30 Withering Silence vs. 44 Agonizing Silence

Mindtric · 06-28-2005, 11:56 PM

30 Withering Silence vs. 44 Agonizing Silence

Why is it I always hear people talking about Withering Silence being most effective? Is Agonizing Silence not an upgrade to the same spell line?

Pins · 06-29-2005, 12:34 AM

Agonizing Silence has the following words on it:Does not Effect EpicsWithering Silence does not. That is why agonizing silence isn't an "upgrade" but it is an upgrade.

ProteusTielaxi · 06-29-2005, 03:17 AM

Shhhhhhh...

That being said, agonizing silence is clearly superior, for all but raid mobs.

Chath · 06-29-2005, 06:31 AM

OK, so Agonizing doesn't affect epics?

This game keeps getting sillier and sillier.

xev · 06-29-2005, 07:07 AM

I noticed the same thing a little over a week ago when I was looking over all my spells (that withering silence does not say "does not effect epic mobs"). So I booted up my parser and tried it out.

From what I can tell, it shows the icon in the spell window as if it landed, but my parser says that it misses everytime. I think the spell is too low to land on epic mobs (the 50+ ones).

I wish Agonizing would we usuable, since I use it alot vs other mobs, but than we would own Epic encounters =P. (actually, you can agonizing on all epic adds, just not the ^^^'s).

ProteusTielaxi · 07-02-2005, 07:49 PM

I've had withering land on plenty of ^^^ mobs before, including Myrgroth, and Zalek. In both cases, it stiffled all but innate abilities.

Tanatus · 07-02-2005, 09:16 PM

Lets discuss this on constructive note:

I have tested it many time Withering Silence do not prevent next spells - Ice Commet (Archlich, Drayek) and Devastation (warlock version of Archlich and SoF Drakota). Frankly I did not checked other spells

It is possible that withering silence work exactly as it written - limited casting ability of mob aka preven mob from casting certain lvl of spells and it be interesting to find out what lvl cap of spell that withering silence can actually stop. It not affect lvl 50 spell for sure.

There is a good place to test it. Miragul Mengarie single group instance final mob... Its a warlock with normal warlock spell array and that mob tend to cast Devastation and Nil Distortion - what need to be checked if WS can stop ND.

I know for sure that Agonizing Silence stop any spell casting completely - using this spell on Astrologer in CL and Archmagi in Ant - prevent both mobs from casting ANY spells

Azmode · 07-06-2005, 01:05 AM

Yes Tan it certainly does not stop the Ice Comets and Devastatsions and any AE from a major dragon. Basically the things that I want to prevent, will still get off.

SpirituSanctu · 07-23-2005, 02:43 AM

I am almost to lvl 40 and am considering taking the upgrade to withering silence (does added dmg with stifle) only because i solo ALOT at the moment. I know everyone screams to get mind gorge, and will prob respec that when the option becomes available shortly. My question is , anyone know how much damage the lvl 40 training option does? Is it dot dmg or direct dmg?

My opinion at the moment is my main role is to stifle while soloing, so withering silence is ALWAYS on, the added dmg of this would help me greatly. Although, this will make agonizing silence kinda useless for me when i get to lvl 44. Not sure what to do at the moment.Any suggestions?

Dystr · 07-23-2005, 12:45 PM

i wouldnt take the stifle upgrade if all you are worried about is soloing. BMG will be more useful for the power regen, and will lessen down time. agonizing silence is a great spell. the only advantage of the stifle upgrade is that it cons higher than withering silence and can affect epics, which is irrelevent for soloing.

Tanatus · 07-24-2005, 10:17 PM

For crist sake for the last time

Withering silence and its upgrade DO stick on epic, both spells DO NOT have lvl limitation, both spell DO NOT PREVENT SPELL CASTING OF EPIC MOBS - period.

Dont trust me? for crist sake for 1 time in your life go to Icebound or Shattered Stillness and place that spell on wizard version of Drayek or on Archlich Udalan - it will NOTHING but power drain. Archlich WILL cast BOTH Devastation AND Nil Distortion ..

So what actually WS do (and its upgrade) - well as far as I can say its stop only next things from epic - Crushing Blow and Barrage

Huskyla · 07-25-2005, 08:37 PM

Yes it does. Try it and see.

Tanatus wrote:

For crist sake for the last time

Withering silence and its upgrade DO stick on epic, both spells DO NOT have lvl limitation, both spell DO NOT PREVENT SPELL CASTING OF EPIC MOBS - period.

Tanatus · 07-26-2005, 07:27 AM

I did try it every day for last month roflmao it NEVER stoped Devastation or Nil Distortion it NEVER stoped Ice Commet...

I use my coercer exclusively for 2 zones - Shattered Stillness and Meeting of Mind (if we short on healers) - I have not just Withering Silence I have MASTER 1 of WS and nope it not work ...

Huskyla · 07-26-2005, 10:09 AM

Go into Spirits of the Lost and fight Venekor. Have your tank pull it to the wall, have a Templar or Inquiz debuff Venekor versus magic attacks, and cast your best debuffs before withering / liska's quietude. Watch what happens to Venekor's AE.

You couldn't be more wrong on this spell.

It isn't guaranteed to stick forever due to resists, but with hard work and good team work, it will do amazing things.

Sy · 07-28-2005, 01:02 AM

WS does not work.. Parsed it last night on Drayek. End of Story.

Huskyla · 07-28-2005, 01:19 AM

Unless Liska's is working and WS isn't, you all are totally missing it.

Liska's works great.

Sy · 07-28-2005, 01:25 AM

Parsed that too.. doesnt work.

Tanatus · 07-28-2005, 02:51 AM

Been there done that ... nope it not work on Vene lol you mess it up with assasins interupts (on Vene + Vara)

Huskyla · 07-28-2005, 04:37 AM

Believe what you guys want to.. but it works

There was no assasin, no monk, no bruiser. I was the sole person on stiffle duties and it worked perfect. The only time Venekor AEd was the INSTANT my stiffle broke. Either you guys are just being obstinate, or afraid something is going to be nefed and don't want it made public. I'm done debating, for any curious coercers who see this, yes it works, try for yourself and you will see.

nithrill · 07-28-2005, 08:44 AM

Syan wrote:

WS does not work.. Parsed it last night on Drayek. End of Story.

Since you didn't in particular elaborate I am going to assume you saw Drayeks favorite DoT ticking away while you had him stifled (i.e. Incinerate).

I just did Drayek tonight with my guild and I can't see better than my stifle is working just fine.

And just to make it clear I'd like to reiterate two points:

Coercer Stifles do NOT interrupt and because of that they will not stop a mob from finishing a cast that has already started
Coercer Stifles do NOT remove or prevent DoTs that are already in effect

Tanatus · 07-29-2005, 11:05 AM

Nithrill please do next simple step that show you that it do NOT work ..

Cast WS/training skill on Drayek WIZARD version and chain cast it ... watch IC comming left and right ... lol

Keldo · 07-29-2005, 03:36 PM

Drayek is always a wizard, he just doesn't always load IC. That being said, he never casts more than 1 spell when we raid him every single day, because our coercer casts WS on him. Arch Lich casts maybe 3 spells (other than his tap/stun which is innate) in 8-12 minute fights due to being stifled the entire time other than a few strings of multiple resists. Niscanith casts nothing but his innate knockback and melee. Some mobs in Spirits of the Lost fail to AE, the Spirit of Vox fails to AE, any pure melee mob cannot crushing blow or wild swing, the list goes on and on. If you are seeing anything other than this, you are letting it wear off or your parser is broken, plain and simple. You have to be denying it in fear of nerf, I don't think anyone is capable of having such a powerful tool and denying it works otherwise. I doubt they will change it before the combat update and this spell won't survive that in its current state anyway, so I don't think you have much to worry about.

Tanatus · 07-29-2005, 11:19 PM

Jesus crist .... how many time need to be told

a) YES there are a ways to prevent mobs from casting lvl 50s spells, YES there are a ways to prevent mob spawn many adds

b) NO its NOT Withering Silence or Class Trait

c) There is NO WAY IN HELL you can stop INNATE abilities ... like AoE.

Azmode · 07-30-2005, 12:03 AM

Im still waiting for a way to stop BORXX Gaze AE. Man have tried everything in the book. We dropped him one time, we thought his Gaze was Cone.. next time... it was 360... so poop.

Tanatus · 07-30-2005, 01:58 AM

Az lol according to Nithrill you just dont know how to use Withering Silence roflmao...

Kylal · 08-10-2005, 06:25 AM

Don't worry about the difference between these once the changes on test hit the live servers. Both will hit epics now, though at a reduced effectiveness. AS is now just an upgrade to WS...

06-28-2005, 11:56 PM	#1
Mindtric Join Date: Nov 2004 Posts: 13	30 Withering Silence vs. 44 Agonizing Silence Why is it I always hear people talking about Withering Silence being most effective? Is Agonizing Silence not an upgrade to the same spell line? __________________

06-29-2005, 12:34 AM	#2
Pins General Join Date: Nov 2004 Posts: 3,040	Agonizing Silence has the following words on it:Does not Effect EpicsWithering Silence does not. That is why agonizing silence isn't an "upgrade" but it is an upgrade. __________________ Calaglin, Former Illusionist/Guild Leader of Dissolution on Nektulos Calaglin, Former Illusionist/Guild Leader of Confirmed on Unrest

07-23-2005, 12:45 PM	#10
Dystr General Join Date: Feb 2005 Posts: 339	i wouldnt take the stifle upgrade if all you are worried about is soloing. BMG will be more useful for the power regen, and will lessen down time. agonizing silence is a great spell. the only advantage of the stifle upgrade is that it cons higher than withering silence and can affect epics, which is irrelevent for soloing. __________________ ------------------------------------------- "The poison of which weaker natures perish strengthens the strong -- nor do they call it poison." --Nietzsche Dystrax Dysenchanted - 60 Coercer The Tribunal - Butcherblock Could I have a more appropriate last name?

07-25-2005, 08:37 PM	#12
Huskyla Join Date: Dec 2004 Posts: 42	Yes it does. Try it and see. Tanatus wrote: For crist sake for the last time Withering silence and its upgrade DO stick on epic, both spells DO NOT have lvl limitation, both spell DO NOT PREVENT SPELL CASTING OF EPIC MOBS - period.

07-28-2005, 08:44 AM	#20
nithrill Loremaster Join Date: Nov 2004 Posts: 124	Syan wrote: WS does not work.. Parsed it last night on Drayek. End of Story. Since you didn't in particular elaborate I am going to assume you saw Drayeks favorite DoT ticking away while you had him stifled (i.e. Incinerate). I just did Drayek tonight with my guild and I can't see better than my stifle is working just fine. And just to make it clear I'd like to reiterate two points: Coercer Stifles do NOT interrupt and because of that they will not stop a mob from finishing a cast that has already started Coercer Stifles do NOT remove or prevent DoTs that are already in effect __________________ ... I see you - Nithrill - 65 Coercer - Harlequin, The world of Runnyeye

06-29-2005, 03:17 AM	#3
ProteusTielaxi Loremaster Join Date: Nov 2004 Posts: 64	Shhhhhhh... That being said, agonizing silence is clearly superior, for all but raid mobs.

06-29-2005, 06:31 AM	#4
Chath Join Date: Feb 2005 Posts: 117	OK, so Agonizing doesn't affect epics? This game keeps getting sillier and sillier.

06-29-2005, 07:07 AM	#5
xev Join Date: Nov 2004 Posts: 62	I noticed the same thing a little over a week ago when I was looking over all my spells (that withering silence does not say "does not effect epic mobs"). So I booted up my parser and tried it out. From what I can tell, it shows the icon in the spell window as if it landed, but my parser says that it misses everytime. I think the spell is too low to land on epic mobs (the 50+ ones). I wish Agonizing would we usuable, since I use it alot vs other mobs, but than we would own Epic encounters =P. (actually, you can agonizing on all epic adds, just not the ^^^'s).

07-02-2005, 07:49 PM	#6
ProteusTielaxi Loremaster Join Date: Nov 2004 Posts: 64	I've had withering land on plenty of ^^^ mobs before, including Myrgroth, and Zalek. In both cases, it stiffled all but innate abilities.

07-02-2005, 09:16 PM	#7
Tanatus Loremaster Join Date: Nov 2004 Posts: 2,003	Lets discuss this on constructive note: I have tested it many time Withering Silence do not prevent next spells - Ice Commet (Archlich, Drayek) and Devastation (warlock version of Archlich and SoF Drakota). Frankly I did not checked other spells It is possible that withering silence work exactly as it written - limited casting ability of mob aka preven mob from casting certain lvl of spells and it be interesting to find out what lvl cap of spell that withering silence can actually stop. It not affect lvl 50 spell for sure. There is a good place to test it. Miragul Mengarie single group instance final mob... Its a warlock with normal warlock spell array and that mob tend to cast Devastation and Nil Distortion - what need to be checked if WS can stop ND. I know for sure that Agonizing Silence stop any spell casting completely - using this spell on Astrologer in CL and Archmagi in Ant - prevent both mobs from casting ANY spells

07-06-2005, 01:05 AM	#8
Azmode General Join Date: Nov 2004 Posts: 213	Yes Tan it certainly does not stop the Ice Comets and Devastatsions and any AE from a major dragon. Basically the things that I want to prevent, will still get off.

07-23-2005, 02:43 AM	#9
SpirituSanctu Loremaster Join Date: Nov 2004 Posts: 44	I am almost to lvl 40 and am considering taking the upgrade to withering silence (does added dmg with stifle) only because i solo ALOT at the moment. I know everyone screams to get mind gorge, and will prob respec that when the option becomes available shortly. My question is , anyone know how much damage the lvl 40 training option does? Is it dot dmg or direct dmg? My opinion at the moment is my main role is to stifle while soloing, so withering silence is ALWAYS on, the added dmg of this would help me greatly. Although, this will make agonizing silence kinda useless for me when i get to lvl 44. Not sure what to do at the moment.Any suggestions?

07-24-2005, 10:17 PM	#11
Tanatus Loremaster Join Date: Nov 2004 Posts: 2,003	For crist sake for the last time Withering silence and its upgrade DO stick on epic, both spells DO NOT have lvl limitation, both spell DO NOT PREVENT SPELL CASTING OF EPIC MOBS - period. Dont trust me? for crist sake for 1 time in your life go to Icebound or Shattered Stillness and place that spell on wizard version of Drayek or on Archlich Udalan - it will NOTHING but power drain. Archlich WILL cast BOTH Devastation AND Nil Distortion .. So what actually WS do (and its upgrade) - well as far as I can say its stop only next things from epic - Crushing Blow and Barrage

07-26-2005, 07:27 AM	#13
Tanatus Loremaster Join Date: Nov 2004 Posts: 2,003	I did try it every day for last month roflmao it NEVER stoped Devastation or Nil Distortion it NEVER stoped Ice Commet... I use my coercer exclusively for 2 zones - Shattered Stillness and Meeting of Mind (if we short on healers) - I have not just Withering Silence I have MASTER 1 of WS and nope it not work ...

07-26-2005, 10:09 AM	#14
Huskyla Join Date: Dec 2004 Posts: 42	Go into Spirits of the Lost and fight Venekor. Have your tank pull it to the wall, have a Templar or Inquiz debuff Venekor versus magic attacks, and cast your best debuffs before withering / liska's quietude. Watch what happens to Venekor's AE. You couldn't be more wrong on this spell. It isn't guaranteed to stick forever due to resists, but with hard work and good team work, it will do amazing things.

07-28-2005, 01:02 AM	#15
Sy Join Date: Nov 2004 Posts: 49	WS does not work.. Parsed it last night on Drayek. End of Story.

07-28-2005, 01:19 AM	#16
Huskyla Join Date: Dec 2004 Posts: 42	Unless Liska's is working and WS isn't, you all are totally missing it. Liska's works great.

07-28-2005, 01:25 AM	#17
Sy Join Date: Nov 2004 Posts: 49	Parsed that too.. doesnt work.

07-28-2005, 02:51 AM	#18
Tanatus Loremaster Join Date: Nov 2004 Posts: 2,003	Been there done that ... nope it not work on Vene lol you mess it up with assasins interupts (on Vene + Vara)

07-28-2005, 04:37 AM	#19
Huskyla Join Date: Dec 2004 Posts: 42	Believe what you guys want to.. but it works There was no assasin, no monk, no bruiser. I was the sole person on stiffle duties and it worked perfect. The only time Venekor AEd was the INSTANT my stiffle broke. Either you guys are just being obstinate, or afraid something is going to be nefed and don't want it made public. I'm done debating, for any curious coercers who see this, yes it works, try for yourself and you will see.

07-29-2005, 11:05 AM	#21
Tanatus Loremaster Join Date: Nov 2004 Posts: 2,003	Nithrill please do next simple step that show you that it do NOT work .. Cast WS/training skill on Drayek WIZARD version and chain cast it ... watch IC comming left and right ... lol

07-29-2005, 03:36 PM	#22
Keldo General Join Date: Nov 2004 Posts: 528	Drayek is always a wizard, he just doesn't always load IC. That being said, he never casts more than 1 spell when we raid him every single day, because our coercer casts WS on him. Arch Lich casts maybe 3 spells (other than his tap/stun which is innate) in 8-12 minute fights due to being stifled the entire time other than a few strings of multiple resists. Niscanith casts nothing but his innate knockback and melee. Some mobs in Spirits of the Lost fail to AE, the Spirit of Vox fails to AE, any pure melee mob cannot crushing blow or wild swing, the list goes on and on. If you are seeing anything other than this, you are letting it wear off or your parser is broken, plain and simple. You have to be denying it in fear of nerf, I don't think anyone is capable of having such a powerful tool and denying it works otherwise. I doubt they will change it before the combat update and this spell won't survive that in its current state anyway, so I don't think you have much to worry about. __________________ Katsuki [70 Swashbuckler] Katsu2 [70 Brigand] Blackburrow.Bane

07-29-2005, 11:19 PM	#23
Tanatus Loremaster Join Date: Nov 2004 Posts: 2,003	Jesus crist .... how many time need to be told a) YES there are a ways to prevent mobs from casting lvl 50s spells, YES there are a ways to prevent mob spawn many adds b) NO its NOT Withering Silence or Class Trait c) There is NO WAY IN HELL you can stop INNATE abilities ... like AoE.

07-30-2005, 12:03 AM	#24
Azmode General Join Date: Nov 2004 Posts: 213	Im still waiting for a way to stop BORXX Gaze AE. Man have tried everything in the book. We dropped him one time, we thought his Gaze was Cone.. next time... it was 360... so poop.

07-30-2005, 01:58 AM	#25
Tanatus Loremaster Join Date: Nov 2004 Posts: 2,003	Az lol according to Nithrill you just dont know how to use Withering Silence roflmao...

08-10-2005, 06:25 AM	#26
Kylal Join Date: Dec 2004 Posts: 22	Don't worry about the difference between these once the changes on test hit the live servers. Both will hit epics now, though at a reduced effectiveness. AS is now just an upgrade to WS...