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Old 02-09-2012, 07:32 PM   #1
Yimway

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Hey guys, you know, you really don't have to just remove CM and add health...

You could do something a little different, and I dunno, like add +mitigation on some things as well.

For example, take the warden buff, changing it to 2.5% HP and 5% mitigation increase would make it more interesting.

A little flavor in the pot would be nice ya know.

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Old 02-09-2012, 07:46 PM   #2
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^^ This...right there.  Or CC, pot, +x to resists, anything or something other than hps

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Old 02-10-2012, 12:09 PM   #3
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So you're asking for a game-wide buff? Considering Crit. Mit. just helped you survive I don't see why it would be turned into anything else except HP...

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Old 02-10-2012, 12:17 PM   #4
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Given mobs are still critting past this implementation, are you suggesting that hp is equal to crit mit? 

It isn't.

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Old 02-10-2012, 12:26 PM   #5
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Hit Points don't scale very well .. and changing the yellow CM adorn to such a low HP value adorn will make them nearly useless right from the onset, let alone in DOV 2.0.

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Old 02-10-2012, 02:21 PM   #6
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[email protected] wrote:

So you're asking for a game-wide buff? Considering Crit. Mit. just helped you survive I don't see why it would be turned into anything else except HP...

Maybe you don't understand that mitigation is a similar mechanic to surviving.

Adding 5% mitigation to someone squishy will have a larger effect than adding just HP.  A few of these replacement effects having mitigation on them will have a similar effect as the previous CM buff did. 

As in, placing the previous CM buff on someone allowed them to survive where they couldn't before.  A mitigation buff will have similar results.  A few more HP when that person's gear is low for the zone will likely not be as effective as upping their mitigation amounts since things still crit, and they hit harder now.

The specific example of the warden buff that is single target, being mitigation based (or atleast partially) adds more than a single purpose for the buff, and makes it more similarly useful as the previous effect was.

I'm certainly not saying everything should be mitigation either, but a tiny bit of flavor in these changes would be more interesting than cut/paste; cm/hp

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Old 02-10-2012, 02:37 PM   #7
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Really another thread about stuff like this? If mobs once its done arnt going to crit the remove of CM was working as it should. Why should they add other stuff to surviveability? You do understand that if they do that they have to increas the damage out put of some raid mobs aswell? (not drunder HM) but the rest. Just get rid of it.... And focus on rebalance the gear on stats abit and jobs done... they dont need to add anything new from the old CM thats just stupid.

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Old 02-10-2012, 02:43 PM   #8
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Netty wrote:

Really another thread about stuff like this? If mobs once its done arnt going to crit the remove of CM was working as it should. Why should they add other stuff to surviveability? You do understand that if they do that they have to increas the damage out put of some raid mobs aswell? (not drunder HM) but the rest. Just get rid of it.... And focus on rebalance the gear on stats abit and jobs done... they dont need to add anything new from the old CM thats just stupid.

This isn't about gear/adornment replacement. It's about AAs that previously gave crit mit.

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Old 02-10-2012, 03:19 PM   #9
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Mermut wrote:

Netty wrote:

Really another thread about stuff like this? If mobs once its done arnt going to crit the remove of CM was working as it should. Why should they add other stuff to surviveability? You do understand that if they do that they have to increas the damage out put of some raid mobs aswell? (not drunder HM) but the rest. Just get rid of it.... And focus on rebalance the gear on stats abit and jobs done... they dont need to add anything new from the old CM thats just stupid.

This isn't about gear/adornment replacement. It's about AAs that previously gave crit mit.

Replacing EVERYTHING <---------------- that was CM with HP. To me that sounds like just what it says.

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Old 02-10-2012, 04:07 PM   #10
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Netty wrote:

Really another thread about stuff like this? If mobs once its done arnt going to crit the remove of CM was working as it should. Why should they add other stuff to surviveability? You do understand that if they do that they have to increas the damage out put of some raid mobs aswell? (not drunder HM) but the rest. Just get rid of it.... And focus on rebalance the gear on stats abit and jobs done... they dont need to add anything new from the old CM thats just stupid.

I'm never said the stat itself should just transform into something.

My post was directed towards the things that are getting replaced (namely buffs / procs).

CM adornments don't need to change into anything other than HP, cause there are already lots of interesting adornment choices.  But items/spells/procs/short term effects/etc that affected CM should/could have their affects adjusted to do something besides just HP accross the board.

The static CM values on gear that I think you are aluding to should just vaporize.  This was by no means meant as yet another thread about that.

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Old 02-10-2012, 04:28 PM   #11
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There are only 2 buffs in game that i know off that gives CM and thats the warden buff and the AA on the warrior group mit buff. Adorns even tho that they are weak cant be made into something amazing since that would unbalance the rest since its like you still got to keep your CM and in the same way add more surviveability with it. I agree tho that the health gain is abit small and not many will take them....

If its the buffs you mean tho +5 mit is like 300 mit for a plate tank. So imo then 5% health is better. It should be damage reduction off spell damage imo. Since then it would have more use. You just place it on the tank if ppl are geared up or place it on say a new recruit that dont have that much gear yet to help them surive aoes abit better. As for the warrior one. I dident take that one befor and i will not take after if they dont make it stupidly OP so yeah health is fine on that one imo.

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Old 02-13-2012, 02:19 PM   #12
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The thing with the warden buff...It was given to wardens as an assist to make them useful and wanted, it was, initially an ability that no one else brought to a raid, a reason to maybe use a warden, since all the other buffs are pretty much meh. 

And, in the flavor of the class, it was a defensive buff that actually helped with survival.  Changing it to 2.5% hp does not keep it a defensive buff that helps with survival.  The 5% mit might be okay, but I would prefer a 5% damage reduction, to keep it in the same spirit as the buff was created.

Mystics do have an AA that adds cm to one of their spells, bolster I think.  With the removal of cm, I tend to think changing that to a ward rather than hp would be better.

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Old 02-13-2012, 02:37 PM   #13
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gatrm wrote:

Mystics do have an AA that adds cm to one of their spells, bolster I think.  With the removal of cm, I tend to think changing that to a ward rather than hp would be better.

From the test update notes:

Mystic

Bolstering Spirits no longer adds max health and now improves the attributes granted by Bolster, maxing at 23% in total.

 

They've already made the mystic buff more interesting the just 'max health', though with the stat increase, health is indirectly part of the package, because Bolster increases sta too.

 

 

Also from test update notes:

 

Warden

Aura of Health is now 5% max health and can be cast on any player in the raid.

 

Warrior

Robust Bulwark is now 5% max health at rank 10.

 

 

 

It's just the warden and warrior buff that is left with the mostly useless token amount of max health. The other ironic thing about the proposed warden buff.. the more a person can use the buff (ie they've got low hit points and are getting 1-shot) the less useful it is to them, because the health buff is percentage based.

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Old 02-13-2012, 03:05 PM   #14
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Mermut wrote:

gatrm wrote:

Mystics do have an AA that adds cm to one of their spells, bolster I think.  With the removal of cm, I tend to think changing that to a ward rather than hp would be better.

From the test update notes:

Mystic

Bolstering Spirits no longer adds max health and now improves the attributes granted by Bolster, maxing at 23% in total.

 

 

They've already made the mystic buff more interesting the just 'max health', though with the stat increase, health is indirectly part of the package, because Bolster increases sta too.

They didn't make Bolster at all interesting. Bolster already increases all attributes by 20%. The enhance added mitigation and crit mit into the mix. Basically, we're getting an extra 3% on the enhance to what's already there....which is pretty lawls as a trade.

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Old 02-13-2012, 03:31 PM   #15
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[email protected] wrote:

Mermut wrote:

gatrm wrote:

Mystics do have an AA that adds cm to one of their spells, bolster I think.  With the removal of cm, I tend to think changing that to a ward rather than hp would be better.

From the test update notes:

Mystic

Bolstering Spirits no longer adds max health and now improves the attributes granted by Bolster, maxing at 23% in total.

 

 

They've already made the mystic buff more interesting the just 'max health', though with the stat increase, health is indirectly part of the package, because Bolster increases sta too.

They didn't make Bolster at all interesting. Bolster already increases all attributes by 20%. The enhance added mitigation and crit mit into the mix. Basically, we're getting an extra 3% on the enhance to what's already there....which is pretty lawls as a trade.

Oh, I don't disagree. It's just marginally better then some token amount of hitpoints SMILEY

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Old 02-13-2012, 07:31 PM   #16
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We're working on some pretty cool stuff for Game Update #63. I'm hoping you guys will like the flavor of it! SMILEY

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Old 02-13-2012, 07:47 PM   #17
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Xelgad wrote:

We're working on some pretty cool stuff for Game Update #63. I'm hoping you guys will like the flavor of it!

Is that when we should be expecting the crit mit changes to move to live?

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Old 02-13-2012, 08:39 PM   #18
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No, the critical mitigation changes will go live when they're ready. SMILEY I've been focused on Game Update #63 for the past week while other people iron out the kinks with criticial mitigation.

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Old 02-13-2012, 08:42 PM   #19
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Sounds like some AA and/or adornment revamps are incoming.

Unless what you are working on is just completely unrelated to what people are talking about here and you decided to swing some weight around to derail threads heh.

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Old 02-13-2012, 08:55 PM   #20
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Xelgad wrote:

No, the critical mitigation changes will go live when they're ready. I've been focused on Game Update #63 for the past week while other people iron out the kinks with criticial mitigation.

Hopefully it's those bruiser buffs we talked about! Or... Heroic Ops redone!

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Old 02-13-2012, 09:14 PM   #21
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Do brawlers need anymore stuff?  I thought they was the best?

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Old 02-13-2012, 09:18 PM   #22
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[email protected] Bayle wrote:

Do brawlers need anymore stuff?  I thought they was the best?

Yeah I'm not quite at the power level I think I should be at as an Iksar bruiser.

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Old 02-13-2012, 09:25 PM   #23
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Corydonn wrote:

[email protected] Bayle wrote:

Do brawlers need anymore stuff?  I thought they was the best?

Yeah I'm not quite at the power level I think I should be at as an Iksar bruiser.

What about other Iksars that don't play a bruiser, shouldn't they be better too?

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Old 02-13-2012, 09:35 PM   #24
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[email protected] Bayle wrote:

Corydonn wrote:

[email protected] Bayle wrote:

Do brawlers need anymore stuff?  I thought they was the best?

Yeah I'm not quite at the power level I think I should be at as an Iksar bruiser.

What about other Iksars that don't play a bruiser, shouldn't they be better too?

Giving us back our 50 meter spit attack would be a start!

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Old 02-13-2012, 09:46 PM   #25
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Corydonn wrote:

[email protected] Bayle wrote:

Corydonn wrote:

[email protected] Bayle wrote:

Do brawlers need anymore stuff?  I thought they was the best?

Yeah I'm not quite at the power level I think I should be at as an Iksar bruiser.

What about other Iksars that don't play a bruiser, shouldn't they be better too?

Giving us back our 50 meter spit attack would be a start!

 yea man, when my guard lost venom spit or whatever i wanted to cry  SMILEY

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Old 02-13-2012, 10:20 PM   #26
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Davngr1 wrote:

Corydonn wrote:

[email protected] Bayle wrote:

Corydonn wrote:

[email protected] Bayle wrote:

Do brawlers need anymore stuff?  I thought they was the best?

Yeah I'm not quite at the power level I think I should be at as an Iksar bruiser.

What about other Iksars that don't play a bruiser, shouldn't they be better too?

Giving us back our 50 meter spit attack would be a start!

 yea man, when my guard lost venom spit or whatever i wanted to cry 

Ugh, Iksar spitting all over ... nasty!

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Old 02-13-2012, 10:29 PM   #27
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Xelgad wrote:

We're working on some pretty cool stuff for Game Update #63. I'm hoping you guys will like the flavor of it!

I checked my dev decoder ring, and I think that means he's nerfing monks =P

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Old 02-13-2012, 11:06 PM   #28
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Xelgad wrote:

We're working on some pretty cool stuff for Game Update #63. I'm hoping you guys will like the flavor of it!

Can we hope for some serious class balancing?

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