EQ2 Forum Archive @ EQ2Wire

 

Go Back   EQ2 Forum Archive @ EQ2Wire > EverQuest II > General EverQuest II Discussion > General Gameplay Discussion
Members List Search Mark Forums Read

Notices

Reply
 
Thread Tools
Old 10-29-2009, 08:38 PM   #241
Myster

General
Myster's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2004
Posts: 114
Default

Gaige wrote:

Lethe5683 wrote:

Because the only reason most people would change their race is because of the racial trait changes that were so conveniantly released right before the race change potion.

SOE announced the racial trait revamp well ahead of the race change potion.  It wasn't decided until Fan Faire to add the item to the SC marketplace per player request.

They were going to just redo the racials and that was that.  Don't like your race choice after the revamp, REROLL.

Thankfully they listened to the players at Fan Faire and via the survey and they implemented the potion AFTER doing the revamp and letting people get a feel for the racials.

You're making a mountain out of barely any sand.

So SOE decides to completely change racial abilities, making some races have... nothing what so ever that is useful for their class, when before they did have useful abilities. And your respons is to just reroll your possibly level 80 well geared character? This is the kind of opinion that makes people want to quit.

And no, I'm not quiting yet. But only due to friends that are still playing. And they are getting tired of it too.

__________________
Mysteran of Phoenix Rising - Antonia Bayle
Myster is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-29-2009, 08:42 PM   #242
hellfire

Loremaster
hellfire's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2004
Location: NY
Posts: 1,842
Default

[email protected] Bayle wrote:

So SOE decides to completely change racial abilities, making some races have... nothing what so ever that is useful for their class, when before they did have useful abilities.

Some class race combo wasdrastically like this so much that there was  a reason for the revamp.

What class/race combos dont get anything usefull now...because from what have seen it very much evened out across the board with packages that effect most everyone.

__________________
Summoner pets are 1/3 the dps of a summoner and yet our stats and modifiers do not affect them.Since a pet is 1/3 a summoners dps,a summoner receives 2/3 benefit from gear when compared to any other class.

SHARED STATS AND MODIFIERS ARE A MUST!

FIX SUMMONERS IN 08!

FIX SUMMONERS IN 09!

FIX SUMMONERS IN 10!


2011 and Finally we are Fixed!

/Rides off into the sunset
hellfire is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-29-2009, 08:44 PM   #243
Myster

General
Myster's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2004
Posts: 114
Default

[email protected] Bayle wrote:

[email protected] wrote:

Well, I didn't compile that write up, but I do believe that he meant the zone takes 5 min to get through.

  However, I think you're missing the point on that. When LoN first launched, and now Station Cash, some people were upset that there would be in-game items that could only be had through playing the game and therefore purchasing packs. SOE told us, at the time, that these were only to be fluff items, so what's the big deal?

  Now, there's a pretty nice wrist item (Legendary tagged, but could easily have a Fabled tag) that can only be had by purchasing gawd know how many packs of LoN. Where is this going to lead us next? LoN loot Mythicals? Or maybe just spend 200,000 SC for one? That's perhaps blowing it a bit out of proportion, but the path seems to be a slippery one...

I don't think I am missing the point, though, I do honestly appreciate it being explained as you have.  Conversationally SMILEY

Seriously...thank you for the civility.

I dont believe I need to worry about any of it to be perfectly honest.

I don't care what car my neighbor drives.  I don't care if he obtained it in some way other than me.  My car is still my car and my history with it is not lessened by anything my neighbor does.

Poor analogy I know.

But seriously, WHY should I or any player who reads this care how any raider or casual obtained their gear?

I don't care if player x raided a castle 50 times to get one drop that allowed him to craft something that he had to then give to x NPC who then sends them to raid the super epic part of the castle another 50 times....or if you whipped out your credit card and paid $15 bucks for 3 boosters and were lucky enough to get it in the pack...either way.../shrug

Why should I as a player, care more about what you are doing, than my own actions?  You spending time or money on this game in whatever form you so desire does not diminish or stop me from playing my game.

I know there is some proverbial slippery slope that we all are in danger of falling down...but I just can't imagine some of the doom scenarios actually playing out as people describe (maybe not here...but certainly elsewhere).

I read all these posts, and please dont misunderstand or think I am belittling anyones opinion, but I just dont get riled at all.  I don't see a reason to expend my energy getting upset over this.

Kinda more like... you and your neighbor have similar model cars. But after you buy yours, the manufacturer comes in and removes your AC unit (After all, it's not strictly needed to use or drive the car but it is rather nice to have). At the same time, they go in and not only leave your neighbor's AC unit in, but also give him some great benefits, like free DVD system and heck, maybe a better sound system while they are at it. Then they say they'll charge you $500 to put in a tray that holds a big ice cube into the car so that you can keep cool.

You aren't where you started, maybe a little worse off. After all, you don't need an AC. While your neighbor gets some rather nice benefits to it. In a situation like that I would be more than a little upset.

It's not an issue as to what you are driving compared to what they are driving. It's the changes that were made without your consent.

__________________
Mysteran of Phoenix Rising - Antonia Bayle
Myster is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-29-2009, 08:46 PM   #244
Myster

General
Myster's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2004
Posts: 114
Default

[email protected] wrote:

[email protected] Bayle wrote:

So SOE decides to completely change racial abilities, making some races have... nothing what so ever that is useful for their class, when before they did have useful abilities.

Some class race combo wasdrastically like this so much that there was  a reason for the revamp.

What class/race combos dont get anything usefull now...because from what have seen it very much evened out across the board with packages that effect most everyone.

Take a look at Dark Elf Healer/Inquisitor. Mage and Scout stuff. So offensive spell bonuses and melee bonuses. Not exactly useful if your primary role is a healer now is it?

My wood elf Guardian (Who used to have some decent tank bonuses) can now get scout things... which help a bit, but still are not for his primary role.

__________________
Mysteran of Phoenix Rising - Antonia Bayle
Myster is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-29-2009, 10:14 PM   #245
aphfid

Newbie
 
Join Date: Oct 2009
Posts: 5
Default

Lethe5683 wrote:

Gaige wrote:

Race changes aren't like AA respecs or anything like that, according to SOE doing them was a lot more involved.  Thus the extra cost associated with them.

And you actually belive them? Why am I not surprised.

If they did the appropriate testing when implementing the new racial traits, they would already have the capacity to change race.  Baby stuff.  We are being asked to pay $AU40 for an automated sql query to run that was probably run a few thousand times during testing while they were developing the new racial traits.  If it wasn't, they couldn't have done their testing very thoroughly before implementing the new racial traits. 

aphfid is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-29-2009, 11:10 PM   #246
aphfid

Newbie
 
Join Date: Oct 2009
Posts: 5
Default

Lethe5683 wrote

Because the only reason most people would change their race is because of the racial trait changes that were so conveniantly released right before the race change potion.

Yes, this is the key.

If they implemented a pay for race change without having made any changes to racials, then I would have no comment to make.  And, I would have been happy to pay for a race change if it happened that way and I wanted to change race.  In fact, I would have seen it as an opportunity, as some people have.  Just like having to pay to change servers, I am happy to pay if it is the result of me changing my mind.

But when they generate the need to change race by changing racial traits, and then ask you to pay for it, that is bad spirited and a breach of trust. 

aphfid is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-30-2009, 12:44 AM   #247
Lethe5683

Loremaster
 
Join Date: Feb 2008
Posts: 5,351
Default

Gaige wrote:

Lethe5683 wrote:

Because the only reason most people would change their race is because of the racial trait changes that were so conveniantly released right before the race change potion.

SOE announced the racial trait revamp well ahead of the race change potion.  It wasn't decided until Fan Faire to add the item to the SC marketplace per player request.

They were going to just redo the racials and that was that.  Don't like your race choice after the revamp, REROLL.

Thankfully they listened to the players at Fan Faire and via the survey and they implemented the potion AFTER doing the revamp and letting people get a feel for the racials.

You're making a mountain out of barely any sand.

Says the SoE fanboi.  Seriously it's not even worth discussing with you.

Lethe5683 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-30-2009, 12:45 AM   #248
Lethe5683

Loremaster
 
Join Date: Feb 2008
Posts: 5,351
Default

[email protected] Bayle wrote:

Kinda more like... you and your neighbor have similar model cars. But after you buy yours, the manufacturer comes in and removes your AC unit (After all, it's not strictly needed to use or drive the car but it is rather nice to have). At the same time, they go in and not only leave your neighbor's AC unit in, but also give him some great benefits, like free DVD system and heck, maybe a better sound system while they are at it. Then they say they'll charge you $500 to put in a tray that holds a big ice cube into the car so that you can keep cool.

You aren't where you started, maybe a little worse off. After all, you don't need an AC. While your neighbor gets some rather nice benefits to it. In a situation like that I would be more than a little upset.

It's not an issue as to what you are driving compared to what they are driving. It's the changes that were made without your consent.

I totally agree with that.

Lethe5683 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-30-2009, 12:47 AM   #249
Lethe5683

Loremaster
 
Join Date: Feb 2008
Posts: 5,351
Default

aphfid wrote:

Lethe5683 wrote:

Gaige wrote:

Race changes aren't like AA respecs or anything like that, according to SOE doing them was a lot more involved.  Thus the extra cost associated with them.

And you actually belive them? Why am I not surprised.

If they did the appropriate testing when implementing the new racial traits, they would already have the capacity to change race.  Baby stuff.  We are being asked to pay $AU40 for an automated sql query to run that was probably run a few thousand times during testing while they were developing the new racial traits.  If it wasn't, they couldn't have done their testing very thoroughly before implementing the new racial traits. 

Yes, that's what I'm saying.  People always belive it when SoE says stuff like how hard it is to change certain things when obviously it is not.  Heck they said it would be impossible to change your race without completly remaking your enrtire character yet now they can do is quickly with an automated system that probably took no more than a few days to make.

Lethe5683 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-30-2009, 02:10 AM   #250
aphfid

Newbie
 
Join Date: Oct 2009
Posts: 5
Default

Lethe5683 wrote:

aphfid wrote:

Lethe5683 wrote:

Gaige wrote:

Race changes aren't like AA respecs or anything like that, according to SOE doing them was a lot more involved.  Thus the extra cost associated with them.

And you actually belive them? Why am I not surprised.

If they did the appropriate testing when implementing the new racial traits, they would already have the capacity to change race.  Baby stuff.  We are being asked to pay $AU40 for an automated sql query to run that was probably run a few thousand times during testing while they were developing the new racial traits.  If it wasn't, they couldn't have done their testing very thoroughly before implementing the new racial traits. 

Yes, that's what I'm saying.  People always belive it when SoE says stuff like how hard it is to change certain things when obviously it is not.  Heck they said it would be impossible to change your race without completly remaking your enrtire character yet now they can do is quickly with an automated system that probably took no more than a few days to make.

Even if they did have to 'remake' your character, it would still be relatively easy.  How do people imagine that they test the new zones they create?  It would take them a few minutes to create a character at any level with any equipment they want it to have.  

aphfid is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-30-2009, 06:16 AM   #251
Lethe5683

Loremaster
 
Join Date: Feb 2008
Posts: 5,351
Default

aphfid wrote:

Lethe5683 wrote:

Yes, that's what I'm saying.  People always belive it when SoE says stuff like how hard it is to change certain things when obviously it is not.  Heck they said it would be impossible to change your race without completly remaking your enrtire character yet now they can do is quickly with an automated system that probably took no more than a few days to make.

Even if they did have to 'remake' your character, it would still be relatively easy.  How do people imagine that they test the new zones they create?  It would take them a few minutes to create a character at any level with any equipment they want it to have.  

Indeed... I'm not used to people agreeing with me.  This feels wrong.

Lethe5683 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-30-2009, 08:09 AM   #252
Shareana

Lead Volunteer Moderator
Shareana's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2008
Posts: 3,921
Default

Insult free please posters

Snide comments are not needed either

__________________
|| Forum Guidelines || Knowledge Base || Tech Support ||






Shareana is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-30-2009, 12:03 PM   #253
Odysia
Server: Antonia Bayle
Guild: Tapiolan Sankarit
Rank: Member

Loremaster
 
Join Date: Nov 2004
Posts: 108
Default

Shareana wrote:

Snide comments are not needed either

Frankly, SOE would generate less snide comments if they were to treat their customer base with a little more respect.

Respect doesn't mean just talking politely, it also encompasses the general customer / provider relationship. To be specific, the implemention of SC (touted as 'fluff only' ) followed by racial changes and race change potions for SC is pretty transparent. The fact that SOE think we can't see through it gives the impression that SOE thinks its customers are stupid.

People don't like being treated as stupid, or as 'easy marks'. It gets their backs up and thats what generates snide coments.

Ask yourself this; before SC how many EQ2 players would recommend EQ2 to their friends? What do you think the answer is now?

I can tell SOE what it is for me: I have brought 6 new players into this game. I have talked one other player into returning, who subsequently brought another player, as well as been a factor in luring 2 other ex players back into the game. But as a result of this SC business, I find it very difficult, in good conscience, to recommend this game to anyone I know. And since SOE will just NOT advertise, can it really justify annoying a proportion of its playerbase who are the only real ammbassadors the game has?

Odysia is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-30-2009, 01:00 PM   #254
Andok

Loremaster
Andok's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2006
Location: San Diego, CA
Posts: 1,039
Default

[email protected] Bayle wrote:

Shareana wrote:

Snide comments are not needed either

Frankly, SOE would generate less snide comments if they were to treat their customer base with a little more respect.

Respect doesn't mean just talking politely, it also encompasses the general customer / provider relationship. To be specific, the implemention of SC (touted as 'fluff only' ) followed by racial changes and race change potions for SC is pretty transparent. The fact that SOE think we can't see through it gives the impression that SOE thinks its customers are stupid.

People don't like being treated as stupid, or as 'easy marks'. It gets their backs up and thats what generates snide coments.

Ask yourself this; before SC how many EQ2 players would recommend EQ2 to their friends? What do you think the answer is now?

I can tell SOE what it is for me: I have brought 6 new players into this game. I have talked one other player into returning, who subsequently brought another player, as well as been a factor in luring 2 other ex players back into the game. But as a result of this SC business, I find it very difficult, in good conscience, to recommend this game to anyone I know. And since SOE will just NOT advertise, can it really justify annoying a proportion of its playerbase who are the only real ammbassadors the game has?

It’s funny when people use words like “playerbase” to suggest that everyone agrees with them.I’m sorry to inform you that you are almost certainly in the minority with your opinion of LoN and SC.  Next time you’re in game, just look around you.  There are far, far, far more people wearing/using SC/LoN items than there are people complaining about them.  Even the people who are ambivalent or apathetic outnumber you.  Go ahead and continue your crusade of the evils of LoN/SC, but do it with an understanding that you are in the vast minority.

Andok is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-30-2009, 02:16 PM   #255
Odysia
Server: Antonia Bayle
Guild: Tapiolan Sankarit
Rank: Member

Loremaster
 
Join Date: Nov 2004
Posts: 108
Default

Andok wrote:

It’s funny when people use words like “playerbase” to suggest that everyone agrees with them.

Context is everything. I said "a proportion of the playerbase". There is no suggestion that everyone agrees with me; that is purely an artefact of your take on it.

I have no idea what proportion; but one thing I do know is that a significant proportion of my friends do use SC items, but now view this as a "bridge to far".

Go ahead and continue your crusade of the evils of LoN/SC, but do it with an understanding that you are in the vast minority.

There's a big difference between tolerating something and agreeing with it. If I was a hardcore min/maxer I might racially respec my characters, but it would be out of perceived necessity rather than out of desire.

To me, it seems that the potential damage of SC is medium to long term, and it's effects relatively intangible, as opposed to the immediate improvement in the bottom line. I have no problem with SOE wanting to make money btw, the issue is short term versus long term.

(For me, I'd happily pay a significantly higher sub in order to have a microtransaction free environment. EQ2 is good value for money when considered as entertainment time per unit cash. The account fees have not (anywhere near) kept up with inflation. And yes, I do realise that not everyone will agree with that). 

The fact remains, whatever you think of LoN, SC etc, SOEs implementation of it has been botched from a customer relations point of view. Its either been deliberately orchestrated as a cash grab, or incompetantly pitched so it looks like one! I suppose, to be fair, Hanlon's razor applies.

But as a customer I am entitled to say my piece, whether by design or incompetence SOE are giving the impression they think we are stupid. Making your customer think you are taking the mickey is not a smart place to go. Ask Gerald Ratner.

Odysia is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-30-2009, 04:07 PM   #256
Andok

Loremaster
Andok's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2006
Location: San Diego, CA
Posts: 1,039
Default

[email protected] Bayle wrote:

The fact remains, whatever you think of LoN, SC etc, SOEs implementation of it has been botched from a customer relations point of view. Its either been deliberately orchestrated as a cash grab, or incompetantly pitched so it looks like one! I suppose, to be fair, Hanlon's razor applies.

But that is not a “fact” – it’s merely your opinion.  Considering that the people that are railing against SC/LoN would likely be doing the same thing no matter what SoE said, I think SoE handled the customer relations aspect fine.  Show me the people saying “I love SC/LoN, but I hate the way SoE implemented it from a customer relations standpoint.”  I don’t think I’ve seen a single one.  What I see is people that don’t want SC/LoN at all slinging mud in all directions in their anger/disappointment that it's in the game at all.

Andok is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-30-2009, 07:50 PM   #257
Lethe5683

Loremaster
 
Join Date: Feb 2008
Posts: 5,351
Default

[email protected] Bayle wrote:

If I was a hardcore min/maxer I might racially respec my characters, but it would be out of perceived necessity rather than out of desire.

I am a hard core min/maxer but I do not have the option of changing race.  So this is particularly problematic for me.

Lethe5683 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-01-2009, 07:17 AM   #258
Odysia
Server: Antonia Bayle
Guild: Tapiolan Sankarit
Rank: Member

Loremaster
 
Join Date: Nov 2004
Posts: 108
Default

Andok wrote:

[email protected] Bayle wrote:

The fact remains, whatever you think of LoN, SC etc, SOEs implementation of it has been botched from a customer relations point of view. Its either been deliberately orchestrated as a cash grab, or incompetantly pitched so it looks like one! I suppose, to be fair, Hanlon's razor applies.

But that is not a “fact” – it’s merely your opinion. 

Yeah, whatever. In my opinion, its a fact. I think, in my opinion, it's a fact. Wooly communication - you can generally strike though the words "I think" and "In my opinion" without changing the meaning of a sentence. Obviously its my opinion, or I wouldn't be expressing it.

 Considering that the people that are railing against SC/LoN would likely be doing the same thing no matter what SoE said, I think SoE handled the customer relations aspect fine. 

I dispute this point of view. Do you have any experience in a service related industry? I worked for about 10 years in a role where I often had to give customers bad news. The best way to do it is in a forthright manner with total honesty. Your customers may not be happy, but they'll still trust you, and in a service industry trust is everything. If you try and obfuscate the truth they will rarely forgive you, and if they have a choice they'll invariably walk.

 Show me the people saying “I love SC/LoN, but I hate the way SoE implemented it from a customer relations standpoint.”  I don’t think I’ve seen a single one.  What I see is people that don’t want SC/LoN at all slinging mud in all directions in their anger/disappointment that it's in the game at all.

That simply suggests to me you can't differentiate between the issues. For starters, why do I need to show you people with that view point? Why is it necessary to have a "love" view of SC in order for a "poorly implemented" view to be valid. Plenty of people I know are in the 'apathetic camp as far as SC goes. They don't really care what other players are doing because they feel they can just ignore it. But these same people are now sitting up and expressing reservations bout the 'suposed to be fluff only' issue.

They have botched it. Its so obvious that for SC to penetrate the marketplace it HAS to offer game mechanics advantages. They should have just fessed up in the first place.

If they had, this conversation would simply be me saying "Well, I don't like SC, but thank goodness they are being straight with us".

The bottom line is I feel like I've been lied too. Other people feel they've been lied too. We can argue to toss about whether whether its a 'tiny tiny minority" (although anyone with service industry exoerience should know that for every customer that is prepared to complain there are a dozen that will just walk without saying a word). All I can say is in my circle of aquaintances the proportion is quite substantial.

And with that, I withdraw from this conversation. I pay my subs to SOE, not you, so tbh I don't really care if you think SOE have done a good job.

Odysia is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-03-2009, 04:38 AM   #259
Gaige

Loremaster
Gaige's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2004
Location: Arizona
Posts: 9,500
Default

Lethe5683 wrote:

Says the SoE fanboi.  Seriously it's not even worth discussing with you.

Calling me a SOE fanboi is pretty rich.

__________________
Gaige is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-03-2009, 11:09 AM   #260
DngrMou

General
DngrMou's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2005
Posts: 1,286
Default

[email protected] Bayle wrote:

Gaige wrote:

Lethe5683 wrote:

Because the only reason most people would change their race is because of the racial trait changes that were so conveniantly released right before the race change potion.

SOE announced the racial trait revamp well ahead of the race change potion.  It wasn't decided until Fan Faire to add the item to the SC marketplace per player request.

They were going to just redo the racials and that was that.  Don't like your race choice after the revamp, REROLL.

Thankfully they listened to the players at Fan Faire and via the survey and they implemented the potion AFTER doing the revamp and letting people get a feel for the racials.

You're making a mountain out of barely any sand.

So SOE decides to completely change racial abilities, making some races have... nothing what so ever that is useful for their class, when before they did have useful abilities. And your respons is to just reroll your possibly level 80 well geared character? This is the kind of opinion that makes people want to quit.

And no, I'm not quiting yet. But only due to friends that are still playing. And they are getting tired of it too.

As a wood elf Swashbuckler, the original racial traits offered nothing.  Now they do, and it seems there is more for everyone, in general, than there was.  It's not perfect, but it's better than their original implementation, which is better than the nothing that preceded it.

DngrMou is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-03-2009, 05:37 PM   #261
Lethe5683

Loremaster
 
Join Date: Feb 2008
Posts: 5,351
Default

DngrMouse wrote:

[email protected] Bayle wrote:

Gaige wrote:

Lethe5683 wrote:

Because the only reason most people would change their race is because of the racial trait changes that were so conveniantly released right before the race change potion.

SOE announced the racial trait revamp well ahead of the race change potion.  It wasn't decided until Fan Faire to add the item to the SC marketplace per player request.

They were going to just redo the racials and that was that.  Don't like your race choice after the revamp, REROLL.

Thankfully they listened to the players at Fan Faire and via the survey and they implemented the potion AFTER doing the revamp and letting people get a feel for the racials.

You're making a mountain out of barely any sand.

So SOE decides to completely change racial abilities, making some races have... nothing what so ever that is useful for their class, when before they did have useful abilities. And your respons is to just reroll your possibly level 80 well geared character? This is the kind of opinion that makes people want to quit.

And no, I'm not quiting yet. But only due to friends that are still playing. And they are getting tired of it too.

As a wood elf Swashbuckler, the original racial traits offered nothing.  Now they do, and it seems there is more for everyone, in general, than there was.  It's not perfect, but it's better than their original implementation, which is better than the nothing that preceded it.

It is not better at all.  My traits are FAR worse than they were before and nearly completly useless now.  The only usefull traits I get now are the +2da and +hp/power.  Before some races were overpowred and some were underpowered, now MANY are overpowered and the MAJORITY are underpowered.  I don't know how you can say that's better balanced than it was before.  Maybe because now a higher % of people are stuck with useless traits?  And the last racial traits you're saying were better than nothing? Don't make me laugh.

Lethe5683 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-03-2009, 05:53 PM   #262
Andok

Loremaster
Andok's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2006
Location: San Diego, CA
Posts: 1,039
Default

[email protected] Bayle wrote:

Andok wrote:

[email protected] Bayle wrote:

The fact remains, whatever you think of LoN, SC etc, SOEs implementation of it has been botched from a customer relations point of view. Its either been deliberately orchestrated as a cash grab, or incompetantly pitched so it looks like one! I suppose, to be fair, Hanlon's razor applies.

But that is not a “fact” – it’s merely your opinion. 

Yeah, whatever. In my opinion, its a fact. I think, in my opinion, it's a fact. Wooly communication - you can generally strike though the words "I think" and "In my opinion" without changing the meaning of a sentence. Obviously its my opinion, or I wouldn't be expressing it.

** parsed garbage that no one ever reads **

Sorry for the misunderstanding - in my upside down world, there is a distinct difference in fact and opinion.  I guess Hanlon’s Razor applies to your post as well. 

Andok is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-03-2009, 11:09 PM   #263
Xypez

Loremaster
Xypez's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2005
Location: EU
Posts: 17
Default

SOE's intention is just way too obvious... change the racial traits just before you implement a 25$ way to get back to your optimized class/race balance...

Why do I chose my race carefully based on what bonuses my class gains when you then, out of all sudden, decide to change them? With no option to get back other than paying 37$... This is not a F2P game!

Why 37$? Well, this is Sony's dollar/euro ratio. EU players have to pay 25€, which is equal to 37$ for this race reset! Please tell me why the dollar/euro ratio is 1:1 in SOE's funny world?

The new racial traits don't even make any sense! Heck, you even had to change your official race descriptions just to make your new traits fit! This just proves your intention once more.

There are only three solutions for me:

- give every character a free race change potion every single time you decide to change the racial traditions OR

- completely remove the racial traditions OR

- make every race choose on their own which racial traditions they want to have, out of all available traditions. Once again with free reset every time u change stuff...

For the fanboys, please bring an argument other than something like "it's not a big deal to me". Just accept the fact that there are MANY players who do care about this, since the racial bonuses make up quite a difference.

Xypez is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-04-2009, 11:05 AM   #264
Lethe5683

Loremaster
 
Join Date: Feb 2008
Posts: 5,351
Default

Xypez wrote:

There are only three solutions for me:

- give every character a free race change potion every single time you decide to change the racial traditions OR

- completely remove the racial traditions OR

- make every race choose on their own which racial traditions they want to have, out of all available traditions. Once again with free reset every time u change stuff...

For the fanboys, please bring an argument other than something like "it's not a big deal to me". Just accept the fact that there are MANY players who do care about this, since the racial bonuses make up quite a difference.

The first is not a solution, in fact not even an option.  It wouldn't matter if the race potions were free or $1000.  Either way I'm stuck with crap racial traits that make no sense whatsoever.  Either change them back, get rid of them all together or let us choose.  Letting us choose however kind of negates the point of them being called racial traits.  Maybe call them character traits.

Lethe5683 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-04-2009, 01:27 PM   #265
Andok

Loremaster
Andok's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2006
Location: San Diego, CA
Posts: 1,039
Default

Xypez wrote:

SOE's intention is just way too obvious... change the racial traits just before you implement a 25$ way to get back to your optimized class/race balance...

Would you have preferred that they offer the race change potion before the racial balance was done?

Andok is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-04-2009, 04:43 PM   #266
Fendaria

Loremaster
Fendaria's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2004
Posts: 296
Default

Andok wrote:

Xypez wrote:

SOE's intention is just way too obvious... change the racial traits just before you implement a 25$ way to get back to your optimized class/race balance...

Would you have preferred that they offer the race change potion before the racial balance was done?

I would have prefered they implemented the racial rebalance in such a way I wouldn't have felt the need/desire to buy a race change potion to change my race because my race/class selection was no longer favorable immediately after the racial revamp went live.

Fendaria

Fendaria is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-04-2009, 04:56 PM   #267
Andok

Loremaster
Andok's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2006
Location: San Diego, CA
Posts: 1,039
Default

I felt the same thing a few years ago after the last racial balance.  The big difference back then is that we didn’t have any option to change our race afterwards.  At least we have an option now, and I would rather have an option that costs $25 than no option at all.That said, I was addressing the poster I quoted that claims SoE’s intention is “just way too obvious”.    Mr. Obvious must not have realized that SoE could have made a lot more money if they implemented the change the other way around.

Andok is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-04-2009, 06:23 PM   #268
Xypez

Loremaster
Xypez's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2005
Location: EU
Posts: 17
Default

Lethe5683 wrote:

Xypez wrote:

There are only three solutions for me:

- give every character a free race change potion every single time you decide to change the racial traditions OR

- completely remove the racial traditions OR

- make every race choose on their own which racial traditions they want to have, out of all available traditions. Once again with free reset every time u change stuff...

For the fanboys, please bring an argument other than something like "it's not a big deal to me". Just accept the fact that there are MANY players who do care about this, since the racial bonuses make up quite a difference.

The first is not a solution, in fact not even an option.  It wouldn't matter if the race potions were free or $1000.  Either way I'm stuck with crap racial traits that make no sense whatsoever.  Either change them back, get rid of them all together or let us choose.  Letting us choose however kind of negates the point of them being called racial traits.  Maybe call them character traits.

Yes #2 and #3 would at least rectify the 25$, since race change potion would then only affect the visual appearance. #1 would at least count as solution for those who don't care about the visual appearance at all rather than having their optimized racial trait for their class back. I do agree that #2 and #3 are the better solutions though.

Andok wrote:

I felt the same thing a few years ago after the last racial balance.  The big difference back then is that we didn’t have any option to change our race afterwards.  At least we have an option now, and I would rather have an option that costs $25 than no option at all.That said, I was addressing the poster I quoted that claims SoE’s intention is “just way too obvious”.    Mr. Obvious must not have realized that SoE could have made a lot more money if they implemented the change the other way around.

"Back then" was no such thing like a market place. And it doesn't even matter anyway since your "they could have implemented it earlier if it was about money" is a fairly weak argument...

Still I don't get it, you obviously don't seem to be too happy that they once changed your racial traits. Now they do it again... and want 25$ from you just so you can choose the optimized race for your class once again... and once you payed the 25$, you still have no idea when they will change the traits the next time.

And you are actually happy about this solution? You do realize that you are paying 14€ a month for a support... and that this is the FIRST pay to play game with real cash ingame items which affect gameplay? And you are telling me it's not about money?

Better bring an argument why they actually change racial traits in a way so they don't make any sense... even forcing them to change the official race descriptions. This is something NO ONE asked for. They know exactly that ppl do care about their racial traits...

Xypez is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-04-2009, 06:26 PM   #269
CoLD MeTaL

Loremaster
CoLD MeTaL's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2005
Posts: 3,217
Default

I just hope that now that I have paid $25 for my race, that that race is protected from changes.

__________________


CoLD MeTaL is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-04-2009, 06:55 PM   #270
Yimway

Loremaster
Yimway's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2005
Posts: 9,707
Default

CoLD MeTaL wrote:

I just hope that now that I have paid $25 for my race, that that race is protected from changes.

Thats some wishful thinking =)

__________________
Yimway is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Thread Tools

Forum Jump


All times are GMT. The time now is 05:28 AM.

vBulletin skin by: CompleteGFX.com
Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.7.5
Copyright ©2000 - 2019, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
All threads and posts originally from the EQ2 and Station forums operated by Sony Online Entertainment. Their use is by express written permission.