Str line AA

[Grimskay]

I have noticed on these forums nobody every suggests the last of the Str line, which is the 10% reduction in timers per point. Is this a bad choice? I am currently INT4-4-4 Str 4-4-2 and not sure what to do. I've seen alot of good suggestions. Grimskayle

[AziBam]

There are a few people around who have taken the end line in STR.  Can't recall names but I've seen them talk about in the various AA threads.  Just so you understand though...it isn't 10% per point.  The final ability of any line for any class costs 8 points to get and is not upgraded.  In other words, you don't put points into it one at a time but have to wait to put all 8 in at once either by saving or doing a respec.  So, all you will ever get is a one shot 10% reduction when you dump 8 points into that ability.  My personal view is there just isn't enough bang for the buck on this one.  For most of our CAs 10% only amounts to a few seconds.  Death March loses 18 seconds on a three minute timer?  Bleh.  Still takes 13.5 mins for recast on HT?  Again, bleh.  I just don't see the value for the most part.  

[Grimskay]

Ohhhhh I see now. I thought it was 10% everytime. Thats kinda lame. I can see where putting those points into something else would be betterGrimskayle

[Nicholai24]

If you think it's lame, you're being foolish. 10% Cast Times / Recovery Times equates to more available uses of AEs and spells, quicker recovery on all of our taunts ( even a few seconds shaved off of each is probably more of a boon than the passive hate gain, and they're both in the same line ), and more frequent uses of Death March, Tap Veins, etc., as well as even faster casting spells when DM's spellhaste is active.With M1 Death March, Strength Mastery, and Doomsworn Mace, I can get up to 86% spellhaste self-buffed. That's significant.And 1.5 minutes sheered off Rescue and HT is significant, too.

[Xanoth]

the STR end AA ability must be the ONLY case of inappropriate use of "recovery" which is NOT the same as recast...the main reason i have avoided STR so long was because i thought it was just a lame 10% spell haste. as recovery reduction of 10% would still only turn a 0.5s recovery time to a 0.4%.guess i should upload some pics from illusionist AA's, the final monk ring and the STR AA to help show what im saying.

[Xanoth]

ok here is what i can get from my SK...edit:Chronomotion reducces reovery, just like it says, i think at rank 8 you can get it down to 0.3s, although i've yet to respec into AGI and i dont think i'll b putting that many points there... but anyway. it says recovery and means recovery.ring of four winds says reuse and means recast, as does fearless moral.so when i looked at the STR end ability and it said recovery, i assumed it ment recovery... are you definatly and honestly saying that it means recast?

Message Edited by Xanoth on 09-25-2006 12:11 PM

[Beldin_]

I respeced to Int 4,4,8 .. Str 4/4/4/8 .. Sta 4,5 when i finished my 50 AA-points. Before i had more in the STA line, but i was a little disappointed about the +life. The last point in STR is simply at least 10% more DPS because you don't only cast faster .. you can also use the spells more often,for example death march 180sec - 10% = 162sec . The only negative effekt .. you'll burn down even more mana :smileysad:

[AziBam]

Shalla, have you seen the 10% boost?  I'd like to know as I wouldn't have thought it would add up that high since you have to give up something else like melee crits to get to the end of the STR tree.  My thought has always been that, as you said, it would burn more power which is always an issue when MT (for all tanks that I see) and losing the other crits or possibly losing haste you would end up at roughly the same dps.  How long have you had your current AA spec and are you happier with it?  My plan has been Int 4/4/8 was going to use the rest to max melee crits and haste.  (10 points left to go...too many alts.)     

[Tyrani]

My very first AA spec was INT 4-4-8, STA 4-4-8, WIS 4-4-8....dps was pretty decent.  I got some gear/spell upgrades and respec'd to STR 4-4-5-4-8, INT 8-8-8 and my dps got better (hard to tell whether it was gear/spells or the AA spec).  What I'm going to try and do is take my current spec and do some fairly standard tests...then respec to STR 4-4-8, STA 4-4-8, INT 4-4-8 and do those same tests.

I'm guessing that the dps will be very similar in both builds, melee crits might edge out on single targets, but end of STR line might edge out on groups is my theory right now.

Either way, I am enjoying the STR end ability....Tap Veins, Mana Sieve, HT, FD, Evac....everything is a lot nicer when it's up 10% sooner.

[Beldin_]

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Dkel wrote:

Shalla, have you seen the 10% boost?  I'd like to know as I wouldn't have thought it would add up that high since you have to give up something else like melee crits to get to the end of the STR tree.  My thought has always been that, as you said, it would burn more power which is always an issue when MT (for all tanks that I see) and losing the other crits or possibly losing haste you would end up at roughly the same dps.  How long have you had your current AA spec and are you happier with it?  My plan has been Int 4/4/8 was going to use the rest to max melee crits and haste.  (10 points left to go...too many alts.)     

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I think melee crits are highly overrated.

Ok .. so  100% melee crit would be 35%, but how much do you get .. maybe 20% ? That would be 7% .. but only if you melee 100% of the time. So since wo normally make maybe 30% meleebased damage, that would be a total of 2,1% more dps :smileysurprised:

 

[Nicholai24]

Yes, it's truly a 10% reduction in the reavailability of all spells. Recast timers are reduced, not the cooldown inbetween spells.

[Hopefulne]

crits of any type are important since a crit uses the maximium damage value as it's base.  I believe a crit is the max value + 10% .  So Frostwrath  ( aITEM -1556817848 -560489460:Frostwrath/a  )  would hit for about 102 damage on a crit but would still hit for 31 - 93 on a regular non-criting swing.  This makes it difficult to calculate how much a crit adds to dps since it varies depending on your weapon ( blackscale maul - aITEM -867018884 -1807896261:Blackscale Maul/a - would never crit for less than 561 and would add more to your dps on crits than a weapon with a lower max damage value) or your spell.

[Beldin_]

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Hopefulness wrote:

crits of any type are important since a crit uses the maximium damage value as it's base.  I believe a crit is the max value + 10% .  So Frostwrath  ( aITEM -1556817848 -560489460:Frostwrath/a  )  would hit for about 102 damage on a crit but would still hit for 31 - 93 on a regular non-criting swing.  This makes it difficult to calculate how much a crit adds to dps since it varies depending on your weapon ( blackscale maul - aITEM -867018884 -1807896261:Blackscale Maul/a - would never crit for less than 561 and would add more to your dps on crits than a weapon with a lower max damage value) or your spell.

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Crit is +30 or 35% not 100% shure about that. But .. at least spells crit with random numbers, i always see the same number for tap veines because it has no min-max, but i constantly see numbers from 1500-2500 or whatever when Abominable Wrath crits. And i don't believe that it works like you mentioned with melee. The only thing that my be possible is that the 35% is calculated on max damage so that a weapon with 1-100 crits from 36-135.

[Tyrani]

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Beldin_ wrote:

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Hopefulness wrote:

crits of any type are important since a crit uses the maximium damage value as it's base.  I believe a crit is the max value + 10% .  So Frostwrath  ( aITEM -1556817848 -560489460:Frostwrath/a  )  would hit for about 102 damage on a crit but would still hit for 31 - 93 on a regular non-criting swing.  This makes it difficult to calculate how much a crit adds to dps since it varies depending on your weapon ( blackscale maul - aITEM -867018884 -1807896261:Blackscale Maul/a - would never crit for less than 561 and would add more to your dps on crits than a weapon with a lower max damage value) or your spell.

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Crit is +30 or 35% not 100% shure about that. But .. at least spells crit with random numbers, i always see the same number for tap veines because it has no min-max, but i constantly see numbers from 1500-2500 or whatever when Abominable Wrath crits. And i don't believe that it works like you mentioned with melee. The only thing that my be possible is that the 35% is calculated on max damage so that a weapon with 1-100 crits from 36-135.

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I think on melee crits it will always hit at least +1 max damage, so if you happen to be unlucky on a roll and hit the very low end of melee, but crit, it will do +1 max damage, however, if you hit somewhere in the middle, it should be +30% of that hit.