Rerolled a Character since they nerfed my Berserker. Input on Bruiser please?

[caine71]

I'm planning on becoming a Bruiser or A Shadow Knight. Any input on pros and cons to both would be greatly appreciated. Here are my thoughts so far, as far as both classes go. By the way I'm playing a female Dark Elf.

 

Good points-

 

Bruiser-

 

1. As stated by Moorgard Bruiser and Monk are supposed to have higher DPS the my old zerker.

 

2. Evil Monk does seem appealing.

 

3. New pink armor might actually look good on a female char? Screen shots appreciated.

 

Shadow Knight-

 

1. Horse/Mount -nuff said

 

2. I'm evil, Shadow Knights with new Dark Armor in coming Adventure Pack would look cool, no?

 

3. Other than that, not sure about my reasons for Knight, they are mainly based on flavor and concept for character.

 

Bad Points-

 

Bruiser-

 

1. May get nerfed due to the fact they admitted they have higher DPS than Zerker.

 

2. No swords, kinda of prefer swords.

 

Shadow Knight-

 

1. Not sure what role they serve, is it same as Paldin?

 

2. Heard there was a problem with elves appearing to float above stteds. Is this true with Dark Elf females as well?

 

I really appreciate any info you guys can give me, thanks in advance.

 

Message Edited by caine71 on 01-11-2005 10:09 AM

[Gestalt79]

My bruiser just hit 20, so I don't have much imput on them, though I'll say I could take on stuff that woulda completely destroyed me at 19 (with the same level difference).  At 19, a group mob 16^^ was extremely tough and less than a 50/50 fight for me.  15 groups were easy.  When I hit 20, both 15/16 greyed on me, so lowest exp are now 17s.  My first fight I took on 2 mobs, group 17 ^.  Partway through killing first creature, I got attacked from behind by a 17^^.  Once he was in front of me as well, I had no problem finishing them all, except I ran outta power cause I wasn't expecting the add.   That impressed me, but for grouping and tanking tougher stuff as a bruiser, dunno yet.

 

I would caution you, right now bruisers/monk are looking pretty good, especially in the 30+ game according to many that have achieved that level.  They might be near the top of list for balancing next.  Such is the nature of MMO's, they will frequently balance top dogs down a notch or two, and occassionally balance weaklings up to par, or sometimes vault em to the top.

 

As for bruiser DPS, they are supposed to be the overall highest DPS of all tank types, followed by monk and then Berzerker.  I doubt we'll get nerfed because we beat zerker damage.  We may get tuned down cause other damage classes have trouble sustaining an equal damage to us it seems.  I'd rather them balance up the other classes who need it.  That's the prefered action imo.

[Gronker]

Bruisers aren't crybabies (reference to zerker nerf whine).  They aren't evil monks, they are bruisers.  Monks are goodie goodie bruiser wannabes.  Sounds more like you are Qeynos Pally material from your analysis.

 

 

[kakar]

if bruisers dmg get nerfed then they are a useless class.  if zerkers did more dmg then why not play a zerker in the first place because they get like 500more ac than a bruiser does since they can wear heavy armor.  u want highest dmg and ac? where does that leave a bruiser.  lower dmg and the poorest ac for a warrior type.  that would just suck and i would quit if they did that

[pb]

>>>if bruisers dmg get nerfed then they are a useless class.

 

apart from the whole tanking and agro management we can do. 

 

 

as for the remark about bruisers being evil monks, pah.  We are bruisers, we are dirty fighters.      do not even sully our name with the monks.

[caine71]

What? Who pi&&ed in your cereal? I stated that I'm merely fed up with my class being nerfed to death and wanted some pros and cons about Bruiser and I get attacked? If your any indication of what bruiser are like, maybe you answered my question. So much for helpful information, sorry if I offended anyone by my analogies, they wern't meant as criticism. Why woould I criticize a class I'm considering? I merley stated the pros and cons that I saw from observing some posts on here, in paticular the new armor. Anyways, any more information would be helpful. Thanks.

 

P.S. Thanks Gesalt for your helpful response.

Message Edited by caine71 on 01-11-2005 02:37 PM

[ganjookie]

Caine there is alot of info on the bruisers boards here, including pics of armour and such. You should invest some time into the other pages on this board. Also if you think your being " nerfed to death" after the game being out for less then a quarter of a year, you may want to styick with it and not try a flavor of the month sub-lass, which it seems we are turning into now post level 30Your last response makes no sense,"If your any indication of what bruiser are like, maybe you answered my question."How does one persons response affect a character kit defined by SOE?check out, they may have more info for you toohttp://www.brawlers-pit.com/

[Odissi]

Wow, what a pack of hypocrites.

[ganjookie]

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Odissius wrote:

Wow, what a pack of hypocrites.

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how so?

[Joxer]

Hello, my name is (insert name),

I am looking for a new "Flavor of the Month" class that can roxxor your soxxors, and prolly get nerfed in 2 to 3 months again, which class will it be, do you guys know?

 

/sarcasm

[caine71]

Caine there is alot of info on the bruisers boards here, including pics of armour and such. You should invest some time into the other pages on this board. Also if you think your being " nerfed to death" after the game being out for less then a quarter of a year, you may want to styick with it and not try a flavor of the month sub-lass, which it seems we are turning into now post level 30

 

Why would I want to continue playing a class, that is no longer fun to play. Sorry, but I have a life and can't waste time playing a class that SOE screwed up. I'm not looking for the flavor of the month, I'm looking for fun, is that so much to ask?

Your last response makes no sense,

"If your any indication of what bruiser are like, maybe you answered my question."

How does one persons response affect a character kit defined by SOE?

 

It doesn't, but it does affect my level of fun while playing. I don't want to be a class that attacks people for asking questions about their class, which is what is what most of the responses have been.

check out, they may have more info for you too
http://www.brawlers-pit.com/

[Reol]

I have a 25 zerker and a 27 bruiser, as I saw the nerfing coming for the berserkers, The bruiser is very much a damage dealer that can solo single mobs with no arrows up all day long with little problem, the difference really being that a bruiser AVOIDS damage, and we do avoid alot of it. I haven't parsed any numbers. However comparing both of my characters at lvl 25 and what mobs they could solo. The zerker by far takes more damage, however they ABSORB the damage.

 

As far as Zerkers go, yeah they used to do more damage, however they have until later game nerfed the crap out of the ability to zerk more than a few times per fight, turned the dps rate of zerkers down massively.

 

The bruiser IMO does suffer abit till i would say 25+ hell even 30+ as our dual wield isn't nothing to write home about, however later in game I think this class has mucho potential. So much so that I figure it will only be a month or two before Guardians demand the nerfing of the bruiser, to put there insecure little brains at ease.

 

The bruiser though is tons of fun to play, there are very few bruisers around, and even though we have really really light red AQ armor, and we get Poopskin ability at 40, we get compensated cuz we massively beat the crap out of anything that attacks us.

Message Edited by Reolas on 01-12-2005 08:18 AM

[caine71]

Thank you for th einfo, very helpful.

[ethan]

Hello Caine

 

 

Im currently lvl 35 Bruiser number 2 on Tox server and I regularly group with my guild buddy lvl 38 Zerker. Let me answer some of your questions. I'm not claiming im an expert on my class but base what I have seen or tested, I hope you can find this useful.

 

Tank role:

 

Bruisers can do it, but it consumes a lot of power and need combination of good group to keep up powers and this include any chanter and shaman and good homemade drinks. DPS while tanking you can forget about it, most of mob at higher lvl will parry/block very well. Bruiser also gain curtain train skills which include avoid hits/riposte etc. If you prefer to be a main tank and want to tank very well I suggest you to pick defensive skill and try to aqquire agility items while you at it and str will be secondary.

 

DPS role:

 

I had to say that sub 30, bruisers dps are OK but once you pass lvl 30 you get some nice skill and make sure try to get all adept 1 atleast if you can. I'm very happy with my DPS eventhough my assasin buddy out dmg me but other than that im still very happy. Your str will be your primary, and make sure you always pick STR if you planing to be dmg dealer. You can still tank ok, but lack of agi will hurts you a bit but its not too bad. One thing that i dont understand is why scout class got medium armour and they had more AC than us (unbuffed), but our AC can go up higher which rely on selfbuff and other class and again, tanking can be done but it require a lot of combinations.

 

Now let me answer about Zerker:

 

I dont believe that Zerker should or able to out dmg Bruisers class in the 1st place because of they do, there is no point of playing bruiser after all. Zerker had access to very nice armour and obviously nicer AC. Zerker can tank very well and dont have to try as hard as we do. Zerker got some very nice group buff which increase group atk and AC. Again, Holding agro is no problem for Zerker.

 

 

Hope it helps, and i think noway that our dmgs will be nerf you can trust me on that one. Any high lvl Bruiser will agreed w/ me as well.

[fur]

Well one thing that you gotto know is the coming from the heavy armor side of the warrior arch your first impression will be, j h c green mobs kick my [Removed for Content]!

 

Reason i say that is cause i have a berserk alt, bruisers pre 30 are imo the weakest tank in the game (the tanking part never catch up btw however dps will=), first of all you cant just hit aoe taunt and then have mobs wail on ya in a 360 degree circle while you run and get coffe anymore, deflection doesnt work if the mobs are outside your frontal 180 degree radius, so if ya get mobs on yer flanks / back your going down, fast. 2nd and this was my biggest grief is the fact that after shout you have no real aoe taunt that you can safely use in dungeuns, meaning youll loose aggro ..ALOT , and no not against single 2 arrow mobs but against those 3+ encounters. So you will have to multitask like crazy , using your group buff , mezz and plain damage to maintain control which drains your mana like its noones business.

 

 3rd, gone are the days when you had millions (slightly exxagerated but hey=) of weapons to choose from every time you hit that next 5 level mark, bruisers can use staffs , fist weapons and maces thats it (we can use hammers as well but cant say ive seen alot of good hammer weaps as they are 2h or 1h only no dw hammers that i know off). While there are a few good weapons to be found you will find yourself searching high and low for weapons and the same goes for armor, while there are good light armor drops they are far and few between , so alot of your armor will be playercrafted unless your flithy rich or just plain lucky. On a side note , as we only have 2 out of 3 damage types ( no pierce weaps available that i know off) we have a distinct disadvantage against melee resistant mobs, like for instance the watcher lizard in obelisk of lost souls who is slash and blunt immune meaning only piercing weaps can damage it , so against those kind of mobs your SOL! And last, if you wanna play bruiser cause you are used to tanking then choose something else, seriously. With my zerk i was an obvious choice for a tank , i knew this and other players knew this. So when i flipped on that lfg switch, my first bruiser levels waiting for my first tell, i waited for a long time , in fact the only tells i got where to fill dps slots so dont expect to be picked before those guardians/zerks/sk's/pals lfg in re with ya, youll be invited for dps not tankin.

 

Ok thats the downsides, the good sides are that we do very solid damage, and our self only buffs like boast,brawl etc makes us pure dps when we want to. As opposite to monks who get very good agi/defence self and group buffs and targettable mend (heal). So if you still want to actually tank, go monk if you on the other hand dont care too much about the tanking and are fully satisfied with beeing backupsinger but with lethal dps then hop on the boat to freeport, Overseer Snug will have an apartment ready.

[Odissi]

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ethan76 wrote:

Hello Caine

 

 

Im currently lvl 35 Bruiser number 2 on Tox server and I regularly group with my guild buddy lvl 38 Zerker. Let me answer some of your questions. I'm not claiming im an expert on my class but base what I have seen or tested, I hope you can find this useful.

 

Tank role:

 

Bruisers can do it, but it consumes a lot of power and need combination of good group to keep up powers and this include any chanter and shaman and good homemade drinks. DPS while tanking you can forget about it, most of mob at higher lvl will parry/block very well. Bruiser also gain curtain train skills which include avoid hits/riposte etc. If you prefer to be a main tank and want to tank very well I suggest you to pick defensive skill and try to aqquire agility items while you at it and str will be secondary.

 

DPS role:

 

I had to say that sub 30, bruisers dps are OK but once you pass lvl 30 you get some nice skill and make sure try to get all adept 1 atleast if you can. I'm very happy with my DPS eventhough my assasin buddy out dmg me but other than that im still very happy. Your str will be your primary, and make sure you always pick STR if you planing to be dmg dealer. You can still tank ok, but lack of agi will hurts you a bit but its not too bad. One thing that i dont understand is why scout class got medium armour and they had more AC than us (unbuffed), but our AC can go up higher which rely on selfbuff and other class and again, tanking can be done but it require a lot of combinations.

 

Now let me answer about Zerker:

 

I dont believe that Zerker should or able to out dmg Bruisers class in the 1st place because of they do, there is no point of playing bruiser after all. Zerker had access to very nice armour and obviously nicer AC. Zerker can tank very well and dont have to try as hard as we do. Zerker got some very nice group buff which increase group atk and AC. Again, Holding agro is no problem for Zerker.

 

 

Hope it helps, and i think noway that our dmgs will be nerf you can trust me on that one. Any high lvl Bruiser will agreed w/ me as well.

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Wrong, Berserkers should be the most damaging fighter class because we take SO MUCH damage, yet we do not have the damage output to balance this. If you had a berserker you would know, but it's obvious that you don't so you have no room to comment. The whole point of berserkers is to do massive damage while not caring about self-preservation.

[D]

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Odissius wrote:

 

The whole point of berserkers is to do massive damage while not caring about self-preservation.

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If that's the case then throw on some leather armor like us and see how well you tank compared to a bruiser. Heck, I'll tank you can DD - I don't mind.

 

Why have the the bruiser boards become a repository for disgruntled zerkers looking for the next overpowered fighter class that they can whine about.....you're not going to find that here.

[Odissi]

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Dvt wrote:

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Odissius wrote:

 

The whole point of berserkers is to do massive damage while not caring about self-preservation.

---

If that's the case then throw on some leather armor like us and see how well you tank compared to a bruiser. Heck, I'll tank you can DD - I don't mind.

 

Why have the the bruiser boards become a repository for disgruntled zerkers looking for the next overpowered fighter class that they can whine about.....you're not going to find that here.

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Throw any armor on us, we don't care!

[ethan]

"Wrong, Berserkers should be the most damaging fighter class because we take SO MUCH damage, yet we do not have the damage output to balance this. If you had a berserker you would know, but it's obvious that you don't so you have no room to comment. The whole point of berserkers is to do massive damage while not caring about self-preservation"You should have the most dmgs class because you take SO MUCH dmgs? ROFL that is the funniest thing i ever heard. Any one that dont even play your class will agree w/ me. Concept of anygame is you gain some you lose some, in this case you got win/win situation.

[Odissi]

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ethan76 wrote:
"Wrong, Berserkers should be the most damaging fighter class because we take SO MUCH damage, yet we do not have the damage output to balance this. If you had a berserker you would know, but it's obvious that you don't so you have no room to comment. The whole point of berserkers is to do massive damage while not caring about self-preservation"






You should have the most dmgs class because you take SO MUCH dmgs? ROFL that is the funniest thing i ever heard. Any one that dont even play your class will agree w/ me. Concept of anygame is you gain some you lose some, in this case you got win/win situation.

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I think you are not understanding what I am saying. This is a lose-lose situation at the moment. Berserkers take so much damage because of LOW DAMAGE MITIGATION. To make up for this we should have the highest damage out there out of all melee classes, and also have medium or light armor

[fur]

First of all it is pretty obvious you dont play a bruiser cause then you wouldnt say zerks have the lowest damage mitigation, thats reserved for classes usin light or very light armor, BRUISERS and MONKS are supposed to be kings of warrior arch dps as stated by soe, berserks are heavy armor tanks that come slightly ahead of guardians, zerks are the flip side of the coin from guardians ie you are offensive guardians, we bruisers are the offensive monks by comparison just as shadow knights are offensive paladins (heh), thats it . Thats how the warrior archs work and its pretty obvious even if you just bought the game.

[justfr]

Bruiser suck..we are weak and useless..and we smell...alot.Sk's are awesome, they can do stuff with swords and they have a horse!Everyone is becoming a bruiser...we are gonna get nerfed.

[caine71]

You guys, I'd like to thank you for all your input. I decided to go with SK, it seems to suit my style better at the moment.

[Icr]

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caine71 wrote:

You guys, I'd like to thank you for all your input. I decided to go with SK, it seems to suit my style better at the moment.

---

Ewww hehe, good luck, sorry you didnt find bruisers to you likeing. I played an SK in beta, found them to be bland and not very unique. But to each is their own.
Oh and btw, Feign Death so pwns a horse ;p

Scrubs
40 Bruiser

[Odissi]

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furok wrote:

First of all it is pretty obvious you dont play a bruiser cause then you wouldnt say zerks have the lowest damage mitigation, thats reserved for classes usin light or very light armor, BRUISERS and MONKS are supposed to be kings of warrior arch dps as stated by soe, berserks are heavy armor tanks that come slightly ahead of guardians, zerks are the flip side of the coin from guardians ie you are offensive guardians, we bruisers are the offensive monks by comparison just as shadow knights are offensive paladins (heh), thats it . Thats how the warrior archs work and its pretty obvious even if you just bought the game.

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I never said lowest.

And SoE never said anything about Monks/Bruisers  being biggest DPS out of fighters. In their descriptions in didn't say anything about damage, but in the berserker class description it said HEAVY DAMAGE.

 

Oh and I didn't just by the game, and I'm not a noobie.

Message Edited by Odissius on 01-15-2005 11:43 AM

[LadySyl]

"And SoE never said anything about Monks/Bruisers being biggest DPS out of fighters. "Bzzzt, wrong. I don't have the quote off hand, but they have said in very simple language that Bruisers are meant to be the highest dps of the fighter class.

[Dzhoka]

I never said lowest.

And SoE never said anything about Monks/Bruisers  being biggest DPS out of fighters. In their descriptions in didn't say anything about damage, but in the berserker class description it said HEAVY DAMAGE.

 

Oh and I didn't just by the game, and I'm not a noobie.

Message Edited by Odissius on 01-15-200511:43 AM

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http://eqiiforums.station.sony.com/eq2/board/message?board.id=4&message.id=4608#M4608

 

 

There have been many posts lately about recent changes to the berserker class. I thought I would talk a bit about the reasons for these changes and the goal for balancing going forward.

 

Before the update on January 6, berserkers could outdamage most other classes--usually by a considerable margin. This not only unbalanced the fighter archetype, but the relative power of the other archetypes as well. This required that several berserker abilities be adjusted. While no class likes to have their damage output reduced, change was needed for the health of the game.

 

In terms of damage output, berserkers are intended to fall behind bruisers and monks. Berserkers should do a bit more damage than a guardian, since they do not tank quite as well as the guardian.

 

We are in the process of evaluating the damage output of all professions to see if they perform as we want them to. We will make further changes to the overall potency of spells and arts in order to achieve our desired results.

 

Regardless of how we balance the classes, there will be some people who don't agree with our decisions. A lot of the distinctions in class balance are subtle ones, prone to emotional interpretation--especially when players make such an personal investment in their characters. While balance will be one of the gameplay elements we focus on over the next couple weeks, it will also be an ongoing process.

 

In the wake of these changes you may not believe this, but we want berserkers to enjoy their characters and their role in the game. I hope that you can understand why changes like this happen, even if you personally don't agree with them. I regret that we didn't provide more warning that these changes were coming, especially when they affected so many players.

===========================
Moorgard
EverQuest II Community Guy