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Old 10-26-2011, 08:46 PM   #1
TwistedFaith

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What happened to the game I first started to play all those years ago. All I see these days is more 'costumes' through station cash and quite frankly boring as hell events that may as well be designed for five year olds. 

What happened to gaming? 

Maybe it's me but house decorating is not a game! EQ2 never used to be about housing but more and more all I am seeing is this kind of stuff. My only conclusion is that stay at home moms are the ones spending the big bucks on all the marketplace items, so SOE are now simply plowing their meagre resources into that for the money.

It's sad what this game has come down to SMILEY

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Old 10-26-2011, 08:49 PM   #2
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Sexist much? 

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Old 10-26-2011, 09:08 PM   #3
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If you are looking for true substance in the game the marketplace & holiday events are not the places to look for them. Those places are pretty much pure fluff for those that enjoy that kind of thing. Holiday events have never been the place to find a lot. Some of them have lore & lead-ins to upcoming content but they are there for fluff & fun.

There is plenty still out there for the times when fluff isn't what you need or want.

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Old 10-26-2011, 09:28 PM   #4
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While I wouldn't necessarily be as strident in tone, I do have to agree that it is disappointing to see so many resources plowed into things that really aren't at the core of a game, as opposed to an RPG version of the SIMS.

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Old 10-26-2011, 10:50 PM   #5
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There are many different gamer psychographics, and each one is drawn to different aspects of an MMO. Just because you don't enjoy a particular facet of the game it doesn't mean that it isn't valuable to others. The game is not all about you. There is plenty of adventuring content in the game, and more is being added every GU. Your complaint is pure hyperbole.

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Old 10-26-2011, 11:16 PM   #6
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The_Cheeseman wrote:

There are many different gamer psychographics, and each one is drawn to different aspects of an MMO. Just because you don't enjoy a particular facet of the game it doesn't mean that it isn't valuable to others. The game is not all about you. There is plenty of adventuring content in the game, and more is being added every GU. Your complaint is pure hyperbole.

+1

I have exactly zero ability at home decoration, even though my wife is a wizard at it.  To me, home decoration is a pain in the tush and a waste of time.  More often than not, my character's houses are dumping grounds for trophies, books, and so forth, all haphazardly tossed inside after aquiring them.  I have exactly one character that has an awesome interior decorating job, and it goes without saying that it was my wife that did it, simply because the spirit moved her.  Interior decoration interests me less than not at all.

But there are hundreds of people who absolutely love it.  And the devs know this.  And the game needs to appeal to as broad a base as it can, and interior decorating is one facet of this.  I have zero business complaining about items for home decoration, and similarly, no one should waste time complaining about clothes that they have introduced.  Heck, I'd love for them to cater to my tastes exclusively, who wouldn't?  But that's not in the cards, ever.

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Old 10-27-2011, 01:26 AM   #7
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To the OP - sadly yes.

Constant house/appearance updates, and constant repatches to 'fix' broken core game.

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Old 10-27-2011, 02:18 AM   #8
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Housing is not the problem and doesnt conflict with adventuring. I do some instances only for appearance or housing items tbh. My house and the trophys are sometimes the only things keeping me playing.

The instances are the problem. They are not dungeons anymore. The group content is utterly broken since TSO. The "micro console raid" design prevents solo to trio groups to play them. Even the most easy ones like Erudin Library have silly debuffs or dps checks and so nobody is playing them at all. Over 20 80-90 instances of wasted server space. There are more people in Fallen Gate then in all dungeons from TSO to SF.

2nd problem is the huge inflation of ingame currency. Its so bad that even basic adorning is to expensive. Money, in or out of game, has become a playing element. 

Its not all fluff. To put it a bit into sarcasm, the game is like a sports league with (raid) players and bored player wifes  and follows the same rules, having the same problems the leagues have. And as in real life, where people stop caring and turning to basic sports it happens to mmo's too. Hence the exodus and top headed stagnation.

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Old 10-27-2011, 03:16 AM   #9
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The_Cheeseman wrote:

There are many different gamer psychographics, and each one is drawn to different aspects of an MMO. Just because you don't enjoy a particular facet of the game it doesn't mean that it isn't valuable to others. The game is not all about you. There is plenty of adventuring content in the game, and more is being added every GU. Your complaint is pure hyperbole.

The problem is its so much easier for the devs to make money from fluff and the decorating customers: of course they are focusing on that then. The classic adventurer customer gets broken content and bugs that are never fixed. For the adventurers times were much better before the big decorating/fluff hype. Its said that decorating/fluff dont take resources from the adventuring part of the game (which to me is the real game)...really? How come the only fully functioning quality stuff that goes live is content for decorators and online barbie players? How come they dont manage to deliver quality content to adventurers anymore? Of course its about allocating focus on different areas. One area does steal from the other, the proof is right in front of us.

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Old 10-27-2011, 04:01 AM   #10
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TwistedFaith wrote:

What happened to the game I first started to play all those years ago. All I see these days is more 'costumes' through station cash and quite frankly boring as hell events that may as well be designed for five year olds. 

What happened to gaming? 

Maybe it's me but house decorating is not a game! EQ2 never used to be about housing but more and more all I am seeing is this kind of stuff. My only conclusion is that stay at home moms are the ones spending the big bucks on all the marketplace items, so SOE are now simply plowing their meagre resources into that for the money.

It's sad what this game has come down to

I would have to agree with most of these comments.

Maybe the adventure content suffers as a result of too much time and money spent in other areas. Strange that the original EQ never had these sorts of problems until EQ2 and other competing games caused a large population decrease. There is simply too much focus on things that are not core to the adventure side of the game that are stealing resources.

Raiding seems ok for the majority of content, but there are still quite a few encounters that need some mechanics work. Group content seems to have serious problems from the number of complaints in other threads or maybe it's a case of the roleplayers and decorators trying to run zones knowing nothing about proper group setups, cast orders and AA builds.

Think of how much better the adventure side of the game could be if devs weren't busy with all the non-adventure side content. SOE might actually be adding servers rather than needing to merge them and things like the dungeon finder wouldn't even be needed.

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Old 10-27-2011, 04:20 AM   #11
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The_Cheeseman wrote:

There are many different gamer psychographics, and each one is drawn to different aspects of an MMO. Just because you don't enjoy a particular facet of the game it doesn't mean that it isn't valuable to others. The game is not all about you. There is plenty of adventuring content in the game, and more is being added every GU. Your complaint is pure hyperbole.

I think the proof that not enough resources are going towards the adventure side is shown in the volume of posts complaining about the adventure content being broken, too hard or simply not fun in some way or another.

The problem isn't quantity of content so much as it is the quality of content. If the devs actually allocated more resources to developing and testing adventuring content rather than appearance items people might actually enjoy playing the adventuring side more without needing to post about all the complaints about the poor quality of the content.

It's very obvious there are resource allocation problems when serious bugs exist and remain unresolved yet shiny new items keep popping up in the marketplace. Sure they might be different devs but the question needs to be asked why devs were even hired for those positions when there are clearly not enough devs in adventure content. The marketplace might not even be needed if the effort was put into keeping the core adventure side players interested in the game.

Maybe real expansions could actually be released if the dev allocation was corrected to be more adventure content focused.

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Old 10-27-2011, 04:47 AM   #12
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That gane is still here and then some!  I remember adventuring with friends questing and crafting and helping each other.  I also decorated my house with the things my carpenter could make so that it looked nice when people came to shop there. I don't know where you live irl but after a hard day's work it's nice to rest and have some social time in a comfortable atmosphere.  This is  a ciomplete world, the best of it's kind and while there issues that might slow it's growth, being able to beter customize our toons and our environment does not deter from it, but enhances it.

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Old 10-27-2011, 05:26 AM   #13
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Cloudrat wrote:

That gane is still here and then some!  I remember adventuring with friends questing and crafting and helping each other.  I also decorated my house with the things my carpenter could make so that it looked nice when people came to shop there. I don't know where you live irl but after a hard day's work it's nice to rest and have some social time in a comfortable atmosphere.  This is  a ciomplete world, the best of it's kind and while there issues that might slow it's growth, being able to beter customize our toons and our environment does not deter from it, but enhances it.

Not surprising to see these comments considering which gameplay style you seem to fit into. Something tells me you would be perfectly happy in a game without the adventuring side.

For the rest of us unhappy with the game's direction it is very clear that resource allocation is all screwed up. Rather than making the adventure side so good that it attracts new players SOE seems to be clueless why adventurers (those who actually PLAY the adventure content) are unhappy with the direction the game has been going and try adding in fixes like dungeon finder to fix a problem that is really content and mechanics related. In short players would group if the content was actually fun which for the most part it is not either due to broken content or other mechanics issues.

So be happy with your online barbie game but keep in mind as the adventurers leave for other games and funding dries up eventually even the online barbie SC game will become unprofitable when enough players leave due to management's decision to not allocate enough resources to the core of the game which is the adventure side.

SOE management is really trying to hold onto adventurers with the beastlord class but even that tactic will have little power in keeping players happy with the game when the problems remain with the adventuring core of the game. It's too bad not enough resources are there to fix the core of the game so it could actually attract new players but it is even worse when these resources are wasted in areas that do not help the core part of the game which is adventuring in solo/group/raid forms.

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Old 10-27-2011, 05:57 AM   #14
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I for one am a gamer who enjoys both sides. I raid regularly with my guild, but I also enjoy house decorating. There is nothing wrong with catering to both and to be honest it does not significantly affect the adventure side, only adds another aspect for people to enjoy the game with. You may not appreciate but they are many who do - changing codes in the editor to reposition things in a way that cannot be done naturally, the inspiration and thought that goes into certain houses, and once you are finished having others come and rate your work highly - the achievement is similar to taking down a new HM mob to me!

In no way do I believe that the adventuring problems are due to the devs spending more time on the housing and appearance side. Developing new outfits based on current models would not take that much time and would not have any major bug problems. The adventuring bugs they have would unfortunately be there whether or not there was the other facet to the game. That seems more to do with the way in which they handle testing feedback than anything.

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Old 10-27-2011, 07:48 AM   #15
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I love the appearence , and definately the housing system... this is the best game out there in my opinion because of things like this... and no im not a sit at home mom, sexist much?
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Old 10-27-2011, 08:38 AM   #16
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Adventuring and "dress-up Barbie" are NOT mutually exclusive.  I spend the lion's share of my in-game time raiding, however, I enjoy selecting my outfits for each week's raids.  I generally stick with items that can be acquired through adventuring or crafting, but I like my complete collection of SC petamorph wands.  I, for one, shudder when I consider the days before appearance armour.  I distinctly remember my defiler looking like he had dressed out of a church jumble sale--the best pants he could get at the time were a purple and green pantaloon affair.  He looked like he was auditioning for a kerra circus.  Furthermore, I can't think of one person in my guild's raid force that does not pay at least a little attention to how they look. 

So yes, bugs should be fixed and game mechanics should be adjusted as needed, though I'd wager--opinions being like a$$holes-- that you might have an argument about just what things are actually broken and how they should be repaired.  At any rate, it does no good to come insult people with interests different than your own.  There is a wide range of people that play this game, some only adventure, some only decorate and play dress-up, but quite a few do all three.

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Old 10-27-2011, 09:35 AM   #17
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The_Cheeseman wrote:

 Your complaint is pure hyperbole.

Most of the complaints on these forums are hyperbole. 

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Old 10-27-2011, 09:45 AM   #18
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The_Cheeseman wrote:

There are many different gamer psychographics, and each one is drawn to different aspects of an MMO. Just because you don't enjoy a particular facet of the game it doesn't mean that it isn't valuable to others. The game is not all about you. There is plenty of adventuring content in the game, and more is being added every GU. Your complaint is pure hyperbole.

Agreed.

For years, my homes largely consisted of the original 1-room apartments, completely devoid of furnishings apart from a then-required bulletin board so that I could sell my crud.  I thought I was going places when SOE converted them into 2-room apartments one day. 

Even my Mistmoore Crags has sat virtually empty for a year now.  And still I think the OP is being backward and chauvenistic to say the least in both his post title and his actual post.   And besides that, no one died and made him god of all gamers who can decide what everyone should like or do.

And he's going out of his way to complain about facets he doesn't like instead of finding ones he does, and drawing some imaginary line in the sand about what is acceptable and what is not in the world of digital pixels we are all playing with.

OP:  Egomaniacal much?

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Old 10-27-2011, 09:52 AM   #19
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The_Cheeseman wrote:

There are many different gamer psychographics, and each one is drawn to different aspects of an MMO. Just because you don't enjoy a particular facet of the game it doesn't mean that it isn't valuable to others. The game is not all about you. There is plenty of adventuring content in the game, and more is being added every GU. Your complaint is pure hyperbole.

This might have been an accurate post if we hadn't all witnessed an overwhelmingly offensive number of broken patches, broken fixes to patches, and completely ignored testing/bug/feedback relationships over the course of the expansion.  Through that prism, the OP is only partial hyperbole.

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Old 10-27-2011, 11:03 AM   #20
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Without the ton of apperance stuff (and my 1pt AA illusion on my Tigress .. uhm warden! <3) I would have bid this game farewell years ago. While being okish, the endgame in the group and solo department is rather lackluster and basically the same as in other games. But what makes EQ2 still shine for me is the ton of fluff and fun stuff around that can keep me entertained while I'm not collecting gear. And this is where other games (even the evil snowstorm's one)  fail for me.

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Old 10-27-2011, 11:23 AM   #21
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I don't think my post was sexist whatsoever, it's the truth. It may not be 'PC' but it's certaintly the truth. This game has completely lost focus, it used to be about adventuring and questing on a large epic scale. Over the course of the last year it has become more and more like Sim Barbie than anything else.

SOE seem to have latched on to the whole housing theme and are just throwing resources at it whilst abandoning the adventuring side of the game. Let's release another house via station cash that will sell, don't worry about fixing broken gameplay issue the money is with the stay at home moms who like to play in their virtual barbie houses and decorate them.

What's next for EQ2, the in game ability to have a virtual tea party for you and all your friends at my new house?

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Old 10-27-2011, 11:46 AM   #22
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[email protected] DLere wrote:

Adventuring and "dress-up Barbie" are NOT mutually exclusive.  I spend the lion's share of my in-game time raiding, however, I enjoy selecting my outfits for each week's raids.  I generally stick with items that can be acquired through adventuring or crafting, but I like my complete collection of SC petamorph wands.  I, for one, shudder when I consider the days before appearance armour.  I distinctly remember my defiler looking like he had dressed out of a church jumble sale--the best pants he could get at the time were a purple and green pantaloon affair.  He looked like he was auditioning for a kerra circus.  Furthermore, I can't think of one person in my guild's raid force that does not pay at least a little attention to how they look. 

So yes, bugs should be fixed and game mechanics should be adjusted as needed, though I'd wager--opinions being like a$$holes-- that you might have an argument about just what things are actually broken and how they should be repaired.  At any rate, it does no good to come insult people with interests different than your own.  There is a wide range of people that play this game, some only adventure, some only decorate and play dress-up, but quite a few do all three.

I agree with this.  I also spend a big share of my game time raiding.  My main is fully raid geared and two of my alts are close to that.  I have three 90/300 characters,  4 level 90 crafters and a 5th crafter that is over half way there.  I also have numerous homes and thoroughly enjoy decorating them.  I enjoy all of the holiday and special events as well as questing, grouping, and raiding.  I also have several bank boxes full of "outfits" on each character and enjoy "dressing up" when the mood hits me.

To me, this game has so much to offer, no matter what your playstyle.  SMILEY

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Old 10-27-2011, 11:56 AM   #23
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I enjoy all aspects of this game , and am glad they try to enhance all of it. 

Your post

= same as a casual player crying about SOE only catering to raiders and end game content

= same as raiders crying about SOE only catering to the casual adventurer

= same as crafters crying about SOE only caring about the advernture side of the game

I guess when your focus is on  one aspect of the game ....everything else seems pointless...

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Old 10-27-2011, 11:58 AM   #24
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TwistedFaith wrote:

I don't think my post was sexist whatsoever, it's the truth. It may not be 'PC' but it's certaintly the truth. This game has completely lost focus, it used to be about adventuring and questing on a large epic scale. Over the course of the last year it has become more and more like Sim Barbie than anything else.

SOE seem to have latched on to the whole housing theme and are just throwing resources at it whilst abandoning the adventuring side of the game. Let's release another house via station cash that will sell, don't worry about fixing broken gameplay issue the money is with the stay at home moms who like to play in their virtual barbie houses and decorate them.

What's next for EQ2, the in game ability to have a virtual tea party for you and all your friends at my new house?

And you don't think you're being sexist at all? Gads. Are you back in the 50s?

I am a woman who works full-time at a job which is not secretarial and for which I actually make a decent salary. I raid as one of my primary activities in game (and we're 9th or 10th in progression on the most populous server). I also solo and do heroic adventuring with various alts of different levels. I even like changing outfits on one of my characters 'cause it suits her personality (yes, I roleplay). I craft (a few 90s there, too) and I even do a bit of house decorating (though I run out of time too much to do a lot). I also socialise with friends online (though I am not too fond of the "virtual tea parties" 'cause I like being more active in-game than that). I know players of both genders who likewise play through the variety of content including the "fluff" aspects (my boyfriend spends A LOT more time at the "virtual tea parties" than I do.. he spends more time at them then I spend raiding each week, but he likes that aspect of game play more than I do).

It is your characterising of everything YOU don't like as being only suitable for "stay at home moms" that's sexist and denigrating. Not only are you insulting the content not being what you want, you're dismissing female players as something you infer is worthless and implying any player who does enjoy that content as likewise worthless.

So, yes, you are being sexist.

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Old 10-27-2011, 12:11 PM   #25
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Rijacki wrote:

TwistedFaith wrote:

I don't think my post was sexist whatsoever, it's the truth. It may not be 'PC' but it's certaintly the truth. This game has completely lost focus, it used to be about adventuring and questing on a large epic scale. Over the course of the last year it has become more and more like Sim Barbie than anything else.

SOE seem to have latched on to the whole housing theme and are just throwing resources at it whilst abandoning the adventuring side of the game. Let's release another house via station cash that will sell, don't worry about fixing broken gameplay issue the money is with the stay at home moms who like to play in their virtual barbie houses and decorate them.

What's next for EQ2, the in game ability to have a virtual tea party for you and all your friends at my new house?

And you don't think you're being sexist at all? Gads. Are you back in the 50s?

I am a woman who works full-time at a job which is not secretarial and for which I actually make a decent salary. I raid as one of my primary activities in game (and we're 9th or 10th in progression on the most populous server). I also solo and do heroic adventuring with various alts of different levels. I even like changing outfits on one of my characters 'cause it suits her personality (yes, I roleplay). I craft (a few 90s there, too) and I even do a bit of house decorating (though I run out of time too much to do a lot). I also socialise with friends online (though I am not too fond of the "virtual tea parties" 'cause I like being more active in-game than that). I know players of both genders who likewise play through the variety of content including the "fluff" aspects (my boyfriend spends A LOT more time at the "virtual tea parties" than I do.. he spends more time at them then I spend raiding each week, but he likes that aspect of game play more than I do).

It is your characterising of everything YOU don't like as being only suitable for "stay at home moms" that's sexist and denigrating. Not only are you insulting the content not being what you want, you're dismissing female players as something you infer is worthless and implying any player who does enjoy that content as likewise worthless.

So, yes, you are being sexist.

I agree 100%!!!! As a fellow female player I take great offense to your statements as I am sure a lot of other female players do. Maybe once a long time ago men may have dominated the mmo gaming world, but that has changed. A lot of players in most of the top mmo's are now female. To make a comment that claiming the game is being ruined by "stay at home moms" shows just how out of touch you are.

I enjoy raiding, soloing, crafting, and yes I also enjoy decorating. Heck I even enjoy taking a day and doing nothing but harvesting. Are there areas of the game I think need work, yes. But to blame someone else's play style for what you feel is lacking in the game is very childish.

And to say one facet of the game takes away from others also makes little since to me. I highly doubt that every department working on the eq2 game spends all their time coming up with new "fluff" stuff. They have departments which work on different areas of the game like most business do. If one department is handling the decorating aspect of the game and another team is dealing with raiding/adventurer content then it makes no sense to blame the decorating, etc  for the what you see as broken with the game.

 

 

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Old 10-27-2011, 12:28 PM   #26
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Malleria wrote:

BMonkeeus wrote:

Uhh, what?   Reading comprehension for $100 Alex.

Uhh, what? Indeed.

What, if not the barbie or female player references, do you find sexist about the OP?

But that is just it. The OP didn't say 'hello kitty' and 'out of work bums'. He was very specific in his wording and you know the old saying --- "Say what you mean and mean what you say..."

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Old 10-27-2011, 12:29 PM   #27
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Rijacki wrote:

TwistedFaith wrote:

I don't think my post was sexist whatsoever, it's the truth. It may not be 'PC' but it's certaintly the truth. This game has completely lost focus, it used to be about adventuring and questing on a large epic scale. Over the course of the last year it has become more and more like Sim Barbie than anything else.

SOE seem to have latched on to the whole housing theme and are just throwing resources at it whilst abandoning the adventuring side of the game. Let's release another house via station cash that will sell, don't worry about fixing broken gameplay issue the money is with the stay at home moms who like to play in their virtual barbie houses and decorate them.

What's next for EQ2, the in game ability to have a virtual tea party for you and all your friends at my new house?

And you don't think you're being sexist at all? Gads. Are you back in the 50s?

I am a woman who works full-time at a job which is not secretarial and for which I actually make a decent salary. I raid as one of my primary activities in game (and we're 9th or 10th in progression on the most populous server). I also solo and do heroic adventuring with various alts of different levels. I even like changing outfits on one of my characters 'cause it suits her personality (yes, I roleplay). I craft (a few 90s there, too) and I even do a bit of house decorating (though I run out of time too much to do a lot). I also socialise with friends online (though I am not too fond of the "virtual tea parties" 'cause I like being more active in-game than that). I know players of both genders who likewise play through the variety of content including the "fluff" aspects (my boyfriend spends A LOT more time at the "virtual tea parties" than I do.. he spends more time at them then I spend raiding each week, but he likes that aspect of game play more than I do).

It is your characterising of everything YOU don't like as being only suitable for "stay at home moms" that's sexist and denigrating. Not only are you insulting the content not being what you want, you're dismissing female players as something you infer is worthless and implying any player who does enjoy that content as likewise worthless.

So, yes, you are being sexist.

Yeah yeah you're a strong independant women *yawn* heard it all before.

Point being that the vast majority of people I know who are all into the decorating side of the game are stay at home moms. Sorry if that hurts your feelings but it's true.

Either way the emphasis on this game has shifted dramtically over the last 18 months, more and more time is being spent on fluff content rather than what used to be the core gaming elements of EQ2. 

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Old 10-27-2011, 12:31 PM   #28
Malleria

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[email protected] wrote:

Malleria wrote:

BMonkeeus wrote:

Uhh, what?   Reading comprehension for $100 Alex.

Uhh, what? Indeed.

What, if not the barbie or female player references, do you find sexist about the OP?

But that is just it. The OP didn't say 'hello kitty' and 'out of work bums'. He was very specific in his wording and you know the old saying --- "Say what you mean and mean what you say..."

That would be true if the intention of the OP was to attack women. But it isn't. It's a complaint about adventure content not receiving the attention housing/appearance content does. So the fact they mentioned women, while maybe being a poor choice, isn't sexist unless you misinterpret the intent of the poster.

Choosing to focus on the poor wording and not on the actual issue is your problem, not theirs.

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Old 10-27-2011, 12:31 PM   #29
Laenai
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I think several folks who are talking about the enjoyment of multi-faceted games are missing the actual point of the OP.

Yes, there's lots of fun stuff to do in EQ2 including raiding, soloing, grouping, house decorating, crafting, role-play...whatever. No, they are not mutually exclusive of each other, but entirely symbiotic. I myself do all of those things.

HOWEVER

If you want to see where the red names post, check the housing and "fluff" item forums.

If you want to see answers to bugs/glitches/problems with the game, you'll see them only in those places.

Ongoing bugs with classes and adventure content go without simple acknowledgement for months, yet the "fluff" side is acknowledged within hours and fixed within the next hotfix or two.

Ask me how long my shaman pet has been broken, how many ongoing threads on the forums are started each day with the same pet issues, and if a red name has even said "Oh, snap. We need to look at that." Or how long AA mirrors are forgetting specs and whether or not there's a fix in the works. How long did challenge mode raid encounter double up on casting AEs before those were fixed?

And while devs might be working on these things? The public face shows something very different. The public face- the posting of devs- has to do with "fluff." Not with mechanics, not with content, and not with the "adventuring" side. But with house decorating, furniture, and appearance items.

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Old 10-27-2011, 12:31 PM   #30
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Stay on topic please.  Everyone has their own reasons for playing this game, wether is it questing, decoating, raiding, roleplaying, crafting or soloing....  they are all valid reasons to play this game.  

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