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Old 12-17-2007, 11:47 AM   #1
Fyxie

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So, I have been playing a Warden now for a few weeks and reached level 42. Generally solo, root nuking. I group some and when I do, I am the primary healer as that is my preferred role. However, I'm getting somewhat lost on where I should be putting my AA's. I started out maxing the WIS line because it was the most helpful at the time as I was always OOP. However that doesn't seem to be the case now with mastercrafted INT and WIS gear. What I have noticed is compared to other wardens I have grouped with I kill things much slower then them and it seems to be a difference in AA's. So I could use some advice. Right now I have 8 in the first part of the stam line, and in the wis line I have 8 - 6 - 8 -0 -1, but I am thinking of redoing it and making an INT/STA build. In the warden tree I have 3 - 5 in the movement line for the maxed SOW. What I'm wondering is what is a good placement for a root and nuke build?Any advice would be very much appreciated, thanks guys SMILEY.
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Old 12-17-2007, 11:53 AM   #2
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Honestly, you might to give the Warden AA line a look and turn your spells into CA's.

It adds a ton to your dps, does not hurt your healing and if you go down the STR Aa line after that, you get some bonus group healing from your melee attacks.

If you are going to root/nuke, a fury is a better class choice for a nuker/healer.   Wardens have a great tool set in the AA's to allow us to be a melee/healer and not give up an ounce of healing ablility.

The CA damage also scales as you level, so you don't have to "waste" some M2 choices on your DD and/or spend gold on the spell upgrades. 

If you go that way, dump your first 21 points in the AA tree for you CA and the 75% Crit AA.    Then go down the STR line for the haste, double attack and aoe heals on melee.   I also am putting 5 into the improved SOW

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Old 12-17-2007, 11:56 AM   #3
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The INT line will increase the damage of your spells, so will increase your damage-output in both grouping and root/nuke situations. STA line improves your healing, so it is very usefull in groups. If you are having problems with mobs breaking free when you root/nuke, you can put some points into the 2 types of roots in the warden tree too. WIS-line is pretty useless to you I think, much better things for you at the moment.

 I belive you can do the best damage in a grouping situation going with a melee build, however it takes quite a few AAs, and alot of special gear with STR on it... I would not know, since I have never really given it an honest try - I am a healer SMILEY

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Old 12-17-2007, 11:57 AM   #4
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I hadn't even thought about a warden being a better melee/healer honestly as everything I had read up until I came here was that we were the best nuke healers. But melee healer is fine by me as well, so long as stuff is dying faster then it currently is. I'll have to try that out when I can, as I am sure it's going to need a gear switch I can't afford right now as well because I'm completely outfitted in WIS/INT gear :-/.
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Old 12-17-2007, 11:59 AM   #5
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[email protected] wrote:

I belive you can do the best damage in a grouping situation going with a melee build, however it takes quite a few AAs, and alot of special gear with STR on it... I would not know, since I have never really given it an honest try - I am a healer SMILEY

I'm definitely a healer at heart as well, my preferred role overall. Just right now I really need a better solo-able build too as I spend a large amount of time solo'ing while LFG for things.
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Old 12-17-2007, 04:39 PM   #6
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And here's the thing about being a melee warden ... you DO heal better.Str line gives a group heal proc from melee attacks.Str line gives a 40% double attack, meaning you have 40% more chances to proc that group heal.Because your offensive abilities take less time to use (CA's are very fast, spells are slower), you have MORE time to get your cast heals out while STILL generating some nice DPS.
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Old 12-17-2007, 05:10 PM   #7
Arielle Nightshade

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Whatever you decide...nuking vs. melee, get rid of the WIS line.  It's not one of the more helpful lines, and the end ability is clever, but it's usefulness is iffy at best.  

STA is sort of the anchor of the druid bunch of AAs, I'd go that one first.  Then consider AGI.   Those of us who chose that line for the Wild Regen ability at the end were grumbling about how useless all those points were to get to that ability (which is INCREDIBLY useful for a healer), till we got to RoK where everything is 'an animal' and can be charmed to tank or dps for us.

If you don't like that one, and are going melee, go STR, then go INT when you get additional AAs after 70.. is my advice.  The trouble with STR and melee, is as a healer, I find you have to have 2 sets of gear:  1 if you are primarily healing (like in a raid) and another for STR to be able to do decent dps.    Other more experienced melee wardens could tell you differently.

You have an opportunity to play around a bit with the specs though.  You get 5 free respecs of both druid and warden aa lines by talking to the AA trainer.  That will give you enough to really see which you like better without spending a ton of plat - then you can settle in when you decide.

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Old 12-17-2007, 05:11 PM   #8
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Yup, unless you just don't like the concept of being a melee/healer (which is fine, but then go fury, I say) the melee path is just amazing for both solo and grouping.

It takes time though, so do not give up too early.  You need 21 aa just to get your melee stuff hammered out then you dip into the STR tree for the double attack and heal procs.  

At lower levels, just get the highest damage 2 hander you can find.  The CA really do great damage.  Even con mobs die in one round of my CA (I do have half elf racial dd in that cycle though, when up).  Wish the refresh was just a few seconds quicker on the CA is all.

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Old 12-17-2007, 05:28 PM   #9
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[email protected] wrote:
 I belive you can do the best damage in a grouping situation going with a melee build, however it takes quite a few AAs, and alot of special gear with STR on it... I would not know, since I have never really given it an honest try - I am a healer SMILEY

As are the melee wardens- healers first.  The difference is in how you choose to do the dps you do- melee or casting- and in soloing speed.  There is not one AA choice on the EOF line that improves your healing ability, so you may as well use those points to go into the melee line. 

DrOctober wrote:

And here's the thing about being a melee warden ... you DO heal better.

Eh,  maybe not better, but equally well.  There are some who say you lose out on heals if you don't go agi/sta, but according to parses I have made (no longer have cause I can't figure out how to save them) the heal proc/heal boost on agi line is a wash in zonewide healing.

Str line gives a group heal proc from melee attacks.Str line gives a 40% double attack, meaning you have 40% more chances to proc that group heal.

The heal only procs on the first attack, the second hit on the double attack can't proc anything, including stuff that has a 100% chance to proc- was changed in the last few months.

Because your offensive abilities take less time to use (CA's are very fast, spells are slower), you have MORE time to get your cast heals out while STILL generating some nice DPS.

Personally I prefer the melee build- I find it to be much more FUN.  I did however level to 70 with 50 AAs before having access to the EOF melee line (Combat arts/ 75% crits). 

To the OP, if you want to increase your dps as a caster, make sure you get yourself some proc gear, a lot of int, and increase disruption- only root the mobs if they are tough (heroic)- use thorns and make sure you are melleing between spells.  Even if you choose not to go melee line, put AAs in the self/mitigation buff so you can take a hit better.  One thing about the caster build, it's much easier to find the gear to support that play style.  

When I decided to go melee, I vowed that I would not go strength at the expense of wisdom.  Instead I looked for and found gear with both str and wis.  Try exchanging str for int.  That way your power pool does not lack and no one can honestly accuse you of giving up healing ability for more dps.  You won't get as much str this way, but after all, you are a healer first....and you can get enough str so that you can melee just fine.

As far as specific advise, I would say get out of the wisdom line altogether for now, assuming you have enough power without it.  I wouldnt put more than 4 AAs in stat row of any of the lines (though I have been tempted to do so with str cause you get 8 for each AA).  Go sta/int for caster or str/sta for melee imo. 

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Old 12-18-2007, 07:19 AM   #10
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gatrm wrote:
There is not one AA choice on the EOF line that improves your healing ability, so you may as well use those points to go into the melee line. 

Not? What about improving Regenerating Spores proc rate, for more free healing (and earlier into fights, on average). And faster recast on Tree (yes, pretty effects for whole raid to enjoy too! SMILEY) and on Tranquility (which does heal for alot if you let tank get stacked with detrim SMILEY)? And if you (like me) actually use deathprevention spells, you can make those heal more, half recast, and proc twice instead of once.

There is also the curing part of EoF which I actually almost got maxed, but still not sure about how effective it is. At the moment each time i cure a physical on tank, the next 3 hit he will take 3-5% less damage - damage avoided is damage healed in some sence I guess. And for the other damage types (poison/deseace, mental/divine/magic, fire/cold) this number is twice as much if I remember right. Oh, and group cure adds this to all group members, not just a single one SMILEY

 Some of these may be marginal improvements, some very situational, but they do improve healing...

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Old 12-18-2007, 12:02 PM   #11
Fyxie

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Well, I made the decision yesterday to try a melee warden, even though I don't really have the gear for it and it's already a huge difference without even a gear change. I have 44 AA's to spend at 42, so I maxed out the warden line to the 75% and then started down the str line and went out questing.What a huge HUGE difference. Things were typically dying or close to dead within one round of CA's, and I could even kill some blue con'd heroic ^^ and ^^^ monsters. All before a gear change from full wis/sta gear using a buckler and morning star. Now I know what I've been missing! Thanks for the advice guys SMILEY!My only other question is, after I finish off the str line, where should I look to go after next? I'm kind of torn between the sta line and agi line :-/.
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Old 12-18-2007, 02:31 PM   #12
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[email protected] wrote:
Well, I made the decision yesterday to try a melee warden, even though I don't really have the gear for it and it's already a huge difference without even a gear change. I have 44 AA's to spend at 42, so I maxed out the warden line to the 75% and then started down the str line and went out questing.What a huge HUGE difference. Things were typically dying or close to dead within one round of CA's, and I could even kill some blue con'd heroic ^^ and ^^^ monsters. All before a gear change from full wis/sta gear using a buckler and morning star. Now I know what I've been missing! Thanks for the advice guys SMILEY<img src=" width="15" height="15" />!My only other question is, after I finish off the str line, where should I look to go after next? I'm kind of torn between the sta line and agi line :-/.

I prefer sta line.  While neither is necessary to keep a group alive, I prefer heal crits to wild regeneration (but then again, imo the faster tick is too much of a negative to compensate for the initial boost......yeah, I know there's gonna be a lot of wardens replying that I don't know what I'm talkin about and that wild regen is the end all in healing, but to that, I say HUMBUG.

And Ezken...yeah, spores are nice, but you can still put points in those if you go melee.....tree is useful depending on your level, but once you get to RoK, furgetaboutit....even the no-arrow solo mobs have aoes that kill it.  Cures were cool until they were nerfed 3 days after EoF was released..reminded me of how our cures worked pre-lu 13...but I can't bring myself to start reminiscing about the glory days...

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Old 12-18-2007, 04:18 PM   #13
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I vote STA too.   Since you are meleeing, you'll want as much health as you can get, and you'll also want the Anti-Stun ability that the line gives you at the end. 

To the poster that says EoF doesn't have any heal boost AA's .......Huh?  Did you read them?   And gatrm...the tree does just fine when it's upgraded.   Your level 58 tree has some difficulties against level 74 mobs, but I'm leaving trees all over the place that lasted longer than the fight anymore.

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Old 12-18-2007, 06:20 PM   #14
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Arielle Nightshade wrote:

   but I'm leaving trees all over the place that lasted longer than the fight anymore.

What??? we cant have that ...*Skivley goes to find some beavers to take care of the problem*
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Old 12-18-2007, 10:31 PM   #15
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Arielle Nightshade wrote:

I vote STA too.   Since you are meleeing, you'll want as much health as you can get, and you'll also want the Anti-Stun ability that the line gives you at the end. 

To the poster that says EoF doesn't have any heal boost AA's .......Huh?  Did you read them?   And gatrm...the tree does just fine when it's upgraded.   Your level 58 tree has some difficulties against level 74 mobs, but I'm leaving trees all over the place that lasted longer than the fight anymore.

I was thinking STA for the same reasons. Plus the anti-stun would be helpful in both grouping and solo situation I'm sure.
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