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Old 08-09-2012, 09:19 AM   #61

Join Date: May 2011
Posts: 335

46.) Incorporate trophies of player characters' heads mounted on a plaque as a RARE body drop, with full particle effects/clothing retained.

consolidating new complications...

Seliri wrote in "Why GU#64 Doesn't Offer a Robust PvP Experience":

Lol @ how PvE/PvP integration was attempted, so terrible...

Phuaearoeeoaurking with crit chance rates, potency capped higher than CB, MA/flurry/DPS caps FAR too low...

What has it beeen, 3 or 4 yrs with 100+ crit & now estimating focus/spike damage is just urinating in the wind unless you have mage odds.

Shouldve just adjusted toughness' strength with LIGHT scaling on MA/flurry (auto attack damage is vital for many classes & obviously SOE's budget is too feeble to focus on adjusting melee CA damage).

"In PvP" for PvE gear should have stats reduced to old DoV PvP gear status, HP at least...PvE procs should work in PvP, but they should be obtainable in pvp, even if as rare drops or rare drop quests requiring a variety of class/zone/hot zone specific kills.

Now the fastest way to compete is PvE raiding, then the long haul battlegrounds/warfield grind...Warfields are still so mundane an objective they really shouldve never been implemented with as dry a premise behind them...

Body drop tokens also discourage open world pvp & writs should return, as the gain is just so miniscule when split between large #s that battlegrounds becomes the obvious fastest route amidst a sprinkled warfields round, which is truly ignorant & unacceptable for promoting open world PvP.

Cleric/Shaman group heals shouldntah been nerfed, neither Doom Judgement, crowd control for the 2nd time, Sanctuary, or some of the other flippantly undermined goodies.

That just further reduces player morale & pushes toward a loss of individuality, tactics, & veteran favor.

Aaaand also lm/-o @ scaling 30-89 "level agnostic" battlegrounds. Absolutely unacceptable...

If match queues & #s are so low, it's a sign that even inadvertent/passive attempts to undermine level locking wont revive poor attendance.

Rewarding the best pvp pieces for all toons if a 1st-3rd competitor in battlegrounds or with CLASSIC PVP ranks remains the more respectable attempt at stimulus.

Removing player choice to enjoy success in lower level locking tiers, those revered for less overpowered gimmicks & less time until competency is adopted, it only breeds disagreement & abandonment.

See: further population decline when T2-T3 LVL locking niches were erased with wrongful imposition of city pvp rules in T2 zones.

Lowbie PvP has already been seriously bastardized & destroyed with the annihilation of spike DPS as toughness wrongly remains in place on lowbie PvP gear when originally designed for crit bonus introduced in sentinel's fate -- now still with its life being leeched through terrible PvE/PvP integration & damage balance.

Plus all the other stuff in my 45 PoAfEP (dat siggy link).

Of course, these 3 threads are appropriate & well founded.

In this thread, post Ideas that would increase open world pvp on nagafen.

Seriously what will it take...

Discuss GU #64 PvP Abilities/AA Changes

On the plus side, token cost for PvP gear is high, which means there will be some content longevity out of this for the diehards...but the T1-T2 prices are ridiculous, especially being worse than old DoV PvP gear...

Seliri wrote in "Blood Symphony & Blood Ritual Nerf Must be Reverted...":

Bunji wrote:


The effects of Blood Ritual and Blood Symphony have been reduced in effectiveness in PVP combat.

Mage Damage has been reduced in PVP combat.

The effectiveness of Lethality and Toughness has been increased.

The 2 most popular jewelry items containing these buffs were like, one of the only unique & beneficial accessories from past content that were useful.

Striving for & acquiring items like these gave & gives strategery to mastering successful PvP planning/itemization & now they're worthless.

They need to be unnerfed.

The fastest route to competency is now T10 raiding & I guess that's a little bland with the nullifying of farming Zarrakon & Gwarthlea in Vasty Deep: Vestigial Cella (or Marks of Manaar in generic Sentinel's Fate content).

[email protected] wrote in "Blood Symphony & Blood Ritual Nerf Must be Reverted...":

TBH the proc nerf was another fools errand just like gear seperation was...procs were never the main issue it was stat inflation/unadjusted blue stats for pvp that was the serious issue...a real pvp dev that actually you know spent years actually on the pvp server would have know this instead of beta buffing to lvl 20 and trying procs and classes out in darklight woods...oppps cats out out of the bag...

There can't remain a healthy expectation for PvP balance with the systematic disabling of melee competency.

|-| EverQuest Next Principles to Abide by (30) |-| True Ks: 40.2K Ds: 3.6K Ratio:11:1 |-| |-| PvP Briefing 101 (Outdated) |-| 45 Points of Awesome-o for PvP! |-|Â*

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Old 09-18-2012, 08:34 PM   #62

Join Date: Apr 2010
Posts: 272

I've been enlisted by the great Gnome of Gnomes for archiving the latest recap on things to do for EQ2 PvP! SMILEY

Seliri wrote:

razu wrote:

SOE gives players pvp hot zones- players farm alts instead

Players kill towers and call out as fast as possible to avoid pvp. I guess SOE made them hit their call to guild hall instead of engaging pvp?

I don't see that all of the problems are with SOE, I see the problem with a player base that has obviously changed since 2006. Saying that it's all Sonys fault and not the players who CHOOSE to take actions other than PVP is very one sided. 

Most negative changes that have been made to PVP is because of the PLAYER POPULATION crying untill SOE caves in and changes it to appeal to the masses. 

Removal of T2 PVP. Why did that get taken out of the game? Oh yeah, because PLAYERS cried and cried untill it was removed. 

I stand by my statement. It is the player base where the true problem lies. If people really wanted to pvp, they would, instead of farming alts and avoiding open world pvp every chance they get. When the pvp hot zones first came out, I personally thought it was going to bring out some open world pvp, instead it brought out a bunch of cheaters who farm alts to get gear and STILL don't attempt to fight other players. 

If BGs were removed from the server, people would leave the server, because as it stands now this PLAYER BASE for the most part does not truly want pvp. This is evident from the actions that PLAYERS take. Alright, I'll rephrase that a little bit, everyone would leave except the true pvpers, which would just be a handful of us, then they would shut the server down from lack of population. 

IF removing BGs would really stimulate pvp then I am all for it, but I honestly do not see that being a fix, because like I said before, the player base is the problem. Nobody makes anyone que up for BGs, that is a choice, when killing ONE person solo gives 25 tokens, 32 in a pvp hot zone. Thank you SOE for attempting to revive open world pvp, it's not your fault that the PLAYER BASE is horrible and chose to farm alts instead. Fix alt farming before BGS are even looked at.

Uhm, the fact remains that solo PvP isn't necessarily the most rewarding given flawed PvE/PvP gear integration & glaring class imbalances with FOTM status.

SOE has NOT adequately promoted world PvP because the GUARANTEE FOR EASY TOKENS is easymode, instant battlegrounds & getting flagged at warfields.

Honestly I don't see the justification for being such an oblivious fanboy in this regard, because the facts & the details are just absolutely against you.

Lol @ ACTING LIKE PvP hot zones were ever going to be the remedy to anything when tokens are divided so drastically when groups engage.

Overland PvP is ambiguous, difficult, demanding of coordination, & the reward isn't guaranteed.

The problem is that GUARANTEED easymode options detract from true dedication to organizing a successful hunt.

You seem to have a problem with the "risk of losing players" if battlegrounds are neutered, when in reality, this isn't an issue.

This is a PvP server, & the community/health of overland PvP takes precedence.

There's honestly no grounds for this pessimism aside from minor vocal posters on the forums.

Overland PvP was rampant & boisterous in the past, & to doubt optimistic hope for its return when bloccades to it are abolished has no place in consciousness.

Sure, run a server vote on the issue, though I doubt SOE "devs/visionaries" would be willing to phrase questions in a fair manner or even run the poll, regardless, i.e. "Considering that many feel a PvP server primarily identifies with a community actively overland PvPing, CHECK which ruleset mods you would approve of..."

And even if some redactions/inclusions weren't supported by the community, they'd need to go forward anyways, because all of the complications I've addressed detract from engagement & the niche of players who pursue PvP. /emphatic_nod

Though I'd agree other ruleset changes are needed before battlegrounds are castrated (on only Tues/Wed, for instance), as PrometheusAfire noted...

1.) NO HEIRLOOM PVP TOKENS (again, reduces content longevity, promotes easymode alt farming [LVL 10s, trade, etc, dumb, etc, blah] -- who cares if correcting this is a 3rd or 4th flip flop, IT'S WRONG, & whoever approved it must confess that)

2.) classic mount runspeeds

3.) leapers/gliders/fliers on Tues/Wed only (or always allowed if altitude capped & FINE TESTING ABSOLUTELY equates their speed to classic ground mount runspeeds -- portals on the ground leading to the higher platform of the Plane of War would negate altitude needs -- altitude caps in the Great Divide could be lifted on Tues/Wed for the flying mount quest)

3a.) pvp should be allowed while flying/gliding/leaping if speed adjustments go forward

4.) crowd control/cures being unnerfed

5.) 30 sec immunity when done zoning/evacuating

6.) no Toughness on lowbie gear

7.) level locking starting at T2

8.) REMOVE city PvP rules in T2 contested zones

9.) classic PvP rank system (with an eventual seasonal leaderboard/reward system w/ GMs investigating abuse/farming)

9a.) the +/- 1 rank fame range ensured casuals would progress through PvP ranks

9b.) the +/-1 rank fame range ensured deep PvP rank progression would actually be a DIFFICULT HUNT

9c.) the +/-1 rank fame range lets players engage without pressure of fame loss at times, which is a staple for engaging without inhibition, a common player desire

10.) ERASE all simplified global travel

10a.) no guild druid/spire/wizard portals or bells

10b.) no quest/zone rewards providing travel to a zone or instance

10c.) no immunity on Antonican/Commonlands/Nektulos docks

10d.) place the otters leading to the Great Divide on a newly created set of Sinking Sands docks, at least 40 sec travel from the normal docks at the classic ground mount runspeed cap.

10e.) no portal from the Great Divide to the Eastern Wastes

10f.) erase guild strategist amenity to replace with track lock of 3 overland targets contested for 3+ minutes

10g.) include forgotten additions as needed, etc...

11.) no mercenaries (auto-poof when engaged in PvP)

12.) a return of overland PvP writ givers [no posters] ONLY

13.) the removal of warfields or giving a flag doubling tokens during their CONSTANT duration AND changing victor rewards to NOT be PvP tokens, but durational flags valuable to all playstyles

14.) entering the dungeon finder/dungeon creator/house directory must take 30 seconds once the queue is approved

15a.) free transfers to Nagafen from the FREEPORT server for TWO WEEKS (no PvP offering was given when F2P 1st launched

15b.) cut in half transfer cost from all servers TO Nagafen

16.) have battlegrounds return you to the zone you were in, & not the battlegrounds hub

17.) battlegrounds tier segments should at least be in blocks of 2 (20-39, 40-59, 60-79, 80-91, 92 [then 92-95])

17a.) it's obvious that disparity in spells/CAs, gear, mythical, & AAs cant be compensated for despite any "balancing" algorithms

18.) battlegrounds on Tues/Wed only

19.) hire me as the janitor closet apprentice gnome developer

I for one, probably won't play EQ2 unless the PvE/PvP integration & damage balance mechanics are adequately revised, & that will also probably never happen.

Seliri wrote:

1.) potency has a higher cap than crit bonus

2.) crit bonus' cap is too low

3.) multi-attack/flurry are capped too low

4.) pve/raid gear didnt get reduced "in pvp" stats to make it equal to old DoV PvP gear (meaning PvEing is the fastest way to PvP competency -- if PvEers fear PvP gear will be too strong compared to PvE gear, then just make PvP gear weaker in its normal state, & stronger in its "In PvP" state)

5.) lethality/toughness are worthless

The "devs/visionaries" seem to have hang-ups about these vital compromises though, as I can't really see them ever having been avid PvPers...

Also, I've modified an older list of urgencies I made, separate from what I see as the simpler list above...

Seliri wrote:

Top 6 "Eventual" to do for EQ2 PvP... :

1.) Choice of rewards per tier for 1st-4th placement in the PvP rank scheme, every 2 months...

1a.) Best item in 1-2 slots, SPECIFIC TO THE TIER YOUR CHAMPION IS IN (i.e. highest LVL 44 Overlord unlocks T5 earrings), unlocked on all characters, PLUS 1 or more other choices from the seasonal rewards list in the 45 PoAfEP in my signature

2.) Choice of rewards, per tier, for 1st-4th placement in Battlegrounds, every 2 months...

2a.) Best item in 1-2 slots, SPECIFIC TO THE TIER YOUR CHAMPION IS IN, unlocked on all characters, PLUS 1 or more other choices from the seasonal rewards list in the 45 PoAfEP in my signature

3.) Difficult, contested x4/x3/x2 raids dropping valuable loot/components...

4.) Redo objectives in PQs/WFs to become unique, scene/task-based, stages of objectives covering a large swathe of an overland zone in public quests & warfields, with sustained rewards/buffs, timer resets or reducers, or rare recipes/trinkets/components, etc...

5.) Multi-region, rare-trinket drops (from Sentinel's Fate instances made contested, for example) & chances at a ultra rare Fabled or Mythical crafted products from these collective trinkets, promoting contested PvP abroad in various settings, without the zerg...

6.) Kills have a chance to drop the player's head on a plaque as a house item (full armor/skin/preferred non-SOGA model type/particle effects preserved).

So 29-30 revised points total! n_n

If you think "SOE listens to the players", the fact is that this "just listening to players" entirely irrelevant because, A, "Do they listen to the actual avid PvPers with experience?", & B, "Do they "listen" in a haphazard manner, wherein they add their own additions or approve their own omissions to the suggestions of experienced players?"

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