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Old 03-06-2007, 02:38 PM   #1
Wrapye

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My guild was in Freethinkers fighting Malkonis D'Morte.  He will periodically kick the raid into the air.  Above the raid will spawn epic mobs that will aggro if a character gets too close.  In general, as long as everyone stays at a wall and does not use blue AoEs (i.e. ones that impact everything around them regardless of encounter) the mobs don't aggro. We were running into an issue where mages with the Finesse of the Magi on their weapon would aggro the flying mobs.  The proc is a deaggro proc, so should only be affecting those friendly to the caster, reducing their aggro to the mob that was the target of the spell that triggered the proc.  It may be doing that, but it is also hitting mobs outside of the raid, aggro'ing them in the process. Why is a deaggro proc aggroing/pulling other mobs into combat?
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Old 03-06-2007, 05:10 PM   #2
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yeah just did this last night, have that adornment.  i couldnt figure out why i kept aggroing the bats and dying.  sounds like a plausible theory.
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Old 03-06-2007, 05:42 PM   #3
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Even though the action decreases aggro it's still a hostile act. By any action even touching it you generate aggro, and the only way you can be completely erased from a mobs hate list is a memwipe, either inherant to the mob or a player action (amnesia, tinkered memwipe thing.)

 Try it, cast your deaggro on a grey mob and watch it come try to eat you.

 edit: to clarity, the adornment you're talking about proc a pbaoe deaggro, not single target... thats why it was pulling bats.

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Old 03-06-2007, 05:56 PM   #4
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kingdeke wrote:

Even though the action decreases aggro it's still a hostile act. By any action even touching it you generate aggro, and the only way you can be completely erased from a mobs hate list is a memwipe, either inherant to the mob or a player action (amnesia, tinkered memwipe thing.)

 Try it, cast your deaggro on a grey mob and watch it come try to eat you.

 edit: to clarity, the adornment you're talking about proc a pbaoe deaggro, not single target... thats why it was pulling bats.

The thing is the spell is not reducing my aggro to the bats.  It is reducing Malkonis' aggro to the bats.  By that logic, Malkonis should then be aggro to the bats.
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Old 03-06-2007, 06:45 PM   #5
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Wrapye wrote:
kingdeke wrote:

Even though the action decreases aggro it's still a hostile act. By any action even touching it you generate aggro, and the only way you can be completely erased from a mobs hate list is a memwipe, either inherant to the mob or a player action (amnesia, tinkered memwipe thing.)

 Try it, cast your deaggro on a grey mob and watch it come try to eat you.

 edit: to clarity, the adornment you're talking about proc a pbaoe deaggro, not single target... thats why it was pulling bats.

The thing is the spell is not reducing my aggro to the bats.  It is reducing Malkonis' aggro to the bats.  By that logic, Malkonis should then be aggro to the bats.
I don't think you understand how the proc works.  It is basically an AoE De-aggro spell being cast every now and then.  This is why the bats are being "aggro'd", even though they are being de-aggro'd.  I saw a post from a developer over on the warlock boards that they are looking into it and will change how it works.
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Old 03-06-2007, 06:54 PM   #6
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Wrapye wrote:
kingdeke wrote:

Even though the action decreases aggro it's still a hostile act. By any action even touching it you generate aggro, and the only way you can be completely erased from a mobs hate list is a memwipe, either inherant to the mob or a player action (amnesia, tinkered memwipe thing.)

 Try it, cast your deaggro on a grey mob and watch it come try to eat you.

 edit: to clarity, the adornment you're talking about proc a pbaoe deaggro, not single target... thats why it was pulling bats.

The thing is the spell is not reducing my aggro to the bats.  It is reducing Malkonis' aggro to the bats.  By that logic, Malkonis should then be aggro to the bats.
Even though that would be pretty funny to see, thats not the way the proc works, as Pinski said.
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Old 03-07-2007, 10:43 AM   #7
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Pinski wrote:
I don't think you understand how the proc works.  It is basically an AoE De-aggro spell being cast every now and then.  This is why the bats are being "aggro'd", even though they are being de-aggro'd.  I saw a post from a developer over on the warlock boards that they are looking into it and will change how it works.
See, that just doesn't make sense mechanistically.  The mob maintains the hate list, not the character.  It makes no sense to speak of an AoE deaggro without relating it to whom the aggro is reduced.  I have to be dropping my aggro in relation to some mob that has me on their hate list, which in this case should be the mob that I had targeted with the spell that caused the proc to fire.  Otherwise the effect makes no sense whatsoever.
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Old 03-07-2007, 11:38 AM   #8
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ok think of the adornment proc like a "true" aoe (blue button) spell. When it procs you are essentially casting a pbaoe deaggro, which will cause you to become hated by surrounding mobs that you didn't have aggro on before because you are hitting them with a spell, even if that spell reduces aggro.
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Old 03-07-2007, 11:40 AM   #9
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Its an AoE so is out of encounter and its a problem with a few games ive played where a deagro actually agros things. The de-agro is a hostile effect - Its effect being it lowers your hate but in doing so puts you on the hate list to begin with.  So you may be - 1000 hate on its list but you are still the only one on its list.
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Old 03-07-2007, 12:15 PM   #10
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Look, deaggro has to be in relation to some mob.  You can't just have a 'AoE deaggro'.  It has to be lowering the aggro on some mob's hate list. If the deaggro is hitting all mobs in the area, it is lowering their aggro in relation to some mob.  It is not reducing the aggro of a mob in the AoE to me. To talk of an AoE deaggro without considering the mob for whom the aggro is being reduced mechanistically makes no sense whatsoever. When the bloodsuckers are hit with the AoE deaggro, whose hate list are they being reduced?  If I cast a deaggro directly on them, then I am modifying my position on their hate list, but that is not what this proc is supposed to be doing.
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Old 03-07-2007, 12:27 PM   #11
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Wrapye wrote:
Look, deaggro has to be in relation to some mob.  You can't just have a 'AoE deaggro'.  It has to be lowering the aggro on some mob's hate list. If the deaggro is hitting all mobs in the area, it is lowering their aggro in relation to some mob.  It is not reducing the aggro of a mob in the AoE to me. To talk of an AoE deaggro without considering the mob for whom the aggro is being reduced mechanistically makes no sense whatsoever. When the bloodsuckers are hit with the AoE deaggro, whose hate list are they being reduced?  If I cast a deaggro directly on them, then I am modifying my position on their hate list, but that is not what this proc is supposed to be doing.
YOU are casting the AoE De-Aggro.  It is lowering YOUR hate in an Area of Effect.  It is the same as you casting a single-target de-aggro on a mob, except now isntead of a single-target, you are casting it in an Area of Effect.  How do you not understand this?  You get it to proc, and it casts a Point Blank Area of Effect De-Aggro that lowers YOUR hate on all the mob's hate list that are hit.  Understand?
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Old 03-07-2007, 12:37 PM   #12
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Pinski wrote:
Wrapye wrote:
Look, deaggro has to be in relation to some mob.  You can't just have a 'AoE deaggro'.  It has to be lowering the aggro on some mob's hate list. If the deaggro is hitting all mobs in the area, it is lowering their aggro in relation to some mob.  It is not reducing the aggro of a mob in the AoE to me. To talk of an AoE deaggro without considering the mob for whom the aggro is being reduced mechanistically makes no sense whatsoever. When the bloodsuckers are hit with the AoE deaggro, whose hate list are they being reduced?  If I cast a deaggro directly on them, then I am modifying my position on their hate list, but that is not what this proc is supposed to be doing.
YOU are casting the AoE De-Aggro.  It is lowering YOUR hate in an Area of Effect.  It is the same as you casting a single-target de-aggro on a mob, except now isntead of a single-target, you are casting it in an Area of Effect.  How do you not understand this?  You get it to proc, and it casts a Point Blank Area of Effect De-Aggro that lowers YOUR hate on all the mob's hate list that are hit.  Understand?
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Old 03-07-2007, 12:39 PM   #13
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Okay, reread the item description.  I thought it lowered the aggro of everyone in the AoE to the target of the spell that triggered the proc.  I now see that it is indeed an AoE lower my aggro to everything in the AoE, which makes sense as to why it is pulling aggro. My apologies for being so dense. The dev comment on the warlock board is for something related, but different.  There the AoE is so small that the character virtually needs to be on top of the mob for it to be hit by the deaggro.  This is different, in that the mobs are being hit by the deaggro, they are just being aggro'ed by it if they didn't previously have aggro.
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Old 03-07-2007, 12:46 PM   #14
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yeah it needs to be changed to proc either single target or encounter deaggro. As it is now it's pretty useless.

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Old 03-07-2007, 02:26 PM   #15
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Aye,

It is basically the exact same thing as Conjy's stone skin (when it got changed oh so long ago).

Casting stone skin gives you 3 free hits, and they added a pbaoe deagro as well.

When that first went live, conjys were dropping like flys because they were using that and not realizing it was a PBAOE deagro and were pulling all kinds of adds. lol

 The adorn definitely should be changed to an encounter deagro though for sure. (the coding is already there, there is an AA spell that does that very thing for Summoner mage pets in the Int line, so it shouldn't be too hard to change i'd think)

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