Sony please stop spam from Platinum Sellers!!!

[hobi]

<p>i ran across this article and thought is was an interesting read <a href="http://www.shacknews.com/onearticle.x/47220" target="_blank" rel="nofollow">http://www.shacknews.com/onearticle.x/47220</a>.</p><p> basically about a group of wow players in floridia that has actually filed a class action lawsuit against a gold selling company that spams them in wow. it also mention s about blizzards lawsuit against another one. </p><p>this got me thinking thant maybe a solution would be to change how the marketing of the future and current mmos are done. i mean switch to some thing that has proven to make a profit for the company that runs them. possibly goto something like guild wars.  where you buy the game play for fee  just buy campaigns/expansions  once a year. and in between the devs do in game events like double xp weekend or weekend of increased rare drops/spawn ect.  and make all servers exchange servers. and open up a game store where the company sells  extra char char slots, gold. items such as potion to give a short term xp boost you name it.  it similar  to guildwars marketing except they don't have exchange servers. but even tho they still have some spam it no wheres near as bad as with eq2  or wow there by easier for them to deal with. this would be better than the pay to play based games  on account these spammers don't like to compete directly against the ones that runs  the game cause they will most likely lose. and another benifit would be the game would recieve a continual influx of new players  and reduce server decline and with more people  that would use possibly use exchange services or the  store it would potententially increase soe profits and comtinually renew the community and resulting in a win win situation. plus reduce the spam as those gold sellers will now have to compete with the the big boys and possible get sued by them for trying since legally with th eula this would be soes ingame monoply.</p><p>it something to think about or ponder isn't it?? </p>

[NiteWolfe]

Brorim@Runnyeye wrote: <blockquote>Erin@Blackburrow wrote: <blockquote>So I happened to be in POF today.  There were 3 groups of farmers there.  All the usual symptoms, generated bad names, no guilds, anon, etc.  Pulling all the goblins and not allowing me to finish my quest. Now, as far as I know, this is happening on every server.  Are they doing anything wrong?  Well... tough question.  Yes and no.  No, because if I was doing what they were doing, for say a few hours, it wouldn't be wrong.  But when they do it day after day, week after week for long months... there has to be a reason.  Could they be legit players?  Yes, its absolutely possible.  But isn't it more likely that they are farming plat to sell?  Since everyone has complained about these farmers in POF, couldn't SOE try and prevent the farming?  Give these people a warning, then ban the accounts when it continues.  I know that if I get a warning from a GM, even if I feel that I wasn't doing anything wrong, I wouldn't repeat the activity!  Shouldn't we start working on these people so that there is no plat to sell? Or is that naive? </blockquote><p> You have /petition options here . it's a harrasment and player gamer breaker and is reportable .. </p><p>( the continued "killstealing" of your quest mob that is ) </p><p> Yours</p><p>Brorim</p></blockquote>  First off you cant kill steal since no MOB belongs to any one player. There for it is not YOUR quest mob but simple a quest mob you need.  There is call for reporting some one for monopolizing content. But you have to PROVE they did not let you have a shot at it IE you asked them more than once if you could have a shot at killing a mob because it was a quest issue.  To the person who said couldnt soe try to prevent the farming. Well to be honest  there is not rule against farming. There are plenty of honest players who farm to support there ingame plat needs. I farm regularly myself since i have a dayly cost of 5 to 6 plat in posions alone. Personaly i prefer to farm instances so i advoid the over zelous players reporting me to be a bot since i have 2 other accounts on AF the whole time i farm. BTW the char's i farm with are anon, are in my own alt guild so the guild is very low level and they all have very good kill to death ratio's b/c  i farm easy stuff for  body loot  and masters.  This fits the so called bot farmers yet i break no soe rules and i dont sell my plat.  i was almost forced into instance farming due to steady reports against me yet not once was i ever asked if a group or player could have a shot at some mob. It was always some player role up see me camping a named or a group of mobs and they /report me for monopolizing content. Thank god the GM's actualy contact the player in question and dont instant ban!

[xOnaton1]

<cite>Noaani wrote:</cite><blockquote><cite>AntLion wrote:</cite><blockquote> I hear Blizzard have taken this issue up a notch. They’re now filing a lawsuit against the web sites that sell the gold and offer power leveling services. </blockquote><p> You have heard wrong.</p><p>Blizzard have not taken up any lawsuits against anyone, a sinlge lone player has.</p><p>Also, it is not against web sites (plural), it is against IGE, a single company with an office in Florida.</p><p>If any good actually comes out of this, it may open up the way for SoE and Blizzard to take action, but that is yet to be seen.</p><p>Get facts straight, Blizzard have done considerably less in their game to combat plat spam than SoE have.</p></blockquote>I think you have heard wrong. The Florida class action lawsuit is against IGE. The Blizzard lawsuit is against Peons4hire. <a href="http://www.gamasutra.com/php-bin/news_index.php?story=14169" target="_blank" rel="nofollow">http://www.gamasutra.com/php-bin/ne...php?story=14169</a>

[Dasein]

The lawsuit against IGE is an interesting one, as the crux of the tort is that IGE's actions devalue player's gold. For this suit to have merit, it means that the virtual currency in a game like WoW actually has value, and that any action which devalues that currency is now potential grounds for a lawsuit. There's a good chance Blizzard might side with IGE on this, as a successful lawsuit here would set much worse precedents for MMO publishers.

[DreadPirate]

<cite>Amana wrote:</cite><blockquote>Heck I would join the SoE guide program just to be a plat seller hunter.  Have that nice little title near my name "Plat Seller Slayer". </blockquote> Nice thought, but Guides don't do that kind of thing.

[interstellarmatter]

They do need to catch up with hunting plat spammers.  Notice I said spammers not sellers.  Catching sellers and buyers is a very difficult task.  The spammers definitely need to be stopped.  Sony is starting to fall behind the curve on this issue.  Blizzard put in some report methods and filters to stop spammers recently.  I haven't heard from a spammer since.  This was coming from getting 30 spams a hour.  Now, it's Sony's turn to step up to put a stop to it.

[Groma]

You can do everyone a favor to lock down a plat seller.  Just start talking to them, ask questions about their services, and they eat it up.  I kept one going for over an hour one night when i was bored and i was asking in levels channels who had gotten tells previous to my starting the convo, and then after, and apparently he sent no tells while i was talking to him.  I know they are a PITA, but there are things that one person in the community can do to keep the rest of the community spam free.  Time to start working shifts.

[Velsha]

<img src="http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v606/digitalvixxen/goldfarm.jpg" border="0">

[hobi]

<cite>Dasein wrote:</cite><blockquote>The lawsuit against IGE is an interesting one, as the crux of the tort is that IGE's actions devalue player's gold. For this suit to have merit, it means that the virtual currency in a game like WoW actually has value, and that any action which devalues that currency is now potential grounds for a lawsuit. There's a good chance Blizzard might side with IGE on this, as a successful lawsuit here would set much worse precedents for MMO publishers. </blockquote><p> the thing here is the gold sellers are selling for actual cash so doesn't that prove that virtual currency has value? becuase if it did have any monetary value then it wouldn't be generating cash flow for these companies. </p><p>either way i believe in some shape or form the marketing sturucture of mmos will need to change or some sort of regulations may need to be placed virtual property. other wise i can see this as potentially threatening the surviabilty of any mmo</p>

[SG_01]

I never receive tells from plat farmers... Then again, I'm on /roleplay or /anonymous all the time <img src="/smilies/283a16da79f3aa23fe1025c96295f04f.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" />

[Thicket Tundrabog]

<cite>Dasein wrote:</cite><blockquote>The lawsuit against IGE is an interesting one, as the crux of the tort is that IGE's actions devalue player's gold. For this suit to have merit, it means that the virtual currency in a game like WoW actually has value, and that any action which devalues that currency is now potential grounds for a lawsuit. There's a good chance Blizzard might side with IGE on this, as a successful lawsuit here would set much worse precedents for MMO publishers. </blockquote>I saw much more that devaluing player's currency. The suit alleges * Effect on time where gold farmers strip scarce and limited resources. * Devaluing player currency. * Destroying subscriber experience through spamming and junk mail. * Competitively disadvantaging honest subscribers It all hinges on damaging the enjoyment of paying subscribers.

[Image_Vain]

I don't care, I mean does it really annoy you when you get a few tells every few hours advertising plat?

[Ama]

<cite>DreadPirate wrote:</cite><blockquote><cite>Amana wrote:</cite><blockquote>Heck I would join the SoE guide program just to be a plat seller hunter.  Have that nice little title near my name "Plat Seller Slayer". </blockquote> Nice thought, but Guides don't do that kind of thing.</blockquote> Not yet anyways....<img src="/smilies/b2eb59423fbf5fa39342041237025880.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" /> never forget they are among us.

[xOnaton1]

I really hope the devs are working on a solution and there have been many ideas offered. Here is my contribution: 1. Tell throttling. Limit tells to one every two seconds (or some reasonable number.) This could easily be done within the client so it wouldn't even affect the server code. These spammers are obviously sending out hundreds of /tells per minute. 2. One click reporting. Reporting spam has to be quick and easy. Reporting mail spam is done this way-- you click on the spam button and you click a second time on a confirmation window. Reporting /tell spam takes far too long and you can't even /report more than once every 5 minutes when we get spam every 2 or 3 minutes! Petitioning takes too long and you can only have one petition open at a time. We need to be able to click on a name, report spam, and then click on a confirmation window. Done! 3. Automatic /tell gagging. After 25 (or some number) spam reports are filed against one account no tells are allowed from that account. If the account tries to send another /tell they get a polite response, "You have been reported by at least 25 players for spamming. You are not allowed to send any more tells. A GM will contact you on their findings. You may /petition for help if you think you have been wrongfully accused of spamming. Thank you for your patience." If one player griefs another player by reporting them for spamming... nothing happens. After 25+ players report one account for spamming, all 25 reports are grouped together and automatically filed as a petition that a GM can handle in one fell swoop, thus saving GM time in the process. Please SOE, the game is painful to play now. My only option currently is to just turn off all tells in my chat window. Othesus - Dirge - Lucan DLere Vaspar - Fury - Lucan DLere

[dawy]

I must admit its been great today not a single tell from the farmers..salad days indeed.

[Nakaru-Nitepaw]

the last couple of days have been almost plat seller free for me. It seams to have died down a little. day before yesterday i had 1 send me a tell and i replied to them saying "i like order pizza. you sell domino? i take mushroom, olive, onion, and dis ting you call plat? is the platter to hold pizza? i take too". He didnt reply of course. <img src="/smilies/3b63d1616c5dfcf29f8a7a031aaa7cad.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" />

[Axelia]

<p>Today was the turning point for me and I think this is the only way to get rid of the plat sellers is to make it unprofitable for them. I hated this game when it was first released and it has become one of the best MMOs and it saddens me to see what has happened over the last 6 months.</p><p>First of all as an individual I can do nothing but as a community we can do a lot. We need to give the game maker some ammunition and no better way than lost revenue due to plat sellers using private channels.</p><p>I sent feedback to the game maker stating the exact reason I was canceling was due to the constant tells ever 2 to 5 minutes. I stated that I would return when this issue is resolved but in the mean time I intend to strike. I then logged out and canceled my subscription.</p><p> Now as one lost account is not a big issue I think as more and more players tell in feedback the reason they are leaving the game, SOE can go after these guys for a LOT of lost revnue. We are talking here in the range of several million.  </p>

[Jagged Halo]

the real rason for why we have the plat spam is being ignored the buyers get rid of them and these companys will fold very fast

[joebyrdw]

<p>I agree something needs to be done about these guys. Yesterday I got 14 tells in less than  10 minutes of being logged in. This continued for my entire play time last night. </p>

[KunamitsuUK]

<cite>joebyrdws6 wrote:</cite><blockquote><p>I agree something needs to be done about these guys. Yesterday I got 14 tells in less than  10 minutes of being logged in. This continued for my entire play time last night. </p></blockquote> WOW! Here I am complaining about one or 2 during a 6 hour session, some of the servers seem to get it rough! Id hate to think what I would be like if I was getting incessant spam, think I'd stop playing.

[erin]

Brorim@Runnyeye wrote: <blockquote>Erin@Blackburrow wrote: <blockquote>So I happened to be in POF today.  There were 3 groups of farmers there.  All the usual symptoms, generated bad names, no guilds, anon, etc.  Pulling all the goblins and not allowing me to finish my quest. Now, as far as I know, this is happening on every server.  Are they doing anything wrong?  Well... tough question.  Yes and no.  No, because if I was doing what they were doing, for say a few hours, it wouldn't be wrong.  But when they do it day after day, week after week for long months... there has to be a reason.  Could they be legit players?  Yes, its absolutely possible.  But isn't it more likely that they are farming plat to sell?  Since everyone has complained about these farmers in POF, couldn't SOE try and prevent the farming?  Give these people a warning, then ban the accounts when it continues.  I know that if I get a warning from a GM, even if I feel that I wasn't doing anything wrong, I wouldn't repeat the activity!  Shouldn't we start working on these people so that there is no plat to sell? Or is that naive? </blockquote><p> You have /petition options here . it's a harrasment and player gamer breaker and is reportable .. </p><p>( the continued "killstealing" of your quest mob that is ) </p><p> Yours</p><p>Brorim</p></blockquote>ROFLMAO.  OMG are you serious?  Sorry.  I was laughing so hard, EQ2 came out my nose.  You think I haven't petitioned these people for zone disruption?  You think dozens of others haven't done the same?  Seriously, you think we're that stupid, that lazy, that... I don't even know what you think.  Guess what?  Nothing ever happens.  Go to POF.  Any day, any time, there they are.  Petition them yourself.  Try again.  And again.  NOTHING happens.  I don't know if hte GMs can't, or just won't, but nothing happens.  Even if a GM responds within a few hours, they can't do anything.  Yes of course I've sent tells to these farmers to please let me finish my quest.  Heck, I've spammed them, trying to annoy them enough that they want me to leave so they'll let me finish.  Nothing.  Usually 0 response, and if I get one, its not in english and I don't know what they are saying. Through sheer persistence, I managed to finish my quest, mostly because the content was almost all grey to me.  When I've gone there when the content is still blue, they train me over and over trying to get me killed or forcing me to leave.  So I don't bother till its grey anymore.  How sad is that?  I cannot access this content when its level appropriate. I know its primarily just this one zone, or rather a small number of zones, but that doesn't mean I should roll over and accept it. I know you meant well with your post, you were trying to give good advice, but seriously, we, collectively as a player base, are smart enough to have petitioned this behavior, are smart enough to figure out that zone disruption is against the game, while farming isn't.  Heck I farm, we all farm.  The difference is that I don't do it for hours on end, months on end in a single zone.  Follow the money, where does it go?

[Dasein]

Oakthicket@Permafrost wrote: <blockquote><cite>Dasein wrote:</cite><blockquote>The lawsuit against IGE is an interesting one, as the crux of the tort is that IGE's actions devalue player's gold. For this suit to have merit, it means that the virtual currency in a game like WoW actually has value, and that any action which devalues that currency is now potential grounds for a lawsuit. There's a good chance Blizzard might side with IGE on this, as a successful lawsuit here would set much worse precedents for MMO publishers. </blockquote>I saw much more that devaluing player's currency. The suit alleges * Effect on time where gold farmers strip scarce and limited resources. * Devaluing player currency. * Destroying subscriber experience through spamming and junk mail. * Competitively disadvantaging honest subscribers It all hinges on damaging the enjoyment of paying subscribers. </blockquote>1. Stripping scarce resources is part of legitimate gameplay and not grounds for a lawsuit. 2. Player currency is inherently valueless (in terms of real money) per Blizzard's EULA. 3. Not grounds for a lawsuit, as a certain degree of unwanted chatter in the form of tells or open channel spam is expected from people looking for groups or to sell things. Further, it is not the obligation of other players to ensure you enjoy the game. 4. Balance within the game is again, not the obligation of other players. If anything, in a competative game, it is expected that other players will do anything in their power to maximize their advantage. If this lawsuit is successful, the precedent it sets would be far worse than the occasional spam tell. First, if virtual currency in games like WoW and EQ2 is held to have real money value despite the claims of the EULA, this opens up these games to things like gambling laws, taxation and a host of other regulations. Money laundering is a concern, so expect legislation to regulat online gaming to combat that, too. Of course, if virtual currency has real value, this also opens up all sorts of property disputes, and effectively legitimizes RMT. In the end, it would do far more to hurt the situation that help it. Second, if it becomes possible to sue other players for disrupting my gameplay or diminishing my enjoyment of the game, that has the potential to lead to so many lawsuits it would make being a player virtually impossible. Imagine being sued if you take a contested mob or harvest someone else's node, or refuse to group with someone, or kick them from your guild?

[Betatroll]

First off apologies to the previous posters, I'm just not going to read this whole thread. Secondly I've noticed when I'm grouped that when I get a PM from someone selling plat so does everyone else in the group. Is it that difficult to create code that would watch for more than X many outgoing PMs to different names withing X many seconds to auto suspend an account until it can be reviewed? I should mention they amuse me way more than irritate me and I understand the appeal it has to people. I'm not big on having to compete on the broker to make money, but I do it because otherwise I'd be having to borrow money every time I wanted something. Personally I'm thinking some people need to lighten up. The economy isn't completely fubared as it is in other games I can think of.

[Bunnyfluff]

<p>What a huge thread! I also apologize to previous posters if I'm echoing earlier sentiments (but consider them support for such sentiments!).</p><p> Here are some ideas that I'd support (and I'm sure they're mentioned multiple times above in one form or another):</p><p> 1. /spamreport or /reportspam feature: Allow players to instantly send a report to a guide/GM with the text of the last tell they received from that player. No delay, no "every five minutes," no petition or report needed. Just let the player fire off the command and forget (hopefully).</p><p>2. /tellsquelch: For guides and GMs, this command automatically puts a squelch on the tells of the targeted player. (Someone suggested that the tells by a spambotter LOOK like they go out, but don't actually go to the bin, so the spambotter THINKS he/she is doing his/her spamjob, but nobody is getting harmed in the tellprocess.) This allows us to breathe a temporary sigh of relief until the squelched player logs out and brings in another spambot. It also gives GMs a chance to deal with the bulk of evidence against the player and make any judgments that need to be made without that possible spambot sending out a LOT more tellspams.</p><p>3. Get more guides involved in the game! You may want to have a subset of Apprentice Guides that do item 2 (and only item 2); give them the chance to move up in the ranks of guides if they want, but if they'd prefer to help only with this spambot issue, let them stick around that level, too. Call this subset the Spammerwhammers or Spamwhammers. (You could add a question to the guide application that asks if the player is interested only in this or would rather step into the role of full guide eventually. If the Spammerwhammer eventually decides that maybe doing MORE would be fun, I'm sure the senior guides and GMs would be happy to consider putting him/her into the regular program based on the Spammerwhammer's record.) [I say all of this without knowing how the guide program works ultimately, so if it's unrealistic, adjust it to where it's workable somehow. I'm sure there many folk out there who would be more than happy to simply /tellsquelch tellspammers for a bit every day.] Yes, I expect that the full process of approvals and whatnot would still be involved in getting the Spammerwhammer into the program -- we don't want spambotter allies getting Spammerwhammer status!</p><p>4. Wishful thinking idea: If a GM sees a /spamreport that does indeed tout a certain website, send the spambot to the PVP server flagged (and to a high-level zone), and let anyone who is nearby whack on him or her. Make sure you add a "Spambot" tag to the character's name somehow. Make sure you /tellsquelch the person, first, though, because we don't want the spambot to get revenge by spamming everyone on the PVP server. (Yeah, so the idea needs polish. Maybe the drop into a lava pit really is the way to go.)</p><p> 5. Possible alternative or additional idea: Let us turn off our tells. Or give us tools to tweak WHO we allow to send tells to us. This could include a friends-list-only feature, plus maybe a level-based feature. I saw someone with this idea in chat, and it could be workable.</p>

[Bromir]

Othesus@Lucan DLere wrote: <blockquote>I really hope the devs are working on a solution and there have been many ideas offered. Here is my contribution: 1. Tell throttling. Limit tells to one every two seconds (or some reasonable number.) This could easily be done within the client so it wouldn't even affect the server code. These spammers are obviously sending out hundreds of /tells per minute. 2. One click reporting. Reporting spam has to be quick and easy. Reporting mail spam is done this way-- you click on the spam button and you click a second time on a confirmation window. Reporting /tell spam takes far too long and you can't even /report more than once every 5 minutes when we get spam every 2 or 3 minutes! Petitioning takes too long and you can only have one petition open at a time. We need to be able to click on a name, report spam, and then click on a confirmation window. Done! 3. Automatic /tell gagging. After 25 (or some number) spam reports are filed against one account no tells are allowed from that account. If the account tries to send another /tell they get a polite response, "You have been reported by at least 25 players for spamming. You are not allowed to send any more tells. A GM will contact you on their findings. You may /petition for help if you think you have been wrongfully accused of spamming. Thank you for your patience." If one player griefs another player by reporting them for spamming... nothing happens. After 25+ players report one account for spamming, all 25 reports are grouped together and automatically filed as a petition that a GM can handle in one fell swoop, thus saving GM time in the process. Please SOE, the game is painful to play now. My only option currently is to just turn off all tells in my chat window. Othesus - Dirge - Lucan DLere Vaspar - Fury - Lucan DLere </blockquote><p>I fail to see the reasoning . </p><p>You will still get spammed .. so whats the point  ? </p><p>Yours</p><p>Brorim </p>

[Bromir]

Erin@Blackburrow wrote: <blockquote>Brorim@Runnyeye wrote: <blockquote>Erin@Blackburrow wrote: <blockquote>So I happened to be in POF today.  There were 3 groups of farmers there.  All the usual symptoms, generated bad names, no guilds, anon, etc.  Pulling all the goblins and not allowing me to finish my quest. Now, as far as I know, this is happening on every server.  Are they doing anything wrong?  Well... tough question.  Yes and no.  No, because if I was doing what they were doing, for say a few hours, it wouldn't be wrong.  But when they do it day after day, week after week for long months... there has to be a reason.  Could they be legit players?  Yes, its absolutely possible.  But isn't it more likely that they are farming plat to sell?  Since everyone has complained about these farmers in POF, couldn't SOE try and prevent the farming?  Give these people a warning, then ban the accounts when it continues.  I know that if I get a warning from a GM, even if I feel that I wasn't doing anything wrong, I wouldn't repeat the activity!  Shouldn't we start working on these people so that there is no plat to sell? Or is that naive? </blockquote><p> You have /petition options here . it's a harrasment and player gamer breaker and is reportable .. </p><p>( the continued "killstealing" of your quest mob that is ) </p><p> Yours</p><p>Brorim</p></blockquote>ROFLMAO.  OMG are you serious?  Sorry.  I was laughing so hard, EQ2 came out my nose.  You think I haven't petitioned these people for zone disruption?  You think dozens of others haven't done the same?  Seriously, you think we're that stupid, that lazy, that... I don't even know what you think.  Guess what?  Nothing ever happens.  Go to POF.  Any day, any time, there they are.  Petition them yourself.  Try again.  And again.  NOTHING happens.  I don't know if hte GMs can't, or just won't, but nothing happens.  Even if a GM responds within a few hours, they can't do anything.  Yes of course I've sent tells to these farmers to please let me finish my quest.  Heck, I've spammed them, trying to annoy them enough that they want me to leave so they'll let me finish.  Nothing.  Usually 0 response, and if I get one, its not in english and I don't know what they are saying. Through sheer persistence, I managed to finish my quest, mostly because the content was almost all grey to me.  When I've gone there when the content is still blue, they train me over and over trying to get me killed or forcing me to leave.  So I don't bother till its grey anymore.  How sad is that?  I cannot access this content when its level appropriate. I know its primarily just this one zone, or rather a small number of zones, but that doesn't mean I should roll over and accept it. I know you meant well with your post, you were trying to give good advice, but seriously, we, collectively as a player base, are smart enough to have petitioned this behavior, are smart enough to figure out that zone disruption is against the game, while farming isn't.  Heck I farm, we all farm.  The difference is that I don't do it for hours on end, months on end in a single zone.  Follow the money, where does it go? </blockquote><p> It is odd youre saying this because i have petitioned them and gotten help .. </p><p>So .. go figure ..</p><p>Yours</p><p>Broirm</p>

[Nakaru-Nitepaw]

Today I've had 3 tells from gibberish names.. I guess it's picking up again. :/ This is a serious method of griefing. They are definitely breaking rules. First it's the naming policy (the antonia bayle is a roleplay server. names like djfhdgdfhgkjh do not fit into the RP), second they repeatedly send these tells out the same same people over and over to the entire list of players online, and they mail you if your not online. And third, their selling plat, power leveling, and gear which ruins the economy. the worst of them i've encountered is gmworker... A bunch of losers they are.

[selch]

All will be okay if they just ban *.sn.cn

[Nakaru-Nitepaw]

I'd hate to say it but I'm starting to think that EQ2 needs a 3rd party tool sniffer bot like WoW has. It bans them if it catches anything. Although it can easily mistake something as a hack. I know these guys are using bots to spam us all.

[Ian_RangerTank]

Othesus@Lucan DLere wrote: <blockquote> 1. Tell throttling. Limit tells to one every two seconds (or some reasonable number.) This could easily be done within the client so it wouldn't even affect the server code. These spammers are obviously sending out hundreds of /tells per minute. </blockquote> If it's going to be effective at all, it's going to have to be server side.  Within mere days of any client-side restriction going live, I guarantee the bots will have a hack around it. 2 seconds would be good to start out with, though if a character were to send enough tells in a short time, it should raise it to 5 seconds.... and eventually to 10 if the suspicious pattern continues.

[Cele]

<p>I got a couple PL tells today.  Actually tookthe time to read one and was floored to learn people pay $700 to be PL'd from 1-70.</p><p>WHY!?!?!</p>

[erin]

<cite>Celena wrote:</cite><blockquote><p>I got a couple PL tells today.  Actually tookthe time to read one and was floored to learn people pay $700 to be PL'd from 1-70.</p><p>WHY!?!?!</p></blockquote>Seriously?  $700?  That's nuts!

[Cele]

Erin@Blackburrow wrote: <blockquote><cite>Celena wrote:</cite><blockquote><p>I got a couple PL tells today.  Actually tookthe time to read one and was floored to learn people pay $700 to be PL'd from 1-70.</p><p>WHY!?!?!</p></blockquote>Seriously?  $700?  That's nuts! </blockquote> Yup!  Had to read it twice to be sure I saw it right.  Quite a few folks must be paying for it, otherwise, they would not offer it so much.  scary on about a zillion levels.

[StormCinder]

<cite>Celena wrote:</cite><blockquote>Erin@Blackburrow wrote: <blockquote><cite>Celena wrote:</cite><blockquote><p>I got a couple PL tells today.  Actually tookthe time to read one and was floored to learn people pay $700 to be PL'd from 1-70.</p><p>WHY!?!?!</p></blockquote>Seriously?  $700?  That's nuts! </blockquote> Yup!  Had to read it twice to be sure I saw it right.  Quite a few folks must be paying for it, otherwise, they would not offer it so much.  scary on about a zillion levels.</blockquote>A 70 Warden sold on the Exchange this week for $1,100.  Go figure.

[Cele]

<cite>StormCinder wrote:</cite><blockquote><cite>Celena wrote:</cite><blockquote>Erin@Blackburrow wrote: <blockquote><cite>Celena wrote:</cite><blockquote><p>I got a couple PL tells today.  Actually tookthe time to read one and was floored to learn people pay $700 to be PL'd from 1-70.</p><p>WHY!?!?!</p></blockquote>Seriously?  $700?  That's nuts! </blockquote> Yup!  Had to read it twice to be sure I saw it right.  Quite a few folks must be paying for it, otherwise, they would not offer it so much.  scary on about a zillion levels.</blockquote>A 70 Warden sold on the Exchange this week for $1,100.  Go figure. </blockquote>Stormcider, we are not talking about legally selling toons on SE.  We are talking about morons paying a third party website to PL a toon from 1-70.  What does SE have to do with that?

[evhallion]

<cite>Celena wrote:</cite><blockquote><cite>StormCinder wrote:</cite><blockquote><cite>Celena wrote:</cite><blockquote>Erin@Blackburrow wrote: <blockquote><cite>Celena wrote:</cite><blockquote><p>I got a couple PL tells today.  Actually tookthe time to read one and was floored to learn people pay $700 to be PL'd from 1-70.</p><p>WHY!?!?!</p></blockquote>Seriously?  $700?  That's nuts! </blockquote> Yup!  Had to read it twice to be sure I saw it right.  Quite a few folks must be paying for it, otherwise, they would not offer it so much.  scary on about a zillion levels.</blockquote>A 70 Warden sold on the Exchange this week for $1,100.  Go figure. </blockquote>Stormcider, we are not talking about legally selling toons on SE.  We are talking about morons paying a third party website to PL a toon from 1-70.  What does SE have to do with that? </blockquote>Cause you're basicly talking about the same morons. Think about it, what is a toon on exchange? Basicly a leveled toon. So what's the difference in paying 700 to have the toon PLed or just buying a toon for 1,100 pre-leveled? Only difference is one is SOE approved and one is not. Not to mention the exchange toon will likely come with more items, access and plat. With a free name change and the apperence respec it IS the SOE powerleveling service.

[NiteWolfe]

Sarafan@The Bazaar wrote: <blockquote><cite>Celena wrote:</cite><blockquote><cite>StormCinder wrote:</cite><blockquote><cite>Celena wrote:</cite><blockquote>Erin@Blackburrow wrote: <blockquote><cite>Celena wrote:</cite><blockquote><p>I got a couple PL tells today.  Actually tookthe time to read one and was floored to learn people pay $700 to be PL'd from 1-70.</p><p>WHY!?!?!</p></blockquote>Seriously?  $700?  That's nuts! </blockquote> Yup!  Had to read it twice to be sure I saw it right.  Quite a few folks must be paying for it, otherwise, they would not offer it so much.  scary on about a zillion levels.</blockquote>A 70 Warden sold on the Exchange this week for $1,100.  Go figure. </blockquote>Stormcider, we are not talking about legally selling toons on SE.  We are talking about morons paying a third party website to PL a toon from 1-70.  What does SE have to do with that? </blockquote>Cause you're basicly talking about the same morons. Think about it, what is a toon on exchange? Basicly a leveled toon. So what's the difference in paying 700 to have the toon PLed or just buying a toon for 1,100 pre-leveled? Only difference is one is SOE approved and one is not. Not to mention the exchange toon will likely come with more items, access and plat. With a free name change and the apperence respec it IS the SOE powerleveling service. </blockquote> so and so charges 700 bucks for 1-70 PL + 50 bucks? server move to a exchange server= 750 buck The PL toon  then can sell legally for 1100 bucks a profit of 350 bucks. Iam sure the the 1100 buck thing dont happen to often but as he said one did sell for that.  So maybe those  using the PL are hoping to cash in? Just a thought. i never really looked into the legal selling of toons on exchange so iam not sure.

[Bromir]

<cite>NiteWolfe wrote:</cite><blockquote>Sarafan@The Bazaar wrote: <blockquote><cite>Celena wrote:</cite><blockquote><cite>StormCinder wrote:</cite><blockquote><cite>Celena wrote:</cite><blockquote>Erin@Blackburrow wrote: <blockquote><cite>Celena wrote:</cite><blockquote><p>I got a couple PL tells today.  Actually tookthe time to read one and was floored to learn people pay $700 to be PL'd from 1-70.</p><p>WHY!?!?!</p></blockquote>Seriously?  $700?  That's nuts! </blockquote> Yup!  Had to read it twice to be sure I saw it right.  Quite a few folks must be paying for it, otherwise, they would not offer it so much.  scary on about a zillion levels.</blockquote>A 70 Warden sold on the Exchange this week for $1,100.  Go figure. </blockquote>Stormcider, we are not talking about legally selling toons on SE.  We are talking about morons paying a third party website to PL a toon from 1-70.  What does SE have to do with that? </blockquote>Cause you're basicly talking about the same morons. Think about it, what is a toon on exchange? Basicly a leveled toon. So what's the difference in paying 700 to have the toon PLed or just buying a toon for 1,100 pre-leveled? Only difference is one is SOE approved and one is not. Not to mention the exchange toon will likely come with more items, access and plat. With a free name change and the apperence respec it IS the SOE powerleveling service. </blockquote> so and so charges 700 bucks for 1-70 PL + 50 bucks? server move to a exchange server= 750 buck The PL toon  then can sell legally for 1100 bucks a profit of 350 bucks. Iam sure the the 1100 buck thing dont happen to often but as he said one did sell for that.  So maybe those  using the PL are hoping to cash in? Just a thought. i never really looked into the legal selling of toons on exchange so iam not sure. </blockquote><p>as far as i know it's free to move to exchange .</p><p>You can only keep nodrops and attuned ..No gold or other items come along</p><p>Just realized that this is FAR of topic .. <img src="/smilies/3b63d1616c5dfcf29f8a7a031aaa7cad.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" /></p><p>Yours</p><p>Brorim</p>

[Cele]

Bromir@Runnyeye wrote: <blockquote><cite>NiteWolfe wrote:</cite><blockquote>Sarafan@The Bazaar wrote: <blockquote><cite>Celena wrote:</cite><blockquote><cite>StormCinder wrote:</cite><blockquote><cite>Celena wrote:</cite><blockquote>Erin@Blackburrow wrote: <blockquote><cite>Celena wrote:</cite><blockquote><p>I got a couple PL tells today.  Actually tookthe time to read one and was floored to learn people pay $700 to be PL'd from 1-70.</p><p>WHY!?!?!</p></blockquote>Seriously?  $700?  That's nuts! </blockquote> Yup!  Had to read it twice to be sure I saw it right.  Quite a few folks must be paying for it, otherwise, they would not offer it so much.  scary on about a zillion levels.</blockquote>A 70 Warden sold on the Exchange this week for $1,100.  Go figure. </blockquote>Stormcider, we are not talking about legally selling toons on SE.  We are talking about morons paying a third party website to PL a toon from 1-70.  What does SE have to do with that? </blockquote>Cause you're basicly talking about the same morons. Think about it, what is a toon on exchange? Basicly a leveled toon. So what's the difference in paying 700 to have the toon PLed or just buying a toon for 1,100 pre-leveled? Only difference is one is SOE approved and one is not. Not to mention the exchange toon will likely come with more items, access and plat. With a free name change and the apperence respec it IS the SOE powerleveling service. </blockquote> so and so charges 700 bucks for 1-70 PL + 50 bucks? server move to a exchange server= 750 buck The PL toon  then can sell legally for 1100 bucks a profit of 350 bucks. Iam sure the the 1100 buck thing dont happen to often but as he said one did sell for that.  So maybe those  using the PL are hoping to cash in? Just a thought. i never really looked into the legal selling of toons on exchange so iam not sure. </blockquote><p>as far as i know it's free to move to exchange .</p><p>You can only keep nodrops and attuned ..No gold or other items come along</p><p>Just realized that this is FAR of topic .. <img src="/smilies/3b63d1616c5dfcf29f8a7a031aaa7cad.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" /></p><p>Yours</p><p>Brorim</p></blockquote><p>Well, I stand corrected, then.  I never thought people would be THAT moronic.  I have nothing against SE, moved a toon there once when I thought I was going to quit, played a few months, then quit and sold it.</p><p>Still, paying a third party to level  a toon with the hopes of selling it on SE could back fire big time since you cant take everything w/you when you xfer, and you cant be sure what the toon will sell for once it gets to SE.</p><p>People are odd! </p>

[Nakaru-Nitepaw]

EEK $700 to have someone else play your toon? thats awful lol... I feel sorry for anyone paying for that. It isn't that hard to get to 70 on your own... A friend of mine i got him into the game 2 weeks ago and hes already a level 45 illusionist. Some people might think thats slow, but to me thats fast... I've been playing since November of last year since i got back (played since beta but quit for a few years) and so far I'm only a level 56 warden. IT wasn't hard though... I'm just slow. ;p

[Lornick]

<p>BTW, from someone who actually plays on the Bazaar.  Don't go thinking selling a character for over 1,000 dollars is common.  It has to be an extremely well geared raid character to go for that much and even then it's pretty rare.  The average level 70 character seems to sell for around 150-300 dollars.  Also bear in mind it costs 10 dollars to list a character and SOE takes a 10% cut on top of that.  So if your character sells for 300 the seller will actually gain 260 bucks.  It's hardly a get rich quick scheme.</p>

[Echgar]

Let's stay on topic please. <img src="/smilies/3b63d1616c5dfcf29f8a7a031aaa7cad.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" />

[Birkenstocky]

<p>Okay we have the /filter for bad words which makes those words appear as (*$*&*^# or whatever and not as text.  Why not enhance this feature in Options and allow players to build a filter.  The default choices would be gameworker.com, gamenoble.com and all the sites SOE is quite aware of in the advertisements.</p><p> By allowing each person to add 'keywords' to their filters this blocks their advertising since no one knows what freaking sight they came from unless they want to buy plat.</p><p> Another option rather than to #*#($)@ out specific keywords is give us an in game option to block any sent message containing a keyword.</p><p> Now the plat sellers will try to get cute with their company name - but if in account settings, we could save our own filtering we can in effect be able to block anyone associated with a plat seller site from spamming us.  (theoretically)  </p><p>It would require diligence on our part as players to update our lists of words we don't wanna hear about, but if SOE would build it I know I would use it.</p><p> They have built the ability to block names, they have built the ability to filter words - why not combine this sorta with a setting that allows us to block these chumps.</p>

[Bromir]

<cite>Birkenstocky wrote:</cite><blockquote><p>Okay we have the /filter for bad words which makes those words appear as (*$*&*^# or whatever and not as text.  Why not enhance this feature in Options and allow players to build a filter.  The default choices would be gameworker.com, gamenoble.com and all the sites SOE is quite aware of in the advertisements.</p><p> By allowing each person to add 'keywords' to their filters this blocks their advertising since no one knows what freaking sight they came from unless they want to buy plat.</p><p> Another option rather than to #*#($)@ out specific keywords is give us an in game option to block any sent message containing a keyword.</p><p> Now the plat sellers will try to get cute with their company name - but if in account settings, we could save our own filtering we can in effect be able to block anyone associated with a plat seller site from spamming us.  (theoretically)  </p><p>It would require diligence on our part as players to update our lists of words we don't wanna hear about, but if SOE would build it I know I would use it.</p><p> They have built the ability to block names, they have built the ability to filter words - why not combine this sorta with a setting that allows us to block these chumps.</p></blockquote><p>Problem with a filter is that it wont stop the spam. Account ignore will help abit but not alot and not for long . The spammers make new accounts as they go along. Problem is that if you want to really stop the spam. Ie . not get any . You would need to filter out a full range of tellers. </p><p>Yours</p><p>Brorim  </p>

[kukubird]

Well it the spamm took a little 2 day break.. but it is back again....... <img src="/smilies/9d71f0541cff0a302a0309c5079e8dee.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" />  Was so nice.... without it for even those 2 days. I don't think there is a point to this thread... obviously SOE wants them here.... I mean they can make it so there is a swear filter but can't take 2 minutes to not allow the game to use their websites names? Ohh well...

[Kileren]

Sony should just put the following in their MOTD: "Safe gold! Fast power leveling. Special service of gold farming. Enjoy the fun we give you and you guild at "you know where.com"" That would get it over with. I see it so much I know it by heart. Does it ruin my day? No. Is it a pain in the behind? After the third or fourth time, yes, especially when it is from the same guy.

[Dasein]

<cite>kukubird wrote:</cite><blockquote>Well it the spamm took a little 2 day break.. but it is back again....... <img src="/smilies/9d71f0541cff0a302a0309c5079e8dee.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" />  Was so nice.... without it for even those 2 days. I don't think there is a point to this thread... obviously SOE wants them here.... I mean they can make it so there is a swear filter but can't take 2 minutes to not allow the game to use their websites names? Ohh well... </blockquote> The profanity filter is rather basic, and what constitutes profanity tends not to change, so filtering a few words is all you need to do. Against an intelligent opponent, who can very easily register new domain names as needed, and who may be actively trying to subvert the filter, such blacklist filters are worthless.

[kukubird]

The hassle of building a brand name.... registering new domains etc.. is well worth the time it would take to add those names to the filter. Trust me... they are spamming us.. and for every dollar they put into spamming.. they are building value in the business. AGIAN, I think the time it would take to enter those names into a filter would WELLLLLLL be worth the cost it would be to these guys. Then again.... I honetly don't like them hiring the IGE guy as their VP..... just doesn't sit well with me and their lack of effective action against these guys.

[Dasein]

<cite>kukubird wrote:</cite><blockquote>The hassle of building a brand name.... registering new domains etc.. is well worth the time it would take to add those names to the filter. Trust me... they are spamming us.. and for every dollar they put into spamming.. they are building value in the business. AGIAN, I think the time it would take to enter those names into a filter would WELLLLLLL be worth the cost it would be to these guys. Then again.... I honetly don't like them hiring the IGE guy as their VP..... just doesn't sit well with me and their lack of effective action against these guys. </blockquote>You can register a domain name and set it up to forward to your primary domain in a matter of minutes. Domain names themselves are cheap, so the financial cost is minimal. The people who won www.goldseller.com might also own www.goldseler.com, www.g0ldseller.com, www.g0ldseler.com and so on, all pointing to the same place. Then you have the IP addresses, which will get you to those sites as well. Next, you have all the wonderful variations on spacing, alternate spellings and character substitution. Since EQ2 allows expanded character sets in it's chat ystem, you're looking at a huge number of possible combinations, all of which would be different strings from a computer's standpoint, but would be readily readable by a human as the same address. Very quickly, you end up with an unmanagable blacklist. Also remember it takes processing power, either client side or server side, to run every tell through this filter. When you have a list of potentially millions of strings to filter against, that's not an insubstnatial amount of processing, and that translates into chat lag for players, which most find unacceptable.

[sah]

<cite>Dasein wrote:</cite><blockquote>You can register a domain name and set it up to forward to your primary domain in a matter of minutes. Domain names themselves are cheap, so the financial cost is minimal. The people who won www.goldseller.com might also own www.goldseler.com, www.g0ldseller.com, www.g0ldseler.com and so on, all pointing to the same place. Then you have the IP addresses, which will get you to those sites as well. Next, you have all the wonderful variations on spacing, alternate spellings and character substitution. Since EQ2 allows expanded character sets in it's chat ystem, you're looking at a huge number of possible combinations, all of which would be different strings from a computer's standpoint, but would be readily readable by a human as the same address. Very quickly, you end up with an unmanagable blacklist. Also remember it takes processing power, either client side or server side, to run every tell through this filter. When you have a list of potentially millions of strings to filter against, that's not an insubstnatial amount of processing, and that translates into chat lag for players, which most find unacceptable. </blockquote><p> Yup, it only takes a couple minutes and a few dollars to get a new website address and set it to point to your main website.  The profanity filter in EQ2 is a very basic algorithm that I suspect has an O(N*X) runtime where N is the number of words of the message and X is the number of words in the blacklist.  Obviously, increasing X to a very high amount would make the filter impractical to use and as has already been stated, a plat spamming site could easily go through hundreds of new domain names per month.  The current filter doesn't even take into account spacing or punctuation (I think that it takes into account capitalization although I haven't confirmed that).  If you were to modify the algorithm to take those things into account, the runtime would increase to O(X*n^2) where n is the number of non-space characters in the message which is significantly higher than the number of words.  A quadratic runtime algorithm in a real-time chat system without some sort of tell-throttling would be impractical because a spammer sending out hundreds of messages within a few seconds could easily overload the system.  </p><p>Anyways, this is from the Jun 12 dev chat:</p><blockquote>(Calthine) Ever think of a new setting in EQ2 that would prevent people from sending you a private msg unless in your friends list ? (kiara) yes well we already know that you're a little tetched in the head Tamat dear. (Calthine) (compiled from several questioners) (Gallenite) I'm assuming that reason for this question is related to spam - And I sympathize with that. Let me answer from that angle: (Gallenite) Yes, we're committed to addressing spam, but no, not by removing the "meeting new people" aspect of an MMO that is key to keeping the game feeling alive. (more) (Gallenite) We have quite a few medium and long term projects that we've been working on in the background. Some we don't talk about much at all until they're about to go live. One of those projects has been a prototype of an intelligent spam filter, built into the game itself. (Gallenite) Ideally, we'll be at the point within the next few weeks to where we can start talking about our progress down that front on the boards, in more detail. (Gallenite) But the end goal is, as you have a right to expect, that we're working hard to combat spam. </blockquote><p>If you want a brief explanation on intelligent spam filters, check out: <a href="http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bayesian_spam_filter" target="_blank" rel="nofollow">http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bayesian_spam_filter</a></p><p>For a more detailed explanation, this is a project by one of my former professor's grad students: <a href="http://www.cs.berkeley.edu/~kwei/projects/spam/spam.pdf" target="_blank" rel="nofollow">http://www.cs.berkeley.edu/~kwei/pr...s/spam/spam.pdf</a></p><p>and I'm sure that spam filters used by major companies such as Google or Yahoo are much more complicated...</p>

[Copperheadr]

Want to stop the gold spam ? Don't buy gold.

[The_Real_Ohno]

<p>Someone should just make some kind of mod that lets u disable all tells from players a certin lvl.  Even set in block tells from only lvl 1s in WoW stopped all my spam msgs.  Would work here to im sure.</p><p>Naggy is gettin really bad, pretty much a tell every 30 mins all mornin and well into the afternoon.</p><p>SoE DO SOMETHING! <img src="/smilies/1cfd6e2a9a2c0cf8e74b49b35e2e46c7.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" /></p>

[DragonMaster2385]

I agree, a level restriction would certainly get rid of a lot of spams.  Even something as low as level 10 would put a dent in it, as it would take time for gold sellers to grind to that level just to send tells.  Then, they get to 10, spam everyone, get reported, account gets banned.  Once that happens, they have to get a new account and start all over, causing a huge time sink.

[Maroger]

<p>When I got my 2 new character slots I decided to use them to make life miserable for plat sellers.</p><p>I created one each on the newbie isles and then if my high level got a "tell" from a plat seller on the newbie isle and the toon wasn't busy I would stop and log on my new PlatHater newbie on the newbie isle. Find the plat sellter and begin shoutint his profession all over the isle. I would then challenge him to a duel and keep challenging him till he logged off.</p><p>I had one logoff who was plat selling for one Domain and who relogged in about 30 miniutes selling for another domain -- obviously the domain names were part of a chinese ( I did a WHOIS on the Domain) plat farming outfit locatedin Beijing.</p><p>NOw I don't understand why SOE can't block those IP's and tells from Newbie isle - or give players tha ability to block tells by name or by level. </p>

[Sharp1]

<p>I am an American living in China and I have seen the way some of these people sit in these internet cafe's and play these games for hours upon hours and I have actually seen a "sweatshop" for gold farmers.  It was located in a very old apartment building, with about 20 computers and people manning each one.</p><p>Nobody really cares here, including the government, that this goes on and there is really no way to really stop it within China.  On a semi-positive note, EQII is virtually unknown here, those that do farm it usually are limited to less shops and more resellers (i.e. 1 shop will pay a commission to those sitting in the cafe's selling it).  WoW on the other hand is huge here, every internet cafe promotes this game as the #1 game and everyone seems to be playing/farming it.</p><p>I think the easiest way to slow it down is to stop all tells generated from trial accounts. </p>

[Themaginator]

<cite>Maroger wrote:</cite><blockquote><p>When I got my 2 new character slots I decided to use them to make life miserable for plat sellers.</p><p>I created one each on the newbie isles and then if my high level got a "tell" from a plat seller on the newbie isle and the toon wasn't busy I would stop and log on my new PlatHater newbie on the newbie isle. Find the plat sellter and begin shoutint his profession all over the isle. I would then challenge him to a duel and keep challenging him till he logged off.</p><p>I had one logoff who was plat selling for one Domain and who relogged in about 30 miniutes selling for another domain -- obviously the domain names were part of a chinese ( I did a WHOIS on the Domain) plat farming outfit locatedin Beijing.</p><p>NOw I don't understand why SOE can't block those IP's and tells from Newbie isle - or give players tha ability to block tells by name or by level. </p></blockquote>lol wow thats funny/pitiful at the same time

[Maroger]

<p>Interesting article in the NY TIMES on the subject of Chinese Gold Farmers.</p><p>Check out this URL: <a href="http://www.nytimes.com/2007/06/17/magazine/17lootfarmers-t.html" target="_blank" rel="nofollow">http://www.nytimes.com/2007/06/17/m...tfarmers-t.html</a></p>

[Sedenten]

<p>I'll be honest -- I don't want an intelligent spam filter, at least not as a sole way of combatting the spam.  I don't want anything that relies on code to hopefully "catch" what the code considers spam.  Sony can add such an intelligent filter, but I would like to see that taken one step further.  I want a spam filtration system that I can tailor specifically to what I want the system to do.  If I do not want to receive tells/email from level 1-10 players that are not on my friends list then I would like to have the capability to do so.  Other games have the capability of doing this in some fashion, be it by developer designed tools or player designed tools.  I've played all the MMO's out there on the market, and no single game I've come across has so adversely affected by enjoyment of said game due to not having available outlets for players to combat the spam.  Sure the spammers are bad in WoW, but I can at least write my own mod to completely and utterly get rid of it, without having to turn ALL my tells off (as was so eloquently suggested by a previous poster).</p><p> To be honest, I would like to know how the spammers get away with being able to create character after character on account after account without the money loss from Sony banning the accounts becoming too much.  I do feel with all faithfulness that Sony is banning these accounts that are spamming away.  I'm just arguing that the banning isn't helping the spam at all.  If the spammers are not losing money somehow with every account that is being banned, then something needs to change so that they are losing money every time they lose one of these accounts.  If an account is not subject to monetary loss if the owner is banned or has their subscription frozen, then they should not be able to spam the server with tells from randomly named characters.  In other words, when a new player comes to the game,  they should be heavily restricted (not just on Trial of the Isle accounts) from being able to openly communicate with people all over the game world.  I totally understand the need for a community spirit and the ability for newer players to participate in that community, but until a player has committed themselves enough to put some of their money forward to play the game they should have zero capability to spam relentlessly until their accounts are finally suspended and/or banned.</p><p>For example, in the last month <i>every single day</i> I've been spammed by no less than 20 tells.  The average is probably around 40-45 or so tells in one sitting.  If I don't take the time to place these characters on ignore, I'll get 2-3 more tells <i>from the same character</i> before they disappear from the game world.  The other night I petitioned and reported every single tell I received--before my petition was put into "resolved" status, I had replied to my own petition and added a total of 8 to the original petition.  Two of those I had trouble reporting because you cannot submit more than one report every 5 minutes (I really wonder how anyone could exploit being able to report more than once every 5 minutes).  That added up to 9 individual characters within a 30 minute period sending me plat spam.  This wasn't just across one character--this occurred on 2 level 70 characters and 1 level 10 alt.  All of them are either /anon or /role, and all have their profiles on EQ2players.com set to private (none of which stops the spam in the least).  </p><p> Now there's some people that bring up the real life case--that we live in a world surrounded by advertising.  When we go out, there's billboards and ads all over the radio and television.  We're constantly pounded with advertising.  The problem is, that advertising always pays for something else.  To get an ad on TV, you pay quite a bit to get that ad there.  The same goes for radio, or renting the billboard to splay your add out for everyone to see.  To send out millions of spam via mail, you have some overhead cost.  For phone and email, you have ways to completely abolish spam.  There's spam filters for every email program to <i>very specifically</i> filter out what you don't want to see.  In real life, people hate spam as much as MMORG players do.  The difference is in real life either that spam is paying for something very important to justify it's existence, or there's tools to virtually get rid of the spam that we don't want to deal with.  Also, there exists "good" spam in MMORGs.  That good spam is the "WTS/WTB" auctions in various channels and shouts, from fellow players wanting to hawk their tradeskilled goods or hard earned spoils from adventuring.  I wouldn't really mind if players were able to put up signs in city zones and elsewhere advertising themselves as blacksmiths with an overloaded supply of plate armor or a bowyer open at the edge of East Freeport with the sharpest arrows this side of the Commonlands.  That sort of spam adds to the adventure, and is appropriate for the game itself.  When I'm playing an online game and paying for the immersion quality of such a game, I'd like to at least get a way to remove that advertising aspect from within the game that does not belong there.</p><p>This doesn't hold true in EQ2.  In EQ2 I talk to friends in tells all the time or are immersed in the game itself, either roleplaying with friends or simply getting into the lore behind quests.  Out of the blue I get a tell from Qalsasklgahpwoeighkgapwogh (not a real name to my knowledge) or some other oddly named character promising me the cheapest gold and powerleveling this side of Cleveland.  That kind of stuff really just kills the immersion factor of the game for me, and currently there's no way of combating the spam than just doing a /report and taking 2 minutes to stop what I'm doing and fill out a petition.  I could just ignore the tells, and go on with whatever I was doing, but if I don't at least /ignore that character, I find myself getting spammed constantly over the next few minutes that person stays in the game world.  This is then repeated by several other characters, all filling my chat box with stuff I'd rather not see there.  I know the above may not hold necessarily true for every player in EQ2, but there are quite a few people who do share my annoyance with this sort of thing and are having our enjoyment of the game adversely affected by the constant spam.</p>

[NiteWolfe]

<cite>Maroger wrote:</cite><blockquote><p>When I got my 2 new character slots I decided to use them to make life miserable for plat sellers.</p><p>I created one each on the newbie isles and then if my high level got a "tell" from a plat seller on the newbie isle and the toon wasn't busy I would stop and log on my new PlatHater newbie on the newbie isle. Find the plat sellter and begin shoutint his profession all over the isle. I would then challenge him to a duel and keep challenging him till he logged off.</p><p>I had one logoff who was plat selling for one Domain and who relogged in about 30 miniutes selling for another domain -- obviously the domain names were part of a chinese ( I did a WHOIS on the Domain) plat farming outfit locatedin Beijing.</p><p>NOw I don't understand why SOE can't block those IP's and tells from Newbie isle - or give players tha ability to block tells by name or by level. </p></blockquote> So you feel its ok to break the game rules yourself to combat someone else that is breaking the game rules?(refering to your harrasment on the starter islands) Personaly i feel players like yourself that take the enforcement of game rules into your own hands to be no better if not worse than the  spammers themselfs. All your allowed to do by the rules is /report /petition them as soon as you go past that you yourself broke a game rule! you have set yourself up as judge, jury and exicutioner. A rule is a rule and the old saying applies 2 wrongs dont make a right!

[Rijacki]

<cite>NiteWolfe wrote:</cite><blockquote><cite>Maroger wrote:</cite><blockquote><p>When I got my 2 new character slots I decided to use them to make life miserable for plat sellers.</p><p>I created one each on the newbie isles and then if my high level got a "tell" from a plat seller on the newbie isle and the toon wasn't busy I would stop and log on my new PlatHater newbie on the newbie isle. Find the plat sellter and begin shoutint his profession all over the isle. I would then challenge him to a duel and keep challenging him till he logged off.</p><p>I had one logoff who was plat selling for one Domain and who relogged in about 30 miniutes selling for another domain -- obviously the domain names were part of a chinese ( I did a WHOIS on the Domain) plat farming outfit locatedin Beijing.</p><p>NOw I don't understand why SOE can't block those IP's and tells from Newbie isle - or give players tha ability to block tells by name or by level. </p></blockquote> So you feel its ok to break the game rules yourself to combat someone else that is breaking the game rules?(refering to your harrasment on the starter islands) Personaly i feel players like yourself that take the enforcement of game rules into your own hands to be no better if not worse than the  spammers themselfs. All your allowed to do by the rules is /report /petition them as soon as you go past that you yourself broke a game rule! you have set yourself up as judge, jury and exicutioner. A rule is a rule and the old saying applies 2 wrongs dont make a right! </blockquote>QFE I abhor the attitude that it's okay to break the rules to affect others who break the rules.  When you do that, you're no better than the ones you decry.

[Maldach]

<cite>Copperheadr wrote:</cite><blockquote>Want to stop the gold spam ? Don't buy gold. </blockquote> I don't buy gold, yet I get gold spam. Time for you to come up with another brilliant idea.

[Maroger]

<cite>Rijacki wrote:</cite><blockquote><cite>NiteWolfe wrote:</cite><blockquote><cite>Maroger wrote:</cite><blockquote><p>When I got my 2 new character slots I decided to use them to make life miserable for plat sellers.</p><p>I created one each on the newbie isles and then if my high level got a "tell" from a plat seller on the newbie isle and the toon wasn't busy I would stop and log on my new PlatHater newbie on the newbie isle. Find the plat sellter and begin shoutint his profession all over the isle. I would then challenge him to a duel and keep challenging him till he logged off.</p><p>I had one logoff who was plat selling for one Domain and who relogged in about 30 miniutes selling for another domain -- obviously the domain names were part of a chinese ( I did a WHOIS on the Domain) plat farming outfit locatedin Beijing.</p><p>NOw I don't understand why SOE can't block those IP's and tells from Newbie isle - or give players tha ability to block tells by name or by level. </p></blockquote> So you feel its ok to break the game rules yourself to combat someone else that is breaking the game rules?(refering to your harrasment on the starter islands) Personaly i feel players like yourself that take the enforcement of game rules into your own hands to be no better if not worse than the  spammers themselfs. All your allowed to do by the rules is /report /petition them as soon as you go past that you yourself broke a game rule! you have set yourself up as judge, jury and exicutioner. A rule is a rule and the old saying applies 2 wrongs dont make a right! </blockquote>QFE I abhor the attitude that it's okay to break the rules to affect others who break the rules.  When you do that, you're no better than the ones you decry. </blockquote>I think all is fair in "love and War" when you are dealing with chinese gold farmers. SOE does not appear to be doing anything about it.  If this were WoW you could kill them in PvP -- I understand that is getting to be a hot thing to do to them on WoW.

[Rijacki]

<cite>Maroger wrote:</cite><blockquote><cite>Rijacki wrote:</cite><blockquote><cite>NiteWolfe wrote:</cite><blockquote><cite>Maroger wrote:</cite><blockquote><p>When I got my 2 new character slots I decided to use them to make life miserable for plat sellers.</p><p>I created one each on the newbie isles and then if my high level got a "tell" from a plat seller on the newbie isle and the toon wasn't busy I would stop and log on my new PlatHater newbie on the newbie isle. Find the plat sellter and begin shoutint his profession all over the isle. I would then challenge him to a duel and keep challenging him till he logged off.</p><p>I had one logoff who was plat selling for one Domain and who relogged in about 30 miniutes selling for another domain -- obviously the domain names were part of a chinese ( I did a WHOIS on the Domain) plat farming outfit locatedin Beijing.</p><p>NOw I don't understand why SOE can't block those IP's and tells from Newbie isle - or give players tha ability to block tells by name or by level. </p></blockquote> So you feel its ok to break the game rules yourself to combat someone else that is breaking the game rules?(refering to your harrasment on the starter islands) Personaly i feel players like yourself that take the enforcement of game rules into your own hands to be no better if not worse than the  spammers themselfs. All your allowed to do by the rules is /report /petition them as soon as you go past that you yourself broke a game rule! you have set yourself up as judge, jury and exicutioner. A rule is a rule and the old saying applies 2 wrongs dont make a right! </blockquote>QFE I abhor the attitude that it's okay to break the rules to affect others who break the rules.  When you do that, you're no better than the ones you decry. </blockquote>I think all is fair in "love and War" when you are dealing with chinese gold farmers. SOE does not appear to be doing anything about it.  If this were WoW you could kill them in PvP -- I understand that is getting to be a hot thing to do to them on WoW. </blockquote>You can do that in EQ2, too, just start a character on the PvP server.

[Maroger]

<p>Found this interesting assessment of stopping gold farming on the net: <a href="http://www.ski-epic.com/world_of_warcraft_guide/world_of_warcraft_gold_farming_controversy.html" target="_blank" rel="nofollow">http://www.ski-epic.com/world_of_wa...ontroversy.html</a></p><div align="justify"><i>I believe that this is all simple economics for Blizzard -> As long as the gold farming is not causing players to stop playing the game, there is no economic incentive for Blizzard to invest in the additional programming effort it would take to stop or severely limit gold farming.  On a more subtle note, I actually suspect gold farming encourages more people to play the game (thus making more money for Blizzard).  Without purchasing a little outside gold, the game can get frustrating and boring.  Gold farming allows both poor players with a lot of time on their hands to play, and ALSO allows players who have an extra $20 but do not have much spare time to also play at the same level.  So for these reasons, Blizzard is watching to make sure they don't lose too much business, but is quietly allowing the gold farming to continue.</i> .........<i>What gold farming gold actually buys is the ability to avoid some aspects of the game that many people find time consuming and not very rewarding.</i>  </div><div align="center"> </div>

[Paxe35]

<p>Is anyone at Sony working on stopping all this spam? Ive been getting 3-4 tells an hour from plat sellers and the only in game mail I get is spam.</p><p>Its becomeing a burden to play this game, Getting spammed all days isnt my idea of fun.</p>

[Krelor]

Paxe@Mistmoore wrote: <blockquote><p>Is anyone at Sony working on stopping all this spam? Ive been getting 3-4 tells an hour from plat sellers and the only in game mail I get is spam.</p><p>Its becomeing a burden to play this game, Getting spammed all days isnt my idea of fun.</p></blockquote> I don't know if it's SOE doing something or they (the "service" providers) moved on but on Splitpaw - a certain infamous website hasn't bothered any of my chars last few days where previously I'd be guaranteed to get a few an hour at least.

[Silverpaws]

Between the hours of 4am and 6am, I received 20 spam tells to my AFK ranger.

[Rajasa]

<p>Simple solution to start at least.</p><p>NO transfers of gold to anyone period, other than a shared gold slot in your bank for your alts. You can buy goods from the AH but not privately. You can't email gold either, period. Of course, you can transfer equipment to other players but NOT for gold in return. </p><p>So, you can still give new players gifts. And yes, they can sell them to make some cash but NO transferring of money of any kind.</p><p>This restriction would not really harm legitimate players in any way.</p><p>Give it some thought.</p>

[Zehl_Ice-Fire]

<p>It's harassment plain and simple. You ask them to stop you tell them to stop you curse your head off to stop and it does no good.  </p><p>I know I just read something about it being addressed, but it's still not good enough for me. This has been an issue for a long time. I have wasted a lot of time /report & /petition because they [Removed for Content] me off a lot, but I say wasted time because this has been going on rampantly on Unrest since we had a server merge a year or so ago and it's even worse now instead of better. I have a programming background and I know if they can filter out bad words they can filter out phrases which are ALWAYS used in every one of their copy & paste spams. If anyone from the spam companies is reading this, you are (insert the worse words there are which would be filtered out) *#*%$*%*$*$%.   "enjoy the fun we bring you" Yeah it's so fun being <span style="font-size: small"><b>harassed</b></span> every 10 minutes to cheat.... so. fun. I mean maybe the 801st time you spam me I'll realize I've been missing out! I reply to them (politely at first) asking to stop harassing me but they think they are funny to just hit me 10x as often since I don't want it. Real nice. Maybe everyone wouldn't want to shut you down if you respected those who told you they don't want to hear from you again. Do you really think people who hate you are going to become your customer.... Please do something already, it has been a severe problem for at least a year now, I'm sure some servers are worse but the fact that you can buy 100s of plat from all of these websites on ANY server means it's some serious stuff going on that could be stopped if someone wanted to. If not a filter, how about if someone NOT on your friend list wants to send you a tell you get a request like if you are a guild promoter and someone wants to talk to you, if spammers actually do this it could get very annoying or even non spammers, a pop up while you are typing INC MEGA RAID MOB HEAL NOW and it steals focus.... just do the freaking filter. Please. Or you can kiss even more subscribers bye. I don't get why I can't have the option of no one sending me tells who is not on my friend list, it should be a safety for teens who play this game.</p>

[Zehl_Ice-Fire]

<cite>Rajasa wrote:</cite><blockquote><p>Simple solution to start at least.</p><p>NO transfers of gold to anyone period, other than a shared gold slot in your bank for your alts. You can buy goods from the AH but not privately. You can't email gold either, period. Of course, you can transfer equipment to other players but NOT for gold in return. This restriction would not really harm legitimate players in any way.</p></blockquote> I have 2 accounts and I 2 box often, what about when my rich toon needs to buy a horse for my alt or supply it with a few plat for fuel for tradeskilling or gear? If they could allow you to link up accounts that would be fine. And for buying pricey no-trade things like horses for friends, why not add a comission system like they did for tradeskilling?

[Maroger]

<p>Since the majority if not all of the companies spamming players are located in China, I think blocking Chinese IP's would go a long way to solving the problem. They surely have to know what IP's these spammers are sending their tells from.</p><p>Also if they would give us a filter to block tells either by location or by player level that would help too. Most of these tells come from Level 1's since the spammers know that  their toon's life is short -- until a GM bans them - I doubt they will go to the effort to level them up.</p><p>WHat is starting to get to be a PITA are the daily E-MAILs for gold. Surely SOE can scan the E-MAILs and block the obvious gold sellers.</p><p>And that doesn't even beging to deal with Plat seller bots on the Broker. -- although you can usually tell who they are.</p><p>I just want SOE to deal with the TELLS and the SPAM E-Mail and I can't believe it is hard to do.  </p><p>As for tansferring gold between players -- I believe SOE can tell if it is "bought" gold or not. I am sure they have a way to scan all this stuff and know what is legitimate and what is not.</p><p>I am more disappointed at SOE's lack of effort ( at least that is how we perceive it) and their failure to communicate with the players and let us know if they are taking action or if action is planned.</p>

[Rajasa]

<cite>Zehl_Ice-Fire wrote:</cite><blockquote><cite>Rajasa wrote:</cite><blockquote><p>Simple solution to start at least.</p><p>NO transfers of gold to anyone period, other than a shared gold slot in your bank for your alts. You can buy goods from the AH but not privately. You can't email gold either, period. Of course, you can transfer equipment to other players but NOT for gold in return. This restriction would not really harm legitimate players in any way.</p></blockquote> I have 2 accounts and I 2 box often, what about when my rich toon needs to buy a horse for my alt or supply it with a few plat for fuel for tradeskilling or gear? If they could allow you to link up accounts that would be fine. And for buying pricey no-trade things like horses for friends, why not add a comission system like they did for tradeskilling?</blockquote><p> Certainly, I would agree with that. My post was just to get a conversation started. We can tweak it a bit.</p><p>What I was trying to do is DEAL with the gold sellers. Limiting in-game mail, and tells et al... That is simply a way to avoid getting spammed. It in no way deals with the root of the problem. I was attempting to start a conversation to do just that.</p><p>Have to admit, I never thought about people with 2 accounts, but "linking" them is a viable solution to my suggestion.</p><p>Basically, we need to get rid of parasites. Not just mask over the problem by limiting "tells".</p><p><img src="/smilies/3b63d1616c5dfcf29f8a7a031aaa7cad.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" /></p>

[Gladiia]

<p>somewhere on page 17 or 18 of this thread (i think) was the timeframe when the tells were coming out like 1-2 minutes apart from each other - those couple of days seriously were rediculous.  The tells generally dont bother me much, but when i couldnt turn a corner without a tell it was very annoying.  I am at least happy that after that time there was like a 48 hour period with ZERO tells, and since then no more than one or 2 a day.  Apparently something was done to help out somewhere.</p>

[Silkmyst]

Gladiia@The Bazaar wrote: <blockquote><p>somewhere on page 17 or 18 of this thread (i think) was the timeframe when the tells were coming out like 1-2 minutes apart from each other - those couple of days seriously were rediculous.  The tells generally dont bother me much, but when i couldnt turn a corner without a tell it was very annoying.  I am at least happy that after that time there was like a 48 hour period with ZERO tells, and since then no more than one or 2 a day.  Apparently something was done to help out somewhere.</p></blockquote> Last time I played a few days ago (haven't bothered to log in after that), I got 8 - 12  tells per 30 mins, some from the same Oquaviz or whoever.  Like they are mass spamming anyone online repeatedly.  We tried calling out the names of spammers in guild chat so we could /ignore before everyone got them, but we couldn't keep up.  <img src="/smilies/0320a00cb4bb5629ab9fc2bc1fcc4e9e.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" /> I don't enjoy posting on this topic, but every few days these tells seem to stop for 12 hours at best, then accelerate to an increased intensity than before.  Like some sort of mutant virus thats unstoppable.  Its making me miserable. I've made this statement before, and I'll make it again:  These plat spammers from these websites are taking over Sony's MMO's.   Silk

[NiteWolfe]

<cite>Maroger wrote:</cite><blockquote><cite>Rijacki wrote:</cite><blockquote><cite>NiteWolfe wrote:</cite><blockquote><cite>Maroger wrote:</cite><blockquote><p>When I got my 2 new character slots I decided to use them to make life miserable for plat sellers.</p><p>I created one each on the newbie isles and then if my high level got a "tell" from a plat seller on the newbie isle and the toon wasn't busy I would stop and log on my new PlatHater newbie on the newbie isle. Find the plat sellter and begin shoutint his profession all over the isle. I would then challenge him to a duel and keep challenging him till he logged off.</p><p>I had one logoff who was plat selling for one Domain and who relogged in about 30 miniutes selling for another domain -- obviously the domain names were part of a chinese ( I did a WHOIS on the Domain) plat farming outfit locatedin Beijing.</p><p>NOw I don't understand why SOE can't block those IP's and tells from Newbie isle - or give players tha ability to block tells by name or by level. </p></blockquote> So you feel its ok to break the game rules yourself to combat someone else that is breaking the game rules?(refering to your harrasment on the starter islands) Personaly i feel players like yourself that take the enforcement of game rules into your own hands to be no better if not worse than the  spammers themselfs. All your allowed to do by the rules is /report /petition them as soon as you go past that you yourself broke a game rule! you have set yourself up as judge, jury and exicutioner. A rule is a rule and the old saying applies 2 wrongs dont make a right! </blockquote>QFE I abhor the attitude that it's okay to break the rules to affect others who break the rules.  When you do that, you're no better than the ones you decry. </blockquote>I think all is fair in "love and War" when you are dealing with chinese gold farmers. SOE does not appear to be doing anything about it.  If this were WoW you could kill them in PvP -- I understand that is getting to be a hot thing to do to them on WoW. </blockquote> Personaly i like to see those that turn vigilanty banned imo they are more harmful than the spammers. Those who do this harm inocent players as well since some of us fall into a farmers type of game play i 2 box and 3 box a lot farming gold for personal use yet i get yelled at trained and generaly harassed even thu i broke no rules.  all is fair in love and war is a cop out for if they can break the rules so can i!

[Maroger]

<cite>NiteWolfe wrote:</cite><blockquote><cite>Maroger wrote:</cite><blockquote><cite>Rijacki wrote:</cite><blockquote><cite>NiteWolfe wrote:</cite><blockquote><cite>Maroger wrote:</cite><blockquote><p>When I got my 2 new character slots I decided to use them to make life miserable for plat sellers.</p><p>I created one each on the newbie isles and then if my high level got a "tell" from a plat seller on the newbie isle and the toon wasn't busy I would stop and log on my new PlatHater newbie on the newbie isle. Find the plat sellter and begin shoutint his profession all over the isle. I would then challenge him to a duel and keep challenging him till he logged off.</p><p>I had one logoff who was plat selling for one Domain and who relogged in about 30 miniutes selling for another domain -- obviously the domain names were part of a chinese ( I did a WHOIS on the Domain) plat farming outfit locatedin Beijing.</p><p>NOw I don't understand why SOE can't block those IP's and tells from Newbie isle - or give players tha ability to block tells by name or by level. </p></blockquote> So you feel its ok to break the game rules yourself to combat someone else that is breaking the game rules?(refering to your harrasment on the starter islands) Personaly i feel players like yourself that take the enforcement of game rules into your own hands to be no better if not worse than the  spammers themselfs. All your allowed to do by the rules is /report /petition them as soon as you go past that you yourself broke a game rule! you have set yourself up as judge, jury and exicutioner. A rule is a rule and the old saying applies 2 wrongs dont make a right! </blockquote>QFE I abhor the attitude that it's okay to break the rules to affect others who break the rules.  When you do that, you're no better than the ones you decry. </blockquote>I think all is fair in "love and War" when you are dealing with chinese gold farmers. SOE does not appear to be doing anything about it.  If this were WoW you could kill them in PvP -- I understand that is getting to be a hot thing to do to them on WoW. </blockquote> Personaly i like to see those that turn vigilanty banned imo they are more harmful than the spammers. Those who do this harm inocent players as well since some of us fall into a farmers type of game play i 2 box and 3 box a lot farming gold for personal use yet i get yelled at trained and generaly harassed even thu i broke no rules.  all is fair in love and war is a cop out for if they can break the rules so can i! </blockquote><p>Frankly if SOE won't deal with the problem then the players don't have much choice do they?</p><p>My posts mostly have dealt with level 1 tell Spammers from the newbie Isles -- but if someone is training you and hogging a spawn you need, if they don't respond when you ask them politely, as far as I am concenred deal with and train them right back. </p><p>SOE is simply NOT stepping up to this problem. They get complaints, petitions etc. and yet they don't deal with it, at some point I think the players are justified in taking action.  If someone is farming a location and a spawn spot and someone comes up and politely says they need the next spawn for a quest and you ignore them and train them, well sorry I won't let you roll over me like that. </p><p><b><span style="font-size: x-small">SOE needs to step up and deal with this problem, their refusal to deal with plus their lack of response to this thread does not give me any comfort that they are dealing with the problem. </span></b></p>

[Dasein]

SOE is working on the problem, as the posted dev chat indicates. This is not a simple problem to fix, it's not like a bug in the game where you can release a hotfix. Dealing with spam without gutting the chat system or creating some unmangable blacklisting/filtering system is a very difficult task.

[Maroger]

<cite>Dasein wrote:</cite><blockquote>SOE is working on the problem, as the posted dev chat indicates. This is not a simple problem to fix, it's not like a bug in the game where you can release a hotfix. Dealing with spam without gutting the chat system or creating some unmangable blacklisting/filtering system is a very difficult task. </blockquote><p>I can't believe it is too terribly difficult to put in a fix so players could block spam  tells by levels.</p><p>I admit the plat farmers hogging spawn is more difficult to deal with and SOE may not have the staff to get on it right away. but I don't see why they can deal with TELL Spam more quickly. </p>

[Femke]

Don't know.... If I get<b> ONE</b> tell from a plat-seller in two or three days it is a lot. I just skip it an go on. A lot of chat in the channels is more annoying then that lately (specially the 1-9 channel). Femke.

[Triplin]

<p>Here is my idea to stop plat sales - I looked at GMworker and it says to pay with credit card or PayPal - so SOE should make a couple hundred accounts both in EQ2 and on PayPal, they should buy up a lot of plat, then call visa or paypal and stop payment.  This will eat at the margins of the plat farmers and make them increase prices - higher prices means fewer players buying plat, which would also mean a higher percentage of sales to SOE that don't get paid for.  After awhile there would be no profit in plat selling, because 9 out of 10 times the person buying the plat stops payment.</p><p>It would mean working with PayPal and credit card companies, but they have reputations they want to keep.  </p><p>It would force the plat sellers to use E-Gold or international calling cards in their transactions, and I am not sure those companies would be as easy to work with as PayPal, but those accounts are not as easy to setup either, still, I think elminating VISA/MC and Paypal as transactors would severely constrict the market.</p><p> SOE might also be able to spam GMworker with thousands of fake orders a minute, and see if their customer service people can find the real ones.</p><p>there has to be a better way to combat this than banning accounts that can just be re-opened.</p><p>I am not worried so much about getting spammed in game, it is a little annoying, but I am worried about the rate of inflation like in EQ, where you almost HAVE to cheat just to afford your equipment, since everyone is a millionaire.  The money sinks have to keep up with the rate of money generation or everyone gets richer and everything will cost more and more.   SOE has to balance item creation with money creation to keep prices stable.</p><p> If this was already mentioned sorry to repeat it - it is a LONG thread.</p>

[Jeridor]

<cite>Femke wrote:</cite><blockquote>Don't know.... If I get<b> ONE</b> tell from a plat-seller in two or three days it is a lot. I just skip it an go on. A lot of chat in the channels is more annoying then that lately (specially the 1-9 channel). Femke. </blockquote> I play on two different servers and I get a plat spam about once every 1-2 hours. It's really annoying. They're always in the starting zone... obviously they aren't on trial accounts, so I don't know why SOE isn't banning these accounts. They always have names with 4+ consecutive consonants, and almost every one mentions gmworker.com. I really don't see why soe hasn't done more about this. I also don't see why there isn't any dev posting about it (that I could find at least.) I'm really confused.

[Sedenten]

<cite>Maroger wrote:</cite><blockquote><cite>Dasein wrote:</cite><blockquote>SOE is working on the problem, as the posted dev chat indicates. This is not a simple problem to fix, it's not like a bug in the game where you can release a hotfix. Dealing with spam without gutting the chat system or creating some unmangable blacklisting/filtering system is a very difficult task. </blockquote><p>I can't believe it is too terribly difficult to put in a fix so players could block spam  tells by levels.</p><p>I admit the plat farmers hogging spawn is more difficult to deal with and SOE may not have the staff to get on it right away. but I don't see why they can deal with TELL Spam more quickly. </p></blockquote><p>It's not that creating an advanced filter system is <i>hard</i> to do at all (it might very well be difficult), but that Sony is not going to implement a filter system where players can choose to filter by level of the character sending the tell or based solely on who is on your friends list.  The reasoning is that they don't want to risk alienating new players from the community, since their assumption is that the majority of players over a certain level will simply choose to ignore everyone below X level.  This would prevent legitimate players in that ignored level range from interacting with the community at all.</p><p> In my opinion, that isn't a good reason at all to not implement such a filter system.  That kind of filter system will be the ONLY effective way of allowing players to combat the spam.  Banning accounts is doing nothing to stem the spam, and I do not believe an intelligent server-side spam blocking type script (which is what Sony has said is in the works) will solve anything.  People can work their way around such intelligent spam filters by simply altering their methods to circumvent the system.  If I only wanted to receive tells from people over a certain level that are not on my friends list already, those spammers would have to invest some time to level each spamming account character up before they can unleash their annoyance.  To be honest, I wouldn't use such a filter for long--the fact it exists would send a clear message to the spammers that their methods are not worth taking the time to do.  </p>

[Silkmyst]

Last nite on Mistmoore, I got so many spam tells in two hours I could barely message friends without being interrupted by paragraphs of the same junk.  Several were from repeat guys, like they didn't think spamming the entire server worked the first time around? A post or update on this topic from SOE would be much appreciated, do they really want us to barely be even to talk to other players due to this massive clogging of private chat by these guys? /eternal sigh Silk

[Sedenten]

<p>I figured I would update with my morning experience.</p><p> It's 7:30 CST my time, and I logged onto EQ2 around a half hour ago to work on a low level alt for some before heading to work.  This was on the Crushbone server.  In that 30 minute time period, I received EIGHT UNIQUE TELLS (i.e. one tell from 8 unique characters) advertising the same gold farming company (I don't need to post the name for most people to know which company I am referring to).  Three of those characters spammed 3 times in a row before I was able to stop what I was doing long enough to put them on ignore.  I petitioned and reported 6 or them, but was unable to report the last two because the /report command only allows one report every five minutes.  I logged out in pure frustration, as I couldn't even enjoy talking with an overseas friend without being interrupted by the steams of paragraphs from spammers.  That same overseas friend would receive the <i>same exact tells from the same exact characters</i> almost at the same exact time that I received them.  The delay was no less than 2 seconds from each tell.  So it seems readily apparent the plat spammers aren't hampered in their ability to send out massive amounts of spam within a very short time period (i.e. in less time than a human would be capable of typing).  It would only make sense that some sort of safeguard were placed on tells to prevent people from sending more than X amounts of tells every Y amount of seconds.  Sure the spammers could adjust their auto-spam programs to slow down to that delay, but that would still be slowing them down.</p><p> My ignore list is approaching 100 players, all spammers.  There's probably 100 others I didn't bother putting on ignore, mainly because by the time I was able to go through the steps of filling out another petition against the spammer the character had long logged out and no longer existed.  On one such day of fun filled chain petitions, it took <i>over two hours</i> for my one petition to be answered.  This was during daylight morning hours, so was not during an offpeak time.  I kept replying to that same petition, adding character after character that was spamming me.  By the time the petition was finally set to resolved status, I had received around 25 tells from 25 unique characters.</p><p>Almost every day, I send a very frustrated /report asking for an advanced <i>player customizable</i> filter system (i.e. ability to not receive tells from players in a certain level range, only receive tells from players on my friends list unless, both unless I have /lfg up), then log out to find something else to do.  My frustration is further multiplied when I read feedback from developers saying they have no intentions of adding such a customizable tell filter system to the game.  I have read and understand their reasoning behind this, but do not agree with it.  In the meantime, the tell spam gets more annoying and I get closer to closing all my accounts and giving up the game to the farmers altogether.</p>

[Stabbath]

I could be wrong, but I think spamming is a sign of desperation. I really wonder who would ever buy from them. Theres sites to go to like The Station exchange, that doesn't annoy people. I'm for banning accounts. Yes, they could go out and buy a new one, but guess what? They won't be happy about it, make less profit, and have to spend their time doing setting up accounts etc. At least they suffer annoyance, which is [I cannot control my vocabulary]-for-tat. I can control my vocabulary btw.

[Kaldrin]

Wow... 22 pages and no red names. Anyway, why not drop the website names on a hack list for 'investigation'? Oops... was that out loud?

[LowfyrWildforge]

<p>   The spammers are throwaway accounts.   It's highly probable part of the system is even automated, including the making of new characters, etc.</p><p>   And the ads are obviously working, because they keep doing it.'</p><p>Edited to add:</p><p> The reason the devs aren't talking about what they're doing to fix the spam problem is that talking about it gives the spammers themselves information to protect their own spam operations.   Or, let's hope that's the case, anyway.</p>

[kukubird]

It gets good then it gets bad.  Sadly, when I say good I am talking a spamm every few hours.......  I am very against these spammers, as it annoys the heck out of me.. and if I am tired of reporting em and taking time away from my playing... I can imagine others. I am getting to the point where I don't report all of them as I feel ( and rightly so ) that whatever is being done is not enough.  Maybe SOE wants this issue to just subside without any action taken that makes a difference.  Kind of like getting numb to a situation...... Spamm?  hmmm what should we do?  Nothing.. who cares.... we are a big company and I will have my job... so why bother taking the community serious.   The difference between a good company and a great company is caring about the little things that your customers care about.  ( even if the ramifications aren't blatantly obvious ). I gurantee you we have had many many many people leave the game relateed one way or another to these guys and their activities.  I know 3 accounts from my family have already quit.  Some people will say yeah what is a few 100 accounts a month lost due to these guys when the farmers themselves have 1000 paying subscriptions?  Well the difference is ( that for the life of me I can't understand why SOE can't see )  is that a banned farmer acccount will buy another 19.99 account the next day ( it is his job, if you loose a shirt do you say [Removed for Content] that was my last shirt .. can't go to work next day? nope you buy a new one ).  However, the people that leave cause they are finaly fed up will not be back.... they have many other shirts <img src="/smilies/3b63d1616c5dfcf29f8a7a031aaa7cad.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" /> I would give anythigng to know exactly what the guy from IGE was hired to do as VP of SOE.  Was it to spearhead new projects in the RMT games? Or was it to strike deals to allow this spamm and 3rd world farm companies ways to get around legal issues and company " happy face tell the players we hate spamm also charade "   Hey players we hate spamm as much as you guys do!  We are doing everythign we possibly can to fight these guys.. but they are just too darn smart for us!  Meanwhile.....** hushed tones ***  hey Mr. X spamm company.. we will leave the backdoor open, a lite on, a warm glass of milk... and our new VP to make you feel warm and at home.. Now to tell you the truth... do I honestly think the later?  Nope.. but man, after a bunch of years playing as a loyal customer with my whole family and many accounts.... you start to wonder. Someone posted a link to some efforts being made.... I just hope these are true words and not just anotehr stall tactic like when they were going to bann buddy account keys from spamming us.   Too my knowledge it hasn't been implemented and has not been talked about since.... hence, free reign for these guys to spamm you and me relentlessly without consequences. <img src="/smilies/9d71f0541cff0a302a0309c5079e8dee.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" /> Ohh well... we can only hope.

[Dasein]

SOE has no magic bullet to stop spam. The IGE guy was hired to help expand SOE's presence in Asian markets. SOE was quite upfront and clear about that in their press releases.

[tass]

all I know is I logged on last night and first thing I get BUY SOME SWEET FN GOLD MAN!!!!!!!!!!!!! 10 min later GMWORKER.COM [Removed for Content]!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! another min later 10% OFF!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! BUY NOW WOOOOOOOOO!!!!!! I swear to god, if I find even 1 of those tellers weather they work for soe or not Im gonna cut off all their fingers. and then im gonna mail every little bloody nub to whoever they say they work for. At least then their will be 1 less dam tell.

[kukubird]

I agree with you.... I think he was hired actually more so to expand company sponsored RMT in new and upcoming games. However, the Spamm tells and in game mail started right around when he was hired.  Maybe these companies saw it as a sign of... SOE is going to relax and we can try and grab more of the RMT market in these games.  Who knows.. it just left a bad taste in my mouth when it was announced. What a company says and what they are actually doing are often not the same.  Anyone that is of working age knows that by now or soon will <img src="/smilies/3b63d1616c5dfcf29f8a7a031aaa7cad.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" />  Agian, not saying this is the case here... but.... i just hate the coincidences.... Heck the guy was brilliant I guess if ignoring the rights of others to make money is your thing.  They blatantly skirted laws and hid behind walls in other countries to make millions at the expense of players and the companies that ran the games...   But.... guess that is why they hired him... has insights into the RMT and that it is without a doubt the future. I give SOE credit for having the vision to know that this is where these games are going.  Short of offering virtual items directly from the company for purchase.... RMT will be a part of these games for a long time and will only grow stronger.   Most of us that have played these games know it will always be there... The only question becomes if a company will try to tailor to both player mindsets or just ignore the one like a stubborn mule. You have 4 types of players... 1. hates all RMT 2. loves all RMT 3. Doesn't care and lastly those that say they hate it but buy virtual goods anyways<img src="/smilies/3b63d1616c5dfcf29f8a7a031aaa7cad.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" />  I think we should all have servers dedicated to our styles of play and rules should be strictly enforced on those servers.   Not the case currently...

[Sedenten]

<p>So I worked a few hours today, get home and log on for some more EQ2 (Crushbone server).  This is about 12:30 CST, so not at an oddball hour.  Within <b>5 minutes</b> of logging on, I get a spam tell.  While I am reporting and petitioning this person, I get a second tell.  I add that person to my current petition, but mention I cannot report them at this time <b>due to some stupid restriction placed on the /report command that doesn't let players use it more than once every 5 minutes</b>.  No problem--I reported that person a few minutes later.  About 10 minutes after that, I received another spam tell from another company (not going to say the company name).  This one <i>almost</i> made me smile, as the tell itself was dead opposite of one I would suspect of a business trying to sway customers:</p><p>"Get extra 10% gold 4 free 4 ne order  while u register on new XXX.com wesite.cheapest price plus largest bonus,pls visit XXX.com for further details."</p><p>So not only are they spamming relentlessly and annoying other players (those two points alone make me never want to do business with this company), but they can't bother to actually spell out the actual words in their spam in a way that might draw people in.  If I'm ever doing business with a company that is interested in my money, I'm not going to purchase anything from someone that feels the need to use "4" instead of "for", "u" instead of "you", and the worst, "ne" instead of "any".  That's not even mentioning the fact they mispelled "website".  </p><p> My original petition still hasn't been resolved, so I add this person to the list.  I suspect in the next 10 minutes I'll get more.</p><p> If Sony has implemented something in the background that hasn't been mentioned publicly, it is doing a horrible job of eliminating or reducing the spam.  I've heard more measures will be implemented at some point, but I am highly doubting anything as impassive as an "intelligent spam blocker" will do much to solve this issue.  I also submitted 2 feedbacks today requesting they implement a customizable /tell filter so that I can meticulously build my own personal anti-spam filter for my tells.  That still won't solve <b><i>all</i></b> the issues, but it will give some relief while Sony does whatever they want to in order to address the issue in a more impassive manner.</p>

[Moongloom]

<p>To put the name of someone on ignore I just hit reply, which autotypes their name in.  Then I just overwrite /ignore on the /tell.  Saves much time.  </p><p>As sad as I am to say but putting yourself on /anon or /roleplay helps.  I get maybe one tell a day like this.  And those are most likely from the ones that get your game name from EQ2Players.com.  </p>

[Xant1]

Thanks for the tips, will be using anon right away <img src="/smilies/3b63d1616c5dfcf29f8a7a031aaa7cad.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" /> Bilzzard is now taking one of the companies to court for spamming in game..I wonder if SOE will ever do this.

[willnotuse]

I, and others, have noticed no real difference between having /anon and /role on as compared to not.  Whether they pull your name from EQ2players.com or from /who all (which btw does show your name even if you are /role or /anon hint hint and they can parse that hint hint) does not matter. Mostly when and how many tells you get depends on what time of day you are on and if you actually use the chat channels.  It tends to stay quiet for me when I don't touch the chat channels (not always but most).

[Martessa]

<p>I agree it's annoying.  In the beginning I thought by adding them to my ignore it would stop.  But the names keep changing, oh well <img src="/smilies/2786c5c8e1a8be796fb2f726cca5a0fe.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" />.   I think the only thing you can do is ignore them.  Besides they don't interfere in my game that much.  I know it's not the answer you are looking for but it works for me.  I have my Tells and Group chat in the same window, which is separate from the general game chat and the Guild chat, which are in their own windows.  If I'm grouped and the gold sellers send their tells, I'll see it instantly and then it scrolls by instantly.  </p><p>What annoys me is when they send their tells when I'm not grouped. I'll hear that familiar "pop" Then I'm like,  Oh goody! Someone is inviting me to join their group.  Or maybe it's someone friendly just trying say hello.  I will  then click over from my guild chat window or the general chat window  (I love reading the fun conversations, in ooc) only to find it's them.  Darn! <img src="/smilies/136dd33cba83140c7ce38db096d05aed.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" /> Anyway, IMO the best thing to do is just ignore them.  They are probably not going to go away.  </p><p>I hope that helps.  <img src="/smilies/8a80c6485cd926be453217d59a84a888.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" /></p>

[Ama]

<cite>Xant1 wrote:</cite><blockquote>Thanks for the tips, will be using anon right away <img src="/smilies/3b63d1616c5dfcf29f8a7a031aaa7cad.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" /> Bilzzard is now taking one of the companies to court for spamming in game..I wonder if SOE will ever do this. </blockquote><p> Unfortunately it is hard to do something against these plat sellers and their disturbing tells.  What needs to be done is SoE needs to track these new accounts made and who they are registered to.  They also need to bypass IP addresses so that the fake shadow company they are using isn't shown but the users.  </p><p>Have a feeling it may come down to finding if certain companies are US based or foreign based.  If they are foreign based then they'll have to get their overseas subsidiaries to do the prosecuting.  </p>

[Jeridor]

<p>Tips from someone who gets way too many, too:</p><p>1. Click on their name and select ignore.</p><p>2. Hit r for reply. Select their name in that line using shift and your left/right arrow keys, then hit ctrl+c to copy to clipboard.</p><p>3. Use /report then ctrl+v to paste their name.</p><p>4. Use /petition and ctrl+v to paste their name into the petition window.</p><p>5. Don't forget you can only have 1 active petition at a time, so check your history -> questions list to see if your last one is active before you waste time on a new one.</p>

[Eldcen]

<cite>Amana wrote:</cite><blockquote><cite>Xant1 wrote:</cite><blockquote>Thanks for the tips, will be using anon right away <img src="/smilies/3b63d1616c5dfcf29f8a7a031aaa7cad.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" /> Bilzzard is now taking one of the companies to court for spamming in game..I wonder if SOE will ever do this. </blockquote><p> Unfortunately it is hard to do something against these plat sellers and their disturbing tells.  What needs to be done is SoE needs to track these new accounts made and who they are registered to.  They also need to bypass IP addresses so that the fake shadow company they are using isn't shown but the users.  </p><p>Have a feeling it may come down to finding if certain companies are US based or foreign based.  If they are foreign based then they'll have to get their overseas subsidiaries to do the prosecuting.  </p></blockquote>I don't know anything about Blizzard's lawsuit, but good for them.  I know going after a plat seller is all but impossible, 1) because most if not all are not in the US, and 2) Whether it is truly illegal, criminally, or civilly is debatable. But the tack Blizzard might be taking is the volume of tells is annoying their paying customers enough to make them lose customers.  While RMT may or may not be a criminal or civil offense, deliberately doing something to cause another company to lose customers probably is. Anyway, I hope Blizzard's lawsuit is a success, because it will set a precedent.

[Xant1]

<cite>Eldcen wrote:</cite><blockquote><cite>Amana wrote:</cite><blockquote><cite>Xant1 wrote:</cite><blockquote>Thanks for the tips, will be using anon right away <img src="/smilies/3b63d1616c5dfcf29f8a7a031aaa7cad.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" /> Bilzzard is now taking one of the companies to court for spamming in game..I wonder if SOE will ever do this. </blockquote><p> Unfortunately it is hard to do something against these plat sellers and their disturbing tells.  What needs to be done is SoE needs to track these new accounts made and who they are registered to.  They also need to bypass IP addresses so that the fake shadow company they are using isn't shown but the users.  </p><p>Have a feeling it may come down to finding if certain companies are US based or foreign based.  If they are foreign based then they'll have to get their overseas subsidiaries to do the prosecuting.  </p></blockquote>I don't know anything about Blizzard's lawsuit, but good for them.  I know going after a plat seller is all but impossible, 1) because most if not all are not in the US, and 2) Whether it is truly illegal, criminally, or civilly is debatable. But the tack Blizzard might be taking is the volume of tells is annoying their paying customers enough to make them lose customers.  While RMT may or may not be a criminal or civil offense, deliberately doing something to cause another company to lose customers probably is. Anyway, I hope Blizzard's lawsuit is a success, because it will set a precedent. </blockquote> Thanks for the replies everyone <img src="/smilies/3b63d1616c5dfcf29f8a7a031aaa7cad.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" /> Eldcen, I think what they are doing is not actually trying to prosecute them for selling (which would probably be very difficult, agreed), but prosecute them for using their game for advertising their own business. I guess it might be the same as an employee from one shop going into another and spamming their own wares. It will certainly be interesting to see the outcome <img src="/smilies/8a80c6485cd926be453217d59a84a888.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" /> Apparently the company's main office is in Miami.

[Jeridor]

<p>If it's any indication of what SOE's doing about the problem, I just received notification that a thread I started to suggest augmenting /petition to make it easier to deal with spammers was being removed because other spam related topics exist. Those topics weren't related to the same sort of request I made for /petition, but the moderator felt it was more important that we avoid two threads remotely like each other than perhaps make it easier for players to fight this plat spam problem.</p><p>So, that's apparently how important this issue is to at least one person in the organization.</p>

[Image_Vain]

Does it really ruin your gameplay? I mean it's just a /tell

[Jrral]

<cite>Amana wrote:</cite><blockquote><p>Unfortunately it is hard to do something against these plat sellers and their disturbing tells.  What needs to be done is SoE needs to track these new accounts made and who they are registered to.  They also need to bypass IP addresses so that the fake shadow company they are using isn't shown but the users.</p></blockquote>Unfortunately those new accounts (the ones used for spamming) are registered to made-up names and paid for by game-time cards or single-use debit cards that were bought with cash. There's no need for anything more 'cause those accounts aren't expected to last more than a half-hour, certainly not a full month. It's impossible to trace such an account because there's no real information to trace. The only way to change this would be to eliminate game-time cards and refuse to accept debit cards (even the Visa/Mastercard-branded ones), and then require an actual charge to the credit card even for the first month that you currently get for free by buying the game. And even that wouldn't help if the spammers are using stolen credit card information. As far as bypassing the IP address, you do realize you <i>can't</i>, right? The IP address belongs to the computer being used to run the game client, not the person owning the account. There's no way to lock an IP address to a person, not without breaking the entire Internet in the process.

[Jrral]

Aphlos@Lucan DLere wrote: <blockquote><p>If it's any indication of what SOE's doing about the problem, I just received notification that a thread I started to suggest augmenting /petition to make it easier to deal with spammers was being removed because other spam related topics exist. </p></blockquote>SOE quite a while back added an automatic process that scans /reports and automatically flags gold-selling spams for action. So you don't need to bother with /petition, just "/report <name> gold selling spam" and let the system take care of it.

[Blintok]

fastest and easiest way to add them to ignore is left click the name in chat window then click - "toggle ignore"

[Windowlicker]

I just spam them right back. I"ll tap my up arrow and enter over and over with something like: "OH BOY PLAT SPAM" and they seem to log off pretty quickly.  I'll send them group invites, guild invites, or anything that'll pop up a confirmation box. At the very least it makes me feel better spamming them back <img src="/smilies/3b63d1616c5dfcf29f8a7a031aaa7cad.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" /> Edit: And just in case anyone would like to call these people up and talk to them in person about this harrassment, I'd like to point out you can do a Domain Name lookup on each WWW and quickly pickup contact information for the business, and the people's names who are responsible. <a href="http://www.networksolutions.com/whois/results.jsp?domain=gmworker.com" target="_blank" rel="nofollow">http://www.networksolutions.com/who...in=gmworker.com</a>

[erin]

<cite>Image_Vain wrote:</cite><blockquote>Does it really ruin your gameplay? I mean it's just a /tell </blockquote>"A" tell?  No, its dozens of tells during a single play session.  Multiple lines of text that might mean something, so you start to read it only to realize its just another plat spam.  Maybe if you don't get any tells from other people, it wouldn't matter, but if you have friends in the game and get regular tells, then the plat spam is an annoyance because you have to read it to see if its "good" or "bad".

[Jeridor]

<cite>Image_Vain wrote:</cite><blockquote>Does it really ruin your gameplay? I mean it's just a /tell </blockquote>It's just jarring. I'm sure many people are less bothered by it, and I salute them for it. But to me, it's a real annoyance. It's not the end of the world, but I get enough spam every day and deal with it enough in both my personal mailboxes and combating it on the mail server I operate. Confronting it in game too is a nuisance and sort of breaks away some of my "escape from reality" offered by EQ2.

[Jeridor]

Jrral@Unrest wrote: <blockquote>Aphlos@Lucan DLere wrote: <blockquote><p>If it's any indication of what SOE's doing about the problem, I just received notification that a thread I started to suggest augmenting /petition to make it easier to deal with spammers was being removed because other spam related topics exist. </p></blockquote>SOE quite a while back added an automatic process that scans /reports and automatically flags gold-selling spams for action. So you don't need to bother with /petition, just "/report <name> gold selling spam" and let the system take care of it. </blockquote>Hmm, I hadn't heard this. I wish the moderator in question had stated this, it sure would have helped.

[avow]

<p>A few players are suing gold selling spammers using the small claims or lower court of California. for 500 dollers each instance. A judge has said that players who pay for the subscription and have been affected by the spammers HAVE STANDING and can sue.</p><p>the idea is to also get a restraining order-cease and desist order(s) anti-harrasment orders against the companys/websites/accounts used in spamming and harvesting.  they will also demand to see the accounts true owners in DISCLOSURE or reveal to track them down.</p><p>They do not expect the companies to show up in court to defend themselves nor to pay for the awarded damages therefore orders to use a collection process are ready which include seizing assets and income of anyone involed in the sale/harvesting/spamming of gold sales.etc.</p><p>I am not a lawyer nor do i play one on tv.  This is going to be fun!</p>

[Silverpaws]

Is there a 3rd party program that could stop the plat spam without breaking th EULA?  I know we have programmer geeks out there.  Lets start the revolution instead of waiting for SOE.

[Silverpaws]

I just sent one of the spam companies and 'opt out' request per federal regulation requirements. <a href="http://www.spamlaws.com/federal/108s877.shtml" target="_blank" rel="nofollow">http://www.spamlaws.com/federal/108s877.shtml</a>

[avow]

<p>If you are going to sue the plat spammers these are some of the arguements being used:  asserting various causes of action, including unfair trade practices, interference with contractual relations (player and soe), and breach of contract.  By the way, soe is not required (yet) to do anything about the plat farmers if they do not want to.  </p><p>If they really wanted to be strict they could say the plat farmers are allowed to spam you as much as they want since soe has provided you with an /ignore function and they can use chat channels and tells just like you can. I don't speak on soe's behalf but i have heard this arguement from asian and european gamer blogs.  </p>

[Dalgor1]

<p>Well, after more /Tells from plat sellers than I care to talk about. Here are the truths I've come to.</p><p> 1) Plat selling is a very good industry. You know this because as of this day there are at least 3 Web sites using in-game spamming, if thet are not making money then they are not doing it. How do they make money? People playing EQ2 buy plat! They ain't selling it to each other!</p><p>2) It is to easy to buy and create new players. Plat spammers can buy a basic account for one month and spam away till that account gets banned. They hope they draw in enough business to offset the cost and they will if all they have to do is make a level 1 player, park it on the noob isle, do a Global Who All, and spam till they are made to go away.</p><p>Here is how you kill most of the spam. I'm talking to seasoned players, by the time a REAL Noob figures out what is going on he/she has left the Isle or is in Neriak/Gfay falling from trees and leveling away.</p><p>Sony, create Level Filters for sending personal messages in the ranges from levels 1 thru 9 and 10 thru 19. Fix it so default is ON for no tells from those levels unless Friends List is on. That way Guildies can add them to Friend list and other friends who know this players main can add them. Plat Spammers are not going to waste the time leveling a spammer much past level 10, because they soon will get banned. The shear number of new spam accounts is what is making it seem like Sony is doing nothing.</p><p>Stop players in level range 1 thru 15 or so from doing global Who ALL searches. Seasoned players can find each other, noobs, real noobs, have no clue nor do they need to know I have a level 70 Fury playing. Also, why do players in the noob levels, 1 thru 15, need to know anything outside the Zone they are in when it comes to Player Searches? The only reason a level 1 player wants to know who every other player on the server is, to send out those Plat Spams!</p><p>You cannot stop it, but you can make it so the spammers take a hard lick by having to level a player past 15 to do Global Searches or send random tells. When that account gets banned it will hurt.</p><p>Other than that, I'm a happy camper. Neriak is an Awesome place, EQ1 should be drooling and they are. This patch is a good one guys. Lots of Eye candy, most excellent quests, good solo play and grouping into the high teens if ya want. My hat is off to that team who did it. </p><p>Sign me,</p><p>Woadheart on the Nek</p>

[Dasein]

Ostacizing the new players is also a good way to kill a game. Placing restrictions on lower level players will hurt the game far more than plat spam will.

[k7eric]

Dalgor1 wrote: <blockquote><p>Stop players in level range 1 thru 15 or so from doing global Who ALL searches. Seasoned players can find each other, noobs, real noobs, have no clue nor do they need to know I have a level 70 Fury playing. Also, why do players in the noob levels, 1 thru 15, need to know anything outside the Zone they are in when it comes to Player Searches? The only reason a level 1 player wants to know who every other player on the server is, to send out those Plat Spams!</p></blockquote><p> This won't work...all they need is one higher level character (even I can get to 20 in one long day) on a seperate box to do the who ALL search and generate the list of active players.</p><p>I think the number one easiest thing to do would be to block tells before level 5 outside of your starting zone.  It's quick, easy (probably mentioned many times before) and would at least make it a "little" more difficult to drop a lvl 1 character in to spam away.</p><p>The only real solution though is a built in filter run by SOE.  There is simply too much money being made to let a little thing like a level restriction or zone tell restriction stop them.  When you're making six figures doing this do you really care if it takes an extra day to spam your crud out?</p>

[Silkmyst]

<cite>Dasein wrote:</cite><blockquote>Ostacizing the new players is also a good way to kill a game. Placing restrictions on lower level players will hurt the game far more than plat spam will. </blockquote> Really?  I can barely get a word in edgewise to my online friends now without a couple paragraphs of spam (last nite three different companies, this morning so much spam I couldn't read my own chat).   So, how do you expect to be able to even get through to anyone to ask a higher level player a question? I am beginning to believe that SOE really doesn't care.  Seems like a year or so back, they blocked tells from Queens colony to the main island.  It worked.  Now its open season, and no recent word on any plan to deal with this.  Might as well just turn off tells altogether and talk on the phone, since apparently a tell filter is just too much trouble to create.  Or perhaps they money made from plat spam game cards or whatever is just too good to pass up to risk alienating them. Silk

[Silkmyst]

Aphlos@Lucan DLere wrote: <blockquote>Jrral@Unrest wrote: <blockquote>Aphlos@Lucan DLere wrote: <blockquote><p>If it's any indication of what SOE's doing about the problem, I just received notification that a thread I started to suggest augmenting /petition to make it easier to deal with spammers was being removed because other spam related topics exist. </p></blockquote>SOE quite a while back added an automatic process that scans /reports and automatically flags gold-selling spams for action. So you don't need to bother with /petition, just "/report <name> gold selling spam" and let the system take care of it. </blockquote>Hmm, I hadn't heard this. I wish the moderator in question had stated this, it sure would have helped. </blockquote> And another thing /rant....  only one report per five minutes is allowed, I get 5 spam tells in two minutes.  Can't report them all or keep up.  The amount of spam tells is multiplying exponentially. Silk

[Dasein]

I see maybe 2-3 tells a week. On a rare day, I might get maybe 2 spam tells. It seems a small group of people get a very large number of tells, while  the rest of the population gets only a few. Thus, for me, plat spam is not much of a concern, whereas the disruptive effects of placing limits on tells and such would be much larger. I am an officer in a guild, with many members spread over all levels, and so regularly need to be accessible for tells from all levels. Thus, level range filters are a hinderence to me.

[Silverpaws]

I easily can get 2-3 an hour. Why not just make it so /anon means just that.  You are anonymous.  Nobody can know if you are online or offline unless they are on YOUR friends list. Make it sort of like yahoo chat /invisible mode.

[bleap]

Well however you view this issue let me give you a warning. if you value your ability to post here do NOT post your opinion on it in any other thread you start. My husband was given a 3 day ban from these boards for posting a tounge and cheek thank you to the plat spammers. It appears it's OK for the plat spammers to spam us in game but do not DARE try to bring attention to them in any other thread....

[kukubird]

Sadly bleap- It looks like SOE affords the spammers more consideration then the players.  Soon players will move on.. tired of being treated 2nd class to the spammers/exploiters.... and nobody will be left but the illegal farmers etc... they will leave when nobody to sell to. Watching my server go from popular to ghost town in less then 2 months....

[bleap]

<cite>kukubird wrote:</cite><blockquote>Sadly bleap- It looks like SOE affords the spammers more consideration then the players.  Soon players will move on.. tired of being treated 2nd class to the spammers/exploiters.... and nobody will be left but the illegal farmers etc... they will leave when nobody to sell to. Watching my server go from popular to ghost town in less then 2 months.... </blockquote>Guk was suffering badly before the free xfers. It looks like with the end of the school year, plus a few xfers the population WAS climbing a bit...but now it's dropping again. I hope it's due to player's families going on vacation. It's ashame that plat farmers can spam the game with ads for illegal RMT coin, but when concerned players bring ideas to minimize it or complain about it we are told by the moderators that WE are in violation of the forum rules....The moderators need to hang their head in shame...I believe most of them play EQ2..they need to be lending their voices to the issue and not shy away simply because they work for SOE....

[Dasein]

<cite>bleap wrote:</cite><blockquote>Well however you view this issue let me give you a warning. if you value your ability to post here do NOT post your opinion on it in any other thread you start. My husband was given a 3 day ban from these boards for posting a tounge and cheek thank you to the plat spammers. It appears it's OK for the plat spammers to spam us in game but do not DARE try to bring attention to them in any other thread.... </blockquote>If he violated the forum rules, he got the punishment he deserved. The forum rules still apply to this topic, just like any other.

[Themaginator]

this is the thread that never ends it goes on and on my friends some people staaaarted posting in it not knowing what it was and they'll continue whining forever because... this is thread that never ends...etc etc. yall get the point

[bleap]

<cite>Dasein wrote:</cite><blockquote><cite>bleap wrote:</cite><blockquote>Well however you view this issue let me give you a warning. if you value your ability to post here do NOT post your opinion on it in any other thread you start. My husband was given a 3 day ban from these boards for posting a tounge and cheek thank you to the plat spammers. It appears it's OK for the plat spammers to spam us in game but do not DARE try to bring attention to them in any other thread.... </blockquote>If he violated the forum rules, he got the punishment he deserved. The forum rules still apply to this topic, just like any other. </blockquote> Right, I am sure he did....but you missed the point entirely...sometimes you need to break the rules to make a point...It's ashame that in order to make yourself heard on this issue you need to break the rules...No one at SOE is going to concern themselves with this thread...they don't give a rat's butt if the plat spammers break the rules and promote cheating in the game...Now go back to the basement of your parent's house and pretend you have a life..

[kukubird]

Sashtan- This is the thread that never ends because if you post anything remotely about the subject anywhere else.. you get locked and sent here. It is a hot subject- will SOE listen or continue to loose subs and make the same mistakes they did in the past like SWG.  People were up in arms against the changes.. SOE didn't  listen and ruined that game. Will they make the same mistake and realize it too late again?  We will see.

[Ama]

<p>Plat sellers are deffinatley stepping up their efforts and i'm just waitin to get banned by these scum suckers.  Spammed atleast 3 of the buggers back today with garbage till I saw they put me on ignore.  </p><p>Have to say right here and now SoE needs to make an excemption to the EULA where if a plat sellers spams you as harrassement you have all right to spam them back.  Always one thing to remember is these SoBs are not players, people who are trying the game out and what not.  They come in with one reason and one reason only with that being to undermine what exists.  </p><p>They spam legitimate players with garbage and need to be dealt with the harshest punishment possible.  SoE wants to make some money track these people down and make them destroy what they have accumulated.  Also make em fork over billing information to who they have sold plat to.  Then charge those people $5000 fines for corrupting the gaming community.  </p><p>At this point and time there is no grey area anymore dealing with this trash.  They are A.) harrassing players with tells non stop and when I tell a botter to F off i'm not gonna say something different the next day, B.) undermining the player economy and community through their profiting, and C.) are driving away buisness for SoE.  Already seen alot of players I knew leave not through lack of updates but because of this [Removed for Content].  </p><p>One thing I will say to everyone here is if I had the money I would go to the sleasest lawyer I could find and sue these people for millions of dollars. </p>

[Siogai]

<blockquote> Right, I am sure he did....but you missed the point entirely...sometimes you need to break the rules to make a point...It's ashame that in order to make yourself heard on this issue you need to break the rules...No one at SOE is going to concern themselves with this thread...they don't give a rat's butt if the plat spammers break the rules and promote cheating in the game...Now go back to the basement of your parent's house and pretend you have a life..</blockquote> Wow, [Removed for Content] much? Folks... it's a plat spammer. They're in every single MMO out there, even the free ones. It's like junk-mail in  your post box, spam in your inbox, just ignore it, it's not something to get your knickers in a twist over.  If you really want to get mad at someone for it, look within your guilds at the people *buying* the plat.  If there wasn't a market, there wouldn't be any sellers.

[Themaginator]

<cite>kukubird wrote:</cite><blockquote>Sashtan- This is the thread that never ends because if you post anything remotely about the subject anywhere else.. you get locked and sent here. It is a hot subject- will SOE listen or continue to loose subs and make the same mistakes they did in the past like SWG.  People were up in arms against the changes.. SOE didn't  listen and ruined that game. Will they make the same mistake and realize it too late again?  We will see. </blockquote>LOL WOW!  its so easy to make people angry here, don't take it so seriously, i mean look at the thread its 25 pages long its quit easy to believe it is a never ending thread, down fido down.  Anyway i won't voice my opinions on this because its a waste of time to type out a novel over it, when we already know what action is being taken and what action isn't being taken.

[kukubird]

sashtan- i honestly don't see where i was mad at you? Don't know why in any way you took it I was mad lol.... maybe cause I replied to you with your name? Anyways, I read again and again what I commented on about what you wrote and don't see where you thought I was mad.. lol... unless you were trying to provoke people? and were just waiting and expect8ing someone to get mad?

[Dasein]

SOE is aware of the issue and is working on an intelligent spam filtering system. I fail to see what more you want them to do about the issue. If you have relistic suggestions, SOE would be quit willing to entertain them, but thus far, all the proposed suggestions cause far more problems than they'd solve.

[kukubird]

I still don't get how turning off tells from trial accounts would hurt the community that much.  It is after all A TRIAL.  It would mean a lot less spamm for us players.. OR a lot more money from bannings.....  for SOE.

[Dasein]

They've already turned off tells from trial accounts. That change was implemented months ago.

[Nodok]

Someone had a great idea here to at least help with the aggravation.. <u><b>Let us (optionally) ignore tells from any level range we want, IF they're not on our friends list. </b></u>  If you don't want to use it you don't have to, but for me this would go a long way to solving my complaints for awhile I think.

[Nodok]

And Dasein, that's a pretty broad stroke you're using there.  "All suggested ideas have caused more problems blah blah"..  I disagree, I've seen several ideas that looked impressive and possibly doable with the right resources, at least that's how it appears from the outside. For those of you that don't have a problem with plat spam, consider yourselves lucky and stop taunting the rest of us who are annoyed with it while we try to find a real solution please.  Your comments of "its not a problem, ignore it" and "i only get 2 tells a week" are completely unhelpful.  Some of us do in fact get many tells and emails a day, and we consider it a huge problem.

[Silkmyst]

<cite>Dasein wrote:</cite><blockquote>I see maybe 2-3 tells a week. On a rare day, I might get maybe 2 spam tells. It seems a small group of people get a very large number of tells, while  the rest of the population gets only a few. Thus, for me, plat spam is not much of a concern, whereas the disruptive effects of placing limits on tells and such would be much larger. I am an officer in a guild, with many members spread over all levels, and so regularly need to be accessible for tells from all levels. Thus, level range filters are a hinderence to me. </blockquote> You're lucky, but on my server more than a small group of folks are getting these tells.  The tell filter would be optional, set it yourself.  I think folks who are really tired of being harassed would be the ones who turned on the filter. Silk

[erin]

<cite>Dasein wrote:</cite><blockquote>I see maybe 2-3 tells a week. On a rare day, I might get maybe 2 spam tells. It seems a small group of people get a very large number of tells, while  the rest of the population gets only a few. Thus, for me, plat spam is not much of a concern, whereas the disruptive effects of placing limits on tells and such would be much larger. I am an officer in a guild, with many members spread over all levels, and so regularly need to be accessible for tells from all levels. Thus, level range filters are a hinderence to me. </blockquote>Isn't that just marvelous for you?  The rest of us have to deal with multiple tells an hour, often from the same spam-character, plus e-mails.  I think a level based tell filter (optional) is one decent idea.  A proper filter that filters out all the variations of the words blankety-blank.com for the 3 major plat spammer companies would be better. Preferrably server side.  One step beyond that would be to allow us to add certain words to our own personal filter, thus allowing us to choose who and what to filter out.  Sure there's risks with all of them, yes some groups (lowbies possibly) will be alienated. But so many of us are on the brink of going back to single player games, that SOE needs to do something. I'm also frankly stunned that they haven't said one word in this thread.  Not even "we're working on it".  Nothing.  What ever happened to interacting with us, the frustrated, angry customers?

[hellfire]

Sure turn off all tells and ooc and say and chat channels1-70 and trader channels and mail.....................you have some game there. May as well just hop on the x box <img src="/smilies/69934afc394145350659cd7add244ca9.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" />. The funny thing is people actually think there is some magical easy way to get rid of this.Sorry but there isnt. Other funny thing is people think its just this game that this is happening to.News flash its every game out there. And the funniest thing is that people thinks Soe turns a blind eye to all this because spammers are still around.

[hellfire]

Erin@Blackburrow wrote: <blockquote><cite>Dasein wrote:</cite><blockquote>I see maybe 2-3 tells a week. On a rare day, I might get maybe 2 spam tells. It seems a small group of people get a very large number of tells, while  the rest of the population gets only a few. Thus, for me, plat spam is not much of a concern, whereas the disruptive effects of placing limits on tells and such would be much larger. I am an officer in a guild, with many members spread over all levels, and so regularly need to be accessible for tells from all levels. Thus, level range filters are a hinderence to me. </blockquote>Isn't that just marvelous for you?  The rest of us have to deal with multiple tells an hour, often from the same spam-character, plus e-mails.  I think a level based tell filter (optional) is one decent idea.  A proper filter that filters out all the variations of the words blankety-blank.com for the 3 major plat spammer companies would be better. Preferrably server side.  One step beyond that would be to allow us to add certain words to our own personal filter, thus allowing us to choose who and what to filter out.  Sure there's risks with all of them, yes some groups (lowbies possibly) will be alienated. But so many of us are on the brink of going back to single player games, that SOE needs to do something. I'm also frankly stunned that they haven't said one word in this thread.  Not even "we're working on it".  Nothing.  What ever happened to interacting with us, the frustrated, angry customers? </blockquote>If getting all these tells fom same person  ..../ignore.actually not sure why wouldnt ignore after first tell.any word filters are very very easy to get around.just look at bad word filter anyone that can spell a word  can get around it. level limit tells would be hardest to get around  but would be ways around it such as  chat channels and other channels. There are a dozen or so red named posts if countless other threads  that address the situation.

[dwarfminion]

<p>I'm gettin spammed like crazy lately it seems. One tell per 10 min at least, sometimes if there are two on (or its just a real fast employee) I get a tell every 5 min. Each time by a diff name (just randomly mash keyboard).  Example: dekltjwea.</p><p>A little bit of pink text by asgdseg saying "buy gold now!", doesnt bother me so much. But it does leave me concerned with the genre and how it seems this is becoming so rampant/blantant. </p><p> Possible Solutions</p><p>1 Whisper function is disabled till level 10. Only guild chat, zone chat, open chat is available till that time. </p><p>2 Code a program that flags names that are status quo like "oiujljm" for immediate investigation.</p><p>3 Cool down timer on deleting characters. E.V.E Online requires 9 hrs for a character to be deleted with only recieving 3 character slots.</p>

[Nodok]

Bigron@Najena wrote: <blockquote>Sure turn off all tells and ooc and say and chat channels1-70 and trader channels and mail.....................you have some game there. May as well just hop on the x box <img src="/smilies/69934afc394145350659cd7add244ca9.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" />. The funny thing is people actually think there is some magical easy way to get rid of this.Sorry but there isnt. Other funny thing is people think its just this game that this is happening to.News flash its every game out there. And the funniest thing is that people thinks Soe turns a blind eye to all this because spammers are still around. </blockquote> [Removed for Content] do you care if I don't accept /tells from less than level 50 unless they're on my friends list?  I've had 1 tell from someone low-level besides plat spam in years of playing.  Try considering the alternative of playing in a world with less people because they can't stand the spam.  Everytime I read a ridiculous reply to this problem I wonder if they're a plat buyer or seller, because clearly they're not interested in helping find a solution. I still think the level filter is a (potentially) fast and easy way to stop a lot of aggravation.  At lvl 70 it's (finally) easy to ignore the rampant farming in obelisk, pillars of flame and barren sky .. but I just can't get away from tells from level 1 sellers.  Why?

[Silverpaws]

If you could toggle /invisible, only those people on your friends list could '/who all' you, it would fix the problem.   It wouldnt restrict direct tells from people, nor would it restrict your friends from knowing when you log in or out.  It would only restrict people not on your friends list to know if you are online or not. Honestly, this would take care of harassment and spam all in one swoop.

[kukubird]

I had one petition open... and had to reopen it to add 2 more names i got within 2 minutes of each other. So 3 names they are backed up on one petition that hasn't been even looked at yet. No wonder these guys get away with it.... 19.99 to spamm 100's or 1000's of people for 6-12 hours or even more? 19.99 is cheap I guess... not only that they had 2 guys going at once...... Just rediculous.....

[Dasein]

Denuve@Mistmoore wrote: <blockquote>If you could toggle /invisible, only those people on your friends list could '/who all' you, it would fix the problem.   It wouldnt restrict direct tells from people, nor would it restrict your friends from knowing when you log in or out.  It would only restrict people not on your friends list to know if you are online or not. Honestly, this would take care of harassment and spam all in one swoop. </blockquote>No it wouldn't. It would be easy enough to rip a list of names from EQ2players, and then send tells out based on that. They do not need to be able to 'see' that you're online to send out a tell.

[NosajMa]

<cite>Nodok wrote:</cite><blockquote>Bigron@Najena wrote: <blockquote>Sure turn off all tells and ooc and say and chat channels1-70 and trader channels and mail.....................you have some game there. May as well just hop on the x box <img src="/smilies/69934afc394145350659cd7add244ca9.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" />. The funny thing is people actually think there is some magical easy way to get rid of this.Sorry but there isnt. Other funny thing is people think its just this game that this is happening to.News flash its every game out there. And the funniest thing is that people thinks Soe turns a blind eye to all this because spammers are still around. </blockquote> [Removed for Content] do you care if I don't accept /tells from less than level 50 unless they're on my friends list?  I've had 1 tell from someone low-level besides plat spam in years of playing.  Try considering the alternative of playing in a world with less people because they can't stand the spam.  Everytime I read a ridiculous reply to this problem I wonder if they're a plat buyer or seller, because clearly they're not interested in helping find a solution. I still think the level filter is a (potentially) fast and easy way to stop a lot of aggravation.  At lvl 70 it's (finally) easy to ignore the rampant farming in obelisk, pillars of flame and barren sky .. but I just can't get away from tells from level 1 sellers.  Why? </blockquote>Agree 100% with Nodok.  I'm sorry, what level 1 toon needs to be sending me tells at all? Unless it's a friend I know is rolling an alt, none.  And there's zero need to worry about keyword/phrase lists to ignore to keep up with; if I decide that no one under level 65 is going to send me a tell, that's all I should have to do.  I NEVER get spammed by a level 70 platfarmer; it's ALWAYS a level 1 froglok <insert class here> from Queen's Colony spamming me with platselling. I want people like Bigron to tell me 1) why I should have to put up with that, and 2) why hasn't SOE implemented such a SIMPLE idea if they're truly interested in alleviating the spam problem.

[Gladiia]

<p>People keep saying SOE isnt interested in fixing the problem, because they haven't used 'x persons' suggestion to fix the problem.  Only thing is that none of the other MMOs have used those solutions either.  Is it possible that ALL of these companies just don't care?  Sure, it's possible.  It's also possible that the people working for these companies that make the bucks have also got good reason to know why our suggestions don't work.  </p><p>Of course to that people want to know why someone doesn't post an explanation as to why our suggestions don't work.  If it isn't evident it would take a full time employee to read over, and reply to all the responses in plat selling threads, and it IS NOT WORTH $10 an hour to repeat answers that have probably already been touched upon before.  </p><p>Murder still happens in the world.  Must be because legal agencies don't care whether or not people live.  Stores in every city in the world still get robbed.  This is obviously because local police don't care about the merchandise of other people.  Extreme examples, sure.  THE PLAIN AND SIMPLE FACT IS THAT PEOPLE BREAK EVERY RULE KNOWN TO MAN.  THEY ALWAYS WILL, AND NOTHING ANYONE DOES TO TRY AND STOP IT WILL EVER WORK ENTIRELY.  PERIOD.  </p>

[zerosumga]

Did not read all 26 pages but an easy way would be to enable when we do an /ignore it does not just ignore that character but the entire account. That way if we get spammed once the person can't just switch toons and spam us again.

[LowfyrWildforge]

<p>Oh for the love of God, this is a 10 hour project.</p><p> 2 hours to gather requirements, 1 hour to make the plan, and 5 hours to code it, and 2 hours to test it.</p><p> Here, I'll even make it easier for you:</p><p> Put a field in all accounts (this may exist already) for trial accounts.</p><p>Code a feature to disable tells from people flagged with trial accounts.</p><p>If you know a buddy is going to log on and play, you can always uncheck the box.</p><p>Now, was that so hard?</p><p>Thanks,</p><p>Lowfyr Wildforge, PMP</p>

[Bolooen]

<p>I'll give my 2cp, although it probably won't make much difference.  Now that we have the new evil zones, I get up to 6 tells a session, always from level 1s in darklight wood.  As you guys have already alluded to earlier, its pretty much a waste to report or petition as they will just get a new account and do it again.  </p><p>I have an idea.  Attack the source, the websites.  After all, the spammers always advertise the same sites.  Have Sony, Blizzard, etc get together and make an announcement that they will begin class-action type suing of the websites or whoever sponsers the servers unless the plat/item/powerlvl-selling is discontinued.  Not sure how bad this is for every online game out there (some may allow it), so may want to limit which specific games are being targeted.   If they don't remove the targetted games, actually sue them to stop.   If they just change their website and keep selling, concentrate on the companies who sponsor the website server.  If I see that a customer of mine has a website for plat-selling and I know that it is a targeted offense for possible lawsuit, I'd prevent it to protect myself.  With any luck, they have no place to sell the plat, no reason to spam, etc.</p><p>Sorry, I'm not totally familar with how websites/servers are kept, I hope that made sense.  Its just an idea, so please don't crucity me for it, hehe.  <img src="/smilies/47941865eb7bbc2a777305b46cc059a2.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" /></p>

[Gladiia]

<cite>LowfyrWildforge wrote:</cite><blockquote><p>Oh for the love of God, this is a 10 hour project.</p><p> 2 hours to gather requirements, 1 hour to make the plan, and 5 hours to code it, and 2 hours to test it.</p><p> Here, I'll even make it easier for you:</p><p> Put a field in all accounts (this may exist already) for trial accounts.</p><p>Code a feature to disable tells from people flagged with trial accounts.</p><p>If you know a buddy is going to log on and play, you can always uncheck the box.</p><p>Now, was that so hard?</p><p>Thanks,</p><p>Lowfyr Wildforge, PMP</p></blockquote>Trial accounts can't send tells...

[Lavenderboi]

Here is my suggestion regarding Plat sellers.  If SoE were to put into effect that you couldn't leave the newbie island until you were level 8 and made it so you could not send tells until you left the island, it would mean that the plat sellers would have to level each character up before they could even send a tell to anyone off the island.  It wouldn't stop it completely, but it would reduce the time they can solicit their wares considerably and as they say, "time is money".  There are several newbie areas other than the island of course, but couldn't the same rules be put into effect simply by creating a zone line that cannot be crossed until level 8?  It would mean taking away a couple choices for players early on, but the plat sellers are doing that already.  Just a suggestion, not a popular one I'll warant, but players are going to be inconvenienced either way, just the lesser of two evils IMO.

[StoneySilen]

<cite>Lavenderboi wrote:</cite><blockquote>Here is my suggestion regarding Plat sellers.  If SoE were to put into effect that you couldn't leave the newbie island until you were level 8 and made it so you could not send tells until you left the island, it would mean that the plat sellers would have to level each character up before they could even send a tell to anyone off the island.  It wouldn't stop it completely, but it would reduce the time they can solicit their wares considerably and as they say, "time is money".  There are several newbie areas other than the island of course, but couldn't the same rules be put into effect simply by creating a zone line that cannot be crossed until level 8?  It would mean taking away a couple choices for players early on, but the plat sellers are doing that already.  Just a suggestion, not a popular one I'll warant, but players are going to be inconvenienced either way, just the lesser of two evils IMO.</blockquote>They would just log multiple accounts on, get them all to lvl 8 in about 20-30 minutes then log all the accounts off but one then start spamming until all 6 accounts are banned.  Wouldn't slow them down much. I play on Bazaar and I get tells about every 10-15 minutes.  Sometimes so quickly that my last /report hasn't expired yet (5 minute timer between /reports) and many times my old CS ticket from the previous spammer is still open so I can't report the new one (since SOE insist on only ONE complaint per ticket otherwise they complain that you reported more than one at a time).

[rubels]

<p>SOE please follow the below example. I play WOW and theres no spam .... if they can do it ... so can you.</p><p><a href="http://forums.worldofwarcraft.com/thread.html?topicId=106771592&pageNo=1&sid=1#0" target="_blank" rel="nofollow">http://forums.worldofwarcraft.com/t...o=1&sid=1#0</a></p><p>So I like to hear your excuss of why GMxxxxxx still is spamming us.</p><p>- Krov</p>

[LowfyrWildforge]

<p>If Trial accounts aren't the problem, then why hasn't Sony banned the accounts causing the spam?</p>

[Dasein]

<cite>LowfyrWildforge wrote:</cite><blockquote><p>If Trial accounts aren't the problem, then why hasn't Sony banned the accounts causing the spam?</p></blockquote>They do. The spam accounts are then recreated. It doesn't take much to set up an account in EQ2.

[Gladiia]

<cite>LowfyrWildforge wrote:</cite><blockquote><p>If Trial accounts aren't the problem, then why hasn't Sony banned the accounts causing the spam?</p></blockquote><p> Right, the accounts are banned frequently.  In an interview with an international plat seller, they said that sometimes they personally go thru three or four accounts a day.</p><p>(they being the plat seller - - not the number of accts SOE bans a day)</p><p>edit for clarification</p>

[Gladiia]

<cite>rubelson wrote:</cite><blockquote><p>SOE please follow the below example. I play WOW and theres no spam .... if they can do it ... so can you.</p><p><a href="http://forums.worldofwarcraft.com/thread.html?topicId=106771592&pageNo=1&sid=1#0" target="_blank" rel="nofollow">http://forums.worldofwarcraft.com/t...o=1&sid=1#0</a></p><p>So I like to hear your excuss of why GMxxxxxx still is spamming us.</p><p>- Krov</p></blockquote><p> I heard about this recently - very exciting indeed!  Considering how expensive litigation can be, I doubt that SoE or anyone else will follow suit until we see an outcome on this case.  Hopefully it goes well.  No matter how well it goes, it will NOT end plat selling, but if it is a succesful case, then I am sure it will bring a powerful blow.</p><p>sorry about the double post...</p>

[Dawnrise]

I did notice a sudden drop in plat/level service spam between June 27th and June 28th.  On the 27th, I must have been spammed at least 8 times during the day, and I reported it at least 4 times.  It was SO annoying! Then, the next day, not ONE spam - ALL day!   Now I know yesterday was LU36 patch day, but I don't see how that would have frightened them all away..... As long as I have more June 28th days compared to June 27th days, I'll be happy! <img src="/smilies/3b63d1616c5dfcf29f8a7a031aaa7cad.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" /> Deep

[Dasein]

<cite>rubelson wrote:</cite><blockquote><p>SOE please follow the below example. I play WOW and theres no spam .... if they can do it ... so can you.</p><p><a href="http://forums.worldofwarcraft.com/thread.html?topicId=106771592&pageNo=1&sid=1#0" target="_blank" rel="nofollow">http://forums.worldofwarcraft.com/t...o=1&sid=1#0</a></p><p>So I like to hear your excuss of why GMxxxxxx still is spamming us.</p><p>- Krov</p></blockquote> 1. There's still spam in WoW. 2. It is quite possible Blizzard will lose their lawsuit.

[kukubird]

I have a few accounts... on 2 of them I have 1 petition with 3 names each.... because I get spammed so fast .. the petitions don't get their cut and paste reply from the GM's fast enough. I log out and in on 2 srvers few different toons...... even while i am writing this i heard the tell sound in the background.... imagine it is another platt spamm.... <img src="/smilies/9d71f0541cff0a302a0309c5079e8dee.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" /> <img src="/smilies/9d71f0541cff0a302a0309c5079e8dee.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" /> <img src="/smilies/9d71f0541cff0a302a0309c5079e8dee.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" /> <img src="/smilies/9d71f0541cff0a302a0309c5079e8dee.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" /> <img src="/smilies/9d71f0541cff0a302a0309c5079e8dee.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" /> <img src="/smilies/9d71f0541cff0a302a0309c5079e8dee.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" />

[StoneySilen]

Auric@Oasis wrote: <blockquote><cite>madhatr wrote:</cite><blockquote><p> Or let us macro a way to reply to tell without having to type their names in or a pop up feature to report pp spam faster, i dont report anymore much easier to ignore them or turn tells off. </p></blockquote> The sad part is sometimes I get spammed faster than I am allowed to submit a second petition. You can only submit one petition per, something like, five minutes.  <img src="/smilies/2786c5c8e1a8be796fb2f726cca5a0fe.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" /></blockquote> The /report feature only works every 5 minutes.  I too have them so fast that my 5 minutes isn't up.  But I believe you also have to submit a /petition in order for them to do anything about it because if I remember right /report just puts it in a log.  They don't look at it till you /petition it. Anyway, I get them about every 10-15mins.  I generally am not too busy so I start talking to them.  They usually log off within a few tells.

[Maroger]

Gladiia@The Bazaar wrote: <blockquote><cite>LowfyrWildforge wrote:</cite><blockquote><p>If Trial accounts aren't the problem, then why hasn't Sony banned the accounts causing the spam?</p></blockquote><p> Right, the accounts are banned frequently.  In an interview with an international plat seller, they said that sometimes they personally go thru three or four accounts a day.</p><p>(they being the plat seller - - not the number of accts SOE bans a day)</p><p>edit for clarification</p></blockquote>What do they do? Buy a ton of EQ2 with account numbers? I mean to set up an account you have to have an account number from the box? They must spend a lot of money buying copies of the game I would think.

[Maroger]

Gladiia@The Bazaar wrote: <blockquote><cite>rubelson wrote:</cite><blockquote><p>SOE please follow the below example. I play WOW and theres no spam .... if they can do it ... so can you.</p><p><a href="http://forums.worldofwarcraft.com/thread.html?topicId=106771592&pageNo=1&sid=1#0" target="_blank" rel="nofollow">http://forums.worldofwarcraft.com/t...o=1&sid=1#0</a></p><p>So I like to hear your excuss of why GMxxxxxx still is spamming us.</p><p>- Krov</p></blockquote><p> I heard about this recently - very exciting indeed!  Considering how expensive litigation can be, I doubt that SoE or anyone else will follow suit until we see an outcome on this case.  Hopefully it goes well.  No matter how well it goes, it will NOT end plat selling, but if it is a succesful case, then I am sure it will bring a powerful blow.</p><p>sorry about the double post...</p></blockquote><p>There are actually 2 lawsuit pending - One is Blizzards against Peonsxxxxxxx and the other is by a player group and is a class action suit for harassment in game. But Blizzard is much more legally aggressive than SOE is.</p><p>The class action suit filed in Florida against IGE is by a group of WoW Players. You can read the PDF file outlining the complaint here :</p><p><span style="color: #ccffcc"><span style="color: #ffcc99">http://www.warcraftrealms.com/temp/ige-classaction.pdf</span> </span></p>

[liveja]

<cite>Maroger wrote:</cite><blockquote><p>The class action suit filed in Florida against IGE is by a group of WoW Players. You can read the PDF file outlining the complaint here :</p><p><span style="color: #ccffcc"><span style="color: #ffcc99">http://www.warcraftrealms.com/temp/ige-classaction.pdf</span> </span></p></blockquote><p>I would be much more interested in actually reading court rulings on the class-action suit, than in the complaint.</p>

[NiteWolfe]

<cite>Maroger wrote:</cite><blockquote>Gladiia@The Bazaar wrote: <blockquote><cite>LowfyrWildforge wrote:</cite><blockquote><p>If Trial accounts aren't the problem, then why hasn't Sony banned the accounts causing the spam?</p></blockquote><p> Right, the accounts are banned frequently.  In an interview with an international plat seller, they said that sometimes they personally go thru three or four accounts a day.</p><p>(they being the plat seller - - not the number of accts SOE bans a day)</p><p>edit for clarification</p></blockquote>What do they do? Buy a ton of EQ2 with account numbers? I mean to set up an account you have to have an account number from the box? They must spend a lot of money buying copies of the game I would think. </blockquote> pretty much yes, possibly even buy the accounts direct thru soe digital download. if i remember right the first 30 days are free with a new retail account and the basic eq2 is only 10 bucks. so even if the seller lost 4 accounts a day just 1 decent sell a day would cover the replacement cost. the rest is profit.

[liveja]

<cite>Maroger wrote:</cite><blockquote>But Blizzard is much more legally aggressive than SOE is.</blockquote><p>O, BTW ... in the thread about this issue, several WoW players pointed out that PeonsXXXXXXXXXX is only one of the dozens of gold-sellers spamming them. But Blizz only filed a lawsuit against Peons.</p><p>Why do you think Blizz only sued one company? I can think of one very very good reason: that one company is the only one they could file an American federal lawsuit against, because the others are off-shore & thus not subject to American laws. </p>

[Dasein]

1. The class action suit against IGE will not succede because part of the complaint is that IGE devalues player gold, and Blizzard itself states that gold has no real-money value. Were the suit to prove successful, it would actualy legitimize gold selling, as it would give player-held virtual property real world value. Blizzard itself has a strong interest in seeing that suit dismissed. 2. A company located outside the US can still be subject to US laws if the offense occurs in US jurisdiction.

[USAFJeeper]

This is really starting to hack me off. I have had over ten tells today, almost 10 yesterday. Dammit let me filter out under level 10 so that I dont have to see this crap. ANd no I dont care if n00b01 cannot send me a tell.

[Cuz]

I may have broken the 10 plat spam in one day mark. Could we get a new function /spam <name> that would be a direct plat spam report, and wouldn't be limited by the 5 minute rule?

[FireDragon]

I think the best idea would be to either: Make characters under 2 hours logged in unable to send tells or Make it a toggleable option to automatically refuse tells from characters under level 10.

[Yngwiem]

<p>Has anyone else noticed that you receive more /tells during the weekend than you do on weekdays? At least that's been my observations. I think it's because the plat sellers figure that Sony doesn't work the weekends. </p>

[Hukklebuk]

well it's about 1300 est and since maybe 0830 I've received 7 tells on a Monday from three sources [I cannot control my vocabulary] which translates to G M WORKER.COM  (why is that filtered?), Gamenoble.com and someone at <a href="mailto:[email protected]" target="_blank" rel="nofollow">[email protected]</a> email and same address but hotmail for msn messenger.   Yesterday was absolutely horrible.  I just invite them to a group and on the odd chance they accept, I kick them.  /reporting takes to long to be effective and they come back with another under 10 in 5 minutes anyhow. personally I say block anything under level 20.  If you really want to send a tell to a friend, use email or some other means until you're over 20.  If you want to do it that bad, level 20 can be had in a day if you push it or accidentally ding 20 in two or three days. But of course that's forcing the community to adjust to the plat spammers and not them to us.

[liveja]

<cite>Dasein wrote:</cite><blockquote>2. A company located outside the US can still be subject to US laws if the offense occurs in US jurisdiction. </blockquote>Yes, but actually "punishing" that company is a different story altogether.

[Crolack]

I was thinking. How about if setting it up so that if you send the same tell to lets say, 20 people within 30 seconds, it logs you off and locks your account for 3 hours.

[Dasein]

<cite>Crolack wrote:</cite><blockquote>I was thinking. How about if setting it up so that if you send the same tell to lets say, 20 people within 30 seconds, it logs you off and locks your account for 3 hours. </blockquote>It would be easy enough to add some random text to each message to make them unique. However, tell-throttling is a possible part of a solution, and looking for people sending mass quantities of tells in a short period of time is certainly a sign of a suspect account.

[Maroger]

I just got my First tell today from a Level 1 in DARKLIGHT WOODS -- not the newbie isles? Did they get run off the newbie isles or something?

[Maroger]

<cite>livejazz wrote:</cite><blockquote><cite>Maroger wrote:</cite><blockquote>But Blizzard is much more legally aggressive than SOE is.</blockquote><p>O, BTW ... in the thread about this issue, several WoW players pointed out that PeonsXXXXXXXXXX is only one of the dozens of gold-sellers spamming them. But Blizz only filed a lawsuit against Peons.</p><p>Why do you think Blizz only sued one company? I can think of one very very good reason: that one company is the only one they could file an American federal lawsuit against, because the others are off-shore & thus not subject to American laws. </p></blockquote><p>Well you only need to sue and win against one company to use the ruling as a precedent in actions against other companies.</p><p>I suspect they picked PEONSxxxxx since it is a relatively small-company and may not the financial resource to hire a top lawyer and to fight a long legal battle in the federal courts. By picking a "poor" defendant, a rich company like Blizzard stands a better chance of winning for less money than if they picked one with more money to fight the lawsuit. </p>

[Raveller]

Don't forget, the buyers are the real problem, because if the play buying filth wasn't around then their plat selling parasites wouldn't be around either. I don't think SOE has any desire to end plat farming/selling. The total number of accounts that are involved in selling and buying is probably more than 50% of the subscriber base.

[Gladiia]

<cite>Maroger wrote:</cite><blockquote><cite>livejazz wrote:</cite><blockquote><cite>Maroger wrote:</cite><blockquote>But Blizzard is much more legally aggressive than SOE is.</blockquote><p>O, BTW ... in the thread about this issue, several WoW players pointed out that PeonsXXXXXXXXXX is only one of the dozens of gold-sellers spamming them. But Blizz only filed a lawsuit against Peons.</p><p>Why do you think Blizz only sued one company? I can think of one very very good reason: that one company is the only one they could file an American federal lawsuit against, because the others are off-shore & thus not subject to American laws. </p></blockquote><p>Well you only need to sue and win against one company to use the ruling as a precedent in actions against other companies.</p><p>I suspect they picked PEONSxxxxx since it is a relatively small-company and may not the financial resource to hire a top lawyer and to fight a long legal battle in the federal courts. By picking a "poor" defendant, a rich company like Blizzard stands a better chance of winning for less money than if they picked one with more money to fight the lawsuit. </p></blockquote><p>Indeed.  You have to start somewhere to get the footing, and it works best to find the easiest foothole first.</p><p> and raveller - I hate to think any major mmo company would feel that way, but realistically, the money made from banning accounts on a frequent basis, so that they may then be recreated is bound to bring in more money than it costs.  </p>

[Raveller]

Gladiia@The Bazaar wrote: <blockquote> <p> and raveller - I hate to think any major mmo company would feel that way, but realistically, the money made from banning accounts on a frequent basis, so that they may then be recreated is bound to bring in more money than it costs.  </p></blockquote>There is certainly money to be made by banning the spam accounts and selling them new accounts at $10 a pop. There is also money to be made by banning the farming teams, though SOE doesn't seem to be doing much about them. However, if SOE were to aggressively ban the accounts of the plat buying filth, do you really think those players are going to keep coming back? How many raiding guilds do you think would come back if they were banned for buying plat to pay for repairs? How many casual players do you think would repeatedly buy new accounts if they were banned for buying plat because they're too lazy and stupid to figure out how to earn coin in-game?

[StarryEyedElf]

Tormod@Blackburrow wrote: <blockquote>some stuff..... ***jerkspammers***.COM  (why is that filtered?)..... some more stuff. </blockquote> Suffice it to say, if a word is filtered, that should be your hint to not put spaces in the word in an effort to evade the filter. So let's not do that in the future please. The primary reason that word is blocked is because every time someone mentions it on the boards, the only person on the universe who has not gotten one of their lovely messages will probably be the person who sees that site address. So while 99.9999% of the game has seen it and knows who they are, there is a chance that all you are doing by freely handing out their web address in a thread complaining about them is advertising for them.

[NiteWolfe]

<cite>Raveller wrote:</cite><blockquote>Don't forget, the buyers are the real problem, because if the play buying filth wasn't around then their plat selling parasites wouldn't be around either. I don't think SOE has any desire to end <span style="color: #cc0000">plat farming</span>/selling. The total number of accounts that are involved in selling and buying is probably more than 50% of the subscriber base.</blockquote> Plat farming is not against the soe rules and  is a allowable playstyle as long as you do not interfer with other players content. Please dont lump those of us that do farm with in the rules with  spammers!

[Bromir]

<p>Great the spammers are back </p><p>Level filter NOW please .</p><p>/ignore tells level x - xx </p><p>people on friends list wont be effected . </p><p>Give me my /ignore tells level 1 - 20 </p><p>I should be able to choose who I talk to </p><p>Brorim</p>

[Cuz]

<cite>Raveller wrote:</cite><blockquote>Gladiia@The Bazaar wrote: <blockquote> <p> and raveller - I hate to think any major mmo company would feel that way, but realistically, the money made from banning accounts on a frequent basis, so that they may then be recreated is bound to bring in more money than it costs.  </p></blockquote>There is certainly money to be made by banning the spam accounts and selling them new accounts at $10 a pop. There is also money to be made by banning the farming teams, though SOE doesn't seem to be doing much about them. However, if SOE were to aggressively ban the accounts of the plat buying filth, do you really think those players are going to keep coming back? How many raiding guilds do you think would come back if they were banned for buying plat to pay for repairs? How many casual players do you think would repeatedly buy new accounts if they were banned for buying plat because they're too lazy and stupid to figure out how to earn coin in-game? </blockquote>I wouldn't be surprised if more people would leave if they couldn't cheat than people are leaving now because of the plat sellers.

[Jakuza]

Hello everybody, I am always het-up when I receive spam mail or tell with pp offer. And I think that not only me. So from this reason I have one question. Do you think that it is possible to implement / set up some buton or mechanism or etc.. that I will not accept mail&message from character lvl 10 and below?

[Norrsken]

<cite>Jakuza wrote:</cite><blockquote>Hello everybody, I am always het-up when I receive spam mail or tell with pp offer. And I think that not only me. So from this reason I have one question. Do you think that it is possible to implement / set up some buton or mechanism or etc.. that I will not accept mail&message from character lvl 10 and below? </blockquote>the devs are working on a spam filter that will filter out all spam (Hopefully).. I cant wait for them to get it finished.

[Maroger]

<cite>Cuz wrote:</cite><blockquote><cite>Raveller wrote:</cite><blockquote>Gladiia@The Bazaar wrote: <blockquote> <p> and raveller - I hate to think any major mmo company would feel that way, but realistically, the money made from banning accounts on a frequent basis, so that they may then be recreated is bound to bring in more money than it costs.  </p></blockquote>There is certainly money to be made by banning the spam accounts and selling them new accounts at $10 a pop. There is also money to be made by banning the farming teams, though SOE doesn't seem to be doing much about them. However, if SOE were to aggressively ban the accounts of the plat buying filth, do you really think those players are going to keep coming back? How many raiding guilds do you think would come back if they were banned for buying plat to pay for repairs? How many casual players do you think would repeatedly buy new accounts if they were banned for buying plat because they're too lazy and stupid to figure out how to earn coin in-game? </blockquote>I wouldn't be surprised if more people would leave if they couldn't cheat than people are leaving now because of the plat sellers. </blockquote><p>I wouldn't ban the plat buyers but I would take the money they bought and give them a warning.I am sure that would get a lot of folks attentions.</p><p>Remember SOE supposedly can track stuff like all our E-MAILs, source of money etc. </p>

[liveja]

Bromir@Runnyeye wrote: <blockquote><p>Level filter NOW please .</p><p>/ignore tells level x - xx </p><p>people on friends list wont be effected . </p><p>Give me my /ignore tells level 1 - 20 </p><p>I should be able to choose who I talk to </p></blockquote><p>I get plat spam so rarely that it's not even an issue for me. However, it's obviously an issue for others.</p><p>I think this suggestion -- which is not unique to this poster, & has been offered up countless times -- is the best overall approach. Others have suggested that it "punishes" legit low level players. I entirely disagree with that argument, <b>as it does not prevent them from sending messages. </b>It's very important to keep that point in mind. Contrary to the claims of the "o the poor lowbies" crowd, <b>nothing is being taken away from them with this option</b>. Instead, what this option does is to empower the user to decide for him/herself.</p><p>Something similar, of course, can be done by the diligent player. Here's what you do:</p><p>A. Turn off ALL tells in your main chat window. You could, of course, leave your guild/group chat in the main window, since presumably the plat spammers are neither in your guild nor your group <img src="/smilies/3b63d1616c5dfcf29f8a7a031aaa7cad.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" /></p><p>B. Set up a separate, "special" channel in a new, special chat window.</p><p>C. Tell ALL your friends about your new "special" channel.</p><p>D. Now, ONLY ever chat in your new, "special" chat window.</p><p>Your problem is solved, & you will never get plat spam again. However, this is a lot of work & effort to go through, thus a lot of players won't take this option, & instead -- quite reasonably -- expect SOE to do something, instead. That is why people have instead suggested the <b>OPTION </b>to filter incoming chat by the level of the person sending it.</p><p>It seems to me that giving us the option to filter incoming chat by level would be the easiest for SOE to implement, & the easiest for the end-use player to deal with. Whether it would eliminate the plat spam is a different story; conceivably, plat spammers may just level up to, say, 11th level -- since it doesn't take all that long to do -- & then continue spamming. But I've a feeling even the most aggressive spammers would balk at the though of having to level all the way to 20, or 30, etc., because all that time is that much less time they spend advertising. That's why they stay at 1st level, after all.</p><p>So, in summation: SOE, please, implement the level-based chat filtering. It's probably your best option for silencing the complaints about plat spam.</p>

[Windowlicker]

<p>This is starting to become absolutely [Removed for Content].  Because this is now nearly 30 pages in, I highly doubt anyone from Sony will be reading this thread.</p><p>Almost everyone in the game is now /anon.  It's now nearly impossible to /who someone to find out what class/level they are, or their whereabouts in the game.  Most people are doing this to avoid the plat spam.</p><p>You can be guarenteed to receive plat spam if:</p><p>- Your in any starting city and/or Newbie zone</p><p>- Your in any instance in the game</p><p>- Your in any raid zone in the game</p><p>It's getting to the point where there are two or three companies that HAMMER you the entire time your online.  I'm talking frequent messages that come within 1 or 2 minutes of each other.</p><p>It was bad before, it's worse now.</p><p>Someone REALLY needs to find a solution for this.  It's annoying as hell to have to wade through plat spam to find my real /tells.  Beyond that, it interfears with chat.</p><p>How can I use the quick-reply feature when plat spammers keep overwriting the name of the person I was talking to?  </p><p>Please fix this! </p>

[liveja]

Zahne@Mistmoore wrote: <blockquote><p>It's getting to the point where there are two or three companies that HAMMER you the entire time your online.  I'm talking frequent messages that come within 1 or 2 minutes of each other.</p></blockquote><p>If I got plat spam anywhere near that frequently, I wouldn't be playing this game. </p><p>Sure do hate it for you, tho. That would drive me off the wall.</p>

[kukubird]

Since there are no plat sinks in game to speak of... how about make banning these guys the new " unnoficial SOE plat sink " [Removed for Content]. Don't even ban buyers of plat when you finally prove they are the illegal plat spammers and track all the gold.. just remove it from game. Track all their farming alts that acquired the plat.. ban them and make them buy and level all new accounts... Track the plat they gathered and what " big boss " they gave it to .. delete all his plat.. track all he sold to.. and delete their plat. and finally have a plat farmer exchange program set up for SOE fanfaire..... import some of these plat farmers for an all expense paid vacation to vegas.... set up a booth make em feel like they won something... and let people heckle em all day with random crap. However, don't give em anyway of leaving the booth.... I bet you people would pay 10 bucks a head to get a chance to pay back these annoying creeps that will not leave us alone in game. Ok... I am kidding... or am I?..... lol... but wouldn't it be great! <img src="/smilies/3b63d1616c5dfcf29f8a7a031aaa7cad.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" />

[NiteWolfe]

<cite>kukubird wrote:</cite><blockquote>Since there are no plat sinks in game to speak of... how about make banning these guys the new " unnoficial SOE plat sink " [Removed for Content]. Don't even ban buyers of plat when you finally prove they are the illegal plat spammers and track all the gold.. just remove it from game. Track all their farming alts that acquired the plat.. ban them and make them buy and level all new accounts... Track the plat they gathered and what " big boss " they gave it to .. delete all his plat.. track all he sold to.. and delete their plat. and finally have a plat farmer exchange program set up for SOE fanfaire..... import some of these plat farmers for an all expense paid vacation to vegas.... set up a booth make em feel like they won something... and let people heckle em all day with random crap. However, don't give em anyway of leaving the booth.... I bet you people would pay 10 bucks a head to get a chance to pay back these annoying creeps that will not leave us alone in game. Ok... I am kidding... or am I?..... lol... but wouldn't it be great! <img src="/smilies/3b63d1616c5dfcf29f8a7a031aaa7cad.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" /> </blockquote> Once more PLAT FARMING is NOT against the rules. Hogging content is. Selling the gained plat for RL money is against the rules. Not all farmers hog the content or sell there plat. Some of us hored it or blow mass plat on twinking alts.  Since i personaly only raid and farm in this game i feel postings like this are a personal attack on my playstyle!

[Shalwin]

<p>What I can't figure out is why Sony, and their team of lawyers, can't make these guys stop.  It's not like they don't know who is doing this.  I constantly get spam for the same companies over and over again.  They have to know who they are, and if they're doing business with people in the US, that means that they're subject to our laws.  If Sony REALLY wanted to shut them down, they could.</p><p> As a stop gap measure, the ability to only accept tells from people on my friends list and/or in my guild would be just fine and dandy.  I don't even care about a level filter.  If you need to talk to me, you can do it in "say", if I determine it important enough to go to tells, I can temporarily put you on my friends list.</p><p>The true solution, in my opinion, would be for Sony to just sell platinum, and levelling services.  Their prices need to be just low enough that someone else can't farm the platinum themselves and make money.  I would prefer that to a station exchange type system because it removes the incentive for people to farm platinum and sell it.  Want a level 70 with all adept III, and all mastercrafted gear?  Just pony up the cash to Sony.  If people are going to buy the platinum, and levelling services anyway, Sony might as well mitigate the impact on my experience, and make some money to put back into the game.</p>

[Shalwin]

<cite>NiteWolfe wrote:</cite><blockquote><p>  Since i personaly only raid and farm in this game i feel postings like this are a personal attack on my playstyle! </p></blockquote> No, a PERSONAL attack would be if I said "that rotten scoundrel NoteWolfe is plat farming".

[woolf2k]

please stop "stop spammer" spam! tired of people whining ...oy vay!

[kukubird]

Nitewolf when you quoted my post and took offense did you read it? or just read it and ignored it and took offense? Since there are no plat sinks in game to speak of... how about make banning these guys the new " unnoficial SOE plat sink " [Removed for Content]. Don't even ban buyers of plat when you finally prove they are the illegal plat spammers and track all the gold.. just remove it from game. HERE  I CLEARLY START OFF BAN BUYERS OF PLAT... NO MENTION OF PEOPLE WHO FARM WITHOUT SELLING OR BUYING... Track all their farming alts that acquired the plat.. ban them and make them buy and level all new accounts... hERE I AM CLEARLY REFFERING TO THE ABOVE SENTENCE WHERE I AM TALKING ABOUT PLAT BUYERS AND SELLERS....  nope still not you lol Track the plat they gathered and what " big boss " they gave it to .. delete all his plat.. track all he sold to.. and delete their plat. Sold to.. yep still talking about the illegal activity.. still not you... and finally have a plat farmer exchange program set up for SOE fanfaire..... import some of these plat farmers for an all expense paid vacation to vegas.... set up a booth make em feel like they won something... and let people heckle em all day with random crap. HERE i am still talking about the illegal activity.... and how it cause all this plat spam.. nothign about your farming legit still.... However, don't give em anyway of leaving the booth.... I bet you people would pay 10 bucks a head to get a chance to pay back these annoying creeps that will not leave us alone in game. Ok... I am kidding... or am I?..... lol... but wouldn't it be great! SO IN CLOSING .. please... read before you take offense.. unless you are covering by pretending your farming is for your personal use?  I doubt that is what you are trying to do... but stilll see how I can start making stuff out of thin air?

[Maroger]

Libbylou@Mistmoore wrote: <blockquote><p>What I can't figure out is why Sony, and their team of lawyers, can't make these guys stop.  It's not like they don't know who is doing this.  I constantly get spam for the same companies over and over again.  They have to know who they are, and if they're doing business with people in the US, that means that they're subject to our laws.  If Sony REALLY wanted to shut them down, they could.</p><p> As a stop gap measure, the ability to only accept tells from people on my friends list and/or in my guild would be just fine and dandy.  I don't even care about a level filter.  If you need to talk to me, you can do it in "say", if I determine it important enough to go to tells, I can temporarily put you on my friends list.</p><p>The true solution, in my opinion, would be for Sony to just sell platinum, and levelling services.  Their prices need to be just low enough that someone else can't farm the platinum themselves and make money.  I would prefer that to a station exchange type system because it removes the incentive for people to farm platinum and sell it.  Want a level 70 with all adept III, and all mastercrafted gear?  Just pony up the cash to Sony.  If people are going to buy the platinum, and levelling services anyway, Sony might as well mitigate the impact on my experience, and make some money to put back into the game.</p></blockquote><p>I saw an interesting TV program the other night on DTMS(Discovery Times Channel) which was about the video gaming phenomenon. One hour of it was devoted to online MMO's -- the three they focused on were WoW, CoH, and Lineage. </p><p>They talked about why players buy plats. The people they talked to from WoW (didn't show on camera) were saying that they bought plats for mounts and spells. They had a long interview on camera with someone who bought power-levelling from a Company in Romania. It was a husband and wife team, they had 2 small children, and were in a guild with other adults in CoH but because of the children she couldn't put in as many hours and her character was falling behind and it was hard for her to play with her guild. I think he was a broker of some kind. Anyway she paid $175 to have her character go from level 20 to level 30. She said it was only be levelling up that she could keep playing with her husband and her guild.</p><p>The "analysis" done by whoever put the show together basically implied that online games ate up a lot of time for levelling and acquiring money within the game mechanics, but since the company placed items like mounts in the game which were considered by players as essentials or the need to keep up with a guild etc. that players felt they had no alternative but to buy plats since they lacked the time to play. They said that the design of the games were such that career oriented young professionals simply would buy the game coin as a way to acquire game esssentials, (mounts, bank space etc.) which they lacked the time to get within the game mechanics.</p><p>Oh by the way - the Class Action Suite against IGE goes to a jury trial in March 2008.</p>

[dawy]

Back on runnyeye after a few weeks peace and quiet learning to ignore it now

[Solarax]

also back on splitpaw and ruining the game for my guildies and i once again. cant even send tells to friends without mistelling them a dozen times

[Raveller]

<cite>Dasein wrote:</cite><blockquote>I see maybe 2-3 tells a week. On a rare day, I might get maybe 2 spam tells. It seems a small group of people get a very large number of tells, while  the rest of the population gets only a few. Thus, for me, plat spam is not much of a concern, whereas the disruptive effects of placing limits on tells and such would be much larger. I am an officer in a guild, with many members spread over all levels, and so regularly need to be accessible for tells from all levels. Thus, level range filters are a hinderence to me. </blockquote>Which server are you on? What days of the week and hours of the day do you play. Which plat farming/selling company do you work for? Or, are the plat sellers only contacting you occasionally because you are on their Preferred Customer list and they just want to find out if you are satisfied with their current service? Maybe you've bought so much plat from them that they only contact you to notify you of special discounts for their highest volume customers?

[erin]

<cite>Solarax wrote:</cite><blockquote>also back on splitpaw and ruining the game for my guildies and i once again. cant even send tells to friends without mistelling them a dozen times </blockquote>What the heck are you talking about?  They provide fun for you and your guild.  They say so.  So it must be true!

[Alienor]

Tormod@Blackburrow wrote: <blockquote>well it's about 1300 est and since maybe 0830 I've received 7 tells on a Monday from three sources [I cannot control my vocabulary] which translates to G M WORKER.COM  (why is that filtered?), Gamenoble.com and someone at <a href="mailto:[email protected]" target="_blank" rel="nofollow">[email protected]</a> email and same address but hotmail for msn messenger.   </blockquote>Question would be, why is it filtered here on the forums but not ingame. Could imagine that it might be difficult to get customers when not being able to advertise the correct website <img src="/smilies/3b63d1616c5dfcf29f8a7a031aaa7cad.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" />

[liveja]

<cite>Raveller wrote:</cite><blockquote><cite>Dasein wrote:</cite><blockquote>I see maybe 2-3 tells a week. On a rare day, I might get maybe 2 spam tells. It seems a small group of people get a very large number of tells, while  the rest of the population gets only a few. Thus, for me, plat spam is not much of a concern, whereas the disruptive effects of placing limits on tells and such would be much larger. I am an officer in a guild, with many members spread over all levels, and so regularly need to be accessible for tells from all levels. Thus, level range filters are a hinderence to me. </blockquote>Which server are you on? What days of the week and hours of the day do you play. Which plat farming/selling company do you work for? Or, are the plat sellers only contacting you occasionally because you are on their Preferred Customer list and they just want to find out if you are satisfied with their current service? Maybe you've bought so much plat from them that they only contact you to notify you of special discounts for their highest volume customers? </blockquote><p>Don't know about Dasein, but I'm on Mistmoore, I play either in the early mornings or early afternoon, I don't work for any plat selling company, I've never bought plat, & I rarely ever see any plat spam; maybe 2 a day at the most.</p><p>So much for your suspicion.</p>

[Valita]

They will never do anything about this because they are completely happy to have spam and 3rd party coin farmers ruining the game for some. Why bother will a real solution?? As for those of you who claim to only get 2-3 spam tells a week... Errr... I've gotten as many as 7 or 8 in an hour. Doesn't matter if I'm ANON or RP. Doesn't matter if I'm in the furthest loneliest zone in the game... I still get them. Rarely do I go a day without getting one. And if I get 1 there's usually another within the hour. It is a serious problem which SOE and apparently some players don't take seriously. SOE has said they wont allow us to blow tells from specific level ranges. I can't think of a reason why not. It makes no sense to me to deny such a simple and personal choice.

[hellfire]

<cite>livejazz wrote:</cite><blockquote><cite>Raveller wrote:</cite><blockquote><cite>Dasein wrote:</cite><blockquote>I see maybe 2-3 tells a week. On a rare day, I might get maybe 2 spam tells. It seems a small group of people get a very large number of tells, while  the rest of the population gets only a few. Thus, for me, plat spam is not much of a concern, whereas the disruptive effects of placing limits on tells and such would be much larger. I am an officer in a guild, with many members spread over all levels, and so regularly need to be accessible for tells from all levels. Thus, level range filters are a hinderence to me. </blockquote>Which server are you on? What days of the week and hours of the day do you play. Which plat farming/selling company do you work for? Or, are the plat sellers only contacting you occasionally because you are on their Preferred Customer list and they just want to find out if you are satisfied with their current service? Maybe you've bought so much plat from them that they only contact you to notify you of special discounts for their highest volume customers? </blockquote><p>Don't know about Dasein, but I'm on Mistmoore, I play either in the early mornings or early afternoon, I don't work for any plat selling company, I've never bought plat, & I rarely ever see any plat spam; maybe 2 a day at the most.</p><p>So much for your suspicion.</p></blockquote>Im in same boat  i get hardly any tells. I useually play 7 pm est-12 midnite so thats prob considered primetime.Not saying some dont get more tells but most days i get zero.I figure get  maybe half dozen tells in a week and thats includeing when leave toon on afk overnight.Maybe it cause im roleplaying or im in raid guild.Im on najena but use to be on  permafrost and mistmoore and never got "spammed" there either. And to the guy saying those that dont get tells brought plat befor id bet its the other way around.

[Femke]

<cite>Valita wrote:</cite><blockquote> As for those of you who claim to only get 2-3 spam tells a week... Errr... I've gotten as many as 7 or 8 in an hour. Doesn't matter if I'm ANON or RP. Doesn't matter if I'm in the furthest loneliest zone in the game... I still get them. Rarely do I go a day without getting one. And if I get 1 there's usually another within the hour. </blockquote> Hmmm.... If I get one or two per week it is a lot... and yes, I am enough hours in game. Apart from that, it is only a tell. You can ignore those. In Lineage II is was a problem, there you got PKed when you bothered farmers too much. <b>That</b> I call a real problem. Tells not. Femke.

[kukubird]

It is sad but true.. when we get a lot of people coming here and saying they get no tells in broken english... it is very fishy. Wish you could go into my account history..... have report after report with 3 names or more on each with platt spamm petitions.. Yes, this thread is so popular because 200 people decided to make up that we get spammed multiple times per hour/day/minute etc.... I pose to you that it is of no use to come here and say you get no tells and try to convince people there is no problem.   Because who are you talking to?  Players?  We all know the amount of tells we get....   Talking to devs? trying to convince them there is no problem?  They play also and get the same spamm.  Talking to GM's?  Trying to convince them there is no problem?  Again, sorry they get all the petitions and see all the logs.... So no point trying to convince people the sky isn't blue.... ... well maybe white on a cloudy day <img src="/smilies/3b63d1616c5dfcf29f8a7a031aaa7cad.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" />

[erin]

<cite>Femke wrote:</cite><blockquote><cite>Valita wrote:</cite><blockquote> As for those of you who claim to only get 2-3 spam tells a week... Errr... I've gotten as many as 7 or 8 in an hour. Doesn't matter if I'm ANON or RP. Doesn't matter if I'm in the furthest loneliest zone in the game... I still get them. Rarely do I go a day without getting one. And if I get 1 there's usually another within the hour. </blockquote> Hmmm.... If I get one or two per week it is a lot... and yes, I am enough hours in game. Apart from that, it is only a tell. You can ignore those. In Lineage II is was a problem, there you got PKed when you bothered farmers too much. <b>That</b> I call a real problem. Tells not. Femke. </blockquote>You are missing the point.  Picture it.  You are playing, chatting with friends and your group.  /tell from a plat spammer.  No big deal, maybe you report it, maybe you don't.  Keep going.  No more than 2 minutes later, just as you hit r to reply to a friend, bam, another plat spammer. And again a couple minutes later.  And again 5 minutes later.  5 minutes later.  15 minutes later.  10 minutes later.  Etc.  Over and over again, throughout your play session.  Does this happen every day?  No.  But I got over a dozen tells today in a 2 hour period.  Several times just as I was going to reply to a friend, which just makes it extra intrusive. Most days, I get 2 to 3 tells in a 2 hour period, but I box, so I'm getting them on multiple screens at the same time. Yes its just an annoyance.  Yes it can be ignored.  But its getting VERY old.

[Windowlicker]

<cite>livejazz wrote:</cite><blockquote><p>Don't know about Dasein, but I'm on Mistmoore, I play either in the early mornings or early afternoon, I don't work for any plat selling company, I've never bought plat, & I rarely ever see any plat spam; maybe 2 a day at the most.</p><p>So much for your suspicion.</p></blockquote><p> So either you:</p><p>- Completely avoid all instances</p><p>- Remain ANON the entire time your playing</p><p>- Completely avoid all raids</p><p>- Completely *miss* the spam your being hit by somehow</p><p> Or your defending them because you work for them.  Because I'm on Mistmoore as well, and I'm pummeled by these /tells where-ever I go.</p><p><b><u>I can't believe anyone would even try to suggest there isn't a huge problem with this, in a thread with over 30 pages of people complaining this is hurting the gaming enviroment.</u></b></p>

[sah]

Zahne@Mistmoore wrote: <blockquote><cite>livejazz wrote:</cite><blockquote><p>Don't know about Dasein, but I'm on Mistmoore, I play either in the early mornings or early afternoon, I don't work for any plat selling company, I've never bought plat, & I rarely ever see any plat spam; maybe 2 a day at the most.</p><p>So much for your suspicion.</p></blockquote><p> So either you:</p><p>- Completely avoid all instances</p><p>- Remain ANON the entire time your playing</p><p>- Completely avoid all raids</p><p>- Completely *miss* the spam your being hit by somehow</p><p> Or your defending them because you work for them.  Because I'm on Mistmoore as well, and I'm pummeled by these /tells where-ever I go.</p><p><b><u>I can't believe anyone would even try to suggest there isn't a huge problem with this, in a thread with over 30 pages of people complaining this is hurting the gaming enviroment.</u></b></p></blockquote>Why is it that anyone who comes out and says that they aren't getting tons of spam has to be working for plat selling companies?  I'm in a casual raiding guild on Guk with 2 lvl 70 characters and I sometimes play for as much as 12 hours a day and there are some days where I don't get a single spam tell.  My average is usually 1 tell every 2-3 hours and 1 mail every 2-4 weeks and I don't even use anon/roleplay and I've never bought plat.  I don't think anyone has actually said that spam is not a big problem; all they've said is that they don't receive anywhere near as much spam as you do.  Is it so hard to believe that not every single person on every single server is being constantly spammed every few minutes?

[Femke]

<cite>kukubird wrote:</cite><blockquote>It is sad but true.. when we get a lot of people coming here and saying they get no tells in broken english... it is very fishy. </blockquote> So what are you trying to say here? That I am a plat-seller, because my English is not perfect? Which may be logical, because English is not my main language.... Dutch is. And there is a big change my English is a lot better then your Dutch... as maybe my German and French is then yours (and I might add 2 more languages to that). I will not say what I think is fishy.... Femke.

[Maroger]

<p>I usually play in the morning on weekdays. I avoid holidays and if I play on weekends I go to an instance and farm for my broker.</p><p>I usually get about 1 tell in the morning, occasionally 2 -- and E-MAIL about every 2 weeks or so.</p><p>However, unless I am playing and doing quests, I go after the spammers and usually force them off the system in about 5-10 minutes. I know what some will say, but if SOE doesn't care, I am not going to let a bunch of plat spammers spam me with tells. I spam them with tells right back using a macro on a key and they log in about 5 minutes -- I think if they get a lot of tells it probably stops them from spamming so much. </p><p>What is annoying is that the interface we get cannot be easily modified. With the WoW interface there are some user written mods to block plat spammers but I take it this is impossible to do with the EQ2 interface which is rather inflexible when it comes to user-written mods. </p>

[ke'la]

<cite>Chenzir wrote:</cite><blockquote><p>wether you ban the seller or the buyer doesn't matter, neither will change the way it is.</p><p>If the person is buying plat, he has the money and time to buy the powerleveling to get back to where he was.</p><p>No game will ever eliminate plat selling or farming.  There is no way to do it.</p><p> Honestly you can't even slow it down.  In regards to how they do it, yes they use a custom gui, and that could be the way to solve the spamming but wouldnt stop the farming.  The custom gui's are created by simply monitoring and editing packets.  An annoying and not feasible way to fix the spamming is to change the packet handlers for the chatting system every few days, but I mean personally I could care less if someone buys it or not or if someone sends me a tell to buy it, i could care less, it's such a waiste of resources, it's not really worth it.</p><p> Sure keep banning accounts once in awhile in order to keep up appearances, but you really think they will ban 5k ++ accounts at 15$ a month cause you complain that your getting spammed?</p><p><span style="color: #ff0000">Yes I do think they will ban those accounts and they do it as frequiently as they can, why? Because $19 every few weeks is alot more then $15 a month. You are forgetting every time they ban a Plat seller, Farmer or Spamer that seller goes out and buys the game again, so the more often they ban these people the MORE not less money they make.</span></p><p> This isn't a problem that you can expect to disapear and compalain loud enough and a company will just ban all farmers, it will never happen.  </p><p>You cant just change your economy in the middle of a game either, I mean no game in the world would randomly change such a game mechanic like that.</p><p>Blah I cant even keep one idea straight in my head atm, the plat farmer argument has been around for over 10 years, this isn't a new problem, and as you see companies do not take action that any player would notice.  They do ban accounts and they can ban billing info, but it hasn't and never will cure the problem.</p><p>For the most part alot of ideas get tossed around and people have no clue what it would entail or how it would affect the game.  Which is why 95% of the ideas that players suggest for plat farming will never work or be implemented.</p><p>modifying chat channels and the /tell system.. blah never work, and not even remotely a decent idea.</p><p> Make everything no drop, nope will never work. To many casual players would complain about it. </p><p>Make everything questable no need for a cash economy... nope wont work either casual gamers would still complain.</p><p>As long as a game has anything tradeable there will be plat farmers.  The biggest issue is for the game companies to spend more time on is network security.  Without going in to to much deatil, cause I'm sure the post would get edited anyways, most major games have huge security issues with their networks, and the game code.  This is also cause some people don't care either so they will change and modify code to let them do almost anything they want to.</p><p>It would be nice to say stopping farming has an easy solution that you could just edit the game some how, but there is always a way around it.  Both game mechanics and network security is where the problems are, Keeping data secure between server and client being on eof the hardest things to do, and one of the easiest ways to exploit a game.</p><p>Blah rambling but maybe someone will read this and understand that stopping this problem has nothing to do with so the simple changes of a chat system or economy.  There is alot more to it.</p><p>FLame away for those that don't understand <img src="/smilies/69934afc394145350659cd7add244ca9.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" /> </p></blockquote>

[Maroger]

ke'la wrote: <blockquote><blockquote><p><span style="color: #ff0000">Yes I do think they will ban those accounts and they do it as frequiently as they can, why? Because $19 every few weeks is alot more then $15 a month. You are forgetting every time they ban a Plat seller, Farmer or Spamer that seller goes out and buys the game again, so the more often they ban these people the MORE not less money they make.</span></p></blockquote> </blockquote><p> But the Plat spammers are making more than $19 a day selling the plat so I doubt if the cost of buying another copy of the game is a hardship. Also the cost is NOT $19.00 </p><p>Also you have forgotten that it probably costs a whole less in China -- probably more like $1-$2.00 -tops is $5.00 Prices are scaled to the country where you are selling the game. </p>

[hobi]

your forgetting one thing most spammers don't even buy the game they spam from the trial accounts  soe banns thier accounts  all they do  is use the bots to create a new trial account. so only real way is to eliminate the trial accounts but that also has its drawbacks in leess exposure to those thinking about playing. the account where they ban and they would have to buy the game again are the ones they use for farming to get the plat to sell. but as others pointed out thats even trickier to do.  to tell who is doing that just to make plat to seel and who farming for plat for thier own benifit i farm occasionally for extra funds for equipment for my main or an alt and thats not  against the eula as it not being done tfor a monetary profit. so the trick is cathing thier account that are being used for farming for the purpose of selling plat you shut down thier source of plat at the source and that inturn will take care of the spammers that use trial accounts.

[sah]

I'm pretty sure that you can't send tells or mail from trial accounts anymore so the spammers are actually paying for their accounts...

[DragonMaster2385]

<p>correct, you can't send tells from the trial accounts.  All that needs to be done is give every toon the personal option in the persona window that can be checked.  "Ignore Tells from characters under level 15".  Problem solved.  The question is, why hasn't SOE done it?</p>

[Dasein]

<cite>DragonMaster2385 wrote:</cite><blockquote><p>correct, you can't send tells from the trial accounts.  All that needs to be done is give every toon the personal option in the persona window that can be checked.  "Ignore Tells from characters under level 15".  Problem solved.  The question is, why hasn't SOE done it?</p></blockquote>And what consequences will this have on new players? Will this simply cause the spammers to seek new venues, like public channels? How long before people are caliming Qeynos Harbor is unusable because there's dozens of spambots clogging up Say, OOC and Shout?

[KunamitsuUK]

<p>I never see them in Level Channels or OOC, is that a taboo area for them? If they start and Spam that would it result in a warning/ban? If something was put in place to stop them spamming everyone with private tells and they moved to the other options then maybe we would be onto a winner!</p><p>Common sense has it, why send 1000s of personal tells when you can send a tell out every couple of mins in each level channel and everyone will see it! So doing this must be against the games rules, stop them sending private tells with an intelligent filter or a user defined spam filter then they may end up breaking the rules and we can get rid of them!</p><p>Or is it just that SOE wants their monthly $ as much as ours?</p>

[Nodok]

<cite>Dasein wrote:</cite><blockquote><cite>DragonMaster2385 wrote:</cite><blockquote><p>correct, you can't send tells from the trial accounts.  All that needs to be done is give every toon the personal option in the persona window that can be checked.  "Ignore Tells from characters under level 15".  Problem solved.  The question is, why hasn't SOE done it?</p></blockquote>And what consequences will this have on new players? Will this simply cause the spammers to seek new venues, like public channels? How long before people are caliming Qeynos Harbor is unusable because there's dozens of spambots clogging up Say, OOC and Shout? </blockquote>Again Dasein, it will have little consequence for new players because of the good folk like you who don't get plat spam and won't bother using the tell filter.  The rest of us can get back to the enjoying the game without a few dozen spam tells a day. I can easily ignore public channels right now, so I'm not too concerned there.  If they start cluttering up QH or EFP then a lot more people will complain and SOE will find another solution, such as hiring more employees to actively handle the problem. Just make sure the tell filter <b>lets us choose the level</b>.  I think plat farmers actually will start leveling toons to get around any hardcoded level limits, since the first 30-40 levels can be done pretty quickly/easily.

[Bromir]

<cite>Dasein wrote:</cite><blockquote><cite>DragonMaster2385 wrote:</cite><blockquote><p>correct, you can't send tells from the trial accounts.  All that needs to be done is give every toon the personal option in the persona window that can be checked.  "Ignore Tells from characters under level 15".  Problem solved.  The question is, why hasn't SOE done it?</p></blockquote>And what consequences will this have on new players? Will this simply cause the spammers to seek new venues, like public channels? How long before people are caliming Qeynos Harbor is unusable because there's dozens of spambots clogging up Say, OOC and Shout? </blockquote><p> Yes but that would be tolerable . </p><p>I dont hang around there and the only channels i have active are 60-69 and 70 . It would give US the OPTION to turn them off without making it a gamebreaker .. </p><p>I have said and asked for this before if you read the entire thread .</p><p>/ignore tells level x - xx </p><p>Where people on your friends list wont get affected by your filter .. First thing i would do is .. </p><p>/ignore tells level 1 - 20 </p><p>It would make things so much harder for the plat tellers and it wouldnt change anything in my playstyle .. </p><p>To avoid them using any other channels on trial accounts just make it as it was back in the days where you couldnt leave the island on a trial . Also remember many of the public channels used are infact the level channels . and they would still on a buyaccount have to level to use the channels in question .. </p><p>IMO .. theres no other efficient solution to this problem than a tell ignore filter .. Also have in mind that it would be optional .. so .. if you dont mind the spammers .. Dont use the filter .. easy .. But it should be just as easy the other way around . if I DONT want them I should be able to turn them OFF ..</p><p>Yours</p><p>Bromir</p>

[Owilliams]

<cite>NiteWolfe wrote:</cite><blockquote><cite>kukubird wrote:</cite><blockquote>Since there are no plat sinks in game to speak of... how about make banning these guys the new " unnoficial SOE plat sink " [Removed for Content]. Don't even ban buyers of plat when you finally prove they are the illegal plat spammers and track all the gold.. just remove it from game. Track all their farming alts that acquired the plat.. ban them and make them buy and level all new accounts... Track the plat they gathered and what " big boss " they gave it to .. delete all his plat.. track all he sold to.. and delete their plat. and finally have a plat farmer exchange program set up for SOE fanfaire..... import some of these plat farmers for an all expense paid vacation to vegas.... set up a booth make em feel like they won something... and let people heckle em all day with random crap. However, don't give em anyway of leaving the booth.... I bet you people would pay 10 bucks a head to get a chance to pay back these annoying creeps that will not leave us alone in game. Ok... I am kidding... or am I?..... lol... but wouldn't it be great! <img src="/smilies/3b63d1616c5dfcf29f8a7a031aaa7cad.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" /> </blockquote> Once more PLAT FARMING is NOT against the rules. Hogging content is. Selling the gained plat for RL money is against the rules. Not all farmers hog the content or sell there plat. Some of us hored it or blow mass plat on twinking alts.  Since i personaly only raid and farm in this game i feel postings like this are a personal attack on my playstyle! </blockquote><p>Unless your name is Bzyjilk and you are dragging bots named Gsdft, Ooinjoi and Eslkiu behind you I seriously don't think anyone is confusing you with the type of PHARMER associated with gold selling companies.</p><p>Feel safe in the knowledge that  people in this thread are not attacking your playstyle. It's not about you.</p><p>Happy Gaming,</p><p>--Orv </p>

[Owilliams]

<blockquote><cite>Dasein wrote:</cite><blockquote>I see maybe 2-3 tells a week. On a rare day, I might get maybe 2 spam tells. It seems a small group of people get a very large number of tells, while  the rest of the population gets only a few. Thus, for me, plat spam is not much of a concern, whereas the disruptive effects of placing limits on tells and such would be much larger. I am an officer in a guild, with many members spread over all levels, and so regularly need to be accessible for tells from all levels. Thus, level range filters are a hinderence to me. </blockquote></blockquote><p> You would have to turn the filter ON for it to hinder you. Most suggestions I am aware of refer to any filter as something that can be TOGGLED by the user.</p><p>Happy Gaming,</p><p>--Orv</p>

[DragonMaster2385]

<p>If they put in a tell filter, </p><p>1) They won't use the level channels.  What high level toon still has the 1-9 or 10-19 channels on?  The audience they would reach would be very minimal.</p><p>2) OOC / Shout in QH would not be that beificial.  They would only be getting the attention of 40 people, unlike tells where they are able to hit mass quantities of people in a short time.</p><p>If that level filter was put on, it would definatly reduce the problem.</p>

[Terrifier]

 Put a 5 second per tell time limit in place. That will cause the spammers using the 3rd party software to take forever to get tells out.  Another option is to only allow a new character every 6 hours. That would stop the spammer from logging out and making a new spam bot name right away and would allow people to actually use /ignore

[liveja]

<cite>Owilliams wrote:</cite><blockquote> <blockquote><cite>Dasein wrote:</cite><blockquote>I see maybe 2-3 tells a week. On a rare day, I might get maybe 2 spam tells. It seems a small group of people get a very large number of tells, while  the rest of the population gets only a few. Thus, for me, plat spam is not much of a concern, whereas the disruptive effects of placing limits on tells and such would be much larger. I am an officer in a guild, with many members spread over all levels, and so regularly need to be accessible for tells from all levels. Thus, level range filters are a hinderence to me. </blockquote></blockquote><p> You would have to turn the filter ON for it to hinder you. Most suggestions I am aware of refer to any filter as something that can be TOGGLED by the user.</p></blockquote><p>One of Dasein's issues is easily eliminated: code the toggle so that people on your FRIENDS list, or your GUILDIES, are ignored by the filter. Besides, as Orv pointed out, you'd have to actually turn the filter ON for it to be a hindrance.</p><p>As for Joe Noobie: I actually couldn't care less whether or not he can send me tells about my cool hat, or where he can go to level, etc. & since I don't turn on /say, /shout, or /ooc, & only have the 70 channel on, I couldn't care less about the other channels.</p><p>The toggle for filtering chats by level is the only suggestion I've seen so far that could reasonably get rid of spam, & even though it's not perfect, it's better than nothing. Personally, I never get more two plat spams a day, so honestly the whole issue doesn't affect ME much, but as I've said before, I'll be happy to see something implemented that causes the whining on the forums to die out.</p>

[jetproped]

It is a supply and demand thing IF people didnt buy from those sites then there wouldn't be a demand so in reality it is the player base and those people who buy from those sites that are causing the problem. but that is only my opinion.

[aardda]

<p>i've just seen something truely hilarious with regards to platfarmers linked from the bbc.co.uk website, the link to the article is <a href="http://www.www.wowinsider.com/2007/07/04/new-gold-seller-tactic-trying-way-too-hard" target="_blank" rel="nofollow">http://www.www.wowinsider.com/2007/...ng-way-too-hard</a></p><p>For those who don't want to follow the link, the main part of the story is</p><p>"Apparently, a certain gold seller got creative when trying to figure out ways to advertise past Blizzard's spam filter. The gold farmers created hundreds of identical level 1 gnomes, postion-hacked them into mid-air, and let them fall to certain doom in a way that spelled out the web address of their gold-selling site"</p><p>And who says wow have the problem solved? omg! its raining gnomes! <img src="/smilies/ed515dbff23a0ee3241dcc0a601c9ed6.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" /></p>

[Stuge]

<span style="font-family: courier new,courier">"Not wanting to tip their hand" isn't a good enough excuse for silence anymore.  Either they have an effective set of countermeasures in the works or they don't.  If their plans are going to be truly effective, then it shouldn't matter whether they tell us what the plans are now or at implementation.  If their plans are weak, however, they will be circumvented shortly after implementation and better to know the flaws now by giving the community at least a theoretical crack at them.  It's the same idea as testing new encryption algorithms.  If the architecture can't stand up to the scrutiny of the community, then it certainly will have no chance against pointed, directed attacks from those that would seek to maliciously circumvent it. I've been a supporter for a long time and have always been in the "wait and see" camp.  But this has gone on too long.  They won't tell us what is being planned.  They won't tell us why they don't nuke certain accounts.  They won't even tell us why things that the community has suggested <i>wouldn't</i> work.  We're losing patience.  I'm beginning to think that there is something aside from their "plans that are in the works" that they aren't telling us. </span>

[wilba]

<p>A tired and worn out subject that I expect will most likely be locked/moved/deleted.</p><p>1. BAN ALL DIRECT(PRIVATE) TELLS FROM PLAYERS UNDER LEVEL 10 to ANYBODY OVER LEVEL 10.  (Initiate a friends/whitelist system to allow GUILD members etc. full chat access as stated below)</p><p>2. BAN ALL EMAILS FROM PLAYERS UNDER LEVEL 10 to ANYBODY OVER LEVEL 10.  (This is NOT unreasonable since the BULK of people under level 10 are usually GETTING emails from their alts, friends or Guild to twink or send money!)</p><p>3. The ability for a FILTER that a higher level can use to ALLOW direct tells with a player under level 10 IF it is THAT important for them to NEED to correspond with a friend that low.</p><p>4. Assuming that there are people who for some reason or another NEED to stay under level 10 and NEVER get any higher they would be allowed chat access via a Friends/WHITELIST system.</p><p>5. IF there are accounts that continuously make a NEW level 1 char EVERY day even as often as 3-4 times in 2-3 hours there MUST be a LOG you can keep since the Character creation is PRIOR to the actual LOGIN server in the first place. this would most likely require ONE low powered PC to process the logs since there would hardly be ANY overhead to pre-login server action.</p><p>You NEED (if you haven't already done so) to create the ability to log these events AND tools for more in depth User Database perusal.</p><p>Level 10 is the Answer.</p><p>The point is that the IDIOTS who spam email and direct tells are NOT going to spend the time to level a character up to 10 just so they can send unsolicited spams to PAYING fulltime customers of SOE. It takes a good 30 mins to go to this extent and they simply don't want to be online for longer than 30 mins average.  This will ALSO ensure they are easily trackable with database tools especially IF they just camp rather than delete the character.</p><p>Regardless of the FREE Trial accounts being an introduction to EQ2, it is NOT necessary for the GOOD of the MMO community to allow people TRYING out the game to have access to high level chat and emails UNLESS they are going to become fulltime users to be honest.  IF they are NOOBS then they wouldn't know a lot about the chat to require the ability.</p><p>As stated previously IF they have friends or whatever IN the game already then the whitelists will allow them to carry on as fulltime members WITH their buddies anyway! The bigger RAIDers and Guild members are probably using VOICE access anyway.</p><p>Summary:</p><p>Making new characters over and over to try them out does not require full CHAT and EMAIL access before level 10!</p><p>The only ones they really NEED to chat with generally would be OTHERS THEIR LEVEL!</p><p>Friends/whitelist filters would ALLOW for the exceptions!</p><p>Level CHAT and OOC are more than adequate for Learner's to get a taste of EQ2 and deal with each other in general.</p><p>All players on the Trial Accounts would have full chat abilities ONLY up to level 10 AND on the isles.</p><p>The spammers would soon give up since they are hardly likely to want to listen to EACH OTHER!</p><p>It is hardly unreasonable to expect PAYING customers offpeak (OUTSIDE SOE OFFICE HOURS) or the MINORITY to have to deal with SPAMMERS.  We may NOT have the numbers but we ARE paying SOE to play NOT playing to PAY for gold!</p><p>All the Bleeding heart liberals who believe it to be a simple case of exaggeration and the ruination of the MMO spirit are NOT dealing with the same issues.</p><p>Having the ability to set CHAT options is FINE if you DO want to avoid ANY CONTACT with ANYBODY else in EQ2, but WHY should the PAYING customer have to spend the time dicking around changing this back and forth just to avoid nuisances?</p><p>Burn me.</p>

[erin]

Having just been hit 6 times in less than 5 minutes (/sigh) I ask for one more innovation - when you put someone on ignore, please make any text from that individual go away!

[Dasein]

Stugein@Antonia Bayle wrote: <blockquote><span style="font-family: courier new,courier">"Not wanting to tip their hand" isn't a good enough excuse for silence anymore.  Either they have an effective set of countermeasures in the works or they don't.  If their plans are going to be truly effective, then it shouldn't matter whether they tell us what the plans are now or at implementation.  If their plans are weak, however, they will be circumvented shortly after implementation and better to know the flaws now by giving the community at least a theoretical crack at them.  It's the same idea as testing new encryption algorithms.  If the architecture can't stand up to the scrutiny of the community, then it certainly will have no chance against pointed, directed attacks from those that would seek to maliciously circumvent it. I've been a supporter for a long time and have always been in the "wait and see" camp.  But this has gone on too long.  They won't tell us what is being planned.  They won't tell us why they don't nuke certain accounts.  They won't even tell us why things that the community has suggested <i>wouldn't</i> work.  We're losing patience.  I'm beginning to think that there is something aside from their "plans that are in the works" that they aren't telling us. </span></blockquote>The devs have stated they are working on an intelligent spam filter similar to what is used in email spam filters.

[Stuge]

<cite>Dasein wrote:</cite><blockquote>Stugein@Antonia Bayle wrote: <blockquote><span style="font-family: courier new,courier">"Not wanting to tip their hand" isn't a good enough excuse for silence anymore.  Either they have an effective set of countermeasures in the works or they don't.  If their plans are going to be truly effective, then it shouldn't matter whether they tell us what the plans are now or at implementation.  If their plans are weak, however, they will be circumvented shortly after implementation and better to know the flaws now by giving the community at least a theoretical crack at them.  It's the same idea as testing new encryption algorithms.  If the architecture can't stand up to the scrutiny of the community, then it certainly will have no chance against pointed, directed attacks from those that would seek to maliciously circumvent it. I've been a supporter for a long time and have always been in the "wait and see" camp.  But this has gone on too long.  They won't tell us what is being planned.  They won't tell us why they don't nuke certain accounts.  They won't even tell us why things that the community has suggested <i>wouldn't</i> work.  We're losing patience.  I'm beginning to think that there is something aside from their "plans that are in the works" that they aren't telling us. </span></blockquote>The devs have stated they are working on an intelligent spam filter similar to what is used in email spam filters. </blockquote><span style="font-family: courier new,courier">Yeah, I was at that dev chat too.  They were vague and nondescript.  Intelligent filters?  Like email spam filters?  That could mean anything.  White-listing?  Rate-limiting?  Adaptive blacklisting?  A Bayesian classification filtering scheme?  Rule-based scoring? No, they gave no details.  It was not an answer.  It was essentially a blow-off comment. <People> We're hungry! <Ruling Body> We're aware that you're hungry and believe us when we say that we're working on the problem. <People> What are you doing? <Ruling Body> Well, we can't really tell you, but we assure that food of some sort is in the works and will be maybe made available to you at some point in the future that we also can't clue you in on. <People> ... </span>

[erin]

Stugein@Antonia Bayle wrote: <blockquote><cite>Dasein wrote:</cite><blockquote>Stugein@Antonia Bayle wrote: <blockquote><span style="font-family: courier new,courier">"Not wanting to tip their hand" isn't a good enough excuse for silence anymore.  Either they have an effective set of countermeasures in the works or they don't.  If their plans are going to be truly effective, then it shouldn't matter whether they tell us what the plans are now or at implementation.  If their plans are weak, however, they will be circumvented shortly after implementation and better to know the flaws now by giving the community at least a theoretical crack at them.  It's the same idea as testing new encryption algorithms.  If the architecture can't stand up to the scrutiny of the community, then it certainly will have no chance against pointed, directed attacks from those that would seek to maliciously circumvent it. I've been a supporter for a long time and have always been in the "wait and see" camp.  But this has gone on too long.  They won't tell us what is being planned.  They won't tell us why they don't nuke certain accounts.  They won't even tell us why things that the community has suggested <i>wouldn't</i> work.  We're losing patience.  I'm beginning to think that there is something aside from their "plans that are in the works" that they aren't telling us. </span></blockquote>The devs have stated they are working on an intelligent spam filter similar to what is used in email spam filters. </blockquote><span style="font-family: courier new,courier">Yeah, I was at that dev chat too.  They were vague and nondescript.  Intelligent filters?  Like email spam filters?  That could mean anything.  White-listing?  Rate-limiting?  Adaptive blacklisting?  A Bayesian classification filtering scheme?  Rule-based scoring? No, they gave no details.  It was not an answer.  It was essentially a blow-off comment. <People> We're hungry! <Ruling Body> We're aware that you're hungry and believe us when we say that we're working on the problem. <People> What are you doing? <Ruling Body> Well, we can't really tell you, but we assure that food of some sort is in the works and will be maybe made available to you at some point in the future that we also can't clue you in on. <People> ... </span> </blockquote>Hmmm here's a thought, brought on for some reason by the above post.  What if, the second someone gets reported, or maybe on the 3rd report of one person, that person can no longer send tells?  That would mean a plat spammer could only hit about 3 people before they are throttled?  I realize this can be abused against obnoxious twits in chat, but how about it only applies to people who are below level 10?  or 20?  Interesting?

[Solarax]

Domain Name: GMWORKER.COM Registrar: XIN NET TECHNOLOGY CORPORATION Whois Server: whois.paycenter.com.cn Referral URL: <a href="http://www.xinnet.com" target="_blank" rel="nofollow">http://www.xinnet.com</a> Name Server: NS.XINNET.CN omain Name:gmworker.com Registrant: gmworker Room 703, Yaofuli 32th 314000 Administrative Contact: Gu Min GuMin Room 703, Yaofuli 32th Ganzhou Jiangxi 314000 China tel: 86 0797 8246137 fax: 86 0797 6155359 [email protected] Technical Contact: gu min XIAMEN D-JET.COM CO.,LTD. Room 10E,Yongtongchang Building, No.388 Jiahe road,Xiamen,China xiamen Fujian 361000 China tel: 86 0797 8246137 fax: 86 0797 8246137 [email protected] Billing Contact: gu min XIAMEN D-JET.COM CO.,LTD. Room 10E,Yongtongchang Building, No.388 Jiahe road,Xiamen,China xiamen Fujian 361000 China tel: 86 0797 8246137 fax: 86 0797 8246137 [email protected] Registration Date: 2005-06-28 Update Date: 2005-09-30 Expiration Date: 2011-06-28 Primary DNS: ns.xinnetdns.com 210.51.170.66 Secondary DNS: ns.xinnet.cn 210.51.171.209 Verio Inc. - Growing Your Business, One Click At A Time Name Server: NS.XINNETDNS.COM here is the info on the website that is ruining our game . now that we have a place to start legal action is the BEST course. most would say not BUT if they tried to target the individuals then they can just continue since each worker for the site works from thier own home ccomputer and has thier own IP taht would need to be blocked. then of course there is the filters that would have not just fixed the problem with them but the underlying issue of any unwanted tells

[erin]

But it isn't just this one. There's 3 of them that I know of spamming me in game.  And if you manage to slow one down, that just means the other 2 become more active.  There needs to be a better solution.  The reason these people operate out of china is because they can escape U.S. laws (take a look at all the copyright problems created by China copying materials and selling them without benefit to the owners).

[Solarax]

here is another Domain Name: [Removed for Content].COM Registrar: XIN NET TECHNOLOGY CORPORATION Whois Server: whois.paycenter.com.cn Referral URL: <a href="http://www.xinnet.com" target="_blank" rel="nofollow">http://www.xinnet.com</a> Name Server: NS.XINNET.CN Name Server: NS.XINNETDNS.COM Name Server: YNS1.YAHOO.COM Name Server: YNS2.YAHOO.COM Status: ok Updated Date: 16-jun-2007 Creation Date: 30-may-2006 Expiration Date: 30-may-2008

[Solarax]

only to a point. anyone that plays the game is subject to the laws of california and deleware under the un treaties on contracts quoting the EULA This Agreement is governed in all respects by the substantive laws of the State of Delaware and of the United States of America. Notwithstanding the foregoing, Section 17(b) below shall be governed by the Federal Arbitration Act. The UN Convention on Contracts for International Sale. another quote Formal Resolution – International Residents Both parties submit to personal jurisdiction in California and further agree that any Claim shall be exclusively brought in the County of San Diego, State of California, United States of America, in the appropriate state or federal court. <cite>erin wrote:</cite><blockquote>But it isn't just this one. There's 3 of them that I know of spamming me in game.  And if you manage to slow one down, that just means the other 2 become more active.  There needs to be a better solution.  The reason these people operate out of china is because they can escape U.S. laws (take a look at all the copyright problems created by China copying materials and selling them without benefit to the owners). </blockquote>

[Stuge]

<cite>Solarax wrote:</cite><blockquote>only to a point. anyone that plays the game is subject to the laws of california and deleware under the un treaties on contracts quoting the EULA This Agreement is governed in all respects by the substantive laws of the State of Delaware and of the United States of America. Notwithstanding the foregoing, Section 17(b) below shall be governed by the Federal Arbitration Act. The UN Convention on Contracts for International Sale. another quote Formal Resolution – International Residents Both parties submit to personal jurisdiction in California and further agree that any Claim shall be exclusively brought in the County of San Diego, State of California, United States of America, in the appropriate state or federal court.</blockquote> <span style="font-family: courier new,courier">How nice for the EULA.  Now let's see you compel a citizen of a foreign entity that may not believe there is legal ground for the enforcement of such a countract and who refuses to respond to claims of such, to respond to a suit in a U.S. court of law where you can garner a judgement.  Yeah, exactly.  Therein lies the problem.  The EULA is not an enforceable mandate to foreign entities.  It's not that easy, not to mention very spendy to try. </span>

[Dasein]

Stugein@Antonia Bayle wrote: <blockquote><cite>Dasein wrote:</cite><blockquote>Stugein@Antonia Bayle wrote: <blockquote><span style="font-family: courier new,courier">"Not wanting to tip their hand" isn't a good enough excuse for silence anymore.  Either they have an effective set of countermeasures in the works or they don't.  If their plans are going to be truly effective, then it shouldn't matter whether they tell us what the plans are now or at implementation.  If their plans are weak, however, they will be circumvented shortly after implementation and better to know the flaws now by giving the community at least a theoretical crack at them.  It's the same idea as testing new encryption algorithms.  If the architecture can't stand up to the scrutiny of the community, then it certainly will have no chance against pointed, directed attacks from those that would seek to maliciously circumvent it. I've been a supporter for a long time and have always been in the "wait and see" camp.  But this has gone on too long.  They won't tell us what is being planned.  They won't tell us why they don't nuke certain accounts.  They won't even tell us why things that the community has suggested <i>wouldn't</i> work.  We're losing patience.  I'm beginning to think that there is something aside from their "plans that are in the works" that they aren't telling us. </span></blockquote>The devs have stated they are working on an intelligent spam filter similar to what is used in email spam filters. </blockquote><span style="font-family: courier new,courier">Yeah, I was at that dev chat too.  They were vague and nondescript.  Intelligent filters?  Like email spam filters?  That could mean anything.  White-listing?  Rate-limiting?  Adaptive blacklisting?  A Bayesian classification filtering scheme?  Rule-based scoring? No, they gave no details.  It was not an answer.  It was essentially a blow-off comment. <People> We're hungry! <Ruling Body> We're aware that you're hungry and believe us when we say that we're working on the problem. <People> What are you doing? <Ruling Body> Well, we can't really tell you, but we assure that food of some sort is in the works and will be maybe made available to you at some point in the future that we also can't clue you in on. <People> ... </span> </blockquote>1. It is enitrely possible they do not have the specific details to release at this point, as they could be researching different methods. 2. It may not be prudent to release details beyond stating such a filter exists. The devs have stated they are working on a solution. That's it. You are not entitled to any more information than that.

[Stuge]

<cite>Dasein wrote:</cite><blockquote>The devs have stated they are working on a solution. That's it. You are not entitled to any more information than that. </blockquote> <span style="font-family: courier new,courier"> A year ago I would've agreed with you.  6 months ago I may have agreed with you.  But now?  No, it's been far too long without a real solution being presented.  Too much lip service and too few results.  We <i>are</i> entitled to answers.  You may have devalued your worth as a subscriber in your own eyes, but naive though it may be I still choose to believe that customers matter to service organizations.  But aside from that, it isn't even a matter of entitlement.  It's a matter of them following through on promises and making good on a strong, lasting solution to a long-standing problem.  </span><span style="font-family: courier new,courier">You may choose to just grin and bear it with constant unfulfilled promises that it will get better, but </span><span style="font-family: courier new,courier">"In devs we trust" doesn't work for us anymore.  "They said so" doesn't fly. </span>

[Troubor]

<p>In my opinion, the simple fact of the matter is either they can't, or they won't.  To be blunt, I suspect the latter.  Why you might ask?  Simple.  Last few spam /tells by one of them, I've noticed something.  The domain name is spelled in a slightly different manner.  To be specific, using a generic name as opposed to the real one so I don't advertise them, this is what I see.  (As an aside, none of these are real hyperlinks):</p><p>www. platspammer . com</p><p><a href="http://www.platspammer/" target="_blank" rel="nofollow">www. platspammer</a> .com</p><p><a href="http://www.platspammer.comv/" target="_blank" rel="nofollow">www. platSpammer.COMv</a></p><p>There's other small variants, but as you can see, they do things like add additional spaces, illogical capitilzation, maybe an extra character or letter somewhere, or some such.  The actual message itself might also show this, I've seen an extra space, or maybe no spaces between sentences for instance.  Since they are just cutting and pasting something from the Windows Clipboard into a /tell and then sending it off (I've seen them flub up and send me a /tell that says "WINDOWS CLIPBOARD IS NULL"<img src="/smilies/8a80c6485cd926be453217d59a84a888.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" />, this tells me they are using the same message in games other then this one.  And, the only reason I can think of to slightly vary the message in such a way is to try and bypass a spam filter.  SOE says one is "in the works" while being very vague and refusing to tell us anything past that.  So, they are doing this so they can use this message in any game, including one or more games that already have a spam filter that's at least somewhat effective, for them to bother to do this.</p><p>Otherwise, other games are trying to combat this.  Maybe SOE is also with EQ2 and it's other MMO's, but they sure don't give us much confidence with their answers.  Going /anon or /role, even when one doesn't wish to be either doesn't work now, I still get hit.  I now consider it "lucky" to only see one plat spam every 2 to 4 hours now.  IF SOE was going to try to impliment something, well they would have by now.</p><p>Or to put it another way, if anyone is even going to bother to read this:</p><p>SOE PUT UP OR SHUT UP.  If you have no solution, at least admit it.  IMO you have a poor record of communication with your customers, and customer service in general is IMO spotty.  Want to convince me it isn't?  Drop the canned replies and vague "Well, we have something in the works..." comments, and either PUT UP OR SHUT UP.</p><p>Okay, I'm done for now on this.</p>

[NosmokIng]

Low and behold its getting worse and worse.. why did they level people leave the island and spam people. hell even an option to not receive mails or tells from non guild or non friends would help. This is ridiculas. I left my alt in butcherblock for an hour whilst watching TV and got 6 tells and a email. Please do something

[bensilvi]

<cite>NosmokIng wrote:</cite><blockquote>Low and behold its getting worse and worse.. why did they level people leave the island and spam people. hell even an option to not receive mails or tells from non guild or non friends would help. This is ridiculas. I left my alt in butcherblock for an hour whilst watching TV and got 6 tells and a email. Please do something </blockquote> <img src="http://groups.msn.com/_Secure/0TwDtAuIY!vxCf!LqsXBkoLXuJ0MS!*SqpH8VwXdtWpv4XVx7N BucxjJh2umHmm2c83SmaHcre6HAhkr33eDqi82b2CUpiYc1WH7 nGFtSe74!5sVUE*1!vg/beating-a-dead-horse.gif" border="0">

[NosmokIng]

LOL

[Silverpaws]

The registration info is nice and all, but its pretty common knowledge by now.  Im sure its been looked up hundreds of times already before your post. I just dont log into the game.  That has fixed the spam. 

[damicatz]

Since SOE won't do anything about it, I have taken it upon myself to.  I don't play EQ2 (I have access to these forums for some reason) but I do play SWG and the same people that are spamming EQ2 are doing the same in SWG. As for the websites that are hosted in the US, I've taken it upon myself to start sending notices to the hosts of these websites as they are engaging in tortious interference of a contract between me and SOE. <blockquote> only to a point. anyone that plays the game is subject to the laws of california and deleware under the un treaties on contracts quoting the EULA This Agreement is governed in all respects by the substantive laws of the State of Delaware and of the United States of America. Notwithstanding the foregoing, Section 17(b) below shall be governed by the Federal Arbitration Act. The UN Convention on Contracts for International Sale. another quote Formal Resolution – International Residents Both parties submit to personal jurisdiction in California and further agree that any Claim shall be exclusively brought in the County of San Diego, State of California, United States of America, in the appropriate state or federal court. </blockquote> Choice of law provisions like that are not valid in my state. 

[liveja]

<p>I conservatively estimate that I get <b>at least</b> 5 times as much spam from people whining about plat spam, as I do actual plat spam.</p>

[Solarax]

Stugein@Antonia Bayle wrote: <blockquote><cite>Solarax wrote:</cite><blockquote>only to a point. anyone that plays the game is subject to the laws of california and deleware under the un treaties on contracts quoting the EULA This Agreement is governed in all respects by the substantive laws of the State of Delaware and of the United States of America. Notwithstanding the foregoing, Section 17(b) below shall be governed by the Federal Arbitration Act. The UN Convention on Contracts for International Sale. another quote Formal Resolution – International Residents Both parties submit to personal jurisdiction in California and further agree that any Claim shall be exclusively brought in the County of San Diego, State of California, United States of America, in the appropriate state or federal court.</blockquote> <span style="font-family: courier new,courier">How nice for the EULA.  Now let's see you compel a citizen of a foreign entity that may not believe there is legal ground for the enforcement of such a countract and who refuses to respond to claims of such, to respond to a suit in a U.S. court of law where you can garner a judgement.  Yeah, exactly.  Therein lies the problem.  The EULA is not an enforceable mandate to foreign entities.  It's not that easy, not to mention very spendy to try. </span></blockquote>yes it cost resources and yes it sucks but by playing the game they submit to the fact that they are juris prudent. but to sue them cost so much the answer is to just deny them and thier entire ISP privledge to the use of SOE servers until they comply. the only way that holds any water is to make the threat one of blocking entire ISPs until the ISPs get in on the act. i know SOE has done this in the states as i have talked to a representitive from cox that has done this for them