Pedestal of Sky, Simple Question

[Taschen77]

If the balance between Night and Day is disrupted, a zonewide AOE called Supernova goes off and your raid force is history.My simple question is just needing conformation on my theories:Is the balance related to keeping Barakah's and Siyamak's hitpoints roughly equal as you burn them down or is the balance related to keeping the dragons on their respective sides?We've been trying it both ways, and can beat this encounter with time and preperation (having beaten all raid content except PoS and Prism) but I've noticed Supernova will go off sometimes when we haven't scratched either dragon. I'm sure I'll figure out the answer soon with some more testing, but any insight is appreciated. We also have not been using Stamina debuffs in most cases because of the HP theory.Essentially, we can hold up our tanks for at least a minute while pulling / positioning the dragons, but have had bad luck working out Supernova.Thanks in advance.<div></div>

[Gaellen]

HP balance.<div></div>

[Cragger]

<div></div>Wow, now that is a raid... And sadly something I shall most likely never get to see.

[ChaosUndivided]

<div></div><p>Probably one of the most fun fights out there especially once you beat it, The loot imho is a bit dissapointing, there are some nice items but some of the stuff that drops is a bit sub-par compared to drops from GoAA and Courts.</p><p> </p>

[Ilucide]

<hr size="2" width="100%"><blockquote>The loot imho is a bit dissapointing, there are some nice items but some of the stuff that drops is a bit sub-par compared to drops from GoAA and Courts.</blockquote><hr size="2" width="100%">I'll take a look and see if there are a few things I can tweak to address that. <img src="/smilies/8a80c6485cd926be453217d59a84a888.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" /><div></div>

[Straylig]

<div></div><p>HP Balance. </p><p>Try keeping them within (a number that is less than 10%) of each other. </p><p>Split your raid into two equal forces.</p>

[Switch9]

<div><p>Compared to when this expansion came out the devs have done so much. Almost everypost that i am seeing about raids either Illuicide or Lyndro has been responding and helping. This is great...Much more of a community sense then it felt in this game before.. Great going devs... Only one thing... It would be nice for some more lockjaw type zones in next xpac. Raids that don't take hours to clear.. that is..not ones that are easy just dont' take long hours...</p><p><font size="5" color="red">-Ardant</font><font size="4" color="green"> 60 Berserker 60 Armorer</font><font size="3" color="blue">-Ondria 60 Provisoner 20 Mystic</font><font size="1" color="orange">-Fornitore 36 Illusionist</font></p></div>

[Ratty31]

<div></div><blockquote><hr>Straylight wrote:<div></div><p>HP Balance. </p><p>Try keeping them within (a number that is less than 10%) of each other. </p><p>Split your raid into two equal forces.</p><hr></blockquote>I'd shoot for 5%

[Straylig]

<div>lol I didn't want to spoil it completely.  <img src="/smilies/3b63d1616c5dfcf29f8a7a031aaa7cad.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" /></div>

[ChaosUndivided]

<div></div><div></div><blockquote><hr>Ilucide wrote:<hr size="2" width="100%"><blockquote>The loot imho is a bit dissapointing, there are some nice items but some of the stuff that drops is a bit sub-par compared to drops from GoAA and Courts.</blockquote><hr size="2" width="100%">I'll take a look and see if there are a few things I can tweak to address that. <img src="/smilies/8a80c6485cd926be453217d59a84a888.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" /><div></div><hr></blockquote>Thanks Noel, much appreciated!!! <3<p>Message Edited by ChaosUndivided on <span class="date_text">01-25-2006</span><span class="time_text">08:45 AM</span></p>

[Goozman]

<div>While you're looking at items, put some INT on priest fabled/legendary gear omgplzthzplz? teehee</div>

[ReviloTX]

<div></div><blockquote><hr>Goozman wrote:<div>While you're looking at items, put some INT on priest fabled/legendary gear omgplzthzplz? teehee</div><hr></blockquote><p>Yea no doubt.  I'm a guardian but I feel for my priests.  Itemization as a whole is pretty poor when it comes to raid gear, but priests really get the shaft.  Wis/Int/Sta is what should be on theirs.</p><p>Along the same lines, most warriors are going to have Str/Sta WAY over cap, please add some agility to warrior items.  I see all kind of raid items with 60-70+ total stats, and warriors get screwed with 20 str 20 sta on every [expletive haxx0red by Raijinn] item, two stats that we no longer really need and 20-30 total stats less than some other gear.</p>

[Lyrus]

yeah, I feel for our priests as well, except for our shamans, they're pretty decked out in fetid chainmail.<div></div>

[BlueQui]

<div></div><p>In response to the loot needing to be tweaked, is absolutely correct.</p><p> </p><p>The health/power on most items need an upgrade, to be on par with other good items.</p><p>This zone is far and above the level of difficulty the other zones have, with gear seemingly much worse.</p><p> </p><p>From what ive seen in there, the mage dagger doesnt proc as it should, the tower shield is much worse than other shields in game, the crusader boots are well, rather pathetic.</p><p>The earring however is a decent piece of loot, but could use a health/power upgrade as well.  I know we probably have not seen all the loot yet, but from what weve seen, it needs an upgrade.</p><p>Oh, and honestly, a tri stat fabled for a tank would be good, and finally some real crusader loot that has INT would be very beneficial.</p><p> </p><p>Message Edited by BlueQuick on <span class="date_text">01-25-2006</span><span class="time_text">02:17 PM</span></p>

[Ratty31]

<div></div><blockquote><hr>BlueQuick wrote:<div></div><p>From what ive seen in there, the mage dagger doesnt proc as it should, the tower shield is much worse than other shields in game, the crusader boots are well, rather pathetic.</p><p> </p><p>Message Edited by BlueQuick on <span class="date_text">01-25-2006</span><span class="time_text">02:17 PM</span></p><hr></blockquote>What tower shield is better? How are the boots pathetic?

[BlueQui]

<div>well, not only a tower shield thats better, like the aranae one. But also fellbrand is far superior.</div><div> </div><div>The boots are craptastic when compared to force wrapped plate plate boots. Or cold forged. For the difficulty involved, dare i say risk vs. reward, the items are bad.</div><div> </div>

[Ratty31]

<div></div><blockquote><hr>BlueQuick wrote:<div>well, not only a tower shield thats better, like the aranae one. But also fellbrand is far superior.</div><div> </div><div>The boots are craptastic when compared to force wrapped plate plate boots. Or cold forged. For the difficulty involved, dare i say risk vs. reward, the items are bad.</div><div> </div><hr></blockquote><p>I much rather have +2 def and regen 3 than what the aranae offers...and as far as fellbrand I have no interest in kite shields.</p><p>Force wrapped boots offer 2 more flowing thought but less resists and less mitigation vs crush slash. Cold-forged have 1 resist and +5 parry +5 def...I rather have mitigation. I can't even wear the boots in question (crusader only) but if I could they would definately be my first choice.</p>

[Traldan Omegafyre]

<div><span><blockquote><hr>Ilucide wrote:<hr size="2" width="100%"><blockquote>The loot imho is a bit dissapointing, there are some nice items but some of the stuff that drops is a bit sub-par compared to drops from GoAA and Courts.</blockquote><hr size="2" width="100%">I'll take a look and see if there are a few things I can tweak to address that. <img src="/smilies/8a80c6485cd926be453217d59a84a888.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" /><div></div><hr></blockquote>I think I speak for....well, quite a few people, when I say I officially love you.<3 designers who listen to the players. <img src="/smilies/3b63d1616c5dfcf29f8a7a031aaa7cad.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" />  Thanks!</span></div>

[D-lirium]

<div><span><blockquote><hr>Taschen77 wrote:I've noticed Supernova will go off sometimes when we haven't scratched either dragon. I'm sure I'll figure out the answer soon with some more testing, but any insight is appreciated.<hr></blockquote>We're having the same problem, the Supernova on pull means a guaranteed failure and it happens even when none of the dragons have been damaged or positioned yet. I like the fact that this is hard to do and requires communication, but having to depend on luck really isn't good. =(</span></div>

[Ilucide]

<hr size="2" width="100%"><blockquote>with gear seemingly much worse</blockquote><hr size="2" width="100%">After looking over the pieces, there are some small areas where they could be improved, but the gear is exactly on par with other encounters, really only short of contested outdoor drops from the dragons. I'll probably tweak some hp/power stats, but that's about it. Well, that and I'll take a look at the proc.<div></div>

[Ilucide]

<hr size="2" width="100%"><blockquote><span>We're having the same problem, the Supernova on pull means a guaranteed failure and it happens even when none of the dragons have been damaged or positioned yet. I like the fact that this is hard to do and requires communication, but having to depend on luck really isn't good. =(</span></blockquote><hr size="2" width="100%">I've watched quite a few  dragon fights on live, and never once have I witnessed the supernova go off on a pull... unless someone did something really, really silly. Which I have seen. And that's intentional. Balance is the key!<span></span><div></div>

[D-lirium]

<div><span><blockquote><hr>Ilucide wrote:<hr size="2" width="100%"><blockquote><span>We're having the same problem, the Supernova on pull means a guaranteed failure and it happens even when none of the dragons have been damaged or positioned yet. I like the fact that this is hard to do and requires communication, but having to depend on luck really isn't good. =(</span></blockquote><hr size="2" width="100%">I've watched quite a few  dragon fights on live, and never once have I witnessed the supernova go off on a pull... unless someone did something really, really silly. Which I have seen. And that's intentional. Balance is the key!<span></span><div></div><hr></blockquote>Okay, we're at it right now so I'll let my guildmates know, I hope to post tonight that we've managed to complete the zone. =)</span></div>

[Gaellen]

I'd put MONEY on this -It's your defiler using his STA debuff. <div></div>

[Drizz]

<div>Would you consider making the Wand a Symbol, so a caster doesnt have to choose from Pris 2.0 for a very small dps upgrade?</div>

[D-lirium]

<div></div><div></div><div><span><blockquote><hr>Gaellen wrote:I'd put MONEY on this -It's your defiler using his STA debuff. <div></div><hr></blockquote>Nope, that isn't it. We've managed some good progress, I certainly think it's possible to do if we can get some minor issues fixed. =)</span></div><p>Message Edited by D-lirium on <span class="date_text">01-25-2006</span><span class="time_text">03:12 PM</span></p>

[Tauch]

<span><blockquote><hr>Ilucide wrote:I've watched quite a few  dragon fights on live, and never once have I witnessed the supernova go off on a pull... unless someone did something really, really silly. Which I have seen. And that's intentional. Balance is the key!<span></span><div></div><hr></blockquote>Was one of those people named "Placid"?<span></span><span>:smileysurprised:</span></span><div></div>

[Drizz]

<div>Also what could make the items pretty nice would give them some old world effects, Such as Battlement of Mind on the druid helm, Foritude of the Body on the shield, or if you really want to make people happy the effect the Nagalik shield has that procs a dps debuff on a mob, Also to note there is currently 1 haste item to my knowledge within the entire expansion in DoF - and thats Dorns Sash which was most likely custom made by the Quest designer for Ring of Fate.  These are some things that would add some much needed flavor to these items.  90% of item effects these days are FT 1, 2, 3 or HP regen 1, 2, 3.</div>

[Magu]

<div><span><blockquote><hr>Drizzen wrote:<div>Would you consider making the Wand a Symbol, so a caster doesnt have to choose from Pris 2.0 for a very small dps upgrade?</div><hr></blockquote>That would be far too overpowering, if we could equip both prismatics.Now, what they should do is make the mage prismatics proc off spell cast, not melee hit <img src="/smilies/3b63d1616c5dfcf29f8a7a031aaa7cad.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" /></span></div>

[MystaSkrat]

<div></div><div></div><blockquote><hr>Ilucide wrote:<hr size="2" width="100%"><blockquote>with gear seemingly much worse</blockquote><hr size="2" width="100%">After looking over the pieces, there are some small areas where they could be improved, but the gear is exactly on par with other encounters, <strong>really only</strong> <strong>short of contested outdoor drops from the dragons</strong>. I'll probably tweak some hp/power stats, but that's about it. Well, that and I'll take a look at the proc.<div></div><hr></blockquote><p><a href="http://i32.photobucket.com/albums/d1/Mystaskratch/siyamakBP2.jpg" target="_blank">http://i32.photobucket.com/albums/d1/Mystaskratch/siyamakBP2.jpg</a></p><p> </p><p>That's in response to your bolded statement there.  That BP is from Siyamak, so according to your post, it should be up there with some of the best loot in the game atm.  Well, that doesn't really seem like the case...  I threw the Voidwalker gloves up there to make somewhat of a comparison.  Please note: I'm <em>not</em> saying the legendary gloves are better than the fabled BP.  I am saying, however, that this is hardly comparible to the godking scout BPs, and they're on a 20 hour timer zone.  Seeing how there is so little scout armor (especially predator BPs >.< ), it would be nice if you could take a look at the contesteds dragons' loot a little closer.  I'd say that the BP needs a boost on the stats (STR), and could lose the + vs. Piercing for another stat (like 10 Int).  Or, an effect wouldn't hurt :smileywink:.  These are supposed to be the hardest contesteds in the game, right?  How about you make the loot worthy of their loot table? :smileyhappy:</p><p>Message Edited by MystaSkratch on <span class="date_text">01-25-2006</span><span class="time_text">08:43 PM</span></p>

[Drizz]

<div></div><p>Err Magus, did you read what i said?</p><p> </p><p>I said make the 1h PRIMARY wand that drops from Pedastal of sky that has an apparent broken 5% Proc rate for spells be a SYMBOL slot so it can go in SECONDARY or RANGE slot so that the caster wouldn't need to give up the 14 Power regen from Prismatic 2.0 in PRIMARY slot.</p>

[Exill]

<div><span><blockquote><hr>Ilucide wrote:After looking over the pieces, there are some small areas where they could be improved, but <b>the gear is exactly on par with other encounters</b>, really only short of contested outdoor drops from the dragons. I'll probably tweak some hp/power stats, but that's about it. Well, that and I'll take a look at the proc.<div></div><hr></blockquote>Thats the problem people are seeing Ilucide. This zone is FAR harder then Gates or Courts and yet the loot it yields is "on par" with it.Pedastal of Sky has only been beaten a few times by a few guilds while Gates and Courts get cleared weekly by even the most un seasoned Guilds.If <b>Risk vs Reward</b> means anything in this game then the loot from Pedastal of the Sky needs to be looked over.</span></div>

[Exill]

Here are a few examples of what I am talking about. The first loot in the screenshots are from Pedastal of Sky and comparing it to similar loot from MUCH EASIER encounters. (Starsunder Belt and Siyamak's Guard from Pedastal)(The priest belt Starsunder actually rotted the last time we beat Pedastal, sad eh?)<img src="http://www.secondawn.com/images/upload/starsundercompare.jpg"><img src="http://www.secondawn.com/images/upload/siyacompare.jpg"><div></div>

[Pins]

<blockquote><hr>Drizzen wrote:<div></div><p>Err Magus, did you read what i said?</p><p> </p><p>I said make the 1h PRIMARY wand that drops from Pedastal of sky that has an apparent broken 5% Proc rate for spells be a SYMBOL slot so it can go in SECONDARY or RANGE slot so that the caster wouldn't need to give up the 14 Power regen from Prismatic 2.0 in PRIMARY slot.</p><hr></blockquote>It's a Dagger, not a wand, that's where the confusion is.

[Moriga]

<div></div><p>Glad you posted those particular pics, brought to mind a question for the dev's.  Why does so little of the priest stuff have flowing thought on it compared the the mage items.  Power is a big issue for us too.</p><p>Morgaine</p>

[Success]

<div></div><div></div>Exactly, that seems to be the theme throughout DoF. You can get just as good, or better stuff, from easier encounters. Then when you do beat Godking, PP2, Pedestal finally, then you are rewarded with stuff that is just as good or worst than the easy stuff. It's like a crushing blow to the climax of beating the encounter. It reminds us of the days when you beat a named weekly spawn contested mob that is a pita, only to get a wood box or beat the big named in pp2 to get wood.<p>Message Edited by Successer on <span class="date_text">01-26-2006</span><span class="time_text">12:08 PM</span></p>

[Abazagorath]

<div>In the off chance that the appropriate devs missed this thread of mine that I started about the aforementioned dagger, here is a link to the page where I discuss the low proc rate:  <a href="http://eqiiforums.station.sony.com/eq2/board/message?board.id=items&message.id=59769" target="_blank">http://eqiiforums.station.sony.com/eq2/board/message?board.id=items&message.id=59769</a></div><div> </div><div>An increase in the stats of the dagger (increased/fixed proc rate, maybe some stats that make up for having to give up the prismatic regen, etc.) would be certainly welcomed, as I am sure that it would make the other guilds who have actually been to beat this zone very happy to see some scaling of the loot.  Being that it is so close to the expansion and so few guilds have been able to beat this instance (unlike most of the rest of DoF short of the wonderful Djinn Prism instance), I am sure that I can safely speak for many people in thinking that this loot should easily trump the loot from easier instances like Gates and Court.</div><div> </div><div>Anyways, thanks for looking into it!</div>

[Ilucide]

<hr size="2" width="100%"><blockquote>In the off chance that the appropriate devs missed this thread of mine that I started about the aforementioned dagger, here is a link to the page where I discuss the low proc rate:  <a href="message?board.id=items&message.id=59769" target="_blank">http://eqiiforums.station.sony.com/eq2/board/message?board.id=items&message.id=59769</a></blockquote><hr size="2" width="100%">Yep, it's pretty low, considering melee chances to proc are so high compared to chance to proc off of such a limited number of spells being cast. It's on my list.All of the items will see slight mitigation increases. They're already really about the same as some of the other tough fights in DoF (eg: the Black Queen), but I agree that they should be a little higher than what they currently are based on the zone. I'm loathe to remove anything to add cooler effects though, because people have already picked up items based on what the item was at the time. So what you'll see mostly are the mit increases and slight bumps to stats/pools/resists/skills. Just FYI. You'll probably see these changes with LU 19, though I'm not going to guarantee that - they may show up a bit later. <img src="/smilies/8a80c6485cd926be453217d59a84a888.gif" border="0" alt="SMILEY" /><div></div>

[Exill]

Thanks for looking into this Ilucide, you the man bro.<div></div>

[Lizardling]

<div></div><div>I mentioned this a long time ago but nothing was done, so ill bring it up again here.</div><div> </div><div>On the baton, I think the proc looks a little off as well. Lemme get [Removed for Content] for ya</div><div><img src="http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v486/nathan1337/dfb.jpg"></div><div> </div><div>btw, the items used to be even worse lol</div><div> </div><p>Message Edited by Lizardling on <span class="date_text">01-27-2006</span><span class="time_text">02:26 AM</span></p>

[Ixidor]

<div></div>And if the stats are what they are suppoed to be, why even heal for 27 pts of dmg, I mean seriously~

[Daelomd]

Illucide -I know its been talked about by a dev at some point, but lacking the ability to search specifically for dev posts on the forums could you please enlighten us to the proc formulas?I had heard that is was:<Weapon Delay>/3 * <Proc %> = Chance to proc per weapon use.Given this, there is a chance for the weapon to proc no matter how its used on any given use, counting both auto-attacks and combat-abilites.Questions:How the recent update note about "Dual Wield weapons having a greater chance to proc" plays into things?How does the formula work for the new items that proc on successfull spell hit? (as there is no weapon delay)I know you mentioned looking into the dagger that procs extra dmg on a successfull spell, could you be so kind to look into the "Wraith Touched Necklace" and the "Cirlet of Living Fire"?Just guessing, as I am not sure if the same formula is used for "Successfull Hostile Spell" procs, but on the surface it would seem that the chance for these items to proc is quite a bit smaller then the chance for melee weapon procs.  The assumption here is that there is no auto attack for spells and the casting times on spell is much higher then that of combat arts.  So if the formula is like above and it works out that all things considered there is determined % to proc on every use...Any info you can give to shed some light on this subject would be great.~Velkyn~<div></div>

[Asterra]

<div></div><span><blockquote><hr>Ilucide wrote:<hr size="2" width="100%"><blockquote>In the off chance that the appropriate devs missed this thread of mine that I started about the aforementioned dagger, here is a link to the page where I discuss the low proc rate:  <a href="message?board.id=items&message.id=59769" target="_blank">http://eqiiforums.station.sony.com/eq2/board/message?board.id=items&message.id=59769</a></blockquote><hr size="2" width="100%">Yep, it's pretty low, considering melee chances to proc are so high compared to chance to proc off of such a limited number of spells being cast. It's on my list.<div></div><hr></blockquote></span>There's a rumor going around that the so-called "Prismatic 2.0" mage weapon, from the Fountain of Life quest, will be seeing a long-belated modification to make the proc operate on casts.  If so, congratulations.But that does mean that the dagger referenced in the above thread will become instantly superfluous.  One needs to weigh what we have, here.  A legendary item that can be won at the end of a quest by everyone in the raid, and a <i>fabled</i> item from what is currently the most difficult winnable encounter in the game - the only such item, incidentally, that mages even get from said encounter.  It certainly seems obvious to me that the fabled dagger ought to provide something dramatically more substantial than a quest reward that pretty much every raiding mage owns.  Substantial in terms of DPS.  Because otherwise, that dagger is going to sit in the backpack, or the bank, serving only to remind the mage of the foolhardiness of accepting items that haven't been properly beta-tested, and all subsequent daggers (again, the only mage loot) will ROT.Just a thought.Edit: Since the Prismatic 2.0 happens to include regen as part of the package, maybe one thing that could be considered, in addition to the improvement to the proc rate you already plan to implement, would be to make the dagger equipable in the secondary and/or range slot, so that it doesn't interfere with the Prismatic 2.0 at all.<p>Message Edited by Asterra on <span class="date_text">01-27-2006</span><span class="time_text">07:40 PM</span></p>

[HomeChicken]

<div>the pics for the new upgrade to pris 2.0 for casters makes me happy, but, and this is prolly just me, but since that dagger from PoS does seem to show potential for a caster weapon that someone would actually use, it still falls so short that i dont see how anyone would ever use that over prismatic weapons, and this has been a trend for casters for a very long time.  I mean whats the point of fabled weapons for casters that drop from raid zones, becuase not many people out there would trade power regen + decent stats for anything unless the proc was going to be more usefull than the power regen, and the way i see it, there isnt anything so far in game that i would even consider switching out a prismatic for a main weapon.</div><div>/shrugs</div><div>just my 2c about this</div><div> </div><div> </div>

[D-lirium]

As a follow up to one of my previous posts, we got it done tonight (first on Splitpaw as well).Fun fight and needs everyone paying attention for sure! =)Got Starsunder Belt & Skullcap of the Draconic Disciple.<div></div>

[Asterra]

<span><blockquote><hr>the pics for the new upgrade to pris 2.0 for casters makes me happy, but, and this is prolly just me, but since that dagger from PoS does seem to show potential for a caster weapon that someone would actually use, it still falls so short that i dont see how anyone would ever use that over prismatic weapons<hr></blockquote></span>It's not just you.  This was pointed out before the Prismatic 2.0 upgrades were even a rumor.  The dagger is also apparently getting an upgrade, but it's still nowhere near a match for 14 regen <i>plus</i> a nice damage proc.  I don't know, perhaps the devs really think that a questable stick, which every single mage in the raid simultaneously obtains at the end, and which can be two-grouped for almost the entire quest, really ought to be overwhelmingly superior to one of the rarest and newest fabled mage loots, and one of but a handful that actually have a useful mage effect.  Maybe they really think that famously rare mage loot - from the toughest encounter in EQ2, no less - ought to be undesirable to the point of rotting and/or sitting in the bank.  Or perhaps they somehow believe that a guild is going to find themselves winning the encounter in question without having bothered with the Fountain of Life.  (...)The helpful suggestion of making the dagger range-equipable was made several times.  I suppose there's still time before changes to the dagger are finalized.

[HomeChicken]

<div>from what i ahve heard the dagger is gonna get upgraded, but still not gonna be on par with the new prismatics</div><div>/sigh</div><div>gimme power regen on fabled caster weapons or dont even bother please....</div><div> </div>