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Old 10-29-2012, 11:37 AM   #31
Leawyn

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[email protected] wrote:

but the mystic and defiler division in methods isn't like the coercer/chanter. both of them use enchantment...one just warps your perception of reality, and one warps your mind itself. example being an illusionist would make you see a naked woman jumping off a water fall which makes you chase after her and jump of a cliff into a pit of molten lava. the coercer just flat you tells your brain to do it like programing a robot.

the mystics and defilers...it's like a hunter and a vegan looking at a deer. one wants to shoot it, eat it, mount the head on his wall...the other wants to observe it, feed it, pet it, and call it bambi. (this case the 'deer' being the Truespirit)

So now hunters are evil? Just trying to understand you're comparison. Because honestly, living in the PNW, I know alot of hunters and none are evil for going hunting. In fact, I know this one woman who does observe, feed, pet and call a deer Bambi, then will gladly hunt it and butcher it for food for the winter.

Again, just because their methods are different doesn't designate who is evil and who isn't. Just because my mystic might revere the spirits doesn't mean she doesn't use them for her own evil intentions. As long as she feels its right and true, the spirits would follow her lead and do what she asked.

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Old 10-29-2012, 12:24 PM   #32
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yohann koldheart wrote:

there is a way already to do this, it does cost SC though.

roll a mystic on nagafen on the freeport side. buy the transfer token and move it to your server.

So I can server hop my swashbuckler for $25 to the PvP server, betray him from Qeynos to Freeport and remain a swashbuckler when he rolls on into Freeport. I then pay another $25 to move my evil swashbuckler back to Unrest. Now my raiding swashy can do Freeport/evil quests and follow an evil god without having to exile.

Because I want a good AND evil swashbuckler on my account, I'm going to have to then betray my brigand to Qeynos to turn him into a swashbuckler.As soon as I do this, SOE will "fix" this "workaround" to keep evil paladins out of Freeport and good shadowknights out of Qeynos...and the other 6 classes that are screwing up the holy PvE-based lore. (To heck with lore on PvP!!!)...and I'll have wasted my time betraying 2 toons...not to mention wasting $50 to get what I want out of my characters on an account that I've been paying $15/mo for nearly 8 years. Yet, if I played on a PvP server...this wouldn't be an issue.Talk about not being fair and balanced for people who play on PvP versus playing PvE.

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Old 10-29-2012, 12:26 PM   #33
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[email protected] wrote:

/snip wall of text 

Answer me this, Rainmare:Let's say you decided to move to the PvP server and managed to find a group of people who role played while they PvPed. You would then have to learn to role play and interact with all 25 classes being neutral...just like you would have to do if SOE allowed the last 8 classes to be neutral on the PvE servers. Or would you opt to /ignore the players who are running around as good SKs and evil paladins, just because of who and what they chose to be is now ruining your RPing life?

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Old 10-29-2012, 05:11 PM   #34
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myself? if I saw a paladin living in freeport or an SK living in qeynos as a member of those cities? I probably would ignore them. right now I'd ignore them becuase obviously they are from a PVP server and frankly I have yet to meet a single pvp player that moved to my sever who isn't a jack*ss of a person that I wouldn't want to spend time with in the first place.

if they opened up the pvp aspect on pve...thus making all the classes neutral...yeah I'd probably still put them on ignore. I might give them the benefit of the doubt at first, but thier disregard of the lore would severly lower my tolerance for crap I might put up with from someone else.

and if I moved to a PVP server, it would strictly be for alignment restricted battles. good vs evil, qeynos vs freeport. as they are supposed to be. not as they are right now where the crying Raiders got thier way rather then learn to work with what they had.

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Old 10-29-2012, 05:17 PM   #35
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While I agree that they should go ahead and free up the remaining classes to be available on either side, I do think that they should have a special area that those classes have to hide in from the main populace.  Like in eq1, the city was good but go into the sewers and you find the evil class trainers.

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Old 10-29-2012, 06:38 PM   #36
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From a lore perspective aren't the two factions all teaming up to form the 'New Combine' anyway?  Seems its about time these silly faction restrictions be removed.

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Old 10-29-2012, 07:26 PM   #37
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Ulrichvon wrote:

From a lore perspective aren't the two factions all teaming up to form the 'New Combine' anyway?  Seems its about time these silly faction restrictions be removed.

becoming part of the combine doesnt make them any less enemies/rivals joining isnt membership as long as both empires shall live. if you've been killnig each other for so long suddly declaringp eace at the top of both factinos isnt gonna erase them mutal hatred and desire to violently kill each other in acts of revenge.

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Old 10-29-2012, 09:38 PM   #38
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General_Info wrote:

Ulrichvon wrote:

From a lore perspective aren't the two factions all teaming up to form the 'New Combine' anyway?  Seems its about time these silly faction restrictions be removed.

becoming part of the combine doesnt make them any less enemies/rivals joining isnt membership as long as both empires shall live. if you've been killnig each other for so long suddly declaringp eace at the top of both factinos isnt gonna erase them mutal hatred and desire to violently kill each other in acts of revenge.

Or look at it from another angle: the enemy of my enemy is my friend.Countries/cities that used to be enemies now get along (tolerate) each other because a new rival has shown up to try to shut them both down. Applies in real life like it does this game.I know PvP raiding had a disadvantage due to class balance, and that did need to change. Likewise, this game had restrictions early on like not being able to share a bank with characters from opposite cities. I remember having a friend log in an alt that was based in Freeport and meeting me on the docks in TS to swap out stuff that we wanted to shuffle back and forth between good and evil cities. This was back when the blackmarket sold items for a 40% broker fee, and level 50 masters were selling for 75g each.Times have changed. The game has changed. The lore has changed for PvP....make it so for PvE.

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Old 10-29-2012, 09:47 PM   #39
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[email protected] wrote:

myself? if I saw a paladin living in freeport or an SK living in qeynos as a member of those cities? I probably would ignore them. right now I'd ignore them becuase obviously they are from a PVP server and frankly I have yet to meet a single pvp player that moved to my sever who isn't a jack*ss of a person that I wouldn't want to spend time with in the first place.

if they opened up the pvp aspect on pve...thus making all the classes neutral...yeah I'd probably still put them on ignore. I might give them the benefit of the doubt at first, but thier disregard of the lore would severly lower my tolerance for crap I might put up with from someone else.

and if I moved to a PVP server, it would strictly be for alignment restricted battles. good vs evil, qeynos vs freeport. as they are supposed to be. not as they are right now where the crying Raiders got thier way rather then learn to work with what they had.

So you'd do what I suggested...use the /ignore feature that SOE has put into place for your enjoyment and sanity. Pity /ignore also doesn't make the ignored character go "poof" on your screen like it does in channel chat and /say, /tell, etc.Honestly, I wish SOE didn't bother with breaking apart the original EQ1 classes like bards, rogues, monks, chanters, shaman, etc. Your class was defined by your race, and seeing a traditional tank class like an ogre being a wizard or a gnome monk would mess with my perception of EQ lore more than seeing a good SK or evil paladin.

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Old 10-30-2012, 07:31 AM   #40
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the hunter thing was more on the idea that the way a mystic operates and the way a defiler operates...those two (hunter and vegan) will never see eye to eye on how to treat the deer (Truespirt/spiritrealm)

and yes, the Troll wizard and the Ogre brigand do annoy me. that ARAC thing. and yeah I do tend to ignore people that do that, mostly becuase they seem to pick the race/class combo just to make jokes on it...and usually have an equally idiotic or 'punned' name...and amusingly enough, most people that play actually seem to pick race/class combos that make sense. you atually don't often see a troll mage. or an ogre dirge or a halfing monk.

As to Combine Empire...yes, all the major cities are a part of it. and they are all part of it because Kerafyrm can destroy each of them seperately. there' no doubt on that. he only MIGHT not be able to destroy them if they present a united front. and make no mistake that Lucan and Antonia would sever that tie as soon as possible. that doesn't mean Qeynos and Freeport don't hate eachother, or that Lucan wouldn't still want to raze Qeynos to the ground if he had an opportunity to do so.

In fact I am fully expecting to see Lucan, the second Kerafyrm's body hits the ground, before his blood even cools, to try and strike Qeynos and dissolve the Combine in one motion. So being part of the combine isn't really a 'good and evil aren't there anymore' kinda of thing.

think of the Combine in the manner of world war two. Kerafyrm is the Axis. Qeynos is the US and Freeport is Stalin's Russia. Russia and the US may have hated eachother politically/ideaologically...but they knew better then to not team up againse the Axis.

and of course the second the Axis powers fell...the US and Russia were back at eachother's proverbial throats.

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Old 10-30-2012, 02:17 PM   #41
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[email protected] wrote:

and yes, the Troll wizard and the Ogre brigand do annoy me. that ARAC thing. and yeah I do tend to ignore people that do that, mostly becuase they seem to pick the race/class combo just to make jokes on it...and usually have an equally idiotic or 'punned' name...and amusingly enough, most people that play actually seem to pick race/class combos that make sense. you atually don't often see a troll mage. or an ogre dirge or a halfing monk.

One of my favorite players that I knew back in the first year was a guardian gnome named Crunk Stinkstar. He had awesome hair and was a riot to be around and made this game fun. It goes beyond the characters, the races, the classes, and the lore for me. The right person behind the oddball class/race combo can manage to work his story into pure entertainment and comedy gold. Halfling monk...I think Mae* has one of those in her Hobbit Army of Evil (with a wannabe evil mystic that stares longingly at the gates of Freeport, wanting to be able to walk about the city without being bothered by the guards and to not be snubbed by the bankers and merchants.)

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Old 10-30-2012, 02:44 PM   #42
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[email protected]_old wrote:

[email protected] wrote:

and yes, the Troll wizard and the Ogre brigand do annoy me. that ARAC thing. and yeah I do tend to ignore people that do that, mostly becuase they seem to pick the race/class combo just to make jokes on it...and usually have an equally idiotic or 'punned' name...and amusingly enough, most people that play actually seem to pick race/class combos that make sense. you atually don't often see a troll mage. or an ogre dirge or a halfing monk.

Halfling monk...I think Mae* has one of those in her Hobbit Army of Evil (with a wannabe evil mystic that stares longingly at the gates of Freeport, wanting to be able to walk about the city without being bothered by the guards and to not be snubbed by the bankers and merchants.)

I certainly do. Maekita, the evil halfling monk. My evil halfling army, led by the Evil Mystic Who Can't Live in Freeport, consists of an illusionist, troubadour, warden, brigand, necromancer, monk, beastlord, assassin and shadow knight. Out of all of those, I believe only the warden (druid), brig and assassin (rolled into rogue) were capable in EQ1... the thing is, my main in EQ1 was an enchanter, who wore the permanent illusion of a halfling, and had a froglok paladin who got to share the halfling illusion when I 2boxed. So even back then, I had a halfling enchantress and halfling paladin that I two boxed =P

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Old 10-31-2012, 01:38 PM   #43
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gnomes could be warriors in eq1 though as well. halflings were warriors, druids, rogues and later got to be rangers.

the only monks in eq1 were humans and iksar.

my only thing about halfling monks that makes the idea silly to me, is that bruisers/monks use hand to hand combat. I mean your as high as my mid calf...are your kicks really going to possibly do that much? but it's not so unreasonable or downright dumb as the Troll Wizard or the ogre brig.

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Old 10-31-2012, 06:48 PM   #44
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I for one enjoy your informative posts Rainmare.

But I wan't to be a Drakkin!

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Old 11-01-2012, 06:20 PM   #45
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[email protected] wrote:

gnomes could be warriors in eq1 though as well. halflings were warriors, druids, rogues and later got to be rangers.

the only monks in eq1 were humans and iksar.

my only thing about halfling monks that makes the idea silly to me, is that bruisers/monks use hand to hand combat. I mean your as high as my mid calf...are your kicks really going to possibly do that much? but it's not so unreasonable or downright dumb as the Troll Wizard or the ogre brig.

LOL! Clearly you're not a dude. Trust me, there is plenty of damage to be done below the belt =P

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Old 11-01-2012, 06:33 PM   #46
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[email protected]_old wrote:

[email protected] wrote:

gnomes could be warriors in eq1 though as well. halflings were warriors, druids, rogues and later got to be rangers.

the only monks in eq1 were humans and iksar.

my only thing about halfling monks that makes the idea silly to me, is that bruisers/monks use hand to hand combat. I mean your as high as my mid calf...are your kicks really going to possibly do that much? but it's not so unreasonable or downright dumb as the Troll Wizard or the ogre brig.

LOL! Clearly you're not a dude. Trust me, there is plenty of damage to be done below the belt =P

Mae* plays mean and dirty, which is my main (undisclosed until now) reason why I want to move to Freeport. Being on the same side as her is a lot less painful compared to being from an opposing city!

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Old 11-06-2012, 01:51 PM   #47
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heh I am a dude. but a halfling, as tall as they get, the top of there cute little heads is the middle of my calf. you can't reach that particular area without jumping at least with your foot. at which point moving my knee forward would toss you on your backside.

and your fist might reach..but I'm sure my metal codpeice will be protection enough rom your pudgy hand. while I don't think yoru leather gi is going to provided equal protection from my armored foot. which literally can hit you in the face and the chest at the same time.

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Old 11-07-2012, 04:36 PM   #48
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[email protected] wrote:

heh I am a dude. but a halfling, as tall as they get, the top of there cute little heads is the middle of my calf. you can't reach that particular area without jumping at least with your foot. at which point moving my knee forward would toss you on your backside.

and your fist might reach..but I'm sure my metal codpeice will be protection enough rom your pudgy hand. while I don't think yoru leather gi is going to provided equal protection from my armored foot. which literally can hit you in the face and the chest at the same time.

It's hard to see a halfling brawler's attacking moves when you have jumjum pie in your face. They do not throw shurikens from a ranged attack...it's jumjum pie.

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Old 11-08-2012, 12:41 AM   #49
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It can't be jum jum pie. that'd be like a drug dealer trying to blind you by throwing his cocaine in your eyes. SMILEY

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Old 11-08-2012, 02:20 AM   #50
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We're getting off topic here. I'd like to bring it back around to allowing players to pick their own alignment, independant of their class. My poor lonely Mystic, leader of the evil halfling army, cannot live where the rest of her minions live. It's a sad day.

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Old 11-08-2012, 02:59 AM   #51
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but there are some classes that are by thier nature forced into a particular alignment, that simply isn't an alignment that can't function in thier opposing city without adopting the methods and ideology of thier opposing half, thus no longer being said alignment and becoming the other class. Mystic is one of them.

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Old 11-08-2012, 04:50 AM   #52
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[email protected] wrote:

but there are some classes that are by thier nature forced into a particular alignment, that simply isn't an alignment that can't function in thier opposing city without adopting the methods and ideology of thier opposing half, thus no longer being said alignment and becoming the other class. Mystic is one of them.

Says you.

Things change, and lore changes, and people change. Maybe not this expansion, but soon, they can and hopefully will find a way to let all classes live together, instead of arbitrarily picking 8 classes that can't.

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Old 11-08-2012, 02:45 PM   #53
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[email protected]_old wrote:

Says you.

Things change, and lore changes, and people change. Maybe not this expansion, but soon, they can and hopefully will find a way to let all classes live together, instead of arbitrarily picking 8 classes that can't.

I dont see how in any way their choices have been arbitrary it's not like suddenly one dev decides to make say underdepths harder and expects the other devs to go along with it without any disscusion or debate about it.

The reasons why those classes are restircted has been explained/ comparing a pally to a sk is like comparing an exicutioner to a murderer they are fundementally different one is abiding by the law and the other is pursued by the law.

mystics/defilers while not as extreme as pally/sk how they treat spirits and how each city's set of acceptable behavor makes them what they are. Freeport can see the subjugation of spirits for military use as a kind of strength in the same way a master coercer can been seen as stronger in direct conflict against a master illusionist.

it's just as much about the way each class' way of doing things as it is about the oppinon's/perceptions of citizens and the hierarchy of the cities.

if you were a qeynosian who would you trust if you had to pick between a mystic that works with spirits in a cooprative manner of the spirit's choosing and a defiler that bends spirits to their will without regret or remorse?

no different then say a jury being inclinded to trust the testomony of a police officer over an accused offender.

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Old 11-08-2012, 03:12 PM   #54
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General_Info wrote:

[email protected]_old wrote:

Says you.

Things change, and lore changes, and people change. Maybe not this expansion, but soon, they can and hopefully will find a way to let all classes live together, instead of arbitrarily picking 8 classes that can't.

I dont see how in any way their choices have been arbitrary it's not like suddenly one dev decides to make say underdepths harder and expects the other devs to go along with it without any disscusion or debate about it.

mystics/defilers while not as extreme as pally/sk how they treat spirits and how each city's set of acceptable behavor makes them what they are. Freeport can see the subjugation of spirits for military use as a kind of strength in the same way a master coercer can been seen as stronger in direct conflict against a master illusionist.

it's just as much about the way each class' way of doing things as it is about the oppinon's/perceptions of citizens and the hierarchy of the cities.

I say its arbitrary because they decided to make ASSASSINS good, when their job is to kill people. They get paid to do it. I get the whole "Greater good" blah blah, Antonia bending to the pressures whatever, but if you can rationalize assassins being good enough to live in Qeynos, you can rationalize anything. It would have made FAR more sense to keep the Assassin/Ranger as evil/good and make the brigand and swash neutral.

What I fail to see is why defilers are SOOOO evil for manipulating the spirits, but coercers are A-OK though they can manipulate and torture REAL LIVE PEOPLE. Its inconsistencies like that that drives me bonkers.

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