Good news from today's test update

Zoren Northwood · 10-18-2005, 09:39 PM

Paladin changes:- Courageous Wrath, Implacable Wrath, and Unyielding Will are now classified as Combat Arts and provide a Strength bonus.

Traygar · 10-18-2005, 10:01 PM

Definitely seems like a great change. Main question would be have all of our skills been also changed to be effected by Str versus Int? From what I rememeber, most of our skills do divine damage versus melee and it seemed like the extra Int did up the dps. Would hate for them to make what seemed like a simply change that would actually reduce our dps. The extra power would be a huge improvement though.

Zoren Northwood · 10-18-2005, 10:12 PM

I'm assuming that the strength bonus isn't meant to replace the intelligence bonus, though I could be wrong.

NighthawkX · 10-18-2005, 10:14 PM

It would make str the defining factor for the damage bonus vs int the defining factor for the damage bonus. Now as a paladin your more likely to have way more strength than intelligence so this ups your damage on these. Now if for some miraculous reason you had more Intelligence than strength it would go down in damage but I would say it would be unlikely.

PS. The damage type divine vs trauma etc has no effect on if it uses Int or Str modifier. Its rather it is considered a CA or spell that makes the difference. You can have a CA that does divine damage and you can have a spell that does trauma damage. If its a CA the modifier is str, if its a spell modifier is int.

Message Edited by NighthawkX on 10-18-2005 11:19 AM

Traygar · 10-18-2005, 11:00 PM

That makes total sense. Is there an indicator on the skill that defines whethere it is a CA or a spell. Being almost lvl 59 you would think I would have seen this but never really checked tbh as dps has always been pretty good.

I guess if we are getting both int and str, the point and question is moot. If not, then would be interested what fraction of skills at 60 will be CAs versus Spells to see the net effect on the dps if they are giving str instead of int. Our pwr would most definitely be increased which is a very nice bonus. Not a class defining thing but one that would be a nice improvement.

A better change would be adding range slot and fixing sigil of heroism but would take what we can get.

Traygar

NighthawkX · 10-18-2005, 11:15 PM

Easiest way to tell is what tab it is in, there is a tab for Combat arts, and a tab for spells. Most classes only have one tab as everything they have is a CA or Spell. But crusaders and bards get both.

TooSwi · 10-19-2005, 12:12 AM

I hope that was a Type-O and they will fix Relentless Wrath (our lvl 60 offensive stance) as well.

Boli32 · 10-19-2005, 03:36 AM

Its both, so if you had +75 INT on your Offensive stance... you now have +75 INT, +75 STR. Best news we have seen in a LONG time.

agememn · 10-19-2005, 02:05 PM

Hell yeah - great news SMILEY

Krussh

Arkn · 10-19-2005, 04:46 PM

boli wrote:
Its both, so if you had +75 INT on your Offensive stance... you now have +75 INT, +75 STR.

Best news we have seen in a LONG time.

Was just about to post to ask that. If its both then thats great news. Now about the mitigation, power pool, ranged slot...

Another question; Mitigation is capped as a % of HP right? With us having the lowest HP of all the fighters that means that even if we reach the cap our mitigation will still be lower than every other tank? Has anyone discussed this before?

dKKeN · 10-19-2005, 04:46 PM

How much power do we get from 1 str point excactly?Also, does it change from different tiers?

Was just about to post to ask that. If its both then thats great news. Now about the mitigation, power pool, ranged slot...

Don't you think this solves some of our power issues?Dkken45 PaladinAB

Message Edited by dKKeN on 10-19-200505:48 AM

Message Edited by dKKeN on 10-19-2005 05:48 AM

Nurta · 10-19-2005, 05:11 PM

Wow this is actually some of the best news I've heard since LU13. Well that and that they are lowering raid mobs damage, maybe some of the old world stuff will be doable again without zerg fests.

/clap

Now please give me a ranged item. SMILEY

Belgor · 10-19-2005, 05:19 PM

if it is true that we get both str and int now at the same level we got int before, then that will probably solve most of my power-pool issues as well.

MeridianR · 10-19-2005, 05:53 PM

It would be nice, but I don't think they will do both Int and Str...unless they revamp all of the other fighter Offensive Stances. So my guess is that we will just have +str, which will be nice for our Combat Arts, but Refusal of (Faith/Grace) will take a hit.

NighthawkX · 10-19-2005, 06:18 PM

Arknen wrote:

boli wrote:
Its both, so if you had +75 INT on your Offensive stance... you now have +75 INT, +75 STR.

Best news we have seen in a LONG time.

Was just about to post to ask that. If its both then thats great news. Now about the mitigation, power pool, ranged slot...

Another question; Mitigation is capped as a % of HP right? With us having the lowest HP of all the fighters that means that even if we reach the cap our mitigation will still be lower than every other tank? Has anyone discussed this before?

This is news to me haven't heard this, only thing I remember seeing was about mitigation and avoidance being capped at 80% at your level. Never heard of it being based on your HP pool that just sounds odd

Nurta · 10-19-2005, 06:52 PM

MeridianR wrote:
It would be nice, but I don't think they will do both Int and Str...unless they revamp all of the other fighter Offensive Stances.

So my guess is that we will just have +str, which will be nice for our Combat Arts, but Refusal of (Faith/Grace) will take a hit.

Well that will certainly put a damper on things SMILEY

/sigh Anyone else feel like we're at a roulette wheel with the devs day to day? You just never know what you're going to get.

Sedi · 10-19-2005, 07:55 PM

Not really Nurta. Havent had to many large changes to Paladin's since LU13. If its just adding strength, it will boost our dps far more then Int. We should of had strenght from the begining, seeing that what, only 3 or 4 of our spells get boosted on intel?

Str= more power, more auto attack dps, more ca dps, much better then intel!

Queen Alexandria · 10-19-2005, 08:08 PM

I would rather have intelligence than strenght, but that's me personally. It better be both. If you ask why? Most of my damage comes from procs, in raids, my strenght is not an issue. Soloing? I would rather have my huge damage procs against undead get the boost.That's just a matter of preference though. Some people would rather have strenght.

Blacktemplar · 10-19-2005, 08:19 PM

Well that is good news, but I swear that the SoE President plays a Zerker, now if they could just change the warding casting time and or at the very least allow use to move and cast that one spell again.

Boli32 · 10-19-2005, 08:32 PM

I would rather have intelligence than strenght, but that's me personally. It better be both. If you ask why? Most of my damage comes from procs, in raids, my strenght is not an issue. Soloing? I would rather have my huge damage procs against undead get the boost. That's just a matter of preference though. Some people would rather have strenght.

When it comes down to it... we need ALL the stats, Since the Offensive stance is used more in SOLOing and OffTanking the Additional STR we recive will not only upp our autoattack damage but increase our powerpool by a good sized chunk. Implacable Wrath App2 for instance is: +47 STR +47 INT now if 1 point of STR is 2.5 power 47 STR = +117 power that's almost 2 additional heals/wards. Out of the two I liked the IDEA we buffed our Intelligence (Set us apart from the other fighters) but given the choice I woudl say +STR is the most useful.

Khar Ni · 10-19-2005, 09:01 PM

For those who wont be able to log in for a while. The update does just tack on the same amount of str as int to the spell. So now it does boost both int and str.

Arkn · 10-19-2005, 10:28 PM

NighthawkX wrote:

Arknen wrote:

Another question; Mitigation is capped as a % of HP right? With us having the lowest HP of all the fighters that means that even if we reach the cap our mitigation will still be lower than every other tank? Has anyone discussed this before?

This is news to me haven't heard this, only thing I remember seeing was about mitigation and avoidance being capped at 80% at your level. Never heard of it being based on your HP pool that just sounds odd

Right, 80% of your level is what? Mitigation on my UI shows as a straight number, which doesn't appear to go beyond the same % of my HP. I'll do some checking today but it would seem that way. That being said it may be the UI interpretation and presentation and not the underlying game mechanics as mitigating 80% of hits is very different from a mitigation of 3k for example.

However I have seen it at 2400ish when my HP are around 4k and 3kish when buffed to 5k, both around 60%. It just seemed a little strange (could have been coincidental) that it was the same % in both cases. I hope that I am wrong that it is a % of HP.

djhbeek · 10-19-2005, 10:44 PM

Arknen wrote:

NighthawkX wrote:

Arknen wrote:
Another question; Mitigation is capped as a % of HP right? With us having the lowest HP of all the fighters that means that even if we reach the cap our mitigation will still be lower than every other tank? Has anyone discussed this before?

This is news to me haven't heard this, only thing I remember seeing was about mitigation and avoidance being capped at 80% at your level. Never heard of it being based on your HP pool that just sounds odd

Right, 80% of your level is what? Mitigation on my UI shows as a straight number, which doesn't appear to go beyond the same % of my HP. I'll do some checking today but it would seem that way. That being said it may be the UI interpretation and presentation and not the underlying game mechanics as mitigating 80% of hits is very different from a mitigation of 3k for example.

However I have seen it at 2400ish when my HP are around 4k and 3kish when buffed to 5k, both around 60%. It just seemed a little strange (could have been coincidental) that it was the same % in both cases. I hope that I am wrong that it is a % of HP.

purely coincidence ... becuase max hp and mit are similar for alot of players, the rough amount that each gets buffed in group is also similar....

10-19-2005, 12:12 AM	#7
TooSwi Join Date: Nov 2004 Posts: 60	I hope that was a Type-O and they will fix Relentless Wrath (our lvl 60 offensive stance) as well. __________________ Skizzrik 60 Paladin Ne Plus Ultra

10-19-2005, 02:05 PM	#9
agememn General Join Date: Dec 2004 Posts: 44	Hell yeah - great news Krussh

10-19-2005, 04:46 PM	#10
Arkn Join Date: Nov 2004 Posts: 27	boli wrote: Its both, so if you had +75 INT on your Offensive stance... you now have +75 INT, +75 STR. Best news we have seen in a LONG time. Was just about to post to ask that. If its both then thats great news. Now about the mitigation, power pool, ranged slot... Another question; Mitigation is capped as a % of HP right? With us having the lowest HP of all the fighters that means that even if we reach the cap our mitigation will still be lower than every other tank? Has anyone discussed this before?

10-19-2005, 05:53 PM	#14
MeridianR Loremaster Join Date: Nov 2004 Posts: 1,402	It would be nice, but I don't think they will do both Int and Str...unless they revamp all of the other fighter Offensive Stances. So my guess is that we will just have +str, which will be nice for our Combat Arts, but Refusal of (Faith/Grace) will take a hit. __________________ Meridian - L70 Brigand (Vendetta)

10-19-2005, 06:18 PM	#15
NighthawkX Loremaster Join Date: Dec 2004 Posts: 98	Arknen wrote: boli wrote: Its both, so if you had +75 INT on your Offensive stance... you now have +75 INT, +75 STR. Best news we have seen in a LONG time. Was just about to post to ask that. If its both then thats great news. Now about the mitigation, power pool, ranged slot... Another question; Mitigation is capped as a % of HP right? With us having the lowest HP of all the fighters that means that even if we reach the cap our mitigation will still be lower than every other tank? Has anyone discussed this before? This is news to me haven't heard this, only thing I remember seeing was about mitigation and avoidance being capped at 80% at your level. Never heard of it being based on your HP pool that just sounds odd

10-18-2005, 09:39 PM	#1
Zoren Northwood Loremaster Join Date: Nov 2004 Posts: 120	Paladin changes:- Courageous Wrath, Implacable Wrath, and Unyielding Will are now classified as Combat Arts and provide a Strength bonus.

10-18-2005, 10:01 PM	#2
Traygar Loremaster Join Date: Nov 2004 Posts: 21	Definitely seems like a great change. Main question would be have all of our skills been also changed to be effected by Str versus Int? From what I rememeber, most of our skills do divine damage versus melee and it seemed like the extra Int did up the dps. Would hate for them to make what seemed like a simply change that would actually reduce our dps. The extra power would be a huge improvement though.

10-18-2005, 10:12 PM	#3
Zoren Northwood Loremaster Join Date: Nov 2004 Posts: 120	I'm assuming that the strength bonus isn't meant to replace the intelligence bonus, though I could be wrong.

10-18-2005, 10:14 PM	#4
NighthawkX Loremaster Join Date: Dec 2004 Posts: 98	It would make str the defining factor for the damage bonus vs int the defining factor for the damage bonus. Now as a paladin your more likely to have way more strength than intelligence so this ups your damage on these. Now if for some miraculous reason you had more Intelligence than strength it would go down in damage but I would say it would be unlikely. PS. The damage type divine vs trauma etc has no effect on if it uses Int or Str modifier. Its rather it is considered a CA or spell that makes the difference. You can have a CA that does divine damage and you can have a spell that does trauma damage. If its a CA the modifier is str, if its a spell modifier is int. Message Edited by NighthawkX on 10-18-2005 11:19 AM

10-18-2005, 11:00 PM	#5
Traygar Loremaster Join Date: Nov 2004 Posts: 21	That makes total sense. Is there an indicator on the skill that defines whethere it is a CA or a spell. Being almost lvl 59 you would think I would have seen this but never really checked tbh as dps has always been pretty good. I guess if we are getting both int and str, the point and question is moot. If not, then would be interested what fraction of skills at 60 will be CAs versus Spells to see the net effect on the dps if they are giving str instead of int. Our pwr would most definitely be increased which is a very nice bonus. Not a class defining thing but one that would be a nice improvement. A better change would be adding range slot and fixing sigil of heroism but would take what we can get. Traygar

10-18-2005, 11:15 PM	#6
NighthawkX Loremaster Join Date: Dec 2004 Posts: 98	Easiest way to tell is what tab it is in, there is a tab for Combat arts, and a tab for spells. Most classes only have one tab as everything they have is a CA or Spell. But crusaders and bards get both.

10-19-2005, 03:36 AM	#8
Boli32 Loremaster Join Date: Nov 2004 Posts: 1,425	Its both, so if you had +75 INT on your Offensive stance... you now have +75 INT, +75 STR. Best news we have seen in a LONG time.

10-19-2005, 04:46 PM	#11
dKKeN Loremaster Join Date: Dec 2004 Posts: 39	How much power do we get from 1 str point excactly?Also, does it change from different tiers? Was just about to post to ask that. If its both then thats great news. Now about the mitigation, power pool, ranged slot... Don't you think this solves some of our power issues?Dkken45 PaladinAB Message Edited by dKKeN on 10-19-200505:48 AM Message Edited by dKKeN on 10-19-2005 05:48 AM

10-19-2005, 05:11 PM	#12
Nurta Loremaster Join Date: Nov 2004 Location: Living in York, PA Posts: 185	Wow this is actually some of the best news I've heard since LU13. Well that and that they are lowering raid mobs damage, maybe some of the old world stuff will be doable again without zerg fests. /clap Now please give me a ranged item.

10-19-2005, 05:19 PM	#13
Belgor Join Date: Nov 2004 Posts: 180	if it is true that we get both str and int now at the same level we got int before, then that will probably solve most of my power-pool issues as well.

10-19-2005, 06:52 PM	#16
Nurta Loremaster Join Date: Nov 2004 Location: Living in York, PA Posts: 185	MeridianR wrote: It would be nice, but I don't think they will do both Int and Str...unless they revamp all of the other fighter Offensive Stances. So my guess is that we will just have +str, which will be nice for our Combat Arts, but Refusal of (Faith/Grace) will take a hit. Well that will certainly put a damper on things /sigh Anyone else feel like we're at a roulette wheel with the devs day to day? You just never know what you're going to get.

10-19-2005, 07:55 PM	#17
Sedi General Join Date: Jan 2005 Posts: 53	Not really Nurta. Havent had to many large changes to Paladin's since LU13. If its just adding strength, it will boost our dps far more then Int. We should of had strenght from the begining, seeing that what, only 3 or 4 of our spells get boosted on intel? Str= more power, more auto attack dps, more ca dps, much better then intel!

10-19-2005, 08:08 PM	#18
Queen Alexandria Loremaster Join Date: Nov 2004 Posts: 221	I would rather have intelligence than strenght, but that's me personally. It better be both. If you ask why? Most of my damage comes from procs, in raids, my strenght is not an issue. Soloing? I would rather have my huge damage procs against undead get the boost.That's just a matter of preference though. Some people would rather have strenght. __________________

10-19-2005, 08:19 PM	#19
Blacktemplar Join Date: Nov 2004 Posts: 5	Well that is good news, but I swear that the SoE President plays a Zerker, now if they could just change the warding casting time and or at the very least allow use to move and cast that one spell again.

10-19-2005, 08:32 PM	#20
Boli32 Loremaster Join Date: Nov 2004 Posts: 1,425	I would rather have intelligence than strenght, but that's me personally. It better be both. If you ask why? Most of my damage comes from procs, in raids, my strenght is not an issue. Soloing? I would rather have my huge damage procs against undead get the boost. That's just a matter of preference though. Some people would rather have strenght. When it comes down to it... we need ALL the stats, Since the Offensive stance is used more in SOLOing and OffTanking the Additional STR we recive will not only upp our autoattack damage but increase our powerpool by a good sized chunk. Implacable Wrath App2 for instance is: +47 STR +47 INT now if 1 point of STR is 2.5 power 47 STR = +117 power that's almost 2 additional heals/wards. Out of the two I liked the IDEA we buffed our Intelligence (Set us apart from the other fighters) but given the choice I woudl say +STR is the most useful.

10-19-2005, 09:01 PM	#21
Khar Ni Join Date: Jan 2005 Posts: 9	For those who wont be able to log in for a while. The update does just tack on the same amount of str as int to the spell. So now it does boost both int and str.

10-19-2005, 10:28 PM	#22
Arkn Join Date: Nov 2004 Posts: 27	NighthawkX wrote: Arknen wrote: Another question; Mitigation is capped as a % of HP right? With us having the lowest HP of all the fighters that means that even if we reach the cap our mitigation will still be lower than every other tank? Has anyone discussed this before? This is news to me haven't heard this, only thing I remember seeing was about mitigation and avoidance being capped at 80% at your level. Never heard of it being based on your HP pool that just sounds odd Right, 80% of your level is what? Mitigation on my UI shows as a straight number, which doesn't appear to go beyond the same % of my HP. I'll do some checking today but it would seem that way. That being said it may be the UI interpretation and presentation and not the underlying game mechanics as mitigating 80% of hits is very different from a mitigation of 3k for example. However I have seen it at 2400ish when my HP are around 4k and 3kish when buffed to 5k, both around 60%. It just seemed a little strange (could have been coincidental) that it was the same % in both cases. I hope that I am wrong that it is a % of HP.

10-19-2005, 10:44 PM	#23
djhbeek Loremaster Join Date: Nov 2004 Posts: 679	Arknen wrote: NighthawkX wrote: Arknen wrote: Another question; Mitigation is capped as a % of HP right? With us having the lowest HP of all the fighters that means that even if we reach the cap our mitigation will still be lower than every other tank? Has anyone discussed this before? This is news to me haven't heard this, only thing I remember seeing was about mitigation and avoidance being capped at 80% at your level. Never heard of it being based on your HP pool that just sounds odd Right, 80% of your level is what? Mitigation on my UI shows as a straight number, which doesn't appear to go beyond the same % of my HP. I'll do some checking today but it would seem that way. That being said it may be the UI interpretation and presentation and not the underlying game mechanics as mitigating 80% of hits is very different from a mitigation of 3k for example. However I have seen it at 2400ish when my HP are around 4k and 3kish when buffed to 5k, both around 60%. It just seemed a little strange (could have been coincidental) that it was the same % in both cases. I hope that I am wrong that it is a % of HP. purely coincidence ... becuase max hp and mit are similar for alot of players, the rough amount that each gets buffed in group is also similar.... __________________ Who is General Failure and why is he reading my hard disk?