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Old 11-06-2014, 11:16 AM   #91
Kalika

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Yes but only on the first tick ... since it is apparently recomputed each time it regenerates.

I should test... may be if you perform ritual in the middle it will be applied to the next regeneration (assuming you don't use heals in between).

Ritual work on runic armor, but effect dissapear after the first regen tick.
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Old 11-06-2014, 04:03 PM   #92
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I don't know what yall are complaining about. My defiler tops raid hps. Even when I'm cross healing I still land 2nd or 3rd. It's the dps that I have trouble with. Even in groups learn to debug and the group takes much less dmg. Use your crystal group heaks. Tel group members to use them.
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Old 11-07-2014, 08:26 AM   #93
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I tested it and Ritual doesnt even apply to the initial ward...and not on refresh ticks either. Thats what my initial question was aming at Wink
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Old 11-07-2014, 11:09 AM   #94
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Ritual has never consumed itself on regenerating wards though it always applied, maybe because soul shackle is seen as a hostile detriment rather than a strictly beneficial heal is only reason it may no apply.

Also shamans look as if they are completely breaking game balance which puts druids to shame in ToV. At least I may get to play Ebofu again in our 4 healer, 4 mystic raids.
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Old 11-07-2014, 12:14 PM   #95
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I dont know ebofu, my numbers dont seem to be that great, tested wards with the new gear fully adorned sitting at 901 pot all im getting is ~470k regular and ~650k legendary crit grp ward...no clue how you guys reach those 1.7 mil numbers...
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Old 11-08-2014, 01:00 AM   #96
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Did some random Beta raids and I was on MT Templar. Had 23 online so I logged my mystic and stuck him in a random mage group. I was simply alt tabbing to refresh soul shackle and queue whatever group wards I had available and I was 2nd on HPS, the top 4 were all shamans. They were all over double the nearest healer, from memory about a 150% disparity. Hopefully with soul shackle being fixed it will be less of an issue.

I was seriously considering the legitimacy of 4 shaman raids, with a channeler/templar in MT for a really hard fight...
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Old 11-08-2014, 02:04 AM   #97
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numbers ebofu, I want numbers! how much was SS, how much were the group wards, how much the single targets?
getting on top of the hps is no big deal since we all know how the mechanics work.
question is, will the mystic still be fun (im talking pre-tov fun) to play or remain the same blue collar utility henchman it is now?
because I really feel face punched by the devs after realizing those initial beta phase numbers (groupd wards matching the tanks HP) were just due to the bolstered effects they gave us, now that theyre gone, wards still arent scaling were they should belong....in terms of having FUN with that class.
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Old 11-08-2014, 05:46 AM   #98
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Personally I'd have preferred to see a nerf to the size of soul shackle than SL, especially since druids got a massive boost to SoD with the CB lift on wards, they have to press less buttons now than ever before, while shamans get made to press more (yet again). A 6s regenning ward when **** ticks every 4s is about as useful as teats on a bull, the only component that makes soul shackle worth a **** is the initial ward, the regen just looks good on ACT cos it's counted before HoT's, It's definitely not functional. Truth is, the only reason that it parses well is cos umbral barrier/ward still blows. TBH I'd happily take either the cleric or druid endline and they can have soul shackle if it meant lifting the 15% nerf to SL. Only thing is, they don't need it.

I couldn't give less of a **** about the overall heal parse and who's topping it as we all know that's not even relevant, groups that have no shaman in it don't suffer at all, the templars and druids push those numbers solo healing their groups just fine too. The difference is that druids and templars didn't need a boost, they were already a 2 button faceroll class, now they get the benefits of full CB to wards, they're even more op than before. But hey let's not look at balancing the classes lets just stick with the 4 druid raids with a templar in for hard fights and the 1 or 2 shamans just there to fill a spot cuz buffs and yeah, wards look good on the heal parse.
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Old 11-08-2014, 06:28 AM   #99
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Practiced and uplifting items but practiced just got massively nerfed (justifiably) so it's whatever really. The numbers you're quoting are stock standard numbers for a self buffed solo mystic, not raid buffed with a gazillion potency and CB benefits all at maxxed increments from the raid. A 1.7 mil group ward is still gone in the blink of an eye by damage hitting each group member for 800k-1.4 mil per person per 4s tick and unlike group HoT is dead and cannot be recast for 7.5s with the 2.5s cast time (or 2.1s if specced for it which you should be), so yeah this is where soul shackle and spiritual leadership saves the day and you spam cast group heal as fast as it refreshes cos templar cast shield of faith and went afk to make sammich or druid just mashing dps buttons.

Fact is the life of a shaman is never going to change, whenever grouped with another healer they always expect you to do all the work so they can play candy crush while /autofollow on you this is what ppl complained about pre ToV and ToV never changed that, it just made healing harder for shamans and so the druids could whine more about not having enough non-heal buttons to push.

IMHO the prestige abilities should have been class specific, templars and Inq's getting the same ability when Inq's were hurting for some love and templars were already rediculous OP just doesn't make sense. I'd have liked to see Torpor loose it's penalties and be turned into a groupwide ability rather than being given a new ward that kinda does the same thing (but much better) in soul shackle.
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Old 11-08-2014, 01:20 PM   #100
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Did they changed somethiing to runic armor ? It was not great, may be 20-40K but now it's zero ... i mean 2000K ;-)
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Old 11-08-2014, 09:17 PM   #101
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When was it good? It's been **** for as long as I remember, but that's across the board for all healers so whatever.
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Old 11-09-2014, 01:39 PM   #102
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Spiritual Leadership now wards for 15% less.

Why even touch it.. wards still don't crit.. going and touching things that were well enough off, not cool at all.. agree with soul shackle reuse.
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Old 11-09-2014, 07:04 PM   #103
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Did they make it to where wards are not critting I have not checked beta in a few days?
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Old 11-09-2014, 07:09 PM   #104
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which of your wards weren't critting and when? mine were all critting fine last night.
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Old 11-09-2014, 07:13 PM   #105
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In Sf it was like 5% sometimes more of my HPS .. I think that i saw it around 40K on beta when i logged to check new ward values, then later it was down to zero (ie 2K may be 4K with good gear).

It should protect at least as much as undaunted 10/10 or mage regenerating wards.

Same issue with aura of leadership, it used to be somewhat good (indeed it was quite bigger than the mystic passive group ward, but it has been useless since probably velious 1.0.
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Old 11-10-2014, 03:00 AM   #106
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I think you were dreaming.
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Old 11-10-2014, 09:29 AM   #107
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You're right.. I stand corrected.. I meant we don't full value Crit bonus applied.. rate needs to be upped some... especially when critical wards are going for.. lets say 200-400k... that's not even half life for most tanks. I removed names from the logs as they don't matter, and didn't want to put other people's names out there without asking them first.

YOUR Spiritual Leadership has applied to YOU as a critical ward for 53,948.
(1415509986)[Sat Nov 08 21:13:06 2014] YOUR Spiritual Leadership has applied to xxxxxx as a critical ward for 53,948.
(1415509986)[Sat Nov 08 21:13:06 2014] YOUR Spiritual Leadership has applied to xxxxxxx as a critical ward for 57,994.
(1415509986)[Sat Nov 08 21:13:06 2014] YOUR Spiritual Leadership has applied to xxxxxxx as a Legendary critical ward for 67,435.
(1415509986)[Sat Nov 08 21:13:06 2014] YOUR Spiritual Leadership has applied to xxxxxx as a critical ward for 53,948.
(1415509986)[Sat Nov 08 21:13:06 2014] YOUR Spiritual Leadership has applied to xxxxxx as a Legendary critical ward for 67,435.
(1415509986)[Sat Nov 08 21:13:06 2014] YOUR Spiritual Leadership has applied to xxxxxxx as a critical ward for 53,948.
(1415509986)[Sat Nov 08 21:13:06 2014] YOUR Spiritual Leadership has applied to YOU as a critical ward for 53,948.


That was just some numbers after change went in.. with around 580 potentcy.. even if I pull lets say 800-1000 pot... the wards will not go up that much more.. and that's a critical.. add 15% back to that and it's still not hurting anything.. again.. there was nothing wrong with it in the first place. People just look at heal parses (useless) and go.. oh look spiritual leadership is way overpowered lol.. lets knock it down a little.
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Old 11-10-2014, 10:28 AM   #108
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Spiritual leadership was always OP for a passive ability, I was surprised they never put a trigger limit on it considering thats the new fix all fad lately.
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Old 11-10-2014, 11:34 AM   #109
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All wards get full crit bonus now.

Spiritual Leadership was OP (comparatively) and is still fairly strong.
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Old 11-10-2014, 01:06 PM   #110
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By all means lets reduce all the wards of the "warding class" healer. we would not want shamans to return to being useful or fun to play and upset the status quo. Druids must reign supreme!!!!! nothing like 2 people who don't play shamans full time cheering every time the class takes another beating.
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Old 11-10-2014, 01:31 PM   #111
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But we do. That change went in like two weeks ago, have you tested?

What "all wards" have been reduced? All the wards have been increased with AoM due to the crit change. Have you even played the beta before posting this?? Can you cite all the wards individually that have been reduced for you compared to live?
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Old 11-10-2014, 02:20 PM   #112
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the post was partially sarcastic in that they have reduced 2 abilities already in SL and SS by doubling the reuse time. what ability will be next. and wards were long over due a "fix" after last xpac's fiasco of multiplying hit points and ignoring shamans. CB increased everyone's heals not just shamans. i guess i should go post on druid forums that im unhappy i can dps 4mil and heal 300k please nerf the ticks on my hots and double the reuse on my best heals i feel so OP.
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Old 11-10-2014, 02:37 PM   #113
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Soul Shackle was a beta ability that was being tested and balanced. The feedback (correctly) was that it was pretty OP. That's what happens in beta, stuff gets adjusted. Leaving SL as the ONLY ability from live that's been adjusted and if you compare it to live, i wouldn't be suprised if it's actually STILL parsing higher when considering the CB change. Did it need changing? Not really imo, but it's not really a major change.

Actually it didn't. It has zero effect on anyone's HEALS, since heals were already getting full CB benefit. What it did was increase EVERYONE's wards, but since shamans - by a huge margin - have the most wards, we were the prime beneficiaries of the change.
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Old 11-10-2014, 02:48 PM   #114
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To be fair, it has made Repent pretty amazing, on what is already a very strong priest class.
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Old 11-10-2014, 03:14 PM   #115
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it has full effect on 'EVERY" healers wards.. which druids and templars have a ward that can be larger then shamans.. duh not direct heals and direct heals was never a part of this rant...it was about
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Old 11-10-2014, 03:15 PM   #116
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WARDS
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Old 11-10-2014, 03:16 PM   #117
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No argument there and I made my complaint about repent back when it was initially given to Templars. Templars (Channelers too) having stronger single target wards than shamans is kinda /boggle, but i guess we're all sharing stuff these days.

That said, I do have like 15 different wards that have benefitted versus like 1 or 2 for other classes.
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Old 11-10-2014, 03:17 PM   #118
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SS being a meager attempt to make up for poor shaman healing ability against 800k to mil plus ticks every 4 seconds. but the whole point being shamans NEEDED the bump compared to other healers to begin with.. and please tell my you arent one of the people who read and believe the heal parse
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Old 11-10-2014, 03:26 PM   #119
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so what exactly are you having trouble keeping up with? i've found - in both AoM heroics and AoM raids - that i'm able to do much better relatively to the other healing classes (vs. on live).

I mean, if you have issues regarding healer balance in AoM, i'm not sure what exactly what they are other than "SS and SL are lower now", which isn't so much report of an issue as it is a rehash of the patch notes.

In what zones or on what encounters in AoM have you had performance problems vs. other healing classes? Are you being kicked from groups and replaced by druids/clerics? Are groups simply not taking you because you're a shaman? Are you being significantly outparsed in both HPS and DPS? (not that this is a huge indicator, but numbers are numbers).

In other words: what AoM testing experiences have led you to conclude that changes are required?
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Old 11-10-2014, 03:36 PM   #120
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my problem is this is the 1 class that does not need to be deminished in any capacity compared to the other healers. my problem is posts in this forum seeking to continue to keep shamans below other healers. the only word that can be used in the same sentence as OP is Druid. your numbers appear fine as they always do as wards are counted first. balance is a sick joke.. i mean if i can use all 3 of my group cures, my 2 death saves, my multiple stoneskins, my Unlimited health regeneration while doing 4+million dsp to the tune of 300k +heals then ok im OP....oh crap i'm not druid wtf was i thinking. and yes no raid takes 4 shaman..but they sure do love 4 druids
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