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Old 02-19-2008, 10:28 AM   #61
Shaulin Dolamite

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What hurts the most about posts like this and the many that have come from the ranger forum  as of late, is they all stem from a horribly thought out and poorly worded post from a certain dev. We respond to his/her post and the dev ignores everything from that point on : (

Sensing a pattern here.

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Old 02-19-2008, 10:27 PM   #62
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Shaulin Dolamite wrote:

What hurts the most about posts like this and the many that have come from the ranger forum  as of late, is they all stem from a horribly thought out and poorly worded post from a certain dev. We respond to his/her post and the dev ignores everything from that point on : (

Sensing a pattern here.

If I was a dev. manager, and one of my devs went off the reservation and posted something that generated as much vehemence (deserved or not) back at home, I wouldn't let that person post anything again without getting approval even in official forums, at least until such time as the griefing had died down.I don't see this dying down until next expansion, and maybe not even then, unless they actually fix something.  I am not holding my breath.Oh, and if one of my devs created an account to try to mask who they were (confirming that would require knowing the IP addresses being posted from, which certainly eq2flames has the ability to do, if they chose to) and posted a second time, they wouldn't be a dev in my organization anymore.  I expect that the ip address for HATEU2 is not from an SOE computer- the opportunity to grief your customers (your employers, really) isn't usually worth losing your job over, at least to those in a normal state of sanity.That said, there IS still a pattern of no dev response to a very pertinent issue.  Shame, because this is a wonderful opportunity for engagement, to show concern for the customer base, and try to repair the ill-will created by a dev's post (well, at least one post) in an unofficial forum.  People skills seem definitely lacking.Maybe the SOE management should have to undergo the same classes that the managers that thought putting a root kit on Sony music CDs probably had to go through.
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Old 02-20-2008, 04:13 AM   #63
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I seriously doubt that it was a developer that made the post in question - just someone trying to stir up the pot, which it clearly did.

In any case, the forum folks would do well to keep thier own personal attacks in check, which some do not.

In any case, whether the problem lies with a developer or with soe's current position toward our class as a whole, the situation has been poorly managed at best.

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Old 02-20-2008, 04:54 AM   #64
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[email protected] wrote:

Anyway, the only thing HATEU2 said that made sense, was: 'show me the parses, then we'll talk'. So, let's get those bows and go out and get the parses. The parses will tell it all in about a week or two. Then we can come back here and give HATEU2 the proof he needs.

I wish you were right Meerah but I fear you are wrong.  I think the response will be "well you solo better than assassins do.  Thats the trade off."  I really think that this is what he isooking at.  One of the guys in my guild regularly runs parses of various players while we are soloing (I have NO clue how he does it but one day he posted a parse on me and I hadn't grouped with him or anyone in the guild).   He sees my numbers and says I rock.  That being said when we do the odd 2.5 group raid (about the most we ever have on at one time) The assassin, the casters etc are usually out parsing me with the exception of one conjuror who was built to solo as well (neither of us have our AA mirrors yet). 

Because of this I have chosen to take the role of what I call the "death commando".  I target off the MT typically BUT if by some weird happenstance the Alt Tank or one of the healers is getting smacked HARD and the MT is overwhelmed (we are WAY short on tanks in the over 50 range, hence another reason we are not a "raid" guild).  I nuke the dickens out of the mob and pull the aggro off of them to me.  Then I get rezzed and other guild member doing more dps than I on the main target probably lived because the tank and/or the healers lived.  Its a thank less job but it seems a "taking one for the team" is the best I can do right now on a raid.  But the devs won't care about that.  They'll just say "you solo better Gisallo, be thankful, or I'll laterally shift ya" all the while forgetting that I spend the gross national product of Guatemala on arrows and poisons every month in order to do it.  That apparently is not a high enough price to be able to solo a "little" better.

The devs seem to think that if you can raid well, you don't have to solo and if you can solo, you don't have to raid well.  Makes sense for them, no reason to actually THINK and develope mechanics that balance things out.  MAYBE because of the fact that their Kunark bows actually perform worse than T-8 bows due to arrow mechanics they will fix this one issue, but I'll wager it will be by creating a T-9 arrow that requires a rare to make not by fixing the mechanic itself.

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Old 02-20-2008, 05:48 AM   #65
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im very surprised they havent created a recipe for lvl 7x arrows already... Handcrafted. That would be the easies and most logical "fix" for the mechanics.*shrug*++Xan
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Old 02-20-2008, 06:56 AM   #66
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Just because we haven't responded doesn't mean we aren't aware of the issues and complaints.  I think we try to explain this every time a new issue arises.  You can be sure that we're aware of what is being discussed on the forums.This isn't my area, so it's not up to me to post about what is or is not being done.  I know you guys want to at least see a response that we're reading this, so thats why I made the post.  Unfortunately I can't discuss specifics and I hope you understand why.
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Old 02-20-2008, 07:07 AM   #67
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thx for the reply!SMILEY++Xan
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Old 02-20-2008, 07:31 AM   #68
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Thanks a lot for responding here, Rothgar.  I certainly do realize this isn't your particular area.While we certainly appreciate the response, I think the issue extends beyond just the lack of communication in the past.  While more communication and more detailed communication would certainly help relieve some frustration, these class-breaking issues that rangers have have been left outstanding for months to years, and at some point no amount of communication can make up for a lack of action.  Please note that I'm not blaming you for this lack of action, as again I realize this is not your area, but simply stating that at this point rangers are highly anxious to see their concerns remedied.  Again, thank you for responding.  I realize this is the best you can do, given that this is not your area, and it's certainly a step in the right direction.-Azleya, Ranger and Officer of StrikeLucan D'Lere
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Old 02-20-2008, 07:34 AM   #69
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Am faithful to my ranger and I will never betray.  But after losing to greens and greys PvP.  He is going Crafter/Harvester, and I'll start working on one of my alts...
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Old 02-20-2008, 07:35 AM   #70
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Rothgar wrote:
Just because we haven't responded doesn't mean we aren't aware of the issues and complaints.  I think we try to explain this every time a new issue arises.  You can be sure that we're aware of what is being discussed on the forums.This isn't my area, so it's not up to me to post about what is or is not being done.  I know you guys want to at least see a response that we're reading this, so thats why I made the post.  Unfortunately I can't discuss specifics and I hope you understand why.

The major problem is, that this isn't a new issue, rangers have been pointing this out and bringing it up for over a year now and developers continue to do nothing, thus the frustration you are seeing.

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Old 02-20-2008, 08:11 AM   #71
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Rothgar wrote:
Just because we haven't responded doesn't mean we aren't aware of the issues and complaints.  I think we try to explain this every time a new issue arises.  You can be sure that we're aware of what is being discussed on the forums.This isn't my area, so it's not up to me to post about what is or is not being done.  I know you guys want to at least see a response that we're reading this, so thats why I made the post.  Unfortunately I can't discuss specifics and I hope you understand why.

Honestly, what is more discouraging than seeing no developer responses to issues is developers names only popping up in the NGD section of the forums... Shows you guys are willing to take the time to post some useless nonsense yet you "don't have the time" to post and aknowledge that you are at least aware of an issue.

And by the way, Aeralik has been the absolutely most biased developer this game has ever seen. This alone adds fuel to the fire.

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Old 02-20-2008, 10:25 AM   #72
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[email protected] DLere wrote:
Thanks a lot for responding here, Rothgar.  I certainly do realize this isn't your particular area.While we certainly appreciate the response, I think the issue extends beyond just the lack of communication in the past.  While more communication and more detailed communication would certainly help relieve some frustration, these class-breaking issues that rangers have have been left outstanding for months to years, and at some point no amount of communication can make up for a lack of action.  Please note that I'm not blaming you for this lack of action, as again I realize this is not your area, but simply stating that at this point rangers are highly anxious to see their concerns remedied.  Again, thank you for responding.  I realize this is the best you can do, given that this is not your area, and it's certainly a step in the right direction.-Azleya, Ranger and Officer of StrikeLucan D'Lere
Totaly agree with Azleya, while I appreciate you posting in this forum Rothgar, the problem we are all so worked up about, is a class breaking issue that has been a problem for much too long with zero action taken to resolve the issue.
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Old 02-20-2008, 10:55 AM   #73
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Rothgar wrote:
Just because we haven't responded doesn't mean we aren't aware of the issues and complaints.  I think we try to explain this every time a new issue arises.  You can be sure that we're aware of what is being discussed on the forums.This isn't my area, so it's not up to me to post about what is or is not being done.  I know you guys want to at least see a response that we're reading this, so thats why I made the post.  Unfortunately I can't discuss specifics and I hope you understand why.
Good to see a reply, no matter who it is. I just hope that this means a fix is in the works (and not the kind of ''fix'' that a vet performs on a dog...), and this is not just here to try and make the issue simmer down and die.
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Old 02-20-2008, 11:49 AM   #74
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Thanks for the reply Rothgar, this is an issue that has been going on so long we often wonder if anyone is even aware of the issue over there.
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Old 02-20-2008, 12:31 PM   #75
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Rothgar wrote:
Just because we haven't responded doesn't mean we aren't aware of the issues and complaints.  I think we try to explain this every time a new issue arises.  You can be sure that we're aware of what is being discussed on the forums.This isn't my area, so it's not up to me to post about what is or is not being done.  I know you guys want to at least see a response that we're reading this, so thats why I made the post.  Unfortunately I can't discuss specifics and I hope you understand why.

Thank you for responding, Rothgar.

I don't think the issues Rangers have comes from believing developers are unware of our concerns. Our frustration is born out of the general sense that we believe SOE is aware, but either (1) doesn't care much about fixing broken ranger issues, or (2) is repositioning the class toward a different playstyle and is not communicating this vision to players and potential players.

Basically, we just want to know where things stand so we can make decisons about how, or even if, we are going to invest more time into playing the class. The player base is simply getting increasingly fustrated, and a result, increasingly angry because we have had numerous developer responses that communicate SOE awareness of broken ranger issues, with lots of talk about looking into it, but nothing gets ever gets done. Add to that, the amount of direct and indirect nerfing to the class over the last year or so, and there you have it. Given the way things have been handled, I think it's unrealistic for SOE to expect Ranger players to be feeling anything less than disenfranchised by thier game experience over the last year.

I do not agree with the aggressive posture some players have taken toward our developer - its counter-productive and ignores the fact that he, just like everyone else, is trying to do his job in the best way he knows how.

Never the less, Rangers don't know from day to the next what thier character will play like. Our dps has been nerfed in pve and pvp, our class is heavily gear dependent and the itemizatin options that are optimal for it are scarce and average at best.

Our role has been pure dps. Now, we are falling behind other classes dps with the added disadvantage of having no other group utility function. So rangers are stuck in purgatory in both the pve and pvp experiece, and this not fun.

If SOE would simply communicate a vision as to what the Rangers is becomming, it help  many of us make decisons now and in the future.  

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Old 02-20-2008, 01:09 PM   #76
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Reading this thread, it's like it's 2005 and I'm a SWG ranger again...(I'd go play a hunter in WoW but I've already done that SMILEY )
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Old 02-20-2008, 01:22 PM   #77
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Knowing Sony, this "fix" will involve a nerf to all bows below lvl. 80.
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Old 02-20-2008, 02:04 PM   #78
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NGE - its coming.

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Old 02-20-2008, 02:10 PM   #79
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CapnJax21 wrote:

NGE - its coming.

So wait...you're going to leapfrog the CU and go right for the NGE? Man thats cold.
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Old 02-20-2008, 02:39 PM   #80
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Wait, we're not in the CU?
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Old 02-20-2008, 02:51 PM   #81
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CapnJax21 wrote:
Wait, we're not in the CU?
Maybe i missed the memo, I was hoping the CU would bring about improved ammo usage and the NGE would enhance the need of ammo for stats only. Maybe that was a dream I had. Sometimes reality and fantasy bleed into one another. We will have to wait and see if any changes are implemented to make the game more "iconic" and feel more "everquesty".
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Old 02-20-2008, 03:19 PM   #82
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I'm hoping for more particle effects and the removal of 15 classes (ranger being one of them).
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Old 02-20-2008, 03:21 PM   #83
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Oh oh and the addition of shiney trinkets as a reward for hard work.

Lol both of us being SWG alumni we could keep this going all day.

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Old 02-20-2008, 03:27 PM   #84
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I made a medic in the NGE.  Loved it when I would use my Heal Bomb and would lag out the entire zone.  Medic crosses all over the screen for everyone FTW!

Oh, you have pets?  Not anymore.  Oh, you can still have them in your datapad, but forget about letting them out.  Enjoy!

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Old 02-20-2008, 03:32 PM   #85
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Gasisna wrote:

Lol both of us being SWG alumni we could keep this going all day.

I could, but I feel like feces everytime I write something about it.  Sad pandas.  That was the most immersive MMO i've ever played. 
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Old 02-20-2008, 04:36 PM   #86
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voxranger wrote:

Thank you for responding, Rothgar

I don't think the issues Rangers have comes from believing developers are unware of our concerns. Our frustration is born out of the general sense that we believe SOE is aware, but either (1) doesn't care much about fixing broken ranger issues, or (2) is repositioning the class toward a different playstyle and is not communicating this vision to players and potential players....

If SOE would simply communicate a vision as to what the Rangers is becomming, it help  many of us make decisons now and in the future.

I agree it was nice to see a developer respond, though one could argue whether a response with no substance is simply counter productive.

As for where the ranger is going, I hate to say it, but NO where.  Why.  Our own developer has said so.  He has said and I quote "you guys are doing fine" and "while we may do something about arrow mechanics don't expect any big fix, it'll be more like a lateral shift" in so far as Rangers are concerned.  Thats from our dev the guy who's "area" this is.  So basically as far as our dev's concerned we have no problems and even if they fix the arrow mechanic issue they will nerf something else related to us to keep us in what he sees as a good position.

I would agree with you that singleing out our developer is counter productive if I had not gone through posts from before I started posting on any mechanics related forum and seen just how arrogant and unresponsive.  One gives respect to those who show it.  I have seen perfectly reasonable, logical and polite posts dismissed and insulted out of hand by our developer.  Does that deserve respect in return?

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Old 02-20-2008, 04:45 PM   #87
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Its nice to see a dev respond. However, sony really needs to prioritize alittle better. This has been a known issue for 6 moths now, rolling on 7. And for someone to be waiting that long just isent fair. What did it for me was nerfing the epic. At the start of the game near the first year I remember CLEARLY sony deciding to change hitbox's of giants so rangers wouldent have to be so far back. When sony nerfed our epic with the current hitbox issue with dragons/other large mobs. It made me go "wait dident they fix this. Why did they make it harder on my class?" That for me was the last straw. Currently my account expires on march 7th. If my issues are solved i'll jump back quickly. If they arent, i'll keep playing WoW for awhile.
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Old 02-20-2008, 04:45 PM   #88
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[email protected] DLere wrote:
voxranger wrote:

Thank you for responding, Rothgar

I don't think the issues Rangers have comes from believing developers are unware of our concerns. Our frustration is born out of the general sense that we believe SOE is aware, but either (1) doesn't care much about fixing broken ranger issues, or (2) is repositioning the class toward a different playstyle and is not communicating this vision to players and potential players....

If SOE would simply communicate a vision as to what the Rangers is becomming, it help  many of us make decisons now and in the future.

I agree it was nice to see a developer respond, though one could argue whether a response with no substance is simply counter productive.

As for where the ranger is going, I hate to say it, but NO where.  Why.  Our own developer has said so.  He has said and I quote "you guys are doing fine" and "while we may do something about arrow mechanics don't expect any big fix, it'll be more like a lateral shift" in so far as Rangers are concerned.  Thats from our dev the guy who's "area" this is.  So basically as far as our dev's concerned we have no problems and even if they fix the arrow mechanic issue they will nerf something else related to us to keep us in what he sees as a good position.

I agree.  I have already made the decision to relegate my ranger into harvesting mode. I still bring him out for instance runs and pvp, but only to help guildies - hes just not that much fun to play atm and I am tired of sinking 15-20P per week into consumables for a character that just isnt that fun to play anymore. Now, I'm power leveling an alt to 80 asap so can better enjoy the t8 content and pvp.

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Old 02-20-2008, 05:08 PM   #89
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Rothgar wrote:
Just because we haven't responded doesn't mean we aren't aware of the issues and complaints.  I think we try to explain this every time a new issue arises.  You can be sure that we're aware of what is being discussed on the forums.This isn't my area, so it's not up to me to post about what is or is not being done.  I know you guys want to at least see a response that we're reading this, so thats why I made the post.  Unfortunately I can't discuss specifics and I hope you understand why.

Thanks for the response, it is appreciated.

As others have already said though, the fantastically frustrating part is that the person who IS in charge of this area continues to post that we are 'fine' and shows absolutely no real desire to fix an issue that is truly, truly gamebreaking.  After months and months of posts on this topic, detailed, very well reasoned posts, to have the only response be 'oh, yeah, that's broken, but meh' is maddening. To have our epic nerfed after less than a day after the discovery, after epics were delayed for months, by the same man who has shown absolutely no desire to fix our issues, and on top of that to have the nerf remove the one and only reason any ranger would ever use the fabled version over a T7 bow is insane. It was the very last straw, and I cancelled.

I appreciate that this issue is not one that can be easily fixed. I appreciate that it will take time. But we have no guarantee that any real fix is actually coming (and not some half-arsed 'lateral shift' as was hinted at), and meantime SOE is asking us to continue to give them money. It's not just arrows. Rangers need a serious overhaul to be a valid class able to compete with the others. There are so many problems with this class, BIG issues, that need to be addressed and that are continuously ignored that I'm at the last end of my rope for hoping that any of them will ever be addressed.

Why am I still posting? Because I don't want to quit. I would love to resubscribe. I like your game. But I'm no longer willing to give SOE more money for the sake of 'maybe, someday'.

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Old 02-20-2008, 05:43 PM   #90
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This thread makes me sad.  I log into my ranger now to try and get to 80 but its not fun anymore.  I feel like I'm going through the motions but with no real enjoyment out of it.  How sad is it that devs that aren't even responsible for us are feeling the need to post and tell us that they are reading it.  It doesn't matter who reads it because our own developer said he doesn't care and other developers aren't going to go to him in his little cube and say "whats up?".

Simple fact is he plays an assassin, he is tired of being beaten by rangers in PvE or PvP and has decided to buff his class and nerf the one that he hates.  I only speculate on this based upon the actual responses we have gotten from him to posts that have been well organized, well thoughout, and with no disrespect towards him.  The only enjoyment 90% of us who have lvled up to end game are going to get is to either betray to an assassin or leave and play a game where their ranger class is more in line with what we are looking for.

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