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Old 01-19-2007, 09:36 AM   #1
wmmdcis

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+50 to caliginous corruption, are you kidding me, dont get me wrong, the stats on the bp rock, but 50 to caliginous is slap in the face, insulting imo, added to the fact that it isnt even 50 to each tick, seems to add 6 with both the bonus and the 30 more int, so it isnt even a reasonable increase there, but im a healer ffs, i dont want random stupid increases to my dmg spells, give me a bonus worth having as a healer, i swear they didnt think about this shiz at all
 
Ipum 70 Defiler / Aftermath

Message Edited by wmmdcis on 01-18-2007 08:37 PM

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Old 01-19-2007, 10:37 AM   #2
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not to mention i havent even scribed the apprentice 1 version of this spell because its damage is such a joke, and the cast time is too long to make it worth the debuff on resists. what junk
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Old 01-19-2007, 02:07 PM   #3
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That effect is simply terrible.What a disappointment.I would consider wearing MO BP fulltime over that , even considering the (7) set effects and the superior stats.I have defended this game since launch when talking to other people about it, but then I see an item like this and it really makes me sad.Itemization is holding this game back.
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Old 01-19-2007, 06:12 PM   #4
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I'll reserve judgement until I see both BP's and legs, but what irks me is that mystics have a 5 percent increase to their DPS debuff on their breastplate. I really don't understand why a, on a fabled, RAID OBTAINED breastplate, which is a part of set gear oriented towards RAIDING, we get an increase to our LEAST used DPS spell on a raid (due to cast times largely). Seriously, it just doesn't make much sense to me, and doesn't seem to be inline with most of the other breastplates I've seen up to date.
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Old 01-19-2007, 08:10 PM   #5
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Congrats on the bp. Yeah disspaointed on the effect. I would have rather seen maybe an increase to one of our wards or sometheng to that effect. But still grats an the piece hope to get my second one some time soon just only got the gloves so far.
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Old 01-20-2007, 06:31 PM   #6
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archanglwarlord09 wrote:
not to mention i havent even scribed the apprentice 1 version of this spell because its damage is such a joke, and the cast time is too long to make it worth the debuff on resists. what junk

Yeah why bother scribing it when you can pick master 2?Seriously, though... it's a good spell. You realize it's an encounter spell and not just single target right?The Effect on the BP is still crap, but the spell itself is not.
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Old 01-21-2007, 12:17 AM   #7
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Not a bad encounter spell really, the damage isnt too great but my Necro and Warlock pals really like the resist debuffs SMILEY

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Old 01-21-2007, 04:28 AM   #8
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I will mail gold to the first person to provide me with a reasonable explanation as to why our Relic Chest increases our DPS by more than this piece of crap.  (Gratz btw, not your fault it blows)
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Old 01-21-2007, 08:24 AM   #9
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rofl they made our BP such a joke....
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Old 01-21-2007, 02:55 PM   #10
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arieste wrote:
I will mail gold to the first person to provide me with a reasonable explanation as to why our Relic Chest increases our DPS by more than this piece of crap.  (Gratz btw, not your fault it blows)



It's a focus for an encounter AoE thus actually does more damage if used against multiple mobs? If this was a T8 BP yea I'd be [Removed for Content], but its just another T7 choice.

I'd be happy had I won that. Life would go on, mobs would still die, and I'd wouldnt be worse off wearing it. Sure the focus isnt ideal, but the devs never have to make any item absolutely perfect.

 

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Old 01-21-2007, 09:08 PM   #11
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im not asking for it to be perfect.  but *better than relic** is a reasonable expectation considering what this drops from.
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Old 01-22-2007, 02:46 AM   #12
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Hehe, I deny the chain relic BP drops, even as backups. I was luckly enuf to get a nearly full set of Doomseer early off (garr, no mantle still) and other chain wearing classes get much better relic BP's from the pattern.

I wouldnt say the EoF BP itself is worse than relic... and depending on your choice of stats its on-par with Doomseer. The relic focus will definitly be better overall since the haste debuff is used more often than the poison debuff, but you could theoretically get more damage from the EoF one since its applied to an AoE.

All I'm saying is considering its mit, resists and its part of a set piece, I would be extatic to get it. I wouldnt go to multiple forums saying how bad it is like the op did.

I'd rather congrat the OP then say how bad he has it. SMILEY So Congrats!

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Old 01-22-2007, 03:59 AM   #13
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The BP itselfe is great (statwise)...there are not so many shammie BP's out there, so everything is a nice addition. But everything about the focus-effect is true...it sucks...I would rather like to see something that reduces a recast or improves the duration of a spell (either reduce the recast on umbral trap or improve the duration of abasement to be en-par with the other debuffs) or that adds something to my warding abilities (may it be reduced recast on the group ward or by making spiritual circle raid-wide, like it is stated, if you hover over the buff icon).Effect-wise I would still prefer to wear the relic BP...

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Old 01-22-2007, 06:53 AM   #14
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BeatinGuts wrote:

Hehe, I deny the chain relic BP drops, even as backups. I was luckly enuf to get a nearly full set of Doomseer early off (garr, no mantle still) and other chain wearing classes get much better relic BP's from the pattern.

I wouldnt say the EoF BP itself is worse than relic... and depending on your choice of stats its on-par with Doomseer. The relic focus will definitly be better overall since the haste debuff is used more often than the poison debuff, but you could theoretically get more damage from the EoF one since its applied to an AoE.

All I'm saying is considering its mit, resists and its part of a set piece, I would be extatic to get it. I wouldnt go to multiple forums saying how bad it is like the op did.

I'd rather congrat the OP then say how bad he has it. SMILEY So Congrats!




you seem to have misunderstood me, i didnt say the stats or the set bonus is bad, and i was extatic to get the bp, but the focus is bull[expletive haxx0red by Raijinn], and you retardedness shows in your support of the focus. TY, and have a good day

ohh, the reason its in both multiple forums is because i wanted 2 different types of responses, one from the community as a whole, and a more educated response form just the defiler community

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Old 01-22-2007, 12:28 PM   #15
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Sigh, just cant please them all can I ehh?

First to the the lil shout fest above, my advice is just that. Advice. Our views seem to conflict quite abit... they really do. I've seen you give advice that completly astounds me hun, advice that makes horrible sense but I dont go threading a reply in gigantic orange about how I dont like your advice.

If you think I know jack about gear your wrong. I am one of the top 3 Defiler on my server when it comes to stats, resists and masters at the moment. My resists are near perfect and I have 2 chests of backup gear with every type of stats out there. Its mostly still KoS but I'm working on that. Anyways, In any situation I can adapt. I can max FT, max 2 resist (yes MAX) and still have 600+ WIZ and 400+ to STR, STA and INT. But yes, I know nothing about gear.

If that BP is trash then quit the game. Obviously it affects you so badly you must be furious with SOE. HOW DARE THEY MAKE AN ITEM YOU DONT LIKE!!!! Do you even remember T6 hun? Fun getting defiler gear then hun? Be happy about the BP and the fact SOE gave us a focus at all, because it could be MUCH worse.

I barely killed the 2 easy mobs in MMIS?

Barely was never in that post.  I said we didnt kill jack the first time we explored MMIS and last night we killed the 2 easiest mobs and was on our way to Viswin. Unfortunatly do to circumstances (of being a casual guild) we never got 1 pull in. You see, this sorta blatant accusation is why we dont get along. I'm supposed to be the idiot but your the one acting the part.

If you honestly think I know little about the defiler class then fine. I really dont care about your personal opinion of me anymore because youve proven your only narrowminded. But if you want to continue to fight I can easilly dig up some of your wonder posts and replies that show what kinda advice is REALLY silly.

Oh screw it, here's some of your wonderful comments...

"As far as that goes you are correct all except that healers dont gain dmg from str"
Bwahahaha, mkay. My softcapped STR has no effect on my melee damage... Next.

"both legendary sets suck imo and are not worth getting"
Yea, our legendary set is horrible compared to the other legendary crap... /sarcasm off. Maybe you could offer better advice to defilers who dont raid than "dont get the legendary set." Nice advice to our young defilers.

"Wards are 1/4th less effected by + to heals"
I proved ya wrong on this one the same day... working as intended. Alot +heals is almost perfect for shaman, where our slow casting gets the best use.

But like you said, I should just stop posting here because I'm just a fool who knows nothing about this game and you are not. Please, continue to give wonder advice like above so we can all become as great as you are. Please, respond. The reason you dont like me is because I keep proving you wrong and am willing to keep doing it for the sake of those who listen to you.

 

As for Ipum, I never supported the focus. I would want a ward focus more than anything like yourself.... But its not gonna happen. When have they changed a focus because its not what we want? I just didnt care for the drama in the forums. The first link thread of the Defiler BP was about how much BS it was.... Sheesh.

Atleast now you've said you really were happy about it getting it, because above you sounded like you'd rather use it as a bedpan.

 

Message Edited by BeatinGuts on 01-21-2007 11:36 PM

Message Edited by BeatinGuts on 01-22-2007 12:02 AM

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Old 01-22-2007, 02:25 PM   #16
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BeatinGuts wrote:

If you think I know jack about gear your wrong. I am one of the top 3 Defiler on my server when it comes to stats, resists and masters at the moment. My resists are near perfect and I have 2 chests of backup gear with every type of stats out there. Its mostly still KoS but I'm working on that. Anyways, In any situation I can adapt. I can max FT, max 2 resist (yes MAX) and still have 600+ WIZ and 400+ to STR, STA and INT. But yes, I know nothing about gear.

I barely killed the 2 easy mobs in MMIS?

Barely was never in that post.  I said we didnt kill jack the first time we explored MMIS and last night we killed the 2 easiest mobs and was on our way to Viswin. Unfortunatly do to circumstances (of being a casual guild) we never got 1 pull in. You see, this sorta blatant accusation is why we dont get along. I'm supposed to be the idiot but your the one acting the part.

If you honestly think I know little about the defiler class then fine. I really dont care about your personal opinion of me anymore because youve proven your only narrowminded. But if you want to continue to fight I can easilly dig up some of your wonder posts and replies that show what kinda advice is REALLY silly.


Ok I talked to a few friends on oasis Nvia and Achilies, they said you are pretty good but you are in a compleatly casual guild, the majority of my post was pointed at the fact you have youre two cents on high end raiding. Which every other random person seems to have, and let me tell you it is compleatly anoying valid my post is over the top. But that is how I am some times, though if you care to do research or ask around like I did you might find something out. Lets look at your points.


BeatinGuts wrote:

Oh screw it, here's some of your wonderful comments...

"As far as that goes you are correct all except that healers dont gain dmg from str"
Bwahahaha, mkay. My softcapped STR has no effect on my melee damage... Next.

"both legendary sets suck imo and are not worth getting"
Yea, our legendary set is horrible compared to the other legendary crap... /sarcasm off. Maybe you could offer better advice to defilers who dont raid than "dont get the legendary set." Nice advice to our young defilers.

"Wards are 1/4th less effected by + to heals"
I proved ya wrong on this one the same day... working as intended. Alot +heals is almost perfect for shaman, where our slow casting gets the best use.


 

On the left we see my melee dmg with 300 str. On the right we see my melee dmg with 150 str, any questions? Also you claim you are soft capped with the softcap being roughly 1000, man you are better than me SMILEY.

As for your second question basicly all that proves is I am an jerk, everyone knows I am an jerk you are proveing nothing. but the fact of the mater is the legendary set is horrible, you could get an random pick of gear and have a better asortment of stats/ resist.

 

The image on the left is with +up to 15 heals, the one on the right is without. 3358 - 3346 = 12

Now the formula for up to effects is as fallows. (((castingspeed + recovery) / 3) * bonus) now with that being said any spell with a casting time of 2.5 should get maximum use of the up to effect, this is not true for the ward. Though if i rember correctly you said it was a display bug, I checked this out and found that you are wrong again the acctual difference look at what I acctualy warded for is still wrong and does not fallow the correct guidelines via heals.

I admit my post was made while angry and was over the top, but here is my response to you take it as you will.

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Old 01-22-2007, 02:42 PM   #17
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Ok, softcap is 510ish, Hardcap is 1000ish. And I'll hafta do my own testing with my melee weapons, but STR has been a factor in auto attack melee damage for quite some time. If its not SoE needs to change it back as STR should once again be used for more than just carrying more weight.

As for the ward, please refer to my previous post in the forums on he issue.

http://eqiiforums.station.sony.com/eq2/board/message?board.id=20&message.id=13310

There is a gaint display bug on the group ward. With +180 to heals I'm actually getting +216 on group ward. To verify, please mouse over the ward when its active up top. Thats the actual correct amount. Because the group ward is expecially slow, you'll always get more to +heal than you adorned. The single target ward will be less.

The display bug is seen on all other wards but the group ward /bug is gynormous. Rest assured, its working correctly tho.

I get mad too, and I go over the top also. I just like to give advice and I generally see myself as the medium between extremes on subjects. Concerning this issue of the BP alot of players were hating it. But really, hey, its no so bad. Any defiler would be happy to wear it and we'll all get the job done. I just wanted to prevent a 4 page thread that was looking to be only 100% negative.

 

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Old 01-22-2007, 02:49 PM   #18
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Snark. Thats nice that you think that, but lack of your reason for the thought says it all... If anything I've ever said is wrong, please show me and I'll verify and apologize.

 

Edited to Add: I just verified that STR does raise a priests Melee damage. If you seriousy want some pics then ask, I have ACT and I'll redo it and take shots.

Anyways if you trust me, both /weaponstat and parse confirmed a raise in crushing damage when going from 120 STR to 400 STR. /weaponstat alone showed a difference when raising and lowering STR. From ACT...

120 str =  an average of 64.84 a swing
400 str =  an average 84.32 a swing

No crits were counted in averaging.

 

Message Edited by BeatinGuts on 01-22-2007 02:21 AM

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Old 01-22-2007, 05:36 PM   #19
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BeatinGuts wrote:

Ok, softcap is 510ish, Hardcap is 1000ish.


is that meant as a joke?
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Old 01-22-2007, 05:48 PM   #20
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Xanoth wrote:


BeatinGuts wrote:

Ok, softcap is 510ish, Hardcap is 1000ish.



is that meant as a joke?

I wasent going to comment on this, BUT 510 ish is not the soft cap 1050 is the new soft cap. Do you understand what diminsing returns are beacuse this is how the new stat system works. though around 570 your return becomes very steep.
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Old 01-22-2007, 05:50 PM   #21
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Do we really hafta divert this thread again because I used a wrong term? Is it so wrong that I call the point where diminishing returns really starts to kick in my softcap, and the point where you no longer get returns period my hardcap? Doesnt that sound just, right?

Edited:

Actually, I think a dev used the same terminology. A hard-cap is the cap you've no need to pass or cant pass. Either way it offers no more returns.  Soft-cap is the start of diminishing returns. You know, the more I think about it the more I know its the right term for explaining caps. And I'm definitly not the only one who uses them.

http://eqiiforums.station.sony.com/eq2/board/message?board.id=combat&message.id=119183&query.id=177122#M119183

So many out to get me tonight. SMILEY Tho its getting real old now...

 

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Old 01-22-2007, 06:55 PM   #22
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That guy is not a dev nore does he know what hes talking about, if you go over 1050 in a stat you still get benifit which would mean its not a hard cap.
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Old 01-22-2007, 08:34 PM   #23
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Sharing opinions and ideas regarding the topic is great, personally attacking other posters on these forums is not cool.  don't do it.
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Old 01-22-2007, 09:54 PM   #24
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since the MODs will not ban people for consistently giving poor or incorrect advice, I personally would like to see them straightened out by other players who bring supporting evidence for the claims as I see being done in this thread.

if one of these people is full of it, i really would like to find out which one.

Please do not close this thread.

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Old 01-22-2007, 10:21 PM   #25
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samejima wrote:
That guy is not a dev nore does he know what hes talking about, if you go over 1050 in a stat you still get benifit which would mean its not a hard cap.
uhhhh...As someone with an assassin as a main I have to tell you that the hardcap is 1070.  Diminishing returns up until this point, that is to say that the dimishing returns curve is always there, however for low STR you now get more benefit than you did before the addition of dimishing returns, the break even point, as a dev put it, the point where you get roughly the same benefit now as you did before is around 600 STR.

Dymus wrote:
Stat Caps•    All stat cap maximums have been increased from [ 7 * Level + 20 ] to [ 15 * level + 20 ]
That is a hardcap, that guy IS a dev, and that post comes from here.By the way, STR makes a big difference to all melee damage.  Be it auto-attack or a CA (not spells, nor most procs).STR is my domain as an assassin, and I'm pretty confident I know what it is used  for :smileywink:On the subject of the BP;  a very nice BP, the focus' on single peices of EoF fabled are almost universally pointless.  Everyone complains, but you have to admit that the raw stats tend to make them worthwhile.Also I would like to point out that the healing pulse abilities don't seem to be exact figures added on to healing spells.Aanyway, chill dudes, chill. :smileyindifferent:

Message Edited by steelbadger on 01-22-2007 09:26 AM

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Old 01-22-2007, 11:44 PM   #26
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Yes I was incorrect about stat caps, that was I think eight am my time. What was ment to be said was just that there is no soft cap anymore and just diminishing returns, I apologise for that.
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Old 01-23-2007, 06:34 AM   #27
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Wasn't taking sides, was just wanting to clear up some of the misconceptions about the effects of STR and the function by which it increases. :smileytongue:Although I have to admit that my point of even returns at 600 seems to have been off, a dev post suggested that it would be nearer 400 (40% of the hardcap).But, to be quite honest I don't think that a trash focus on this otherwise awesome BP warrents such harsh judgement, hell assassins get a single piece focus (leggings) that increases Eviscerate by 60 dmg, on a skill that hits for 2-3k, woot.  And a SET bonus that increases finishing blow by 60 as well, a skill that hits for 3-4k.And other classes get these pointless focii too, its not a kick in the teeth for Defilers, its just the continuation of a trend (of pointless focii :smileytongue: )
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Old 01-23-2007, 12:32 PM   #28
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arieste wrote:

since the MODs will not ban people for consistently giving poor or incorrect advice, I personally would like to see them straightened out by other players who bring supporting evidence for the claims as I see being done in this thread.

if one of these people is full of it, i really would like to find out which one.

Please do not close this thread.




Question answered.  Thanks Steel. =)
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Old 01-23-2007, 07:51 PM   #29
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Grimjakk wrote:

Question answered.  Thanks Steel. =)


Sigh i dont think this means I am giveing incorrect advice all the time, beacuse I miss said something. but what ever you want to think SMILEY, I proved all my facts with screen shots and the formulas that there for back them up up untill now what i was triyng to get at with my post was the fact that there is no soft cap any more there is just a hardcap with now diminishing returns.
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