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Old 02-15-2007, 01:50 PM   #1
Magnis
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Can Sony reconsider alowing mentors to pvp? Thers has to be reasonable way.

My friends only play on the weekend so they have less time than me, I would love to do the EoF expansion solo, and do the rest of the game with my friends. Ofcourse you all know that  if I outlevel them I would have to mentor them and that is very hard in peak hours in the in nagafen server. 

I know this is a touchy subject but I heard so good suggestions in the past, and im sure if Sony puts some thought they can come up with something, good.

I know many of you would like to have that ability, with no ganking, farming reasons.

One good suggestion would be, have the whole group unable to attack and have 2 or 3 arrows up over their name, that would make anybody hesitant to attack.

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Old 02-15-2007, 02:00 PM   #2
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Sanser wrote:

Can Sony reconsider alowing mentors to pvp? Thers has to be reasonable way.

My friends only play on the weekend so they have less time than me, I would love to do the EoF expansion solo, and do the rest of the game with my friends. Ofcourse you all know that  if I outlevel them I would have to mentor them and that is very hard in peak hours in the in nagafen server. 

I know this is a touchy subject but I heard so good suggestions in the past, and im sure if Sony puts some thought they can come up with something, good.

They will not change it. It was abused way TOO MUCH. If you want to mentor you just have to take the chances that you will be killed or go do it in a instance.
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Old 02-15-2007, 05:35 PM   #3
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Yeah all thats a given, yes I remember the system being abused, but that was when mentors where open to pvp like the general public that they mentored down to.  Im just saying that they should not dump the idea in one try, they could implement other factors into the mentoring system, run a few test if test does good put it live.  They could make it so if it does get abused again turn it of, like they are planning on doing with the no zoning if your in pvp.

These are just the thoughts of a casual player.

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Old 02-15-2007, 05:45 PM   #4
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Roll an alt, lock him, and don't out level your friends.
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Old 02-15-2007, 05:48 PM   #5
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Sanser wrote:

Yeah all thats a given, yes I remember the system being abused, but that was when mentors where open to pvp like the general public that they mentored down to.  Im just saying that they should not dump the idea in one try, they could implement other factors into the mentoring system, run a few test if test does good put it live.  They could make it so if it does get abused again turn it of, like they are planning on doing with the no zoning if your in pvp.

These are just the thoughts of a casual player.

If you were actually a casual player you would not need to mentor to your friends hehe. I suggest having an alt, it is the best answer right now, and i doubt you will see much effort in the mentoring thing it is just "the way it is"
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Old 02-16-2007, 01:14 PM   #6
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I tell you what.Go to the arena and fight a lvl 70 mentored down to lets say 40 and them come back and say mentor in pvp is a good idea.

I have tried this and with him just sitting there not fighting back i could not land even 1 of my master spells on him.Each was resisted every single time.

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Old 02-16-2007, 01:27 PM   #7
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Mentoring is definitely one of those areas where some serious work would have to be done to implement into the game.  Somehow, the reduction downward just doesn't seem balanced.  Yet, fighting in the arena is no way to judge this because arena ruleset is different than PvP.

I totally agree that mentoring down to help someone outside of an instance is as close to hanging a kill me sign as possible in the game as it stands, and this is an area that could do with some scrutiny.  But until a balanced fix can be put in, it will need to stay for the moment.

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Old 02-16-2007, 02:32 PM   #8
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They would have to make mentor much more harsh for it to viable. Example in pve my lev70 mentors down to like low 20s and I can still get my nuke off for over 1k sometimes same with other ca's and such plus the top end gear would just make it impossible for others. Matter of fact I have mentored and gone out questing with others been attacked and they could barely touch me. It would be nice.

Maybe if you wanted it maybe they could make you use those level appropiate spells and armor, and weapons. That might do the trick. Anything over your mentor level would not work. Sucks to have a second set of lowbie gear but I think this could be your solution.

I would like to see a test of this and see what the difference in numbers would be

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Old 02-17-2007, 01:49 AM   #9
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I never expected to say this, but I actually agree with Gildorath and Bozidar.  The current mentoring system leaves the mentored player way too uber and it's just not fair, so rather than fix it, SOE just disabled it.  The solution, as Bozidar mentioned, roll an Alt and lock XP on it and just play the alt when your friend is online and keep it level locked at your friend's level.  When your friend isn't around, you shouldn't get too much more xp (quests, discoveries, etc., but not too much extra most likely) and be able to stay within a level of your buddy even if u do accidently level up. 

If SOE actually fixed the mentoring system to make mentored players equal to the level they were mentoring down to, there are a great many wonderful things they could accomplish on the PvP servers.  What it would take is to treat every piece of equipment as the Mastercrafted version of that tier ... so all mentored people would be equal to twinks, but not uber.  The mentored player would still be above someone that level in treasured gear, but not too overpowered.  Additionally, change the health, power, spells/combat arts, etc. back to the level being mentored down to.  Sure, AA's might be a problem, but that's about the only problems I could really see. 

I'm guessing SOE doesn't want to do that because they intentionally made mentored players uber so the mentoring player would enjoy mentoring in PvE ... unfortunately, that makes things unfair in PvP. 

If the mentoring was done correctly, you could auto-mentor everyone above a certain level down to a certain level that is set so that most of the mobs in that zone are greyed out.  That allows higher level toons to move through the zone relatively easily, but also allows everyone in that zone to be a white-con.  This would give people something to do with their level 70 characters besides raid.  If there is no PvP action in one tier, go to a zone in a lower tier, this way you could almost always find goood PvP action. 

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Old 02-17-2007, 02:44 AM   #10
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The only way mentoring would work is if it was like it was originally, where you used your actual abilities for the level. The way it was implemented back then though made it a pain to have hotkeys for each tier you were mentoring in.
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Old 02-17-2007, 03:58 AM   #11
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zorros wrote:

I tell you what.Go to the arena and fight a lvl 70 mentored down to lets say 40 and them come back and say mentor in pvp is a good idea.

  As  always Lageb, your exactly right! They dont scale. They also have spells that arent even available at that lvl!!

   That is not the problem though. The problem is outlined here in this fictional, but very closeto the truth example

 Example:::::  the valiant Troubador Dankshasta,is chasing some orange con Q's, did I say some, Ok a full group !yeah thats it, a full group of oranges. So these Orange conned Q's they know they aint got a chance, they know they are gonna get rolled by the mighty solo Troubador. So they run into an instance. Now they get on guild chat, and put out the cry for help

" Please help us!! That meanie Dankshasta has our whole group holed up in Fire Myst Gulley, and we are scared to fight him. Now the way things are now, they must either call home, or face the beating outside the instance at the hands of the God like Troubador awaiting them.I  mean I'dbe scared too! That troubador is tough.

 So now if we can mentor PvP, it wouldbe like this___> Coward Q #1 we'll call him Ragatussin, no connection to any cowardly Q's.i just like te sound of that name. So Ragatussin say in guild " we need some help ,that Dankshasta has my group trapped" So the guild leader,we'll call him Keshsux, he says " well we got 70'swe could mentor down to con orange to him,  how many do you need?" Ragatussin replys " well it's Dankshasta, I already peed my pants, HELP ME!!!!! I need 20 t7s here asap, I dont want to take any chances."

       In comes the 20 mentored Q's, actually it'smy example so to make the story more realistic, I pwn all 26 orange conned Qs.For most players though it wouldnt end like that, they would get rolledby a crap load of people,ad it could happen at any time they had alot of t7 characters online, but you can see how server resources, farming spots, pvp choke points, everything, could be manipulated by a guild that had alot of 70s.

 Fast example, how could you ever hunt someone, when they could be out there PvPing at any level they find a group?  Yeah it would be cool, and I sympathize, but it will never happen!

   Did anybody understand this? If youdid please explain it to me, I got confused after the part about the Valiant Troubador. Whether it makessense or not, i think I see a movie script in there!

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Old 02-17-2007, 11:03 AM   #12
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lol I remember mentored pvp. You see a few greens the situation looks cool then the that green wiz unleashes ice comet on ur [Removed for Content]. Or a sniper shot comes outa know where. You rush the twink as a team looking to crush his mentored green [Removed for Content] but ur attacks and spells glance off like water against his fabled ur so screwed armor.
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Old 02-17-2007, 01:46 PM   #13
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my suggestion:

While mentoring, you can only attack a player who is attacking you (not your groupmate, but only you.) If you kill a player while mentoring, you will not get any faction or loot, and the killed player will not lose any faction or loot either.

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Old 02-17-2007, 07:35 PM   #14
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DankShasta wrote:
zorros wrote:

I tell you what.Go to the arena and fight a lvl 70 mentored down to lets say 40 and them come back and say mentor in pvp is a good idea.

  As  always Lageb, your exactly right! They dont scale. They also have spells that arent even available at that lvl!!

   That is not the problem though. The problem is outlined here in this fictional, but very closeto the truth example

 Example:::::  the valiant Troubador Dankshasta,is chasing some orange con Q's, did I say some, Ok a full group !yeah thats it, a full group of oranges. So these Orange conned Q's they know they aint got a chance, they know they are gonna get rolled by the mighty solo Troubador. So they run into an instance. Now they get on guild chat, and put out the cry for help

" Please help us!! That meanie Dankshasta has our whole group holed up in Fire Myst Gulley, and we are scared to fight him. Now the way things are now, they must either call home, or face the beating outside the instance at the hands of the God like Troubador awaiting them.I  mean I'dbe scared too! That troubador is tough.

 So now if we can mentor PvP, it wouldbe like this___> Coward Q #1 we'll call him Ragatussin, no connection to any cowardly Q's.i just like te sound of that name. So Ragatussin say in guild " we need some help ,that Dankshasta has my group trapped" So the guild leader,we'll call him Keshsux, he says " well we got 70'swe could mentor down to con orange to him,  how many do you need?" Ragatussin replys " well it's Dankshasta, I already peed my pants, HELP ME!!!!! I need 20 t7s here asap, I dont want to take any chances."

       In comes the 20 mentored Q's, actually it'smy example so to make the story more realistic, I pwn all 26 orange conned Qs.For most players though it wouldnt end like that, they would get rolledby a crap load of people,ad it could happen at any time they had alot of t7 characters online, but you can see how server resources, farming spots, pvp choke points, everything, could be manipulated by a guild that had alot of 70s.

 Fast example, how could you ever hunt someone, when they could be out there PvPing at any level they find a group?  Yeah it would be cool, and I sympathize, but it will never happen!

   Did anybody understand this? If youdid please explain it to me, I got confused after the part about the Valiant Troubador. Whether it makessense or not, i think I see a movie script in there!

LOL this post had me rolling!You meanieSMILEY
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Old 02-17-2007, 07:36 PM   #15
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QQ-Fatman wrote:

my suggestion:

While mentoring, you can only attack a player who is attacking you (not your groupmate, but only you.) If you kill a player while mentoring, you will not get any faction or loot, and the killed player will not lose any faction or loot either.

With taunt this would get abused fast, all you would have to do is taunt the player attacking your firends, they attack you then kick their butt.
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Old 02-18-2007, 02:42 AM   #16
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 Bringing mentoring back would probably to get some of you wimps to unlock.
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Old 02-18-2007, 07:34 AM   #17
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Gildorath wrote:
QQ-Fatman wrote:

my suggestion:

While mentoring, you can only attack a player who is attacking you (not your groupmate, but only you.) If you kill a player while mentoring, you will not get any faction or loot, and the killed player will not lose any faction or loot either.

With taunt this would get abused fast, all you would have to do is taunt the player attacking your firends, they attack you then kick their butt.
No hostile action is allowed unless you're attacked first. My idea is just so we dont have to lock xp to get quest aa's before the quests are grey... we'll be able to mentor to get aa's without getting killed (at least i can fight back if someone is trying to kill me.)
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Old 02-20-2007, 05:15 PM   #18
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A combination of the ideas here would work great.  Make a group with a mentoring person unable to attack unless they are attacked first, and give a warning over their heads.  If you came across a group with three arrows up you would know at least one of them is mentored, and what you might be up against.  It would be nice to be able to mentor friends and guild mates without being a sitting duck to the next gank group that passes by.  On the flip side, if sony just removed the pvp death penalty for mentored players, that would be a step in the right direction, but I for one would prefer to be able to fight back when I'm attacked.
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Old 02-21-2007, 07:36 PM   #19
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I would prefer to go through all the trouble of putting my lower level equipment, and redoing my hot bar to be able to pvp while mentoring someone.  I atleast would have a fighting chance.  I bet many of us would rather have that option too.
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Old 02-22-2007, 12:23 AM   #20
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I'd prefer that you not have that option so that my locked toon can continue his business with less interference.
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Old 02-22-2007, 12:53 AM   #21
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Are you attempting to be satirical?
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Old 02-22-2007, 12:58 AM   #22
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No, he stated his opinion so I did mine.
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Old 02-22-2007, 01:12 AM   #23
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Just wonderin' mang, clarification is key when ambiguity has sa présence.
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Old 02-22-2007, 02:12 PM   #24
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Well I guess im just a special case, heck ive spent so much time leveling cafters id never consentrated on my adventuring.

The new expansion is great realy injoy it, im trying to get to 70 asap by doing EoF.  But I feel like im really missing a big part of the game by skipping the earlier content.  Thank God RL friends play the game but since they are brand new they are not doing EoF.

I can mentor them and do the Q, TS and EL and so on and feel like im doing as much as I can.  Im the kind of guy that actually reads the quest, even if it ends up kill 20 of X modns. and I have too many alt crafts, and my original pally is my one and only so I dont see myself makling an alt ATM.  Sure I can try dropping the group and getting invited when we see a group of FPs or when unmentor and get my friends through a zone when PVP is on the way.  But mentored PVP would be and added flavor to my cake.  I believe it can be done, but if not the game goes on.

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