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Old 07-13-2012, 11:12 PM   #31
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Old 07-17-2012, 07:16 AM   #32
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No difference between day and night:  Night should limit viewing range and be actually dark.  If possible take in account overcast vs starry vs single vs multiple moon effects on ambient lighting.  Adds tension to the game.  West Karana was a hoot when a cat would jump your group as people waited to heal/get mana back after a fight.  The mobs would pounch out of the night and scare the crap outta ya.

Brightly lit abandoned dungeons.  Put light/darkness back into the game.  Again not being able to see or limited vision puts back tension into the game and enhances enjoyment.  A mission in Secret World requires you to use a head mounted light at the beginning and then flares later on.  Vision is limited to what the little light on the helmet shows and what the flares lit up.  Really a tense and fun mission especially because you know there are zombies in the area you can't see.

Racial vision:  no one(least I don't) uses this stuff and its a waste of time unless implemented in a meaningfull manner.  If it is meaningfull, limit it to few races and put potions and spells in for enhanced vision for races that don't have it.  Limited duration potions and spells also.  Adds tension when you are low on mana and have to decide if seeing is better than buffing someone during a battle or when you're in the middle of a dungeon and can't see after your last potion is about to expire.  Can the group make it back to a lighted area in time?  Can the group remember which way the corridors turn to get back outside?

Maps:  Let the community map makers have their day again.  I miss EQAtlas.com.  Also will free up screen room for the game world to be enjoyed in.  Plus there used to be some talented map makers out there.  Unlike the '90's people now own printers and can make print outs.  People also now have multiple monitors, so maps sites can now be accessed along with the game.  No reason to waste dev time dealing with maps now days.

No food:  Bring over Eq2's system.  Nuff said.

EQ2 Crafting:  EQ2 crafting is the worst.  Don't bring this system over.  Get Brad to put in Vanguard's resource and crafting system into EQNext.  For those that haven't checked it out, you can do so after the game goes FTP.  I really enjoy those systems.  Especially the falling tree animation when getting wood(get your minds outta the gutter!!!).

Dead harbors.  Vanguard and EQ2 have ports with no traffic.  If you have a port then ships need to sail in and dock, unload, load and then leave.  Put them on a schedule.  Put some random delay or faster trip time in to vary the traffic.  Day/night cycle shouldn't be too hard to do since ships arrive and sail at all times of the day.  Tide times can be ignored.

Predators among the prey.  Shouldn't have wolves wandering around in the middle of deer.  That bothers me sometimes.  Deer are going to give way to any predator and will not be near them.

No music or dance systems.  Had a blast either participating in or watcing dancers and musicians in SWG and LOTRO(music).  Put that in for people to have fun with.  Code is there in SWG, so adapt it for EQN.  Also let it put beneficial buffs on people that stay and watch and/or listen to them.

No diplomacy card game.  Have Brad port that system from Vanguard into EQN.  Too good of an idea just to let Vanguard alone to have it.  Buff system similar to Vanguard's.

Pre-set classes.  I like the Secret Worlds' system where you put a skill point in a weapon to open up ability trees(similar to AA trees in EQ2).  So let us create our own pure or hybrid classes.  Rangers, for example, can put a point into the conjuration skill and be able to buy a conjur arrows ability.  Put in some 'suggested' builds for the newbies to follow.  Don't worry about balance too much.  Players will be able to sort it out in no time on which sets to take and which sets to avoid.

This is kind of a bizzaro wish list thread.  Hypno am glad about post.

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Old 07-18-2012, 01:06 AM   #33
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What i DONT want to see in EQ-Next:

Loading zones: This ruins the "open-worldness" of any MMO. The only time their should be loading zones is when I'm getting teleported, or something to that affect. If their is no loading-zones the world will feel vast, and grand! You should be able to run to every zone w/o loading!

Solo-able Game: This will be the end of EQ-Next if it is solo-able. Huge amount of MMO's now are doing this, and everyone is getting sick, and tired of this. What's so fun in a MMO-World when your doing eveything by yourself... They need to make this game GROUP-RESTRICTED. Bring back the trueness of a strong community sticking together!

Quest, quest, quest, and more quest!: As i mentioned early, every MMO is doing this. They need to go back to their roots, and make questing an OPTION, not MANDATORY! The only questing i see necessarily lvls 1-10, and after that every 10lvls till max. What made questing really unique was when you were rewarding a bad-azz weapon for you specific class after finishing it! <-- BRING THIS BACK!

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Old 07-18-2012, 01:16 AM   #34
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Another EQNext threat filled unrealistic expectations

Corpses runs and bland grinding places aren't happening. If the rumor'd budget is $200,000,000 then you can kiss those ideas goodbye from even being considered on the drawing boards.

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Old 07-18-2012, 11:45 AM   #35
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Hypnotoad wrote:

No difference between day and night:  Night should limit viewing range and be actually dark.  If possible take in account overcast vs starry vs single vs multiple moon effects on ambient lighting.  Adds tension to the game.  West Karana was a hoot when a cat would jump your group as people waited to heal/get mana back after a fight.  The mobs would pounch out of the night and scare the crap outta ya.

Brightly lit abandoned dungeons.  Put light/darkness back into the game.  Again not being able to see or limited vision puts back tension into the game and enhances enjoyment.  A mission in Secret World requires you to use a head mounted light at the beginning and then flares later on.  Vision is limited to what the little light on the helmet shows and what the flares lit up.  Really a tense and fun mission especially because you know there are zombies in the area you can't see.

Racial vision:  no one(least I don't) uses this stuff and its a waste of time unless implemented in a meaningfull manner.  If it is meaningfull, limit it to few races and put potions and spells in for enhanced vision for races that don't have it.  Limited duration potions and spells also.  Adds tension when you are low on mana and have to decide if seeing is better than buffing someone during a battle or when you're in the middle of a dungeon and can't see after your last potion is about to expire.  Can the group make it back to a lighted area in time?  Can the group remember which way the corridors turn to get back outside?

Maps:  Let the community map makers have their day again.  I miss EQAtlas.com.  Also will free up screen room for the game world to be enjoyed in.  Plus there used to be some talented map makers out there.  Unlike the '90's people now own printers and can make print outs.  People also now have multiple monitors, so maps sites can now be accessed along with the game.  No reason to waste dev time dealing with maps now days.

No food:  Bring over Eq2's system.  Nuff said.

EQ2 Crafting:  EQ2 crafting is the worst.  Don't bring this system over.  Get Brad to put in Vanguard's resource and crafting system into EQNext.  For those that haven't checked it out, you can do so after the game goes FTP.  I really enjoy those systems.  Especially the falling tree animation when getting wood(get your minds outta the gutter!!!).

Dead harbors.  Vanguard and EQ2 have ports with no traffic.  If you have a port then ships need to sail in and dock, unload, load and then leave.  Put them on a schedule.  Put some random delay or faster trip time in to vary the traffic.  Day/night cycle shouldn't be too hard to do since ships arrive and sail at all times of the day.  Tide times can be ignored.

Predators among the prey.  Shouldn't have wolves wandering around in the middle of deer.  That bothers me sometimes.  Deer are going to give way to any predator and will not be near them.

No music or dance systems.  Had a blast either participating in or watcing dancers and musicians in SWG and LOTRO(music).  Put that in for people to have fun with.  Code is there in SWG, so adapt it for EQN.  Also let it put beneficial buffs on people that stay and watch and/or listen to them.

No diplomacy card game.  Have Brad port that system from Vanguard into EQN.  Too good of an idea just to let Vanguard alone to have it.  Buff system similar to Vanguard's.

Pre-set classes.  I like the Secret Worlds' system where you put a skill point in a weapon to open up ability trees(similar to AA trees in EQ2).  So let us create our own pure or hybrid classes.  Rangers, for example, can put a point into the conjuration skill and be able to buy a conjur arrows ability.  Put in some 'suggested' builds for the newbies to follow.  Don't worry about balance too much.  Players will be able to sort it out in no time on which sets to take and which sets to avoid.

This is kind of a bizzaro wish list thread.  Hypno am glad about post.

I agree about the lighting ideas you bring up.  I would like things like lighting and night vision abilities to matter.

I absolutely disagree with the suggestion to remove maps from the game.  No way I'm going to make printouts, and I do use a second monitor, but it shouldn't be required.  In game maps are great.  The map system eq2 has is actually one of the best map systems I've seen.

The EQ2 food/drink system is not good at all.  The whole provisioner tradeskill is a joke.  Cooking should be part of the game, but should not be its own tradeskill class.  Crafting in general should take ideas from Vanguard, amazing crafting system in that game.

I also agree with some of your thoughts about mob placement.  I don't like that in EQ2, and most mmos games in general, that the landmass is just completely covered by mobs.  I would rather feel like I'm hunting when in the wild instead of going to a spot and seeing tons of mobs around.

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Old 07-18-2012, 10:47 PM   #36
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Hypnotoad wrote:

No difference between day and night:  Night should limit viewing range and be actually dark.  If possible take in account overcast vs starry vs single vs multiple moon effects on ambient lighting.  Adds tension to the game.  West Karana was a hoot when a cat would jump your group as people waited to heal/get mana back after a fight.  The mobs would pounch out of the night and scare the crap outta ya.

Brightly lit abandoned dungeons.  Put light/darkness back into the game.  Again not being able to see or limited vision puts back tension into the game and enhances enjoyment.  A mission in Secret World requires you to use a head mounted light at the beginning and then flares later on.  Vision is limited to what the little light on the helmet shows and what the flares lit up.  Really a tense and fun mission especially because you know there are zombies in the area you can't see.

Racial vision:  no one(least I don't) uses this stuff and its a waste of time unless implemented in a meaningfull manner.  If it is meaningfull, limit it to few races and put potions and spells in for enhanced vision for races that don't have it.  Limited duration potions and spells also.  Adds tension when you are low on mana and have to decide if seeing is better than buffing someone during a battle or when you're in the middle of a dungeon and can't see after your last potion is about to expire.  Can the group make it back to a lighted area in time?  Can the group remember which way the corridors turn to get back outside?

I agree on all this but the racial visions. frankly the only races that should get visions are those that should have them, or be restricted to mage buffs.

Maps:  Let the community map makers have their day again.  I miss EQAtlas.com.  Also will free up screen room for the game world to be enjoyed in.  Plus there used to be some talented map makers out there.  Unlike the '90's people now own printers and can make print outs.  People also now have multiple monitors, so maps sites can now be accessed along with the game.  No reason to waste dev time dealing with maps now days.

No food:  Bring over Eq2's system.  Nuff said.

I like the maps and the food system. EQAtlas worked because there were no maps, and people cared enough to make them. if they put no maps in EQnext...people will just throw a fit until they do. There just aren't people that will put that kind of effort into mapmaking.

EQ2 Crafting:  EQ2 crafting is the worst.  Don't bring this system over.  Get Brad to put in Vanguard's resource and crafting system into EQNext.  For those that haven't checked it out, you can do so after the game goes FTP.  I really enjoy those systems.  Especially the falling tree animation when getting wood(get your minds outta the gutter!!!).

I liked the original EQ2 crafting cept for the Alchemist not needing anyone. but Vanguard's system was nice too.

Dead harbors.  Vanguard and EQ2 have ports with no traffic.  If you have a port then ships need to sail in and dock, unload, load and then leave.  Put them on a schedule.  Put some random delay or faster trip time in to vary the traffic.  Day/night cycle shouldn't be too hard to do since ships arrive and sail at all times of the day.  Tide times can be ignored.

I agree here.

Predators among the prey.  Shouldn't have wolves wandering around in the middle of deer.  That bothers me sometimes.  Deer are going to give way to any predator and will not be near them.

No music or dance systems.  Had a blast either participating in or watcing dancers and musicians in SWG and LOTRO(music).  Put that in for people to have fun with.  Code is there in SWG, so adapt it for EQN.  Also let it put beneficial buffs on people that stay and watch and/or listen to them.

I loved the music in LoTRO...just wish it wasn't racial restricted on what instrument you got. never saw the dance system for SWG so I got no horse in that race.

No diplomacy card game.  Have Brad port that system from Vanguard into EQN.  Too good of an idea just to let Vanguard alone to have it.  Buff system similar to Vanguard's.

I like EQ2 buff system..but I wouldn't mind the subset armor system. so I can swith to harvest/dilpo/adventure gear easily. diplomacy works in vanguard's world...not so much in EQ. no way on earth a high elf is going to be diplomatic with a dark elf. if they even speak before trying to run eachother through.

Pre-set classes.  I like the Secret Worlds' system where you put a skill point in a weapon to open up ability trees(similar to AA trees in EQ2).  So let us create our own pure or hybrid classes.  Rangers, for example, can put a point into the conjuration skill and be able to buy a conjur arrows ability.  Put in some 'suggested' builds for the newbies to follow.  Don't worry about balance too much.  Players will be able to sort it out in no time on which sets to take and which sets to avoid.

this only works when a game is designed almost competely for PvP. It's horrid on the PvE aspect. I'd rather the set classes and abilities. it makes it impossible to balance PvE when you have that, and sorry, I don't like being told how to spec my toon. I'll build him how I want, and the game better be able to accomadate my 'different' spec and be able to play

This is kind of a bizzaro wish list thread.  Hypno am glad about post.

I left out the mob placement part cause this is a BIG thing to type. Mob placement in EQ is fine. yes, you are going to see wolves around deer. that's becuase wolves eat deer. would you really want to have to hunt wolves, and have to find the deer first, and then spend the next 10 minutes wandering away to the place the wolves might be becuase they can't be closer together cause the deer would run?

and now think about the rest of the game world. like it or not, we know what Griffon's eat. we know what Dragon's eat. we know how Vampires operate, we know what Drachnids do. you really want to have to run to one end of the zone to find the 5 Griffons there becase predator/prey says that there can only be 5 in the zone because they can't make a zone 2X as big as Kunark to properly show the fact that the griffons eat wolves/deer/small bears/people?

and dragons. dragons eat everyone. and thier lairs are usually surrounded by miles and miles and miles and miles of abandoned territory. becuase people and animals aren't generally dumb...or they usually pay tribute to said dragon so thier city/town/village isn't razed.

it's part of the suspension of disbelief to think that you could run across Gfay in a few minutes. that's actually miles and miles and miles of forest. you really think Crushbone Keep is a 3 minute walk from Kelethin? it's probably several days or more hard march.

so yes, you see the random wolf wandering into a group of deer. that just becuase they can't make the zone so big that that wandering wolf show up the half mile or more away form the deer it probably actually is.

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Old 07-19-2012, 05:11 PM   #37
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id like to see the classes, abilities and roles in the game be original to each their own like it was in the old days. the idea that every single class needs to perform the exact same way in solo/group/raid as every other class that this game has turned itself into is rediculous and boring. (e.g. different fighters do not equally perform the same role in everything. scouts, mages, healers ect. ect.)

make them stand apart. make them original. or give us the tools to tweak our own guys so we can make them stand apart. and be prepared for what we will come up with ahead of time so the nerf bats will swing less brutally since alot of the players seem to understand the game better then the people building it

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Old 07-20-2012, 04:56 PM   #38
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Old 07-20-2012, 11:25 PM   #39
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i know this will happen though i wish i didnt $C shop

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Old 07-20-2012, 11:55 PM   #40
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Big_Hammer wrote:

What i DONT want to see in EQ-Next:

Loading zones: This ruins the "open-worldness" of any MMO. The only time their should be loading zones is when I'm getting teleported, or something to that affect. If their is no loading-zones the world will feel vast, and grand! You should be able to run to every zone w/o loading!

When you have and open-world type game there are downsides for a singleplayer game sure it's simple enough to accomplish but in ether case wether singleplayer or multiplayer having and open-world means it is more complex the more boundries(i.e seemless adjact zones) the more powerful your computer needs to be.

no everyone can afford top of the line hardware the system requirements of will determine how many potential customers would be able to purchase and run said game.

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Old 07-21-2012, 01:27 AM   #41
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General_Info wrote:

Big_Hammer wrote:

What i DONT want to see in EQ-Next:

Loading zones: This ruins the "open-worldness" of any MMO. The only time their should be loading zones is when I'm getting teleported, or something to that affect. If their is no loading-zones the world will feel vast, and grand! You should be able to run to every zone w/o loading!

When you have and open-world type game there are downsides for a singleplayer game sure it's simple enough to accomplish but in ether case wether singleplayer or multiplayer having and open-world means it is more complex the more boundries(i.e seemless adjact zones) the more powerful your computer needs to be.

no everyone can afford top of the line hardware the system requirements of will determine how many potential customers would be able to purchase and run said game.

Render distance settings kinda makes that problem obsolete unless in a packed area but that is the same in a zoned game.

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Old 07-24-2012, 11:24 PM   #42
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General_Info wrote:

Big_Hammer wrote:

What i DONT want to see in EQ-Next:

Loading zones: This ruins the "open-worldness" of any MMO. The only time their should be loading zones is when I'm getting teleported, or something to that affect. If their is no loading-zones the world will feel vast, and grand! You should be able to run to every zone w/o loading!

When you have and open-world type game there are downsides for a singleplayer game sure it's simple enough to accomplish but in ether case wether singleplayer or multiplayer having and open-world means it is more complex the more boundries(i.e seemless adjact zones) the more powerful your computer needs to be.

no everyone can afford top of the line hardware the system requirements of will determine how many potential customers would be able to purchase and run said game.

What about EQOA on the PS2??? The world was huge/massive with 50k mobs wondering around and not one loading zone. I remember just running straight for hours untill i would hit some type of city. The game was unlike any other i've experienced. If the PS2 was able to do that seamless world why cant a out-of-date computer or better yet, PS4 be able too. In todays modern world it can be easily done, but everyone never seems to take this route. Anyway what you said is true, but they are other alternatives like, degrading the graphics. Also i'm really hopeing the eqnext will be on the ps4, YES ps4! If you havent played eqoa then there is no way i can convince you

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Old 07-25-2012, 02:06 PM   #43
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I was trying to come up with some pros and cons zoned vs continuous.

Continuous worlds are certainly possible but there will be tradeoffs.  Just have to think about how such a world would actually be implimented.  For example, as you move around, your comp will have to be continually loading new areas and unloading others.  All the time.  Likewise, since the "server" will still not be a single machine, some way of load balancing will be needed. 

In EQ1 that each zone would have it's own models (especially mob models).  This allowed zones to have unique models.  In a contnuous world you can't do that and you're limited by however many models the minimum client you're going to support can hold simultaneously.  Asheron's Call (a continuous world the same vintage as EQ1) had an extremely limited number of mob models compared to EQ1, because they all had to be loaded globally.  Presumably this isn't as much an issue nowadays but I suppose with models having ever higher resolution and multiple textures (color, bump, specular reflection etc.) and the push to make them as high resolution as possible there may still be issues there.

I'm guessing EQN will be a continuous world anyway though.

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Old 07-26-2012, 12:08 AM   #44
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Here are my thoughts on what would make a great mmo

I cant wait to eq next to come out. I fell in love with eq1 when it came out. yet back then there wasn't anything like it and as such we had nothing to compare it too, which made all the hard work seem worth it. Now with the advent of so many mmo's there is a strong distaste for what was, and a desire for what hasn't been done. Only thing is, how do we reinvent the wheel?By looking at what made eq1 So great! as well as what caused its decline!

 

            It all boils dont to the mechanics of the game, A friend of mine once compaired his love for the eq1 like that of a mouse in a maze searching for the cheese at the end, and Eq1 did a great job doing that! You had to work hard inorder to get to that cheese , it took time , and patience, sometimes luck as well. yet when you got that cheese it tasted so good, you would show it off to all your friends, and pat yourself on the back for a job well done. people would come up to you and see your cheese and be jeolouse , so they too worked hard for their piece of cheese. And people played since each achievement and exploration rewarded them for that hard work.

 

            But that was then, As time passed by though there came out other  games, flashier games , better graphics and they made it easier to get the cheese, cause the competition was more complex.The New MMo's satified the immediate need for cheese yet failed, due to the ease of getting it. And as such developers had to work harder and create more content to satify that need. And everyone complained! and then when ever a new game came out , people would jump onto that game. years later and many more MMo's later people are tired of easy, they want a game with a challenge, with an extensive community to interact with. And it has to be fun to play. Now im not going to tell SOE what they already know as far as story lines nor graphics , im talking about the mechanics that make a good game great, and even though some might complain these Mechanics keep people plugged in and turned on to a good mmo.        

 

            First, make the game loot based, after all we are on quests for loot and glory. What makes a mouse run faster thru a maze than to provide a great piece of cheese at the end!! Allow use to give that loot to our alts! part of the fun was twinking lowbies and watch them chew thru mobs !! we loved that! IMHO when sony penalized us for that was the beginning of the end for eq1. Now i dont think we should beable to sell the item , make the heirloom but lets stop making them lvl based! Think about it if items are heirloom you cant aquire them til your able to anyway so why make them based on lvl. Instead make it hard for them to get and let them have fun with it when they do. No need to give a player an exp bonus for their other characters , the items can do that!

 

            Second, allow for unbalanced characters! I know I know , I can hear all the complaints we need balance. Yet dont you remeber how cool it was , when a whole guild would get wiped on a Plane of Fear run and the Sk's and Monks would drag and rezz everyone, Or druid or necro could kite mobs in the plane of air while the rest of the guild would rezz back up!! that was cool!!! There should be times and places certain characters should have an up on the rest. What we should do then is give them an exp penalty for being so unbalanced, that way those characters earn the right to be over powered!!

 

            Third, as one lvls make it so the mechanics change as well, so that each player had to relearn how to play their character, make it interesting. Allow for certain buffs that you get at different lvl teirs as well as the buffs you are given to change the way one plays! We all hate getting the same upgraded skills over and over. This also creates areas of unbalance and as such apply the appropiate exp penalties with the different buffs! Remember this is a loot oriented game, not  lvl oriented the need for the buffs are to be able to accomplish the mission at hand , not to for leveling.

 

            Four, encourage grouping ! people complain alot about having to group but lets face it , the whole reason for an mmo is to meet people, if you hate grouping, play an RPG instead. By playing with others one creates friendships which in turn, keeps you playing the game.

 

             Five, Allow for groups larger than 6 , why 6 ? why 5? why not allow people to join larger groups! Make it so the farther in a dungeon you go the more people you need? make it flexible. Encourage grouping! and make the end of each large dungeon for raids only! and dont put a cap on raids, allowing for only 24 people makes it so disappointing for those who  want to go but cant because it forces guilds to pick and choose the raiders . People will quickly figure out what size a group needs to be for their benefit. As the chances of loot goes down with  the more players that roll for that loot! Remember Lvl does make a difference when one doesnt have the skill to dodge or to fight a mob of the appropiate lvl so abunch of lvl 20's trying to take on a lvl 30 zone would get their butts handed to them.

 

            Six, reward Good leaders and punish bad players!! When someone leads a group they work extra hard , they gather the group together , they keep the people inline. They determine where the group goes, and handle any issues when someone leaves the group. Lets create a point system where , with each successful mission people are rewarded with follower points and leadership points, create tiers where a player can recieve a personel buff that helps fighting and questing, and then leadership buffs that can contribute to the group as a whole. as you group you earn points for killing and recieving rewards.

 

            When someone leaves a group the group can penalize that person  and take way points, if someone solo's then they too lose points ( albeit very slowly so one can lvl by themselves when they dont want to group) causing them to lose those buffs that they aquired. With these buffs people can tell who is a good leader and a good player, create an aura around the personage that glows  brighter an in different collors as they go up in tiers.

 

            Make it so when someone's behavior is negative (kill stealing, training, dropping group, Ninja looting, all things a leader and group can penalize someone for) those characters too, show a darker aura, so other players know when someone might not be the best person to group with. These aura's are also damaging as they weaken a player's abilitiy to play the game, penalizing their skills as well as earning a penalty for exp earned. These negitive auras can be lifted when they behave properly in groups. On a side note Soloing will not cause one to have a negative aura, unless more than one person witnesses a negative action and they report you. ( a guide would have to make that judgement if he finds the actions are negative he can penalize as much as he feels fit too)

 

            Seven, there should be areas that one can pvp. areas that can be fought over that when won by one faction, grants that faction with economic boost (prices of food and items drop) and allow for honor points to grant other buffs and aura's that can be granted to the group and themselves. ( Grouping , soloing outside of the PVP areas cause these buffs to decline, yet dont effect the PVE as much ie. a toughness buff that reduces crit damage, or a buff that increases speed of casting certain spells , such as heals or stuns ) Even setup Npc events within these zones such as invasions of other factions brought on by the known Npc's of the land. For example if one faction is completely rulling the other, and prices go to up to far on that faction , then it only makes since they would go to war and invade the zone to take those parts back! at that point the other factions can try to hold their ground and earn extra honor points .This also allows for some really fun PVP with all the action going on.

 

            Eight, Corpse recovery!! bring it back! I know I know , it sucks but nothing brings you more satifaction than when you can kick those mobs butt, that once made you cry 5 lvls lower when they wiped the floor with you. You can allow someone to help retrieve your corpse ie corpse drag. But Keep corpse recovery in place. I dont care how much someone complains , it should hurt you,  when you make a wrong turn, or the wrong decision  to go into that dungeon!!! the harder it is to explore an area or dungeon , makes it all the worth while when you have earned that right. And it keeps the player from running out of content since they have to work so hard to get there.

 

            Nine, Earning experience, what was wrong grinding? I understand there needs to be a story and we definetley want quests. yet going from one quest to another to another can get boring, place gaps in quests where a player needs to be a higher level, so they have to grind to beable to finish the quest. Create a quest line that allows for solo parts (such as getting pieces in town , or building faction from an npc ) to also making them group up for that last piece way down in that bad dungeon. Create mini caps in lvls that require a player to quest for a certain achievement that unlocks the next tier and another set of spells and skills of which that person has to master inorder to continue to lvl.

 

            Ten, Advertise! Market the game! sometimes the only reason why a game fails is that word of mouth isnt enough! WoW was so popular cause people think there were a million people playing it!!! Keep advertising the game about once every couple of months, let the public know about the game and let them know there are a lot of other people playing that game, lets be honost no one wants to play in a ghost town! Some people stop playing cause the buzz has run out. Keep the Buzz going Advertise!

 

            I could go on more , yet for now will leave this for others to read and add as is needed.

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Old 07-28-2012, 03:44 AM   #45
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Hell, no more zone-based. No more zone-based world in EQnext. EQ1/2 is enough.

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Old 07-28-2012, 05:06 AM   #46
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Playing catch up.

feldon30 wrote:

Agree with most of that, but the reduced hotbars. I do not want to see another Rift where 3-5 buttons are all you need to win the game.

Agreed. Better not look into Guild Wars 2 then.

feldon30 wrote:

I do think abilities should be more varied and situational. We should feel more heroic and less "beating on the mob until it's dead". We should be able to do crazy things in battle that have a significant impact on the group/raid.

Yep. This is why I miss 'disciplines' from EQ1. LONG reuse abilities that had over the top effects. I loved 'saving the day' by suddenly becoming nearly invincible and turning the mob with my ranger's 'weaponshield' on EQ1.

Gilasil wrote:

A lot of the things you say you don't like I either don't care about or actually like.  I few things I kind of agree with but I don't consider anything you said a deal breaker -- i.e. if EQNext has them my decision to buy wouldn't be affected all that much.  I'll be looking much more closely at things like general gameplay, amount of mindless grind, graphics, cool races, and potential for immersion.

[email protected] wrote:

-Tab Targeting Combat: This may seem small but at this point it is nearly a non-starter for me. It also happens to be a non-starter for any kind of action combat, even if these upcoming MMO's insist they still have action combat with it. Tab-targeting = last gen combat. The End. SoE has already made a decent start of good combat with DCUO, lets not take two steps back, shall we? 

Tab targeting is a GOOD thing.  EQNext is NOT going to be a shooter.  If you don't like it don't use it.  In EQ2 you can disable it easily enough.  Attempting to make EQNext a shooter WOULD be a deal breaker for me.  It's not an action game it's an RPG.  There's a HUGE difference.

So Skyrim/elder scrolls series isn't an RPG? Dragon's Dogma isn't an RPG? Think about all the games you have played. MOST of them don't use tab-targeting if there is to be targeting at all. Maybe lock-on combat which still needs you to be looking in their general direction. Tab-targeting is mostly a MMO crutch.

-Calling big groups 'Raid content': 2 or 2 1/2 groups does not raiding content make. I've already had to mourn the loss of what I consider real MMO raiding when the sizes of EQ1 and DAOC weren't carried on in new MMO's. 20 players is the absolute minimum I would consider a base for the bulk of raid content. x2 and x3 sizes are fine for some parts, though. This speaks to another point.

-Calling small groups an 'MMO': Call me crazy but I like my massively multiplayer online games to be massively multiplayer. Not massively simultaneous single player or small group. A persistent world with lots of people running around does not make a MMO all on its own. They are already trying this bunk with these supposed 'next gen' MMO's that have been announced and feature lists laid out.

Then I'll call you crazy.  You can't interact with 5000 people.  Where did I say the whole server or 5k people? You can with 5.  If you can find a good way for 5000 people to work together more power to you.  I've known various games to try -- usually some sort of server wide quest  EQ2 had their unlocking the Frogloks questline but I noticed they never did it again so I suspect it wasn't all that popular.  Other games did more along those lines -- the now defunct Horizons had server events for unlocking races and large infrastructure (to reach several parts of the game required what was basically a server wide crafting effort.  As that game is now defunect that obviously wasn't enough to save it. 

Otherwise, the existing model -- small groups with central places where more people can interact, along with things like brokers -- is good enough.

I would like to see an occasional humongeous raid like we sometimes had in EQ1.  One of those raids with 40-70 people.  (This was more like what I was talking about) While experience and the chance at drops were pretty negligable (Easily fixed: make them drop more loot), it was a lot of fun.  My guild used to run those raids as a way for the whole guild to do something together.  People got to know each other MUCH better then is the case in EQ2, because we all did those raids together (and maybe wiped together).  Since there was no limit on how many we could take we'd sometimes bring a true newbie along just so they could see some high end content.  However, this is most definately in the nice to have category only. This was my favorite thing in EQ1 by far. Matter of fact I would go as far as saying if EQ1 had these poor excuses for 'raids' games have now I would have quit much earlier on and barely cared about any future MMO's. If EQN biggest content is anything smaller than 20 people, i'm out. Absolutely no chance I will be playing it.

-Multiple hotbars needed/Bloated ability pool: Would be nice if a large part of my screen real estate wasn't buttons I had to push. I'd prefer it be used to view the gameplay. This is usually a result of a bloated ability pool, 5-10 ways to hit a single target isn't needed when you can just make one of those reuse fast and bump up their overall performance.

I prefer a more reactive playstyle, and don't appreciate having to memorize several dozen spell effects just so I can do my job, but I don't consider this a deal breaker.  However, my suspecian is they're trying to move away from huge volumes of buttons.  Witness the new beastlord class which has a small handful of fast refreshing combat arts.  While you can get a couple more through AA, it's still a small number compared to other classes. I think it will be much smaller too. Like you said they hinted at it with BL's and it's just the way the winds are blowing in MMO trends, So that one good thing at least.

-Disabling the ability to PLAY: Fine in moderation, extremely maddening in bulk. Basically control effects. being repeatedly disabled imposes the exact opposite of gameplay. When something happens that is the equivilent of unplugging your keyboard and mouse and there is no way out, it is completely unnecessary and has little to nothing to do with skill.

Getting charmed/stunned/stifled definately increases the tension which is good.  A tough fight SHOULD be tense.  I agree that too much of that gets old fast.  Those effects shouldn't be common and when they happen they shouldn't last a really long time.  Not because I'm just sitting around doing nothing -- because it's not long enough for that -- but because it's a cheap cop out if done too much.  An occasional charm in particular really gets players out of a rut.  SoE just shouldn't rely on it too much. Control effects only make me tense if I can actually do something about it. If using any and every ability at my disposal has the same effect as taking my hands of the mouse and keyboard, the last thing I am is 'tense.' Best way I would describe it is involuntary apathy.

 

[email protected] wrote:

Limit the in-combat clicks to 12-18 total spells/clickable items and let people choose what to bring.  Less spells does not mean a lower skill-cap, but too many spells will definitely alienate a large subset of players who feel overly-cluttered.  Please, no piano-playing hotbar combat.  Please, no whack-a-mole of 20-30 spells/clickable items in combat. 

Exactly. Number of abilities has nothing to do with skill. If that were true EQ2 would be the hardest video game on the market.

Kasar wrote:

They stripped the effects and made them plain attacks, so they're really just different timers, but I know all these WoW refugees like GCD timers that would make them meaningless.

You know you can use the keyboard to access four bars with only one taking up screen space using shift, alt, ctrl and the numbers...

And no typical GCD of 1.5-2 seconds. Its an obvious method to cap player skill with a low 'top speed.' It's like putting a speed limit on a foot race and the winner coming down to who had better aerodynamic equipment.

Not liking several hotbars really isn't about screen real estate, its about needing to have a bunch of hotbars. 5 different ways to do the same exact thing is boring, bloated, and again has nothing to do with player skill.

[email protected] wrote:

I think his small groups thing was more about everything being able to be done solo with a merc, or with a duo or trio. basically he's wanting old EQ1 back with this. were group content was GROUP content. you needed 5-6 people to do it, or you failed.

I actually liked trying to duo/trio stuff in EQ1 that I wasn't supposed to. It was like a whole new level of difficulty. I didn't do it a lot, but it was fun BARELY taking down a group mob where the slightest mistep would mean certain death. These days if you are well geared and can't solo group mobs you are a newb.

Veltherel wrote:

Are you sure you actually like playing these MMORPG things?

Yes. Now if people can stop making the same exact one with a few twists and extremely small advancements for 10 years I would be much happier. See the latest single player RPG's on the market? Now......ADAPT IT INTO AN MMO! GO! NO don't touch the combat or graphics.

It's like the MMO developers are purposely short selling themselves so they can get away with the smallest advancements possible. They could easily make huge leaps, all the tech has been around for years and proven, but they refuse to utilize it. At least SoE is knocking the complacent FPS developers around with PS2.

[email protected] wrote:

I disagree - Tera takes as much "skill" as playing diablo3.  Its a point a hold down mouse button then hit a few keys at the right time - essentially no different using current combat arts.  So far playing Tera reminds me of playing an arcade game.  I have not played Vindictus so cannot comment on that one.

Vindictus and more recently another F2P game called "continent of the ninth Seal", C9 for short, showcase much better action combat.

in C9 you really only need one hotbar and a lot of moves are tied into your basic movement functions. Such as doing a special attack by jumping and hitting left click, opposed to just hitting one of your hotkeys. Lots of variations as well. Jump+rclick, evade+lclick/rclick, jump+evade+rclick/lclick, D+lclick, double tap S while getting hit, etc.

Why I just don't play that game? No raiding. ALL instanced. And just a general gear grind. Kind of like D3. If i could smash some nice combat and next gen visuals into EQ1 raiding, grouping, and overall world with a couple more modern twists I would be SOO happy.

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Old 07-29-2012, 10:43 PM   #47
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[email protected] wrote:

[email protected] wrote:

I disagree - Tera takes as much "skill" as playing diablo3.  Its a point a hold down mouse button then hit a few keys at the right time - essentially no different using current combat arts.  So far playing Tera reminds me of playing an arcade game.  I have not played Vindictus so cannot comment on that one.

Vindictus and more recently another F2P game called "continent of the ninth Seal", C9 for short, showcase much better action combat.

in C9 you really only need one hotbar and a lot of moves are tied into your basic movement functions. Such as doing a special attack by jumping and hitting left click, opposed to just hitting one of your hotkeys. Lots of variations as well. Jump+rclick, evade+lclick/rclick, jump+evade+rclick/lclick, D+lclick, double tap S while getting hit, etc.

Why I just don't play that game? No raiding. ALL instanced. And just a general gear grind. Kind of like D3. If i could smash some nice combat and next gen visuals into EQ1 raiding, grouping, and overall world with a couple more modern twists I would be SOO happy.

TERA is terrible. The combat system was very stiff and awkwand like RIFT global cooldown. Largest PvE group size was only 5 man missions.

Vindictus does have 24 man raids where are amazing. That is definately the best raiding content I have ever played and I would like something like that in EQnext. It is very challenging and does not rely on 3rd party programs like ACT and guild connect to excell at it. Vindictus problem is lack of depth with no open world or player housing. Long grind level cap is also a turn off to players.

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Old 07-30-2012, 05:15 PM   #48
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If SOE ever makes EQ Next, how many of you would like to see the avatars be more realistic looking? (as with the star wars games). Yes, No?

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Old 07-30-2012, 08:56 PM   #49
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If I'm told I have to move my mouse every time I want to attack something, I won't play the game.

If I'm told there is only a minimal amount of questing to be done, & then only for certain weapons &/or at certain levels, I won't play the game.

If I'm told I have to group with people, many of whom I don't even know in any meaningful way, to accomplish anything remotely meaningful, I won't play the game. For example, if I can't even go into Antonica solo to hunt gnolls at 10th level, then IMO that game will suck, & I won't go near it.

Now, as for what I do not want in EQ Next: instances. I'm sick past my fuzzy ears of instances. Get rid of instances entirely, & I'll be a much happier camper.

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Old 08-03-2012, 09:53 AM   #50
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Freejazzlive wrote:

If I'm told I have to group with people, many of whom I don't even know in any meaningful way, to accomplish anything remotely meaningful, I won't play the game. For example, if I can't even go into Antonica solo to hunt gnolls at 10th level, then IMO that game will suck, & I won't go near it.

So you would have been one of the many who didn't like EQ2 when it launched.  I had a long friends list of people I'd found through LFG, primarily healers, that I could hit up for groups, since my weak guardian couldn't handle the heroic gnoll groups even around the Antonica claymore.  That list was convenient later in T5 raiding as well, but it was practically a necessity early on.  LFG was a frequently used tool, until it was "fixed" and no longer just a simple flag.

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Old 08-03-2012, 10:06 AM   #51
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Kasar wrote:

Freejazzlive wrote:

If I'm told I have to group with people, many of whom I don't even know in any meaningful way, to accomplish anything remotely meaningful, I won't play the game. For example, if I can't even go into Antonica solo to hunt gnolls at 10th level, then IMO that game will suck, & I won't go near it.

So you would have been one of the many who didn't like EQ2 when it launched.

I first started playing EQ2 in July 2005, before even the Combat Upgrade. I solo'd quite frequently, & had no problem doing so. EQ2 was not even close to the sort of "forced grouping" I'm talking about.

Edit: another thing I don't want to see would be raids limited to only 24 people in 4 groups of 6. I'd much, much prefer to see bigger raids. I like soloing, & I enjoy small groups, but I think raiding took a HUGE hit when raid sizes were maxed out at 24.

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Old 08-03-2012, 12:07 PM   #52
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Freejazzlive wrote:

Kasar wrote:

Freejazzlive wrote:

If I'm told I have to group with people, many of whom I don't even know in any meaningful way, to accomplish anything remotely meaningful, I won't play the game. For example, if I can't even go into Antonica solo to hunt gnolls at 10th level, then IMO that game will suck, & I won't go near it.

So you would have been one of the many who didn't like EQ2 when it launched.

I first started playing EQ2 in July 2005, before even the Combat Upgrade. I solo'd quite frequently, & had no problem doing so. EQ2 was not even close to the sort of "forced grouping" I'm talking about.

Edit: another thing I don't want to see would be raids limited to only 24 people in 4 groups of 6. I'd much, much prefer to see bigger raids. I like soloing, & I enjoy small groups, but I think raiding took a HUGE hit when raid sizes were maxed out at 24.

Most classes could not solo. I had already began taking a long break a couple of months before you started playing, so this may have changed by the time you started, but the reason classes couldn't solo is because of the difficulty of the mobs. Most mobs were meant for groups. As a coercer at launch my damage output was garbage and charm was broken for months. It was possible to kill SOME (very few mobs were solo con) mobs, but the far more viable option was grouping. With that said, I did have guild members that were able to solo x2 encounters solo, I believe it was templers that could do that, also berserkers had a broken skill that allowed them to aoe mow down x4 mobs, a few berserkers used the bug to level quickly.

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Old 08-03-2012, 03:16 PM   #53
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Iad wrote:

Freejazzlive wrote:

Kasar wrote:

Freejazzlive wrote:

If I'm told I have to group with people, many of whom I don't even know in any meaningful way, to accomplish anything remotely meaningful, I won't play the game. For example, if I can't even go into Antonica solo to hunt gnolls at 10th level, then IMO that game will suck, & I won't go near it.

So you would have been one of the many who didn't like EQ2 when it launched.

I first started playing EQ2 in July 2005, before even the Combat Upgrade. I solo'd quite frequently, & had no problem doing so. EQ2 was not even close to the sort of "forced grouping" I'm talking about.

Edit: another thing I don't want to see would be raids limited to only 24 people in 4 groups of 6. I'd much, much prefer to see bigger raids. I like soloing, & I enjoy small groups, but I think raiding took a HUGE hit when raid sizes were maxed out at 24.

Most classes could not solo. I had already began taking a long break a couple of months before you started playing, so this may have changed by the time you started, but the reason classes couldn't solo is because of the difficulty of the mobs. Most mobs were meant for groups. As a coercer at launch my damage output was garbage and charm was broken for months. It was possible to kill SOME (very few mobs were solo con) mobs, but the far more viable option was grouping. With that said, I did have guild members that were able to solo x2 encounters solo, I believe it was templers that could do that, also berserkers had a broken skill that allowed them to aoe mow down x4 mobs, a few berserkers used the bug to level quickly.

Things must have changed, because when I started, the only classes I had any real difficulty soloing were the two Chanters, for reasons you stated. I know of no melee classes that had that difficulty. By July of 2005, there were plenty of soloable gnolls & other such creatures in Antonica.

It's one thing to have a game where soloing is slow but possible -- which is what EQ2 was, in the late summer of 2005. It's entirely another to have a game where even doing n00b quests in the starter zone requires grouping, because there is simply no solo content whatsoever. 2005-era EQ2 was fine.

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Old 08-06-2012, 12:21 AM   #54
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One other thing which was brought home to me today while I was playing EQ2:

Mentoring.  PLEASE!!! DO IT RIGHT OR DON'T DO IT AT ALL!!!!!

The original idea of mentoring was that you could mentor down to someone's level and do it just like you were at that level.  It was a way for friends of different levels to play together.  It was NOT a powerleveling exploit.  The idea of solo mentoring (chronomage) was so you could do lower level content you may have missed originally.

As was brought home to me today, nowadays it's just a way to be horribly overpowered and trivialize content, usually with the intent to powerlevel someone.  That was not the original purpose.

So mentoring doesn't work at all for it's intended purpose.  It only works for powerleveling.  Which is NOT its intended purpose!

This was brought home to me today.  I happen to have several beastlords and decided to finish off the manastone quest in Varsoon on a couple of them.  I mentored my 92/320 beastlord to 30, and headed to varsoon.  Everything was ridiculously easy. I was one shotting stuff right and left.  boring boring boring.  Didn't bother with a merc as it wasn't needed.  I eventually got disgusted and left without finishing the quest.

I then took my naturally level 31 into varsoon with a merc.  Then it was fun and challanging.  I finished the quest and had fun doing it.

This was a dramatic illustration that mentoring in it's current form is a horrible failure at what it was intended to do.  For just letting a high level experience lower level content it doesn't work at all.  I'd LOVE it if I could mentor my high level down and do low level content as it was intended.  That's fun.  But not this.

So instead I"m leveling up alts so I can experience the low level content at level.  Becuase mentoring is just plain broken.

So mentoring is a great idea.  But please please please, don't put it into EQ Next in it's current form.  Please. 

-------------------

And while I"m on the subjects of exploits.  SoE needs to get a lot more serious about not allowing them and plugging them PROMPTLY when they surface.  Exploits completely change gameplay and not for the better.  If there's anything which would keep me away from SoE games (other then cartoony graphics) it would be maintaining their usual lackluster stance towards exploits.  People find a way to cheat and get something for far less effort, others find out about it, and eventually the intended gameplay is forgotten.  At that point, playing largely becomes using a series of exploits.  Any attempt to stick to the intended gameplay meets with ridicule.  I'm getting rather sick of it.

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Old 08-11-2012, 06:37 AM   #55
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MalletMan wrote:

If SOE ever makes EQ Next, how many of you would like to see the avatars be more realistic looking? (as with the star wars games). Yes, No?

Yeah, not expecting SquareEnix-level characters which looks dang cool, but no more plastic-looking playdoh hair and character models like in EQ2. Stylish and realism are both good as long as we can make and customize our chars to look awesome.

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Old 08-17-2012, 11:59 AM   #56
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The one thing I don't want to see is another lobby based instanced themepark. bring back the adventure in a huge open world (preferably without the constant zoning)

[email protected] wrote:

the problem is that the new generation of MMO players don't WANT complex. they don't want interdependancy, and they don't want to wait longer then 5 minutes to do things.

tradeskills used to be more complex. you had to make components before making items, and you couldn't make all the components yourself. so you had to barter with other tradeskillers. you make me that leather wrap for my sword hilt, I'll make you these iron studs for your brawler leather breastplate. failing a reaction could kill you...and reactions at least seemed to come probably twice as fast as they do now (the forge for the longest time was the highest killer of players)

people threw fits and hated it and shouted about it until it became what it is now.

The reason people hated the interdepence is because it shortly becomes a broken mess in level based thempark MMOs. Once most players start leveling up the lower end players can never get anything done because tehy depend on other lower level players in a game where everyone is maxed out sitting in the latest quest hub spamming "LFG for 10000 run thru the latest instance."

Crafting newbie gear shouldn't take longer than actually leveling to the next tier of gear. Hell, even now with as easy as crafting is in EQ2 it still takes more time to harvest the mats than to get the 10 levels needed to use the next tier of gear.

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Old 08-17-2012, 05:38 PM   #57
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It's SOE, they are going to put out what they think you want, regardless.

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Old 08-21-2012, 03:51 AM   #58
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remove speed ... why must everything go so fast?? (can't even walk with my horse and that sux)

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Old 08-22-2012, 12:33 AM   #59
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Freejazzlive wrote:

Iad wrote:

Most classes could not solo. I had already began taking a long break a couple of months before you started playing, so this may have changed by the time you started, but the reason classes couldn't solo is because of the difficulty of the mobs. Most mobs were meant for groups. As a coercer at launch my damage output was garbage and charm was broken for months. It was possible to kill SOME (very few mobs were solo con) mobs, but the far more viable option was grouping. With that said, I did have guild members that were able to solo x2 encounters solo, I believe it was templers that could do that, also berserkers had a broken skill that allowed them to aoe mow down x4 mobs, a few berserkers used the bug to level quickly.

Things must have changed, because when I started, the only classes I had any real difficulty soloing were the two Chanters, for reasons you stated. I know of no melee classes that had that difficulty. By July of 2005, there were plenty of soloable gnolls & other such creatures in Antonica.

It's one thing to have a game where soloing is slow but possible -- which is what EQ2 was, in the late summer of 2005. It's entirely another to have a game where even doing n00b quests in the starter zone requires grouping, because there is simply no solo content whatsoever. 2005-era EQ2 was fine.

I got EQ2 about a week after release.  At that time and for some time after that the first few levels (up to at least 10, maybe a bit farther) were very soloable and most people soloed them.  They were typically the levels you'd do in the Qeynos or Freeport suburbs and Isle of Refuge.  Once you got to Anotnica or Commonlands things changed.  There would still be solo mobs but there would also be heroic mobs and a lot of them.  All those gnoll camps you see outside Qeynos were heroic back then.  As were most of the bears etc.  If you were very careful and lucky you could probably manage to solo stuff but you'd just be soloing trash mobs.  You might be able to solo some green heroics.   It wasn't very productive or satisfying.  If you really wanted to get something done you had to group once you were past the really low level stuff.

I was gone from about late 2005 to 2008 (Kunark) and sometime in that timeframe they did a total revamp, got rid of almost all the overland heroic mobs, and replaced them with solo mobs.  The game became a lot more solo friendly like it is now.   I suspect they did it in response to WoW which was solo friendly and eating them alive (EQ2 and WoW released within a week of each other).  It was kind of funny, I came back fully expecting to quit within a month or two when I hit the grouping required stuff.  Except I never hit it.  So I'm still here.

I do not want to see a return of that.  While I used to put up with the requirment to constantly group because I had no choice, it would be very hard to return to that now.  I never liked the requirement to group and it was a big part of the reason I left for several years to play other games which were solo friendly.

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Old 08-22-2012, 03:02 PM   #60
Freejazzlive

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Gilasil wrote:

Freejazzlive wrote:

Iad wrote:

Most classes could not solo. I had already began taking a long break a couple of months before you started playing, so this may have changed by the time you started, but the reason classes couldn't solo is because of the difficulty of the mobs. Most mobs were meant for groups. As a coercer at launch my damage output was garbage and charm was broken for months. It was possible to kill SOME (very few mobs were solo con) mobs, but the far more viable option was grouping. With that said, I did have guild members that were able to solo x2 encounters solo, I believe it was templers that could do that, also berserkers had a broken skill that allowed them to aoe mow down x4 mobs, a few berserkers used the bug to level quickly.

Things must have changed, because when I started, the only classes I had any real difficulty soloing were the two Chanters, for reasons you stated. I know of no melee classes that had that difficulty. By July of 2005, there were plenty of soloable gnolls & other such creatures in Antonica.

It's one thing to have a game where soloing is slow but possible -- which is what EQ2 was, in the late summer of 2005. It's entirely another to have a game where even doing n00b quests in the starter zone requires grouping, because there is simply no solo content whatsoever. 2005-era EQ2 was fine.

I got EQ2 about a week after release.  At that time and for some time after that the first few levels (up to at least 10, maybe a bit farther) were very soloable and most people soloed them.  They were typically the levels you'd do in the Qeynos or Freeport suburbs and Isle of Refuge.  Once you got to Anotnica or Commonlands things changed.  There would still be solo mobs but there would also be heroic mobs and a lot of them.  All those gnoll camps you see outside Qeynos were heroic back then.  As were most of the bears etc.  If you were very careful and lucky you could probably manage to solo stuff but you'd just be soloing trash mobs.  You might be able to solo some green heroics.   It wasn't very productive or satisfying.  If you really wanted to get something done you had to group once you were past the really low level stuff.

All of that was true in July of 2005 when I started -- except for the notion that you had to group to get anything done. I grouped some, but I solo'd a lot more, & had no trouble doing so. "Productive" & "Satisfying" are relative terms; I had no trouble feeling "productive" & "satisfied," but perhaps that's just me.I don't really want a return to what it was in July 2005 either, but ... I think SOE went way too far in nerfing the overland zones. I'm pretty sure there's a happy medium somewhere, but I'm not seeing it with SOE. All I want is a situation where I actually feel "challenged" when playing, not the current situation where I can take out level 90 mobs without even using stealth, & where simply having a mercenary renders virtually all "solo" content faceroll easy.

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