Monk = Ninja or No?

Ygg_Vafhun · 01-08-2005, 09:44 AM

I dont know about you guys, but Ive always felt the Monk was more of the Ninja role class of the game ,along with the brigand and assassin.The reason i think of that is the martial arts, the ninja practiced the art of ninjitsu, ( correct me if im wrong ) and employed many methods of seath, assassination, espionge, theivery and scouting. Monk, Brigand and Assassin all employ these skills, but only the monk use martial arts.I just have a gripe about the weapon choice for the monk, mostly being limited to only blunt staved weapons. I always thought, being so closey tied to a Ninja, we would be allowed to use sharp or small slicing weapons. Sai's, daggers, kuri's etc. Also, most of the higher level monk armors, 30+ look ninja-like. While I dont think a monk should be exactly like the real life ninja, it would be a nice change of pace from the traditional DnD role.But honestly, the lack of armor and weapon choices drove me to play a berserker more then my monk. Always had a fetish for collecting weapons and armor...Vainqueur 30monkKashama 24berserker

Bad_Mojo · 01-08-2005, 09:51 AM

Ygg_Vafhundr wrote:
I dont know about you guys, but Ive always felt the Monk was more of the Ninja role class of the game ,along with the brigand and assassin.

The reason i think of that is the martial arts, the ninja practiced the art of ninjitsu, ( correct me if im wrong ) and employed many methods of seath, assassination, espionge, theivery and scouting. Monk, Brigand and Assassin all employ these skills, but only the monk use martial arts.

I just have a gripe about the weapon choice for the monk, mostly being limited to only blunt staved weapons. I always thought, being so closey tied to a Ninja, we would be allowed to use sharp or small slicing weapons. Sai's, daggers, kuri's etc.

Also, most of the higher level monk armors, 30+ look ninja-like. While I dont think a monk should be exactly like the real life ninja, it would be a nice change of pace from the traditional DnD role.

But honestly, the lack of armor and weapon choices drove me to play a berserker more then my monk. Always had a fetish for collecting weapons and armor...

Vainqueur 30monk
Kashama 24berserker

Actually, I think the monks in EQ2 are the more historical, zen filled, peace before violence type of monk (think shaolin). Talking to the monk NPC's in Elddar grove only seems to reinforce that mindset. Honestly, I don't think the developer's had any intent to have 'ninja' anything in the game... EQ2 is classic sword and sorcery fantasy, not ninja-to and wu-jen fantasy.

Ygg_Vafhun · 01-08-2005, 10:11 AM

Hmm, read up about the Wu-jen fantasy from DnD, very very intresting. I can see the difference now, still hard to make a monk class without a tie to eastern oriental fantasy, but understand the style.

Sant · 01-08-2005, 10:13 AM

Well of course you can roleplay them as ninja's to your hearts content but I dont really think monks are ninjas.

First of all most ninja lore gives them an evil taint, I think assassin is a closer parallel even though

special forces mercenary seems to be the ninja forta. they were covert ops troops that worked for the highest bidder

from what I have read.

Monks are individuals that have dedicated there lives to the perfection of the physical and the spiritual.

Through the training of the body they hope to gain a better understanding of the spirit. Their motives are

for the good of mankind not for the enrichment of a clan.

Cora · 01-08-2005, 11:13 AM

I'm the monk from kill bill 2, with furry boobies.

Reikets · 01-08-2005, 03:32 PM

^ Haha,

andor · 01-08-2005, 04:34 PM

Monks and Ninja are two entirely different things. Ninja don't exist in EQII - no class really mirrors the position Ninja had in Japanese myth. Monks are somewhat clumsily added to EQ2 (and EQ for that matter) because monks aside, the game is pretty standard western fantasy. Monks really don't fit into that very well, and it kind-of shows in the game implementation too. For instance, the Japanese name of the monk master in Queynos - and yet there arn't any other Japanese names ANYWHERE.

Huflu · 01-08-2005, 08:46 PM

Monks seem to fit into everquest about as well as they fit into dungeons and dragons. But they seem to found their way into each respective setting for one reason and one reason only....

We dorks think they're cool.

Jamboman · 01-09-2005, 10:38 AM

well as has been said a few times already, i think i'll do a short and sweet version myself.

Ninja = Assasin - paid hitman, evil in nature and with stealth skills.

Shaolin Monk = Monk - peacfull untill attacked, good in nature and calm.

assasin is the closest to a ninja due to its stealth skills etc and the way they hunt. a classic ninja would never have used martial arts, because they didnt need to, they could kill a man from distance or before he even reacted, rather like a modern day sniper.

SeTSwi · 01-09-2005, 11:57 AM

Jambomango wrote:

a classic ninja would never have used martial arts, because they didnt need to, they could kill a man from distance or before he even reacted, rather like a modern day sniper.

Sorry, but what?

Ninjas were masters at deception, not ranged. Though, depending on the wording, I might agree on the 'befre he even reacted' part, they are definitely not the modern day sniper.

Kwonryu_DragonFi · 01-09-2005, 04:51 PM

I recommend you all to watch the old movie : Shaolin VS Ninja

Monks > Ninja

But then again, add Pirate to the mix and it gets more complicated.

We have all read about the constant bickering between Pirate and Ninja.

Troja · 01-09-2005, 06:08 PM

Bad_Mojo:"Actually, I think the monks in EQ2 are the more historical, zen filled, peace before violence type of monk (think shaolin). Talking to the monk NPC's in Elddar grove only seems to reinforce that mindset. Honestly, I don't think the developer's had any intent to have 'ninja' anything in the game... EQ2 is classic sword and sorcery fantasy, not ninja-to and wu-jen fantasy."AMEN!!!Totaly agree!Everytime someone says "ninja" i think they are thinking of FFXI (horrid game). Besides "ninja" really wouldn't fit in.

01-08-2005, 09:51 AM	#2
Bad_Mojo Loremaster Join Date: Nov 2004 Location: Colorado Posts: 341	Ygg_Vafhundr wrote: I dont know about you guys, but Ive always felt the Monk was more of the Ninja role class of the game ,along with the brigand and assassin. The reason i think of that is the martial arts, the ninja practiced the art of ninjitsu, ( correct me if im wrong ) and employed many methods of seath, assassination, espionge, theivery and scouting. Monk, Brigand and Assassin all employ these skills, but only the monk use martial arts. I just have a gripe about the weapon choice for the monk, mostly being limited to only blunt staved weapons. I always thought, being so closey tied to a Ninja, we would be allowed to use sharp or small slicing weapons. Sai's, daggers, kuri's etc. Also, most of the higher level monk armors, 30+ look ninja-like. While I dont think a monk should be exactly like the real life ninja, it would be a nice change of pace from the traditional DnD role. But honestly, the lack of armor and weapon choices drove me to play a berserker more then my monk. Always had a fetish for collecting weapons and armor... Vainqueur 30monk Kashama 24berserker Actually, I think the monks in EQ2 are the more historical, zen filled, peace before violence type of monk (think shaolin). Talking to the monk NPC's in Elddar grove only seems to reinforce that mindset. Honestly, I don't think the developer's had any intent to have 'ninja' anything in the game... EQ2 is classic sword and sorcery fantasy, not ninja-to and wu-jen fantasy.

01-08-2005, 08:46 PM	#8
Huflu General Join Date: Nov 2004 Posts: 25	Monks seem to fit into everquest about as well as they fit into dungeons and dragons. But they seem to found their way into each respective setting for one reason and one reason only.... We dorks think they're cool. __________________

01-09-2005, 10:38 AM	#9
Jamboman Join Date: Nov 2004 Posts: 14	well as has been said a few times already, i think i'll do a short and sweet version myself. Ninja = Assasin - paid hitman, evil in nature and with stealth skills. Shaolin Monk = Monk - peacfull untill attacked, good in nature and calm. assasin is the closest to a ninja due to its stealth skills etc and the way they hunt. a classic ninja would never have used martial arts, because they didnt need to, they could kill a man from distance or before he even reacted, rather like a modern day sniper. __________________ Etal - Fury. Darathar Server Siilath - Bruiser. Hatharius - Berzerker. Runnyeye Server

01-09-2005, 11:57 AM	#10
SeTSwi Join Date: Nov 2004 Posts: 155	Jambomango wrote: a classic ninja would never have used martial arts, because they didnt need to, they could kill a man from distance or before he even reacted, rather like a modern day sniper. Sorry, but what? Ninjas were masters at deception, not ranged. Though, depending on the wording, I might agree on the 'befre he even reacted' part, they are definitely not the modern day sniper.

01-09-2005, 06:08 PM	#12
Troja Join Date: Nov 2004 Posts: 77	Bad_Mojo:"Actually, I think the monks in EQ2 are the more historical, zen filled, peace before violence type of monk (think shaolin). Talking to the monk NPC's in Elddar grove only seems to reinforce that mindset. Honestly, I don't think the developer's had any intent to have 'ninja' anything in the game... EQ2 is classic sword and sorcery fantasy, not ninja-to and wu-jen fantasy."AMEN!!!Totaly agree!Everytime someone says "ninja" i think they are thinking of FFXI (horrid game). Besides "ninja" really wouldn't fit in. __________________ ---------------------------------------------------------------- "Imagination is knowledge in a different form."

01-08-2005, 09:44 AM	#1
Ygg_Vafhun General Join Date: Nov 2004 Posts: 4	I dont know about you guys, but Ive always felt the Monk was more of the Ninja role class of the game ,along with the brigand and assassin.The reason i think of that is the martial arts, the ninja practiced the art of ninjitsu, ( correct me if im wrong ) and employed many methods of seath, assassination, espionge, theivery and scouting. Monk, Brigand and Assassin all employ these skills, but only the monk use martial arts.I just have a gripe about the weapon choice for the monk, mostly being limited to only blunt staved weapons. I always thought, being so closey tied to a Ninja, we would be allowed to use sharp or small slicing weapons. Sai's, daggers, kuri's etc. Also, most of the higher level monk armors, 30+ look ninja-like. While I dont think a monk should be exactly like the real life ninja, it would be a nice change of pace from the traditional DnD role.But honestly, the lack of armor and weapon choices drove me to play a berserker more then my monk. Always had a fetish for collecting weapons and armor...Vainqueur 30monkKashama 24berserker

01-08-2005, 10:11 AM	#3
Ygg_Vafhun General Join Date: Nov 2004 Posts: 4	Hmm, read up about the Wu-jen fantasy from DnD, very very intresting. I can see the difference now, still hard to make a monk class without a tie to eastern oriental fantasy, but understand the style.

01-08-2005, 10:13 AM	#4
Sant Join Date: Nov 2004 Posts: 174	Well of course you can roleplay them as ninja's to your hearts content but I dont really think monks are ninjas. First of all most ninja lore gives them an evil taint, I think assassin is a closer parallel even though special forces mercenary seems to be the ninja forta. they were covert ops troops that worked for the highest bidder from what I have read. Monks are individuals that have dedicated there lives to the perfection of the physical and the spiritual. Through the training of the body they hope to gain a better understanding of the spirit. Their motives are for the good of mankind not for the enrichment of a clan.

01-08-2005, 11:13 AM	#5
Cora Join Date: Nov 2004 Posts: 244	I'm the monk from kill bill 2, with furry boobies.

01-08-2005, 03:32 PM	#6
Reikets Join Date: Jan 2005 Posts: 4	^ Haha,

01-08-2005, 04:34 PM	#7
andor Join Date: Nov 2004 Posts: 13	Monks and Ninja are two entirely different things. Ninja don't exist in EQII - no class really mirrors the position Ninja had in Japanese myth. Monks are somewhat clumsily added to EQ2 (and EQ for that matter) because monks aside, the game is pretty standard western fantasy. Monks really don't fit into that very well, and it kind-of shows in the game implementation too. For instance, the Japanese name of the monk master in Queynos - and yet there arn't any other Japanese names ANYWHERE.

01-09-2005, 04:51 PM	#11
Kwonryu_DragonFi Join Date: Nov 2004 Posts: 183	I recommend you all to watch the old movie : Shaolin VS Ninja Monks > Ninja But then again, add Pirate to the mix and it gets more complicated. We have all read about the constant bickering between Pirate and Ninja.