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Old 02-24-2012, 11:35 AM   #1981
isest

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Kasar wrote:

isest wrote:

 Come on get for real they already sold off a part of the player base, this is their out to get out of the mmorpg games all together.

Activision might feel generous, perhaps Kotick would want an MMO with a cash shop in place.  He's still pretty limited with the Warcraft one.

I was thinking gamersfirst they tend to buy out under performing titles.  I.E. Fallen Earth. All of their games have a cash shop in place.  I am just saying they already sold out the euro guys,  the next logical step would be to sale out the US side of things and exit the mmorpg games as we know it.   Sony has a bad year leading up to this, and this kind of looks like they are putting divisions up for sale trying to generate cash,  and we all know the first things to go up are the under performing divisions.

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Old 02-24-2012, 11:35 AM   #1982
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[email protected] wrote:

[email protected] Bayle wrote:

Whilst this is good it is almost unblievable that SOE hadn't anticipated the reaction of their customers and their concerns.  Does SOE not have data on the useage of EQ2?  Do they not know that some accounts from the US log onto the EU server and vice versa?  It would be even worse if you did actually know this was happening and still went ahead with the deal without working out what these people would and would not be able to do after the transition.

I still think the deal was done by someone, who didn't know what they we're selling, and SOE is actually right now figthing to save their games, and ultimately their jobs...

This deal was crafted and lawyers were involved, it was not something that was done in a german pub while the paries from SOE were in a drunken stupor, it was carefully planned, and calculated, the # of players that they had projected who would be up in arms and completely unwilling to accept such ridiculous restrictions was off, actually that is understating it those numbers were WAY OFF. So do not think for one minute that this was some minute detail that was simply 'overlooked' because that is not the case.

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Old 02-24-2012, 11:39 AM   #1983
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/waits for Aussie/Asian player block to be sold off to some Gold Farming Company.

/waits for North/South American block to be sold off to some other shady company.

Only a matter of time now, SoE has truely revealed their hand.  Quality Leadership there!  /rolls eyes

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Old 02-24-2012, 11:40 AM   #1984
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sojurn1 wrote:

/sigh still no real details i just hope they work out some thing so at least players that paid in advance can run till the prepaid sub has ended free x fers if wished etc let us die correctly if we wish to no longer play not force our hands. surprised this has not hit news chans yet tbh but wait i will go look to see if it has, i'm thinking it might when sony sales plummet from less sales

At this point, the ONLY way they would keep me is if they allowed me to transfer my 9 toons off Splitpaw, or mercy kill them before Proseiben got anything from me (I'm in the US; can't probably find their cards over here, so that's out [heck, can barely find SOE cards here...]).  I do feel it would be shooting my poor guildies in the foot, but I hope they can leave, too, and hop on over to the States (it would be good to have the chance to discuss this with them ahead of time).  Fortunately, my toons on Splitpaw are all level 21 or less, so even if I had to pay for it, I'd transfer the one with a prestige home (bought with REAL money, thanks) and just remake the rest elsewhere. :-/

However, I will more than likely tell SOE to take me off recurring payments and just use monthly cards here, if I can; my trust level in them has plummeted. SMILEY

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Old 02-24-2012, 11:44 AM   #1985
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I am not a child. I understand that business deals happen, I understand that whilst I may not be happy with said deal that it is in the interests of the company to make the deal and that it will possibly benefit me as a consumer in its eventuality. What I do not understand nor will forgive is stupidity. And in the case of this deal, the sheer magnitude of the stupidity is breathtaking and uncomprehensible in it's scale. You have not only broken game trust in a lot of cases but also brand trust and loyalty. 

When I am unhappy with something I vote with not only my mouth but my feet and my wallet (slim though it maybe). I for one will no longer buy anything Sony period. This is the last straw for me the same as for so many others. You screwed me over as a Vanguard player and now once again you do it here. 

Enough is enough.

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Old 02-24-2012, 11:45 AM   #1986
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Wow forum lag cuased a double post wow.  

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Old 02-24-2012, 11:45 AM   #1987
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Old 02-24-2012, 11:46 AM   #1988
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And now, for a sober and depressing summary and thought.

Though there's been no official word on the timeline of events that brought us here, it's pretty clear the alaplaya deal came about as part of a larger exchange.  We now now SOE's parent company made a deal for maxdome, a video-on-demand outlet in this same market region, in December; given that this deal was with ProSievenSat.1 Media, alaplaya's parent company, it starts to become clear that handing much of SOE's European operation came about in that context.

Exactly how much money do you think the parent company will make from the maxdome operations?

The sober answer: way the hell more than it would have from MMOs.

The folks who made this deal probably know jack about MMOs and our communities, but they know a profitable deal when they see one.  Odds are good all these cancellations aren't going to hurt SOE's parent company much, though they may hurt SOE itself (more on that later).  What it is doing is driving P7S.1 nuts, as the 'built-in customer base' it thought it would get is imploding before its eyes.  Regardless of what it planned to do with the properties it got, if nobody is playing, they lose money.  This is why they seem to have picked up the vanguard for response--they're the ones getting hurt here.

Now, about SOE...yeah, they're getting hurt, through what's likely no fault of their own (since this decision was made by folks above their level).  So what happens when the parent company sees those profits fall precipitously?

Take a wild guess.

We need a better response than 'cancel your accounts', at least for those of us not on the affected servers.  This isn't hitting those responsible for this deal, and it's only hurting ourselves in the longer term.  I'm open to suggestions, but as you can guess I'm somewhat less than sanguine about the odds.

Think it through, guys.  We need a better plan here.

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Old 02-24-2012, 11:50 AM   #1989
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Does Sony think that their games consumers are all clueless children who cant or wont see the bigger picture. Who will blindly go where ever Sony points? They dont know that completely normal adult consumers are playing their games?

If there will be a bearable solution to this mess I will still not register my card ever again with this company. If needed for my playing experience I'll pay with security codes, one month at a time. However, gaming is such a small part of my life. Im a pretty normal person. I have a job, a family ie spouse, children, house. We are normal consumers. Our home has an exotic mix of consumer products; Sony, Panasonic, Samsung, Toshiba, Nokia, Kenwood, LG, Singer and many many more. We have Xbox kinect console, and we also have a Sony console. The Sonly console is losing 3 billion dollars this year, and yet Sony thinks they can afford to treat their customers in this manner. Where is your face Sony? Among my friends and family the xbox is the winner, and I will definatley recommend it.

Its not easy to find a game to replace eq2. But it is extremely easy to choose other brands of products and avoid Sony products. There are no products, like for example phones, that are completely superior to other brands. The differences are small details like colour, looks, price etc. From now on me and my family will actively avoid Sony products. I currently have a Sony phone, that im tired of. It will be very easy to choose anything but Sony when I buy my next phone. My children will learn that Sony is consumer hostile. They will enter adult life with the knowledge of avoiding Sony:s products. I will spread the word among family and friends that Sony has terrible consumer relations. And that matters a lot when choosing products.

Does Sony serioulsy think that their current business strategy is a winner, or are we witnessing some kind of corporate harakiri?

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Old 02-24-2012, 11:51 AM   #1990
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Uwkete-of-Crushbone wrote:

sojurn1 wrote:

/sigh still no real details i just hope they work out some thing so at least players that paid in advance can run till the prepaid sub has ended free x fers if wished etc let us die correctly if we wish to no longer play not force our hands. surprised this has not hit news chans yet tbh but wait i will go look to see if it has, i'm thinking it might when sony sales plummet from less sales

At this point, the ONLY way they would keep me is if they allowed me to transfer my 9 toons off Splitpaw, or mercy kill them before Proseiben got anything from me (I'm in the US; can't probably find their cards over here, so that's out [heck, can barely find SOE cards here...]).  I do feel it would be shooting my poor guildies in the foot, but I hope they can leave, too, and hop on over to the States (it would be good to have the chance to discuss this with them ahead of time).  Fortunately, my toons on Splitpaw are all level 21 or less, so even if I had to pay for it, I'd transfer the one with a prestige home (bought with REAL money, thanks) and just remake the rest elsewhere. :-/

However, I will more than likely tell SOE to take me off recurring payments and just use monthly cards here, if I can; my trust level in them has plummeted.

Uwk

uk based player on split paw

have like 20, 90+ toons half of wich are 320 aa

6 lvl 90 crafter

and soon to be moving to the usa

so option of free x fer would at least keep me in game untill the 8 months of my 12 month sub ended, already cancelled one account

this would allow me to get my moneys worth so to speak

i run a raid force alliance/raid club style

i feel at this time even my plans to try and move two toons to a usa server is letting them down as its a sign i know what will come.

but will die with it on split paw and have an option to continue when i move state side

this is off subject a lil but getting back to it

We need to get some thing from this sell out even if its short term

and free x fers is a small thing they can give imo

ps: not bought sony products for a while and wont buy any more last was a ps3

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Old 02-24-2012, 11:54 AM   #1991
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Old 02-24-2012, 11:56 AM   #1992
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Revman wrote:

OE-Brasse wrote:

Friends,

As we approach the weekend, we wanted to share that we are working on a plan to keep our communities together with the ProSieben deal. Again, we thank you for your patience - we'll provide more information as soon as it is available.

~Brasse

Translation: people will simmer down over the weekend. It's actually already starting...

If this is the stance SOE is taking it would really behoove them to reevaluate their position.

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Old 02-24-2012, 11:58 AM   #1993
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Hoserbaba wrote:

I doubt they are worried about the player base as it seems it will be Pro7's problem, unless everyone (EU, US, NZ, AU et al)decides to quit en masse before this sell out goes "live"

I cancled my sub 2 days ago and I've only ever played in the US.  Why did I do it?  First off because it still does effect me.  It effects me by causing the people and the US Military stationed in Europe that I have become friends with to sign up with a less than trustworthy company.  I don't treat my friends that way and I won't support a company that would. 

Furthermore it creates a situation where they will eventually have to leave my server, either through not wanting to sign up with said company or because they have other local friends that are playing on the European servers and can't join up on one of our servers.  As these people leave it leaves holes, in our guilds, in our raid groups, in our roleplaying groups, but mostly, in our circle of friends.  Lastly it leaves the servers with less and less people than we alredy have.

It's all a matter of principals really.  If your next door neighbor was selling a product that both of you knew was faulty would you would you send your friends over to buy the product?  Would you personally support him by also buying the product?

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Old 02-24-2012, 11:59 AM   #1994
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Who knows, maybe this whole fiasco will make a great Tv series?

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Old 02-24-2012, 12:01 PM   #1995
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[email protected] wrote:

Who knows, maybe this whole fiasco will make a great Tv series?

And coincidentially,ProSieben is a TV station!SMILEY

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Old 02-24-2012, 12:02 PM   #1996
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[email protected] wrote:

[email protected] wrote:

[email protected] Bayle wrote:

Whilst this is good it is almost unblievable that SOE hadn't anticipated the reaction of their customers and their concerns.  Does SOE not have data on the useage of EQ2?  Do they not know that some accounts from the US log onto the EU server and vice versa?  It would be even worse if you did actually know this was happening and still went ahead with the deal without working out what these people would and would not be able to do after the transition.

I still think the deal was done by someone, who didn't know what they we're selling, and SOE is actually right now figthing to save their games, and ultimately their jobs...

This deal was crafted and lawyers were involved, it was not something that was done in a german pub while the paries from SOE were in a drunken stupor, it was carefully planned, and calculated, the # of players that they had projected who would be up in arms and completely unwilling to accept such ridiculous restrictions was off, actually that is understating it those numbers were WAY OFF. So do not think for one minute that this was some minute detail that was simply 'overlooked' because that is not the case.

The very magnitude, universality, and strength of the reaction is one reason I am willing to consider that this was not something that was iniated by the MMO people. Either that or Smed is really, really, really, incompetent and out of touch AND none of the people who report to him, or are involved with him, had the intestinal fortitude to stand and say "Are you freaking crazy?"

They HAD to know how many Euros play on the US servers and vice versa. Knowing that, and having an MMO background, they would have to know how poorly this would be received.

It just doesn't make sense for SOE to sabotage their own end of it, but maybe I am giving them too much credit.

PSS1 is a subsidary of a MUCH larger company. SOE is a subsidary of a MUCH large company.

Could it be that their superiors sat down, had dinner, and decided on some kind of exclusivity deal and then tossed that down to the subsidaries to implement?

I would rather think something like this than think that ALL the people who work Smed weren't smart enough to think of it and didn't have the guts to tell him. 

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Old 02-24-2012, 12:03 PM   #1997
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132 pages and 1979 posts...and counting.

You thought you would get away with some rants and then people would simmer down ? .....

I think you have no idea how big the pile of dung is that you just stepped in atm. Mainstream gaming magazine are allready picking up the story and more and more people join every minunte.

Yet you remain silent....

At least the alaplayah guy tried to talk to people, but...

Scornyy wrote:That said I feel that Protagonist is trying to fight off a Death Star with a stick of limp celery !

Another thing that you don't seem to realize is that people ARE LEAVING NOW !...not when the changes will happen. 

People delete their toons so they won't be tempted to log back.

It's allready happening. Even if you revert that galactic (f_word) up of Region lock, you will have loast ALLREADY customers and not one or two. Guilds are getting dismantled as I'm writing this....

Yet, you remain silent.....

There is no way in hell I can believe that a company would willingly loose money in this way. No one can be so moronic. Not even Smedley. 

If you plan to ditch the Euros, then have the cojones and come up front AND TELL US. Don't sell us off like cattle to PSS1 who seem regret the second they signed the contract. I know you got away with a truckload of cash and could not care less if all the Euro population is leaving. It's not your problem anymore. It's PSS1's problem now. 

The game was in a delicate balance anyway due to it's old age and countless blunders from SOE, now you have triggered the rollercoaster effect.... People get region locked --> people leave --> guilds/raids fall apart --->  more people leave --> no friends to play with --> even more people leave ---> empty game --> game dead .

Maybe this is what you wanted, maybe this is your way to shut down an old sick game and focus your budgets to new stuff. You sold it of to the germans so they can play SOE for a bit, then throw it away and mix it with the other junk on alaplayah.

 Yet, you remain silent.....

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Old 02-24-2012, 12:03 PM   #1998
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Vrisslar wrote:

No matter how good or bad of a company ProSiebenSat.1 might be i couldnt care less about, im not for sale, SOE thought they could sell me, ProSiebenSat.1 was dumb enough to belive they could buy me and that in my book makes them just as bad as the seller.

So no not shimmering down, canceled and left, testing out new games and couldnt care less about what SOE or ProSiebenSat.1 come up with at this point, the damage is done.

I do not understand how anyone could have a different view than this, unless of course they have less respect for themselves than either of the 2 parties involved in making this deal.

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Old 02-24-2012, 12:04 PM   #1999
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Ruut Li wrote:

Does Sony serioulsy think that their current business strategy is a winner, or are we witnessing some kind of corporate harakiri?

The huge majority of their game players are on PSN, SOE is just a line item on the SCE spreadsheet and for several months there have been articles asking where the PS3 even fits into the "4-screen strategy" they're using to get out of the red.

They'll sell off every asset they have before giving up on televisions if their corporate talk is true.  PC games are just a method to push PC sales in the broader view, and with Stringer on his way out, they may appear expendable.

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Old 02-24-2012, 12:06 PM   #2000
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Katz wrote:

Ah but this has convinced me, a US player, to not acquire EQNext.   I think they should be concerned.

I agree. Both SOE and ProSiebens should be very worried at the likely impact of this on future sales, with the Planetside 2 fans currently unhappy about it too.

Viral marketing is everything in this business, and when in a few months or even a year or two's time SOE/ProSiebens are marketing their new games their former customers will be filling the forums and social networks with more hatred for SOE than we have seen even since the SWG:NGE debacle.

Such a shame, so easily avoided, and yet in many ways so inevitable.

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Old 02-24-2012, 12:10 PM   #2001
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kalaria wrote:

[email protected] wrote:

Who knows, maybe this whole fiasco will make a great Tv series?

And coincidentially,ProSieben is a TV station!

See it all works our in the end! SMILEY

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Old 02-24-2012, 12:10 PM   #2002
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Maybe Pro7 should buy the publishing rights to the whole EQ2 and buy the development from SOE. Pro7 can not be worse businessmen than SOE that is simply . . . .impossible, they at least have one director with some knowledge in communications and public relations.

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Old 02-24-2012, 12:11 PM   #2003
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Old 02-24-2012, 12:11 PM   #2004
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[email protected] wrote:

Who knows, maybe this whole fiasco will make a great Tv series?

LOL - Pro7s1 will be happy about that idea (just cited you on their forum) 

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Old 02-24-2012, 12:14 PM   #2005
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Kenazeer wrote:

I would rather think something like this than think that ALL the people who work Smed weren't smart enough to think of it and didn't have the guts to tell him. 

You've been around since '04. Have they done anything in that time to suggest otherwise?

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Old 02-24-2012, 12:17 PM   #2006
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Katz wrote:

Ah but this has convinced me, a US player, to not acquire EQNext.   I think they should be concerned.

They convinced me to not acquire EQNext when they promoted SJ and put him in charge of its development.

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Old 02-24-2012, 12:22 PM   #2007
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Onorem wrote:

Kenazeer wrote:

I would rather think something like this than think that ALL the people who work Smed weren't smart enough to think of it and didn't have the guts to tell him. 

You've been around since '04. Have they done anything in that time to suggest otherwise?

Outwardly? No. I can always hope though. SMILEY Who knows why some people have completely left SOE, Hartsman for example. Maybe Smed is the cause of it all and he is hardheaded; I just hate to think I have been playing a game where the people who make it are THAT blind.

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Old 02-24-2012, 12:29 PM   #2008
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Kenazeer wrote:

The very magnitude, universality, and strength of the reaction is one reason I am willing to consider that this was not something that was iniated by the MMO people. Either that or Smed is really, really, really, incompetent and out of touch AND none of the people who report to him, or are involved with him, had the intestinal fortitude to stand and say "Are you freaking crazy?"

They HAD to know how many Euros play on the US servers and vice versa. Knowing that, and having an MMO background, they would have to know how poorly this would be received.

It just doesn't make sense for SOE to sabotage their own end of it, but maybe I am giving them too much credit.

PSS1 is a subsidary of a MUCH larger company. SOE is a subsidary of a MUCH large company.

Could it be that their superiors sat down, had dinner, and decided on some kind of exclusivity deal and then tossed that down to the subsidaries to implement?

I would rather think something like this than think that ALL the people who work Smed weren't smart enough to think of it and didn't have the guts to tell him. 

Well publicly traded companies (as from this post I am sure that you know) have obligations. Smedley is the President of SOE, and while SOE is a subsidiary of Sony he had to have some level of complacency here, and while I am in no way a legal expert if he were not included in these talks and the deal there were probably some major violations of security laws here.

I think that you may be giving too much credit, I think that they underestimated the intelligence of the playerbase and that they could just drum up a double SC event for the weekend to soother everyones souls and the fallout was far greater than what they ever imagined.

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Old 02-24-2012, 12:33 PM   #2009
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I am player of EQ2 from begin, already played EQ1 some time in the 90s.There has been many strange marketing stunts over the years but this is the most ill-comsidered one ever.If you want to establish a solid playerbase and a good start for your upcomming EQ Next product then its not a very clever move to get them upset like this.Ignoring the fact that i feel like beeing sold on a cattlemarket, there are still some questions that i need answered before i can make dicisions.

1. will it be possible after the servers are in PSS1 hands to make a charakter transfers from EU to US Servers, from US to EU, or only from EU to EU Servers ?

2. will it still be possible to chat via tell with my friends on other EU and US servers ?

3. will i be able to access the world wide chat channels ? Most worldwide class disscussion channels are located on a singel server.

4. will i have to pay both ayaplaya and SOE if i want to have access to my chars on US and EU servers ?

5. will there be a free server transfer for my chars if i want to flee from the EU servers to US servers ?

6. If i decide to stay with SOE, will i be able to create new chars on US servers ? Or only on servers where i have already chars ? Or will i am not be able to create new chars on US servers.

7. will i be able to use charakter transfers beetween US servers as a EU inhabitant once i have tranfered them to US servers.

8. I once payed for the EQ2Players Services, these things are now back only for a short time. Will EU players now be excluded from the US EQPlayer Data or the Data Stream that is for example accessable via EQU.If PSS1 have there own platform and all that has been developed hard over the past years to get EQ2Player back to work is none existant for me on an EU server ?

9. will the IP Locks in what direktion ever stay and lock US and EU from playing together ?

10. will have PSS1 have the right to change game conntent for example to push marketing and selling stuff through their upcomming Ingame Store (SC clone, AP or whatever it will be called). Their have been rumors/reports that they have done so in other games(e.g.

http://mmohuts.com/editorials/alapl.../comment-page-1

)11. will pss1 have the right to decide to sell gear that is not for lookslot or fluff in their ingame store ? (eg. Legendary,mastercrafted,fabled gear ) like it was on Freeport EQ2X when it started.

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Old 02-24-2012, 12:38 PM   #2010
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[email protected] wrote:

I think that you may be giving too much credit, I think that they underestimated the intelligence of the playerbase and that they could just drum up a double SC event for the weekend to soother everyones souls and the fallout was far greater than what they ever imagined.

That is certainly possible, and may even be the more likely truth. I was simply offering an alternative narative where the MMO folks were acting as agents of another persons "set agenda" and not acting of their own accord with free reign to do as they wished.

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