffered by the entire remaing group. I was easly pay 6g to have a replacement tank brought down to the bottom of Scaleborn. Easily. 6g per person is nothing when compared the time Burned on fighting back up and back down.see where I'm comming from.in order to get, we'd have to basically take some penalties, this the ones I outlined. __________________

03-20-2006, 06:27 PM	#10
faldorian viva General Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Somewhere over the rainbow Posts: 65	Dizax wrote:in order to get, we'd have to basically take some penalties, this the ones I outlined. Well, i see what you mean, but the way CotH works now is so different from the way it was in eq1. At it's current form we can't use it to port in entire raids... with the recast timer being so high. As someone else mentioned before make it higher recast timer, like say 20 min or may be even 30 minutes. No need to make it cost lots of money. What would be a very cool idea, if you make it cost lots of money: Could it be possible to make the reagent come from the one who is being CotHed instead of the one casting it? And to avoid grieving you can add the lovely yes or no box.

03-20-2006, 07:00 PM	#11
Zannah Loremaster Join Date: Nov 2004 Posts: 185	If every priest could do this the restrictions would make it almost impossible to use.ATM - how many people in your raid can CoH? One, maybe 2. How many priests do you have? - 6? Thats a full group ported in at once. SOE won't allow that seeing how the current CoH has been gimped.Summon Corpse? Corpses arent 'real' here in EQ2 - else we could drag them and things would be beautiful. Post OOW druids could summon corpses too I think (tho maybe it was port themselves to the corpse? or port a rezer to the corpse?) after AA point investment (hell they might have given them resurect as well - Dr00dz have always been the darlings of EQ :smileyindifferent: )I just don't think it fits for us - even Odessey is a bit strange - not sure how it fits in the lore of a cleric at all. __________________ _______________________________________________ Strasha@~~Mistmoore~~ Permafrost 90 Shadow Knight Zannah@~~Mistmoore~~ Permafrost 71 Templar (Ret) Aerica et al@Freeport EQ1 Zannah@~~The Tribunal~~ Bristlebane-The Tribunal (Ret)

03-21-2006, 12:18 AM	#12
Giallolas Loremaster Join Date: Jun 2005 Posts: 164	Interesting idea. Though I think I'd rather something different than this. This feels like taking away potential utility from conjies or necros (for the corpses). I hoping for some flavor more along the forgotten gods stuff. Druids draw power from nature, shaman from ancesters and lost spirits. Clerics draw their power from....I think forgotten gods. Hoping for a bit of flavor to come from those gods. Perhaps a special spell per tier based upon your alignment or make us choose what god we profess to follow. Then we would gain their special spell each tier. Hehe, and I would say something better than entertainment level spells. __________________ Brian Ledgers, 92 Inquisitor (formerly Templar, betrayed by the god SOE) "It was more power efficient for me to rez you than to heal you"

03-23-2006, 06:33 AM	#13
dragontamer619 Loremaster Join Date: Jan 2005 Posts: 152	The way I see Odyssey is like this. We are all about the divine righteousness. We are holy warriors who still have faith in the gods that left us so long ago. We are the closest things to the gods that the mortals know. We are all about sending people to higher levels (ie the afterlife etc). Odyssey sends you away from the danger, it blesses you, it saves you. In a sense it's a prayer that is answered by us. We send you home to be safe. I see Call of the Hero a Conjuror spell only. Why? They are summoners. They summon pets. They can summon you to them. It makes sense for them to have Call of the Hero. Necromancers summon undead things. In Everquest they could summon your corpse. They got the short end of the stick in this game because there are no corpses. If they still had spirit shards, they could summon you back to the revive camp then rez you, and cut down on XP debt. But such is not the case anymore. Wizards get evacs, and in Everquest Wizards and Druids could port you all over the place. But in Everquest 2 they cannot, yet. I don't see the big deal about having to make a call of the hero spell for Templars. We get odyssey, we can send you home. I like that. If they had to change Odyssey, they should remove that pop up window asking if they want to be ported. I don't get a pop up window for Evac or to be summoned. That is the only thing I do not like about Oydessey any more. I like have two Call of Qeynos spells though. __________________

03-23-2006, 05:47 PM	#14
Diz Join Date: Nov 2004 Posts: 54	dragontamer619 wrote: We get odyssey, we can send you home. I like that. to change Odyssey, they should remove that pop up window asking if they want to be ported. I don't get a pop up window for Evac or to be summoned. That is the only thing I do not like about Oydessey any more. This was done because Templars with an eval streak were Sending people that opposed them home.IE. If another group was in a camp the Templars group wanted, the TEmplar simply sent their Healer or Tank away, thus [Removed for Content] them off and crippeling their group.this is why, Oddyssey has a Pop up, so you can just Banish people you don't like or want. __________________

03-23-2006, 07:16 PM	#15
AzraelAzgard Loremaster Join Date: Nov 2004 Posts: 511	Odyssey was great. I used to send botters home, most of the time it would be someone playing who had only ever known life farming Feerrott Head Hunters or nodes and they wouldnt know how to get back

03-24-2006, 12:16 AM	#16
Giallolas Loremaster Join Date: Jun 2005 Posts: 164	Odyssey only worked if grouped or in raid with them. Couldn't just target anyone and send them home in the first place. But, if they were foolish enough to join your group or be idiots in your raid force, I did used to send those peeps home. __________________ Brian Ledgers, 92 Inquisitor (formerly Templar, betrayed by the god SOE) "It was more power efficient for me to rez you than to heal you"

03-24-2006, 02:27 AM	#17
Wossname Loremaster Join Date: Nov 2004 Posts: 194	Odyssey is junk, people can already gate home. I've cast it 3 times in 55 levels, I wouldn't miss it. I like the idea of a CoH-like ability for priests. If we could port group members to us once every 30 minutes that would be great given the reality of pickup groups having a slowly changing roster. If we could port the dead to us it would be great but would only make sense if it had a short re-use timer (60s say). What I would object to is a high cost component, make it no more that what Conjurors pay.

03-24-2006, 06:54 AM	#18
dragontamer619 Loremaster Join Date: Jan 2005 Posts: 152	Dizax wrote: dragontamer619 wrote: We get odyssey, we can send you home. I like that. to change Odyssey, they should remove that pop up window asking if they want to be ported. I don't get a pop up window for Evac or to be summoned. That is the only thing I do not like about Oydessey any more. This was done because Templars with an eval streak were Sending people that opposed them home.IE. If another group was in a camp the Templars group wanted, the TEmplar simply sent their Healer or Tank away, thus [Removed for Content] them off and crippeling their group.this is why, Oddyssey has a Pop up, so you can just Banish people you don't like or want. I know that is why odyssey was changed. I understand and I do agree with the changes made to it. That doesn't mean I don't have to like it. =P I cannot for the life of me see a purpose of Templars having a call of the hero spell. Call me crazy but I can't. I use my Odyssey fairly often. I call home, pick up 4 guild writs go out to TT kill a bunch of mobs, odyssey home, rinse and repeat. The recast time of odyssey is way shorter than my Call of Qeynos so I can make a few trips before my CoQ comes back up. I __________________