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Old 07-20-2007, 04:46 PM   #31
Druisagoldengod

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Pretty... pretty [Removed for Content] actually. Soooo, SK's can't T1 dps... we can't solo as well thanks to Reaver nerf... AND with hate changes we can't tank. Thanks...
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Old 07-20-2007, 04:47 PM   #32
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CapnJax21 wrote:

 [email protected] wrote:

Scouts hate xfer = 23% or higher (AD3 if I recall, even after the nerf) Sorcerers = 4% at Master 1.  Yep, 4%.  Its about leveling the playing field - and feeling useful.  I feel even worse for brawlers, which is why my Bruiser is an alt now. agressiv

You didn't finish...

All rangers bring groupwise is PF (out of any of our permabuffs).  Sorcerers have more utility than we do.  You want to level the playing field?  Fine...

I don't have a sorcerer.  I don't know their spells/perma buffs - but I'm sure you guys have more to bring to a raid than we do.  If all we bring is DPS - then let us.

Sorcerers have two buffs that take concentration that affect the group.   Wizards get evac like scouts, and warlocks can go down an AA tree which enhances proc chances for the group.  We each have a few weapon or damage procs we can toss on group members or raid members, but they don't stack even with the other archtype. So yes, we have some utility, but don't call us a chanter or a bard, or even a healer - there is no comparison. I'd gladly trade most, if not all, of that utility to get a 25% hate transfer. Scouts and do high dps because they can transfer or lower their hate significantly without the assistance of anyone.  In addition, there are a lot more non-caster DPS buffs than caster ones.  In order for sorcerers to be effective we need external hate manipulation like from a pally or guard + hate reducers from chanters and troubs.  If we don't get that, we either die frequently or will be doing much lower DPS than any scout. agressiv
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Old 07-20-2007, 04:47 PM   #33
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Oh and whats this?  we-tad-ed gets bleeped on the boards? That in itself is quite lame.
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Old 07-20-2007, 04:47 PM   #34
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CapnJax21 wrote:

I'm finding more and more sorceres being singleminded selfish players.  Is this a trend on all servers?

You're treading on thin ice.  Do yourself a favor and stick to the topic at hand, and not why you have a grudge against another class.
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Old 07-20-2007, 04:48 PM   #35
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I'm with you Brega, I'll be on test pvp within the hour of my getting home and I plan on /feedbacking my [Removed for Content] off.
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Old 07-20-2007, 04:52 PM   #36
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[email protected]ost wrote:
Pretty... pretty [I cannot control my vocabulary] actually. Soooo, SK's can't T1 dps... we can't solo as well thanks to Reaver nerf... AND with hate changes we can't tank. Thanks...

Lockeye hates coercers, SK's, and assassins, and has demontrated this many a time.

I also love how they bring one of the more game changing nerfs in to play right before fanfare, i bet there will be a riot

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Old 07-20-2007, 04:52 PM   #37
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I just think its funny that these Sorc's don't realize that with Troubs and dirges and transfers getting nerfed, Hate will be worse on them too.  Far Far worse.  Basically only the brigand and the ranger changes don't affect EVERYONE in the raid. 
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Old 07-20-2007, 04:53 PM   #38
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Just a heads up to all the mages saying the agro balancing between classes is good, bringing more on par with sorc agro, just remember on raids the tank holding agro over you is greatly helped right now by all these agro transfers being hit. This change means less hate for tank and more deaths for you. I understand the sorc issue that is making them mad. Heck I am leveling a wizard now myself and I see the issue, I also see ways around the issue if you actually use items in game and AAs presented to you. These agro changes will end up hurting raids a lot. Tanks will be getting much, much less hate help from the scouts and coercers and in turn will end up killing much more dps heavy classes. If the devs insist on doing agro changes, please allow for a character copy to test so that raid guilds can come over and test these out heavily on raids, and possibly leave this on test till 38 giving a great amount of time to make sure the changes are done in a way that doesnt greatly affect players experiences in a negative way.
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Old 07-20-2007, 04:54 PM   #39
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FiveFootStep wrote:
I'm with you Brega, I'll be on test pvp within the hour of my getting home and I plan on /feedbacking my [I cannot control my vocabulary] off.
You know they dont seem to care if plat spammers spam people , i should make a / feedback spam that can do it to SOE instead, maby i can annoy them into not screwing up gameplay
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Old 07-20-2007, 04:59 PM   #40
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this has been said a 100 times but it is worth saying again the nerf on the scout hate, is more a nerf on casters.  scouts wont be affected that much we have Ca's and poisons to deal with agro.  I will still go full out.  the tank however will have less hate now, making casters pull more agro. 
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Old 07-20-2007, 05:00 PM   #41
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Hakthaf wrote:
Just a heads up to all the mages saying the agro balancing between classes is good, bringing more on par with sorc agro, just remember on raids the tank holding agro over you is greatly helped right now by all these agro transfers being hit. This change means less hate for tank and more deaths for you. I understand the sorc issue that is making them mad. Heck I am leveling a wizard now myself and I see the issue, I also see ways around the issue if you actually use items in game and AAs presented to you. These agro changes will end up hurting raids a lot. Tanks will be getting much, much less hate help from the scouts and coercers and in turn will end up killing much more dps heavy classes. If the devs insist on doing agro changes, please allow for a character copy to test so that raid guilds can come over and test these out heavily on raids, and possibly leave this on test till 38 giving a great amount of time to make sure the changes are done in a way that doesnt greatly affect players experiences in a negative way.
But... evidently, they *want* to greatly affect players experiences in a very negative way.
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Old 07-20-2007, 05:01 PM   #42
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Agreed, I pointed it out in another thread that the hate transfer nerfs affect everyone. I do think that often the tanks are at or past cap anyways, so some of that hate transfer is simply wasted - in which case its not as large of a calamity for the raid as originally thought. agressiv
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Old 07-20-2007, 05:02 PM   #43
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I cant believe that they are reinstituting the hate nerfs. Here I thought the devs actually showed a spark of minor intelligence by removing it from the previous LU, but then they come and bring it back for this LU, once again proving their complete idiocity.
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Old 07-20-2007, 05:03 PM   #44
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I think it's great. I'm sick of people not being able to control their aggro.

This will surely get people on the balls and dont just smash button and use that [I cannot control my vocabulary] Elude.

Plus, if you take 5mins and read all the AA's change, you'll see that they increase all the hate related buffs so it'd be more effective, the aggro reduction isn't as bad as everybpdy claim. So far, as a swash, I've yet to control my hate in any possible way. We have a good MT who's doing his job correctly.

I just hope the fckin ranger and brig will get one-shotted when they pull aggro so i dont have to worry about chasing the mob.

and for everybody that is claiming OMG OMG WE SAID NO ALREADY, FU. Read the changes, they're not the same as what was on test previously. k.thx.bye

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Old 07-20-2007, 05:08 PM   #45
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The sad thing as far as the hate transfers go is that I believe its just them taking the % transfered down so when RoK comes out and they get upgrades to the spells a few weeks-months down the road they will be back where they were. Just like they have done before..back when EoH was getting released they decreased mitigation and resists on KoS gear. The fact is most raiding classes are back to were they were towards teh end of KoS as far as mitigation and resists go but they had to spend months raiding the new EoH content and getting the new class gear to get there. Heres a clue SOE stop rolling us back so we can get to the same spot after months of raiding new content. You stated that this game was designed to take people all the way to lvl100 or some such BS yet every expansion we get rolled back and have to spend the entire expansion relearning or regearing our toons just to get to the point we were at before the expansion..thats not true progress.

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Old 07-20-2007, 05:11 PM   #46
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if they are going to make upgrades to hate transfers when RoK comes out then they should nerf the old ones then

NOT MONTHS AHEAD OF TIME

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Old 07-20-2007, 05:11 PM   #47
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Boramyr wrote:
I just think its funny that these Sorc's don't realize that with Troubs and dirges and transfers getting nerfed, Hate will be worse on them too.  Far Far worse.  Basically only the brigand and the ranger changes don't affect EVERYONE in the raid. 
I would like to point out that one of 'these sorcs' started this thread and has been defending your [Removed for Content].
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Old 07-20-2007, 05:14 PM   #48
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Mr. Dawkins that is an outstanding idea. We should riot at fan faire... that will teach them...
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Old 07-20-2007, 05:20 PM   #49
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[email protected] wrote:
Mr. Dawkins that is an outstanding idea. We should riot at fan faire... that will teach them...

Exactly!

This is no different than if someone came up to you, told you that they slept with your wife, and then would like to have a plesant lunch with you tomorow in the break room.

Personaly Id throw a chair at the guy.

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Old 07-20-2007, 05:21 PM   #50
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What's the deal with screwing Brigands again?  What's the logic in taking away the hate position decrease of our Confound line?
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Old 07-20-2007, 05:23 PM   #51
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[email protected] DLere wrote:
Boramyr wrote:
I just think its funny that these Sorc's don't realize that with Troubs and dirges and transfers getting nerfed, Hate will be worse on them too.  Far Far worse.  Basically only the brigand and the ranger changes don't affect EVERYONE in the raid. 
I would like to point out that one of 'these sorcs' started this thread and has been defending your [I cannot control my vocabulary].
Sorry Beeglin your one of the good ones SMILEY
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Old 07-20-2007, 05:24 PM   #52
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the coercer hate buff that is getting nerfed...is a level 52 spell that according to the devs will NEVER upgrade. So its not a matter of nerfing it to make it better in RoK or anything.

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Old 07-20-2007, 05:26 PM   #53
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SK's brigands, assassins, coercers,  not so much defilers but some.....Lockeye hates any pure evil class (except necros but plat farmers play necros so they have funds going into making them better all the time)

 SK's cant hold agro (ever) and their heals got nerfed

brigs got their hate nerfed, and amaizing reflexes back in the day that was a huge dps nerf

Assassins just have never gotten anything decently new ever, same old borring backstabs since day 1

coercers........all i can do is cry when the class comes to mind

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Old 07-20-2007, 05:31 PM   #54
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[Bad Artwork] ---> SoE *grabs a chair* See you at Fan Faire! SMILEY             SMILEY             SMILEY
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Old 07-20-2007, 05:36 PM   #55
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Mr. Dawkins wrote:

SK's brigands, assassins, coercers,  not so much defilers but some.....Lockeye hates any pure evil class (except necros but plat farmers play necros so they have funds going into making them better all the time)

 SK's cant hold agro (ever) and their heals got nerfed

brigs got their hate nerfed, and amaizing reflexes back in the day that was a huge dps nerf

Assassins just have never gotten anything decently new ever, same old borring backstabs since day 1

coercers........all i can do is cry when the class comes to mind

1) our SK can tank AND hold aggro just fine...

2) Amazing reflexes makes you loose dps... welcome to the real world dude... Aoe's does exist and you know what.. almost none of them hurts your dps...

3) Asn are freakin amazing dps if they know just a bit [I cannot control my vocabulary] they're doing.

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Old 07-20-2007, 05:39 PM   #56
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If your SK was tanking AND NOT holding agro he isn't much of a tank now is he =P
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Old 07-20-2007, 05:41 PM   #57
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[email protected] wrote:
If your SK was tanking AND NOT holding agro he isn't much of a tank now is he =P
Read again. I said he can tank AND hold aggro.
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Old 07-20-2007, 05:46 PM   #58
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Any tank can hold agro with the right group IE assassin or dirge or god forbid coercer, but put him in a random pick up group and everyone but the sk will hold agro

was yours doing it alone? haha prolly not, so with the whole hate buff nerfs, Im gona sit back and watch all the SK's NOT hold agro

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Old 07-20-2007, 05:50 PM   #59
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Seems to me that maybe hate should follow an curve, greater rate of rise as over dps increases.

Like a 1:1 if the group or raid dps is below Number X, and 1 for 1.5 if between X and Y, and 1 for 2 if above Y.

I still feel at those this change is more intended to be directly at limiting overall dps (thinking raids I suppose).

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Old 07-20-2007, 05:54 PM   #60
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i agree with the hate transfer changes but have to admit scouts did it to themselves.  bragging on forums about how they dont even have to use evade and such when they are using it.  playing a scout on a raid isnt nearly as challenging as eq1.  as a guardian i know first hand with an assassin hate transfer on me i basically have to just stand there with my reactive on.  its not even a challenge. 

just wondering when did you become the game producer?  who cares what you said to their agro changes=) most everyone else sees the imbalance.

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