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Old 02-22-2005, 06:10 PM   #1
lge7

 
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Does adept 1 of lv 35 spell grim lethargy (AoE) slow equal to adept 1 lv 24 spell keening haze (single target) and do they stack ? I just turned 35 and have been starting the MOB fights out with Grim then casting 2 wards on MT ( ancestral ward and the class ward ) then lv 26 spell cry of the ancients (normaly 1st mob taget is dead already), if the slows stack can i cast grim 1st the wards 2nd  then keening 3rd would that be better ?...whats the normal spell cast order everone is using ? On single targets i lv 24 keening haze then lv 21 delusion then 2 wards then 3 DoT lv 24 cold fire lv 28 miasma lv 11 contagion (still sticks on all mobs).
 
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Old 02-22-2005, 07:15 PM   #2
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Grim Lethargy doesn't equate much at all to the Haze spells.  The slow % is very little and there is no debuff effect.  Given the amount of aggro it causes to the mystic I find it near useless - you either have a group of mobs hitting the tank or a group of 90% effective mobs hitting you.  Until they raise the slow and include a debuff so it really is more like a group Haze, I'm not gonna use it.  You're better off Hazing the mobs one at a time.  They don't stack, as far as I know.
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Old 02-22-2005, 08:12 PM   #3
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Tabbing through 6-8 mobs, hazing, then waiting 7 seconds ? what's your ward holding for about 1 hit? Grim Lethargy COULD use some improvement, but if you wait long enough you can avoid aggro usually.....and your ward will last a heckuva lot longer. I use it frequently, and find it to be much easier than trying to tab through all those multi-target encounters and waiting on keening haze to come back up. Granted it isn't quite as effective, but it does help some. Otherwise what are you doing? Spamming your two useful heals (semi-useful really) and getting aggro that way? All the while not keeping the tank healed and hoping your templar/fury is gonna do it?
 
We sure could use some help as Mystics, but at least use what we have
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Old 02-23-2005, 01:50 AM   #4
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Heyya:To answer your question.Keening Haze Adept 3 = 20% slow with attack and str debuffs.Grim Lethargy Adept 3 = 15% slow with no debuffs.I can't be totally sure on the Adept 1 rates, but I think it's 15% for Keening, 11% for Grim, at adept 1. I adpet 3 all my slows because I'm nuts. It's turned out to pay off, with a 5% boost for Keening, 4% boost for Grim. Very nice.Now, Keening > Grim in terms of slowing power, but when you've got a group of 5 in camp, which are you going to use? I cast Grim, then Cry/Howl of the Ancients, rather than target each and do keen/fallacy, just to speed things up. On the named, when we get down to just him and not his buddies, I do Mourning Soul (35% at adept 3), and fallacy. But on the initial situation I always go with the group slow rather than cast multiple slows.
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Old 02-23-2005, 02:32 AM   #5
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Mourning Soul is 35% at App 1.  SMILEY
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Old 02-26-2005, 02:49 AM   #6
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BigDave wrote:
Grim Lethargy doesn't equate much at all to the Haze spells. The slow % is very little and there is no debuff effect. Given the amount of aggro it causes to the mystic I find it near useless - you either have a group of mobs hitting the tank or a group of 90% effective mobs hitting you. Until they raise the slow and include a debuff so it really is more like a group Haze, I'm not gonna use it. You're better off Hazing the mobs one at a time. They don't stack, as far as I know.

No wonder you agree with bandit...you can't see things that are infront of your face.you don't even need Bandit's uber parsing ability for this.Here's a hint for you guys to get a picture of your class.stop playing 2 hours a day in pickup grps where you don't know what lvl the tank's competence lvl and skill lvl abilities are.gain a couple lvls so you're not fighting lvl 35 stuff all the time just because you think your debuffs don't do anything against white yellow con mobs.Think about a place like permafrost...or anywhere that you're fight white/yellow mobs that there are 3-moreif each mob...less say 5...have Xdps (5*x =dps durration of fight) and you cast Dreadful/grim lethargy..then you have (5 * 85%X for the duration of fight{maintaing slow)) vs single haze (80%X + 4x) with 11secs before teh second mob is slowed..11 more secs before the 3rd mob is slowed...11 more secs before the 4th mob is slowed and 11 more secs before the 5th mob is slowed..Now, does the 20% slow mean more on a mob that's hitting full speed for 44 seconds more than the same mob hitting at 85% of speed since begining of fight?Grp with a tank that has adept 1/3 shout and you shouldn't have trouble with the agrobut otherwise listen to other ppl on this forum and think that you mitigate almost as well as a tank and just off tank
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Old 02-26-2005, 03:25 AM   #7
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Sorry to disappoint you Capt Uber Mystic.  I've seen Everfrost.  I've seen nasties just as mean as yours.
 
This is all about numbers, which you clearly don't understand.
 
Here's the deal:
 
Slow only affects the standard melee portion of a mob's DPS.  That's it.  Your Slow, whether it be 15 or 20 percent means very very little.
 
Two thirds of a mob's DPS are completely UNTOUCHABLE by you.  Sorry!  Those specials aren't affected one bit by your Slow.  They still keep landing with the same ferocity and frequency they did before you dropped Slow on.  So, you are left with one third of a mobs total DPS that you can dent.  The best case scenario is to drop Haze and something in the Delusion line on every single mob.  Thats the BEST case.
 
Let's say you manage to get the best case, and let's further say that you manage to do it before a single blow has landed, and go one further and say that you manage to keep every single mob in the encounter debuffed the entire time with these debuffs.
 
How much impact did you have?  Do you know?  I do, I've parsed it.  It's in the neighborhood of 12.5 percent.  You managed to knock 13 percent off the OVERALL DPS of the encounter.
 
That doesn't even consider the fact that a mob is going to Slow itself.  Read that again.  A mob will SLOW ITSELF.  By using it's specials, a mob must pause swinging to cast.  So, by increasing his swing time, you have done nothing but give him more opportunity to slide a special in between his swings and not lose time.
 
It also doesn't consider the time or mana it takes to do that amount of debuffing.  It takes a lot of both to achieve that absolute best case 13 percent.  Most likely you take shortcuts, Grim Lethargy instead of Haze . . . no Delusion.  You're probably only getting 8 - 10 percent knocked off the encounter DPS when those factors are considered.
 
Bring some facts back with you next time, some numeric basis for your assertations, and we'll talk.
 
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Old 02-26-2005, 03:53 AM   #8
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Show some of your parses bandit...scribble it on a notepad of paper scan it in as a jpg and link it something more than just "i've parsed it" that's all you ever saydo something besides coming here thinking you're a statical major and your math is beyond the comprehension of anything the world of everquest has ever seen.Bring your data to the table...I'll grant you some facts...a mobs specials are not effected...butare you saying that if a mob does 10k damage in a fight than 6600 of it was by special moves?...ok show that on a parse of a single mobonce again i'm telling you will not prove any data conclusively untill you use a packet sniffer and examine the true effects of spells...since you don't agree with the text. Or you can duel someone and they use the ShowHud command and see the atkspeed decrease/dps/str/stam debuffs ect..do you cast your nox/elemental debuff?have you parse it to? if so...how...if now..how do you know it's doing anythingHave you parsed your savior line to make sure the %s are correct?...bring your data to the table post some...like your high school teacher said on most of your homework "SHOW YOUR WORK"Does anyone on your server grp with you?I mean if I saw you LFG and had read some of your thoughts on your class, ie; Debuffs don't work, slows only effect 1/3 of the mob dps and are only 11% effective against that...you mitigate almost as well as a tank...to me you sound more like a paly than a mystic.next post I hope to see a logfile/ or scaned in work of some of your calculationsnot someI've done this and that and figured this and here it is I want to to see screenshots/log files of MOB HITS you FOR 500, you cast ward, ward protected you for 1000.show something like that consistently. you want to use the scientific method of getting mobs OOM for your parsing..well show consistant hits like that to prove mitigation is close to a tankshow a timed log of a mob doing regular hits over a min then slow that mob with a 35% slow and see if still does it's regular only 8-11% less.SHOW YOUR WORK!!!
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Old 02-26-2005, 03:54 AM   #9
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Banditman wrote:
Sorry to disappoint you Capt Uber Mystic. I've seen Everfrost. I've seen nasties just as mean as yours.
This is all about numbers, which you clearly don't understand.
Here's the deal:
Slow only affects the standard melee portion of a mob's DPS. That's it. Your Slow, whether it be 15 or 20 percent means very very little.
Two thirds of a mob's DPS are completely UNTOUCHABLE by you. Sorry! Those specials aren't affected one bit by your Slow. They still keep landing with the same ferocity and frequency they did before you dropped Slow on. So, you are left with one third of a mobs total DPS that you can dent. The best case scenario is to drop Haze and something in the Delusion line on every single mob. Thats the BEST case.
Let's say you manage to get the best case, and let's further say that you manage to do it before a single blow has landed, and go one further and say that you manage to keep every single mob in the encounter debuffed the entire time with these debuffs.
How much impact did you have? Do you know? I do, I've parsed it. It's in the neighborhood of 12.5 percent. You managed to knock 13 percent off the OVERALL DPS of the encounter.
That doesn't even consider the fact that a mob is going to Slow itself. Read that again. A mob will SLOW ITSELF. By using it's specials, a mob must pause swinging to cast. So, by increasing his swing time, you have done nothing but give him more opportunity to slide a special in between his swings and not lose time.
It also doesn't consider the time or mana it takes to do that amount of debuffing. It takes a lot of both to achieve that absolute best case 13 percent. Most likely you take shortcuts, Grim Lethargy instead of Haze . . . no Delusion. You're probably only getting 8 - 10 percent knocked off the encounter DPS when those factors are considered.
Bring some facts back with you next time, some numeric basis for your assertations, and we'll talk.
G'day!

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Old 02-26-2005, 04:06 AM   #10
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Banditman wrote:They still keep landing with the same ferocity and frequency they did before you dropped Slow on. So, and something in the Delusion line on every single mob. Thats the BEST case.
Let's say you manage to get the best case, and let's further say that you manage to do it before a single blow has landed, and go one further and say that you manage to keep every single mob in the encounter debuffed the entire time with these debuffs.
How much impact did you have? Do you know? I do, I've parsed it. It's in the neighborhood of 12.5 percent. You managed to knock 13 percent off the OVERALL DPS of the encounter.
hmmmso 20% slow only effects 33% of dps correct1/5 * 1/3 = 1/15 of overall dps correct?so is that in the neighborhood of 12.5% or is it about half that...sans debuffing
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Old 02-26-2005, 04:20 AM   #11
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I think that 12.5% includes the -offensive skills aspect of haze, and may also include a delusion line debuff.
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Old 02-26-2005, 04:23 AM   #12
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Ok so if that's the case bandit is now saying debuffs are as useful as slows...okno correct me if i'm wrong but hasn't it been said that he has parse no difference in a app1 slow vs an adept 3 slow?so that would mean what?1/10 * 1/3 = 1/30th? or 3.33% so that would mean that debuffs are 3x more effective than slows correct?
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Old 02-26-2005, 04:52 AM   #13
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Taken from "By the Numbers. Part II":The most stunning fact, for me personally, was the illustration of how much damage is actually coming from those Special Attacks and Combat Arts. I would certainly never have expected to see 60 percent damage coming from those. Going back to my 1000 points of raw damage (you guys know I love that number). It is now clear that 600 points of that damage is untouchable by our debuffs. By casting two spells, Keening Haze and Delusion, we can decrease the other portion by about 34 percent. So, by debuffing that 1000 points of damage, we still have 864 points of damage left to deal with.864 is 86.4% of 1000 meaning 13.6% which is effected by debuffs.Taken from "By the Numbers, Part III":While some of the details have changed, the song generally remains the same. We still are only able to have an impact upon that portion of damage created by a mobs standard melee attacks. Even at our best, we can debuff an entire group of mobs to about 66% of it's normal damage output within the standard melee portion. The overall decrease in encounter DPS is approximately 12.5 percent - assuming no resists and instant cast and non-expiring debuffs. Yea, that's a pretty big assumption.So the 12.5% did include all debuffs.
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Old 02-26-2005, 06:10 AM   #14
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I went and re-read those two articles...I agree with is calculation of haze line slows (pre-slowcast swings per sec / post-slowcast swings per sec)this conclusion shows that he slow was 15% affective both with wailing and keening haze...so im guessing he was using the adept 1 version of bothso know we prove that.Slow for adept is parsed the same is the spell description (for these two slow spells).[so try this..upgrade to adept 3..see if you can parse a 20% slow]now lets look at the rest of the data and ask these questionspull mob....time the mob till he goes OOP or atleast till about 5% of powerCount swings and specialspull mob with slow...maintain slow till mob goes OOP or atleast till about 5% of power.Count swings and specialsCalculate attacks per sec pre and post slowTo prove that Bandit is correct in saying you can't affect specials then using slow up until the mob is OOM you will only parse a 5% difference in the two.Now for debuffs do the same thingbut you have to treat these differently than swings.Gather all your "Crushing blows"Gather all your "Barrages"Gather all your "other special attacks"get a base damage per attack of each of thesecompare this against the same damage per attack against the mob debuffed with fallacy or what ever.Speculation the str debuffed imo is scaled much like the slow line..with the lvl of the mobso weakness debuffing 11 str on appropriate lvl mobs is as useful as chimerik debuffing 42 on an appropriate lvl mob..given that mobs str scales up with lvls much as Players strength does.I do not agree with you conclusion of AE slow being a 27% slowI think your own data shows more of a 20% slow than a 27% and I would rather see another test to even confirm 20%.Also what you all are failing to realize is that Bandits conclusions about slows overall dps decrease are based solely on mobs that you KILL at the point that the go OOP.What you are failing to see is the EPIC encounters...no ancient watcher, although hard is group do-able.Mobs that take many mins of mana-draining them just to make them OOP and then after that are a 20 min. fight.If infact slows do not affect specials what so ever then a 20% slow is only a 6-7% overall slow on encounters that are killed exactly when mob goes OOP...but ever min after the mob goes OOP and the slow remains the overall slow % increases.On an infinite timescale a 20% slow is a 20% slow.
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Old 02-27-2005, 12:13 AM   #15
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You bring up a good point about the extended fights... two things however.1) This is not the vasty majority of fights... Even for lvl 50 players this is not the only fights that are fought (god I hope... if the only fights I fight at lvl 20 take 30 minutes each then I will be starting many alts SMILEY2) Many mobs have 0 mana specials that never turn off. Raid mobs have group targeted DoTs that are pretty nasty that continue to go off even after the mob has been fully debuffed. This has been true for me through 35 lvls and I expect its true all the way up through 50.
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Old 02-27-2005, 12:31 AM   #16
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Lyonesse wrote:You bring up a good point about the extended fights... two things however.1) This is not the vasty majority of fights... Even for lvl 50 players this is not the only fights that are fought (god I hope... if the only fights I fight at lvl 20 take 30 minutes each then I will be starting many alts SMILEY2)
Well FYI as a member of a high end raiding guild we raided the 4 new instanced zones each night and try to hight 1 to 2 other grpx4 raid mobs when they popped...and the good grpX2s..Due to Sony's decision to have Epic X4 mobs have only a chance at good loot maybe 2-3 rares and a crap-ton of cap of discords my guild has left EQ2...im playing till billing cycle ends.
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Old 02-27-2005, 12:51 AM   #17
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this is the kind of thing i'm always worried about... hopefully the new mentoring system will make people a little more willing to play longer (I help out guildies for free now... if i could do it while gaining a little xp and some loot then all the better SMILEYquitting because the loot tables aren't finished seems like a pretty crappy decision though... IIRC Vox was dropping cloth armor for almost a year before her loot table was fixed...
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Old 02-28-2005, 03:05 PM   #18
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There are also some cases where the mob(s) are using their power to heal themselves, or do something other than damage us that we may not see.  So reducing the melee damage means more in these cases too.
 
But this whole thing flies in the face of the basic experience of how long wards last with or without the debuffs.  Say the first ward goes away in 15 seconds.  Cast your slow and debuff and the second seems to last nearly twice as long.  Part of this could be reduced specials, but if you are tired and forget to use them or misclick or they are both resisted or something, the second ward goes down just as fast as the first (quick fights not included).
 
Also ignored is that the fighter is regenerating some health during the battle.  It happens slowly so it seems like you we should say it is insignificant, but it is a slow but steady process during the entire fight, it adds up.  From the time the ward goes up to the time it goes down, he regenerates a certain number of ticks of health.  With the mob slowed and weakened, the ward lasts longer, so then the fighter has regenerated more health while the ward is up.  That makes the benefit of the debuffs a little bigger.
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Old 02-28-2005, 05:56 PM   #19
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Melampus wrote:

BigDave wrote:
Grim Lethargy doesn't equate much at all to the Haze spells. The slow % is very little and there is no debuff effect. Given the amount of aggro it causes to the mystic I find it near useless - you either have a group of mobs hitting the tank or a group of 90% effective mobs hitting you. Until they raise the slow and include a debuff so it really is more like a group Haze, I'm not gonna use it. You're better off Hazing the mobs one at a time. They don't stack, as far as I know.

No wonder you agree with bandit...you can't see things that are infront of your face.
you don't even need Bandit's uber parsing ability for this.

Here's a hint for you guys to get a picture of your class.
stop playing 2 hours a day in pickup grps where you don't know what lvl the tank's competence lvl and skill lvl abilities are.
gain a couple lvls so you're not fighting lvl 35 stuff all the time just because you think your debuffs don't do anything against white yellow con mobs.

Think about a place like permafrost...or anywhere that you're fight white/yellow mobs that there are 3-more
if each mob...less say 5...have Xdps (5*x =dps durration of fight) and you cast Dreadful/grim lethargy..then you have (5 * 85%X for the duration of fight{maintaing slow)) vs single haze (80%X + 4x) with 11secs before teh second mob is slowed..11 more secs before the 3rd mob is slowed...11 more secs before the 4th mob is slowed and 11 more secs before the 5th mob is slowed..

Now, does the 20% slow mean more on a mob that's hitting full speed for 44 seconds more than the same mob hitting at 85% of speed since begining of fight?

Grp with a tank that has adept 1/3 shout and you shouldn't have trouble with the agro
but otherwise listen to other ppl on this forum and think that you mitigate almost as well as a tank and just off tank


Hmm, nice.  Oversimplify and insult both me and Bandit in one post.  FYI I am 42nd level and I group with the same MT 90% of the time since level 1.  I know her abilities very well.

No group taunt will always be successful.  If I lead with Grim Lethargy, some of the time I get aggro for some amount of time from all-but-one of the mobs.  Especially in groups that are white/yellow, if I get aggro, I am either dead or I blow so much power that a difficult fight becomes a rout.  The percentage of times that I get aggro is too much to make this method of fighting a good idea.

The slow does not stop specials.  The wards do not stop all the specials.  Wards do not stop interrupts.  When I get aggro I am at the mercy of the tanks chances to get aggro back and because they are spending time getting aggro back, all the monsters stay up and doing damage when they could be being killed.

In your example above, you have not factored in the fact that while the tank (and everyone else) is able to concentrate on one mob and not of the panic of keeping the healer alive, the mobs die quickly and the damage output of the encounter is reduced drastically.  In an encounter with 4 mobs, say, by the time I have gotten to slow and debuff the last ones, the first mobs are dead.  If I had used Grim Lethargy, in the same time, all 4 mobs are half dead and their DPS is still going at full.  Also, when I don't have aggro I'm reasonably free to ward as necessary, whereas 4 mobs hitting me = lots of interrupts.

Melampus, perhaps you are used to fighting in 6-person, high-DPS groups or in raids and epic encounters.  This is a totally different situation.  I'm talking about duoing or trioing or whatever with sociable, guild members and friends.

"Here's a hint for you guys to get a picture of your class.  stop playing 2 hours a day in pickup grps"

I guess it's pretty obvious that you look upon anything more casual than raids and epics as not playing 'properly'.  If you consider that the 'norm' for EQ2, then we will never agree on what the class (or any class) should be able to do.

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Old 02-28-2005, 06:04 PM   #20
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Melampus wrote:
Well FYI as a member of a high end raiding guild we raided the 4 new instanced zones each night and try to hight 1 to 2 other grpx4 raid mobs when they popped...and the good grpX2s..
Due to Sony's decision to have Epic X4 mobs have only a chance at good loot maybe 2-3 rares and a crap-ton of cap of discords my guild has left EQ2...im playing till billing cycle ends.

*boggle* "Epic X4 mobs have only a chance at good loot"?

All my gear is orange.  All my spells are Adept1 (game balanced for App2).
 
If you live for raiding you should maybe give EQ1 a go.  I don't mean that to be dismissive or snidey, I seriously mean that as advice.  It's my understanding from all the information and discussion about EQ2 over the last couple of years that it is intended to be targetted much more at 'casual' play.  Questing, grouping, exploring, etc.
 
I played EQ1 for 5 years and did the endless cycle of raids and came to get really bored.  For me, the end-game is the end of the game.  I'm looking forward to 50 only because I can start a new character, though I'm sure I'll enjoy wheeling out my 50 for raids, mentoring is the best thing that could happen because I'll be able to go back and play the lower level 'normal' stuff.
 
*shrug* As I said before, it's no wonder we don't see eye-to-eye on class abilities if you look upon raiding and epic encounters as the only thing worth doing.  Good luck with wherever you go.
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Old 02-28-2005, 11:05 PM   #21
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BigDave wrote:>*boggle* "Epic X4 mobs have only a chance at good loot"?Yes when you kill an epic X4 mob you don't always get the goods..something you get a couple rares a cap of discord and a teakwood bo....only things useful are the rares, which are also droping frequently off regular named mobs doable with one grp.You took me saying play more than 2 hours out of context.I meant I see ppl get on the boards complaining how other priest classes are better..our debuffs don't work were so gimped please fix us blah blah blah.Then I think about things..yeah I've done just about everything in the game..from lvling up to raiding to questing and exploring.I have never felt that I cannot keep my grp alive because of my abilities or class I don't know but i've not seen a situation where i fail at and want it fixed.It seems like some ppl get on the game for a couple hours get in a grp. Try to slow debuff mobs still hit hard tank loses agro ppl die, they spend a large amt of time on a CR then get on the boards saying how ineffective mystics are as a healing classI agree wards should be fixed, ac mitigation should be taken into account. I do not have a problem with our debuffs i thing they work as good or even better than any other debuffs other classes get.Would like to see parsing on specials, to get true data.PPL keep claiming that eq2 isn't a high end game...i saw someone else say that in another thread...I myself was reading boards forums posts etc. about the game I know it's more casual based, but I never thought they intend to leave a player grp with nothing to do...then when I say something like "find a post from a dev, or a game description that says that it's not going to be like eq1 it's not raiding based..etc" no one can ever find that information
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Old 02-28-2005, 11:56 PM   #22
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Melampus wrote:

BigDave wrote:>*boggle* "Epic X4 mobs have only a chance at good loot"?
...PPL keep claiming that eq2 isn't a high end game...i saw someone else say that in another thread...I myself was reading boards forums posts etc. about the game I know it's more casual based, but I never thought they intend to leave a player grp with nothing to do...then when I say something like "find a post from a dev, or a game description that says that it's not going to be like eq1 it's not raiding based..etc" no one can ever find that information

I exaggerated there, I suppose, as many do.  No, you won't find a post saying EQ2 is for casual gamers, but you will find a post saying EQ2 is intended to be accessable and enjoyable to everyone whatever their playstyle: -
 
http://eqiiforums.station.sony.com/eq2/board/message?board.id=glass&message.id=4999&highlight=power+gamer#M4999
 
Moorgard: "We introduce improvements that hopefully make the game enjoyable for all styles of play. So enough bickering; let casuals be casual, and let the hardcore be hardcore. We'll make enough room for everybody."
 
So I guess it annoys me when people imply that the mystic class is perfect because they work really well in high-end raids, when most mystics are not in high-end raids.  There's a lot more to consider than how mystics perform at level 50.  I really do think people, like me, are doing a lot more than playing for a couple of hours, having a bad experience, and [expletive ninja'd by Faarbot]ing about it.  I know where you are coming from, Mel, but I'm not there and nor are most of the mystics in the game.
 
Maybe I'll do some parsing on specials since noone else has, but, to me, it's just absolutely obvious that there's a problem without parsing it.  I can put up 4 wards simultaneously and 2 slows and a debuff and I still get hit before the wards go down and the damage is big chunks of "Wild swing for 365", "Barrage for 650", etc.  *shrug*  I see it all the time.  Nothing more frustrating than Ward, Ward, Slow, Slow, Debuff, Ward and the tank is still saying, "Hey, you gonna heal me?"
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Old 03-01-2005, 01:19 AM   #23
Banditman

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Dave -
 
If you really want to do something interesting and worthwhile with Specials and Wards take a shot at proving once and for all the Ward blow thru's are going strait to health and bypassing mitigation.  If that is true, Wards are even more broken.  I suspect this is the case.
 
If a blow thru is going strait to health, it's actually HURTING your tank to Ward him.  I know I've given up Warding my 42 Guard.  Its basically a choice between chain casting 3 to 5 Wards or waiting to cast 1 direct heal.  I prefer to cast the 1 direct heal for both mana and debuff purposes.
 
You see, what all the "debuff" people (you know, those folks who say that you have to debuff for Wards to be effective) fail to say, or even address, is that debuffs make their direct heals more effective also.  Sure, they make Wards slightly more effective, but the do the same for direct heals.  Debuffs are a wash since they work for both.
 
 
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Old 03-01-2005, 02:11 PM   #24
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I did a whole load of parsing last  night - forgot to bring it into work!  Doh!
 
It was very, very obvious that even when completely warded I was taking significant damage and almost exclusively from specials.  Wards would occasionally drop and I would see some normal damage, then wards would go up and we were back to specials.
 
I will try and pay attention to ward breaks and the damage I took.
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Old 03-01-2005, 08:57 PM   #25
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If you need help just let me know - I'll shoot you an email addy and I can help you parse out stuff.
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Old 03-02-2005, 12:10 AM   #26
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If possible try to get friends to help.This way you can check these things without wardso instead of seeing..You ward absorbed 200 damage which could possibly be a regular attack or a very low end special attack
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