How will we do in PvP?

DragonMaster2385 · 04-08-2005, 04:47 PM

I'm sure everyone has heard it, EQ2 is getting PVP with a lot of changes to the combat system. This was said "right out of the horse's mouth" by John Smedley himself. My question to you is, how are we going to do? In EQ1 we had our earth pet to root the target so we could keep our distance, and PvP was pretty nice for mages if you knew what you were doing. We don't have that rooting pet, our roots are pretty much crap, and our one good stun spell becomes obsolite real quick. Unless they fix frozen by time, I can see us being one of the worse PvPers in the game. Comments please . . . . Oh, and if you haven't read the article yet and don't believe me, here is the link: http://eq2players.station.sony.com/news_archive.vm?id=440&section=News&month=current

SkinnyFats_EQ2 · 04-08-2005, 08:56 PM

DragonMaster2385 wrote:
I'm sure everyone has heard it, EQ2 is getting PVP with a lot of changes to the combat system. This was said "right out of the horse's mouth" by John Smedley himself. My question to you is, how are we going to do? In EQ1 we had our earth pet to root the target so we could keep our distance, and PvP was pretty nice for mages if you knew what you were doing. We don't have that rooting pet, our roots are pretty much crap, and our one good stun spell becomes obsolite real quick. Unless they fix frozen by time, I can see us being one of the worse PvPers in the game. Comments please . . . .

If we're in there with a wizard we'd be face down dead before we even finished casting our first spell given the relative damage and casting times of our respective classes.

Still hoping for LU#7....

Xalmat · 04-08-2005, 09:06 PM

We'd be able to survive a couple hits thanks to Stoneskin, but after that we're wizard fodder.Of course, if we open up with stun and sic our pets on them (and the pets interrupt them) they'll have a hard time casting in the first place.

SkinnyFats_EQ2 · 04-08-2005, 09:25 PM

But our stun has a 4 second cast time. Think we could even get it off before we'd be nuked down? I suppose we could hide in the bushes and surprise them...

zeek · 04-08-2005, 10:08 PM

Typically PVP pet casters in other games have had a tough time. I expect it to be the same in EQ2. Burst DPS MIGHT save wizzies(where they might be able to burn down a tank type heading over to kill them) but our slow consistent DPS will not work well I am afraid in (typical) quick PVP battles. How the system in EQ2 will work is anyones guess though but If PVP is popular I expect to be rolling an alt scout or fighter type to take into battle.

Hiei_1 · 04-09-2005, 04:17 AM

Quick prediction,

I think we will definitely suck in pvp, but we won't be the worst. I think that the rogue and predator archetypes will have it the worst in pvp. I think in larger guild war battles these classes will make good use of their flanking skills to help gang up on key enemies on the battlefield.

I think next worst will be tied between summoners and enchanters. Enchanters will be a great necessity on the battlefield (huge guild war + crowd control = pwnage), but in the 1v1 area the lack of hp and dps will certainly prove a self destructive combo. Summoners, hey...I love us but we're gonna suck at pvp. Our pets will break our roots, and they don't have much dps in the first place. If they allow everyone to use their horses to pvp with, then our kiting ability is non existent. In the end, we will do some dmg but our low hp will equal our quick demise.

I think the the bards will swing in next. The power sapping songs and their dot's will be great. I think they will fail in head on melee combat with a tank class from lack of flanking ability and lesser hp. I also think they will fail in kiting to sorcerer and tank classes due to huge nukes and ranged weapons.

I think that all 3 healer types will come in next. I think they will be so tough to kill, that they will be able to last long enough to beat the prior classes. Any mana regen items will be key for them against the prior classes so they can have enough power to cast their weak nukes along with healing.

I think tanks will rule pvp. They have way more hp than everyone with healers being closest. They should have the staying power to fight every class. Sorcerers might give them a run for their money, but I think if the caster is on their toes, and especially if he has a horse, he'll be able to get in their and use his spell interrupting skills to deadline the sorc's dps. I think their will be some interesting bow wars going on between scouts and warriors. I think the bards will give them a run for their money with all the great songs they play, but I believe the warriors will edge them out a majority of the time if the ranged battle takes place on foot or horseback. Of the tank classes, I think weakest to strongest pvp will go brawler, crusader, warrior. I think brawler and crusader will lose out because of no bows. Both crusader classes have some great utility spells which I think will make them better than brawlers and close to warriors, but I think that both at ranged and close combat they will be edged out by warriors.

In a guild war environment utility characters will be much more valuable. In say a 6 vs 6 battle, I think that normal xp adventuring groups will fare pretty well, with certain small adjustments and tweaking making them great. This would be a great time to plot out some nice dueling groups.

6v6

6 chantys

5 chanty's keep 5 of the enemies mezzd while all 6 of them nuke the one they let run free until he dies....rinse/repeat/pwn?

4 healers 2 sorc

ward, reactive heal, and regenerate whoever everyone is ganging up on, while sorcerers get in the middle of the large group of enemies and let loose aoe's. Healers nuke as necessary when not healing.

6 scouts

Have 6 scouts, on horseback if possibe, if not then sped up with pathfinding or song, kiting the group of baddies. For extra kiting ability use some hex dolls to lower their speed. Make the group dirge, troub, and 4 rangers if possible and let them fire away.

This is totally unrelated to the original post, but to summarize it all up:

I think conjuror's will suck for pvp 1v1, and group wars. I will probably create a new twinked out toon for pvp.

woo · 04-09-2005, 01:30 PM

my bets on monks, bruisers, rangers, swashbucklers, and assassins.

Xalmat · 04-09-2005, 11:21 PM

That does raise a question:EQ2 abilities are based on encounters. Do you suppose that in PvP combat, there will be PvP encounters? After all, if you're being attacked by a group of 6, suddenly Shattered Earth looks like a pretty useful tool.

hellfire · 04-10-2005, 10:51 AM

root wizard ,send hunters, earth pet,shattering earth , stack you dots ...... very dead wizard.

aurabo · 04-10-2005, 01:31 PM

I also noticed that everytime an npc/traps casts dots on you ,you'll get interupted every tick of the dot,imagine those dots stacked on a wizzy,they wont be able to cast a single spell.

DragonMaster2385 · 04-10-2005, 05:56 PM

This is a very interesting topic because there are so many different speculations. If DoTs do interupt the casting, then we will be awesome against any casting type. Plus, if we innitiate the combat, we can send our pets in from a distance and get a great advantage from the get go. There might be hope for us if our dots work to our advantage. Keeping a steady and fast ticking DoT will allow us to overtake any mage class. When it comes to fighting a tank or healer, we might have the short end of the stick. Our DoTs will interupt any healing done, but they can do massive amount of melee damage (even the healers compared to our low hp). Our one technique that might benefit us is kiting for this kind of fight because I have noticed that we are faster than a lot of tanks. I have never met a tank that was faster than me. We get our Jboots on, and we can kite any tank in the game (granted that he doesn't have a good horse). And everytime he stops to fight the pet, we can cast a dot to do even more damage. Don't rule us our of the PvP game yet!

Orn · 04-10-2005, 06:23 PM

We could also run from casting range to give the pet a head start on the opponent, and the power expended due to running could easily be leeched back once we had gained control. Who knows though, guess only time will tell.

kelly · 04-11-2005, 02:36 AM

it will be tough for dot classes against a cleric or with a cleric in group cause clerics have group cures posion/ diease at 10 trauma at 20 and so on kelly

DragonMaster2385 · 04-11-2005, 09:44 PM

true, but our dots should give us an advantage because it would interupt casting.

Jgok · 04-20-2005, 05:42 AM

But do clerics ever get an elemental cure? Almost all of our damage would come from abilities that would require Cure Arcane and Cure Elements... and with the way Cure Arcane is bugged currently, nobody with sense casts it if they're grouped with a healer.

(for those who didn't know, Cure Arcane will remove reactive heals from your group members, possibly also regens and wards, but I rarely group with druids and shaman, so I'm not positive on that.)

Jor · 04-20-2005, 02:27 PM

Face it... Conjurer in PvP is dead meat SMILEY

Probably the least efficient class

Cheater you're supposed to hit my pet :b

Kyralis · 04-27-2005, 09:15 PM

FYI, Clerics get a group Arcane cure but no group elemental cure; Druids get a group Elemental cure but no arcane cure.That said, I think summoners in general will have it rough in pvp. The thing that makes PVP interesting is the intelligence of the players- with a pet class, that intelligence is only really driving half of the character's abilities; the other half are being driven by the rather stupid pet AI.Of course, that isn't stopping me from currently trying to level up a Conjuror....

roarfrost · 04-27-2005, 11:01 PM

In any Mage vs. Mage battle, I think it would be a contest on who can get off the first Stifle and/or Stun.

As a Wizard, I might try my fast casting Stun on you, then my low level (but fast casting) root on your pet, then a Stifle on you, then the unbreakable AOE root on you and your pet. After that, I'd step back and use the big nukes on you and re-apply Stifle/Root as needed.

Note: I'm not sure PvP will actually be the tradtional PvP we are all used to, but it is interesting to discuss tactics anyway.

Sliverhammer · 04-28-2005, 01:44 AM

hellfire wrote:
root wizard ,send hunters, earth pet,shattering earth , stack you dots ...... very dead wizard.

In 2 seconds I can stun you for 5 secondsIn 4 seconds I can do 3500 damage from long rangeIn 4 seconds I'm going to evac if it looks scary. SMILEY

I don't think a summoner will fare well against a wizard, but as someone else mentioned it's more about, who does what first.I'm not here for flames (no pun intended), just made what will be a conjurer alt, so was just browsing.

NG23985_01 · 05-07-2005, 12:13 PM

As a Warlock, I doubt either Summoner subclass will be much of a threat to me once the PvP comes along (although it is arena-based, ive heard... definately not Serverwide-pvp fest - so i doubt i'll pvp much). I'm not bragging or trying to be mean, but with current mechanics, its just inconcievable to me that there would be much of a threat. From what I have grouped with Summoners (both types) I'd feel safe in saying you need a bit of a damage boost, along with my Wizard brethern and Enchanter cousins.

At 37 my Nil Distortion Adept 3 hit for avg 1200, but maybe 1 in 10 hits or so would land for 1550ish. At that level range, that's somewhere in the range of 80% of any fellow Mage's HP max gone in 1 shot. Resists arent much of a problem either, with my debuffs.

Hmm, I speculate that if I were to challenge either Summoner subclass to a duel, I'd do it like this... Flashfreeze (1.0 sec cast, 3.8 sec stun), Dispell (takes off buffs, pet included**) Then start casting my 9.0 second duration stun, before Flashfreeze wears completely off. Hit with Steal Breath (Debuff/DoT), Nil Distortion for ~1000 damage, Bellengere`s Sapping Salvo for ~750, then if the summoner were still alive I'd finish with Noxious Bolt for ~600 damage, all 3 of which are relatively fast-casting spells (2 seconds) compared to my Wizard bretheren equivalent spells. (Poor wizzies SMILEY

they need a boost!) I doubt I'd even get a scratch to my own HP.

**I can personally confirm that the Mage spell that dispells Arcane enhancements (forget the exact name [Dispell?], but the uber low lvl one) indeed removes pets. In EL, some of the evil halflings are Necromancers. I always open my fights on them with Dispell - pet is gone instantly, making them for a significantly easier kill.

Xlap · 05-07-2005, 06:55 PM

but here's the thing...i would never duel! i would walk in the arena, see you somewhere there, and cast heatwave...4 second cast, 6 second stun, then i would cast shattered earth-4 second cast, 16 or so second stifle, then i would layer on the dots and send the pet in to interrupt...as long as we get the first shot in, it seems like we'd do pretty well versus casters...fighters, scouts, and healers....that's an entirely different story ><

Azri · 05-08-2005, 04:59 AM

Templars get an elemental cure as one of their every 10 level skills (not sure what those are called /grin) called Plorsin's Elemental Salve. It dispells 77 levels of hostile cold and heat effects on the group. I think it is the lvl 30 choice, though I cannot remember.

Az

NG23985_01 · 05-09-2005, 12:18 PM

I'm not trying to be sarcastic, rude, nor am i trying to start anything here, Xlapus, but how on earth can a 4.0 cast time 6.0 duration stun compete with my 1.0 cast time 3.8 duration stun? Or my 2.0 cast 9.0 duration stun, for that matter. : The stifle you have is a danger, sure... and i dont doubt summoners (both) will be able to take on the Fighter folk, and probably some of the priests and scouts as well, but as is, i just dont see a summoner being able to stand against a sorcerer unless they put in some massive PvP damage nerf like in EQ1.

Xlap · 05-09-2005, 05:50 PM

i meant to win i would have to catch you off guard. if i see you before you see me it's gonna suck for you...this is assuming you dont actually need to set up matches and can just enter the arena as a zone. :smileyvery-happy:

Kneemin · 05-13-2005, 08:13 PM

Well acutally i was thinking depending on the choices you made in your training we may fair off well.Gimbles shocking burst is weak but includes a stun and has also a very low cast time.

Belld · 05-18-2005, 07:19 PM

Given the difficulty of mobs we can solo you would think we would be good at PvP. Of the 5 characters below though I would rank them in this order:

1. Monk - hits hard, good dps, excellent avoidance, stuns/interrupt abilities

2. Fury - very efficient heals will make him hard to kill. Nukes fairly well: ~200 @ lvl 27 (twice as much as conjurer, 1/3rd as much as a warlock of same lvl)

3. Templar - see above. Doesn't nuke quite as well but heals will keep him alive a long time. Better debuffs than Fury too.

4. Illusionist - Stifles/Stuns, if he lands these (or mez or root) he's in total control: stack dots (which are excellent) and nuke down (better nukes than conjurer, not as good as Fury.

5. Conjurer - after petrify stuns take too long to cast. Pet is good at holding aggro against NPC's but this won't apply to PC's in PvP. Pet dps isn't enough to make it effective in duels like pets in EQ1 were. No nuke other than the gimpy dust blast for quick DD. Has access to stifle via shattered ground but cast time is too long.

Xlap · 05-18-2005, 07:29 PM

as i was saying, against another caster (as long as we get the first hit in) i think we'll do well enough. have you ever tried casting with 8DoTs going on you? plus the pet...well, not that easy. at the lower levels petrify will hold someone easily because of the short cast. once the level for that spell is crossed...frozen by time sucks so bad, i hope you dont actually have to set up duels before going to the arena zone. and yes, gimbles will interrupt casting and has a 1 second cast. could be great if used when needed

fatpuddyc · 05-26-2005, 04:03 AM

There's a nice little summary of some PvP duels on the test server on the ranger boards.

http://eqiiforums.station.sony.com/eq2/board/message?board.id=39&message.id=8378

Seems a ranger/scout class can do pretty well with the Stalk type (in-combat stealth) abilities to get in the backstabs, and the kiting.

No conjurers though.

Junaru · 05-27-2005, 12:46 AM

Interesting read.. The only problem is in 3 levels that Wizard(37) will get a 36 second perma root. Sorry but there isn't a class out there they can stand up to a Wizard/Warlock nuking at will for 36 seconds. Scary thing is it's AoE too so if you pet is in the area it's useless. Now as a 30 Warlock I did a little math to see how I would fair again a summoner. I can put out between 1100-1300 points of damage in 6 seconds (1+0.5+2+0.5+2=6) and that is with 1 stun, 1 chance to strife and a DoT ticking. Flashfreeze, Bellengere's Sapping Salvo and Suffocating Breath If the person is under level 34 I also have another 1 second nuke/stun I can use Freeze.. Warlocks/Wizards just putt out way too much burst damage for most classes to deal with. With the short cast time of the Warlock spells and 36 second perma root I have a feeling Warlocks are going to be king of PvP. But I'm a Warlock so I might just be dreaming.. Plus Player > Class when it comes to PvP.

DragonMaster2385 · 06-06-2005, 09:48 PM

true, you can pump out great damage . . . against NPCs. SOE is setting it up so there will be 2 versions of the spells (PvP and PvE). Your nukes will probobly do less damage AND there is no way that your root will last 36 seconds against a PC.

Like I said, they are setting the system up brilliantly. Balancing PvP won't affect PvE play and will be much easier to balance. Don't get your hopes up yet Mr. Wizzard.

04-08-2005, 08:56 PM	#2
SkinnyFats_EQ2 Loremaster Join Date: Dec 2004 Posts: 114	DragonMaster2385 wrote: I'm sure everyone has heard it, EQ2 is getting PVP with a lot of changes to the combat system. This was said "right out of the horse's mouth" by John Smedley himself. My question to you is, how are we going to do? In EQ1 we had our earth pet to root the target so we could keep our distance, and PvP was pretty nice for mages if you knew what you were doing. We don't have that rooting pet, our roots are pretty much crap, and our one good stun spell becomes obsolite real quick. Unless they fix frozen by time, I can see us being one of the worse PvPers in the game. Comments please . . . . If we're in there with a wizard we'd be face down dead before we even finished casting our first spell given the relative damage and casting times of our respective classes. Still hoping for LU#7....

04-08-2005, 09:06 PM	#3
Xalmat EQ2Achieve.com Join Date: Nov 2004 Location: Phoenix, AZ Posts: 5,895	We'd be able to survive a couple hits thanks to Stoneskin, but after that we're wizard fodder.Of course, if we open up with stun and sic our pets on them (and the pets interrupt them) they'll have a hard time casting in the first place. __________________ EQ2Achieve - Your guide to all EverQuest II Achievements

04-09-2005, 11:21 PM	#8
Xalmat EQ2Achieve.com Join Date: Nov 2004 Location: Phoenix, AZ Posts: 5,895	That does raise a question:EQ2 abilities are based on encounters. Do you suppose that in PvP combat, there will be PvP encounters? After all, if you're being attacked by a group of 6, suddenly Shattered Earth looks like a pretty useful tool. __________________ EQ2Achieve - Your guide to all EverQuest II Achievements

04-10-2005, 10:51 AM	#9
hellfire Loremaster Join Date: Nov 2004 Location: NY Posts: 1,842	root wizard ,send hunters, earth pet,shattering earth , stack you dots ...... very dead wizard. __________________ Summoner pets are 1/3 the dps of a summoner and yet our stats and modifiers do not affect them.Since a pet is 1/3 a summoners dps,a summoner receives 2/3 benefit from gear when compared to any other class. SHARED STATS AND MODIFIERS ARE A MUST! FIX SUMMONERS IN 08! FIX SUMMONERS IN 09! FIX SUMMONERS IN 10! 2011 and Finally we are Fixed! /Rides off into the sunset

04-11-2005, 02:36 AM	#13
kelly Loremaster Join Date: Nov 2004 Posts: 47	it will be tough for dot classes against a cleric or with a cleric in group cause clerics have group cures posion/ diease at 10 trauma at 20 and so on kelly __________________ lilpixie 68 illusionist/ 51 carpenter guk shykelly 70 templar/ 70 provisioner guk kelkel 70 conjuror/ 68 alchy guk

04-08-2005, 04:47 PM	#1
DragonMaster2385 Loremaster Join Date: Dec 2004 Posts: 1,063	I'm sure everyone has heard it, EQ2 is getting PVP with a lot of changes to the combat system. This was said "right out of the horse's mouth" by John Smedley himself. My question to you is, how are we going to do? In EQ1 we had our earth pet to root the target so we could keep our distance, and PvP was pretty nice for mages if you knew what you were doing. We don't have that rooting pet, our roots are pretty much crap, and our one good stun spell becomes obsolite real quick. Unless they fix frozen by time, I can see us being one of the worse PvPers in the game. Comments please . . . . Oh, and if you haven't read the article yet and don't believe me, here is the link: http://eq2players.station.sony.com/news_archive.vm?id=440&section=News&month=current

04-08-2005, 09:25 PM	#4
SkinnyFats_EQ2 Loremaster Join Date: Dec 2004 Posts: 114	But our stun has a 4 second cast time. Think we could even get it off before we'd be nuked down? I suppose we could hide in the bushes and surprise them...

04-08-2005, 10:08 PM	#5
zeek Join Date: Nov 2004 Posts: 8	Typically PVP pet casters in other games have had a tough time. I expect it to be the same in EQ2. Burst DPS MIGHT save wizzies(where they might be able to burn down a tank type heading over to kill them) but our slow consistent DPS will not work well I am afraid in (typical) quick PVP battles. How the system in EQ2 will work is anyones guess though but If PVP is popular I expect to be rolling an alt scout or fighter type to take into battle.

04-09-2005, 04:17 AM	#6
Hiei_1 Join Date: Dec 2004 Posts: 31	Quick prediction, I think we will definitely suck in pvp, but we won't be the worst. I think that the rogue and predator archetypes will have it the worst in pvp. I think in larger guild war battles these classes will make good use of their flanking skills to help gang up on key enemies on the battlefield. I think next worst will be tied between summoners and enchanters. Enchanters will be a great necessity on the battlefield (huge guild war + crowd control = pwnage), but in the 1v1 area the lack of hp and dps will certainly prove a self destructive combo. Summoners, hey...I love us but we're gonna suck at pvp. Our pets will break our roots, and they don't have much dps in the first place. If they allow everyone to use their horses to pvp with, then our kiting ability is non existent. In the end, we will do some dmg but our low hp will equal our quick demise. I think the the bards will swing in next. The power sapping songs and their dot's will be great. I think they will fail in head on melee combat with a tank class from lack of flanking ability and lesser hp. I also think they will fail in kiting to sorcerer and tank classes due to huge nukes and ranged weapons. I think that all 3 healer types will come in next. I think they will be so tough to kill, that they will be able to last long enough to beat the prior classes. Any mana regen items will be key for them against the prior classes so they can have enough power to cast their weak nukes along with healing. I think tanks will rule pvp. They have way more hp than everyone with healers being closest. They should have the staying power to fight every class. Sorcerers might give them a run for their money, but I think if the caster is on their toes, and especially if he has a horse, he'll be able to get in their and use his spell interrupting skills to deadline the sorc's dps. I think their will be some interesting bow wars going on between scouts and warriors. I think the bards will give them a run for their money with all the great songs they play, but I believe the warriors will edge them out a majority of the time if the ranged battle takes place on foot or horseback. Of the tank classes, I think weakest to strongest pvp will go brawler, crusader, warrior. I think brawler and crusader will lose out because of no bows. Both crusader classes have some great utility spells which I think will make them better than brawlers and close to warriors, but I think that both at ranged and close combat they will be edged out by warriors. In a guild war environment utility characters will be much more valuable. In say a 6 vs 6 battle, I think that normal xp adventuring groups will fare pretty well, with certain small adjustments and tweaking making them great. This would be a great time to plot out some nice dueling groups. 6v6 6 chantys 5 chanty's keep 5 of the enemies mezzd while all 6 of them nuke the one they let run free until he dies....rinse/repeat/pwn? 4 healers 2 sorc ward, reactive heal, and regenerate whoever everyone is ganging up on, while sorcerers get in the middle of the large group of enemies and let loose aoe's. Healers nuke as necessary when not healing. 6 scouts Have 6 scouts, on horseback if possibe, if not then sped up with pathfinding or song, kiting the group of baddies. For extra kiting ability use some hex dolls to lower their speed. Make the group dirge, troub, and 4 rangers if possible and let them fire away. This is totally unrelated to the original post, but to summarize it all up: I think conjuror's will suck for pvp 1v1, and group wars. I will probably create a new twinked out toon for pvp.

04-09-2005, 01:30 PM	#7
woo Join Date: Jan 2005 Location: Seattle, WA Posts: 239	my bets on monks, bruisers, rangers, swashbucklers, and assassins.

04-10-2005, 01:31 PM	#10
aurabo General Join Date: Nov 2004 Posts: 6	I also noticed that everytime an npc/traps casts dots on you ,you'll get interupted every tick of the dot,imagine those dots stacked on a wizzy,they wont be able to cast a single spell.

04-10-2005, 05:56 PM	#11
DragonMaster2385 Loremaster Join Date: Dec 2004 Posts: 1,063	This is a very interesting topic because there are so many different speculations. If DoTs do interupt the casting, then we will be awesome against any casting type. Plus, if we innitiate the combat, we can send our pets in from a distance and get a great advantage from the get go. There might be hope for us if our dots work to our advantage. Keeping a steady and fast ticking DoT will allow us to overtake any mage class. When it comes to fighting a tank or healer, we might have the short end of the stick. Our DoTs will interupt any healing done, but they can do massive amount of melee damage (even the healers compared to our low hp). Our one technique that might benefit us is kiting for this kind of fight because I have noticed that we are faster than a lot of tanks. I have never met a tank that was faster than me. We get our Jboots on, and we can kite any tank in the game (granted that he doesn't have a good horse). And everytime he stops to fight the pet, we can cast a dot to do even more damage. Don't rule us our of the PvP game yet!

04-10-2005, 06:23 PM	#12
Orn Join Date: Nov 2004 Posts: 11	We could also run from casting range to give the pet a head start on the opponent, and the power expended due to running could easily be leeched back once we had gained control. Who knows though, guess only time will tell.

04-11-2005, 09:44 PM	#14
DragonMaster2385 Loremaster Join Date: Dec 2004 Posts: 1,063	true, but our dots should give us an advantage because it would interupt casting.

04-20-2005, 05:42 AM	#15
Jgok Loremaster Join Date: Nov 2004 Location: East Coast, USA Posts: 329	But do clerics ever get an elemental cure? Almost all of our damage would come from abilities that would require Cure Arcane and Cure Elements... and with the way Cure Arcane is bugged currently, nobody with sense casts it if they're grouped with a healer. (for those who didn't know, Cure Arcane will remove reactive heals from your group members, possibly also regens and wards, but I rarely group with druids and shaman, so I'm not positive on that.) __________________

04-20-2005, 02:27 PM	#16
Jor Join Date: Dec 2004 Posts: 65	Face it... Conjurer in PvP is dead meat Probably the least efficient class Cheater you're supposed to hit my pet :b

04-27-2005, 09:15 PM	#17
Kyralis Loremaster Join Date: Nov 2004 Posts: 637	FYI, Clerics get a group Arcane cure but no group elemental cure; Druids get a group Elemental cure but no arcane cure.That said, I think summoners in general will have it rough in pvp. The thing that makes PVP interesting is the intelligence of the players- with a pet class, that intelligence is only really driving half of the character's abilities; the other half are being driven by the rather stupid pet AI.Of course, that isn't stopping me from currently trying to level up a Conjuror.... __________________ -- Kyralis Warden of Nagafen

04-27-2005, 11:01 PM	#18
roarfrost Loremaster Join Date: Dec 2004 Posts: 117	In any Mage vs. Mage battle, I think it would be a contest on who can get off the first Stifle and/or Stun. As a Wizard, I might try my fast casting Stun on you, then my low level (but fast casting) root on your pet, then a Stifle on you, then the unbreakable AOE root on you and your pet. After that, I'd step back and use the big nukes on you and re-apply Stifle/Root as needed. Note: I'm not sure PvP will actually be the tradtional PvP we are all used to, but it is interesting to discuss tactics anyway.

04-28-2005, 01:44 AM	#19
Sliverhammer Loremaster Join Date: Nov 2004 Posts: 65	hellfire wrote: root wizard ,send hunters, earth pet,shattering earth , stack you dots ...... very dead wizard. In 2 seconds I can stun you for 5 secondsIn 4 seconds I can do 3500 damage from long rangeIn 4 seconds I'm going to evac if it looks scary.I don't think a summoner will fare well against a wizard, but as someone else mentioned it's more about, who does what first.I'm not here for flames (no pun intended), just made what will be a conjurer alt, so was just browsing. __________________

05-07-2005, 12:13 PM	#20
NG23985_01 Loremaster Join Date: Nov 2004 Posts: 116	As a Warlock, I doubt either Summoner subclass will be much of a threat to me once the PvP comes along (although it is arena-based, ive heard... definately not Serverwide-pvp fest - so i doubt i'll pvp much). I'm not bragging or trying to be mean, but with current mechanics, its just inconcievable to me that there would be much of a threat. From what I have grouped with Summoners (both types) I'd feel safe in saying you need a bit of a damage boost, along with my Wizard brethern and Enchanter cousins. At 37 my Nil Distortion Adept 3 hit for avg 1200, but maybe 1 in 10 hits or so would land for 1550ish. At that level range, that's somewhere in the range of 80% of any fellow Mage's HP max gone in 1 shot. Resists arent much of a problem either, with my debuffs. Hmm, I speculate that if I were to challenge either Summoner subclass to a duel, I'd do it like this... Flashfreeze (1.0 sec cast, 3.8 sec stun), Dispell (takes off buffs, pet included) Then start casting my 9.0 second duration stun, before Flashfreeze wears completely off. Hit with Steal Breath (Debuff/DoT), Nil Distortion for ~1000 damage, Bellengere`s Sapping Salvo for ~750, then if the summoner were still alive I'd finish with Noxious Bolt for ~600 damage, all 3 of which are relatively fast-casting spells (2 seconds) compared to my Wizard bretheren equivalent spells. (Poor wizzies they need a boost!) I doubt I'd even get a scratch to my own HP. I can personally confirm that the Mage spell that dispells Arcane enhancements (forget the exact name [Dispell?], but the uber low lvl one) indeed removes pets. In EL, some of the evil halflings are Necromancers. I always open my fights on them with Dispell - pet is gone instantly, making them for a significantly easier kill.

05-07-2005, 06:55 PM	#21
Xlap Join Date: Jan 2005 Posts: 117	but here's the thing...i would never duel! i would walk in the arena, see you somewhere there, and cast heatwave...4 second cast, 6 second stun, then i would cast shattered earth-4 second cast, 16 or so second stifle, then i would layer on the dots and send the pet in to interrupt...as long as we get the first shot in, it seems like we'd do pretty well versus casters...fighters, scouts, and healers....that's an entirely different story ><

05-08-2005, 04:59 AM	#22
Azri Join Date: Nov 2004 Posts: 12	Templars get an elemental cure as one of their every 10 level skills (not sure what those are called /grin) called Plorsin's Elemental Salve. It dispells 77 levels of hostile cold and heat effects on the group. I think it is the lvl 30 choice, though I cannot remember. Az

05-09-2005, 12:18 PM	#23
NG23985_01 Loremaster Join Date: Nov 2004 Posts: 116	I'm not trying to be sarcastic, rude, nor am i trying to start anything here, Xlapus, but how on earth can a 4.0 cast time 6.0 duration stun compete with my 1.0 cast time 3.8 duration stun? Or my 2.0 cast 9.0 duration stun, for that matter. : The stifle you have is a danger, sure... and i dont doubt summoners (both) will be able to take on the Fighter folk, and probably some of the priests and scouts as well, but as is, i just dont see a summoner being able to stand against a sorcerer unless they put in some massive PvP damage nerf like in EQ1.

05-09-2005, 05:50 PM	#24
Xlap Join Date: Jan 2005 Posts: 117	i meant to win i would have to catch you off guard. if i see you before you see me it's gonna suck for you...this is assuming you dont actually need to set up matches and can just enter the arena as a zone. :smileyvery-happy:

05-13-2005, 08:13 PM	#25
Kneemin Server: Mistmoore Guild: Wicked Rank: Leader Loremaster Join Date: Nov 2004 Posts: 320	Well acutally i was thinking depending on the choices you made in your training we may fair off well.Gimbles shocking burst is weak but includes a stun and has also a very low cast time. __________________

05-18-2005, 07:19 PM	#26
Belld Join Date: Dec 2004 Posts: 7	Given the difficulty of mobs we can solo you would think we would be good at PvP. Of the 5 characters below though I would rank them in this order: 1. Monk - hits hard, good dps, excellent avoidance, stuns/interrupt abilities 2. Fury - very efficient heals will make him hard to kill. Nukes fairly well: ~200 @ lvl 27 (twice as much as conjurer, 1/3rd as much as a warlock of same lvl) 3. Templar - see above. Doesn't nuke quite as well but heals will keep him alive a long time. Better debuffs than Fury too. 4. Illusionist - Stifles/Stuns, if he lands these (or mez or root) he's in total control: stack dots (which are excellent) and nuke down (better nukes than conjurer, not as good as Fury. 5. Conjurer - after petrify stuns take too long to cast. Pet is good at holding aggro against NPC's but this won't apply to PC's in PvP. Pet dps isn't enough to make it effective in duels like pets in EQ1 were. No nuke other than the gimpy dust blast for quick DD. Has access to stifle via shattered ground but cast time is too long.

05-18-2005, 07:29 PM	#27
Xlap Join Date: Jan 2005 Posts: 117	as i was saying, against another caster (as long as we get the first hit in) i think we'll do well enough. have you ever tried casting with 8DoTs going on you? plus the pet...well, not that easy. at the lower levels petrify will hold someone easily because of the short cast. once the level for that spell is crossed...frozen by time sucks so bad, i hope you dont actually have to set up duels before going to the arena zone. and yes, gimbles will interrupt casting and has a 1 second cast. could be great if used when needed

05-26-2005, 04:03 AM	#28
fatpuddyc Join Date: Nov 2004 Posts: 2	There's a nice little summary of some PvP duels on the test server on the ranger boards. http://eqiiforums.station.sony.com/eq2/board/message?board.id=39&message.id=8378 Seems a ranger/scout class can do pretty well with the Stalk type (in-combat stealth) abilities to get in the backstabs, and the kiting. No conjurers though.

05-27-2005, 12:46 AM	#29
Junaru Loremaster Join Date: Nov 2004 Posts: 1,471	Interesting read.. The only problem is in 3 levels that Wizard(37) will get a 36 second perma root. Sorry but there isn't a class out there they can stand up to a Wizard/Warlock nuking at will for 36 seconds. Scary thing is it's AoE too so if you pet is in the area it's useless. Now as a 30 Warlock I did a little math to see how I would fair again a summoner. I can put out between 1100-1300 points of damage in 6 seconds (1+0.5+2+0.5+2=6) and that is with 1 stun, 1 chance to strife and a DoT ticking. Flashfreeze, Bellengere's Sapping Salvo and Suffocating Breath If the person is under level 34 I also have another 1 second nuke/stun I can use Freeze.. Warlocks/Wizards just putt out way too much burst damage for most classes to deal with. With the short cast time of the Warlock spells and 36 second perma root I have a feeling Warlocks are going to be king of PvP. But I'm a Warlock so I might just be dreaming.. Plus Player > Class when it comes to PvP. __________________

06-06-2005, 09:48 PM	#30
DragonMaster2385 Loremaster Join Date: Dec 2004 Posts: 1,063	true, you can pump out great damage . . . against NPCs. SOE is setting it up so there will be 2 versions of the spells (PvP and PvE). Your nukes will probobly do less damage AND there is no way that your root will last 36 seconds against a PC. Like I said, they are setting the system up brilliantly. Balancing PvP won't affect PvE play and will be much easier to balance. Don't get your hopes up yet Mr. Wizzard.