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Old 08-01-2010, 07:19 AM   #91
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Since they added the new wizard and fury 'ring of fire' animations I've had to raid with all particle effects off - not for performance but due to a visual disability I have.

The problem with those ring of fire effects is you can't set 'show max spell results per character' to 0 to get rid of them, you have to turn particles off with /r_particle_priority -1.

At the moment I can enjoy particle effects in groups if I avoid wizards and furies, but if there's more of this coming it'll be very disappointing.

I don't think SOE cares about players with visual impairments, which is a shame.   They could easily create settings that made it easier for players like me to enjoy the game more, e.g. an option to show spell effects on NPCs not players, so you can see when a raid mob is casting, or options to disable certain classes of effects in general.

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Old 08-01-2010, 02:07 PM   #92
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Copied my Troub over who is 90 with mostly masters/Adept 3. I'm afraid to say underwhelmed isnt enough. I rolled a Templar as well and Faith Strike as well as Divine Strike are hilariously low key. I mean Faith Strike was a tiny toy yellow hammer instead of the decent sized one coming at you.

My Ranger's stance abilities are just hilarious. My offensive stance is a brief appearance of a couple of tiny arrows over my head, defensive is a 0.0001 second appearance of a two tiny shields.

Seriously....these arent blowing my skirt up fellas. I've gone from being epic to epic fail...

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Old 08-01-2010, 06:29 PM   #93
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Earthen Avatar, Aery Hunter, and Fiery Magician:

The pets just appear, there's no kind of smooth enterance.

Its hard to tell on Winds of Velious, Crystal Blast, Fiery Annihilation, Aqueous Swarm Petrify, Quicksand, and Vampire bats that anything actually happened.

Planar Shift, no smooth transition.

Heal Servant: I can't tell if im healing my pet!

Ice Storm the ice growing on the monster was cool why was it removed? Earthquake makes sense. 

Shattered Earth, does anything Happen? 

Why do NPC's use all of our old spell effects? Why not give them new effects and let us keep our old ones?

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Old 08-01-2010, 07:31 PM   #94
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The quality of the new wizard effects is absolute trash. Normally I expect to hear the 'could you do better' approach, but yes, I absolutely and positively could.

I was thrilled when I finally learned Glacial Wind -- THAT is one beautiful spell, icicles raining down. I'd cast it just to marvel at it. I loved the way Immolation would converge on enemies with a screen-shaking, fiery BOOM. Same with Solar Flare, except as applies to electricity.

The new spell effects convey NO sense of power, NO sense of impact. They are ugly and bland. I thought it was stupid that all the single target mage stuns used that animation of the hammer flying through the air and exploding on impact: Be careful what you wish for, I guess. Now Magma Chamber is a few pale cylinders with a motion tween. None of the heat spells look hot. There was absolutely no effort put into these effects.

I had my account set to roll over to an annual billing cycle, figuring I was loving the game and was in it for the long hall.

Unfortunately, I play mages in these games because I love obliterating enemies in flashy displays of power. These new effects are SO BAD that they /actually make the game less fun/. It's garbage, so I backed out of the annual sub and returned my next cycle to one month, where it will probably stay until I get sick of this trash and quit for a game with better mages.

My suggestion? Not the most efficient, but if I was in charge I would say start this revamp over -- do it right, or DON'T DO IT AT ALL.

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Old 08-01-2010, 08:27 PM   #95
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[email protected] wrote:

Demonstration of FaithWas: Blue shields surrounded the target then spun faster and faster until they disappeared inside the target. The target's skin turned a shiny blue color, to show they were covered.Now: You duck and cover your head like a wimp and then a golden aura/bubble/shield surrounds the target before shrinking down and solidifying. The bubble itself is too small, it ends up "inside" my body as a Barbarian, looks fine on Elves.Upgrades: Flashiness and number of pulses of the shield.

Comments: Major upgrade. Very happy with this. Make the bubble bigger so it doesn't get swallowed by large bodies in platemail. We paladins are known to be like that.

So let me get this right. A ward with an animation that makes us crouch/cower and cover our heads with our hands, that's a "major upgrade" that you're very happy with?

I can pretty much assure you, if that's the case, you're in a minority (and may actually be the only Paladin who thinks this is an improvement).

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Old 08-01-2010, 10:54 PM   #96
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[email protected] wrote:

[email protected] wrote:

Demonstration of FaithWas: Blue shields surrounded the target then spun faster and faster until they disappeared inside the target. The target's skin turned a shiny blue color, to show they were covered.Now: You duck and cover your head like a wimp and then a golden aura/bubble/shield surrounds the target before shrinking down and solidifying. The bubble itself is too small, it ends up "inside" my body as a Barbarian, looks fine on Elves.Upgrades: Flashiness and number of pulses of the shield.

Comments: Major upgrade. Very happy with this. Make the bubble bigger so it doesn't get swallowed by large bodies in platemail. We paladins are known to be like that.

So let me get this right. A ward with an animation that makes us crouch/cower and cover our heads with our hands, that's a "major upgrade" that you're very happy with?

I can pretty much assure you, if that's the case, you're in a minority (and may actually be the only Paladin who thinks this is an improvement).

The spell effect is a major improvement. The casting animation is already confirmed as a bug in this thread. It is obviously going to be fixed.

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Old 08-02-2010, 12:02 AM   #97
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I actually like the fact that animations and spell effects are going to get more complex with better-quality spells.  That's intuitive, I think.  I wouldn't expect a level 1 wizard's spell-casting to look the same as a level 90's.  Good change, in my book.  Hopefully, some of the bugs and some of the animations will get fixed (the crouching fighters have got to go!) but the concept of increasingly complex animations/spell effects is great!

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Old 08-02-2010, 12:11 AM   #98
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[email protected] Bazaar wrote:

Why do I feel like I went from watching a bluray on an HD TV down to a betamax on a 12 inch black and white TV?

If this goes live...I am out...for good.

You don't take a >5 year old game with amazing graphics and do this to the people who stuck with you through those years.

If you want to make a new game that will attract many new players who want something that EQ2 isn't, then make one...quit messing up this game.

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Old 08-02-2010, 04:51 AM   #99
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Just tested my warlock on testcopy.Tbh I couldnt see much diffrence in the spell, and by that I ment they all pretty much looked the same.Dont get me wrong, I can see they arnt what they are on LIVE, but on Test they seems to share the same green. I couldnt see or tell if I was doing this spell or that spell.

Not impressed.All I remember now after loggin out was some green beams, and tiny cracks in the floor with rocks coming up.

This needs alot more work.

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Old 08-02-2010, 08:35 AM   #100
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My reaction/criticisms:

Druids have the best effects of the healers. I love the fact that there are some autumn leaves thrown in here and there, instead of verdant green ones all the time.

Underwhelmed with Starnova and Thunderbolt. I like the sun over our head, but miss the crashdown like everyone else.

Liking Tempest and Death Swarm better than the old effects. Death Swarm was just a gas cloud before, now it's bugs!

Favor of the Phoenix and Spirit Guide are great now, not too keen on the chalice for the Clerics though.

Karana's Hold effect is an awesome change, Snare should be more like the effect of Ranger's Thorny Trap after it gets set off.

I like the wispy spirits for the new Mystic feet effects.

The magic runes are being used waaaaay too much for all the classes that cast spells.

AA abilities need graphics changes too.

Ranger's Storm and Streams of Arrows is win!

Liking the effect for setting the Thorny Trap, now can we get rid of the ugly trap itself? Maybe use a maintained graphic of the old Fury casting ring instead?

Going stealth and invis looks alot cooler now.

Troub buffs look great. Especially now that the flute is being used.

Mezz is a bit underwhelming. Something over head to flag a mezzed mob would be nice.

Blink looks really nice.

The maintained psy effect for Charm was a cool idea!

Not liking the Warlock's grean beam thing for their primary nuke. It just doesn't fit.

Cataclysm looks cheezy.

I like the acid splash effect on the mobs for the Warlocks.

Cleric reactive triggers is underwhelming.

Necro's offensive spells are the worst effects so far.

Like Ice Spears for Wizzy, but Solar Flare looks kinda dumb.

The new floor graphic for clerics don't really fit the class aesthetically. A square with runes for Temp, and the star with runes for an Inqy?...

I'm liking the over head tribal runes for the Mystic.

Liking the hand effects when casting.

Those are what really stand out to me of the classes I have seen so far.

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Old 08-02-2010, 08:44 AM   #101
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Gold for paladin spells is bad. Blue fire was the way to go and it should have been kept as the theme.

I'm not thrilled with the wizard spell animations now. have not tested my other classes.

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Old 08-02-2010, 12:58 PM   #102
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I almost blinded myself with the Call to Guild Hall.

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Old 08-02-2010, 12:59 PM   #103
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I play an Illusionist and personally, I really like the new particle effects!  I'm so happy they got rid of the "hula hoop" effect from the breeze spell!  One thing I'd like to suggest however, one of my main pet peeves is when players accidentally break mez, because they are unaware that a mob has been mezzed.  Since you guys are changing the particle effects anyway, I really, really think it would be a good idea to make a mezzed mob more "noticable".   Maybe you could even put the "hula hoop" effect around a mezzed mob, so there will be no question as to which mob is under the mez effect.  Just a suggestion, but I'm sure all Enchanters would apprecitate anything you guys could do to ensure that out mez is not constantly being broken, thank you!

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Old 08-02-2010, 01:09 PM   #104
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[email protected] wrote:

[email protected] wrote:

Demonstration of FaithWas: Blue shields surrounded the target then spun faster and faster until they disappeared inside the target. The target's skin turned a shiny blue color, to show they were covered.Now: You duck and cover your head like a wimp and then a golden aura/bubble/shield surrounds the target before shrinking down and solidifying. The bubble itself is too small, it ends up "inside" my body as a Barbarian, looks fine on Elves.Upgrades: Flashiness and number of pulses of the shield.

Comments: Major upgrade. Very happy with this. Make the bubble bigger so it doesn't get swallowed by large bodies in platemail. We paladins are known to be like that.

So let me get this right. A ward with an animation that makes us crouch/cower and cover our heads with our hands, that's a "major upgrade" that you're very happy with?

I can pretty much assure you, if that's the case, you're in a minority (and may actually be the only Paladin who thinks this is an improvement).

+1 Sounds like the animation used for SK blessings. Never liked that animation, too verbose and distracting, but the spell effects were great.

I originally thought they were trying to tone down the animations and effects to be more effective in raid situations. Wrong, they're changing for the sake of change.

There are a few effects I like, the Fury heal I've seen is great. Some of the changes for SK and Pal are ok, (not good or great), many are terrible and are actually more distracting then the originals.

The jolly roger that fires for many of the sk taps has got to go.

A white flash of light for stealth? /boggle

I'd prefer the Pal effects to be silver based not gold. The gold actually has a sickly yellow cast to it.

Between the SOGA default and these changes are they marketing this to the Asian market? I thought the Asian market got their own build?

For the classes I play this revamp is definitely a loser. I'll wait and see what gets released but I am really disappointed.

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Old 08-02-2010, 02:16 PM   #105
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I took a look at the Warden effects this weekend. Most were ok, very toned down. I don't mind not having flashy effects as a healer, so that's ok with me.

The only thing I really don't like is that circle of 4 glowing runes that hovers around your feet while casting. I'd love an option to turn that part off -- it looked the same for pretty much every spell I saw it on, and it's just in the way.

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Old 08-02-2010, 02:33 PM   #106
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I copied my necromancer to Test Copy this weekend, and had a chance to take a look at the new spell effects.  I sent /feedback in-game, but figured that I'd post it here too.  I like the concept of spells becoming more complex as the player increases the quality, but honestly, if this is what spells look like Mastered at level 90, then .... what do level 10 spells look like?  I'm playing a level 90 necromancer, with spells at Expert or Master quality.  I'm rather disappointed by the changes to spell animations and effects.  I like the idea that as I improve my spells, they'll become more complex-looking.  Sadly, that isn't what happens.  Please, forgive me for being so candid, but sometimes you guys don't seem to respond to much else.As I said, the idea of spells gaining visual complexity is good.  In reality though, all of my offensive spells look the same!  Every single attack spell is just my character looking like he's holding a ball by his right hip, and then releasing it into the air.  How about some variety?  Bloodcoil, Soulrot, Lifetap, Pandemic, and Bloodcloud all look exactly the same now.  I don't want to see the same subpar animation over and over.  How could you all think that this is an improvement?  It's horrible.What did you do to Vampire Bats?  It looked so amazing before.  The necromancer pressed his fingertips to his temples and rose off of the ground, calling a flock of vampire bats.  Now?  It looks like he's conjuring something up from the dirt.  You didn't do a new animation, you simply replaced a great animation with a crappy one that already existed.Please, change necromancer animations back to the way that they were before.  Your idea is good, but honestly, your execution is horrible.  Just leave them alone, if this is the best that you can do.Why do my weapons magically return to being sheathed when I begin casting?  It's irritating and distracting.  Please, fix this mess before you send it to the live servers.  This isn't even close to being ready or acceptable.  You haven't added any new animations that I can see.  All you've done is replace existing animations with other existing animations (that suck) and replaced spell effects with WoW-ish spell effects.  It looks to me like you guys are trying to copy WoW, with the changes to the UI and now these spell effects.

edited to correct a spelling error

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Old 08-02-2010, 07:21 PM   #107
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Just tested my conjy 90 with expert/master. All nice looking spells are gone SMILEY

Like my wiz, all spells looks bland. Shattered earth is dead, no more rain of stones with big earthquake ...

I feel upset about this new spell system, every time I copy a new char, I'm very disappointed about the new effects.

We NEED an option to keep the old system.

Could one of the devs come to this post and stop to keep us inform about this issue ?

Thanks a lot in advance.

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Old 08-02-2010, 07:30 PM   #108
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While I do agree the old spell system was a case study for epileptic seizures in game. You need to create a few marquee spells lines for each class that feel SOLID and class defining. With casters defintely having more paticle effects then melee classes who should have better animations.  

Case in point the old warlock skeletal hand was good. The old ghostly chains for the casters root was good.

For instance lets choose a class say WIZARDHe should have a giant ICE comet spell.Where he summons a growing ball of ice above him that shoots across the screen at the target in a massive explosion. of ice.He should have a spell that summons a rain of icicles that fall onto the target with an efect of icicles sticking out of the target and the ground around the target.

Wizards should be able to Encase thier target in ICE.Or have their target feet encased in ice when they root them.

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Old 08-02-2010, 07:38 PM   #109
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For classes like Illusionists and Coercers, it will be very hard to develop any kind of detailed particle effects because of how often they cast and how quickly the spell actually goes through.

My suggestion is simple.. every one of their 5 or so primary spells should place a symbol in front of their character for a decent duration; 5 seconds should work. It should be accompanied by a blast or a beam originating from that symbol.

Chaining all 5 of their spells together should result in 5 symbols in front of their character and a barrage of different colored particles coming from it.

While some flair is important for the really important spells, I think creativity outweighs it. The particles themselves don't need to be absolutely incredible as long as they are presented in a creative way. So far, I've seen more of that with the old particles.

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Old 08-02-2010, 07:57 PM   #110
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These effects will lose subscribers. I've always played DDO since release and considered its engine to be primitive compared to EQ2. However the majority of these new animations make DDO's decidedly low tech ones look absolutely awesome by comparison.

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Old 08-02-2010, 08:00 PM   #111
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Maergoth wrote:

For classes like Illusionists and Coercers, it will be very hard to develop any kind of detailed particle effects because of how often they cast and how quickly the spell actually goes through.

My suggestion is simple.. every one of their 5 or so primary spells should place a symbol in front of their character for a decent duration; 5 seconds should work. It should be accompanied by a blast or a beam originating from that symbol.

Chaining all 5 of their spells together should result in 5 symbols in front of their character and a barrage of different colored particles coming from it.

While some flair is important for the really important spells, I think creativity outweighs it. The particles themselves don't need to be absolutely incredible as long as they are presented in a creative way. So far, I've seen more of that with the old particles.

As i said before i dont think every spell needs to be this sollid form massivly detailed giant explosion, but marquee spells should be.

For illusionist I would say make thier mezz should be noticeable. Maybe a particle effect of a swirling vortex around thier heads with an animation of the character swaying side to side if humanoid.

Prismatic shower should look like fireworks firing from an illusionists hands.

I would love to see enchanters stun turn into a blue/white globe surrounding their target with runes circling the globe. Kinda like an enlarged version of a brawlers claymore fist weapon.

I would love to see more detailed animations like wards summoning a transparent wall in front of a character and as the ward loses amount it cracks and crumbles and falls apart.

I prefer the sollid particle effects and animations to the sparkle explosions many spells had prior. eq2 was always considered on eof the best MMOs for realistic graphics and these graphics took a step back. Not something you should see from an MMO 6 years old with a recent shader 3.0 update.

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Old 08-03-2010, 04:14 AM   #112
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 checked out a handful of expert/master quality T8 & T9 spells today, some thoughts:

NecromancerVampire Bats - I loved the old animation of the caster rising into air and the huge swarm of bats rushing the target. The new animation is very dull in comparison.

Mortality Mark - The spell effect looks fine, but it makes the caster cringe, which is a bit weird.

Lich - The new effect for this looks great, but you can only see it if the illusion is disabled. Otherwise the animation starts as you cast it, but stops as soon as the character model changes. (This is actually an issue for every buff that changes a character's model mid-cast, it just sucks to see it happen to such a cool looking one.)

Transfer Life - Looks a bit too "holy" and doesn't really fit the spell, in my opinion. I always loved EQOA's animation for its equivalent of this spell. A cloud of blood surrounds the target as it sort of pulses out of the necromancer. You can see it pretty well in this video, from 1:00 onward:http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0G5GswJh2hoIf a similar animation exists (or is created) in this game, it would be all sorts of awesome if that was used for Transfer Life instead, perhaps Necrotic Reconstruction as well.

And while I like the swirly green skull effect, I think the nukes/dots could use more variety. At least change the colors, Soulrot could be black and Lifetap could be red or something.

DirgeLooks good, I really like the variety of musical animations for buffs and such.

FurySnare - Hard to see on the target.

Starnova - I agree with those who said the new graphic is underwhelming and weightless. I prefer the old version, where the fireballs smash down on the target.Hibernation - I'm happy that this no longer causes broccoli to sprout from my head. I do think a bear graphic would be better though, or at least a cat if you don't want to steal the Mystics' animal.

Everything else looks good. I love the new nukes (Starnova aside) and the new leaves. I like the additional animal-related graphics, like Ferocity of the Eel creating a little eel silhouette as it's cast, instead of everything being a lion or a wolf (although it is a bit strange that Peerless Predator has a housecat silhouette instead of a lion).

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Old 08-03-2010, 04:56 AM   #113
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Sadly we won't have the option to keep the old system.

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Old 08-03-2010, 06:00 AM   #114
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The new particles effects are completely craps, if we dont have a option to get the old one, i quit EQ2.

They look like WoW, if i want wow particles i go play to WoW.

Clones are always worst than original.

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Old 08-03-2010, 07:02 AM   #115
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Maergoth wrote:

For classes like Illusionists and Coercers, it will be very hard to develop any kind of detailed particle effects because of how often they cast and how quickly the spell actually goes through.

My suggestion is simple.. every one of their 5 or so primary spells should place a symbol in front of their character for a decent duration; 5 seconds should work. It should be accompanied by a blast or a beam originating from that symbol.

Chaining all 5 of their spells together should result in 5 symbols in front of their character and a barrage of different colored particles coming from it.

While some flair is important for the really important spells, I think creativity outweighs it. The particles themselves don't need to be absolutely incredible as long as they are presented in a creative way. So far, I've seen more of that with the old particles.

Incorrect.   I have played a coercer now for 4 years and just because we cast fast doesnt mean the effect should be less than interesting.

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Old 08-03-2010, 11:11 AM   #116
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I haven't read the topic and will do that later and perhaps edit my post if needed.

I copied my bunch of healers, checked all my Test chars and am underwhelmed by this change.

One of the main features I loved in EQ2 was the beautiful particles effects when I cast my spells (and I play mostly mages and healers, with necro and templar at the top). Sickly red for fears, sickly green for warlocks, beautifull particles effects at my feet, learing skulls, shields encompassing the player when a healer buff is cast, flickering animals around my defiler, hordes of fantasmal undeads rising from mother earth to do my biding... All that was the core of the game for me. It's the first thing I looked at when I started playing 5 years ago.

Where are all those features now? Gone. Ok, it will be great for those that raid and need performance, or on some laggy dungeons. Great. And what about the pleasure of playing?

The only nice spells that exists now are for rangers because we see the arrows now. And only on some spells like storms of arrows. All the rest is cartoonish runes all over the place. It's plain ridiculous. I Hate it with a passion. When I first tried my necro I wept for all the evil beauty that was lost. Now I feel stupid with those ridiculous black runes hovering around my butt like some sick cartoon peacock. I never adventured much but I know I'll never adventure anymore if I have too look at those "spell effects", if I keep playing which is becoming unsure.

All over those years, I loved my spell effects. Even when they where crashing my computer due to lag, just because they're beautiful. What are you doing there? Working on DCUO spells? All those flashy colours, solid black, red circles, solid white lightning are just pure cartoonish spells. Between that, the UI and SC everywhere, I have the impression I'm playing Free Realms... Time to switch back to EQ if you don't destroy it in the same way or move on.

If you really want to leave those stupid cartoonish things, sorry, "beautiful spell effects" on, PLEASE GIVE US A SWITCH LIKE WITH SOGA MODELS! So those that want performance or even like those can use them but don't ram this down our throat !

EDIT 1 : I see Xelgad reporting from the art team :

Xelgad wrote:

The purpose for these changes are primarily to optimize and individualize as many spells as possible so there will be more uniqueness to each class.   Also we would like for more players to have the ability to keep the spell FX active during group and raid content and still be able to tell what is going on.(...)

When you start a new character you will have Apprentice spells.  This spell tier along with Journeyman will have a beginner level of FX in both size and quantity.  Later when you acquire Adept or Expert versions of the spells the level of FX will increase.  Finally when you acquire Master and Grandmaster versions of the spells you will experience the full FX force of that spell.  (...)Mages, Bards and Priests will see the spell wheel spin while casting and the corresponding Rune will show up when that skill is used.  Attacks will show in front of caster, buffs and debuffs behind the caster and Heals and summons at the casters feet.

On the first point: sorry, I don't feel individualized. I don't have anymore my effect ring under my feet when I cast which was the main individualizing effect I loved. I don't feel either that runes poping over my head in different colours for different classes are individualizing either.

On the second point: I'm glad my main necro is using expert, masters and grandmasters mainly as I feel I can see nearly no effects anymore! I never saw the difference between this high level necro and my test necro with full apprentices either, so it's either not working or the difference is so small there is nothing to see, and I think the second answer is the best. Sorry Art Team

Third point : so I see a hideous leering bright green skull in front of me when I attack or a peackock black tail around my butt when I debuff and black cartoon of nothingness at my feet if I heal or summon... It makes some sence but it's... hideous. Sorry Art Team.

EDIT 2: I see the spell sounds changed too. I'll suggest adding the sounds to the opt off button if you do one. I had my sound off when I checked and I'll have to check all my classes back to see what changed.

EDIT 3:

Guy De Alsace wrote:

These effects will lose subscribers. I've always played DDO since release and considered its engine to be primitive compared to EQ2. However the majority of these new animations make DDO's decidedly low tech ones look absolutely awesome by comparison.

Yeah, what he said

Sorry Art Team

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Old 08-03-2010, 12:01 PM   #117
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I hopped onto test copy to show someone the green cackling skull and crossbones that was pretty much my only real dislike with necromancer spells only to find, as far as I can tell, it's gone.  Neither of us see it!

I don't know who made the change, but thank you.  To me, it's made all the difference with my spells.  I actually like them now that the skull isn't there irritating me.  (;

Thank you!

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Old 08-03-2010, 12:21 PM   #118
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checking my necromancer...

I still see the ooooh-so-great skull everywhere.

Here's a screen from Soulrot IX (Master)

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Old 08-03-2010, 12:23 PM   #119
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Weird.  I was on high quality and couldn't see it, neither could my friend...  Test or Test Copy?

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Old 08-03-2010, 12:25 PM   #120
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I really wish we could keep the same spell effect for a few of my current spells.

Flames of Velious currently has one of the coolest effects in game, the changes make it something else entirely.

Glacial Wind is also one of my favorites, but now it looks like an EQ1 rain spell effect.

Honestly, most of the effects seem to be taking a step backwards and a lot of them remind me of EQ1.  I always though the EQ2 effects were a lot more polished, and this just seems to be a step in the wrong direction.

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