STOP EQ2 Racism (kinda) - Page 2

Juggercap · 11-08-2012, 03:51 PM

Nynaeve wrote:

Juggercap wrote:
Nynaeve wrote:
well, I like your comments, but mainly as a tool to increas the threadsize and pull more attention from devs. about your opinions I care not one bit.
Yes. Please devs, come and read this thread where one person wants something and the thread is growing and growing with basically every comment from everyone not the OP being against the OPs idea. Please consider your players and what they want.
That's basically proof that my idea is awesome. I got the same reaction when I demanded that all servers should be switched to f2p. I had like 1000 NO posters. just like now.

Your logic sucks. (So does FTP...even though I'll be there soon since so does this game because of players like you.)

SOE-MOD-02 · 11-08-2012, 03:58 PM

Let's get back on track please. Bickering is not necessary.

crazyeyes321 · 11-08-2012, 05:53 PM

It would be neat to have some of those stats more generic now since the game itself has gone more and more generic statwise. Instead of str, make it str/int/wis/agi. Make the other choice sta. Same with the resist pools, make one for magic resists, the other physical. This would make my newest alt, Bowlooga Wailz, ogre ranger, slightly more viable. Very slightly.

There are a lot of other things Id rather them work on though, to be honest.

Juggercap · 11-08-2012, 05:57 PM

crazyeyes321 wrote:

It would be neat to have some of those stats more generic now since the game itself has gone more and more generic statwise. Instead of str, make it str/int/wis/agi. Make the other choice sta. Same with the resist pools, make one for magic resists, the other physical. This would make my newest alt, Bowlooga Wailz, ogre ranger, slightly more viable. Very slightly.
There are a lot of other things Id rather them work on though, to be honest.

The game is more generic so lets make it even more generic. This is exactly why I hate the idea.

General_Info · 11-08-2012, 10:59 PM

crazyeyes321 wrote:

Same with the resist pools, make one for magic resists, the other physical. This would make my newest alt, Bowlooga Wailz, ogre ranger, slightly more viable. Very slightly.

you do realize that when you get geared at 92 nox, arcane, elemental are all at cap of 75% resist right? this would only benifit you while leveling.

diversity is what makes this game great. if you want changes to the system then ask for more unqiue choices not less.

zehly · 11-09-2012, 12:03 AM

I don't let Gnomes heal me. It's a gno-gno.

Malleria · 11-09-2012, 12:22 AM

Nynaeve wrote:

In real life, most women are weaker than men, and have no place at the frontlines.

Your first statement is a fact, your second is an opinion. Learn the difference, then you can argue with the grown ups.

Vlahkmaak · 11-09-2012, 01:08 AM

Race serves no purpose in this game beyond cosmetics. It is not relevant to anything except your viewing pleasure. One can be an equally well played gnome, halfling, troll or ogre tank skill levels being equal: race does not matter in the slightest bit. No racial trait will make one a better tank, healer, mage, or scout. Every race can play equally well at end game. Some flavors such as poison consumption/etc might be somewhat nice but hardly game breaking for a mechanism which means less and less and less. Anyone can fly etc. Race just does not matter at all.

Hopefully they will fix this in EQNext and Trolls will take their rightfull place as king alpha race of all playable races.

Nynaeve · 11-09-2012, 07:53 AM

SOE fixed the deities as well. You could argue with the same flawed logic: Former prime healer Anashti Sul's deity pet CAN ONLY GIVE WIS (or any other single choice)... but this is exactly what decreased variety in game, because you were basically forced to choose 1 deity out of 4 instead of 16 (or how many there are).

Being more flexible on racial traits isn't against lore. It gives players more options to customize their build.

Deago · 11-09-2012, 12:10 PM

Felishanna@Antonia Bayle wrote:

Nynaeve wrote:
hello guys!
So I made a gnome warden as my 10th char. Mainly because they look kinda cute, and I didn't have one yet. I knew that they weren't designed to be healers, but I thought: what the heck, 70 wis less and a few tiny stat-boosts wont break a char. They probably don't... but I think it is still sad that they are all useless to this build.
These predefined racial skills also hurt variety in the game imo. Why not make a gnome tank? After all it's a game, and fun.
(( To respond to the thread title: "What a stupid thread (kinda)".
Gnomes are small and physically weak, and to add to that, they are not very wise, but despite their sometimes bumbling demeanour, they are extremely good at research, academic study and building gadgets and machines.
So, gnomes are excellent as mages, but are not so good as priests and especially not as fighters. This is pretty obvious, and it is the lore, the story background, and has been so for 12-13 years now! (In EQII and EQ1 before it).
>> From your comments, you knew this when you made the character <<
Unlike you, many players actually want real and meaningful differences to the game races, not have them all made exactly the same. The differences are fun, and personally, I would like the differences between races made ten or twenty times larger than they already are, not made even more meaningless just to stop people like you whining after making a choice you knew about before you even made it.
If you do not like your class/race choice, the only person to blame is yourself. If you want the "best" stats/choices for a fighter, choose a race that the lore has set up as a martial race, there are a list of them. If you want the "best" stats/choices for a healer, again, choose a race set up for that specifically.
However, if you want to make a non-conventional choice "for fun", then absolutely fine - except you should accept the consequences of that choice without complaining and without asking for the game to be modified to remove racial differences and make everything even more bland.
There is nothing wrong with playing a race you want to play, I mean, I play all high elves. But I don't whine about the fact that my high elf fighters are not well suited to their race, because it was MY OWN CHOICE and I realize that the racial differences add colour to the game. In this case, it was your choice too, so deal with it, or change your race. The options are right there in front of you. The option to just ask for the game to be changed to remove all racial differences is just the most selfish option possible )

Who says all gnomes are weak? Have you ever seen one powerlift? Ever seen one pull a truck? For that matter ever see an ogre do those things? See my point? It is all fantasy symantics that can be whatever you want it to be etc.. If I want my gnome to be a compact Hercules then that is what he shall become !

Join the Gnomatter Gadget Gangsta Society and watch how serious they are about Gnome rights!

ZachSpastic · 11-09-2012, 12:44 PM

1. The racial traits you see today are the third version of the traits, and every time the devs have changed the traits they have made matters worse. Be careful what you wish for; you may get it.

2. The traits that offer bonuses to primary stats or to resists are so teensy tiny at end-game that they are completely irrelevant, even to a min/max raider. Look for traits that will offer your character something they would not otherwise have. For example, in the last trait revision the devs gave away scout abilities to about half the races so that any class can have tracking, disarm trap or safe fall.

3. There is nothing in the game mechanics preventing any player from creating any race/class combination and the racial traits will not make or break that character. You can't hose your character based on race choice.

Mermut · 11-09-2012, 02:39 PM

Nynaeve wrote:

SOE fixed the deities as well. You could argue with the same flawed logic: Former prime healer Anashti Sul's deity pet CAN ONLY GIVE WIS (or any other single choice)... but this is exactly what decreased variety in game, because you were basically forced to choose 1 deity out of 4 instead of 16 (or how many there are).
Being more flexible on racial traits isn't against lore. It gives players more options to customize their build.

If you want the buffs of a particular race and the appearance of another.. pick the race you want for the 'stats' and then use one of the petrified eye illlusion baubles of the race you want to look like. Presto, you're effectively getting what you want without removing some of the diversity from the game.

11-08-2012, 03:51 PM	#31
Juggercap Elder Join Date: Jul 2012 Posts: 208	Nynaeve wrote: Juggercap wrote: Nynaeve wrote: well, I like your comments, but mainly as a tool to increas the threadsize and pull more attention from devs. about your opinions I care not one bit. Yes. Please devs, come and read this thread where one person wants something and the thread is growing and growing with basically every comment from everyone not the OP being against the OPs idea. Please consider your players and what they want. That's basically proof that my idea is awesome. I got the same reaction when I demanded that all servers should be switched to f2p. I had like 1000 NO posters. just like now. Your logic sucks. (So does FTP...even though I'll be there soon since so does this game because of players like you.) __________________ ------------------ Run away! Run away!

11-08-2012, 03:58 PM	#32
SOE-MOD-02 Community Moderator Join Date: May 2011 Posts: 1,001	Let's get back on track please. Bickering is not necessary. __________________ \|\| Forum Guidelines \|\| Knowledge Base \|\| Tech Support \|\|

11-08-2012, 05:57 PM	#34
Juggercap Elder Join Date: Jul 2012 Posts: 208	crazyeyes321 wrote: It would be neat to have some of those stats more generic now since the game itself has gone more and more generic statwise. Instead of str, make it str/int/wis/agi. Make the other choice sta. Same with the resist pools, make one for magic resists, the other physical. This would make my newest alt, Bowlooga Wailz, ogre ranger, slightly more viable. Very slightly. There are a lot of other things Id rather them work on though, to be honest. The game is more generic so lets make it even more generic. This is exactly why I hate the idea. __________________ ------------------ Run away! Run away!

11-08-2012, 10:59 PM	#35
General_Info Lord Join Date: Jun 2011 Posts: 658	crazyeyes321 wrote: Same with the resist pools, make one for magic resists, the other physical. This would make my newest alt, Bowlooga Wailz, ogre ranger, slightly more viable. Very slightly. you do realize that when you get geared at 92 nox, arcane, elemental are all at cap of 75% resist right? this would only benifit you while leveling. diversity is what makes this game great. if you want changes to the system then ask for more unqiue choices not less. __________________

11-09-2012, 12:03 AM	#36
zehly Loremaster Join Date: Dec 2005 Location: USA Posts: 78	I don't let Gnomes heal me. It's a gno-gno. __________________ Count Xehl, 92/320 Illusionist Savior Niekko, 92/320 Templar Sir Trixle, ??/??? Brigand

11-08-2012, 05:53 PM	#33
crazyeyes321 Loremaster Join Date: Jun 2007 Posts: 104	It would be neat to have some of those stats more generic now since the game itself has gone more and more generic statwise. Instead of str, make it str/int/wis/agi. Make the other choice sta. Same with the resist pools, make one for magic resists, the other physical. This would make my newest alt, Bowlooga Wailz, ogre ranger, slightly more viable. Very slightly. There are a lot of other things Id rather them work on though, to be honest.

11-09-2012, 12:22 AM	#37
Malleria Loremaster Join Date: Mar 2009 Posts: 163	Nynaeve wrote: In real life, most women are weaker than men, and have no place at the frontlines. Your first statement is a fact, your second is an opinion. Learn the difference, then you can argue with the grown ups.

11-09-2012, 01:08 AM	#38
Vlahkmaak Server: Venekor Guild: Opus Dei Rank: Captain Loremaster Join Date: Feb 2005 Location: Yucaipa, CA Posts: 1,213	Race serves no purpose in this game beyond cosmetics. It is not relevant to anything except your viewing pleasure. One can be an equally well played gnome, halfling, troll or ogre tank skill levels being equal: race does not matter in the slightest bit. No racial trait will make one a better tank, healer, mage, or scout. Every race can play equally well at end game. Some flavors such as poison consumption/etc might be somewhat nice but hardly game breaking for a mechanism which means less and less and less. Anyone can fly etc. Race just does not matter at all. Hopefully they will fix this in EQNext and Trolls will take their rightfull place as king alpha race of all playable races. __________________ Obin 92 Iksar Necro Opus Dei Nagafen Vlahkmaak 92 Troll Guardian Nagafen Dwyrm 92 Dwarf Paladin Nagafen Shoofaug 92 Iksar bruiser Nagafen Vlah 92 Troll Inqy Nagafen Vlahk 50 SK Nagafen Glavlahnus 92 Woodelf Ranger, betrayed and back again Cructik 92 TROLL BL Nagafen

11-09-2012, 07:53 AM	#39
Nynaeve Loremaster Join Date: Jul 2009 Posts: 455	SOE fixed the deities as well. You could argue with the same flawed logic: Former prime healer Anashti Sul's deity pet CAN ONLY GIVE WIS (or any other single choice)... but this is exactly what decreased variety in game, because you were basically forced to choose 1 deity out of 4 instead of 16 (or how many there are). Being more flexible on racial traits isn't against lore. It gives players more options to customize their build.

11-09-2012, 12:10 PM	#40
Deago Loremaster Join Date: Jul 2008 Posts: 625	Felishanna@Antonia Bayle wrote: Nynaeve wrote: hello guys! So I made a gnome warden as my 10th char. Mainly because they look kinda cute, and I didn't have one yet. I knew that they weren't designed to be healers, but I thought: what the heck, 70 wis less and a few tiny stat-boosts wont break a char. They probably don't... but I think it is still sad that they are all useless to this build. These predefined racial skills also hurt variety in the game imo. Why not make a gnome tank? After all it's a game, and fun. (( To respond to the thread title: "What a stupid thread (kinda)". Gnomes are small and physically weak, and to add to that, they are not very wise, but despite their sometimes bumbling demeanour, they are extremely good at research, academic study and building gadgets and machines. So, gnomes are excellent as mages, but are not so good as priests and especially not as fighters. This is pretty obvious, and it is the lore, the story background, and has been so for 12-13 years now! (In EQII and EQ1 before it). >> From your comments, you knew this when you made the character << Unlike you, many players actually want real and meaningful differences to the game races, not have them all made exactly the same. The differences are fun, and personally, I would like the differences between races made ten or twenty times larger than they already are, not made even more meaningless just to stop people like you whining after making a choice you knew about before you even made it. If you do not like your class/race choice, the only person to blame is yourself. If you want the "best" stats/choices for a fighter, choose a race that the lore has set up as a martial race, there are a list of them. If you want the "best" stats/choices for a healer, again, choose a race set up for that specifically. However, if you want to make a non-conventional choice "for fun", then absolutely fine - except you should accept the consequences of that choice without complaining and without asking for the game to be modified to remove racial differences and make everything even more bland. There is nothing wrong with playing a race you want to play, I mean, I play all high elves. But I don't whine about the fact that my high elf fighters are not well suited to their race, because it was MY OWN CHOICE and I realize that the racial differences add colour to the game. In this case, it was your choice too, so deal with it, or change your race. The options are right there in front of you. The option to just ask for the game to be changed to remove all racial differences is just the most selfish option possible ) Who says all gnomes are weak? Have you ever seen one powerlift? Ever seen one pull a truck? For that matter ever see an ogre do those things? See my point? It is all fantasy symantics that can be whatever you want it to be etc.. If I want my gnome to be a compact Hercules then that is what he shall become ! Join the Gnomatter Gadget Gangsta Society and watch how serious they are about Gnome rights! __________________ Hello fellow EQ2 gamers!

11-09-2012, 12:44 PM	#41
ZachSpastic Loremaster Join Date: Aug 2006 Posts: 167	1. The racial traits you see today are the third version of the traits, and every time the devs have changed the traits they have made matters worse. Be careful what you wish for; you may get it. 2. The traits that offer bonuses to primary stats or to resists are so teensy tiny at end-game that they are completely irrelevant, even to a min/max raider. Look for traits that will offer your character something they would not otherwise have. For example, in the last trait revision the devs gave away scout abilities to about half the races so that any class can have tracking, disarm trap or safe fall. 3. There is nothing in the game mechanics preventing any player from creating any race/class combination and the racial traits will not make or break that character. You can't hose your character based on race choice.

11-09-2012, 02:39 PM	#42
Mermut Loremaster Join Date: Feb 2009 Posts: 852	Nynaeve wrote: SOE fixed the deities as well. You could argue with the same flawed logic: Former prime healer Anashti Sul's deity pet CAN ONLY GIVE WIS (or any other single choice)... but this is exactly what decreased variety in game, because you were basically forced to choose 1 deity out of 4 instead of 16 (or how many there are). Being more flexible on racial traits isn't against lore. It gives players more options to customize their build. If you want the buffs of a particular race and the appearance of another.. pick the race you want for the 'stats' and then use one of the petrified eye illlusion baubles of the race you want to look like. Presto, you're effectively getting what you want without removing some of the diversity from the game. __________________ I'm willing to suspend my disbelief, But not hang it by the neck until dead.